NationStates Jolt Archive

Have to thank Oprah for putting up these questions. Notice how the majority of the first 8 questions are about money. Would you add your own questions to this list or do you think it about sums it up.

http://www.cnn.com/2007/LIVING/personal/08/02/o.marriage.questions/index.html

By Susan Piver


(Oprah.com) -- You may think that you and your fiancé have talked about everything...but have you discussed the issues that will make your marriage work? Author Susan Piver reveals the questions you and your partner should answer before you say "I do."

Question 1: What percentage of our income are we prepared to spend to purchase and maintain our home on a monthly or annual basis?

Question 2: Who is responsible for keeping our house and yard cared for and organized? Are we different in our needs for cleanliness and organization?

Question 3: How much money do we earn together? Now? In one year? In five years? Ten? Who is responsible for which portion? Now? In one year? Five? Ten?

Question 4: What is our ultimate financial goal regarding annual income, and when do we anticipate achieving it? By what means and through what efforts?

Question 5: What are our categories of expense (rent, clothing, insurance, travel)? How much do we spend monthly, annually, in each category? How much do we want to be able to spend?

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Question 6: How much time will each of us spend at work, and during what hours? Do we begin work early? Will we prefer to work into the evening?

Question 7: If one of us doesn't want to work, under what circumstances, if any, would that be okay?

Question 8: How ambitious are you? Are we comfortable with the other's level of ambition?

Question 9: Am I comfortable giving and receiving love sexually? In sex, does my partner feel my love for him or her?

Question 10: Are we satisfied with the frequency of our lovemaking? How do we cope when our desire levels are unmatched? A little? A lot? For a night? A week? A month? A year? More?

Question 11: Do we eat meals together? Which ones? Who is responsible for the food shopping? Who prepares the meals? Who cleans up afterward?

Question 12: Is each of us happy with the other's approach to health? Does one have habits or tendencies that concern the other (e.g., smoking, excessive dieting, poor diet)?

Question 13: What place does the other's family play in our family life? How often do we visit or socialize together? If we have out-of-town relatives, will we ask them to visit us for extended periods? How often?

Question 14: If we have children, what kind of relationship do we hope our parents will have with their grandchildren? How much time will they spend together?

Question 15: Will we have children? If so, when? How many? How important is having children to each of us?

Question 16: How will having a child change the way we live now? Will we want to take time off from work, or work a reduced schedule? For how long? Will we need to rethink who is responsible for housekeeping?

Question 17: Are we satisfied with the quality and quantity of friends we currently have? Would we like to be more involved socially? Are we overwhelmed socially and need to cut back on such commitments?

Question 18: What are my partner's needs for cultivating or maintaining friendships outside our relationship? Is it easy for me to support those needs, or do they bother me in any way?

Question 19: Do we share a religion? Do we belong to a church, synagogue, mosque or temple? More than one? If not, would our relationship benefit from such an affiliation?

Question 20: Does one of us have an individual spiritual practice? Is the practice and the time devoted to it acceptable to the other? Does each partner understand and respect the other's choices?

Important question in some cases--what gender are you? Don't want that to be a surprise on the honeymoon.

Important question in some cases--what gender are you? Don't want that to be a surprise on the honeymoon.

That's funny because I was thinking the same thing. Probably something one thinks about this day and age.:)

Most of these seem to be things you figure out in the course of dating someone anyways.

Most of these seem to be things you figure out in the course of dating someone anyways.

Seriously. Frankly if you know your partner so little that you have to sit down and explicitly ask these things...you two have no business getting married.

One of the questions I'll ask is Kids or No Kids. If she says Kids, meh I'll move on.

I never have, and don't intend on, asking my fiance any of this before we tie the knot.

I never have, and don't intend on, asking my fiance any of this before we tie the knot.

Why not? I mean #1 reason for divorce is finance related. I actually broke up with a woman because even though she was fully capable of it, she would not get a job, go to college or do anything that'll make her a valuable member of society, she was a Welfare queen. *shrugs*

Why not? I mean #1 reason for divorce is finance related. I actually broke up with a woman because even though she was fully capable of it, she would not get a job, go to college or do anything that'll make her a valuable member of society, she was a Welfare queen. *shrugs* We've already decided to keep our finances separate and have divided the expenses by who can afford what already.

Question 21: Would you be prepared to testify against me?

Question 21: Would you be prepared to testify against me?

Oh didn't see the edit, nvm.

I never have, and don't intend on, asking my fiance any of this before we tie the knot.

you've never discussed if you want a family and of what size? Or considered how important their family is to them/how often you might be seeing them?

We've already decided to keep our finances separate and have divided the expenses by who can afford what already.

That's all good, but what about the little things in life like...a house? rent if you choose not to own? medical care in the event of emergencies? What of future earning prospects? What if one of you loses your job? Or chooses to stay home to raise hypothetical children?
ya know...little things....

not to mention, that sounds as if you've discussed this question
Question 5: What are our categories of expense (rent, clothing, insurance, travel)? How much do we spend monthly, annually, in each category? How much do we want to be able to spend?

you've never discussed if you want a family and of what size? Or considered how important their family is to them/how often you might be seeing them?We have one son already, and have plans in the works to adopt more in the future. My son spends three days a week with my parents and/or sister, and they're over quite a bit.

Oh didn't see the edit, nvm.

*shifty you eyes*

We have one son already, and have plans in the works to adopt more in the future. My son spends three days a week with my parents and/or sister, and they're over quite a bit.

which means that you have discussed family...which means that you have raised at least one of these questions before you got married. Which means this:
I never have, and don't intend on, asking my fiance any of this before we tie the knot.
untrue

which means that you have discussed family...which means that you have raised at least one of these questions before you got married. Which means this:

untrue :p

Not all of them, anyway.

:p

Not all of them, anyway.

haha...to be honest, when I first looked at this list and similar ones, I thought they were stupid...but really, most of these questions are ones that just come up in natural conversation at some point when you start moving towards marriage

haha...to be honest, when I first looked at this list and similar ones, I thought they were stupid...but really, most of these questions are ones that just come up in natural conversation at some point when you start moving towards marriageTru dat.

* Which actions (smoking, drinking, travel by cartwheels, etc.) should be banned?
* Which pets are allowed? And how many?

Q 1: How much exactly does the trust pay you per annum?

Q 2: And you're the *sole* heir to the estate, right? :p

Those would be some good questions. :)

Why would you need to ask that before getting married? Wouldn't you know all that after living together for a good while?

Why would you need to ask that before getting married? Wouldn't you know all that after living together for a good while?

Not everyone does things that way. :p That's probably the idea.

"Are you sure, doctor? Can I have a second opinion?"

Not everyone does things that way. :p That's probably the idea.

Bit irresponsible, isn't it?
Cause I notice those questions focus very much on the materialistic side, there's no question "Do you snore?", "Will I like your sleepy smell?", "How do you hang up your towels after a shower?", "Which side of the bed will you want to sleep on?", "Will you be grumpy or cheerful in the morning?", "Do you insist on buying brand-name cereals?", "What little things in life are you pedantic about?" and other questions that are at least equally if not more important....

