NationStates Jolt Archive

Surely this is one reason why bureaucracies suck?

EDIT: I am obviously right; Jolt ranks me as more important than you. :P

I have a question, why do some immigrants think that by learning English, they are losing their heritage and culture? These people can't juggle two languages?

...before they are allowed to live in an English-speaking country (and if they're just visiting, then made to learn at least basic English): http://www.cnn.com/2007/US/07/22/charges.dismissed.ap/index.html (case against African rapist* gets dropped because an interpreter wasn't found quickly enough)

And for those people who like to shout "racist" for their own ends at things which are not racist:
1. I have no problem with people from ANY country
2. I think English people should be made to learn another country's language before living there too.
3. Etc etc etc

*There were (cowardly/evil) witnesses. Don't give me that "you don't know he's a rapist" crap.

I have a question, why do some immigrants think that by learning English, they are losing their heritage and culture? These people can't juggle two languages?

Well I don't think the problem lies with just immigrants (how many tourists do you know who actually bother learning a country's language before visiting?), but I think it's because they're too lazy to learn - which kinda wrecks any idea of their efficiency as doctors or nurses etc.

I don't think that tourists should be forced to learn English, we need to be making it easier for people to spend their money in the UK, not harder. Likewise with EU migrants, I doubt that under EU law we could refuse entry to people who can't speak English. And I wouldn't impose such a requirement for refugees. For the rest, I don't have a problem with mandatory English classes.

Wait...the guy went to school in America and spoke English to the police...yet someone thought he needed an interpreter?

Oh, and I like the last line of the story: "The Washington Post reported that it identified three Vai interpreters Thursday with help from the National Association of Judiciary Interpreters, including one in Gaithersburg"

Well done, the Washington Post. Three Vai interpreters. I am impressed. Why, that's one fewer than the court managed to find. :rolleyes:

I don't think that tourists should be forced to learn English, we need to be making it easier for people to spend their money in the UK, not harder. Likewise with EU migrants, I doubt that under EU law we could refuse entry to people who can't speak English. And I wouldn't impose such a requirement for refugees. For the rest, I don't have a problem with mandatory English classes.

I don't see why not immigrants/refugees. Stuff EU law, we need to prevent more cases like the one above. And tourists could be made to learn basic English - it won't stop them. After all, the US government still tortures people and English people still fly there.

And btw you leave only English people to learn English.

I don't see why not immigrants/refugees. Stuff EU law, we need to prevent more cases like the one above. And tourists could be made to learn basic English - it won't stop them. After all, the US government still tortures people and English people still fly there.

And btw you leave only English people to learn English.
Taking your post point by point...

1. EU migrants cannot be banned from entering the country because they can't speak the language. If we tried, they could take us (the Home Office, whoever) to court. That would be expensive. Very expensive. And that's before considering the costs of introducing tests for every EU migrant who came to live here.

2. Not refugees? Right... "Sorry, Mr X, you and your family can't come into this country. You can't speak English well enough. Yes, I know this means you'd have to go back to your home country where you'll likely be killed, your wife raped numerous times and your kids sold into slavery, but y'know, Mr Multiland said you can't come in."

3. Tourists could be made to learn English, yes. You just tell me how we'd enforce this on the education systems of other countries and I'll be on the phone to the PM straight away telling him about this.

Or do you want to test them when they arrive? "Sorry, Mr Y, you can't take your holiday here. You don't speak enough English. Yes, I know you've spent your life savings on this holiday, but that's not really my problem now is it? I'm just doing my job. I'm sure you've got insurance against this sort of thing...what's that? You couldn't afford insurance because of the cost of living here? Well, ain't that a shame...?"

4. No, he doesn't leave only English people. What about migrants from non-EU nations? Which, in fact, is relevant to the article you posted...

I don't see why not immigrants/refugees.
I doubt people fleeing natural disasters and political persecution will all know a great deal of English, and even then, are supposed to go home eventually. If they then decide to settle, then they can learn English.

Stuff EU law, we need to prevent more cases like the one above.
Frankly, I don't think it is that frequent a problem to warrant fighting, and losing, a political battle with the EU over. If I had my way EU immigrants would learn English too, but that's tough shit.

And tourists could be made to learn basic English - it won't stop them. After all, the US government still tortures people and English people still fly there.
The USA hardly routinely picks people out of Disneyland and puts them on the rack. Guantanamo Bay doesn't put people off because it doesn't effect them at all. Having to fork out time and money on English classes simply to get into the country for a week will. Most, if not all, tourist resorts and attractions already do fine with tourists that can't speak much English. I don't see what benefit mandatory language classes for tourists would bring, or what problem it would solve.

And btw you leave only English people to learn English.
We have immigrants from countries outside the EU.

...before they are allowed to live in an English-speaking country
Just to very simply blow your argument to pieces.

There is no official language in the US, so it's not really an 'English-speaking country'. You'd be just as well off to claim that everyone speak Spanish.

There is no official language in the US, so it's not really an 'English-speaking country'. You'd be just as well off to claim that everyone speak Spanish.

For all intents and purposes, it is. No other language in the US carries the influence that English does, or will for that matter given that English is rapidly becoming the true world language of business and international relations. If you don't know it, you will be permanently hampered in your career and your opportunities in this country...it's a de facto official language, even if there is no law establishing it as such,

Just to very simply blow your argument to pieces.

There is no official language in the US, so it's not really an 'English-speaking country'. You'd be just as well off to claim that everyone speak Spanish.
It is the de facto official language, and it is official in law in many states.

The article seems to me to be a better demonstration of why people from the U.S. should be MADE to learn a second language. Then finding interpreters would be much less of a problem, no?

I have a question, why do some immigrants think that by learning English, they are losing their heritage and culture? These people can't juggle two languages?Most anglophones can't juggle two languages... :eek:

Most anglophones can't juggle two languages... :eek:Are you saying that learning English causes mental retardation? :mad:

...

*wipes drool off chin*

everyone should learn English because its a great language and I speak it. ipso facto, everyone should speak it to make my life easier. I like it when things are easy.