NationStates Jolt Archive

Dobbs made a comic about the level of hall monitoring going on lately that has gotten people like his, DCD's and now Fass's nation banned.

I thought I would share it along with starting a discussion about the point it makes and see if you agree or disagree:
http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j315/crashcow/Thinkspeak/Junior.jpg


Wellz?

I thought Dobbs was banned too. Never heard it officially, until now.

I thought Dobbs was banned too. Never heard it officially, until now.

Well he was just getting a week ban or something and then his wife created a nation and chimed in on the thread in moderation which made the mods accuse him of skirting the ban (same IP address obviously) I believe which got him the DEAT

The artwork didn't match the dialogue.

The artwork didn't match the dialogue.

:rolleyes:

I'd hate to disagree with 'look on the bright side of life' Kyronea, but this forum really has gone to shit.

Bah, fuck it, I'm not even interested enough to bother posting in this thread, much less the rest of this forum lately.

The artwork didn't match the dialogue.

I thought he did a great job at taking one comic and making about what he wanted it to be about.

At least it's pg-13 for NSG!

I'd hate to disagree with 'look on the bright side of life' Kyronea, but this forum really has gone to shit.

Bah, fuck it, I'm not even interested enough to bother posting in this thread, much less the rest of this forum lately.

Well, I happen to like it for what it is. I think some people are letting their personal feelings about certain people or certain opinions influence their judgment.

If you see problems being addressed incorrectly, speak up. If you see a problem not being addressed, report it! Don't just let it go and then complain about it not being taken care of. Mods are human. They're not super-intelligent robots capable of spotting every little problem.

I'd hate to disagree with 'look on the bright side of life' Kyronea, but this forum really has gone to shit.

Bah, fuck it, I'm not even interested enough to bother posting in this thread, much less the rest of this forum lately.

It's gone to shit for you because you don't like it.

Go then, if there's one thing making this forum depressing it's people coming in to say 'why isn't it like the old days'.

It's like high-school leavers hanging around the gates trying to remember when they were 'cool'.

The comic wasn't bad however, did Dobbsworld actually draw it? He has talent.

but I think the point is that as we get rid of the more risque posters people get bored and look for smaller and smaller infractions to report people for and things get stale. I'm guessing that Neesika wants less people reported, so she probably doesn't want to go about reporting more people just to get back at the lynch mobs.

I saw nothing wrong with what Fass posted. He didn't seem to be attacking anyone personally, moreso just religion. Which is fair game.

I call a bias against atheists here.

Bah, fuck it, I'm not even interested enough to bother posting in this thread, much less the rest of this forum lately.me gustaria que te quedes.. eres parte importante de esta fiesta.

si es Fass el que te preocupa.. el va a volver.

:eek: I'm telling on this thread!

Wait a minute. Dobbs, DCD, AND Fass were ALL banned? WTF???? IT like NSG's politics tilt the exact opposite of real life. Who was the dumbsh*t that banned them?

(yes I fully expect to receive the same, ham-handed "punishment" for using a naughty word, even though I included the asterisk...)

Wait a minute. Dobbs, DCD, AND Fass were ALL banned? WTF???? IT like NSG's politics tilt the exact opposite of real life. Who was the dumbsh*t that banned them?

(yes I fully expect to receive the same, ham-handed "punishment" for using a naughty word, even though I included the asterisk...)

That's the thing about NS Mods, they don't care about the popularity of the poster, because they have a job to do, and that is to make sure this forum is run by the rules.

This is just like when I first got here and the mods had just been instituted and a bunch of whiners loaded up the whine boat and went to their own little forum where they could whine to each other about how mean and put down they were. And they all went "waa waa waa, why they so mean!!!" and some of the whiners would hang around here and smuggly hint about their little whiner island. And when they were all whined out their little whiner island faded away.

Same story, same whining, different little whiner island.

The only real benefit is that eventually they all go to their little whiner island and we don't have to hear their whining for a while.

So you don't think things have gotten duller around here?

Dobbs made a comic about the level of hall monitoring going on lately that has gotten people like his, DCD's and now Fass's nation banned.

I thought I would share it along with starting a discussion about the point it makes and see if you agree or disagree:
http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j315/crashcow/Thinkspeak/Junior.jpg


Wellz?

Dobbs's comic is hilarious.

But, I've just read what led to his getting banned and he deserved it. It saddens me, because I liked him a lot. But I'm not blind to how he violated the rules.

I haven't read what DCD and Fass did (yet), but I expect I will probably find they wouldn't play within the rules.

Overall, I think Moderation gives us some leeway and only comes down hard on those that won't take hints and persist in rule-breaking. I don't always agree with the Mods, but I think they generally are fair.

I guess if you really think the situation has gotten so bad, you need to find another Forum. I think that would be unfortunate.

(FYI, I've already taken my sleep meds for the night and probably shouldn't be posting. Hopefully what I said above makes sense (and won't get me in any trouble).)

So you don't think things have gotten duller around here?


People being dicks has never been what entertains me around here, so no. I'm here for the exchange of ideas. If I wanted people being assholes I'd post on the IMDb forums. Or, frankly, any forum on the internet.

What the whiners want is readily available pretty much everywhere on the web.

Frankly the only thing that is really boring is the whining.

Dobbs's comic is hilarious.

But, I've just read what led to his getting banned and he deserved it. It saddens me, because I liked him a lot. But I'm not blind to how he violated the rules.

I haven't read what DCD and Fass did (yet), but I expect I will probably find they wouldn't play within the rules.

Overall, I think Moderation gives us some leeway and only comes down hard on those that won't take hints and persist in rule-breaking. I don't always agree with the Mods, but I think they generally are fair.

I guess if you really think the situation has gotten so bad, you need to find another Forum. I think that would be unfortunate.

(FYI, I've already taken my sleep meds for the night and probably shouldn't be posting. Hopefully what I said above makes sense (and won't get me in any trouble).)

Actual CTOAN is right to an extent. We did find another forum and do have a thread where we are talking about the state of NSG.

I think the mods are more often fair than not. I did have my own, however many day, ban once for posting stuff that was supposedly worse than PG 13 that was nothing worse than what everybody else was posting, and people that posted worse stuff in that same thread were untouched. When I tried to go plead my case I was belittled by a couple different mods. Sure they don't have to explain anything if they don't want to to me but the way they treated me personally was unnecessary.

I remember people used to freely call each other asshat, but now i hear of people getting bans for it.


Nite nite Cat-Tribe! It's good to see you on the board again lately :)

People being dicks has never been what entertains me around here, so no. I'm here for the exchange of ideas. If I wanted people being assholes I'd post on the IMDb forums. Or, frankly, any forum on the internet.

What the whiners want is readily available pretty much everywhere on the web.

Frankly the only thing that is really boring is the whining.

The only person i can think of that was generally dickish to everyone in my three listed in the OP was Fass. Dobbs and DCD didn't generally attack people did they?

The only person i can think of that was generally dickish to everyone in my three listed in the OP was Fass. Dobbs and DCD didn't generally attack people did they?

DCD was banned for wishing rape on people, and Dobbs was a relentless dick to all kinds of people, heaping more insult on people he didn't like than he would any sort of real debate. Even in your whiner's paradise wasn't there just pages of Dobbs digging into another poster? (I'm being coy, I know there was and think the two are peas in a pod)

The fact of the matter is that these guys were entertaining (if they were at all) in spite of their dickishness, not because of it. And if they could maintain then it wouldn't be a problem.

Seriously, this song and dance ain't new.

Like the Swallows to Capistrano, the tides, religion/atheist threads, or gun control threads, this is just another cycle in a long running forum. Nothing new to see here, just the same ol'.

The only person i can think of that was generally dickish to everyone in my three listed in the OP was Fass. Dobbs and DCD didn't generally attack people did they?

You seem to lack reading comprehension. Dobbs and DCD both attacked people regularly...DCD would usually do it in a sarcastic "I'm just kidding" manner but he'd still do it. As for Dobbs...Dobbs was just angry.

Wellz?I agree. But then, I disagree with the mod version of the three strike policy. I fail to see why the fuck X & Y need different punishment, simply because X have beeen DEATed in the past.

But then again, I generally fail to see why anyone needs punishment for attacking an intellectual construct like religion. Fuck it, Dawkins called it a virus. If I post a direct quote, will I get DEATed too?

I've never been comfortable with people running to the mods anyway. It's just weak, and smacks of the weedy kid nobody liked in school.

This is just like when I first got here and the mods had just been instituted and a bunch of whiners loaded up the whine boat and went to their own little forum where they could whine to each other about how mean and put down they were. And they all went "waa waa waa, why they so mean!!!" and some of the whiners would hang around here and smuggly hint about their little whiner island. And when they were all whined out their little whiner island faded away.

Same story, same whining, different little whiner island.

The only real benefit is that eventually they all go to their little whiner island and we don't have to hear their whining for a while.

Stop whining.

Dobbs made a comic about the level of hall monitoring going on lately that has gotten people like his, DCD's and now Fass's nation banned.

I thought I would share it along with starting a discussion about the point it makes and see if you agree or disagree:
http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j315/crashcow/Thinkspeak/Junior.jpg


Wellz?

http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j315/crashcow/Thinkspeak/Junior.jpg

^ Is that the comic?

Because if it is I can't see it (stupid workplace filter) :(.


If it isn't, where is this comic?

And when did Dobbs get deleted?

The first minute of this video (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u_n5JWzj6yU) should be standard Mod response to complaints about 'rules'.

The rest should be watched for pure amusement.

'People I like are getting banned and it's everyone else's fault'

Don't like the rules, don't post, make your own forum, etc.

Same story, same whining, different little whiner island.

If we're thinking about the same other forum, it's still limping along.

It doesn't matter how many people complain or how long they complain for, the mods are pretty adamant in their decision once it's done. Though while some people believe it's unfair, they are doing their best.

Not much you can do about it.

That reminds me of a quote in my sig from when DCD got his perma-ban:

Risottia - I bet most of NSG trolls will take the deletion of DCD as the proof that this forum is full of godless commies and ruled by KGB officers to boot.

And too bad about Fass... I liked that godless hellraiser. :)

I'm totally out of the loop. Is it possible to link to something that will clue me in on what y'all are talking about?

In my months of lurking on these boards, prior to finally creating a nation, I noted a few interesting characters -- individuals, if you will -- that seemed to be set apart from the generic forum idealogues that have been the norm on Internet message boards since Usenet was all that there was on offer.

I'd pegged Fassigen as one of those 'interesting characters'. Intelligent and eloquent, able to converse knowledgably across a broad spectrum of scientific disciplines, aware of the tenets of most major philisophies and (my interpretation) generally staying out of threads unless he had information relevant to the topic. I stood slightly in awe of his multilingualism, conscious that it showed up my own (British) education as hopelessly inadequate. However, like so many other good posters on so many other boards over the years, he became something of a single-issue attack dog... attacking anything remotely anti-homosexual and using the well-worn arguments against religions' intolerance of homosexuality as his weapons of choice.

I sympathise, I really do. It'd be very hard indeed to find anyone as anti-religion as I am. I don't often express my feelings about it on NSG because I believe that it's a pointless waste of time to attempt to logically argue against any faith-based ideology. Perhaps, as a white heterosexual male living in a reasonably free society, I don't have the same impetus to post. I don't know.

I see that one of the Moderator comments in the thread (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=539959) about his banning refers to a previous thread that had been raised by an objector, and the Mod notes that "it was because of Fass' one-line replies insulting anyone who disagreed with him versus the OP in that thread's multi-quote replies addressing actual arguments and evidence". This is understandable... one line replies, if they contain anything remotely objectionable, are going to stick out like a sore thumb and are always more likely to provoke a response than a well-measured point-by-point rebuttal. Sadly, that's just the nature of a conversational message board. It takes time to prepare and submit a measured response, time that you simply don't have on a busy thread (unless you are happy to have your reply to something buried several pages deeper into the discussion). This is the primary reason that I don't get involved in many of the discussions on here (no great loss, I am sure).

With all that said, I can see the reasons for the Moderators' decision - repeat offences against the rules that we all have access to must be penalised. I just hope that the other 'interesting' posters whose opinions I value, even when I disagree with them utterly, don't fall into the same trap anywhere along the way.