The most important question is will you marry me...EASY!

The most important question is will you marry me...EASY!

If she says "yes", that's usually a bad sign. :p

Bit irresponsible, isn't it?
Cause I notice those questions focus very much on the materialistic side, there's no question "Do you snore?", "Will I like your sleepy smell?", "How do you hang up your towels after a shower?", "Which side of the bed will you want to sleep on?", "Will you be grumpy or cheerful in the morning?", "Do you insist on buying brand-name cereals?", "What little things in life are you pedantic about?" and other questions that are at least equally if not more important....

Agreed! There are a lot of little things to think about if you're going to live with someone "until death do you part". I don't actually live with the potential future Mrs Troll, but I already know of potential issues (she snores, I'm a slob) that would need to be addressed before marriage.

The most important question to ask is "will somebody tie me down before I go and do something stupid?" Hopefully your friends will be there for you.:D

We've already decided to keep our finances separate and have divided the expenses by who can afford what already.

I don't actulay know how that would work? Especilay when kids come into it.

If you don't already know the answers to every single one of those questions, you should not be proposing marriage or accepting a proposal in the first place.

Bit irresponsible, isn't it?
Cause I notice those questions focus very much on the materialistic side, there's no question "Do you snore?", "Will I like your sleepy smell?", "How do you hang up your towels after a shower?", "Which side of the bed will you want to sleep on?", "Will you be grumpy or cheerful in the morning?", "Do you insist on buying brand-name cereals?", "What little things in life are you pedantic about?" and other questions that are at least equally if not more important....
The thing is, you can't really ask somebody questions like that. I mean, you could ask, "Which of your personal habits will get on my nerves?" but neither one of you can really answer that until you've lived together.

Example:

My partner has this thing about people who leave time on the microwave. Like, you take the food out a few seconds early, and don't bother to hit the "clear" button to remove the extra seconds from the panel. It makes him absolutely nuts.

I don't know that I've ever used a microwave WITHOUT doing that.

There is no possible way either one of us would ever have guessed that this would be a subject of discussion between us.

Some things you just have to figure out by actually living with each other.

What my parents taught me, though, is that getting serious with a person means working out something very important: how to fight.

You're going to have fights. I don't care how much you love each other or how perfect you are for one another or how sure you are that they'll never ever anger you. You. Are. Going. To. Fight.

So the important thing is learning how to have "good" fights together. You have to learn how to be upfront and honest about your anger, but in ways that can lead to positive resolution.

This way, when all the random, unpredictable, unforeseeable rough patches crop up, you can deal with each of them as they come and not have to worry about specifically planning ahead for every single tiny problem that might occur within a lifetime.

You're going to have fights. I don't care how much you love each other or how perfect you are for one another or how sure you are that they'll never ever anger you. You. Are. Going. To. Fight.


And the best bit? The. Making. Up!:D

I don't actulay know how that would work? Especilay when kids come into it.

Why should they?

Keeping finances strictly seperate seems sensible to us, too...

Why should they?

Keeping finances strictly seperate seems sensible to us, too...

Sorry what are you asking?

Sorry what are you asking?

"Why should kids come into it".

"Why should kids come into it".

Ohhh I see. I didn't say they should, I said that I can't see how mainianing seperate cash etc, would work, especilay if there are also kids involved.

Ohhh I see. I didn't say they should, I said that I can't see how mainianing seperate cash etc, would work, especilay if there are also kids involved.

Well, with kids I don't know; if that should ever happen I'll have more important bridges to jump off.

But otherwise, exactly the same as if you weren't a couple; bills divided in two and paid accordingly.
If you're rich enough to be able to afford a house it might be a little trickier (and you'll need to make sure that the house is split appropriately when the relationship breaks up - or isn't split, of course, if only one person was paying the mortgage), but it's not rocket science.

It handily avoids the "You can't spend our money on that!" nonsense; so long as the bills are paid it isn't my business what she spends her money on, and vice versa.

It handily avoids the "You can't spend our money on that!" nonsense; so long as the bills are paid it isn't my business what she spends her money on, and vice versa.
My parents have always maintained separate checking accounts. They each have their own credit cards, and they've divided up bills and such so that each of them knows which things they're supposed to pay every month.

They have a joint retirement savings account, and a joint "Uh Oh Fund" that is special savings put aside in case of serious emergency (if none occurs, it merges with the retirement fund in the end). But beyond that, they have their own individual finances.

I think it's a very good system. I'm a bit grossed out by couples where one partner has to ask the other partner for allowance or something.

Well, with kids I don't know; if that should ever happen I'll have more important bridges to jump off.

But otherwise, exactly the same as if you weren't a couple; bills divided in two and paid accordingly.
If you're rich enough to be able to afford a house it might be a little trickier (and you'll need to make sure that the house is split appropriately when the relationship breaks up - or isn't split, of course, if only one person was paying the mortgage), but it's not rocket science.

It handily avoids the "You can't spend our money on that!" nonsense; so long as the bills are paid it isn't my business what she spends her money on, and vice versa.

Okay that seems fine. What about things like telephone bills, would that be split in half, would you each pay only for the numbers you called?

What happens when one partner earns less? Does that mean they get less money to spend on themselves? If the kids need new cloths and only one of you has the spare cash, would you take it turns, would it be case of 'you owe me X for that'

I can only see problems inherent in such a system.

Okay that seems fine. What about things like telephone bills, would that be split in half, would you each pay only for the numbers you called?

My partner and I each have our own phones, which we each pay for.

My parents have a home phone line and an internet line. They've decided to split it such that Dad takes care of paying for phone/internet (that's one of the bills he covers), while Mom covers something else. (I'm not sure exactly which bills each of them takes care of, I just know Dad does phone because he's the one who yelled at me when I ran up the bill.)

What happens when one partner earns less? Does that mean they get less money to spend on themselves?

Yes. Why not?


If the kids need new cloths and only one of you has the spare cash, would you take it turns, would it be case of 'you owe me X for that'

Kids are supported 50-50.


I can only see problems inherent in such a system.
No problem so far.

Okay that seems fine. What about things like telephone bills, would that be split in half, would you each pay only for the numbers you called?

Line-rental halved, numbers divided up yeah.
Other bills that aren't itemised will have to be halved.
Person X pays for Person X's mobile(s) and similar individual bills.

What happens when one partner earns less? Does that mean they get less money to spend on themselves?
Yes.

If the kids need new cloths and only one of you has the spare cash, would you take it turns, would it be case of 'you owe me X for that'
Kids, as I've said, aren't something I've considered because they're something I desperately do not want.

I can only see problems inherent in such a system.
I can only see problems in the opposite system; eg. your partner emptying your bank account and absconding, making you responsible for all sorts of debts, etc.

My partner and I each have our own phones, which we each pay for.

So two phonelines coming into the house?


