NationStates Jolt Archive

When your home country (The US) is currently asking your host country (Japan) to pay more money for the privilege of having you there ( http://www.airforcetimes.com/news/2007/10/ap_japan_071008/ ), that is REALLY not the time to gang rape a 19-year-old woman.

U.S. servicemen in Japan accused of rape

By CARL FREIRE, Associated Press WriterFri Oct 19, 5:22 AM ET

Japanese authorities are investigating the alleged rape of a teenager by four U.S. Marines in southwestern Japan last weekend, officials and media said Friday.

Police in Hiroshima prefecture are working with U.S. military officials to investigate the allegation, which the 19-year-old woman made to police, top government spokesman Nobutaka Machimura told reporters.

"It would be unforgiveable if this turns out to be true," Machimura said.

The U.S. has about 50,000 troops based in Japan under a bilateral security treaty. Many Japanese complain of crime, pollution and noise associated with the bases.

The rape of a schoolgirl in Okinawa, which has the largest U.S. military presence, by three American servicemen sparked large protests in 1995.

The woman in the newly reported incident allegedly met the men, believed to be Marines from the nearby Iwakuni Marine Corps Air Station, at a restaurant or bar in Hiroshima early Saturday morning, local media reports said, citing unnamed police officials.

The men allegedly took the woman outside to a car and drove her to a parking lot about a mile away where they raped her, according to the reports.

The U.S. Embassy said that it was "aware of the reported incident" and, together with U.S. Forces Japan, was cooperating fully with Japanese authorities.

"We take reports of this nature very seriously," it said.

USFJ spokesman Master Sgt. Terence Peck made a nearly identical statement.

Neither officials nor the media reports named any of the people involved in the alleged incident.

Hiroshima is about 430 miles southwest of Tokyo.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20071019/ap_on_re_as/japan_us_rape

As an addendum (I can't find an English translation currently), NHK just reported that the Japanese police and government are calling on the US to turn over the Marines in question.

Marines REALLY need to learn timing!

They can rape, but have to look to their calendar?????

When is there a good time to gang rape a 19 year old girl?

Why doesn't the US use Blackwater instead, in order to contract this kind of risk away?

Why doesn't the US use Blackwater instead, in order to contract this kind of risk away?

No doubt some in the admin would like to.

When your home country (The US) is currently asking your host country (Japan) to pay more money for the privilege of having you there ( http://www.airforcetimes.com/news/2007/10/ap_japan_071008/ ), that is REALLY not the time to gang rape a 19-year-old woman.


http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20071019/ap_on_re_as/japan_us_rape

As an addendum (I can't find an English translation currently), NHK just reported that the Japanese police and government are calling on the US to turn over the Marines in question.

They're sampling the local delicacies... :p

Wow does that sound insensitive. In all seriousness, if the marines want respect, they ought to prosecute those responsible, even if means turning them over to another nations should the offence have taken place on another's soil.

Marines REALLY need to learn timing!

They can rape, but have to look to their calendar?????
I would have thought that the sarcasm would be self-evident without the tags, but...

As an addendum (I can't find an English translation currently), NHK just reported that the Japanese police and government are calling on the US to turn over the Marines in question.

Which the US won't, and if the marines are found guilty, will go "ha, ha, oh dear" and quietly put the accused back in America with a slap on the wrist.

As for paying for utilities, WTF? If I'm reading this right, they're demanding that Japan pay more for water and utilities that Japan is supplying to their bases?

That's just screwed up in so many ways I don't even know where to begin.

Obviously, George Walker Bush personally ordered the rape to be committed.

He called the USMC in Japan and said:

"Hey, people, you need to go out and rape a 19-year old."

And then the Marines said:

"But Mr. President, we don't do that sort of thing. We're Marines."

And then Bush said:

"YOU DO WHAT EVER I TELL YOU TO! I AM THE DECIDER! UNZIP YOUR PANTS AND GO!"

And obviously Bush did that because Cheney told him to.

And Cheney did that because he's beholden to Halliburton.

Whose corporate interests are served by gang rape. Somehow. I haven't figured out how exactly, but I'm going to tune in to Alex Jones to find out.

Obviously, George Walker Bush personally ordered the rape to be committed.

He called the USMC in Japan and said:

"Hey, people, you need to go out and rape a 19-year old."

And then the Marines said:

"But Mr. President, we don't do that sort of thing. We're Marines."

And then Bush said:

"YOU DO WHAT EVER I TELL YOU TO! I AM THE DECIDER! UNZIP YOUR PANTS AND GO!"

And obviously Bush did that because Cheney told him to.

And Cheney did that because he's beholden to Halliburton.

Whose corporate interests are served by gang rape. Somehow. I haven't figured out how exactly, but I'm going to tune in to Alex Jones to find out.

I can habeeb it.

They're sampling the local delicacies... :p

Wow does that sound insensitive. In all seriousness, if the marines want respect, they ought to prosecute those responsible, even if means turning them over to another nations should the offence have taken place on another's soil.
I'm just stunned that it happened. After 4 Marines raped a school girl in Okinawa, one would have thought that they would have it drilled into their heads about doing something like this.

If it were indeed true, this is going to cause a lot of grief for the US. Most Japanese more or less ignore Okinawa, but this happened on Honshu itself.

As for paying for utilities, WTF? If I'm reading this right, they're demanding that Japan pay more for water and utilities that Japan is supplying to their bases?

That's just screwed up in so many ways I don't even know where to begin.
Yes, you are reading that right and a number of Japanese are more than a little annoyed at it.

Yes, you are reading that right and a number of Japanese are more than a little annoyed at it.

So much for getting Japan to pay more...:(

Those Marines have done their country a disfavour, which should be deduced from their pay!

Yes, you are reading that right and a number of Japanese are more than a little annoyed at it.

Why the hell hasn't the Diet kicked out the US forces then? The SDF is strong enough to fend off any attack by its neighbors. Why the heck do they need US forces around anymore?

I'm just stunned that it happened. After 4 Marines raped a school girl in Okinawa, one would have thought that they would have it drilled into their heads about doing something like this.

If it were indeed true, this is going to cause a lot of grief for the US. Most Japanese more or less ignore Okinawa, but this happened on Honshu itself.

Yeah one would think that such policies should be part of the default 'cultural sensitivity' training that marines (and others) should receive.

I hope it isn't true; at least for the girl's sake (hahahahaha!!).

What does it take for a serious ass-whopping to take place?