(Addendum: I've just realised how much the top section of this post reads like an obituary... that wasn't the intent.)

But then again, I generally fail to see why anyone needs punishment for attacking an intellectual construct like religion. Fuck it, Dawkins called it a virus. If I post a direct quote, will I get DEATed too?
Have you even read Fass's posts in the thread which got him banned? He was flaming and trolling up a storm. You're just as sad as those weirdos that complain about a left-wing bias in the moderation.

Yawn.

Time for this already? And only two pages? Man... in the good old days, when we banned Beeker, we had, like, a 3000 page post ten seconds after it happened. Hell, even that was nothing. Why, when the first IP ban ever was handed out (wonder if any of you youngin's know who got it), the world literally exploded!

Kids these days... they don't know how good it used to be...

I'm totally out of the loop. Is it possible to link to something that will clue me in on what y'all are talking about?

Fass got banned, and as usual when a big character on NSG gets banned, people are less than pleased with this decision and are looking for someone to blame. Apparently NSG as a whole is to blame in this case, for not being more tolerant of rule breaking from certain posters.

At least, that's how it looks to me.

Having had people whinge, stomp their feet, threaten me with legal action, stalk me across different boards etc for putting their off-topic shite in a new thread, let alone when I delete their tirades/get jiggy with teh banhammer, I rarely chime in on these.....But in this case I have to presume Fass did something far worse at some stage that I'm entirely unaware of, as that last didn't seem to merit it by a long shot........

I'm totally out of the loop. Is it possible to link to something that will clue me in on what y'all are talking about?here is the link
http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=539959

There is only one Fass.. the one and only.

So Fass if you are reading this... be aware that we want you back.

Having had people whinge, stomp their feet, threaten me with legal action, stalk me across different boards etc for putting their off-topic shite in a new thread, let alone when I delete their tirades/get jiggy with teh banhammer, I rarely chime in on these.....But in this case I have to presume Fass did something far worse at some stage that I'm entirely unaware of, as that last didn't seem to merit it by a long shot........

Well, see, that's not the point. It wasn't just one huge action, but a compilation of actions over and over and over again. Repeated behavior chipping away, as it were...death by a thousand cuts.

And Fass has had a nation deleted before...his first nation was simply Fass. (Though I think he said something about leaving...I can't recall.) After that, he returned later with Fassigen. He should have learned the rules better and because he didn't and kept up the activity his nation was deleted again.

But he isn't banned. He can make a new nation.

It doesn't matter how many people complain or how long they complain for, the mods are pretty adamant in their decision once it's done. They really dont have a choice.

Its like what they teach at the Law enforcement (police) school.. Once you handed the ticket.. NEVER take it back.

If I was the owner of this Forum, I would instruct the Mods to stick with their own decisions... even if they -ever- regret a decision made seconds ago, a mod should never change his own decision -over the pressure by- for the friends of the penalized player.
<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<

Having said that:
(disclaimer: I am not asking the mods to change their decision)

I did read that 6000 thread + the IDF hall-monitoring thread.. but I cant point the reason why Fass was banned, DCD penalty was a clear-cut case, and I dont know why Dobbs was penalized -I would like to have a link-

(disclaimer: I am not asking the mods to change their decision)

Well, see, that's not the point. It wasn't just one huge action, but a compilation of actions over and over and over again. Repeated behavior chipping away, as it were...death by a thousand cuts.

And Fass has had a nation deleted before...his first nation was simply Fass. (Though I think he said something about leaving...I can't recall.) After that, he returned later with Fassigen. He should have learned the rules better and because he didn't and kept up the activity his nation was deleted again.

But he isn't banned. He can make a new nation.

I thought Fass(the nation) was auto-deated for inactivity :confused:

here is the link
http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=539959

Ahh, much appreciated!

So we've got one thread saying of evil the Mods are and how they have an obvious liberal bias and ONLY go after those folks with conservative view points...

And this is ANOTHER thread that mirrors it, only accusing the Mods of conservative bias.

The irony is pretty thick here, don't you think?

The point is, no matter how entertaining some folks can be, no matter how well liked, it ain't their forum. They don't own it and they are not above the rules. The rules apply to people with post counts in the 10,000 range and multi year history as much as they do to the newest newbie.

So we've got one thread saying of evil the Mods are and how they have an obvious liberal bias and ONLY go after those folks with conservative view points...

And this is ANOTHER thread that mirrors it, only accusing the Mods of conservative bias.

The irony is pretty thick here, don't you think?

The point is, no matter how entertaining some folks can be, no matter how well liked, it ain't their forum. They don't own it and they are not above the rules. The rules apply to people with post counts in the 10,000 range and multi year history as much as they do to the newest newbie.

Clearly the mods have a pro-centrist bias, and go around wildly banning everyone who doesn't toe the centrist party line. :rolleyes:

Clearly the mods have a pro-centrist bias, and go around wildly banning everyone who doesn't toe the centrist party line. :rolleyes:
That MUST be it! ;)

So we've got one thread saying of evil the Mods are and how they have an obvious liberal bias and ONLY go after those folks with conservative view points...

And this is ANOTHER thread that mirrors it, only accusing the Mods of conservative bias.


In fairness, I don't think liberal or conservative really comes into it - certainly not in my mind anyway, and not regard to the Fass fella....However I'll keep the bheal dunta....

I thought Fass(the nation) was auto-deated for inactivity :confused:

Was it? I got the impression from the mods that Fass the nation was deleted by them.

Clearly the mods have a pro-centrist bias, and go around wildly banning everyone who doesn't toe the centrist party line. :rolleyes:
You know, in all my time on NS General, I have never received an official reprimand or ban that I know of.

I think it is clear that the mods have a pro-Bottle bias. Those who fail to conform to the ideal standard of Bottleity will be purged.

Was it? I got the impression from the mods that Fass the nation was deleted by them.
I don't know, I didn't really notice he was gone the first time until a few weeks after. I didn't recall any talk of bans, so I assumed that he just drifted away.
You know, in all my time on NS General, I have never received an official reprimand or ban that I know of.

I think it is clear that the mods have a pro-Bottle bias. Those who fail to conform to the ideal standard of Bottleity will be purged.

I can think of worse standards to hold myself too ;)

You know, in all my time on NS General, I have never received an official reprimand or ban that I know of.yeah but thats because you are Max Barry :D

You know, in all my time on NS General, I have never received an official reprimand or ban that I know of.

I think it is clear that the mods have a pro-Bottle bias. Those who fail to conform to the ideal standard of Bottleity will be purged.

Oooh, is this Bottleanity again? Do we get to have more arguments over plastic or glass?

I don't know, I didn't really notice he was gone the first time until a few weeks after. I didn't recall any talk of bans, so I assumed that he just drifted away.


Well, take a look at the thread in Moderation...one of them--I think GMC Military Arms--says something about Fass's deletion that gives the impression they deleted Fass the nation.

Well, take a look at the thread in Moderation...one of them--I think GMC Military Arms--says something about Fass's deletion that gives the impression they deleted Fass the nation.

In fact, I can do one better:

http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=13106564&postcount=5

Was there a 'MODS ARE TEH BIASED!11!1!!' thread that time too?

Dobbs made a comic about the level of hall monitoring going on lately that has gotten people like his, DCD's and now Fass's nation banned.

I thought I would share it along with starting a discussion about the point it makes and see if you agree or disagree:
http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j315/crashcow/Thinkspeak/Junior.jpg


Wellz?

I read Fass's thread and yea...he violated the rules and received punishment. The Punishment fit the crime. As for DCD, I am still not sure what he did.

In fact, I can do one better:

http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=13106564&postcount=5

Not to mention the prior deletion for the same trolling and flamebaiting. Had it been someone with no previous warnings and warn history, they would likely have received a "Knock it off" slap on the wrist sort of warning. With all the warnings Fass has received over the past 2 years, he really ought to know better by now.

Oooh, is this Bottleanity again? Do we get to have more arguments over plastic or glass?

Is her first commandment "Thou shalt recycle"? :D

Wait a minute. Dobbs, DCD, AND Fass were ALL banned? WTF???? IT like NSG's politics tilt the exact opposite of real life. Who was the dumbsh*t that banned them?

(yes I fully expect to receive the same, ham-handed "punishment" for using a naughty word, even though I included the asterisk...)

I believe Reptoids took care of Fass. As for the others, no clue.

Dobbs made a comic about the level of hall monitoring going on lately that has gotten people like his, DCD's and now Fass's nation banned.

I thought I would share it along with starting a discussion about the point it makes and see if you agree or disagree:
http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j315/crashcow/Thinkspeak/Junior.jpg


Wellz?

I like it.

I did also such things a long time ago.
I remember that the OPs of the IRC channel didn't like it -> Perm Ban! :)

So we've got one thread saying of evil the Mods are and how they have an obvious liberal bias and ONLY go after those folks with conservative view points...

And this is ANOTHER thread that mirrors it, only accusing the Mods of conservative bias.

The irony is pretty thick here, don't you think?

The point is, no matter how entertaining some folks can be, no matter how well liked, it ain't their forum. They don't own it and they are not above the rules. The rules apply to people with post counts in the 10,000 range and multi year history as much as they do to the newest newbie.

Indeed. Even my first nation was deleted because I flamed and trolled constantly because I was in a furious mood over something that I cannot simply remember.

As for DCD, I am still not sure what he did.DCD called -multiple times- for teh ebil Muslims and their children to be raped.

I read Fass's thread and yea...he violated the rules and received punishment. The Punishment fit the crime. As for DCD, I am still not sure what he did.

IMS he advocated someone getting raped. Don't remember who.

Is her first commandment "Thou shalt recycle"? :D
I have no idea.

Reptoids

Reploid, not Reptoids.

That's the thing about NS Mods, they don't care about the popularity of the poster, because they have a job to do, and that is to make sure this forum is run by the rules.

Aye, so while I'm not entirely sold on the reasoning behind their banishment of these posters, I also feel that they've acted consistently when dealing with cases such as these. If only our justice system treated folks as equally as the mods did...then OJ would have been in jail a long time ago :D

Was there a 'MODS ARE TEH BIASED!11!1!!' thread that time too?

I don't know. Might try searching for it.

Damn time warps making me miss this post...

Was it? I got the impression from the mods that Fass the nation was deleted by them.

I'm just picking one of these speculation questions at random to answer.

Fass (the nation) was deleted for pretty much doing exactly what he was doing this time. The irony of this Nanny State complaint is that Fass was one of the most vigerous posters in moderation, reporting many a thread and many a poster. There was a time when you could count on looking in on Moderation and seeing at least three or four reporting threads started by Fass, not to mention him inserting his opinion in everyone elses reporting threads (despite being fond of putting "Mods only" in his). So this complaining about the Junior Hall-Monitoring is really over the deletion of one of NSGs most active Junior Hall Monitors. Sort of ironic, really.

He came back as Baguetten, then did a thinly disguised mellodramatic, "Oh, I'm leaving you all" thing while still trying to affect his "I don't care" facade.

Then I think he got sick, or bored, or needed attention or whatever and came back as Fassigen.

I'm just picking one of these speculation questions at random to answer.

Fass (the nation) was deleted for pretty much doing exactly what he was doing this time. The irony of this Nanny State complaint is that Fass was one of the most vigerous posters in moderation, reporting many a thread and many a poster. There was a time when you could count on looking in on Moderation and seeing at least three or four reporting threads started by Fass, not to mention him inserting his opinion in everyone elses reporting threads (despite being fond of putting "Mods only" in his). So this complaining about the Junior Hall-Monitoring is really over the deletion of one of NSGs most active Junior Hall Monitors. Sort of ironic, really.

He came back as Baguetten, then did a thinly disguised mellodramatic, "Oh, I'm leaving you all" thing while still trying to affect his "I don't care" facade.

Then I think he got sick, or bored, or needed attention or whatever and came back as Fassigen.

Oh yeah, the Baguetten thing...I knew I was forgetting something.

Anyway, thank you Seatoan.

DCD called -multiple times- for teh ebil Muslims and their children to be raped.

Um, no, no he didn't. OD, your stance on 'those' topics is not such that disagreeing with you is equivalent to supporting rape.

He got banned for making a general statement about how people who supported censorship should be raped. Now, although I may be still too n00bish to count, personally, I thought the decision was too harsh, but I can't really blame the mods. It was rather unpleasant after all.