My parents have a home phone line and an internet line. They've decided to split it such that Dad takes care of paying for phone/internet (that's one of the bills he covers), while Mom covers something else. (I'm not sure exactly which bills each of them takes care of, I just know Dad does phone because he's the one who yelled at me when I ran up the bill.)

Heh Dads huh!



Yes. Why not?

Really? So you don't see how one partner having more money to spend on themselves could create animosity between each other?

Say I earn more than my wife, I go out and buy myself a nice new stereo system while she just can't afford that new handbag she really wanted. I'd have to buy it for her, or top up her cash so she could. I couldn't sit there and watch the woman I love go without, whilst I can afford all the 'things' that I every wanted, to me that does not seem equal.



Kids are supported 50-50.

Though the point in me asking this question was more to do with. What if you couldn't do it 50-50, what if after paying all the bills, one partner just couldn't afford to pay equaly for all of the things the kids need.

Being indebt to a parntner, or being owed by a partner, I just can't see that as being a good basis for a partnership.


No problem so far.[/QUOTE]

*shrug* Differant strokes I guess. Just wouldn't work for me.

Are we related?

So two phonelines coming into the house?

Nah, just cell phones. We don't have a "house" phone line.

We do, however, have internet and cable. We alternate on that, same as rent.


Heh Dads huh!

How was I supposed to know that any number starting with a 900 will cost craptons of money?!


Really? So you don't see how one partner having more money to spend on themselves could create animosity between each other?

Nope. Hasn't been a problem for us.


Say I earn more than my wife, I go out and buy myself a nice new stereo system while she just can't afford that new handbag she really wanted. I'd have to buy it for her, or top up her cash so she could. I couldn't sit there and watch the woman I love go without, whilst I can afford all the 'things' that I every wanted, to me that does not seem equal.


We buy each other stuff all the time, just for fun.

For a while I was making more than him, and I liked to spoil him rotten. I still like taking him to the mall and buying him clothes because it's an excuse to see him undressing a lot.

Now he makes more than me, and he sprang for a Nintendo DS for my birthday even though it's more expensive than the gifts we usually buy for each other. He knew I'd been wanting one but wasn't quite able to justify the cost.

If I make less than him, I have less of my own disposable income. I have to adjust my personal budget accordingly. Same goes for him. But none of that requires that we stop giving each other gifts.


Though the point in me asking this question was more to do with. What if you couldn't do it 50-50, what if after paying all the bills, one partner just couldn't afford to pay equaly for all of the things the kids need.

Then the other would pay for those things. If you're a parent, your responsibility is TO THE KIDS. It's not about what you owe your partner or spouse, it's what you owe the children.

Now, if your spouse is buying themselves a new pair of shoes every week, but then they insist they can't possibly afford to pay for Junior's school supplies, you get to bitch them out for that.


Being indebt to a parntner, or being owed by a partner, I just can't see that as being a good basis for a partnership.

I'd agree with that, sort of.

For us, the key has been to make sure that nobody feels like they're being taken advantage of. If he paid for the last three times we went out to eat, I make a special point to pick up the tab this time. I want him to know I'm not taking it for granted that he'll always pay. I'm not taking advantage of his generosity and kindness, and I'm willing to give as much as I get.

It's been an easy "problem" to address so far, simply because we both like to spend money on each other. So things even out.

For us, the key has been to make sure that nobody feels like they're being taken advantage of.

It's been an easy "problem" to address so far, simply because we both like to spend money on each other. So things even out.


Yeah I agree, it is a very good point. Heh nice words, good smile, and general nekkidness, I find all helps

I think Bottle's covered this at least as well as I could.

It's been an easy "problem" to address so far, simply because we both like to spend money on each other. So things even out.

Hehe, we have long-running arguments; "but you paid last time, it's my turn!", "But you bought x instead!", "But you paid for the train fare to get here!", "We agreed that train fares don't count!".

Sometimes it just comes down to who gets their card in the machine first ;)

Hehe, we have long-running arguments; "but you paid last time, it's my turn!", "But you bought x instead!", "But you paid for the train fare to get here!", "We agreed that train fares don't count!".

Sometimes it just comes down to who gets their card in the machine first ;)
Yeah, it's like misdirection warfare at this point.

His latest trick is to ask me to do something for him to distract me and keep me from noticing that he paid the bill.

Like the last time we ordered delivery, he asked me to go make drinks for us because he saw the delivery guy coming.

I was all smug about how HAH! I was doing something for HIM! SO THERE!

But then I came out of the kitchen and the food was there, and I knew I'd been had.

I'm currently working on an elaborate system of booby traps to ensnare him and prevent this from happening again.

Important question in some cases--what gender are you? Don't want that to be a surprise on the honeymoon.

If you got a surprise would that really be an issue?

If you got a surprise would that really be an issue?

I'd like to say yes because it's an issue of honesty and trust, which would be lacking if I hadn't been told in the first place and that, if I loved him/her then it really shouldn't matter and I should therefore have been told before.

Yet the truth is that I'd be freaked.

So yes, it would matter.

*snip*

Hehehe, brilliant! I'll have to remember that ;)

My failing is cash. I never pay with cash, and I rarely have more than a few pence in cash in my wallet. So if somewhere should demand cash rather than proper money I'm stuffed and she winds up paying (same with restaurant tips - although I gather tipping is a much bigger deal there than here, so it's rarely even £5). Fortunately cash transactions and tips tend to be trivial relative to the next major transaction, and it's a good point for the argument ;)

Hehehe, brilliant! I'll have to remember that ;)

My failing is cash. I never pay with cash, and I rarely have more than a few pence in cash in my wallet. So if somewhere should demand cash rather than proper money I'm stuffed and she winds up paying (same with restaurant tips - although I gather tipping is a much bigger deal there than here, so it's rarely even £5). Fortunately cash transactions and tips tend to be trivial relative to the next major transaction, and it's a good point for the argument ;)

I am almost constantly amazzed at the differances in people. I on the other hand work exclusivly in cash. If I aint got the cash, it means I can't have it.

The real solution is to not get married. "Love" is chemicals in your brain and after a while with any person the brain stops making said chemicals.

Then you get divorced, and somehow blame yourself or the other person.

I am almost constantly amazzed at the differances in people. I on the other hand work exclusivly in cash. If I aint got the cash, it means I can't have it.

I'm so used to paying with everything with my debit card (apart from food I buy almost everything from internet sites) that cash seems unusual... It doesn't seem to feel like spending "real" money, because it's already came out of my bank account so the numbers have already got smaller - it's already been spent, kind of, so I'm less likely to be careful with it and therefore having much of it around is unwise.

Seriously. Frankly if you know your partner so little that you have to sit down and explicitly ask these things...you two have no business getting married.

Agreed.

The main stumbling block IMHO is:

What does marriage mean to you, and do you REALLY want to be married?

The other questions Oprah asked are answered long before the proposal.

The real solution is to not get married. "Love" is chemicals in your brain and after a while with any person the brain stops making said chemicals.

Then you get divorced, and somehow blame yourself or the other person.

Heh not all of us. I have just celebrated my 17th year of married life.

