NationStates Jolt Archive

Is there anyone one else who is fucking sick of hearing the word "Islamo-fascist"?

From wikipedia:

Fascism is an authoritarian political ideology (generally tied to a mass movement) that considers individual and other societal interests subordinate to the interests of the state. Fascists seek to forge a type of national unity through oppression and coercion, usually based on (but not limited to) ethnic, cultural, or racial attributes. Various scholars attribute different characteristics to fascism, but the following elements are usually seen as its integral parts: nationalism, statism, militarism, totalitarianism, anti-communism, corporatism, populism, collectivism, and opposition to economic and political liberalism

And just for those who don't trust wikipedia as an accurate source, here are 3different dictionary definitions.

a political philosophy, movement, or regime (as that of the Fascisti) that exalts nation and often race above the individual and that stands for a centralized autocratic government headed by a dictatorial leader, severe economic and social regimentation, and forcible suppression of opposition

a system of government characterized by rigid one-party dictatorship, forcible suppression of opposition, private economic enterprise under centralized governmental control, belligerent nationalism, racism, and militarism, etc.

a political system based on a very powerful leader, state control and extreme pride in country and race, and in which political opposition is not allowed

One thing everyone seems to agree on is that fascism requires a nation, and a shitload of nationalism. Now although fascism was founded by Moussolini in pre WW2 Italy, I understand some people believe Hitler to be a better model. But you can apply either leader, and see that Islamo-fascism is a moronic term.

Now let's look at these "Islamo-fascists". I'm going to use al-Queda as an example, since they are the group blamed for 9/11 by the majority of the American people, and it is the name of the insurgency movement in Iraq given by most of the media.

Al-Queda are not nationalists by any means whatsoever. Their operations are scattered all over the Middle East. Osama Bin Laden and various high ranking al-Queda leaders have stated their goal: We want Western culture out of the Middle East.

They are not rallying in Iraq, Saudi Arabia, Syria, Egypt, Iran, or Afghanistan or any other nation in order to make that nation more powerful. They do not pledge their allegiance to any single country. This is because they are not nationalists. They're religious fanatics.

Stop misusing the fucking word "fascism". And I will admit, while there are idiot conservatives who use the word all the time for their own gain, there are likewise idiots on the left misusing the word too.

Fascism has to have nationalism to be fascism just as much as democracy has to involve voting to be a democracy.

You already exploit 9/11, sick children, and puppy dogs for political propagandha, but when you exploit the dictionary, you have crossed the fucking line.

Please leave the word "Islamo-fascism" for Faux News and the idiots who watch it.



With Love,
Pepito 666, Benevolent Leader of the Federation of Free Socialist Allies. :p

What do you propose we call it?

In b4 the Right Wing Brigade(a name I just coined) disagree.

If Left wing nuts get to call Israel an "apartheid state" then I think the right wing nuts should be allowed to use the expression Islamo-Fascism.

When people use the word "Islamo-fascist", I know what it means, and that's good enough for me.

What do you propose we call it?

You could go back to calling it what you really mean: Islam.

"Islamo-fascism" is nothing more than "Islam" dressed minimally to deter immediate accusations of bigotry.

You could go back to calling it what you really mean: Islam.

"Islamo-fascism" is nothing more than "Islam" dressed minimally to deter immediate accusations of bigotry.


Islam extremist can be called Radical Muslims. Moderate Muslims can be called Muslims. Pretty fucking simple to me.

Firstly, I'm not of the 'Islamo-Fascist' fans. Now, for my post:

What about the other goals of Al-Qaeda, such as uniting the entire Muslim world in a giant religious nation that spreads from Morocco to Pakistan? They don't just dismiss nationalism, they want to abolish it, turning Islam to the highest principle.

Also, the OP should ask the mods to change the title of his thread. Flamebaiting is bad, mmmkay?

It depends on how you define fascism, I'm currently reading this (http://www.cursor.org/stories/fascismiii.php)about fascism and more particularly fascism in the US. The writer states that fascism shouldn't only be seen as the typical examples, like fascist Italy or the Nazi's, but that there are other types as well, which are different because of local culture etc. So something like Islamo-fascism could theoretically exist. If something like fascism would arise in a very religious country it would probably appeal more to the religion than the race for instance. It's a very interesting article, also about the ways the word fascist is more and more used by the right to describe the left, thereby destroying the real meaning of the word (something like newspeak)

It's a perfectly cromulent word.

You could go back to calling it what you really mean: Islam.

"Islamo-fascism" is nothing more than "Islam" dressed minimally to deter immediate accusations of bigotry.

Thanks for accusing me of being a bigot. I really appreciate it. I mean, wow, I never would have known if you hadn't said so. I am now joining the Nazi party, and will begin ethnically cleansing the world.

Think before you type.

I shall persist in using that apt term to describe the extremist Islamic political movement. And if you don't like it...tough.

Also, the OP should ask the mods to change the title of his thread. Flamebaiting is bad, mmmkay?

He can do it himself, or they'll do it for him-not so much for the baiting but because the rules on titles are tighter than those on thread content because even if a school that uses the game as a tool might block the forum, the forum titles still appear in the 'most recent threads' and something like "dumbasses" might make the page unviewable by scholastic users.