Anyway, thank you Seatoan.
That took me a second...

DCD called -multiple times- for teh ebil Muslims and their children to be raped.

Bullshit. DCD was banned for wishing the FCC and those who support censorship be gangraped by AIDS patients while their children watch, and it was clearly hyperbole, and not an actual wish. But go ahead...go and find all those horrible time he did what you claim.

Bullshit. DCD was banned for wishing the FCC and those who support censorship be gangraped by AIDS patients while their children watch, and it was clearly hyperbole, and not an actual wish. But go ahead...go and find all those horrible time he did what you claim.

And had anyone other than DCD said that you'd have been calling for their ban from the get go. But because he was an FoS you didn't.

It was disgusting, it was out of line, and hyperbole or no it was seriously offensive and flamebaity. DCD also had quite the past history. He deserved the DoS.

but I think the point is that as we get rid of the more risque posters people get bored and look for smaller and smaller infractions to report people for and things get stale. I'm guessing that Neesika wants less people reported, so she probably doesn't want to go about reporting more people just to get back at the lynch mobs.

It seems to be the cycle here. People whine because there's so much nastiness on here then people whine when the prickly people and the trolls get banned. Somewhere in all this, cool old-timers turn into embittered wankers.

And had anyone other than DCD said that you'd have been calling for their ban from the get go. But because he was an FoS you didn't.

It was disgusting, it was out of line, and hyperbole or no it was seriously offensive and flamebaity. DCD also had quite the past history. He deserved the DoS.

Oh save it. It was over the line, but it in no way merited a DoS, regardless of his past history. The fact is, in this forum, the longer you stick around, the more likely you are to become DoS. Why? Because the positives are absolutely not taken into account. Only the infractions. There is no right to appeal, (sorry, the appeal 'process' is a complete farce) and even behaving for over two years means nothing. I know you are incapable of questioning this and that's fine, be well...but those of us who do question, regardless of our position on the political spectrum DO have some valid points and simply making up a cute acronym (FoS oh ha ha) or screaming 'conspiracy theorists!' does nothing to actually address those points.

Bullshit. DCD was banned for wishing the FCC and those who support censorship be gangraped by AIDS patients while their children watch.meh..

The first time he was banned it was for posting -multiple times- his AIDS gang rape stuff against teh ebil muslims, and he was DoSed for the one against the FCC..

So yes you are rite.

Oh save it. It was over the line, but it in no way merited a DoS, regardless of his past history. The fact is, in this forum, the longer you stick around, the more likely you are to become DoS. Why? Because the positives are absolutely not taken into account. Only the infractions. There is no right to appeal, (sorry, the appeal 'process' is a complete farce) and even behaving for over two years means nothing. I know you are incapable of questioning this and that's fine, be well...but those of us who do question, regardless of our position on the political spectrum DO have some valid points and simply making up a cute acronym (FoS oh ha ha) or screaming 'conspiracy theorists!' does nothing to actually address those points.
I happen to like the FoS acronym(and in truth I respect you greatly for sticking up for your friends like this. You're a very good person, Sin) because I think it's cutely funny. But meh.

But I don't see why there really needs to be an appeal process apart from demonstrating that moderators are acting due to personal feelings or intent rather than the impartiality they are supposed to rule on. As much as you or I may not be very fond of it, this is NOT a democracy. It is a mostly benevolent dictatorship ruled by Max Berry and administered by the mods. And really, the mods are fair most of the time. Do I think they might occasionally go overboard? Perhaps. I know I've disagree with Frisbee plenty of times.

But both this case of Fass and DCD's case were perfectly justified and I'd have ruled in the exact same way had I been in their place. Friend or no, respected poster or no, positives or no, that's just not how this forum works.

So we've got one thread saying of evil the Mods are and how they have an obvious liberal bias and ONLY go after those folks with conservative view points...

And this is ANOTHER thread that mirrors it, only accusing the Mods of conservative bias.

The irony is pretty thick here, don't you think?
That's not ironic; that's just coincidental!

It seems to be the cycle here. People whine because there's so much nastiness on here then people whine when the prickly people and the trolls get banned. Somewhere in all this, cool old-timers turn into embittered wankers.
As the 'fringe elements' get picked off, the points of view within the commons shrinks. And as those 'fringe elements' go, the fringe also shrinks, and the perception of fringe gets closer to you. This is an NSG problem, not just a problem with the Mods, or caused by the mods. We have less diversity of opinion here, less diversity of personality. Yes, that represents a loss. This forum was a lot less PC before the whole 'move to PG-13 standard', and yet it was also a lot less nasty than it is right now.

I haven't seen a real trend of 'liberals' versus 'conservatives' being given the boot...the trend instead has been, more repeated reporting of posters that are disliked, and more booting period. All this praising of the 'rules' is patently ridiculous when certainty goes completely out the window when it comes to applying them. The process of warning/banning/deleting/DoSing is opaque and impenetrable.

No one needs to be respected just because of their amount of time here or their post count...but neither should those things work AGAINST them, which they certainly do. Aside from that issue is the fact that this forum feels a lot less like a community, which I would say it certainly has been, in different forms, influenced by different posters over the years...and a lot more like a place where we just can't wait to find someone 'rule breaking' so we can gleefully watch them go down. This forum isn't so much about debate anymore, as it is about playing a 'game', and whosoever gets booted 'loses' and those who manage to toe the line 'win'.

Oh save it. It was over the line, but it in no way merited a DoS, regardless of his past history. The fact is, in this forum, the longer you stick around, the more likely you are to become DoS. Why? Because the positives are absolutely not taken into account. Only the infractions. There is no right to appeal, (sorry, the appeal 'process' is a complete farce) and even behaving for over two years means nothing. I know you are incapable of questioning this and that's fine, be well...but those of us who do question, regardless of our position on the political spectrum DO have some valid points and simply making up a cute acronym (FoS oh ha ha) or screaming 'conspiracy theorists!' does nothing to actually address those points.

That's BS. Long time posters are given waaayy more rope and they are taken in to consideration. DCD got several warnings about the rape thing specifically, Fass never meet an insult he didn't like, even Eutrusca was the Teflon Troll for years. Years. These people carried on a lot longer than equally insulting or abrasive posters who didn't have their 'charm.'

And there are plenty of us who have been here for a long long time and haven't even managed a warning, much less a deletion. I think the read is accurate.

.. trend instead has been, more repeated reporting of posters that are disliked, and more booting period. If this is the case..
If repeated reporting -in gang- can influence a mod decision.. then I would think it can become a problem.

I dont know if this was the case for Fass.

But this does not apply to DCD.. If I was a Mod, I would have given him a week vacation on the first AIDS/rape/children post, banned on the second, DoS on the third. At the first time any-one-person report such wording.

and NSG mods gave him more warnings than that.

I happen to like the FoS acronym(and in truth I respect you greatly for sticking up for your friends like this. You're a very good person, Sin) because I think it's cutely funny. But meh. Kyronea, shocking as it may be, this is not about Fass, or DCD or Dobbs, or Eut, or anyone else in particular. I said my piece in Moderation about Fass, and I'm going to leave it at that.

What...you think I just got all huffy after DCD got banned and decided not to post out of devotion to him? You think I just got tired of repeated topics? I've been here three years Kyronea...I've seen the same topics over and over and I still wasn't bored...because there was always some new facet to explore. That really isn't the case anymore. Not because I've just 'seen it all', but because we simply do not have the range of posters we used to. Why? Well, I posit that it is because as I said...we've been 'picking off the fringe' a little too joyfully. This forum is certainly more than one poster, or any group of posters...but if after three years I wasn't tired of this place until it started getting nasty...then I'm sorry, but it wasn't just old-timer burnout, or sadness at my 'friends' getting the boot.

But I don't see why there really needs to be an appeal process apart from demonstrating that moderators are acting due to personal feelings or intent rather than the impartiality they are supposed to rule on. Well there you go, we agree on something, because this is one of the reasons I feel there needs to be an appeal process. But you know what would be BETTER than an appeal process? Knowing with more certainty, without fettering the discretion of the Mods, at what point you are actually going to get the boot...what is going to trigger it, and what you can do to avoid it...including a time frame after which you can be sure that your former wrongs are no longer laying in wait, ready at your next minor infraction, to just pull you down into a DoS.

Hey, I'm aware it's a private site. I'm aware that my opinion on this matter is not going to compell anyone affiliated with this site to do jack shit. I'm even fine with that. These are merely suggestions, from someone who used to love this place, and was highly addicted to it, and who now tends to avoid it for the reasons I've laid out. All I'm saying is...we get the kind of forum we deserve. If we make this forum more about hunting down rule-breakers, and less about debate...then what we are left with is a online shooting gallery, not a place for the exchange of ideas.

And there are plenty of us who have been here for a long long time and haven't even managed a warning, much less a deletion. I think the read is accurate.

Quite true.

It's not hard to follow the rules, and they aren't particularly strict or stringent. Keep your temper and keep your wits about you and you'll be fine. Generally, don't say anything you wouldn't say to your parents while drunk, and you ought to be fine. It's not that bad here, far more open to non-orthodox stuff than society in general.

You make solid points, and to be honest I can both agree with you and disagree with you. Agree with you in the sense that I think your model would be fairer and disagree in that I think the current model also suits things very well and does work.

While it does seem like there's less tolerance for insulting folks lately, overall it's mostly the same. Though it's a shame some of the most interesting posters are now banned, one of the reasons I found them interesting was because they constantly skirted the edge. I'll miss them. It feels like all the sudden the mods are cracking down on fun folks, but it may be coincidental that several perennial thin ice skaters went down all at once.

*cross fingers* My only mod warning has been for a too long sig. If I can be diplomatic and not say everything I think, surely it's not that hard.

Kyronea, shocking as it may be, this is not about Fass, or DCD or Dobbs, or Eut, or anyone else in particular. I said my piece in Moderation about Fass, and I'm going to leave it at that.

What...you think I just got all huffy after DCD got banned and decided not to post out of devotion to him? You think I just got tired of repeated topics? I've been here three years Kyronea...I've seen the same topics over and over and I still wasn't bored...because there was always some new facet to explore. That really isn't the case anymore. Not because I've just 'seen it all', but because we simply do not have the range of posters we used to. Why? Well, I posit that it is because as I said...we've been 'picking off the fringe' a little too joyfully. This forum is certainly more than one poster, or any group of posters...but if after three years I wasn't tired of this place until it started getting nasty...then I'm sorry, but it wasn't just old-timer burnout, or sadness at my 'friends' getting the boot.DCD is back.. just that he cant asume cos of the DoS order.

I also think that the mods migth eventually think DCD has learned his lesson and do the beeker thing..
Dont ask...

Quite true.

It's not hard to follow the rules, and they aren't particularly strict or stringent. Keep your temper and keep your wits about you and you'll be fine. I respect people who do keep their tempers, and who argue reasonably. I enjoy their contributions. But I also enjoy the contributions of the less measured, those who argue with more passion, less reason...or even those who are eminently reasonable but still wish to use sarcasm, or passion to get their points across. I don't have to agree, I don't even have to like how they do it...but it all serves a purpose.

If all the posters here kept their tempers, always spoke in measured tones and were completely reasonable 100% of the time...I'm sorry...but are you saying you wouldn't die of boredom?

Well, that may be true...but this would be a lot less attractive place for many of us.

On the other hand, I do think that the mods have been a bit too harsh of late. These sorts of behaviors have been fairly well tolerated in the past, and comparatively recently there's been a pretty severe crackdown, which is somewhat disappointing. Sucks a lot of fun out of this rusting, sinking hulk when we can't have bizarre dick waving contests, crudity and Dobbs' comics. Perhaps a more utilitarian formula should have been employed.

Who, I might add, should not have been permabanned.

And, OD, you're full of it as far as DCD is concerned.

DCD is back.. just that he cant asume cos of the DoS order. De que estas hablando? He isn't 'back' in any way, shape or form. So...:confused:

I also think that the mods migth eventually think DCD has learned his lesson and do the beeker thing..
Dont ask...Not the point.