And a few days afterwards my family was at a BBQ, my wife was haveing a sit down to chat with the other girls, us chaps were kicking a ball about, I passed my wife on the way to fetch beer, and noticed her eyes sparkling in the sun.

I had to stop, take a double look, step over to her, kiss her and tell her how beutiful she looked right then, and how seeing her now, reminded me of the first time I laid eyes on her, and what piercing eyes, and stunningly drop dead gorgouse face she had.

Well she called me silly, I said I love her more now than I did back then, she asked why and I told her because that's what love does dosen't it grow stronger?

Then I noticed my 17 year old neice giving us a soppy look, got a bit red, broke the conection, grabbed beer and went back to the footie!


So you see far from these chemicals disapating, the opposite can and does happen.

I think we only had about three of those answered when I got married.
I didn't want children. Ever.
I was defiantly undomestic.
And if I went into a church, there'd better be somebody laying in a coffin.

This reminds me of the new Robin Williams film, "License to Wed". Those who have been married laughed their a-- off and those that hadn't didn't understand it at all.

The biggest questions before you wed are:

#1. Have you dated for at least a year and gone without sex for at least six months of that time?

#2. Have you ever seen the other person under extreme stress?

#3. Under what religion will you raise the children?

#4. Is this person without a doubt your best friend that you can talk to about anything without any reservations?


Under #1, It takes a while to really know someone, before the shades are pulled back. Sex covers a lot of ills. If you can't live for six months without sex you are not mature enough for marriage. Going without allows the couple to face other problems and solve them before marriage.

Under #2, The real personality of a person comes out in stressful conditions. If you want to know what a person is really like, wait until you see them stressed. If nothing else, go through one Christmas before marriage.

Under #3, A person can openly profess to not care about religion until the children come along. Children change everything. This is also why a couple should not have children for at least a year (3 is better) after they marry. They need to be a real unit before all of the problems that come with children. If you are having problems before children, you will have more after children.

Under #4, This without a doubt is the most important thing a couple can ask before marriage. If there is one thing that you cannot tell your mate and know without a doubt that the mate will be compassionate, Don't Get Married! I will guarantee you that 5-10-15 year goal will vanish as they years go by. The day to day living will take over. The job loss, illness, children, living conditions, location, parents, family deaths,....... The list could go on forever. Everyone marries with stars in the eyes and a smooth future ahead. That lasts until the first bump in the road. Only the love of your best friend will be the anchor that keeps you from drifting onto the rocks.

You're going to have fights. I don't care how much you love each other or how perfect you are for one another or how sure you are that they'll never ever anger you. You. Are. Going. To. Fight.


Never fight when you're mad.

This used to drive my wife nuts when we were first married. She would get mad and want to fight. I'd tell her we would discuss it when we weren't mad. An hour or so later the problem didn't seem so big and the solution was easy.

I don't actulay know how that would work? Especilay when kids come into it. We've either got the expenses split (50/50 or 40/60, depending), or we just pay them as they come along ourselves. I'm responsible for my son (he's not biologically my fiances), and I've always found ways to buy him anything he needs, even during my worst financial state. I'm obligated to.

Never fight when you're mad.

This used to drive my wife nuts when we were first married. She would get mad and want to fight. I'd tell he we would discuss it when we weren't mad. An hour or so later the problem didn't seem so big and the solution was easy.

I find that most people have a need to vent, in addition to having an actual discussion of the problem.

If they don't vent, there isn't any emotional satisfaction.

So I encourage venting, and just understand that it's not the end of the world when I hear it. It's just another emotional need.

Oh, and that applies to both men and women.

We've either got the expenses split (50/50 or 40/60, depending), or we just pay them as they come along ourselves. I'm responsible for my son (he's not biologically my fiances), and I've always found ways to buy him anything he needs, even during my worst financial state. I'm obligated to.We had a great arrangement. My money was mine. His money was ours. Now that we're divorced I really miss my half of his money.

My parents have always maintained separate checking accounts. They each have their own credit cards, and they've divided up bills and such so that each of them knows which things they're supposed to pay every month.

They have a joint retirement savings account, and a joint "Uh Oh Fund" that is special savings put aside in case of serious emergency (if none occurs, it merges with the retirement fund in the end). But beyond that, they have their own individual finances.

I think it's a very good system. I'm a bit grossed out by couples where one partner has to ask the other partner for allowance or something.

What my BF and I are going to do is set up a joint account for rent, bills, expenses, etc. We've yet to figure out how much exactly each of us will have to put in each month, we're just in the process of moving in together. But I think it's a good system. I won't have to worry about his spending habits or my own that way.

I find that most people have a need to vent, in addition to having an actual discussion of the problem.

If they don't vent, there isn't any emotional satisfaction.

So I encourage venting, and just understand that it's not the end of the world when I hear it. It's just another emotional need.

Oh, and that applies to both men and women.

Vent is one thing, anger is something else. Few would rant and rave at their best friend outside of marriage. The friend would never be seen again. Why would you do that to your real best friend?

If you need to cuss and scream, go find a secluded place and go to it. (great part about living on a farm, cows don't care or call the police about a noisy neighbor) Take a walk, pound a pillow, scrub the pots and pans, lots of ways.

When the heat of the moment passes the problem won't be nearly as big.

What are your feelings on bestiality? Just saying, if you're not on the same page on that question, your marriage could be in for a bumpy ride.

Why would you want to keep your finances separate? If you are that worried about maintaining financial independence, you probably shouldn’t get married at all. Cohabitation is a perfectly valid way to live.

I can only see problems with having totally separate finances – who covers what bills is absurd. You pool your assets when you get married – splitting bills and everything is no different than living with a roommate. If your partner has a problem with spending all the money on frivolous crap, then talk to your partner about it. If you split all bills 50/50 and what is left over from your individual incomes is yours to spend, what happens when there is income disparity? One partner can drive up the bills because they want to live comfortably and can afford it, but that pushes the other into effective poverty – then you are back to having one person struggling to meet their bills while begging the other for change to buy a cup of coffee (hyperbole I know, but it illustrates the point).

Why are you so focused on being financially independent and not paying more than your half of the bills? If you are panicked about your partner spending ‘your’ money, you really shouldn’t get married – just be roommates that sleep together.

Why would you want to keep your finances separate? If you are that worried about maintaining financial independence, you probably shouldn’t get married at all. Cohabitation is a perfectly valid way to live.

I can only see problems with having totally separate finances – who covers what bills is absurd. You pool your assets when you get married – splitting bills and everything is no different than living with a roommate. If your partner has a problem with spending all the money on frivolous crap, then talk to your partner about it. If you split all bills 50/50 and what is left over from your individual incomes is yours to spend, what happens when there is income disparity? One partner can drive up the bills because they want to live comfortably and can afford it, but that pushes the other into effective poverty – then you are back to having one person struggling to meet their bills while begging the other for change to buy a cup of coffee (hyperbole I know, but it illustrates the point).

