NationStates Jolt Archive

Story (http://www.cnn.com/2007/WORLD/meast/09/13/iraq.roundtable/index.html)

It seems that the youth realize more clearly what is going on there- and what needs to be done- more than some older Iraqis and U.S. citizens. They are the future of that country and I believe we should listen to what they want done, and try to the best of our ability to make that come true.

Ok that is 5. What about the rest?

Note: I didn't view the video. Something wonky is going on with my machine's player.....

They should start wedgieing insurgents. :)

Story (http://www.cnn.com/2007/WORLD/meast/09/13/iraq.roundtable/index.html)

It seems that the youth realize more clearly what is going on there- and what needs to be done- more than some older Iraqis and U.S. citizens. They are the future of that country and I believe we should listen to what they want done, and try to the best of our ability to make that come true.

You mean after raping the country?

Also, seriously: You're clutching at straws THAT badly now that you have to look for one specific minority group that shares your opinion and treat it as authority? Please.

They should start wedgieing insurgents. :) I agree. And I hope you mean an Atomic Wedgie with a 4 and a half twist put in for good measure.

You mean after raping the country?

Also, seriously: You're clutching at straws THAT badly now that you have to look for one specific minority group that shares your opinion and treat it as authority? Please.
... so the views of a group is nothing to you just because they are a minority?

Also, seriously: You're clutching at straws THAT badly now that you have to look for one specific minority group that shares your opinion and treat it as authority? Please.

And since they agree with him, they're the only group that realizes "clearly" what is going on over there.

And since they agree with him, they're the only group that realizes "clearly" what is going on over there.

Couldn't the same thing be said about this thread (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=538172)?

Couldn't the same thing be said about this thread (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=538172)?

Yep.

Yep.

I'm just waiting for someone to show up posting in both threads. You know it's only a matter of time before the hypocricy starts to show up...

"Apple Scrumping season is May-July here, it'd be good if your troops could be out by then, so that we get security, but it's not like my friend Ahmed gets a 5.56 round to the back like last time. Thanks!"

... so the views of a group is nothing to you just because they are a minority?

Show me where I said that. I was against this damn bloodbath back when I was a minority regarding it; I got called an US-hater for that. I got kicked out of a chatroom for that. I got insulted and screwed for that in many ways. I didn't say the views of the group mean nothing because they are a minority, I said he's trying to use a specific portion of a society to support his skewered view that the US should keep on raping Iraq. And when even THEY are tired of the rape, he'll eschew and discard them if he isn't.

Show me where I said that.

NSG's unofficial sport is strawman construction.

Show me where I said that. I was against this damn bloodbath back when I was a minority regarding it; I got called an US-hater for that. I got kicked out of a chatroom for that. I got insulted and screwed for that in many ways. I didn't say the views of the group mean nothing because they are a minority, I said he's trying to use a specific portion of a society to support his skewered view that the US should keep on raping Iraq. And when even THEY are tired of the rape, he'll eschew and discard them if he isn't.

If you keep saying that is what they are trying to do now, it may come true. :rolleyes:

If you keep saying that is what they are trying to do now, it may come true. :rolleyes:

I never said the US were TRYING to rape Iraq. But level with me here: Is it illegal? Yes. Is it unwanted? Yes. Is it based on power? Yes. Is it violent? Yes. Show me the difference between the US in terms of international relations regarding Iraq and the average rapist. There's even the "she was wearing skimpy clothes" rhetoric in "Saddam had to be deposed"!

The Iraquis want the US to leave, yet they want the protection of our military and the billions of dollars we're pouring into their economy and infrastructure. And they're threatening us with terroristic retribution if we don't comply.

So why the hell are we there? We're causing the problem. If someone attacks us at home--fine, we'll defend ourselves, but these foreign wars (begining with our involvement in the Philipines and extending through the World Wars into Iraq) are ridiculous.

By the way, if you really want stability and all sorts of other goodies for Iraq, I'd advise you either to move to the Middle East and join the military or start donating your own money to the Iraqi government.

Personally, I'm sick of my tax dollars being extorted at the point of the gun, just to end up at the other side of said gun in Iraq.

I never said the US were TRYING to rape Iraq. But level with me here: Is it illegal? Yes. Is it unwanted? Yes. Is it based on power? Yes. Is it violent? Yes. Show me the difference between the US in terms of international relations regarding Iraq and the average rapist. There's even the "she was wearing skimpy clothes" rhetoric in "Saddam had to be deposed"!

This is different, you seem to be implying that by staying in Iraq the USA are continuing to "rape" Iraq, which in fact is not true as you know. They are doing their best to repair and restabilize Iraq, this is separate from the invasion.

