NationStates Jolt Archive

I recently saw an ad for acupuncture on television. It was a testimonial of a customer, who said acupuncture helped her with pain after she broke both her arms.
What do people here think about it? Personally, I don't believe it actually works, but some people clearly do and they actually seem to improve because of it. What's the deal?

It's a mixture of proven medicine and placebo effect. Accupuncture and accurpressure are ancient arts dating back in China with detailed literature and studies done with them. I even remember a very old episode of Ripley's Believe It or Not where a Chinese surgical team performed an operation on a patient using constant accupuncture instead of anesthetics. The patient was awake the whole time and not even so much as wincing from the procedure.

I think certain things like acupuncture are valid medical techniques, because they work by physically altering some characteristic of the body, like muscles or tendons.

Things like voodoo, or prayer, I think those are a joke. And if they work then it is because of some placebo effect.

other: i haven't a clue.

I think certain things like acupuncture are valid medical techniques, because they work by physically altering some characteristic of the body, like muscles or tendons.

Things like voodoo, or prayer, I think those are a joke. And if they work then it is because of some placebo effect.
That's pretty much it. Acupuncture has been tried and tested scientifically. Stuff like homeopathy and faith healing are only successful through the placebo effect.

Just because something may be a "placebo effect" doesn't make it any less successful.

I have lately considered seeking out more alternative medicine since

A) I don't ever plan on paying for health insurance

B) I am trying to live a less corporate dependent life.

Just because something may be a "placebo effect" doesn't make it any less successful.

I have lately considered seeking out more alternative medicine since

A) I don't ever plan on paying for health insurance

B) I am trying to live a less corporate dependent life.

Well, its not that the placebo effect doesn't work, its that medicines that are essentially placebos (homeopathy) are being touted in the media as actively working to relieve symptoms.

Acupuncture sometimes works, especially for pain. However it seems that it really doesn't matter where you put the needles.
Prayer may work for the person doing the praying. Won't work for the person being prayed for if they're unaware they're being prayed for.
"Folk remedies" is such a broad category you'd have to say they work ocassionally.

The brain is the most powerful organ in the body. Placebos can relieve symptoms.

I guess this is my point:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/science/2007/sep/15/1

Was reading it the other day, and it pretty much sums up my view of alternative medicine. (I'm not even going to start on 'healing crystals')

Well, its not that the placebo effect doesn't work, its that medicines that are essentially placebos (homeopathy) are being touted in the media as actively working to relieve symptoms.

The brain is the most powerful organ in the body. Placebos can relieve symptoms.

Homeopathy is not all placebos. In fact, many medicines used today developed from homeopathic roots (and berries... :) ). Consider the humble aspirin, which comes from the bark of a willow tree.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aspirin

Homeopathy is not all placebos. In fact, many medicines used today developed from homeopathic roots (and berries... :) ). Consider the humble aspirin, which comes from the bark of a willow tree.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aspirin
Well that's not homoeopathy, is it? Homeopathic medicine is the dilution of a substance causing similar symptoms to those which the patient is suffering, and administering that dilution and hoping that the placebo effect works.

I have no gripe with natural remedies at all, provided they actually work (via placebo or not).

Just as a clarifier, I'm talking about folk or alternative medicine instead of traditional medicine.

I think certain things like acupuncture are valid medical techniques, because they work by physically altering some characteristic of the body, like muscles or tendons.

Things like voodoo, or prayer, I think those are a joke. And if they work then it is because of some placebo effect.
How can you tell the difference between a "real" effect and a placebo, though?

Certain things like acupuncture work mainly from the placebo effect and in that sense can be beneficial.

HOWEVER

Most alternative medicine is absolute bullshit and people seriously harm themselves by seeking it out rather than turning to scientifically proven medicine, medical technology, ect ect that we know works.

My uncle does accupuncture at a hospital in Japan. It works, I think. He also cured me once, but I was hallucinating with fever so I don't really remember.

I have no opinion until I experience.

It is difficult to prove that acupuncture works simply because it is so difficult to design a trial where the person administering the acupuncture doesn't know if they are or not and the person receiving the acupuncture also does not know if they are getting acupuncture or not. Without a suitable double blind trial being developed it is hard to offer any really concrete evidence either way.

That said I can see it makes more sense than homeopathy or crystals and all that bullshit.

I even remember a very old episode of Ripley's Believe It or Not where a Chinese surgical team performed an operation on a patient using constant accupuncture instead of anesthetics. The patient was awake the whole time and not even so much as wincing from the procedure.

For a claim so spectacular I would like more than a half remembered episode of a TV programme :)

It is difficult to prove that acupuncture works simply because it is so difficult to design a trial where the person administering the acupuncture doesn't know if they are or not and the person receiving the acupuncture also does not know if they are getting acupuncture or not. Without a suitable double blind trial being developed it is hard to offer any really concrete evidence either way.

Though it has been done recently. See here (http://dcscience.net/?p=166). Quite interesting

I had a doctor try to treat my pain with acupuncture. Though he's apparently well respected in the field, it didn't work for me. Perhaps because I went in with a very skeptical attitude. It did, however, make me nauseous and light-headed. I wasn't sure if I was going to faint or throwup. Fortunately, I did neither.

Remedies that have at least a basis in science (acupuncture/acupressure) have at least some form of benefit. Remedies based on plants (natural medicines) can work, although seriously I'd stick with traditional medicine. Placebo effect is the only benefit from others. And since I am aware of the fact that crystals are simply a matrix of molecules arranged in a regular manner, composed of probably a silicate, I am also aware of the fact that there is nothing supernatural about them.

Remedies that have at least a basis in science (acupuncture/acupressure) have at least some form of benefit.

What basis do meridians and Qi have in science?