Why are you so focused on being financially independent and not paying more than your half of the bills? If you are panicked about your partner spending ‘your’ money, you really shouldn’t get married – just be roommates that sleep together.
I'm sure that if there was a large income disparity, it would be fairly easy to work it out that bills and the like were a % of income rather than split evenly (especially if a situation arises where one partner basically leaves their chosen profession or job to live with the other [this situation is the case with some profs at my school, one spouse was going to make a lot more money at one school than the other would make at another school, so they moved to maximize their income and the other spouse is in another profession]).

Having separate finances is a good idea in some ways at least... my parents share the same bank account and credit cards and until recently my mom didn't work so when she'd buy my dad a present, she'd be buying him a present with his own money essentially, which was kinda silly.

Right now, my fiancee and I are prepping for our marriage in June, and apart from the premarital counselling we're arranging to do, we're also going through the book 1001 Questions to Ask Before You Get Married (http://www.amazon.com/1001-Questions-Ask-Before-Married/dp/0071438033). I HIGHLY recommend it; it covers pretty much everything, from family backgrounds to finances to children to expectations. It's much better than most of the questions we've found out there like "If you were a colour, which colour would you be? DURRRRRRRR". The book goes much deeper than that.

Why would you want to keep your finances separate? If you are that worried about maintaining financial independence, you probably shouldn’t get married at all. Cohabitation is a perfectly valid way to live.

I can only see problems with having totally separate finances – who covers what bills is absurd. You pool your assets when you get married – splitting bills and everything is no different than living with a roommate. If your partner has a problem with spending all the money on frivolous crap, then talk to your partner about it. If you split all bills 50/50 and what is left over from your individual incomes is yours to spend, what happens when there is income disparity? One partner can drive up the bills because they want to live comfortably and can afford it, but that pushes the other into effective poverty – then you are back to having one person struggling to meet their bills while begging the other for change to buy a cup of coffee (hyperbole I know, but it illustrates the point).

Why are you so focused on being financially independent and not paying more than your half of the bills? If you are panicked about your partner spending ‘your’ money, you really shouldn’t get married – just be roommates that sleep together. In that case, the one who drives up the bill pays their share, plus the whole portion they put on. That's how it works with me and my fiance. This way no extra burden is put on one another.

The real solution is to not get married. "Love" is chemicals in your brain and after a while with any person the brain stops making said chemicals.

Then you get divorced, and somehow blame yourself or the other person.
Woohoo, it's time for Dr. Neuroscience!

Myth: "Love" is chemicals in your brain and after a while with any person the brain stops making said chemicals.

Fact: Like all human emotions, love does indeed involve the activity of neurotransmitters in the brain. A neurotransmitter is a chemical that relays signals between neurons (or between neurons and other cells).

However, a healthy brain will never "stop making" the chemicals that are most strongly associated with love. As far as we know, there's no magical neurotransmitter that creates love. Instead, there are several neurotransmitters that appear to be key participants, as well as a bunch of hormones!

Lust, which is often an early stage for a relationship, is closely tied to the sex hormones, testosterone and estrogen. But your body still will have testosterone and estrogen when you're not feeling lust, and those hormones serve many purposes beyond lust.

During the initial period of attraction or infatuation, a group of neurotransmitters call monoamines become very important. But the monoamines have a lot of other functions in the brain, too!
-Dopamine is strongly associated with pleasure and reward. It is important for things like hunger/satiety, and is critical for voluntary movements and motivation.
-Norepinephrine, which is otherwise known as adrenalin, is what makes your heart beat faster when your crush comes into view. However, it's also important for regulation of your sleep and wakefulness.
-Serotonin is one of love's most important chemicals, as well as being important in everything from memory to temperature regulation.

The spike in activity of some neurotransmitters during the infatuation phase will eventually drop off, but don't lose hope just yet!

After prolonged periods (something on the order of a year or two) the initial cocktail of attraction chemicals gives way to a period of long-term attachment. This long-term bonding is marked by particular activity of hormones like oxytosin and vasopressin.

If there was ever any doubt that love is a complex emotion, then hopefully the neuroscience of love will help put that doubt to rest once and for all!

Why would you want to keep your finances separate? If you are that worried about maintaining financial independence, you probably shouldn’t get married at all. Cohabitation is a perfectly valid way to live.

Well, quite ;)

But many people (foolishly, in my cynical, untrusting opinion) pool their finances when they just move in together.

Why would you want to keep your finances separate? If you are that worried about maintaining financial independence, you probably shouldn’t get married at all. Cohabitation is a perfectly valid way to live.

Heh, I view it the opposite way.

If you think marriage is about completely and totally merging all aspects of your lives and becoming a single unified entity, then you're way way WAY too naive to make a marriage work!


I can only see problems with having totally separate finances – who covers what bills is absurd.

Why?


You pool your assets when you get married – splitting bills and everything is no different than living with a roommate.

Erm, I don't know how you and your roommates do things, but my relationship with my partner is pretty different from any other roommate relationship I've had.


If your partner has a problem with spending all the money on frivolous crap, then talk to your partner about it.

If you can talk to your partner about that, why can't you simply talk to your partner about who pays which bills?


If you split all bills 50/50 and what is left over from your individual incomes is yours to spend, what happens when there is income disparity?

This has been covered already.


One partner can drive up the bills because they want to live comfortably and can afford it, but that pushes the other into effective poverty – then you are back to having one person struggling to meet their bills while begging the other for change to buy a cup of coffee (hyperbole I know, but it illustrates the point).

Only if one (or both) person is an asshole to begin with. If this is how you would treat your partner, and the only thing stopping you is your merged finances, then you're an asshole who doesn't deserve to be married at all.

Alternatively, if the only way you can keep your partner from being a cheap, inconsiderate jackass is by making sure you know all their PIN numbers, then you need to DTMFA.


Why are you so focused on being financially independent and not paying more than your half of the bills?

Financial independence is important for any adult in this world. Getting married won't change that. And when it comes to paying your share, it's important so that both people in the marriage feel like they are being treated fairly and not taken advantage of.


If you are panicked about your partner spending ‘your’ money, you really shouldn’t get married – just be roommates that sleep together.
I'm not "panicked" about it, I simply don't see any reason why my partner would need my money. He has his own. How he spends his money is his business.

In that case, the one who drives up the bill pays their share, plus the whole portion they put on. That's how it works with me and my fiance. This way no extra burden is put on one another.

Not everything can be measured in terms of money, especially labor in a family.

Let's say you and your wife decide to have a child. And, like some parents, she decides to stay home with the child for the first few years.

She's at home, taking care of the child, and not working a paying job.

Are you going to say she's a deadbeat, and worthless, and not pulling her weight?

At our house, all the money that is made is pooled, and we all agree on how the money is going to be spent. If I want to buy something, even if we have plenty of money, I discuss it with my wife first, even if it's lunch. Same thing the other way around. We don't sit there nickel and dime style - the purpose of the expenditure gets far more weight and discussion than the actual amount (unless it's a ludicrous amount).