I respect people who do keep their tempers, and who argue reasonably. I enjoy their contributions. But I also enjoy the contributions of the less measured, those who argue with more passion, less reason...or even those who are eminently reasonable but still wish to use sarcasm, or passion to get their points across. I don't have to agree, I don't even have to like how they do it...but it all serves a purpose.

If all the posters here kept their tempers, always spoke in measured tones and were completely reasonable 100% of the time...I'm sorry...but are you saying you wouldn't die of boredom?

Well, that may be true...but this would be a lot less attractive place for many of us.

Really nothing I can disagree with, I guess.

On the other hand, I do think that the mods have been a bit too harsh of late. These sorts of behaviors have been fairly well tolerated in the past, and comparatively recently there's been a pretty severe crackdown, which is somewhat disappointing. Sucks a lot of fun out of this rusting, sinking hulk when we can't have bizarre dick waving contests, crudity and Dobbs' comics. Perhaps a more utilitarian formula should have been employed.

Who, I might add, should not have been permabanned.

And, OD, you're full of it as far as DCD is concerned.

Thank you. I'm not a mod conspiracist, I have a lot of respect for people who would volunteer their time, very thanklessly, in this way. I'm not longing for a golden age that never existed. I am simply looking at a forum I used to care about a lot, with all the assorted oddballs, many of which I didn't interact with but nonetheless valued...and seeing a lot less 'us' and a lot more 'let's get em!'.

I've never been absent from Moderation. I agree we need to report some things to allow the forum to run more smoothly. I have also been sucked into the feeling of 'ooh, if I report so and so enough, he/she might get booted, oh what fun'...and it sickened me. It feels like for a while now, the joy of this forum is more about catching posters rule-breaking, and less about actual discussion.

me gustaria que te quedes.. eres parte importante de esta fiesta.

si es Fass el que te preocupa.. el va a volver.
Vamos a ver...y piensas que puedes hablar en Espanol y nosotros no puedemos entender?;)
but this forum really has gone to shit.
So leave instead of complaining.
I'm not even interested enough to bother posting in this thread, much less the rest of this forum lately.
Nooooooooooooooooooooooo!!!!:rolleyes:

So leave instead of complaining.

Keep reading pumpkin. As much as I dislike your points of view, I would actually be sad to see you go. We NEED that diversity of opinion, or this place loses its purpose.

Seconded.

Personally, I know that I post more frequently when there's somebody annoying me. I like being disagreed with around here, and I really really really like it when somebody disagrees with me in an aggressive and coarse manner. That makes for a good brawl.

I abide by the rules of Max's house, but that doesn't mean I like all the rules.
YES!!!!!

I don't want to argue with someone who agrees with me damnit! Part of the joy of NSG is the opportunity to hone your argument, to analyse it, to pick it apart and put it back together in order to counter the excellent points made to counter it. I have settled a lot of things in my mind through debate here, and I am extremely grateful for that opportunity. Controversy is essential to the free flow of ideas, and I like opponents that are not fence sitters, that are firm in their position, and that are passionate.

Keep reading pumpkin. As much as I dislike your points of view, I would actually be sad to see you go. We NEED that diversity of opinion, or this place loses its purpose.

Hear, hear. Hear, hear.

Keep reading pumpkin. As much as I dislike your points of view, I would actually be sad to see you go. We NEED that diversity of opinion, or this place loses its purpose.
Seconded.

Personally, I know that I post more frequently when there's somebody annoying me. I like being disagreed with around here, and I really really really like it when somebody disagrees with me in an aggressive and coarse manner. That makes for a good brawl.

I abide by the rules of Max's house, but that doesn't mean I like all the rules.

Seconded.

Personally, I know that I post more frequently when there's somebody annoying me. I like being disagreed with around here, and I really really really like it when somebody disagrees with me in an aggressive and coarse manner. That makes for a good brawl.

I abide by the rules of Max's house, but that doesn't mean I like all the rules.

I agree with you. Could you now stay away for a while? ;)

Keep reading pumpkin. As much as I dislike your points of view, I would actually be sad to see you go. We NEED that diversity of opinion, or this place loses its purpose.
Yes well I WON'T be leaving and to be honest, I don't want you to leave either...I just said it because you were bitching.:p I also come here because in real life, I'm generally the most political of the people I know, so I can either easily convince them of my views, or they just plain out don't care. Here, although I'd say a large majority don't agree with my views, it's refreshing to find some intelligent and healthy debate and arguement. And, while probably 90% of NSG won't beleive it, in real life I'm actually a really nice, chill guy who get's along with everyone on an individual level....and if there is ever an NS meetup around where I am, I'll go to it and then there will be proof.
Seconded.

Personally, I know that I post more frequently when there's somebody annoying me. I like being disagreed with around here, and I really really really like it when somebody disagrees with me in an aggressive and coarse manner. That makes for a good brawl.

I abide by the rules of Max's house, but that doesn't mean I like all the rules.
That post sorta made me hot. As the post went on, all I could think about was you saying how much you liked being sexually dominated. :p Sorry, but if I didn't tell you that I would have lost sleep at night.:p

But back to being serious, like Sin's post, I agree with yours.

That post sorta made me hot. As the post went on, all I could think about was you saying how much you liked being sexually dominated. :p Sorry, but if I didn't tell you that I would have lost sleep at night.:p

Wait...I think you have the wrong poster....

Keep reading pumpkin. As much as I dislike your points of view, I would actually be sad to see you go. We NEED that diversity of opinion, or this place loses its purpose.Absolutely. If it weren't for the frequent appearance of twits this place could turn into a total bore. Dixieanna is being very entertaining, but I don't think she'll last.

Controversy is essential to the free flow of ideas, and I like opponents that are not fence sitters, that are firm in their position, and that are passionate.
I used to believe in the idea of "all things in moderation." Events in this forum have compelled me to rethink that idea, on several levels. ;)

It doesn't help that my country (USA) is currently suffering from a hideous case of The False Middle. Everything, and I mean EVERYTHING, has to be about finding some supposedly "moderate" position between two equally extreme positions. If one side says the world is round and one side says it's flat, then by Gawd we all must agree that the appropriate stance is that the world is a rounded sort of flat shape, lest we be branded "extremist" for refusing to compromise with the flat-Earthers.

Wait...I think you have the wrong poster....
No, I know you're into that stuff too which is a bit hot, to be honest...but my comment was directed at Bottle and just the way she worded her post.

It really bothers me that Bottle is not a man. Being primarmrily straight, it interferes with me having hot nasty fantasies about someone.

Yes well I WON'T be leaving and to be honest, I don't want you to leave either...I just said it because you were bitching.:p I also come here because in real life, I'm generally the most political of the people I know, so I can either easily convince them of my views, or they just plain out don't care. Here, although I'd say a large majority don't agree with my views, it's refreshing to find some intelligent and healthy debate and arguement. And, while probably 90% of NSG won't beleive it, in real life I'm actually a really nice, chill guy who get's along with everyone on an individual level....and if there is ever an NS meetup around where I am, I'll go to it and then there will be proof.

I think all of us, on an individual level, would be perfectly capable of getting along with one other, even though their views might be radically different than our own. I believe that we used to have the ability to do that as much as is possible online, with the various 'social' threads that now get sent directly to jail, do not pass go, do not collect $200. I didn't care much for Tink's social threads (as one example), but I was damn glad they were there, and I would participate in some others.

I also agree that probably for a large majority of us, we talk more politics here on NSG than we get to in real life. I also find that it is waaaaay to easy to sway people to my viewpoint in real life, and it's boring. It isn't a challenge, and my viewpoints don't get the kind of work-over they get here. It can be an uncomfortable process having your beliefs analysed, and broken down, and having to really reevaluate where you stand on things...but it is frankly, THE most rewarding human exercise I can think of. (especially when it involves sex muahahahahaaha)

I want NSG to continue to be a place where the fringe, the right, the left, the moderate, and even the completely insane (LG love ya) mingle, create friction, and challenge one another.

I hope you like my new sig. More honest words have never been spoken. Maybe it makes people realize that no matter how you view things, we all come to NSG for the same thing, intelligent, healthy, political debate as a way to every once and a while escape the apathy and stupidity of the real world.

______________________________________________________________________
I think all of us, on an individual level, would be perfectly capable of getting along with other, even though their views might be radically different than our own. I believe that we used to have the ability to do that as much as is possible online, with the various 'social' threads that now get sent directly to jail, do not pass go, do not collect $200. I didn't care much for Tink's social threads (as one example), but I was damn glad they were there, and I would participate in some others.

I also agree that probably for a large majority of us, we talk more politics here on NSG than we get to in real life. I also find that it is waaaaay to easy to sway people to my viewpoint in real life, and it's boring. It isn't a challenge, and my viewpoints don't get the kind of work-over they get here. It can be an uncomfortable process having your beliefs analysed, and broken down, and having to really reevaluate where you stand on things...but it is frankly, THE most rewarding human exercise I can think of. (especially when it involves sex muahahahahaaha)

I want NSG to continue to be a place where the fringe, the right, the left, the moderate, and even the completely insane (LG love ya) mingle, create friction, and challenge one another.
I couldn't agree more. :)

I used to believe in the idea of "all things in moderation." Events in this forum have compelled me to rethink that idea, on several levels. ;)

It doesn't help that my country (USA) is currently suffering from a hideous case of The False Middle.

Very good point. Don't get me wrong...I am perfectly capable of seeing the other side or sides of a situation...and I WANT to...but I am not going to say that all points are equally valid or have equal weight, and I am not going to accept that everyone is right 'in their own way'. Gods...if we all actually did that, what the fuck would we ever accomplish?

Not the point.true true

Very good point. Don't get me wrong...I am perfectly capable of seeing the other side or sides of a situation...and I WANT to...but I am not going to say that all points are equally valid or have equal weight, and I am not going to accept that everyone is right 'in their own way'. Gods...if we all actually did that, what the fuck would we ever accomplish?
I'm still more than willing to try to see things from other people's perspective, but after seeing some of the same issues come up over and over again...well, I start to lose patience when Noob Poster #154 waltzes in and imparts his vast wisdom on why abortion is murder, homosexuality is unnatural, and Christianity is the opiate of the yada yada and so forth.

For me, a good time on the Forums should be like a good sparring match. You both lay into each other and do your best to knock the other person senseless, and then when it's done you shake hands and go get a beer. It kind of takes the fun out when you feel like neither one of you is permitted to throw a decent punch.

I'm glad some smart people chimed in with their good points. I was feeling all alone and attacked just from bringing up someone else's idea and seeing what y'all thought about it.

Geez, some of you guys got quite defensive and in turn whiny and dickish about those you perceive to be whiners and/or dicks. Maybe I should go complain to the mods :p - at least the mod who chimed in wasn't too bad. Still the same condescending down talking I am used to from some in that group.

As the 'fringe elements' get picked off, the points of view within the commons shrinks. And as those 'fringe elements' go, the fringe also shrinks, and the perception of fringe gets closer to you. This is an NSG problem, not just a problem with the Mods, or caused by the mods. We have less diversity of opinion here, less diversity of personality. Yes, that represents a loss. This forum was a lot less PC before the whole 'move to PG-13 standard', and yet it was also a lot less nasty than it is right now.

I haven't seen a real trend of 'liberals' versus 'conservatives' being given the boot...the trend instead has been, more repeated reporting of posters that are disliked, and more booting period. All this praising of the 'rules' is patently ridiculous when certainty goes completely out the window when it comes to applying them. The process of warning/banning/deleting/DoSing is opaque and impenetrable.

No one needs to be respected just because of their amount of time here or their post count...but neither should those things work AGAINST them, which they certainly do. Aside from that issue is the fact that this forum feels a lot less like a community, which I would say it certainly has been, in different forms, influenced by different posters over the years...and a lot more like a place where we just can't wait to find someone 'rule breaking' so we can gleefully watch them go down. This forum isn't so much about debate anymore, as it is about playing a 'game', and whosoever gets booted 'loses' and those who manage to toe the line 'win'.
When I first started, it didn't seem so homogenous. There were people on both sides. Now days posters with the less popular view get anihilated. N00bs get pummeled because they don't make the perfect first post. The majority of n00bs who stick around are the the ones that agree with the collective views of the forum.

