NationStates Jolt Archive

Due to the amount of propagandistic garbage relating to Ahmadinejad's speech to the UN, I have noticed that no one have has quoted or even attempted to comment on etc his actual speech to the UN (presumably because they haven't read it, figures), so I thought I would post a link to the video and create this thread for the purpose of actual listening to what he said, his keys points, rather than the kind of collective delusionist mainstream line that tells Americans what to think and how to act.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/7011938.stm
The link is under the picture in this thread.

Discussion:

1. Attacks of the family/social cohesion by rampant international consumerism.

2. Aggression and human rights abuses by the US Empire and it's supporter states.

etc...

pss, we already have one big ass thread on Ahmadinejad, go here. (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=539092)

pss, we already have one big ass thread on Ahmadinejad, go here. (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=539092)

Exactly why I posted this, that thread absolutely no reference to the actual text of his speech, it is merely a pro-American attack fest which totally distracts from content to sound byte (which if of course exactly what American politics is all about - propaganda over harmony).

Exactly why I posted this, that thread absolutely no reference to the actual text of his speech, it is merely a pro-American attack fest which totally distracts from content to sound byte (which if of course exactly what American politics is all about - propaganda over harmony).

yea, it's going to get merged with the other thread anyways, I've already reported this to the Mods. I am part of the Borg, this thread will be assimilated into the borg collective!

yea, it's going to get merged with the other thread anyways, I've already reported this to the Mods. I am part of the Borg, this thread will be assimilated into the borg collective!

I'll appeal that, this is meant to promote an 'actual' discussion of the content of his speech, it's telling that no one in that thread knew anything about that thread nor did they quote it. It's sad NSG is becoming the mainstream propagandistic hatefest the Busheviks like yourself love to propagate.

I thought he made some decent points. Except he missed the part where fact of the world is...if you can hold land by feat of arms...the land is yours. No matter who was there first.

I'll appeal that, this is meant to promote an 'actual' discussion of the content of his speech, it's telling that no one in that thread knew anything about that thread nor did they quote it. It's sad NSG is becoming the mainstream propagandistic hatefest the Busheviks like yourself love to propagate.

Umm...first off, I hate Bush. He has expanded the government powers under the Patriot Act and Homeland Security, all under the name of 'security'. Secondly while he has gave us the tax cut, he also rarely veto a spending bill, thus negating the purpose of the tax cut. Thirdly he tried to expand the government's power again but this time over social lives, IE Gay Marriage Ban, which I disagree with because hey, whoever you want to sleep with or marry is your business and not the government.

Another thing is that NSG is hardly a place for Bush-fans, are there any Bush fans here? and no I'm not talking about the Good kind of Bush, or Busch beer.

... fact of the world is...if you can hold land by feat of arms...the land is yours. No matter who was there first.That's the excuse of the stone-age-minded.

And btw, don't we already have too many Ahmadinejad threads?

Umm...first off, I hate Bush. He has expanded the government powers under the Patriot Act and Homeland Security, all under the name of 'security'. Secondly while he has gave us the tax cut, he also rarely veto a spending bill, thus negating the purpose of the tax cut. Thirdly he tried to expand the government's power again but this time over social lives, IE Gay Marriage Ban, which I disagree with because hey, whoever you want to sleep with or marry is your business and not the government.

Another thing is that NSG is hardly a place for Bush-fans, are there any Bush fans here? and no I'm not talking about the Good kind of Bush, or Busch beer.
Then how can you explain that out of the many NSG threads dealing with the Iranian President in NYC, that non have referenced or attempted to look at the content of his actual speech? They merely say 'anti-semite' yadayadayada and intentionally delude themselves to ensure their 'worldview' is unchallenged, the US media is essentially a propaganda machine to ensure that manifest destiny worldview is not challenge.

Ahmadinejad raised good points about how the US acts imperiously toward sovereign states and undermines great virtues and social coherency through consumerism and a 'might=right' imperialistic agenda.

That's the excuse of the stone-age-minded.

And btw, don't we already have too many Ahmadinejad threads?

They all got merged into one thread that I linked to earlier in this thread.

He's referring to religious ideals too much. Women aren't expressions of divine beauty, nor is the family. They're people and collections of them respectively.

As such nothing is being trampled. Since there is no god telling us to treat women and families a certain way and there is no inviolable rule to that effect, the personal decisions of the people concerned are what matters and nothing else.

He's referring to religious ideals too much. Women aren't expressions of divine beauty, nor is the family. They're people and collections of them respectively.

