NationStates Jolt Archive

Hard to fit the whole question in the topic so let me clarify. I know a President couldnt run for VP after he served two terms as President. But could he say become the Secretary of Education that was like 19 heartbeats away( not the real number in the acention line but you get the idea) and if so, where is the "cutoff" number so to speak.

I believe the answer is no. If he'd be in the line of succession at all, it's unconstitutional.

Wasn't thier talk of Bill Clinton getting a cabinet position if Hillary won '08?

Wasn't thier talk of Bill Clinton getting a cabinet position if Hillary won '08?

That's what the OP was refferring to, yes. But Clinton can't do it. He's said so himself.

That's what the OP was refferring to, yes. But Clinton can't do it. He's said so himself.

Hmm. Pity.

I think he can only run for 2 terms, but he can be VP or in the Cabinet. I may be mistaken though.

I think he can only run for 2 terms, but he can be VP or in the Cabinet. I may be mistaken though.

You are mistaken, for the reason I pointed out earlier.

I believe the answer is no. If he'd be in the line of succession at all, it's unconstitutional.

I don't think that is quite accurate. The Constitution would prevent him from serving as President but not prevent him from being a Cabinet member. Even though he would be in the line of succession, they could always skip over him and go to the next person in line.

From the FAQ on the CONSTITUTION ON-LINE Page...
http://www.usconstitution.net/constfaq_a7.html
Bolding mine, comments in red.


so yes, Bill Clinton can take a Cabinet, or be elected into the House or Senate, but then the line of sucession will just skip him.

I stand corrected.

From the FAQ on the CONSTITUTION ON-LINE Page...
http://www.usconstitution.net/constfaq_a7.html
Bolding mine, comments in red.
Q140. "I heard on talk radio that Bill Clinton was planning to figure out a way to be President again. Is there any possible way this could happen?"

A. The short answer is "No."

But because this sort of rumor circulates pretty quickly across the Internet and talk radio, let's be a little more verbose and look at all the possibilities. First, though, to the subject of Clinton: my understanding is that he was asked to speculate on how he might return to the Presidency - not that he was actually planning to try to do so.

The 22nd Amendment is pretty clear - no president can be elected to the presidency more than twice, and if a Vice President assumes the presidency, he or she can be elected twice thereafter if they serve two years of the former president's term or less, or once if they serve more than two years of the former president's term.

Any scheme to get a two-term president back into the White House, then, must get around these limits. The first way is to get the President into the Vice Presidency somehow. There is one big, major hurdle to this kind of scheme, however - the last clause of the 12th Amendment prohibits anyone from becoming Vice President if they are ineligible for the Presidency. So, Clinton cannot be elected to be Vice President, and he cannot be appointed to replace a Vice President. Any scheme that uses "Clinton as Vice President" as its basis fails on its face on this accord. So not by being VP.

The other scheme is to insert Clinton into the Line of Succession somewhere. This is a possibility - he can be elected to the House and become Speaker, or be elected to the Senate and become President Pro Tem. Both of these positions are in the Line. He can also be named to a Cabinet position, and all cabinet secretaries are in the Line. However, there is one main sticking point in this scheme - the law prohibits anyone constitutionally ineligible from assuming the Presidency. In other words, if Clinton was Speaker of the House, the presidency would skip him over and fall to the President Pro Tem. so no, since he is ineligeble to be President. Since this is just a law, and can be repealed, there is a fall-back: the 22nd Amendment. Though it specifies that no one can be elected more than twice, and this would be an assumption and not an election, it could be argued that the 22nd would not apply. I think this is too strict a reading of the amendment, and if challenged, the Supreme Court would interpret "elected" to mean any means of assuming the presidency.

Lastly, any scheme all assumes some pretty extraordinary circumstances - none of which are likely to ever occur.

The only likely scheme I can see is the repeal of the 22nd Amendment. With that, all of these schemes become unnecessary. But that also seems very unlikely.

so yes, Bill Clinton can take a Cabinet, or be elected into the House or Senate, but then the line of sucession will just skip him.

At one time a relative of the president couldn't hold a cabinet post. This was passed after Bobby Kennedy served as the Attorney General under John. I don't know if that law is still in effect.