I'm still more than willing to try to see things from other people's perspective, but after seeing some of the same issues come up over and over again...well, I start to lose patience when Noob Poster #154 waltzes in and imparts his vast wisdom on why abortion is murder, homosexuality is unnatural, and Christianity is the opiate of the yada yada and so forth. Exactly. There IS a sort of hierachy here, but it's not automatically based on time spent here...it's based on how formed your arguments are. It's one thing to have a sprawling, amorphous belief in something with no real conception of where the edges are, or what it is rooted in. It is quite another to come in with a reasoned approach to the issue...and to me, n00bishness is about the former, not about time spent here.

For me, a good time on the Forums should be like a good sparring match. You both lay into each other and do your best to knock the other person senseless, and then when it's done you shake hands and go get a beer. It kind of takes the fun out when you feel like neither one of you is permitted to throw a decent punch.
Hell yes. I have gotten to 'like' quite a few posters here because of the fights we've had. This doesn't mean, as Kyronea has stated, that suddenly, I'm just defending the Friends of Sinuhue. DCD for example...I disagreed with him on a LOT of issues, but I still went to bat for him, because he wasn't a n00b, he WAS making a contribution, and he IS capable of both arguing his point well and playing the devil's advocate. We want to keep the skilled posters, in my mind...how else are the n00bs going to BECOME skilled?

When I first started, it didn't seem so homogenous. There were people on both sides. Now days posters with the less popular view get anihilated. N00bs get pummeled because they don't make the perfect first post. The majority of n00bs who stick around are the the ones that agree with the collective views of the forum.

That's the problem. There shouldn't BE a 'collective view of the forum'. Ever.

Well maybe at this point, we need to consider solutions? It's fine to critique and all that...but it's also absolutely pointless unless we go further and say...what can be done?

I can certainly understand the perception from the Mod side that this constant talk about NSG going down the tubes is entirely aimed at them and to a certain extent I think that has been the case. I don't believe that will solve anything, nor do I believe that they are the ones to blame and leave it at that...I think the Mods are mirroring what is going on in NSG.

I'm going to have to get back to this topic after my next class (and lunch)...but if we engaged in some dialogue about what we could be doing here to stop NSG from sucking hard...then at least we would be doing more than just bitching.

"And whosoever diggeth a pit...shall fall in it..." (I don't care who first said it, I'm singing Bob Marley babay)

That's the problem. There shouldn't BE a 'collective view of the forum'. Ever.
Especially a political forum. I really don't remember it being this bad when I first started. One of my first posts as Abe was in the driving thread. I was reamed for saying I didn't drive. Hello I live in a huge fucking city. Walking is faster. Mass transit is great here. Garages are expensive. But apparently I'm an underacheiver because of that. That's right I'm bitching. I'm bitching and I'm not leaving.

Maybe we can get Dobbs to do a comic with the solution :D

Maybe we can get Dobbs to do a comic with the solution :D

Hahahhahaa....I'm not sure I want to see what would happen....

That's right I'm bitching. I'm bitching and I'm not leaving.

Hallelujah. The perfect retort any time someone tells you to shut up or get out.

Hallelujah. The perfect retort any time someone tells you to shut up or get out.



OMG I totally see thing different than you do. Why don't you shut up and leave?

When I first started, it didn't seem so homogeneous. There were people on both sides. Now days posters with the less popular view get annihilated. N00bs get pummeled because they don't make the perfect first post. The majority of n00bs who stick around are the the ones that agree with the collective views of the forum.

Agrees highly with the quoted text. One needs an extremely thick skin to post on the general forums.

OMG I totally see thing different than you do. Why don't you shut up and leave?

ZOMG flame! I'm reporting you!

Yawn.

Time for this already? And only two pages? Man... in the good old days, when we banned Beeker, we had, like, a 3000 page post ten seconds after it happened. Hell, even that was nothing. Why, when the first IP ban ever was handed out (wonder if any of you youngin's know who got it), the world literally exploded!

Kids these days... they don't know how good it used to be...... The IP ban wouldn't be Japanica... would it?

IMS he advocated someone getting raped. Don't remember who. Didn't matter who. it was the repeated call for someone(s) being Ass Raped by AIDS infected people.

YES!!!!!

I don't want to argue with someone who agrees with me damnit! Part of the joy of NSG is the opportunity to hone your argument, to analyse it, to pick it apart and put it back together in order to counter the excellent points made to counter it. I have settled a lot of things in my mind through debate here, and I am extremely grateful for that opportunity. Controversy is essential to the free flow of ideas, and I like opponents that are not fence sitters, that are firm in their position, and that are passionate.

and all can be done in a civil and polite manner. ;)

Agrees highly with the quoted text. One needs an extremely thick skin to post on the general forums.

Ur nation is new and u have few posts therefore ur an idiot.:p

ZOMG flame! I'm reporting you!

That's not a flame, this is a flame.... *too scared to post a flame*

Pretend I flamed you.

Well maybe at this point, we need to consider solutions? It's fine to critique and all that...but it's also absolutely pointless unless we go further and say...what can be done?


We need someone to run for president or something.

I saw nothing wrong with what Fass posted. He didn't seem to be attacking anyone personally, moreso just religion. Which is fair game.

I call a bias against atheists here.
When/where did Fass get banned?

When/where did Fass get banned?

Linky. (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=539959)

There's a difference between "Banned" and "Deleted", folks.

All hail Dobbs!

Normally I would have already chimed in with suggestions by this point, but in this particular topic I hesitate to do so.

As I said before, this is forum is Max's house. It's not a democracy. I can't help but feel that it's a bit futile to make suggestions about how the show should be run.

I mean more within the context of how we, as posters interact with one another. The Mods, and the rules are out of our control. But using the mods and rules as weapons to stifle dissent is not.

Well maybe at this point, we need to consider solutions? It's fine to critique and all that...but it's also absolutely pointless unless we go further and say...what can be done?

Normally I would have already chimed in with suggestions by this point, but in this particular topic I hesitate to do so.

As I said before, this is forum is Max's house. It's not a democracy. I can't help but feel that it's a bit futile to make suggestions about how the show should be run.

That's not a flame, this is a flame.... *too scared to post a flame*

Pretend I flamed you.

:eek:

*posts a return flame then reports you to moderation*

:eek:

*posts a return flame then reports you to moderation*

Bah! Pansies! Let me show you how it's done! This how you flame... Uh... you, yes you... uh, you stink of some sort of faecal matter, and it is your head that may reek of such a thing, whose mom wears a kind of boot that may or may not be used in combat. :p

Shit that was lame. Back to the drawing board, but you get the idea. ;)

I guess this is what I get for delving into RL for a few weeks, but can or will some one tell me what this is all about??:confused:

We'll plunder yer booty, ye pox-faced blowfish... Ye'll meet the rope's end for that, me bucko!





Take that from the insult generator! :p

Nooooo!! Not me booty! Get back ye scurvy knave! Me booty!

Bah! Pansies! Let me show you how it's done! This how you flame... Uh... you, yes you... uh, you stink of some sort of faecal matter, and it is your head that may reek of such a thing, whose mom wears a kind of boot that may or may not be used in combat. :p

Shit that was lame. Back to the drawing board, but you get the idea. ;)


We'll plunder yer booty, ye pox-faced blowfish... Ye'll meet the rope's end for that, me bucko!





Take that from the insult generator! :p

Nooooo!! Not me booty! Get back ye scurvy knave! Me booty!

It be mine now! *buries self in booty*

What is with this tendency to make martyrs out of people who break forum rules and get punished for it?

Look, I've broken them myself and gotten punished enough that I'm pretty sure the mods will deat me or something if I do it again. That would kinda suck from my perspective, but its their prerogative, and its acceptable for people to report concerns to moderation.

I think yall need to deal with it instead of doing the whole "tattle-tales suck" angle.

What is with this tendency to make martyrs out of people who break forum rules and get punished for it?

Look, I've broken them myself and gotten punished enough that I'm pretty sure the mods will deat me or something if I do it again. That would kinda suck from my perspective, but its their prerogative, and its acceptable for people to report concerns to moderation.

I think yall need to deal with it instead of doing the whole "tattle-tales suck" angle.

Bunch of cry babies around here I tell you.

Bah! Pansies! Let me show you how it's done! This how you flame... Uh... you, yes you... uh, you stink of some sort of faecal matter, and it is your head that may reek of such a thing, whose mom wears a kind of boot that may or may not be used in combat.Thou saucy dread-bolted hedge-pig! :D

And too bad about Fass... I liked that godless hellraiser. That's the thing about NS Mods, they don't care about the popularity of the poster, because they have a job to do, and that is to make sure this forum is run by the rules.
I liked him too, when he stuck to opinions and ranting and laid off the attacks. I'd be delighted to see him back and playing by the rules. I'm not holding my breath about the second part, of course.
If I was the owner of this Forum, I would instruct the Mods to stick with their own decisions... even if they -ever- regret a decision made seconds ago, a mod should never change his own decision -over the pressure by- for the friends of the penalized player.
We've got an appeals process to correct OUR mistakes, when one of the mods makes a judgment based on incomplete evidence or something like that. It's never been an appeal to popularity, and never will be.

The Mods, and the rules are out of our control. But using the mods and rules as weapons to stifle dissent is not.
Oh really? That was/is one of your specialties? You have been notorious for your trips to Moderation to whine about one thing or another. Despite your desire to demonstrate that you are tough as nails, your performances in the Moderation threads betray you.

http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=10039984&postcount=7

http://forums4.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=10040455&postcount=11

http://forums4.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=10149414&postcount=17

http://forums4.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=10149433&postcount=18

http://forums4.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=10149437&postcount=19

You didn't want to "stifle dissent", you wanted to crush it!! :eek:


BTW, there are plenty more like those, or did you forget?

rules blow. i'm fully in support of favouring interesting and enlightening posters to the detriment of boring or nondescript posters, never mind that this would put me at risk. bring back DCD, Dobbs and Fass if they'd consent to return. i'm off to UMP to see if Fass'll turn up there at last.

I remember a thread just like this when FairyTink got given a vacation.

*sigh* To be Forum Royalty must be a wonderful feeling :D

Fass got banned?

Well there you go, we agree on something, because this is one of the reasons I feel there needs to be an appeal process.As Fris mentioned above, we have an appeal process already.

... The IP ban wouldn't be Japanica... would it?Not the first, no.

What is with this tendency to make martyrs out of people who break forum rules and get punished for it? Hey, GT? This stopped being about Fass a long time ago.


Look, I've broken them myself and gotten punished enough that I'm pretty sure the mods will deat me or something if I do it again. That would kinda suck from my perspective, but its their prerogative, and its acceptable for people to report concerns to moderation.

I think yall need to deal with it instead of doing the whole "tattle-tales suck" angle.
Actually it's a 'mods as weapon' angle. Which you should be quite familiar with, having had that barrel aimed at you more than once.

*snip*

Oh I wondered when my favourite stalker would show up....never one to disappoint hmmm, princess?

Oh really? That was/is one of your specialties? You have been notorious for your trips to Moderation to whine about one thing or another. Despite your desire to demonstrate that you are tough as nails, your performances in the Moderation threads betray you.

http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=10039984&postcount=7

http://forums4.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=10040455&postcount=11

http://forums4.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=10149414&postcount=17

http://forums4.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=10149433&postcount=18

http://forums4.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=10149437&postcount=19

You didn't want to "stifle dissent", you wanted to crush it!! :eek:


BTW, there are plenty more like those, or did you forget?


You picked threads that Neesika was totally right in. :D Plus that was like two years ago!

I violently disagree with the people who think we should somehow have more people who violently disagree with each other. Oh, sure, you can use your "reason" and your "words" to show how a more opinionated, diverse forum would be more "interesting", in some way, but you people are too self-centered to grasp the true purpose behind this forum. It wasn't created so it could be of interest to you, no, rather the real purpose behind NSG is to use varying viewpoints to come to one informed consensus about how best the world should be run. The extremists who cannot figure this out and detract from the one informed consensus by violently disagreeing with people need to be cut out. howwasthat?

the real purpose behind NSG is to use varying viewpoints to come to one informed consensus about how best the world should be run.Actually, the forums were a complete afterthought that were tacked onto the game at the last minute. And since pretty much every forum ever has a 'general' forum, so too did this one.

What is DEAT? :confused:

DEAT = deleted.