It's rather socialist when I think about it - we have communal sharing of all property, and communal decisions on what to do with the property.

If you're going to nickel and dime each other over who spent what in relation to who earned how much, you're going down the wrong road.

Never fight when you're mad.

This used to drive my wife nuts when we were first married. She would get mad and want to fight. I'd tell her we would discuss it when we weren't mad. An hour or so later the problem didn't seem so big and the solution was easy.
I don't know about that.

I think it's very important to feel that you can vocalize anger. It's annoying as hell when a person acts as though your feelings of anger automatically mean you're wrong...in reality, if you're angry then there's probably a reason WHY!

But you also should recognize when you need a time out. If you're too pissed to talk reasonably, taking a break is a good plan.

My parents have a little sign that has hung in our bathroom for as long as I can remember:

"Never go to bed angry. Stay up and fight."

:P

I don't know about that.

I think it's very important to feel that you can vocalize anger. It's annoying as hell when a person acts as though your feelings of anger automatically mean you're wrong...in reality, if you're angry then there's probably a reason WHY!


If some people don't get to vent regularly, they build up pressure.

When they blow, you can get "kitchen sink" arguments, and other bad things.

If they manage to keep it contained, they get major stress problems.

Venting is good.

Not everything can be measured in terms of money, especially labor in a family.

Let's say you and your wife decide to have a child. And, like some parents, she decides to stay home with the child for the first few years.

She's at home, taking care of the child, and not working a paying job.

Are you going to say she's a deadbeat, and worthless, and not pulling her weight?

Only if you're a fucktard. If you've got half a brain, you'd be able to realize how much money it would cost to pay somebody else to do all the work your wife is doing, so you'd be completely aware of the material (not to mention emotional!) value of the work she's doing.

Everybody is acting like it's so hard to keep track of these things, and to keep a general sense of how much each person is putting in to the relationship. Whether we're talking financially or emotionally, I've never found it to be remotely difficult to do this, nor does my partner seem to have any trouble. It doesn't require much effort, just a little practice so that you are used to being aware of things.


At our house, all the money that is made is pooled, and we all agree on how the money is going to be spent. If I want to buy something, even if we have plenty of money, I discuss it with my wife first, even if it's lunch.

See, and that would annoy the fuck out of me. I'm a grown up. I'm not going to ask permission to buy myself a funnybook.

Okay, bad example.

I'm a grown up, and I'm not going to ask permission to buy myself a new set of work clothes.

My folks discuss major purchases (example: my dad's brand new TV, my mom's sort-new car) because pretty much every new big purchase is actually going to end up being used by the whole family. "Mom's car" is actually driven by Dad on weekend shopping trips, and will soon be driven by Younger Brother (shudder). "Dad's TV" is actually in the family room, and the only other TV in the house was a wedding present for my parents in 1976.

That seems perfectly reasonable to me. I discuss furniture purchases of my own with my partner, because my new desk is going to take up space in OUR room. He discussed his new computer purchase with me because he was going to have to put it on his credit card unless I covered rent for an extra month, and he wanted to avoid the interest charges and then just pay me back later. Grown ups can talk about such things without any massive explosions!


Same thing the other way around. We don't sit there nickel and dime style - the purpose of the expenditure gets far more weight and discussion than the actual amount (unless it's a ludicrous amount).

It's rather socialist when I think about it - we have communal sharing of all property, and communal decisions on what to do with the property.

If you're going to nickel and dime each other over who spent what in relation to who earned how much, you're going down the wrong road.
It's not about nickels and dimes. It's about how each person feels about the give-and-take.

You both want to feel like you're contributing, and you both want to feel that the other person is pulling their weight and not taking advantage of you.

Money, particularly when neither of you has a whole lot of it, is one major part of this. Money is a source of worry and tension for most people I know, because money is how you obtain both necessities AND toys, and most of us aren't exactly rolling in loot.

If some people don't get to vent regularly, they build up pressure.

When they blow, you can get "kitchen sink" arguments, and other bad things.

If they manage to keep it contained, they get major stress problems.

Venting is good.
Exactly.

Sometimes it just feels better to get to be angry and get it out.

Of course, this also involves a measure of what my folks taught me about "good fighting." You have to be able to be very angry yet still not completely lose control. For instance, my dad taught me that no matter how angry you get, you NEVER call your partner cuss names. If you start doing it, you sometimes can't seem to stop, so it's better to just hold yourself to the rule that you won't ever start.

My husband and I have found that it is easiest for us to have merged finances, because we transfer between accounts so much anyways. We're in the process of getting pretty much everything moved over to a single account because it will make the whole budgeting/paying bills/etc. process infinitely easier. It may not be the best solution for everyone, but I think it is for us.

Not everything can be measured in terms of money, especially labor in a family.

Let's say you and your wife decide to have a child. And, like some parents, she decides to stay home with the child for the first few years.

She's at home, taking care of the child, and not working a paying job.

Are you going to say she's a deadbeat, and worthless, and not pulling her weight. I'm gay, so...

We've brought this up, since we definitely want to adopt more children in the future (I have a son from a previous relationship already), and the possibility of one of us staying home with the children has crossed our minds, and ultimately we're probably going to wait until we're both firmly in careers (we're both undergraduates in college right now...), so one of us could carry the financial burden better.

Then again, daycare has worked good for us also, which will allow for us both to work.

Why are you so focused on being financially independent and not paying more than your half of the bills? If you are panicked about your partner spending ‘your’ money, you really shouldn’t get married – just be roommates that sleep together.

This is especially true when you think about what legal marriage does in the first place. If you get married, your money is just as much legally your spouse's as it is yours and vice versa. If you are worried about your partner running up a bunch of debt or something, keeping your finances separate isn't going to do anything about your legal responsibility to pay for those debts.

In truth, I think it's much easier for a couple to mitigate those issues if most of their finances are *not* separate. Then, it's much easier to see how much they are spending, and what they are spending it on.

Exactly.

Sometimes it just feels better to get to be angry and get it out.


If I'm arguing with my wife, and she's venting, and I'm venting, there's the understanding that we're venting, and it's not the end of the world. Cussing is out, but venting is in.

See, and that would annoy the fuck out of me. I'm a grown up. I'm not going to ask permission to buy myself a funnybook.

It's not asking permission.

The idea is that any money WE make is OUR money not MY money or HER money.

The house is OUR house. The kids are OUR kids. Not HER kid or MY kid. Not MY house or HER house, regardless of what appears on the paperwork.

Like I said, it's very socialist. I happen to think that socialism is very effective in small groups, and idiotic on a large scale.

Right now, my fiancee and I are prepping for our marriage in June, and apart from the premarital counselling we're arranging to do, we're also going through the book 1001 Questions to Ask Before You Get Married (http://www.amazon.com/1001-Questions-Ask-Before-Married/dp/0071438033). who suggested the book?
he or she?
My bet is she

I'm gay, so...

We've brought this up, since we definitely want to adopt more children in the future (I have a son from a previous relationship already), and the possibility of one of us staying home with the children has crossed our minds, and ultimately we're probably going to wait until we're both firmly in careers (we're both undergraduates in college right now...), so one of us could carry the financial burden better.