A better bet would be for Clinton to be appointed to the Supreme court.

At one time a relative of the president couldn't hold a cabinet post. This was passed after Bobby Kennedy served as the Attorney General under John. I don't know if that law is still in effect.

A better bet would be for Clinton to be appointed to the Supreme court.

I would imagine it is still a law. I'd forgotten about that.

Oh, and SCOTUS is probably out. Wasn't Clinton disbarred?

A better bet would be for Clinton to be appointed to the Supreme court.

I would think it would be highly unlikely that someone unable to practice law in front of the supreme court could ever be successfully appointed to the supreme court

At one time a relative of the president couldn't hold a cabinet post. This was passed after Bobby Kennedy served as the Attorney General under John. I don't know if that law is still in effect.

A better bet would be for Clinton to be appointed to the Supreme court.... would be nice to find that law.

I would imagine it is still a law. I'd forgotten about that.

Oh, and SCOTUS is probably out. Wasn't Clinton disbarred?
I thought Hillary was the lawyer... :confused:

Oh, and SCOTUS is probably out. Wasn't Clinton disbarred?

His Arkansas bar license was suspended for 5 years (and since this was in 2001, is no longer valid). Following that he did, however, resign from the Supreme Court bar.

Clinton has no active disbarrments.

I thought Hillary was the lawyer... :confused:

They both have law degrees from Yale, which is where they met.

They both have law degrees from Yale, which is where they met.

Ah... nice to know. :cool:

I would think it would be highly unlikely that someone unable to practice law in front of the supreme court could ever be successfully appointed to the supreme court

Actually there is no rule that says one has to be a lawyer to be on the supreme court. I believe it was done in the past but not recently. If the senate remains Democratic, all he would need is 50 votes.

I believe the answer is no. If he'd be in the line of succession at all, it's unconstitutional.

Yeah the Line of Succession would mean that he could eventually be President again so probably not. He could be an unofficial member I imagine or a post not in the Line of Succession, which could probably be created by the sitting President if need be, no?

Absolutely. They just wouldn't be eligible for president. A former president could even be vice-president. There are a few non-native born people in the Cabinet, who are therefore not in the line of succession.

I don't think that is quite accurate. The Constitution would prevent him from serving as President but not prevent him from being a Cabinet member. Even though he would be in the line of succession, they could always skip over him and go to the next person in line.

Theres a point that the line of succession is un-breakable.

He can't serve as cabinet or any other position that puts him in line for presidency. Doing so would risk dictatorship, due to the possibility of him taking out the rest of the cabinet to take the presidency.

Absolutely. They just wouldn't be eligible for president. A former president could even be vice-president. There are a few non-native born people in the Cabinet, who are therefore not in the line of succession.

Wrong.

Theres a point that the line of succession is un-breakable.

He can't serve as cabinet or any other position that puts him in line for presidency. Doing so would risk dictatorship, due to the possibility of him taking out the rest of the cabinet to take the presidency.

You know, you people are going to make me get my eyes stuck in this position.

:rolleyes:

Wrong.

So Carlos Guitierrez (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carlos_Gutierrez), Secretary of Commerce isn't in the Cabinet? He was born in Cuba, btw. Or what about Elaine Chao (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elaine_Chao), Secretary of Labor, who was born in Taiwan?

Wrong.

Read the Constitution. It's the only thing that can make restrictions on that kind of stuff. And there's nothing in it that forbids former Presidents from being in any position. They could even run for president, but their VP would immediately get the officie instead, making it pointless.

Wasn't thier talk of Bill Clinton getting a cabinet position if Hillary won '08?

I believe Bill would be the cabin boy, not a member of the cabinet.

:eek:

So Carlos Guitierrez (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carlos_Gutierrez), Secretary of Commerce isn't in the Cabinet? He was born in Cuba, btw. Or what about Elaine Chao (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elaine_Chao), Secretary of Labor, who was born in Taiwan?

and of course, let us not forget the most famous example. Former Secretary of State Henry Kissinger, who was born in Germany

So Carlos Guitierrez (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carlos_Gutierrez), Secretary of Commerce isn't in the Cabinet? He was born in Cuba, btw. Or what about Elaine Chao (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elaine_Chao), Secretary of Labor, who was born in Taiwan?

and of course, let us not forget the most famous example. Former Secretary of State Henry Kissinger, who was born in Germany

And Madeleine Albright (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Madeline_Albright) born in Czechoslovakia.