What does it take for a serious ass-whopping to take place?

The destruction of the White House, Pentagon, Congress, a number of highly placed lobby groups and the USMC.

Why the hell hasn't the Diet kicked out the US forces then? The SDF is strong enough to fend off any attack by its neighbors. Why the heck do they need US forces around anymore?

Well, they don't need them there, but strategically, the US wants to be there, so......

Well, they don't need them there, but strategically, the US wants to be there, so......

So what? Unless the US wants to openly invade and occupy Japan, there isn't squat they can do if they get an eviction notice.

Hell, if they wanted to, they could blockade the 7th fleet when it's in port and demand that the US pays rent if they want out. It's not like Japan doesn't have huge stockpiles of anti-shipping missiles that would murder the docked fleet wholesale.

Bah. As far as I'm concerned, I'm seeing yet another repeat of the whole Black Ships incident and Commodore Perry.

Let them be gangbang-style raped by some big Japanese butt-lovers.

The destruction of the White House, Pentagon, Congress, a number of highly placed lobby groups and the USMC.

...goddamn it!

......
Hell, if they wanted to, they could blockade the 7th fleet when it's in port and demand that the US pays rent if they want out. It's not like Japan doesn't have huge stockpiles of anti-shipping missiles that would murder the docked fleet wholesale.
.......

sounds familiar....housing prices in Hiroshima would plummet

The Japanese are paying for US troops to be rowdy and rape their children, and now the US want them to pay more? Why have they not kicked you out yet?

The Japanese are paying for US troops to be rowdy and rape their children, and now the US want them to pay more? Why have they not kicked you out yet?

Why are they paying for them to be there in the first place? Surely the USMC should be paying rent to the Japanese.

Why are they paying for them to be there in the first place? Surely the USMC should be paying rent to the Japanese.

Apparently the world needs America to baby-sit them whether we like or want them or not. Also the world has to pay for that privilege.

Apparently the world needs America to baby-sit them whether we like or want them or not. Also the world has to pay for that privilege.

One of the younger countries around babysits the older ones. Amusing.

sounds familiar....housing prices in Hiroshima would plummet

Live hostages Mr "Pay us more for using your stuff". Live hostages. And a nuclear first strike is grounds for other countries to turn the initiator into a radioactive wasteland. It doesn't matter who started it.

Which the US won't, and if the marines are found guilty, will go "ha, ha, oh dear" and quietly put the accused back in America with a slap on the wrist.

As for paying for utilities, WTF? If I'm reading this right, they're demanding that Japan pay more for water and utilities that Japan is supplying to their bases?

That's just screwed up in so many ways I don't even know where to begin.

Wrong. That's Vietnam-era and before thinking. After having watched several enlisted Marines go to jail for DUI and other minor crimes, I can attest to the fact that the Marine Corps will not protect its own from prosecution by Japanese authorities.

Live hostages Mr "Pay us more for using your stuff". Live hostages. And a nuclear first strike is grounds for other countries to turn the initiator into a radioactive wasteland. It doesn't matter who started it.

There has already been a first (and a second) strike. Initiator is not yet radioactive wasteland. Point?

They're sampling the local delicacies... :p

Wow does that sound insensitive. In all seriousness, if the marines want respect, they ought to prosecute those responsible, even if means turning them over to another nations should the offence have taken place on another's soil.

Meh. I don't know about the legal prescriptions of the USA-Japan alliance, but NATO regulations make it almost impossible that guest militaries are turned over to the host nation for prosecution (see Cermis massacre, for instance), so I guess that those Marines will never undergo a Japanese trial, although it would be a better PR policy.

Wrong. That's Vietnam-era and before thinking. After having watched several enlisted Marines go to jail for DUI and other minor crimes, I can attest to the fact that the Marine Corps will not protect its own from prosecution by Japanese authorities.

Certainly hope you're right, or this situation's just going to get more and more fucked up.

There has already been a first (and a second) strike. Initiator is not yet radioactive wasteland. Point?

Point is you apparently failed at history. The first two nuclear devices used as weapons of war were when nobody else had them. That's not the case anymore. Try it now, see what that gets you.

I wonder when anybody remember that the Marines in questions have not yet been convicted yet.

Point is you apparently failed at history. The first two nuclear devices used as weapons of war were when nobody else had them. That's not the case anymore. Try it now, see what that gets you.
Why didn't others start trowing nukes as soon as they had them, at the aforementioned initiator?

Who would strike first at the US if they'd level Hiroshima again?

Wrong. That's Vietnam-era and before thinking. After having watched several enlisted Marines go to jail for DUI and other minor crimes,

In American soil or on foreign soil?


I can attest to the fact that the Marine Corps will not protect its own from prosecution by Japanese authorities.

I seem to remember several post Vietnam cases of extreme negligence that resulted in deaths like smacking a plane into cable car supports which had no prosecution allowed by Italian authorities. Or another case where US soldiers drove a tank over some kids in Okinawa I believe. Not on purpose, but what was the punishment? Nothing. A not guilty verdict and the case was buried.

If some guy plowed his car into anyone else and caused their deaths, even if it's an accident, they lose their license. But not if you're wearing a uniform apparently.

Certainly hope you're right, or this situation's just going to get more and more fucked up.
There are news agencies in Japan that tend to blow any event that involves American servicemen out of proportion. I'm sure that Japanese nationals commit crimes from time to time.

Let's face it, no service is devoid of people that will commit crimes when given the opportunity.

Why didn't others start trowing nukes as soon as they had them, at the aforementioned initiator?

'Lets nuke America for nuking Japan all those years ago'
'Yeah, it's not like they could nuke us back or anything'
'Oh wait.......'

Why didn't others start trowing nukes as soon as they had them, at the aforementioned initiator?


You really are daft, do you know that? Once the nuclear table was even, it became a zero sum game. Nobody wanted to start it now that there was somebody else who could flatten you with equal impunity. Pakistan and India fought a war once, despite having nukes, none of them flew. But if one person was stupid enough to launch them, that's it, they were toast.

It's a Mexican standoff. Understand that if you can't understand anything else.


Who would strike first at the US if they'd level Hiroshima again?

Putin would consider it a good excuse. Hu might consider it. France and Britain would drop the US for that like a hot potato. Israel has a Samson type initiative which it would put into play now that it's ally has gone stupid.