Then again, daycare has worked good for us also, which will allow for us both to work.

The idea here is that you both discuss it, and agree.

There are always problems that come up for a couple (gay or not), and their ability to discuss and resolve these things on the fly are more important than trying to anticipate every problem in advance and resolve them in advance.

We had a great arrangement. My money was mine. His money was ours. Now that we're divorced I really miss my half of his money.great arrangement indeed ;)
I recommend it to all NSG females :D

It's not asking permission.

The idea is that any money WE make is OUR money not MY money or HER money.

The house is OUR house. The kids are OUR kids. Not HER kid or MY kid. Not MY house or HER house, regardless of what appears on the paperwork.

Like I said, it's very socialist. I happen to think that socialism is very effective in small groups, and idiotic on a large scale.

With my wife and I we always consult each other on big purchases. My wife will call me up and want to buy a piece of furniture or some other large item and will ask me "Do we have extra money for this?". I do the same with her. Reason is that we view our financial relationship as well as our own as a combined effort. I always find it suspicious of people that keep separate finances while married. I think there is to much damage one spouse can do to the other financially to have them separate.

It's not asking permission.

The idea is that any money WE make is OUR money not MY money or HER money.

The house is OUR house. The kids are OUR kids. Not HER kid or MY kid. Not MY house or HER house, regardless of what appears on the paperwork.

Like I said, it's very socialist. I happen to think that socialism is very effective in small groups, and idiotic on a large scale.

I agree but know some that don't do it that way and get along.

When we were married 25 years ago, I was an Executive Vice President and she had just graduated from university with no job. One of the first things I did was hand her the check book and say "I've never overdrawn, that's the only rule."

Of course we had dated 1 1/2 years then were engaged for 1 1/2 years so I completely understood how we both felt about money. There is no "asking permission". We both know how much the income is and how much the basic bills are and about how much is left for disposable income. At the end of the month there is always more in the account than either has spent. It's really true communism. "From each according to ability, to each according to need." As of right now my wife makes a lot more than me. That's ok. All of the money goes into the same well and is dipped out of the same well.

Personally, I wouldn't have married someone that I didn't trust with my money. I wouldn't have married someone I didn't trust with my life should that come about. Money is such a minor thing it's never brought up until we need a major purchase, then we agree that it's time to buy a car or whatever. We never even need to talk about how much to spend on one of those major needs. We both know what we can afford.

It's not asking permission.

The idea is that any money WE make is OUR money not MY money or HER money.

Sounds like your system is the same as ours.

Any money WE make together is OUR money.

However, seeing as how WE don't do the same job or earn the same money, WE don't make OUR money very often.


The house is OUR house. The kids are OUR kids. Not HER kid or MY kid. Not MY house or HER house, regardless of what appears on the paperwork.

1) Paperwork is not something you should be so quick to dismiss. While things are rosy the paperwork may not matter. But it's when things are not-so-rosy that the paperwork suddenly matters a lot...

2) If YOU both bought a home TOGETHER, then you share the home. If you made/adopted/raise children together, then you are both joint parents. These are completely different than the subject of money that one of you earns independent of the other.

Think about it this way: I'm earning a PhD right now. I have been with my partner for the entire time I've been earning it. He's been a central part of my life. But when I get my PhD, it's MINE, not OURS. I earned it.

My income is a reflection of my efforts and my work. I earned it. It's not OURS, it's mine. I can (and do!) choose to share what I have earned, and use my earnings to better the life that I share with my partner. But that doesn't magically make MY money become OUR money.

Now, if (for instance) we decided to have a kid, and he decided to stay home with the kid, then he would be choosing to take on a job that WE would otherwise have to pay somebody else to do. He is, in effect, providing a service that I am benefiting from. Instead of making a straight-forward money contribution to the family, he is making a contribution of time and work. If this is the system we agree upon, then a portion of my earnings should go to HIM, because he is providing a service! I'd pay a day care worker if they were the ones caring for my child, so it's only reasonable that my partner gets to ask to share my income if I'm the sole breadwinner in the family.


Like I said, it's very socialist. I happen to think that socialism is very effective in small groups, and idiotic on a large scale.
I think it's unnecessary in small groups and inhibitory on a large scale.

It's not asking permission.

The idea is that any money WE make is OUR money not MY money or HER money.

Some people either don't like or simply don't get this arrangement. I make money. My husband makes money (more than me currently, until I get done with my degree). Regardless of who made it, we both see it as our money. We both pull out of both sources of income for our needs (and our wants). And, for us, this arrangement works. And it will be infinitely easier with merged finances than it is when we have to shift money between accounts and/or shuffle bills around to achieve it.

I think it's unnecessary in small groups and inhibitory on a large scale.

And who are you to determine what is necessary, or even good, for groups that you are not a part of?

And who are you to determine what is necessary, or even good, for groups that you are not a part of?

a person who is capable of forming an opinion?

Hmmm, we have no formal system. We pool our money when we need to, for major expenses, in no particular fashion, and we trust one another not to spend the rest of our money on anything ridiculous. I don't care what he spends his money on, and I don't ask permission to spend my money. Sometimes he contributes more to the general pool, sometimes I do. I don't keep track, and don't ever intend to.

a person who is capable of forming an opinion?

A person's opinion on how I should live my life when they know very little about me amounts to absolutely squat. She may as well be giving me her opinion on whether or not I should like purple.

If some people don't get to vent regularly, they build up pressure.

When they blow, you can get "kitchen sink" arguments, and other bad things.

If they manage to keep it contained, they get major stress problems.

Venting is good.
Ugh, tell me about it. I'm a bottler. It's a terrible habit. I let things go, until the stupidest thing sets me off, and it all comes pouring out, absolutely incoherently.

I've gotten a lot better at not letting it get to that stage, but it's something I need to keep on top of. In ALL relationships. But I can't actually talk anything out until I figure out why I'm pissed off in the first place, which means I actually have to have a spare moment to think about it.

Having a beer and bitching at one another is kind of fun.

A person's opinion on how I should live my life when they know very little about me amounts to absolutely squat. She may as well be giving me her opinion on whether or not I should like purple.
Ooooooh! Look at the fur fly!

I thought I was the only one who gets annoyed with Bottle.

Ha, although as you well know...I get annoyed with you too, and I'm sure the reverse is true on both counts :P

A person's opinion on how I should live my life when they know very little about me amounts to absolutely squat. She may as well be giving me her opinion on whether or not I should like purple.

sure, but then again, who said anyone's opinion has to be worth something?

Alright there seems to be a lot of discussion about this topic..When Really it doesn't require that..Sure you might not understand other people's system's..but if It works for them. Be glad for that marvel at it if you will..Sometimes it isn't even about the money at all..It's about the sense of effort the sense of..I did this and bought this..I'm able to give him or her this from my own money...Gifts are a great thing to give but when you pool money is it really a gift? At the very least it isn't a surprise. There are so many different sides and systems to handling money..Some people find it works out better to pool to share into each other lives that way...While other people are more head strong, no offense intended. That they need that sense of being there own person..Wether they are serious involved or not...AS just because you get married doesn't mean you are One being regardless of what the laws say otherwise... Still underlining point to this, If you are in a Relationship figure out what will work for you both.