CTE = Ceased to Exist (same as timed out for inactivity)

DoS= Delete on Sight (a.k.a. You've broken the rules so heinously or repeatedly that we don't want ANY of your nations on here again.)

Actually, the forums were a complete afterthought that were tacked onto the game at the last minute. And since pretty much every forum ever has a 'general' forum, so too did this one.

Way to ruin the silliness.

Silliness ruinor.

Well he was just getting a week ban or something and then his wife created a nation and chimed in on the thread in moderation which made the mods accuse him of skirting the ban (same IP address obviously) I believe which got him the DEAT

What is DEAT? :confused:

What is DEAT? :confused:


DEAT (http://ns.goobergunch.net/wiki/index.php/DEAT).

Damn it's like a mod convention in here!

*steals free pens*

Silliness ruinor.Yet another service I provide.

Actually, the forums were a complete afterthought that were tacked onto the game at the last minute. And since pretty much every forum ever has a 'general' forum, so too did this one.

Oh, sure, thats what you think. But the forums belong to the posters! And by posters, I mean the majority of posters. Which brings me back to my original point, everything that the majority says is true, which means that the various minorities need to be cut out. Which is what you are paid to do in hypothetical, pretend money, not ruin my silliness!

See? This is nice :)

Oh, sure, thats what you think. But the forums belong to the posters! And by posters, I mean the majority of posters. Which brings me back to my original point, everything that the majority says is true, which means that the various minorities need to be cut out. Which is what you are paid to do in hypothetical, pretend money, not ruin my silliness!

Wikiality is what that is i believe
someone needs to go Edit the Nationstates Wiki.

See? This is nice :)

Yeah, it is actually. Get it out of Moderation where things get tense and hysterical, and get it out of the whole 'the Mods are killing NSG' characterisation.

If any one is doing anything negative to NSG, it's NSGers.

Yeah, it is actually. Get it out of Moderation where things get tense and hysterical, and get it out of the whole 'the Mods are killing NSG' characterisation.

If any one is doing anything negative to NSG, it's NSGers.

Yeah!? Fuck you too! Maybe we need to cut you out for implying that we would be anything but perfect! Without tension and hystericalness, how are we supposed to find the ones who violently disagree with people so we can cut them out! *goes both tense and hysterical at the same time*

lol

http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j315/crashcow/Thinkspeak/GoodHappyFunTimes.jpg


Dobbs makes me laugh so much

Would it be too geeky to get that printed onto a shirt? ;)

Would it be too geeky to get that printed onto a shirt? ;)

uh


yeahhhhhh - could you get one in my size too pelase


kthxbi

Linky. (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=539959)He was banned again!

Quick, lets talk about him behind his back.

When in the Course of human events, it becomes necessary for one people to dissolve the political bands which have connected them with another, and to assume among the powers of the earth, the separate and equal station to which the Laws of Nature and of Nature's God entitle them, a decent respect to the opinions of mankind requires that they should declare the causes which impel them to the separation.

Thanks Sumamba, thanks for posting that picture. You are a braver man than I.

Wikiality is what that is i believe
someone needs to go Edit the Nationstates Wiki.

I am the Law and the Law is not mocked.

And yes, I do keep a careful eye on the pages of recently deleted nations. NSwiki is not your political platform to complain about moderator oppression.

Goobergunch (http://ns.goobergunch.net/wiki/index.php/User:Goobergunch)|? (http://ns.goobergunch.net/wiki/index.php/User_talk:Goobergunch)
NSwiki Admin

It be mine now! *buries self in booty*

*curls up into a ball and sobs uncontrollably* WAAAH!! Me booty!!

*pats Kryozerkia*

There, there. Don't cry.

Please stop crying.

Look, if you'll just stop crying I'll let you call him a beggarly rapscallion.

I think one problem that was touched upon here well was the ability of people to use the mods as weapons against people they don't like.

A separate issue that didn't seem to have been talked about too much is the way the rules are enforced. To be specific, by this I mean that a lot of the rules have a grey area. And that's fine, and most likely necessary for the rules to function properly. However,the gray area changes from time to time. Are all of these changes in the gray area necessary? Perhaps, perhaps not, but it's easy to see how certain changes in the grey area might make certain posters feel alienated. At the very least I can see why those changes should be questioned at times.

uh


yeahhhhhh - could you get one in my size too pelase


kthxbi

I'll take CafePress for a thousand, Alex.

I am the Law and the Law is not mocked.

And yes, I do keep a careful eye on the pages of recently deleted nations. NSwiki is not your political platform to complain about moderator oppression.

Goobergunch (http://ns.goobergunch.net/wiki/index.php/User:Goobergunch)|? (http://ns.goobergunch.net/wiki/index.php/User_talk:Goobergunch)
NSwiki Admin

*bows to Inspector Javert*

Oh I wondered when my favourite stalker would show up....never one to disappoint hmmm, princess?
I aim to please little one, or maybe it is big one (have never seen a pic). :p

In reality, I am just pointing out your total lack of sincerity on this matter, and expose you for the phoney that I believe you to be.

You decry the actions of the Mods yet you travel a well worn path to Moderation to decry everyone and anything that is pissing, or has pissed in your soup.

Even a bit of character assassination (http://forums3.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=11476698&postcount=6)in Moderation is okay with you but not okay for others?

"Let it drop. Live and learn. Turn the other cheek...it really is the best policy." :D

I think one problem that was touched upon here well was the ability of people to use the mods as weapons against people they don't like.

I think that's been happening for more than a few monthes now.

I aim to please little one, or maybe it is big one (have never seen a pic). :p

In reality, I am just pointing out your total lack of sincerity on this matter, and expose you for the phoney that I believe you to be.

You decry the actions of the Mods yet you travel a well worn path to Moderation to decry everyone and anything that is pissing, or has pissed in your soup.

Even a bit of character assassination (http://forums3.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=11476698&postcount=6)in Moderation is okay with you but not okay for others?

"Let it drop. Live and learn. Turn the other cheek...it really is the best policy." :D

This is really starting to get on my nerves.

This is really starting to get on my nerves.

Me, too. Cut it out, guys. I thought this was supposed to be a sort of De-Militarised Zone thread? Call a truce and stick to the topic.

I think that's been happening for more than a few monthes now.Yes, but as people use it successfully, they spur more people to do so, in a snowball effect.

Me, too. Cut it out, guys. I thought this was supposed to be a sort of De-Militarized Zone thread? Call a truce and stick to the topic.

Fixed.

You can thank Uncle Sam for that one.

bloody yank imperialists trying to take over my spell-checker

Go to gaol. Do not pass go.

Me, too. Cut it out, guys. I thought this was supposed to be a sort of De-Militarised Zone thread? Call a truce and stick to the topic.

There's something to say about Fassigen in all this.

He's a truly intelligent guy - there was a moment this Summer, when he fell in love, where his natural aptitude for fun was apparent and I, for one, thought that he shined like the crazy diamond he is.

I truly hope he returns, he's not banned and I hope he takes a name like 'Fussigen' or similar because he did add something to these boards.

The forum can lapse into homogeniety (spelling?) and it's refreshing and welcome to get true perspective on issues despite the personal nature of attack he sometimes undertook - regardless of whether he does or not, any reasonable person will miss his contributions if he decides not to return.

bloody yank imperialists trying to take over my spell-checker

Go to gaol. Do not pass go.

You mean go to jail?

"Do not pass go! Do not collect 200 dollars!!!"

Jim Carrey says it better of course.

*snip of the princess's rant*

Awww...I'm sorry you didn't actually bother to read my posts in this thread, truly I am. I'm sorry that you've jumped on the bandwagon of believing I'm just tossing shots at the Mods. I know you like to follow me around, dig up my threads, and fantasise constantly about me...that fine line between love and hate and all. You do all of that, put in great effort...and yet you never actually manage to READ anything. It's a real shame...I mean...hahahaha, like the quote you provided. Wow. Did you read it? At all? Hahahahahahaaaaa.....

http://forums3.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?p=11476698#post11476698
I find it...hmmm...interesting...that the last two reports you've posted here have been about people who are railing against pedophiles. Yeah, it's a real shame that there are people who find pedophiles sickening...

So these kind of 'tactics' are okay as long as it's against something you are also against? And yes, clearly Jocabia has a pro-pedophile agenda motivating his last two reports; having had been molested himself, he obviously 'converted'. :rolleyes:

Hahahaha, because I think you think I was calling Jocabia pro-pedophile...which really made my day...thanks for the chuckle princess.

So sorry? What point were you trying to make? Oh right...how evil I am...how you will one day expose me...hahahahaha....ahhhhh.

Me, too. Cut it out, guys. I thought this was supposed to be a sort of De-Militarised Zone thread? Call a truce and stick to the topic.

Yeah, sorry...CanukHeaven has been on a mission for quite a few months now, to expose me all to you as the fraud and terrible person I really am. I'll save him the effort...hey everyone, I'm a big fraud and a terrible person!

There, should be the end of that.

And de-militarised zone...that's rather apt...

Me, too. Cut it out, guys. I thought this was supposed to be a sort of De-Militarised Zone thread? Call a truce and stick to the topic.

WHAT?! Mods calling for civility and lack of violence?! I am paying you good hypothetical pretend money to rouse up passions and hatred so that you can ban more people! Pfft. We (and by we I mean you) still have more bannings to do in order to make this forum a more homogeneous, peaceful environment. And the only way we (and by we I still mean you) can do that is to encourage crazy people to post their crazy little disagreements (anything that doesn't match with the rest of the forum and is therefor wrong) so we (you) can spot them and ban them!

Yeah, sorry...CanukHeaven has been on a mission for quite a few months now, to expose me all to you as the fraud and terrible person I really am. I'll save him the effort...hey everyone, I'm a big fraud and a terrible person!

There, should be the end of that.

And de-militarised zone...that's rather apt...

I dunno... I'm still not convinced. I'll assume you're a person, but the rest... :p

WHAT?! Mods calling for civility and lack of violence?! I am paying you good hypothetical pretend money to rouse up passions and hatred so that you can ban more people! Pfft. We (and by we I mean you) still have more bannings to do in order to make this forum a more homogeneous, peaceful environment. And the only way we (and by we I still mean you) can do that is to encourage crazy people to post their crazy little disagreements (anything that doesn't match with the rest of the forum and is therefor wrong) so we (you) can spot them and ban them!

Of all the acolytes, you're really the least original.

Of all the acolytes, you're really the least original.

Perhaps, but I still make me giggle. That is good enough for me. :)

Also, acolyte (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Acolyte_%28disambiguation%29)? I just go where the spam wind takes me... I'm not exactly a "devoted follower or attendant"

Neesika, CanuckHeaven, you've both got your lick in at each other, now give it up. No more.

If either of you you post again, post on topic and don't mention the other's name, doings, dress sense, SAT score or probable fate in the afterlife. Or else. Got it?

Neesika, CanuckHeaven, you've both got your lick in at each other, now give it up. No more.

If either of you you post again, post on topic and don't mention the other's name, doings, dress sense, SAT score or probable fate in the afterlife. Or else. Got it?

My goodness that was fast.

Perhaps, but I still make me giggle. That is good enough for me. :)

Also, acolyte (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Acolyte_%28disambiguation%29)? I just go where the spam wind takes me... I'm not exactly a "devoted follower or attendant"

At least Sinuhue et al have a point rather than just trying to be clever.

Either contribute honestly or don't bother at all.

There's something to be said about giving leeway to those posters who may be aggresive but refreshing because they've been here a while and have seen same arguments over and over again - there's something to be said for maintaining a diplomatic stance over these issues.

Simply being offensive for offensive sake serves no purpose.

WHAT?! Mods calling for civility and lack of violence?! I am paying you good hypothetical pretend money to rouse up passions and hatred so that you can ban more people! Pfft. We (and by we I mean you) still have more bannings to do in order to make this forum a more homogeneous, peaceful environment. And the only way we (and by we I still mean you) can do that is to encourage crazy people to post their crazy little disagreements (anything that doesn't match with the rest of the forum and is therefor wrong) so we (you) can spot them and ban them!

Civility? From a mod? Please, all they do is hand out bans as if they were exhaling carbon dioxide.

At least Sinuhue et al have a point rather than just trying to be clever.

Either contribute honestly or don't bother at all.