And Madeleine Albright (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Madeline_Albright) born in Czechoslovakia.

Really now? *scratches head*

He can serve in the Cabinet...he'd just be passed over for line of succession.

Which makes me wonder...after all of the Cabinet members, who's next in line?

He can serve in the Cabinet...he'd just be passed over for line of succession.

Which makes me wonder...after all of the Cabinet members, who's next in line?

We hope that doesn't happen. But, there is currently no provision for it.

He can serve in the Cabinet...he'd just be passed over for line of succession.

Which makes me wonder...after all of the Cabinet members, who's next in line?

Frankly, if something happens so catastrophic that we lose the president, the vice president, the speaker of the house, the president pro tem of the senate and the entire cabinet all in the amount of time before someone can appoint a new cabinet...

Odds are the country is going to be run by some general under a mountain in colorado somewhere.

Frankly, if something happens so catastrophic that we lose the president, the vice president, the speaker of the house, the president pro tem of the senate and the entire cabinet all in the amount of time before someone can appoint a new cabinet...

Odds are the country is going to be run by some general under a mountain in colorado somewhere.

I agree, but did you ever notice that when the President gives a State of the Union address one cabinet member has to stay home? (Usually the Secretary of Education since it's at the bottom of the list.)

Wrong.

Henry Kissinger served as Secretary of State. He was born in Germany.

Madeleine Albright was born as Maria Jana Korbelová IPA: [ˈmarɪjɛ ˈjana ˈkorbɛlova:] in Prague, Czechoslovakia, served as Secretary of State.

Frankly, if something happens so catastrophic that we lose the president, the vice president, the speaker of the house, the president pro tem of the senate and the entire cabinet all in the amount of time before someone can appoint a new cabinet...

Odds are the country is going to be run by some general under a mountain in colorado somewhere.

You've a point there.

Ah well. In any case, the point that he'd simply be passed over stands. As stated, people such as Henry Kissinger and Madeleine Albright were from different countries yet were still appointed as Cabinet members.

and of course, let us not forget the most famous example. Former Secretary of State Henry Kissinger, who was born in Germany

I was sticking with current Cabinet members.

Hard to fit the whole question in the topic so let me clarify. I know a President couldnt run for VP after he served two terms as President. But could he say become the Secretary of Education that was like 19 heartbeats away( not the real number in the acention line but you get the idea) and if so, where is the "cutoff" number so to speak.

Yes he can. All the Constitution states is that he can serve for only 2 terms in office or nor more than 10 years. This as President. Outside of that, as far as the Constitution is concerned, a past President can indeed by in a cabinet.

I believe the answer is no. If he'd be in the line of succession at all, it's unconstitutional.

Wrong for reason stated above.

Absolutely. They just wouldn't be eligible for president. A former president could even be vice-president. There are a few non-native born people in the Cabinet, who are therefore not in the line of succession.

Wrong.

So Carlos Guitierrez (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carlos_Gutierrez), Secretary of Commerce isn't in the Cabinet? He was born in Cuba, btw. Or what about Elaine Chao (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elaine_Chao), Secretary of Labor, who was born in Taiwan?

and of course, let us not forget the most famous example. Former Secretary of State Henry Kissinger, who was born in Germany

And Madeleine Albright (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Madeline_Albright) born in Czechoslovakia.

CoallitionOfTheWilling got skooled. Well done guys :)

I agree, but did you ever notice that when the President gives a State of the Union address one cabinet member has to stay home? (Usually the Secretary of Education since it's at the bottom of the list.)

Actually, homeland security these days :D

Actually, homeland security these days :D

I think they actually just pick randomly...

No.

I think they actually just pick randomly...

And they keep a atleast 4 Reps and 2 senators in secret locations as well IIRC.

CoallitionOfTheWilling got skooled. Well done guys :)

Unless, of course, he was saying "wrong" in response to "A former president could even be vice-president".

In which case he was perfectly correct.