'Lets nuke America for nuking Japan all those years ago'
'Yeah, it's not like they could nuke us back or anything'
'Oh wait.......'

so, if america would nuke japan, nobody would nuke america because america could nuke back?

so, if america would nuke japan, nobody would nuke america because america could nuke back?

No, nobody has nuked America in retalitation for nuking Japan because they would just get nuked back.

That's why nobody is nuking anybody. Mutually Assured Destruction.

You really are daft, do you know that? Once the nuclear table was even, it became a zero sum game. Nobody wanted to start it now that there was somebody else who could flatten you with equal impunity. Pakistan and India fought a war once, despite having nukes, none of them flew. But if one person was stupid enough to launch them, that's it, they were toast.

It's a Mexican standoff. Understand that if you can't understand anything else.



Putin would consider it a good excuse. Hu might consider it. France and Britain would drop the US for that like a hot potato. Israel has a Samson type initiative which it would put into play now that it's ally has gone stupid.

In other words, do you think Japan could realistically pull a Pearl Harbour on the seventh fleet and get away with it?

No, nobody has nuked America in retalitation for nuking Japan because they would just get nuked back.

That's why nobody is nuking anybody. Mutually Assured Destruction.

What if America would nuke Japan tomorrow (to make myself clear)?

Would those who'd nuke America back not worry that they'd get counterNuked?

What if America would nuke Japan tomorrow (to make myself clear)?

Would those who'd nuke America back not worry that they'd get counterNuked?

Which is why America isn't going to nuke anybody anytime soon. Nor anyone else. Because if some dumbass starts lobbing nukes around everyone on the planet(more or less) is fucked.

Which is why America isn't going to nuke anybody anytime soon. Nor anyone else. Because if some dumbass starts lobbing nukes around everyone on the planet(more or less) is fucked.

How about VTTN (very teeny tiny nukes)?

What if America would nuke Japan tomorrow (to make myself clear)?

Would those who'd nuke America back not worry that they'd get counterNuked?

If America nuked Japan those other countries would be just as worried that they'd be next on the chopping block. They'd probably figure that they should at least try to take the US down with them.

How about VTTN (very teeny tiny nukes)?

Doesn´t matter how big the nuke is, as soon as you press that shiny, red button you can consider yourself the owner of very big parking lot.

Doesn´t matter how big the nuke is, as soon as you press that shiny, red button you can consider yourself the owner of very big parking lot.

Even if it is just the garden variety? Sounds rather knee-jerkish...

Even if it is just the garden variety? Sounds rather knee-jerkish...

Welcome to the world of international politics.

HAY LOOK, AMERICAN SOLDIERS DOING SUMTHING BAD!

Hurr hurr.

In other words, do you think Japan could realistically pull a Pearl Harbour on the seventh fleet and get away with it?

Pearl Harbour involved sinking ships in their nations home port. In case you hadn't noticed, Japan is a sovereign nation. And a blockade and ransom demand isn't exactly sinking the fleet.

Improve your reading comprehension.

Even if it is just the garden variety? Sounds rather knee-jerkish...

No such thing as a garden variety nuke. The smallest ever made had variable yield of 10 tons to 1kt of TNT.

Pearl Harbour involved sinking ships in their nations home port. In case you hadn't noticed, Japan is a sovereign nation. And a blockade and ransom demand isn't exactly sinking the fleet.

Improve your reading comprehension.



No such thing as a garden variety nuke. The smallest ever made had variable yield of 10 tons to 1kt of TNT.

Sovereign nation or not, sinking a fleet would have consequences.

What if there was a garden, or indoor variety?

I'll back off now, this is off topic, and you are of course right.

There are news agencies in Japan that tend to blow any event that involves American servicemen out of proportion. I'm sure that Japanese nationals commit crimes from time to time.

Let's face it, no service is devoid of people that will commit crimes when given the opportunity.

Yes, but it's the fact that Americans commit this crime on Japanese soil that's creating the storm. If a Japanese servicemen raped a Japanese teenager, I can guarantee you that, outside of Japan/East Asia, no news agency would probably give a shit.

No such thing as a garden variety nuke. The smallest ever made had variable yield of 10 tons to 1kt of TNT.


10 tons TNT is smaller then some conventional bombs.

Those of you who asked why the U.S. has a presence in Japan need to go retake your modern world history courses. Quick hint: the abbreviated explanation is: "Rich Country, Strong Country", World War II, Douglas Macarthur, and Article 9, with a side of Chinese Communism, and Cold War Tensions.

Those of you who asked why the U.S. has a presence in Japan need to go retake your modern world history courses. Quick hint: the abbreviated explanation is: "Rich Country, Strong Country", World War II, Douglas Macarthur, and Article 9, with a side of Chinese Communism, and Cold War Tensions.

I never did history, you telling us would have been much quicker.

Remember posting RTFM doesn't get anybody anywhere.

Sovereign nation or not, sinking a fleet would have consequences.

What if there was a garden, or indoor variety?

Speculations on "what if" are meangless, as we don´t know the full parameters. If nukes of any kind where used against Japan I´m convinced that all countries with nuclear weapons would answer with nuking USA, but if USA nuked for example North Korea or Iran, I´m not sure. To get a reliable answer we would have to know all political, economic and military conditions.


Anyone else noticing that the US have managed to screw up relations with quite a bit of their allies lately?

Anyone else noticing that the US have managed to screw up relations with quite a bit of their allies lately?
The tendency to employ a bunch immature punks in their 20s as the majority of their military structure and then ingrain in them a sense of entitlement and of being above the law really doesn't help.

10 tons TNT is smaller then some conventional bombs.

Can you carry one of those conventional bombs on your back? No? Does the conventional bomb spread radioactive fallout all over the area? No?

The smallest air delivered nuclear weapon has a much bigger yield than just about every conventional bomb except maybe the newest and heaviest FAEs being developed.

Can you carry one of those conventional bombs on your back? No? Does the conventional bomb spread radioactive fallout all over the area? No?

The smallest air delivered nuclear weapon has a much bigger yield than just about every conventional bomb except maybe the newest and heaviest FAEs being developed.

Part of the problem with the latest FAE's is that they could easily be mistaken for a battlefield nuke. The lack of radiation and neutron pulse isn't something immediately obvious, after all.

Best possible result: Marine Corps retains jurisdiction and prosecutes to the maximum allowed by law. I believe rape is still a death penalty offence under the UCMJ.

Part of the problem with the latest FAE's is that they could easily be mistaken for a battlefield nuke. The lack of radiation and neutron pulse isn't something immediately obvious, after all.