There's something to be said about giving leeway to those posters who may be aggresive but refreshing because they've been here a while and have seen same arguments over and over again - there's something to be said for maintaining a diplomatic stance over these issues.

Simply being offensive for offensive sake serves no purpose.

Pfft. Honest contributions are for serious people.

Speaking of which...
My goodness that was fast.

Not on topic! For the ban!

There's something to say about Fassigen in all this.

He's a truly intelligent guy - there was a moment this Summer, when he fell in love, where his natural aptitude for fun was apparent and I, for one, thought that he shined like the crazy diamond he is.

I truly hope he returns, he's not banned and I hope he takes a name like 'Fussigen' or similar because he did add something to these boards.

The forum can lapse into homogeniety (spelling?) and it's refreshing and welcome to get true perspective on issues despite the personal nature of attack he sometimes undertook - regardless of whether he does or not, any reasonable person will miss his contributions if he decides not to return.

Yeah, I'm with you on that.

As others have said, whenever someone who habitually skates near the edge trips right over it, there's always an outcry. Maybe because the entertainment is over for now, maybe because of a bit of guilt, like what people feel when they gawk at scene of an accident. You know it's not good, but you still keep gawking.

If we're still talking about forums generally, though, I think the people talking about the feeling of community have got to the core of it.

I don't know how you build it, though. I feel NSers generally as "community" because I've used the game to get me through some difficult times; it was such a relief to put aside the problems for a bit and just play.

At least Sinuhue et al have a point rather than just trying to be clever.

Either contribute honestly or don't bother at all.
Sorry...but in one breath you call for diversity...and on the other you're telling Kiryu-shi to shut it? I don't get it. He's expressing himself quite well I think, making fun of the raving conspiracy theorists. It may annoy you...but if you can't say that about any number of posters here...well it makes me wonder :D

If we're still talking about forums generally, though, I think the people talking about the feeling of community have got to the core of it.

I don't know how you build it, though. I feel NSers generally as "community" because I've used the game to get me through some difficult times; it was such a relief to put aside the problems for a bit and just play.

Okay, I didn't want to get into the community thing too much, because although I feel very strongly about it, people seem to misunderstand and think I want to sing kumbaya.

First off...community does not mean 'we all get along'. No community that has ever existed has been like that, completely harmonious. Some of us are just never going to get along, and that's fine...there is no reason to try to force people to like one another.

NSG is important to me, because of the amount of time that I've spent here over the years, the learning I've done here, and the connections I've made with people. I've only recently been posting elsewhere, and that was to keep in touch with some of those people from NSG that I did feel some connection with. So when I bitch about how NSG seems to be going, it's not bitching as an outsider, or someone who just wants things to go a certain way. I want NSG to continue to be a community.

I think it has been, and I've mentioned that. It has been a community that has shifted and looked a bit different depending on the people involved. Think about how the forum looked when Tink, PM, Peechland et al still posted all the time...think about how it looked in the Jessussaves era :P Or when TIN was racking up his post count. Community shouldn't be static.

It has also been affected by the Mods. The flavour of the forum will change accordingly, from Tactical Grace, to Melkor Unchained, Cogitation, to Euroslavia...and on. So it's not that I'm sitting there looking at one particular period of time and going, 'ahhhh, the Golden Age'!

But yeah, this place feels less and less like a community, and more like a place where jaded people get together hoping to see someone slip up so they can report them, and then gleefully sing, 'Ding dong the witch is dead' when they get booted.

How do you build community? You admit you are part of one.

Civility? From a mod? Please, all they do is hand out bans as if they were exhaling carbon dioxide.

Ruffy, you have hurt me so deeply -- I mean, obviously you know that I'm asthmatic, and you're being mean to me because I can't breathe out as well as other people -- that I'm going to go to bed now and cry into my pillow.

The fact that it's 3am here has nothing to do with it. Try not to strangle each other, peeps.

Ruffy, you have hurt me so deeply -- I mean, obviously you know that I'm asthmatic, and you're being mean to me because I can't breathe out as well as other people -- that I'm going to go to bed now and cry into my pillow.

The fact that it's 3am here has nothing to do with it. Try not to strangle each other, peeps.

*points and laughs*

*points and laughs at your timezone*

Sorry...but in one breath you call for diversity...and on the other you're telling Kiryu-shi to shut it? I don't get it. He's expressing himself quite well I think, making fun of the raving conspiracy theorists. It may annoy you...but if you can't say that about any number of posters here...well it makes me wonder :D

What's his motive though - to actually express a point or to simply to support a viewpoint?

There's a difference.

Frankly my opinion doesn't count but at least I can safely say it's my opinion.

What's his motive though - to actually express a point or to simply to support a viewpoint?

There's a difference.

Frankly my opinion doesn't count but at least I can safely say it's my opinion.

How DARE you imply I have some reason or "motive" for my actions?!

How do you build community? You admit you are part of one.

Does that mean that when I deny being part of a community, I am DESTROYING IT?

How DARE you imply I have some reason or "motive" for my actions?!

:)

Indeed, who gives a thought.

:)

Indeed, who gives a thought.

*nods* Thoughts are much too valuable to give away freely.

Um, no, no he didn't. OD, your stance on 'those' topics is not such that disagreeing with you is equivalent to supporting rape.

He got banned for making a general statement about how people who supported censorship should be raped. Now, although I may be still too n00bish to count, personally, I thought the decision was too harsh, but I can't really blame the mods. It was rather unpleasant after all.

A little dramatic irony; he was censored, for saying censorship should be raped. Great.

Civility? From a mod? Please, all they do is hand out bans as if they were exhaling carbon dioxide.

*sends Ruffy another shipment of 100% genuwhine NYC bagels!*

Does that mean that when I deny being part of a community, I am DESTROYING IT?

Yes. Like that bully that steals the bottom block from your tower.

*sends Ruffy another shipment of 100% genuwhine NYC bagels!*

Bribery is a thing o' beauty.

A little dramatic irony; he was censored, for saying censorship should be raped. Great.

No, actually, he was deleted for being told point blank the first time he suggested someone should be raped by AIDs patients that it was over the line and that he'd be deleted the next time he suggested it; then two years later he said that censors should be raped by AIDs patients in front of their children-- repeating it and then upping the ante.

But hey, what are the facts worth when you can yell "censorship" instead?

How do you build community? You admit you are part of one.

Going by what I've seen elsewhere, label posters as relatives. *nod* We'll need a mom, dad, brothers, sisters, grandparents, aunts and uncles, cousins, neices, nephews...

Does that mean that when I deny being part of a community, I am DESTROYING IT?
Fuck you, you're in whether you want to be or not.

Naw, not really. Every community needs its lurkers, it's cast-offs, it's sullen non-participants :P

Going by what I've seen elsewhere, label posters as relatives. *nod* We'll need a mom, dad, brothers, sisters, grandparents, aunts and uncles, cousins, neices, nephews...

Keeping it in the family, are we?

Keeping it in the family, are we?

Oh yes, it opens the way for a running incest gag. ^_^

I'm serious though, I think we should *nod*

Funny enough I have a cousin Dina... ;) shouldn't be hard for me to adapt, Dinaverg.

Funny enough I have a cousin Dina... ;) shouldn't be hard for me to adapt, Dinaverg.

Yay! So I'm a cousin already! Hmm, this requires a thread...

No, it hasn't. The junior-hall-monitor types have always been here....they're on any forum with admins.

NSG has changed though. A couple of years ago this place moved practically as fast as IRC - at almost any time of the day it was alive and one could jump into an ongoing conversation at will. I could sit here for hours and the same regular crowd of people would be replying to things as quickly as I posted them - that's really what made this forum so unique and why I stuck around so long originally...it was a really dynamic experience, it really felt alive. If I found myself frustrated with a "serious" thread I could jump into one of the many social threads on offer...every day spawned several pages worth of content to lose myself in like that - I spent (some might say wasted) many nights engaged in my choice of either debate or silliness for hours on end. Now on a good day NSG struggles to meet 1 page of new threads...and with the decrease in quantity of content and contribution the quality hasn't gone up either like one might be accustomed to expect.

That was a bygone era - and I say pish to anyone who doesn't think there were "good old days" on this forum....at least in my experience there certainly were. Now I find much of the content frustrating with little light hearted content to amuse myself with (there's still some elements of the old forum around, but this old creature ain't what she used to be...).

That's why i've pretty much moved on. I've met some true kindred spirits here and made some friendships that I hope will last a very long time...but to me, NSG has lost its soul. I don't know why, how, or when it happened, but it did.

No, it hasn't. The junior-hall-monitor types have always been here....they're on any forum with admins.

NSG has changed though. A couple of years ago this place moved practically as fast as IRC - at almost any time of the day it was alive and one could jump into an ongoing conversation at will. I could sit here for hours and the same regular crowd of people would be replying to things as quickly as I posted them - that's really what made this forum so unique and why I stuck around so long originally...it was a really dynamic experience, it really felt alive. If I found myself frustrated with a "serious" thread I could jump into one of the many social threads on offer...every day spawned several pages worth of content to lose myself in like that - I spent (some might say wasted) many nights engaged in my choice of either debate or silliness for hours on end. Now on a good day NSG struggles to meet 1 page of new threads...and with the decrease in quantity of content and contribution the quality hasn't gone up either like one might be accustomed to expect.

That was a bygone era - and I say pish to anyone who doesn't think there were "good old days" on this forum....at least in my experience there certainly were. Now I find much of the content frustrating with little light hearted content to amuse myself with (there's still some elements of the old forum around, but this old creature ain't what she used to be...).

That's why i've pretty much moved on. I've met some true kindred spirits here and made some friendships that I hope will last a very long time...but to me, NSG has lost its soul. I don't know why, how, or when it happened, but it did.
*slashes wrists*

*slashes wrists*

*Examines Ruffy's work*

wow... nice slash there ruffy... but... next time... can you slash your own wrists and not mine?

MODS! Can I have a hall pass to go to the Nurses office? I'm kinda bleeding alot here... a whole lot... wow... feeling lightheaded now...


wheeeeeeeeeeeeeee...


*thud*

Fuck you, you're in whether you want to be or not.

Naw, not really. Every community needs its lurkers, it's cast-offs, it's sullen non-participants :P

Its malcontents, its dissidents, its fermenting rebellion...

The junior-hall-monitor types have always been here....they're on any forum with admins.

NSG has changed though. A couple of years ago this place moved practically as fast as IRC - at almost any time of the day it was alive and one could jump into an ongoing conversation at will. I could sit here for hours and the same regular crowd of people would be replying to things as quickly as I posted them - that's really what made this forum so unique and why I stuck around so long originally...it was a really dynamic experience, it really felt alive. If I found myself frustrated with a "serious" thread I could jump into one of the many social threads on offer...every day spawned several pages worth of content to lose myself in like that - I spent (some might say wasted) many nights engaged in my choice of either debate or silliness for hours on end. Now on a good day NSG struggles to meet 1 page of new threads...and with the decrease in quantity of content and contribution the quality hasn't gone up either like one might be accustomed to expect.

That was a bygone era - and I say pish to anyone who doesn't think there were "good old days" on this forum....at least in my experience there certainly were. Now I find much of the content frustrating with little light hearted content to amuse myself with (there's still some elements of the old forum around, but this old creature ain't what she used to be...).

...but to me, NSG has lost its soul. I don't know why, how, or when it happened, but it did.

I agree, I've been on and off NS with various aliases over the last few years, and I must say that I do recall a very different experience. I used to be able to sit on the forums from morning till the next morning, jumping from the ridiculous social posts to the serious debates and back again. It was a lot more active: I could post in one thread, switch over to something else, respond to that, start reading a third and already there'd be something new on the original one. The topics were actually interesting, I'd look at a forum and answer virtually everything on the page, heck there'd be ongoing discussions for weeks and weeks, now I find it unusual if I even read so much as three threads.
I feel that the entire atmosphere has changed, there's less of a community spirit, a lot less debate and more outright bashing... and yes there are the odd jokes that some mod takes to seriously and freaks over, but there are also more malicious jabs that have probably caused the edgy-ness in the first place. I still fondly remember some great intellectual debates spattered with the odd complete rip-off, some friendly jibes and some completely pointless but amusing conversations. I miss that. NS has changed.