They should start wedgieing insurgents. :)

That would be grand, in fact, they should just wedgie everyone until they all stop fighting, and just are busily wedgying each other. Eventually they'll all realize that there really isn't much difference between themselves, they all enjoy giving wedgies, and they all are wedgieable.

Show me where I said that. I was against this damn bloodbath back when I was a minority regarding it; I got called an US-hater for that. I got kicked out of a chatroom for that. I got insulted and screwed for that in many ways. I didn't say the views of the group mean nothing because they are a minority, I said he's trying to use a specific portion of a society to support his skewered view that the US should keep on raping Iraq. And when even THEY are tired of the rape, he'll eschew and discard them if he isn't.
You mean after raping the country?

Also, seriously: You're clutching at straws THAT badly now that you have to look for one specific minority group that shares your opinion and treat it as authority? Please.

1 point, I never said you were for or against anything. just wondering why you are discounting 1 group speaking FOR the US presence (and note, it doesn't mean that they wanted the US there in the first place.)

and as for him eschewing and discarding them... it sure sounded like you just did the same thing by calling them one specific minority group. do you know how many Iraqi youngsters feel this way?

however, I will say that they NEVER said they wanted the US in there from the start. they just realize that with the US gone, the situation would be worse.

also no one has yet commented that they also admit that the current Iraqi Government is so corrupt that they can't think of any one individual in the governemnt that they trust. A Government set up by the US.

SO perhaps they do have a better grasp of the situation than most adults. I hope, however, that they (the children of Iraq) get a chance to improve their country and their government. with or without our 'help'.

This is different, you seem to be implying that by staying in Iraq the USA are continuing to "rape" Iraq, which in fact is not true as you know. They are doing their best to repair and restabilize Iraq, this is separate from the invasion.

Let's keep on the comparison for one moment.

Rapist: "Wanna keep on having sex?"

Victim: "No!"

Rapist: "Tough."

----

US: "Want the occupation to continue?"

Average Iraqi: "No!"

US: "Tough."

And... done.

Snip.

I'm not disparaging one group, I'm disparaging the guy treating this group as if it knew better than all the others just because said group happens to agree with him.

I'm not disparaging one group, I'm disparaging the guy treating this group as if it knew better than all the others just because said group happens to agree with him.

fine. but they (the group) does have a couple of points for them.

1) the current Iraqi Government is corrupt.
2) Pulling out will accelerate the fall into Civil War. (of course staying may delay it, but it may also prevent it. Operative word MAY.)


The op is wrong that they know what needs to be done (the artical states that the group does NOT know what has to be done,) but at least they (the group) are thinking about it. We listened to the adults so far... maybe the children/teens have an idea.

They should start wedgieing insurgents. :)

That's probably more than the politicians want them to do.

A panel of five Iraqi young people proves absolutely nothing.

The Iraquis want the US to leave, yet they want the protection of our military and the billions of dollars we're pouring into their economy and infrastructure. And they're threatening us with terroristic retribution if we don't comply.

So why the hell are we there? We're causing the problem. If someone attacks us at home--fine, we'll defend ourselves, but these foreign wars (begining with our involvement in the Philipines and extending through the World Wars into Iraq) are ridiculous.

All of your opinions aside this is one segment of your argument that I as a history major must argue. We attempted to stay out of both World Wars as an Isolationist nation but Germany wanted to stop our shipping of goods to the UK and France so they continually attacked our merchant vessels also they wanted Mexico to start a war with us (look up the Zimmerman Note), as for WW2 (we were attacked first at Pearl Harbor) if we stayed out all of Europe and Africa would belong to the Germans (imagine if there was no end to the Holocaust), the Russians would have lost or put a peace treaty on the table because the Germans would have had the resources to repel the Russians back into Russia (or defeat them at Stalingrad without having to fight the war in the West or Africa, if we didnt economically help Britian and set up a volunteer group of our Army Air Corps to go over and fight they could have lost), Japan (complete disregard for the well-being of any defeated peoples) would control most of Asia and the Pacific, and we would not be a strong country at all possibly having to fight a war on our own soil at some point.

Snip.

That you had the "right" to enter WW2 that's fine, but I don't think Europe would be in Germany's hands. Reasons: 1- A dystopia always ends, and the Nazi one wouldn't be an exception; At some point the Germans themselves would grow weary of the situation. 2- The British and Russian armies weren't that bad; somewhere there would be a breaking point in the German army. Would it be more difficult? Yes. But it wouldn't be impossible. 3- At some point the supply lines of Germany in Africa and likely Japan in Asia would break.