Generally, decision makers are the ones who get informed whether it's a nuke or not by qualified people before they push the button. At least in places where the football is in use.


Best possible result: Marine Corps retains jurisdiction and prosecutes to the maximum allowed by law. I believe rape is still a death penalty offence under the UCMJ.

Color my cynical, but I doubt they'd get anything even beyond a 6 month sentence.

I never did history, you telling us would have been much quicker.

Remember posting RTFM doesn't get anybody anywhere.

If I had the hour to give justice to the explanation, I would. I don't, unfortunately. In vast oversimplification: after World War II, when the Japanese had surrendered to the U.S./Allies (Not sure whether it was the Allies as a whole or the U.S.), a new constitution was written by a group of Americal Servicemen (I haven't done a lot of research on this, it's one of those things that would have taken an hour to get completely right. I assume that these were legal experts, however.) This Constitution introduced a form of Parliamentary Democracy, moved the power of the Emporer to the realm of the purely symbolic, and, most importantly, included Article 9, which reads:


ARTICLE 9. Aspiring sincerely to an international peace based on justice and order, the Japanese people forever renounce war as a sovereign right of the nation and the threat or use of force as means of settling international disputes.

In order to accomplish the aim of the preceding paragraph, land, sea, and air forces, as well as other war potential, will never be maintained. The right of belligerency of the state will not be recognized.

As a result, the U.S. is involved in a number of Treaties which bind it to defend Japan from attackers. On the issue of American presence on Japan proper, I don't have specifics memorized, but the vague explanation is that during the course of the surrender process: Americans were granted a large portion of Japan's northernmost island as a military base. It's generally seen as militarily important in case of problems in North Korea or China, which is why it is still one of the larger bases we have.

I'm sure that our residents of Japan and our former/current military members can probably give a more full and detailed explanation, and might well have corrections for me. I'd take their word over mine, given that my knowledge of Japanese history extends as far as Post-World War II history from the American History slant, and it's implications upon Japanese Governance through Japan as a Case-Study for Advanced Democracy in Comparitive Politics.

Color my cynical, but I doubt they'd get anything even beyond a 6 month sentence.

Rapists do not get a slap on the wrist if convicted under the military code of justice.

If these guys did in fact rape this girl, there is a very good chance that they are going to spend the rest of their lives turning big rocks into small rocks.

Of course, they have not been convicted yet. But that does not seem to matter to a lot of posters on this thread.

Just read and heres my piece:
HOW DARE THOSE SON OF BITHCS DO THAT, WHAT ARE THEY 2 FUCKING CHEAP TO BUY A HOOKER OR SOMETHING?, THE OFFENDING EXTREMITIES SHOULD BE RIPPED OUT!!!!!

There is a huge advantage to the Japanese in having American military there. It puts the American military in the way. If NK or China decide to attack Japan, especially by way of long range missles, America will consider it not just as an attack on an ally, but as an attack on America. At which point, the SDF (which has low projection of force rates, which is required by treaty and constitution) get to play a support role to the destruction of North Korea.

...And in other news a Canadian is arrested in Thailand for molesting little boys. I guess there are bad people everywhere...

Let them be gangbang-style raped by some big Japanese butt-lovers.


Yes, because two wrongs make a right. Great idea.

Just read and heres my piece:
HOW DARE THOSE SON OF BITHCS DO THAT, WHAT ARE THEY 2 FUCKING CHEAP TO BUY A HOOKER OR SOMETHING?, THE OFFENDING EXTREMITIES SHOULD BE RIPPED OUT!!!!!

Here's my suggestion to you:


Fix your caps lock button. It seems to have been left on. :p

Here's my suggestion to you:


Fix your caps lock button. It seems to have been left on. :p

He clearly doesnt know about Japanese culture either. Rape is just a polite way to say 'hello' in Japan.
Apparently nobody in this topic knows that either. The soldiers just wanted to immerse themselves in Japanese culture ;)

He clearly doesnt know about Japanese culture either. Rape is just a polite way to say 'hello' in Japan.
Apparently nobody in this topic knows that either. The soldiers just wanted to immerse themselves in Japanese culture ;)

Learning about Japanese culture from reading your Hentai collection is like doing a book report on The Scarlet Letter by watching the Demi Moore film.

:p

Learning about Japanese culture from reading your Hentai collection is like doing a book report on The Scarlet Letter by watching the Demi Moore film.

:p

What, you mean that anime ISNT an accurate representation of Japan and Japanese people?
Fuck! I was hoping to get a Japanese robo-wife with superpowers that transformed into a giant world-destroying battleship. Thing.

Learning about Japanese culture from reading your Hentai collection is like doing a book report on The Scarlet Letter by watching the Demi Moore film.

:p
Which one? Striptease?

When is there a good time to gang rape a 19 year old girl?Not during the summer. That's when most legislatures are on holiday and news is slow. Try about mid-November for best results.

Yes, because two wrongs make a right. Great idea.

it's an effective deterrent though, especially in more serious crimes.
if their punishment was to be raped themselves, by some truly repulsive smelly fat people, it would cause a reduction in crimes like these

it's an effective deterrent though, especially in more serious crimes.

Do you know where most pickpockets prior to the 20th century did most of their pickpocketing?
Public executions.
Often of pickpockets.

We shouldn't even have forces in Japan in the first place. Our overseas bases should be closed. Japan and Germany are more than capable of taking care of themselves. Both nations are economic powers. They can change their constitutions to allow for a military. We could use those troops to enforce our southern border.

When your home country (The US) is currently asking your host country (Japan) to pay more money for the privilege of having you there ( http://www.airforcetimes.com/news/2007/10/ap_japan_071008/ ), that is REALLY not the time to gang rape a 19-year-old woman.


http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20071019/ap_on_re_as/japan_us_rape

As an addendum (I can't find an English translation currently), NHK just reported that the Japanese police and government are calling on the US to turn over the Marines in question.

Smegging hell! Is it only me or modern day US soldiers can't go anywhere without raping something?! God!

When your home country (The US) is currently asking your host country (Japan) to pay more money for the privilege of having you there ( http://www.airforcetimes.com/news/2007/10/ap_japan_071008/ ),

We've just about done the rape thing to death. The Marines will be prosecuted and sent to jail, where they will be beaten and served fish heads and rice... Fine, that's exactly what they deserve, if they are guilty. Let's not forget Tawana Brawley...

