NationStates Jolt Archive


Challenging the IMF hegemony

Andaras Prime
09-08-2007, 13:29
Hugo Chavez has an attitude problem. Only last April the Venezuelan president escaped a kidnapping by the Chairman of the nation’s Chamber of Commerce. This weekend, Chavez is facing a recall petition by the angry rich of Venezuela. He also faces the wrath of an angry rich American president who does not appreciate Chavez’ bad attitude toward globalization a la Rumsfeld.

Annoying the moneyed and the powerful is Chavez’ gift. And this week, at the meeting of the Congress of Andean Parliaments, he unwrapped a special surprise, a renewed proposal for PetroSur, functionally, a Latin American OPEC.

Venezuela, not Saudi Arabia, has long been the USA’s largest supplier of foreign oil. By combining Venezuela’s huge state-owned oil company with Ecuador’s, Brazil’s and Trinadad’s (all nations now headed by elected leftists), Chavez could create a bargaining hammer for hemispheric trade talks which, up to now, have been mostly a one-way lecture from the USA.

“If Exxon and Mobil can combine, and Texaco and Phillips, why not PetroBrasil and PdVSA?” Chavez asks, referring to the Brazilian and Venezuelan government operators.

Well, Hugo, you KNOW why not. I remember the story of Ferdinand Marcos’ proposal to the Shah of Iran some years back. The Philippines dictator suggested to the Iranian despot that Iran go around the US oil giants and ship directly to the Philippines for refining and sale. The Shah pointed to his personal jet which brought him to Manila. “Do you see the plane that brought me here? Do you know who paid for it? And what do you think would happen to that plane if I were to adopt your suggestion?”

A proposal for a Latin OPEC is an invitation for a bullet. But that’s Chavez’ style. His assassins don’t have to hunt him down; he looks for THEM. His attitude is, “take your best shot.” And, as if to make the point, I’d noted he left the several bullet holes in the windows of the Presidential Palace from the last coup attempt (the one where he was held hostage under orders of a wannabe dictator, Pedro Carmona, chief of the nation’s business confederation).

If creating a Latin OPEC is possible, Chavez is the man to pull it off. During Venezuela’s recent turn at the Presidency of OPEC, Chavez successfully raised the world price of crude to $20 a barrel from $10.

This year Chavez successfully rebuilt Venezuela’s oil company after a devastating management strike and campaign of widespread sabotage at PdVSA plants and pumps. It has to infuriate Bush’s oil patch buddies that Chavez restored Venezuela’s output from near zero to 2-1/2 million barrels a day while, after the same eight month period, Generalissimo Paul Bremer still can’t pump enough oil out of Iraq to fill a Humvee.
***
Greg Palast, the author of the New York Times bestseller, The Best Democracy Money Can Buy, is in Caracas on assignment for Rolling Stone Magazine. At www.GregPalast.com find photos from Venezuela and Palast’s other reports.

http://www.gregpalast.com/cruisin-for-a-bruisin-with-hugorngreg-palast-in-caracas/

I thought I'd use this article to start a discussion on the economic policies of Chavez, I think a main point to be made in the above article is that the US doesn't like direct oil/petroleum trading between nations, it instead likes the 'petrocredits' to go through money centers in New York as loan which can carry interest rates up t0 16%, Chavez is also trying to set up these kinds of systems with Iran by converting to Euros.
Lunatic Goofballs
09-08-2007, 18:26
IMF=Impossible Missions Force? :confused:

http://www.moviewavs.com/php/sounds/?id=bst&media=MP3S&type=Movies&movie=Mission_Impossible&quote=theme1.txt&file=theme1.mp3
Corneliu
09-08-2007, 18:47
And just who will be in this latin OPEC and what would OPEC do to Venezuela? This will not bode well for gas prices. *shudders*
Brutland and Norden
09-08-2007, 18:50
Well, Hugo, you KNOW why not. I remember the story of Ferdinand Marcos’ proposal to the Shah of Iran some years back. The Philippines dictator suggested to the Iranian despot that Iran go around the US oil giants and ship directly to the Philippines for refining and sale. The Shah pointed to his personal jet which brought him to Manila. “Do you see the plane that brought me here? Do you know who paid for it? And what do you think would happen to that plane if I were to adopt your suggestion?”
Didn't know this factoid. Probably that's why gas prices are way too expensive...
Vetalia
09-08-2007, 19:12
Didn't know this factoid. Probably that's why gas prices are way too expensive...