I feel that the entire atmosphere has changed, there's less of a community spirit, a lot less debate and more outright bashing... and yes there are the odd jokes that some mod takes to seriously and freaks over, but there are also more malicious jabs that have probably caused the edgy-ness in the first place. I still fondly remember some great intellectual debates spattered with the odd complete rip-off, some friendly jibes and some completely pointless but amusing conversations. I miss that. NS has changed.
I remember when you could buy an ice cream soda on NS for fifteen cents, and then go see the latest Western at the theater down the street. It had air conditioning and everything! *Sigh*

I remember when you could buy an ice cream soda on NS for fifteen cents, and then go see the latest Western at the theater down the street. It had air conditioning and everything! *Sigh*

Now you just make me sound old!
Lol.
Change isn't a bad thing, and everything goes through ups and downs... I just feel my life has had enough downs, why does this have to do down too dammit!
:mad:
Excuse me. RL has made me bitter, despondent, pissy and iTunes is mocking me with heroic, cheerful, uplifting movie scores...

Me, too. Cut it out, guys. I thought this was supposed to be a sort of De-Militarised Zone thread? Call a truce and stick to the topic.
And the topic is?

"Has NSG fallen victim to Junior Hall-Monitor syndrome?"

And the opening statement is?

Dobbs made a comic about the level of hall monitoring going on lately that has gotten people like his, DCD's and now Fass's nation banned.

I thought I would share it along with starting a discussion about the point it makes and see if you agree or disagree:
Is the text of the comic also considered to be "on topic"? If so, did you read the text?

Not only does the text refer to a "Junior Hall-Monitor" chasing out "all those unpleasant types", but suggests that by doing so, the JHM as a result will find himself alone, having "left no-one unbanned".

And where does that leave the hero? It leaves him standing at the door of yet another forum "UMP". Free advertising for other forums is allowed in NSG?

So, what is one to do when a member of that other forum shows up here at NSG decrying the heavy hand of Moderation, yet said individual has gleefully taken part in crucifying other posters in Moderation? I find that truly hypocritical, or shall we call it unsportsmanlike conduct?

I have been posting on these boards for 3 1/2 years and have never found it necessary to seek the help of the Mods in coping with "all those unpleasant types", nor have I found the need to put anyone on ignore. Heck, I have never even received an "official" warning, not that I couldn't have; however, I strongly believe that debate requires a thick skinned approach.

There are posters here that are trying to build another forum and are recruiting those that are disenchanted with NSG. That is well and fine, but for them to keep coming back here, taking pot shots at those that like this forum, for their own amusement, should be heartily discouraged.

That's why i've pretty much moved on. I've met some true kindred spirits here and made some friendships that I hope will last a very long time...but to me, NSG has lost its soul. I don't know why, how, or when it happened, but it did.
Naw.....it is just that you haven't won any trophies lately or maybe you found better things to do IRL? :D

Free advertising for other forums is allowed in NSG?Why wouldn't it be?

There are posters here that are trying to build another forum and are recruiting those that are disenchanted with NSG. That is well and fine, but for them to keep coming back here, taking pot shots at those that like this forum, for their own amusement, should be heartily discouraged.

I thought I was fairly discouraging:
Neesika, CanuckHeaven, you've both got your lick in at each other, now give it up. No more.

If either of you you post again, post on topic and don't mention the other's name, doings, dress sense, SAT score or probable fate in the afterlife. Or else. Got it?

The point of that was that constant sniping between two posters who'd rather rehash old scores than address the subject in hand is annoying.

I'm not concerned about what other forums people are members of, but I am concerned with keeping this one relatively civil.

As for not advertising other forums, I think you can take it that since a Game mod and a forum mod have both seen this thread, the OP's post is accepted as a means of stimulating discussion.

Jello Biafra, there's a ruling on this, but the gist of it is that this is Max's forum, so if anything gets advertised, it should be his stuff.

*crickets chirping*

That was a bygone era - and I say pish to anyone who doesn't think there were "good old days" on this forum....at least in my experience there certainly were.Yup. General has been going to hell since May of 2003. Wish you could have seen the good old days, but you missed them by about six months. Of course, I know a couple people who say the whole game has started going downhill since about December of 2002, in which case I missed it.

It's almost as if everyone thinks things are worse than when they first joined. Weird.

Jello Biafra, there's a ruling on this, but the gist of it is that this is Max's forum, so if anything gets advertised, it should be his stuff.Oh, I see. Does this mean I should remove the links from my sig?

Yup. General has been going to hell since May of 2003. Wish you could have seen the good old days, but you missed them by about six months. Of course, I know a couple people who say the whole game has started going downhill since about December of 2002, in which case I missed it.

It's almost as if everyone thinks things are worse than when they first joined. Weird.

Personally, I think things have have never been as good as they were around February '08.

Yup. General has been going to hell since May of 2003. Wish you could have seen the good old days, but you missed them by about six months. Of course, I know a couple people who say the whole game has started going downhill since about December of 2002, in which case I missed it.

It's almost as if everyone thinks things are worse than when they first joined. Weird.

Whatever day it opened, it's been a cesspool since the day immediately following.

For the record I think Fass's (second) deletion was justified. He routinely gets away with things others wouldn't because people think he's funny.

However, the rules must apply to everyone, even popular longtime members or there should be no rules at all.

Never heard about it 'till now, but now that its been said, qould explain why several trolls have suddenly dissapeared....

You picked threads that Neesika was totally right in. :D Plus that was like two years ago!

And people say Historians live in the past :D

Oh, sure, thats what you think. But the forums belong to the posters! And by posters, I mean the majority of posters. Which brings me back to my original point, everything that the majority says is true, which means that the various minorities need to be cut out. Which is what you are paid to do in hypothetical, pretend money, not ruin my silliness!

Um ok...I have a bridge for sale if this is not sarcasm.

Yeah, sorry...CanukHeaven has been on a mission for quite a few months now, to expose me all to you as the fraud and terrible person I really am.

Join the club :D

Um ok...I have a bridge for sale if this is not sarcasm.

If you are talking about the Brooklyn Bridge, I have already bought it. And it wasn't from you. Hmph.

Unfortunately, if you're offering to sell me a different bridge, the mortgage rates on the Brooklyn Bridge are so high, I won't be able to afford another one. Sorry. Good luck on your bridge selling, though!

Yup. General has been going to hell since May of 2003. Wish you could have seen the good old days, but you missed them by about six months. Of course, I know a couple people who say the whole game has started going downhill since about December of 2002, in which case I missed it.

It's almost as if everyone thinks things are worse than when they first joined. Weird.

But I don't think that, because I am an experienced member of online communities and I know that there's always a tendency to worship the created traditions of the near-to-sorta-recent past and to look with rosy lenses on a non-existent golden age!

We are big kids here, and the rules aren't arbitrary. There really shouldn't be any concern over "tattling".

I hope to see the mods shortening leashes. This is a good start.

We are big kids here, and the rules aren't arbitrary. There really shouldn't be any concern over "tattling".

I hope to see the mods shortening leashes. This is a good start.

To what?

To what?

A less crappy NSG.

Trolls respond to flamers, and if the veteran flamers that got a free pass for these last couple of years get cracked down on, there will be less fodder keeping new trolls around.

there's always a tendency to worship the created traditions of the near-to-sorta-recent past and to look with rosy lenses on a non-existent golden age!

back on one of my old usenet haunts we talked about our wall of fallen newsgroup heroes and monuments to what we literally referred to as the golden age (other ages included the silver age, the space-age plastic age, and the rhinestone age)

A less crappy NSG.

Trolls respond to flamers, and if the veteran flamers that got a free pass for these last couple of years get cracked down on, there will be less fodder keeping new trolls around.

Odd. I've been a big fan of NSG until recently. So your 'less crappy NSG' sounds pretty shitty to me.

Odd. I've been a big fan of NSG until recently. So your 'less crappy NSG' sounds pretty shitty to me.

I know it does.

A less crappy NSG.

Trolls respond to flamers, and if the veteran flamers that got a free pass for these last couple of years get cracked down on, there will be less fodder keeping new trolls around.And what would occur in the place of the fodder?

And what would occur in the place of the fodder?

Spam, preferably?

Monitors can be scary.

Classroom democracy (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/asia-pacific/7030725.stm)


Thousands of years of life under a feudal system in China have fostered a culture where official power and authority have seldom been checked.

Once one has the power, then one has everything, and so the whole nation would like to be government bureaucrats.

For example, 60% of China's college graduates choose government as their ideal career.

Chinese government officials are not civil servants in the Western sense, rather they are the people who possess real power.

Against this backdrop, I decided to film a class of eight-year-old schoolchildren in my home city of Wuhan as they went through the process of electing a class monitor.

It was the first time that the post had not been the gift of the teacher and it was the children's first taste of democracy. It turned out to be a cut-throat competition.

Wrong-footing rivals

The class monitor is charged with maintaining order in the classroom when the teacher is out of the room and is expected to report any rule breaking to the teacher.


Cheng Cheng's ultimate ambition is to be president of China
The three candidates were all thoroughly determined to win this prized position of power, and they used a variety of tactics to try to achieve their ambition.

Little Cheng Cheng was astonishing, very conniving. In fact they were all quite strategic in their campaigns.

They had to undertake several tasks to impress their classmates, such as performing a musical "turn" in front of the class, making speeches and taking part in debates where they had to point out each other's faults.

Every step of the way they were forcefully supported and guided by their parents, who behaved almost like political advisers.

Cheng Cheng, whose ultimate ambition was to be president of China, wanted to be class monitor because, he said: "You can order people around."

He was coached by his parents in speechmaking, singing, and wrong-footing his rivals.

Lone parent

Luo Lei had already been a class monitor for two years.

When asked whether he wanted the help of his parents in securing his classmates' votes, he said: "No, I will rely on my own strength.


Xu Xiaofei's mother said being a lone parent was a disadvantage
"I don't want to control others. People should think for themselves."

But soon his parents were helping him with techniques and tricks he could use to make himself popular with the class.

Xu Xiaofei, the only girl candidate, was reluctant at first to try to sell herself to the class, but her mother trained her to make speeches and tried very hard to build up her confidence.

But, as a lone parent, she felt she was at a disadvantage:

"I told her I couldn't help very much. She doesn't have a normal family with a father and mother. I can't help her the way Luo Lei's parents help him."

It is also important to understand that China's Family Plan policy of "one couple, one child" has led to a situation where children find there is too much hope from parents and grandparents pressing on their weak shoulders.

Personally, I do not think we have prepared people properly in how to be parents with only one child. It is a big problem.

Democracy in action

Every child or "small sun" has his parents caring for him and influencing him. His family all expect him to be a success in society, even though he is so young.

There is no world of childhood in China.

BBC POLL: WHY DEMOCRACY?
Twelve thousand people in 15 countries were polled in August
58% thought terrorism could destroy democracy
62% thought voting in national elections was very important
57% thought the US political system better equipped than China's to tackle climate change
14% said they would be very unlikely to support the idea of a global parliament

Luo Lei's parents were able to help his campaign by taking the class for a trip on the modern monorail system - which is managed by his father's police department - and by giving him gifts to hand out after his final speech.

But the "small suns" also had some tricks of their own.

Cheng Cheng ensured that his classmates shouted down Xu Xiaofei before she had even started to speak, and she found it difficult to recover.

The next day he told her it had all been Luo Lei's doing, and then proceeded to boo Luo-Lei off the stage.

Later, in a debate in front of the class, he accused him of being a dictator who had beaten his classmates while he had been child monitor.


Luo Lei was elected by classmates in a secret ballot
Luo Lei replied that even parents beat their children and added: "Do you think it's for no reason? It's because they did something wrong. If my method is wrong, I'll change it."

In the end, although the class agreed that Luo Lei had been very strict with them, they elected him in a secret ballot.

I believe the children's joy and sorrow throughout the election, their winning and losing, truly reflect the tough yet hopeful democratisation process in China.

Yup. General has been going to hell since May of 2003. Wish you could have seen the good old days, but you missed them by about six months. Of course, I know a couple people who say the whole game has started going downhill since about December of 2002, in which case I missed it.

It's almost as if everyone thinks things are worse than when they first joined. Weird.

Too bad if it's true, hm?