But let's look at a different aspect of Nerv's post...
Is it a 'privilege' to be stationed in Japan? Or is it a duty that we've allowed ourselves to be burdened with? Surely, if we are supplementing the Japanese Self-Defense forces, or whatever they call themselves, we should be compensated.

Or is it a duty that we've allowed ourselves to be burdened with?
That one. It's what we had to do to make Japan give up its military.

That one. It's what we had to do to make Japan give up its military.
I think the Japanese are very comfortable with the arrangement. They get to spend much less for our presence, than they would have to spend otherwise... One would think they would be a much bigger philanthropic presence in the world...

When is there a good time to gang rape a 19 year old girl?

I was wondering the same thing...

I was wondering the same thing...

If they're wearing skimpy clothes they're pretty much asking for it. *sigh* When will women learn?This is a joke for anyone looking to burn a witch.

I think the Japanese are very comfortable with the arrangement. They get to spend much less for our presence, than they would have to spend otherwise... One would think they would be a much bigger philanthropic presence in the world...

Myrm... You do know that after us, Japan spends the 2nd largest amount of money on its military, right? And... You do also realize that a great deal of Japanese money is sent overseas as part of their Diplomatic system?

Way to make Americans look completely ignorant, man.

I think the Japanese are very comfortable with the arrangement. They get to spend much less for our presence, than they would have to spend otherwise... One would think they would be a much bigger philanthropic presence in the world...

Japan routinely donates more money to charity than the United States.

Myrm... You do know that after us, Japan spends the 2nd largest amount of money on its military, right? And... You do also realize that a great deal of Japanese money is sent overseas as part of their Diplomatic system?

Way to make Americans look completely ignorant, man.

That is incorrect. The UK, France, and Germany all spend more on their military (according to government published records) then Japan does. Additionally, it is likely that the PRC spends more then Japan.

Way to make Americans look completely ignorant, man.

That is incorrect. The UK, France, and Germany all spend more on their military (according to government published records) then Japan does. Additionally, it is likely that the PRC spends more then Japan.

Citing Oneill, "Case Studies In American Politics". What are your citations?

Citing Oneill, "Case Studies In American Politics". What are your citations?

Wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_and_federations_by_military_expenditures#_note-china).

Wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_and_federations_by_military_expenditures#_note-china).

Right. I'll take a Professor's book on Comparitive politics over Wiki any day.

Wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_and_federations_by_military_expenditures#_note-china).

OMG winz0r!!!!!

Right. I'll take a Professor's book on Comparitive politics over Wiki any day.

Ok, if that's not good enough for you, how about the Stockholm International Peace Research Institute (http://www.sipri.org/contents/milap/milex/mex_trends.html).

Scroll down to the bottom of the page, and click the PDF link to the 15 Major Spenders (http://www.sipri.org/contents/milap/milex/mex_major_spenders.pdf/download).

No doubt some in the admin would like to.

Kickbacks are fun but the Marines make better headlines. Sure they made a gross mistake here and beyond broke the law and they'll definitely be punished. Rape is a capital punishment in the military and I hope they see the injection chair but the Marines still kick ass. Ooh-rah!

I'd just like to point out that this is an alleged incident. The Marines are allegedly guilty.

So many people are assuming that US Marines are bloodthirsty animals who live only to kill, but will settle for gang-rape if they can't get murder. Let's remember that in America -- and I assume in Japan as well, since we pretty much wrote their constituion after WWII -- "innocent until proven guilty" is still the law.

If they did what she's accusing, then by all means castrate them and throw them in the deepest hole in the foulest prison in the coldest forest on Hokkaido. If not, it would be nice to hear an apology from all of you assuming the worst about these men.

Not that I expect that, of course.

Scroll down to the bottom of the page, and click the PDF link to the 15 Major Spenders (http://www.sipri.org/contents/milap/milex/mex_major_spenders.pdf/download).

I'm still more inclined to take the word of the good proffessor. However, either way, my remarks regarding the sheer ignorance of Myrm's statement remain viable in either case.

I'm still more inclined to take the word of the good proffessor. However, either way, my remarks regarding the sheer ignorance of Myrm's statement remain viable in either case.

Would you please find something on the internet to verify your claim? Part of me in inclined to think you're just making it up.

And I find it rather hypocritical that you pound on someone from being ignorant, but you post incorrect information.

Or are people like you exempt from hypocrisy?

Oh, and here's what GlobalSecurity (http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/world/spending.htm)has to say...

And Nationmaster (http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/mil_exp_dol_fig-military-expenditures-dollar-figure)...

Snip.

You might have a point if these weren't frequent complaints from Okinawa.

You might have another point if the rapists in this case didn't have a habit of being let off with a slap on the wrist.

Yeah, SIPRI seems to be what most websites cite when comparing military expenditures.

No matter the discrepancies, none say that Japan is #2.

Would you please find something on the internet to verify your claim? Part of me in inclined to think you're just making it up.

See, the difference is that my source is actually an academic source.

But, since you seem to like less verifiable sources:

- http://www.wanttoknow.info/usmilitaryspending
- http://www.atimes.com/atimes/Global_Economy/FH19Dj01.html (Assuming that the order they list indicates actual order, which appears to be the case)

I did, however, get the book title wrong. The title of the book is "Essential Readings in Comparitive Politics". My bad.

And I find it rather hypocritical that you pound on someone from being ignorant, but you post incorrect information.

Or are people like you exempt from hypocrisy?

And I find your willingness to jump to conclusions and hurl insults unprovoked to be distasteful and immature. My data is not nearly so clearly false as you would like to beleive. Nevertheless, my point to Myrm stands. Now why are you defending him? Let him defend himself.

See, the difference is that my source is actually an academic source.

But, since you seem to like less verifiable sources:

- http://www.wanttoknow.info/usmilitaryspending
- http://www.atimes.com/atimes/Global_Economy/FH19Dj01.html (Assuming that the order they list indicates actual order, which appears to be the case)

I did, however, get the book title wrong. The title of the book is "Essential Readings in Comparitive Politics". My bad.


Funneh enough, they don't cite their source for such information. I did. SIPRI is an academic organization. They are at least as credible (probably more) then this Professor you love to cite. Although I don't believe that they actually collected their own information in their Textbook. One wonders where they got their incorrect information?


And I find your willingness to jump to conclusions and hurl insults unprovoked to be distasteful and immature. My data is not nearly so clearly false as you would like to beleive. Nevertheless, my point to Myrm stands. Now why are you defending him? Let him defend himself.