Nope, it's entirely due to supply and demand. The world economy is booming and demand for oil is soaring as more and more people consume it in their newly bought cars and houses...and world oil supplies are not able to grow to meet the challenge. There is almost no supply cushion in the world market.

Even so, a lot of people forget just how expensive oil is to produce...that's exactly why big state-owned companies dominate the market.
Remote Observer
09-08-2007, 19:34
I don't honestly believe that the OP is completely correct.

Let's notice something: The original OPEC, when it tried to flex its muscles in the 1970s, hurt the US - but they also hurt themselves.

Venezuela needs money, and foreign investment.

Right now, it's pretty hostile to foreign investment. Not many investors want to invest in a country that is nationalizing things left and right.

Selling oil is a big way to make money. But someone has to buy it. In this world, there are people who will buy it - so that's not as big of a problem.

Venezuela has only two oil problems:

1. Their oil is higher sulfur than other oil, which means that it requires more processing. This means that they may end up selling it for slightly less than say, Libyan sweet crude, which is extremely low in sulfur.

2. Like Mexico, and other places, Venezuela's oil will run out. When it does, it is unlikely that Venezuela will have a comparable source of revenue. That, coupled with a then long term hostility to outside investors, will bring the place to its knees without a shot being fired.
Neu Leonstein
10-08-2007, 00:34
I clicked this thread to discuss the IMF, and instead I get this?

Brazil's President doesn't get along with Chavez whatsoever, the two are engaged in a struggle for regional influence. And besides, PdVSA can't afford Petrobras because Chavez keeps using the money it earns to buy votes.

Chavez is as much a demagogue in foreign policies as he is at home. He's just got two messages: "The US Sucks!" and "Here, have some money!". It's like that regional development bank he wants to compete with the World Bank...apparently it's just going to hand money out without any sort of conditions or requirements attached. :D
The Loyal Opposition
10-08-2007, 00:54
I thought I'd use this article to start a discussion on the economic policies of Chavez, I think a main point to be made in the above article is that the US doesn't like direct oil/petroleum trading between nations, it instead likes the 'petrocredits' to go through money centers in New York as loan which can carry interest rates up t0 16%, Chavez is also trying to set up these kinds of systems with Iran by converting to Euros.

Chavez' only goal is his own personal power.

Chavez to expel foreign critics - BBC News (http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/6911246.stm)
Chavez seek to end term limits -- BBC News (http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/6932605.stm)

As one who is opposed to centralized bureaucratic power, I think that an end to the IMF and World Bank is in order (to that extent, I believe in the decentralized anti-government market even more than free market advocates do, it seems...).

But I also think that an end to authoritarian despots like Mr. Chavez is also in order. I'm just a crazy leftist like that.
Sominium Effectus
10-08-2007, 04:14
IMF=Impossible Missions Force? :confused:

http://www.moviewavs.com/php/sounds/?id=bst&media=MP3S&type=Movies&movie=Mission_Impossible&quote=theme1.txt&file=theme1.mp3

International Monetary Fund.


Which this thread had little to nothing to do about. Also this thread would have gotten more replies if the title involved Hugo Chavez.


Chavez is rather authoritarian, but his goals are good for Latin America.
Sel Appa
10-08-2007, 04:18
Good for Chavez. I hope he succeeds.
Lunatic Goofballs
10-08-2007, 09:36
International Monetary Fund.


Which this thread had little to nothing to do about. Also this thread would have gotten more replies if the title involved Hugo Chavez.


Chavez is rather authoritarian, but his goals are good for Latin America.

International Monetary Fund. Impossible Missions Force. IMF.

Coincidence??? HAH! :p
Remote Observer
10-08-2007, 14:25
International Monetary Fund. Impossible Missions Force. IMF.

Coincidence??? HAH! :p

I always thought that the F in acronyms meant a specific word.

UFB = Unbelievable
NFW = No Wai!
FNG = New Guy
JAFO = Just Another Observer
TFB = The Bank

So I don't think you have the F word correct Lunatic.
The Brevious
11-08-2007, 09:58
IMF=Impossible Missions Force? :confused:

http://www.moviewavs.com/php/sounds/?id=bst&media=MP3S&type=Movies&movie=Mission_Impossible&quote=theme1.txt&file=theme1.mp3

Winner of the "who's the smartest ..." thread? :p
The Brevious
11-08-2007, 09:59
I always thought that the F in acronyms meant a specific word.
JAFO = Just Another Observer

So I don't think you have the F word correct Lunatic.

Neither do you, apparently.
Isn't it supposed to read

JERO?