If Left wing nuts get to call Israel an "apartheid state" then I think the right wing nuts should be allowed to use the expression Islamo-Fascism.

One is an actual description of the nature of a state. Israel is a state; a nation. Therefore in some ways, at least even if it's not correct, the term used can apply to the subject, where as with the latter it doesn't.

I agree, it's just a shock word, like neocon for example. The people who use it usually can't define it.

Of all those terms, I think on Corpratism doesn't fit (that is to say, the incorporation of interests, to make them dependant on the state). However, I would concur that there is also a lack of economic nationalism in, specifically, Iran, that makes the system merely authoritarian and fundamentalist in nature.

And, to the fellow above me: Neo-Con is a term used to describe Neo-Straussian international relations that focus on domino-theory democritization, and agressive, assertive foreign policies. It's not a scare word, it's a real ideology. It's just that most people don't understand it.

Most people use it because it sounds like neo-nazi.

"Oh he's a neocon!"

Neo-con is supposed to mean a new conservative. It's only in recent years that it's entire meaning was changed to mitigate the ignorance of the people on the left using it.

I agree, it's just a shock word, like neocon for example. The people who use it usually can't define it.
I define neocon as "Someone claiming to be conservative but whose policies (corporate welfare state, greater government involvement in daily life) actual conservatives would find distasteful."

Actually I usually just substitute both the words "Islamo-facist" and "Neo-Conservative" with a more apt term "A**hole".

The one I like is Radical Islamism, the politicization of Islam, in a militant form. It doesn't have the radical and loaded connotations of "Islamo-Fascism" but it differentiates from the vast bulk of the Muslim center that has jack-all to do with it.

Who-Cares?

I shall persist in using that apt term to describe the extremist Islamic political movement. And if you don't like it...tough.


No problem. We'll go back to calling you Nazis then.

He can do it himself, or they'll do it for him-not so much for the baiting but because the rules on titles are tighter than those on thread content because even if a school that uses the game as a tool might block the forum, the forum titles still appear in the 'most recent threads' and something like "dumbasses" might make the page unviewable by scholastic users.

Actually, I did it both because of the tighter restrictions on titles and the mild trolling.

In any case, the OP would do well to ease up on the inflammatory content, regardless of whether it's in a title or a post.

NationStates Forum Moderator
HotRodia

Islamo-Fascism doesn't exist...It's just a way to further demonize AQ and other muslim extremists by comparing them to Nazis, the epitome of "evil" in Western society...

Thanks for accusing me of being a bigot. I really appreciate it. I mean, wow, I never would have known if you hadn't said so. I am now joining the Nazi party, and will begin ethnically cleansing the world.

Think before you type.

Fire up the gas chambers cause you got some work to do. ;)

Don't forget CNN and MSNBC and the idiots that watch them. Please don't get suckered into the dichotomy of hate. There's absolutely no reason why FOX news is any worse than any of the other channels-- they're all horribly biased and unfair.

Both support continuing the war in Iraq (in fact the front-running Democrats don't want to leave until 2011). CNN, MSNBC, and FOX regularly propagandize the government, and all of the networks are in the pocket of the FCC.

So regardless whether you hate Bush or you hate Pelosi, just remember that both sides have an enormous, vested interest in the continued inflation of the government and the errosion of our civil liberties.

Saudi Arabia is definitely an Islamo-fascist state. The government owns most of the economy, and has huge stakes in the rest, they use their funds to indoctrinate people with a radical form of Islam, and repress them brutally with draconian, inhumane laws in order to subvert them all to the will of the monarchy.

Islam, like Judaism is a violent religion by nature. Ironically enough, Christianity is not...though people have turned it otherwise. The difference is, Judaism is not read literally anymore since the Jewish reformation/enlightenment after the destruction of the second temple. That's why Jews don't go out stoning people and killing idol-worshipers anymore.

Islam, however, is still read literally and has not gone through this enlightenment/reformation.

Though I digress.....Islamic terrorism has nothing to do with Fascism. Fascism has to do with a strong state, a unified people, government control over the economy, government control over "individual" rights and freedoms and a general all around militartistic government control of the country. This has nothing to do with Islamic terrorism.....



Saudi Arabia is definitely an Islamo-fascist state. The government owns most of the economy, and has huge stakes in the rest, they use their funds to indoctrinate people with a radical form of Islam, and repress them brutally with draconian, inhumane laws in order to subvert them all to the will of the monarchy.
That is a very interesting application of Fascism to Saudi Arabia and I never thought of it before.....makes alot of sense.

snip

Al Qaeda support sharia law, which is inherently fascist. They want many countries to use the Islamic based totalitarian system of government (hence the term Islamo-fascism) and thus support Islamo-fascism.

I cannot believe people are actually buying in to his deeply flawed argument, you must at least realise that he is basing his argument on the fact that the only types of people referred to as Islamofascists happen to be Al Qaeda.

Is there anyone one else who is fucking sick of hearing the word "Islamo-fascist"?
You already exploit 9/11, sick children, and puppy dogs for political propagandha, but when you exploit the dictionary, you have crossed the fucking line.
That made me laugh. It's just cause its a scarey word. We shall scare you into conforming to our 2 dimentional view of politics