I just don't really like it when people personally attack others due to their politics.

Oh, and you information isn't that incorrect. It's just off by a few billion USD. No biggie.

I just don't really like it when people personally attack others due to their politics.

When they earn it, they get it. Myrm's statement was insulting, arrogant, massively incorrect, and showed a disregard towards one of America's strongest allies that I found appalling. I may occasionally take shots at him merely for his politics, but in this case, he earned the whole response.

Oh, and you information isn't that incorrect. It's just off by a few billion USD. No biggie.

So you say. I suspect that there is a subtlety in the way the numbers were counted, to be honest. It wouldn't be suprising if both numbers were correct, from their own frame.

Now take it down a notch. You're coming across as as hotheaded as I usually do.

Wrong. That's Vietnam-era and before thinking. After having watched several enlisted Marines go to jail for DUI and other minor crimes, I can attest to the fact that the Marine Corps will not protect its own from prosecution by Japanese authorities.
Maybe, the US has withheld a number of US service men from prosecution in Japan. Currently SOAFA says that US personnel have to be turned over when convicted, something the Japanese police are more than a little annoyed with given that means they cannot actually question said suspects. Also, the US has a bad habit of transferring some people back to the US, out of reach of Japanese law. There's a number of women over here would would like their sailor lovers to pay child support.

*Snip*
Well, it's a little simplistic, and misses a number of things, but it's more or less right.

...And in other news a Canadian is arrested in Thailand for molesting little boys. I guess there are bad people everywhere...
Was that Canadian representing his country? Nope. Was he covered under an agreement which makes him not accessible to the same justice system that everyone else in the country, native or non, faces? Nope. Is Canada in the middle of demanding a large increase of money from Thailand? Nope? Do Canadian citizens swear to uphold the law of their nation? Are they supposed to embody such concepts as honor? And finally, do Canadians have a past problem with doing this in Thailand?

Why, the answer is no to all of the above, showing that you REALLY missed the whole point, didn't you?

When they earn it, they get it. Myrm's statement was insulting, arrogant, massively incorrect, and showed a disregard towards one of America's strongest allies that I found appalling. I may occasionally take shots at him merely for his politics, but in this case, he earned the whole response.


Considering you proposed that Japan hold tens of thousands of US Sailors, Soldiers, and Airmen hostage...

Close allies indeed.


So you say. I suspect that there is a subtlety in the way the numbers were counted, to be honest. It wouldn't be suprising if both numbers were correct, from their own frame.


Sigh. So, somehow, several billion USD worth of military expenditures just disappeared (or were added) somehow?

The guy must have printed his textbook with faulty information. It's the only logical conclusion.

Considering you proposed that Japan hold tens of thousands of US Sailors, Soldiers, and Airmen hostage...

I what? When and where? You either misunderstood me or misattributed a quote.

Sigh. So, somehow, several billion USD worth of military expenditures just disappeared (or were added) somehow?

The guy must have printed his textbook with faulty information. It's the only logical conclusion.

Or numbers were calculated differently, or the numbers were slightly older, or what constitutes "military spending" is debatable. You vastly oversimplify.

Moreover, your sources are more circumspect, given that they are political advocacy groups and wikipedia, and mine is an academic.

But let's look at a different aspect of Nerv's post...
Is it a 'privilege' to be stationed in Japan? Or is it a duty that we've allowed ourselves to be burdened with? Surely, if we are supplementing the Japanese Self-Defense forces, or whatever they call themselves, we should be compensated.
Oh... I'm going to LOVE this one. I really am.

1. The US wrote the current Japanese constitution forbidding war and maintaining weapons of war (Article 9).

2. The US, before the damn ink was dry, forced Japan to rearm by creating the Self Defense Force. It currently is trying to get Japan to revise Article 9 in order to have the SDF become a full fledged military capable of joining in on US missions. In fact the SDF was finally sent to an actual war zone (Iraq) for the first time since WWII because President Bush kept sending Rumsfield over to whine about it to (Then) Prime Minister Koizumi. The US, BTW, led the pack about complaining how Japan sat the first Gulf War out except for sending lots of money.

3. The US would not sign the San Francisco Peace Treaty, finally ending the occupation of Japan unless Japan agreed to host US military bases.

4. When it finally DID end the occupation, the US insisted on holding onto Okinawa until the '70's (27 years), with many of the previous land owners having been forced off of their lands for the bases and only given a fraction of what the land costs in return.

5. And for all of this, the US demands that Japan pay more to support the bases.

Oh yes, this was a true burden alright. Why, I'm sure the Mafia feels the same for their protection racket too.

I what? When and where? You either misunderstood me or misattributed a quote.


I did misattribute a quote. It was not you that said that. My deepest apologies.


Or numbers were calculated differently, or the numbers were slightly older, or what constitutes "military spending" is debatable. You vastly oversimplify.

Moreover, your sources are more circumspect, given that they are political advocacy groups and wikipedia, and mine is an academic.

If you looked, there were two tables on the Wikipedia page. One was from the CIA world factbook. The other was from SIPRI.

SIPRI is not an advocacy organization. It is an academic organization funded by the Swedish government. Their list was put together by an entire platoon of academics!

I did misattribute a quote. It was not you that said that. My deepest apologies.

I blame all the 'K' names around here. It seems like everyone and their brother has a name starting with 'K'.

If you looked, there were two tables on the Wikipedia page. One was from the CIA world factbook. The other was from SIPRI.

SIPRI is not an advocacy organization. It is an academic organization funded by the Swedish government. Their list was put together by an entire platoon of academics!

I suspect that my numbers are just old, in that case, and I'll concede the point.

Myrm... You do know that after us, Japan spends the 2nd largest amount of money on its military, right? And... You do also realize that a great deal of Japanese money is sent overseas as part of their Diplomatic system?

Way to make Americans look completely ignorant, man.

Don't know... The CIA fact book tells me that Japan spends 0.8% of it's GDP on the military. The United States spends 4%. Any way you measure it, we spend a lot more. That has to be a very good thing for the Japanese economy.

Now what did I say that was so ignorant? And why are you right?

Don't know... The CIA fact book tells me that Japan spends 0.8% of it's GDP on the military. The United States spends 4%. Any way you measure it, we spend a lot more. That has to be a very good thing for the Japanese economy.

Now what did I say that was so ignorant? And why are you right?
You're wrong by virtue of being Myrmidonisia. Apparently.

Oh... I'm going to LOVE this one. I really am.