As such nothing is being trampled. Since there is no god telling us to treat women and families a certain way and there is no inviolable rule to that effect, the personal decisions of the people concerned are what matters and nothing else.

Libertarian twaddle.
Is it so bad that he actually legitimately believes righteous virtues of religion rather than using it as a tool of free-market consumerism and world imperialism as the US does? His view is not far from my own, although I do not see religion as a necessary inspiration for such ideals, preserving the social contract against incursions of the materialistic powers. People are not inviolable beings unto themselves, we are all part of the community, we identify ourselves as integral parts in society, like cogs in a giant machine, if one comes out it doesn't work.

Is it so bad that he actually legitimately believes righteous virtues of religion rather than using it as a tool of free-market consumerism and world imperialism as the US does?
Well, his real-world interpretation of such righteous virtues and the things that await those who don't happen to share in them tells me that yes, it is.

His view is not far from my own, although I do not see religion as a necessary inspiration for such ideals, preserving the social contract against incursions of the materialistic powers.
We live in a material world, don't we? We're made of matter, and we have to survive on a planet made of matter, by dealing in material things, like finding food and shelter.

What good is a social contract if it protects us against the material world? Hasn't our species been so successful precisely because of our ability to do well materially? Why the hell would we want to be protected against finding food and shelter? I can be quite happy emotionally and have a really close family, but that won't fill my stomach or protect me from lions.

He takes all these things for granted and pretends we can somehow exist seperately from them. It's classic religion: the material is evil, the spiritual is good. But I see very few people actually living the life of asceticism, nor do I see the appeal in denying the one thing that has allows us to survive.

People are not inviolable beings unto themselves, we are all part of the community, we identify ourselves as integral parts in society, like cogs in a giant machine, if one comes out it doesn't work.
Now there's something for you to actually prove. Take whatever route you want, but I want to see a clear, irrefutable proof of this.

pss, we already have one big ass thread on Ahmadinejad, go here. (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=539092)

No, this thread is different. It's on his speech to the UN.

Here are direct links. You can watch and listen to his UN speech here (http://webcast.un.org/ramgen/ondemand/ga/62/2007/ga070925pm2.rm?start=00:00:48&end=00:39:17), or you can read it here (http://www.un.org/webcast/ga/62/2007/pdfs/iran-eng.pdf). I'm listening to it now.

There's a lot of rubbish there, mixed in with a few good points.

By the way, Ortega's speech (http://webcast.un.org/ramgen/ondemand/ga/62/2007/ga070925am2.rm?start=01:09:17&end=01:43:07) is worth hearing too.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/7011938.stm
The link is under the picture in this thread.

Discussion:

1. Attacks of the family/social cohesion by rampant international consumerism.

:confused:

2. Aggression and human rights abuses by the US Empire and it's supporter states.

He should talk about Human rights abuses when he is a great violator of the them themselves. Pot meet kettle.

Well, his real-world interpretation of such righteous virtues and the things that await those who don't happen to share in them tells me that yes, it is.


We live in a material world, don't we? We're made of matter, and we have to survive on a planet made of matter, by dealing in material things, like finding food and shelter.

What good is a social contract if it protects us against the material world? Hasn't our species been so successful precisely because of our ability to do well materially? Why the hell would we want to be protected against finding food and shelter? I can be quite happy emotionally and have a really close family, but that won't fill my stomach or protect me from lions.

He takes all these things for granted and pretends we can somehow exist seperately from them. It's classic religion: the material is evil, the spiritual is good. But I see very few people actually living the life of asceticism, nor do I see the appeal in denying the one thing that has allows us to survive.


Now there's something for you to actually prove. Take whatever route you want, but I want to see a clear, irrefutable proof of this.

I agree with you Neu Leonstein

Then how can you explain that out of the many NSG threads dealing with the Iranian President in NYC, that non have referenced or attempted to look at the content of his actual speech?

Because its the same old, boring idealistic, paranoid bullshit that we already expect from him.


They merely say 'anti-semite' yadayadayada and intentionally delude themselves to ensure their 'worldview' is unchallenged, the US media is essentially a propaganda machine to ensure that manifest destiny worldview is not challenge.


Do you understand how ridiculously retarded that sounds? Since no true socialist ever spurs out paranoid nonsense like that, I can only assume you are trolling or are mentally unstable.


Ahmadinejad raised good points about how the US acts imperiously toward sovereign states and undermines great virtues and social coherency through consumerism and a 'might=right' imperialistic agenda.

The points are nothing more then the same boring childish rhetoric you expect an annoying little anti-everything teenager to whine about. Everyone already knows that the US acts imperiously, that's a given.