1. The US wrote the current Japanese constitution forbidding war and maintaining weapons of war (Article 9).

2. The US, before the damn ink was dry, forced Japan to rearm by creating the Self Defense Force. It currently is trying to get Japan to revise Article 9 in order to have the SDF become a full fledged military capable of joining in on US missions. In fact the SDF was finally sent to an actual war zone (Iraq) for the first time since WWII because President Bush kept sending Rumsfield over to whine about it to (Then) Prime Minister Koizumi. The US, BTW, led the pack about complaining how Japan sat the first Gulf War out except for sending lots of money.

3. The US would not sign the San Francisco Peace Treaty, finally ending the occupation of Japan unless Japan agreed to host US military bases.

4. When it finally DID end the occupation, the US insisted on holding onto Okinawa until the '70's (27 years), with many of the previous land owners having been forced off of their lands for the bases and only given a fraction of what the land costs in return.

5. And for all of this, the US demands that Japan pay more to support the bases.

Oh yes, this was a true burden alright. Why, I'm sure the Mafia feels the same for their protection racket too.
As I recall Koizumi was one of the Japanese politicians that wanted to eliminate the self-defense force clause. I'm sure Japanese politicians are capable of independent action.

As far as the rest of the crap goes, losing a war has consequences.

Considering you proposed that Japan hold tens of thousands of US Sailors, Soldiers, and Airmen hostage...

Close allies indeed.


Events that are physically possible have little to do with current reality. I suggest you read the line a little more carefully next time.

Additionally, being close allies doesn't keep the US from treating them like shit apparently. How is what is going on any different from when Perry showed up in his black ships and played his racket hmm?

You're wrong by virtue of being Myrmidonisia. Apparently.
Nothing new there... I just didn't realize my wife was on the other end of the Ethernet cable.

As far as the rest of the crap goes, losing a war has consequences.

Well, it's good to know that if you spit on my lawn, I can blow your house to kingdom come and make you pay for the prison guards I have watching you.

So much for your "noble burden" of "protecting" Japan. Protecting in the "pay us or we'll torch you" sense.

Don't know... The CIA fact book tells me that Japan spends 0.8% of it's GDP on the military. The United States spends 4%. Any way you measure it, we spend a lot more. That has to be a very good thing for the Japanese economy.

Now what did I say that was so ignorant? And why are you right?

And? That doesn't change the fact that, compared to most of the rest of the world, Japan still spends a large amount. The claim that we are saving them any kind of money is, at best, erronius. Moreover, your cavelier dismissal of their foreign aid (Japan uses "pocketbook diplomacy", which is to say they spend a large amount on foreign aid as a means of replacing the threat of military force) showed a lack of understanding of how Japan functions. It is best not to critiscize a country when you do not understand how it works, or what it does. You come across as ignorant and belligerant. The last thing we need right now is to alienate our allies more by demonstrating more ignorance and belligerance.

And? That doesn't change the fact that, compared to most of the rest of the world, Japan still spends a large amount. The claim that we are saving them any kind of money is, at best, erronius. Moreover, your cavelier dismissal of their foreign aid (Japan uses "pocketbook diplomacy", which is to say they spend a large amount on foreign aid as a means of replacing the threat of military force) showed a lack of understanding of how Japan functions. It is best not to critiscize a country when you do not understand how it works, or what it does. You come across as ignorant and belligerant. The last thing we need right now is to alienate our allies more by demonstrating more ignorance and belligerance.
It's funny to have a criticism like this come from someone like you...

I've got quite a few business contacts with NEC and the JDA. I just spent several weeks fixing a satellite communications facility in Iioka. And you know what? They like me. Personally and professionally. They come to the U.S. and we visit local sights. They come to the house for drinks and dinner. I travel to Japan and the same thing happens.

Now, how deep do your contacts with Japan go?

I've got quite a few business contacts with NEC and the JDA. I just spent several weeks fixing a satellite communications facility in Iioka. And you know what? They like me. Personally and professionally.

And do you brag to them about how it's "America's burden" to protect Japan while Japan pays through the nose for that "protection"?

Try that. See how much they like you afterwards.

And do you brag to them about how it's "America's burden" to protect Japan while Japan pays through the nose for that "protection"?

Try that. See how much they like you afterwards.

It's not racketteering if it's done on a national scale.

Marines REALLY need to learn timing!

They can rape, but have to look to their calendar????? yep... didn't you know. Rape is legal every third Tuesday of the week.

When is there a good time to gang rape a 19 year old girl? that is only allowed on Feb 31st. between 12:00:00 and 12:00:01.

2. The US, before the damn ink was dry, forced Japan to rearm by creating the Self Defense Force. It currently is trying to get Japan to revise Article 9 in order to have the SDF become a full fledged military capable of joining in on US missions. In fact the SDF was finally sent to an actual war zone (Iraq) for the first time since WWII because President Bush kept sending Rumsfield over to whine about it to (Then) Prime Minister Koizumi. The US, BTW, led the pack about complaining how Japan sat the first Gulf War out except for sending lots of money. hmmm... I always thought the complaint was that Japan promised one amount but paid a much lesser amount.

4. When it finally DID end the occupation, the US insisted on holding onto Okinawa until the '70's (27 years), with many of the previous land owners having been forced off of their lands for the bases and only given a fraction of what the land costs in return. and I believe even till then the Japanese Government still looked down on the Okinawans, not considering them 'true Japanese'.


You know... this is the first time I've ever heard anyone say the US considers the Bases in Japan to be a "Burden".

Chances are, it will be a repeat of Timothy Woodland.

ahem:

814. ART. 14. DELIVERY OF OFFENDERS TO CIVIL AUTHORITIES
(a) Under such regulations as the Secretary concerned may prescribe, a member of the armed forces accused of an offense against civil authority may be delivered, upon request, to the civil authority for trial.
(b) When delivery under this article is made to any civil authority of a person undergoing sentence of a court-martial, the delivery, if followed by conviction in a civil tribunal, interrupts the execution of the sentence of the court-martial, and the offender after having answered to the civil authorities for his offense shall, upon the request of competent military authority, be returned to military custody for the completion of his sentence.


920. ART. 120. RAPE AND CARNAL KNOWLEDGE
(a) Any person subject to this chapter who commits an act of sexual intercourse with a female not his wife, by force and without consent, is guilty of rape and shall be punished by death or such other punishment as a court-martial may direct.
(b) Any person subject to this chapter who, under circumstances not amounting to rape, commits an act of sexual intercourse with a female not his wife who has not attained the age of sixteen years, is guilty of carnal knowledge and shall be punished as a court-martial may direct.
(c) Penetration, however slight, is sufficient to complete either of these offenses.

the first part is from sub-chapter II, apprehension and restraint. the second is rom the punitive articles. notice that DEATH is listed as a punishment. i don't know very many civilian rapists who could be tried as capital offenders (unless they kill their victims, that is).

It's not racketteering if it's done on a national scale.

You mean like how ethnic cleansing isn't murder? Or how one's bank balance makes one eccentric as opposed to utterly screw loose?

If some guy plowed his car into anyone else and caused their deaths, even if it's an accident, they lose their license. But not if you're wearing a uniform apparently.

That's just patently untrue. People are in fatal crashes constantly in the US, not all of them lose their DL. Heck, with the kind of crash rates we have here it would put a major dent in the economy.

As I recall Koizumi was one of the Japanese politicians that wanted to eliminate the self-defense force clause. I'm sure Japanese politicians are capable of independent action.
Actually, no. Koizumi was considering a change of status for the SDF to allow collective defense, not scrapping the article. AND he didn't bring it up till AFTER the US started in on him.

As far as the rest of the crap goes, losing a war has consequences.
Ah, pure Myrmidonisia, your point got demolished as so it must not matter at all.

It's funny to have a criticism like this come from someone like you...

I've got quite a few business contacts with NEC and the JDA. I just spent several weeks fixing a satellite communications facility in Iioka. And you know what? They like me. Personally and professionally. They come to the U.S. and we visit local sights. They come to the house for drinks and dinner. I travel to Japan and the same thing happens.

Now, how deep do your contacts with Japan go?
I live in Japan. I'm married to a fine Japanese lady, have a half Japanese son, work every single day with my Japanese colleagues and I travel all around Japan. You want to keep going?

Is this really a reflection of the armed forces?

Are there really not Japanese citizens who would do the same thing?

Are these two stories really related?

That's just patently untrue. People are in fatal crashes constantly in the US, not all of them lose their DL. Heck, with the kind of crash rates we have here it would put a major dent in the economy.

Really? We have a demerit system here for keeping your license. Killing someone in a car crash if it can be proven to be negligence on your side, i.e. you hit someone and not the other way round, means you lose your license.

hmmm... I always thought the complaint was that Japan promised one amount but paid a much lesser amount.
The US also complained how Japan did not provide any manpower or equipment, due to Article 9.

and I believe even till then the Japanese Government still looked down on the Okinawans, not considering them 'true Japanese'.
A lot of Okinawans believe that is still so, given how Okinawa has, by far, the lion's share of US military bases and presence. Okinawa feels that mainland Japan considers them the dumping ground, which is why, if true, this rape will really cause problems. This happened in Yamaguchi Prefecture, on Honshu, so its going to be harder for the central government to ignore.

I live in Japan. I'm married to a fine Japanese lady, have a half Japanese son, work every single day with my Japanese colleagues and I travel all around Japan. You want to keep going?

Yes but HOW DEEP is your connection! :D

oh, a son! is this the newest addition to the Nervun family?

Is this really a reflection of the armed forces?
Japan has seen, within the last few years, a few cases of rape caused by US military forces. It does not reflect well on people who supposedly are the cream of the crop.

Are there really not Japanese citizens who would do the same thing?
Again, the difference being that Japan isn't sending its young men over to the US to represent Japan while demanding that the US pay for this and then raping an American woman.

Are these two stories really related?
Irony, it's rather ironic that the US is pressuring Japan to pay for for US bases on Japanese soil and then to have something like this happen.

Yes but HOW DEEP is your connection! :D
Where the heck is that trout! ;)

oh, a son! is this the newest addition to the Nervun family?
Yup! My son was born 4 weeks ago, which is why I haven't been on much as of late, he needs a lot of diapers changed. :p

The US also complained how Japan did not provide any manpower or equipment, due to Article 9. ah, but Manpower and equiptment doesn't mean soldiers, it could mean support personnel. but without knowing exactly what was promised or delivered... :cool:

A lot of Okinawans believe that is still so, given how Okinawa has, by far, the lion's share of US military bases and presence. Okinawa feels that mainland Japan considers them the dumping ground, which is why, if true, this rape will really cause problems. This happened in Yamaguchi Prefecture, on Honshu, so its going to be harder for the central government to ignore.

Except the Rape in the 90's led to the soldier being tried and found guilty. And there are articles that allow the civilians to have US military on trial.

The only question is whether or not the Washington boys screw it up.

Where the heck is that trout! ;)


Yup! My son was born 4 weeks ago, which is why I haven't been on much as of late, he needs a lot of diapers changed. :p

*ahem*

CONGRATULATIONS!!!

Yup! My son was born 4 weeks ago, which is why I haven't been on much as of late, he needs a lot of diapers changed. :p

And 2 am feedings. :p

Congratulations Nervun. Try not to fall asleep on the keyboard. Keyboard face isn't pretty. :p

*ahem*

CONGRATULATIONS!!!
Thank you. :D

And 2 am feedings. :p
And 4 am feeding and 5:30 am diaper change... sleep has become a rarity at my house as of late. ;)

Yup! My son was born 4 weeks ago, which is why I haven't been on much as of late, he needs a lot of diapers changed. :p

Congratulations dude, hope he doesn't drive you crazy with the feedings and the diapers, what did you name him?

And 4 am feeding and 5:30 am diaper change... sleep has become a rarity at my house as of late. ;)

Maybe you ought to set up an alternating sleep cycle. It might help lessen the lack of sleep problem.

So much for getting Japan to pay more...:(

Those Marines have done their country a disfavour, which should be deduced from their pay!

LOL? I hope it is more then their pay. It is a few bad people that give America a bad image. All the good incidents are never reported but when one bad thing happens people are all over it. I hate the media.

LOL? I hope it is more then their pay. It is a few bad people that give America a bad image. All the good incidents are never reported but when one bad thing happens people are all over it. I hate the media.

Only that the "few bad people" seem to match some smaller countries whole population. Probably a matter of perspective. :D

I am female, I am American, I have always respected and supported the USMC unreservedly, but let me tell you this...if one, much less four, of the 'misguided children' did this - the USMC & our government had better turn them over to the Japanese immediately.

I don't care who, when and much less why- Rape is unacceptable peroid the end.