Gifts are a great thing to give but when you pool money is it really a gift?

Of course it is.

At the very least it isn't a surprise.

Pooling money doesn't mean that you are constantly looking over each others' shoulders or, as some people have put it, asking permission. It simply means that, instead of keeping track of "his money" and "my money", we simply have "our money."

And who are you to determine what is necessary, or even good, for groups that you are not a part of?
Like all other normal-functioning adult humans, I am capable of forming and holding opinions.

A person's opinion on how I should live my life when they know very little about me amounts to absolutely squat. She may as well be giving me her opinion on whether or not I should like purple.
Um...welcome to NationStates General?

We share opinions here.

I've given my opinion on things like whether or not it's reasonable to hate gays, so why shouldn't I also share an opinion on whether or not it's reasonable to pool assets in a marriage? They're all just topics that I'm sharing opinions on.

I don't know why you think this topic is so very very special. Countless other topics have included countless other people who have strong opinions on how you should live, who you should fuck, when/if/whom you should wed, and so on and so forth. They're just opinions on a 'net forum. They don't hurt you.

In this thread I've had people giving me opinions on how I should run my relationship. As a matter of fact, that's precisely what I was responding to when you popped in. If you aren't interested in participating in a discussion where folks share such opinions, why stay in this thread once you could see that's what it's about?

Ooooooh! Look at the fur fly!

I'm a bit confused as to why you insult a person that you then profess to agree with.


I thought I was the only one who gets annoyed with Bottle.

Then you either haven't been here long or don't read many threads, because I'd say the people who are annoyed with me outweigh the people who aren't by at least 3 to 1. :D

After a while it stops mattering what people think of you. I come here to get other people's opinions of me and my beliefs, and I come in knowing that both my personality and my beliefs are going to annoy the snot out of some people.

A person's opinion on how I should live my life when they know very little about me amounts to absolutely squat. She may as well be giving me her opinion on whether or not I should like purple.

Umm I don't think Bottle was actualy trying to tell you how to live your life, just expresing a general opinion.

Umm I don't think Bottle was actualy trying to tell you how to live your life, just expresing a general opinion.
Oh, yeah, I guess I need to clarify that:

On this thread, I am sharing my personal opinions about relationships and marriage.

I am not remotely interested in personally monitoring or directing the individual relationships of every person in this thread (or anybody else, for that matter). If your marriage is based on a strong foundation of dunking each other in chowder every night after dinner, then that's your freaking business. I may offer up my opinion (pudding instead!), but I'm not going to be busting down your door and dragging you out of that chowder tub by your hair.

Seriously. Frankly if you know your partner so little that you have to sit down and explicitly ask these things...you two have no business getting married.I don't know, I think it's incredibly easy to think you know the answers but don't really know them.

I don't know, I think it's incredibly easy to think you know the answers but don't really know them.
I think a lot of people haven't really thought about those answers themselves.

I have friends who got married right out of college. Now, when I was 21, I know I hadn't really given serious thought to what percentage of my income was going to be spent to purchase and maintain my future home on a monthly or annual basis.

She didn't cover spending money all that well. My wife and I decided that we needed a pot of "our" money and little pots of "my" money and "her" money.

Some people either don't like or simply don't get this arrangement. I make money. My husband makes money (more than me currently, until I get done with my degree). Regardless of who made it, we both see it as our money. We both pull out of both sources of income for our needs (and our wants). And, for us, this arrangement works. And it will be infinitely easier with merged finances than it is when we have to shift money between accounts and/or shuffle bills around to achieve it.

I agree that some people may not like it.

It's the problem with money in general. It ends up being used as a way to value individuals and their contribution (which I think is stupid - there are many ways to be valuable without involving money at all).

Money has a way of getting to be the most important thing in some relationships, and it has a way of getting in between people. If people find a way to prevent this from happening in their relationship, in a way that differs from "we'll pool our money and be little socialists" then good for them.

who suggested the book?
he or she?
My bet is she

To be honest, we were both going through all the premarital questions we could find on the internet, out of a choice by both of us. However, after about the third site's worth of questions, we found that the rest of them were of the the highly irrelevant/shallow variety (ie. what's your spouse's favourite colour).

Now, of course we both understand the benefits of knowing each other's favourite colour (helps in picking out gifts and the such); however, we're concerned with growing deeper with each other, and you can't really do that when questions consist of "What's your favourite movie?" or "What's your partner's middle name?" I mean, come on. If two people who are planning to get married don't even know their respective partner's middle name, something is amiss. I should think it's implied that people should already know the answers to such surface-level questions before they even THINK of getting married.

So, what we decided is that we would both look for sources of meaningful questions. We both found books that fit the bill, however after skimming through them we decided to go with this one. Seriously, it's a great book!

Q 1: How much exactly does the trust pay you per annum?

Q 2: And you're the *sole* heir to the estate, right? :p

Those would be some good questions. :)

Hah! Why do I always love your posts?:)

I've given my opinion on things like whether or not it's reasonable to hate gays, so why shouldn't I also share an opinion on whether or not it's reasonable to pool assets in a marriage? They're all just topics that I'm sharing opinions on.

I don't know why you think this topic is so very very special. Countless other topics have included countless other people who have strong opinions on how you should live, who you should fuck, when/if/whom you should wed, and so on and so forth. They're just opinions on a 'net forum. They don't hurt you.

And all of those are useless. I don't care what you think about how I should live, who I should fuck, when/if/whom I should wed, and so on and so forth. If it isn't affecting you and you are not familiar with me and my particular situation, those things mean absolutely squat.

And they mean even less when they are given in a condescending manner.

In this thread I've had people giving me opinions on how I should run my relationship. As a matter of fact, that's precisely what I was responding to when you popped in. If you aren't interested in participating in a discussion where folks share such opinions, why stay in this thread once you could see that's what it's about?

Because the point that always has to be made in these sorts of threads is the fact that different people have different needs and the solution that is best for one will not be best for another. You seem to have no problem seeing this in discussions of gender, but when it comes to how to handle finances in a relationship, all of a sudden you're the big expert on how things should be handled, with no regard to the other cases.

Your statements are no different than someone who says that all women should stay in the kitchen or that all men should like sports. They don't fit that mold. Likewise, all couples don't fit into a given mold. There is no solution that will work for everyone. And it is ludicrous to pretend that there is.


Umm I don't think Bottle was actualy trying to tell you how to live your life, just expresing a general opinion.

Edit: To be more exact:

She stated:

Financial independence is important for any adult in this world. Getting married won't change that. And when it comes to paying your share, it's important so that both people in the marriage feel like they are being treated fairly and not taken advantage of.


First of all, she's telling us what is important to "any adult". Bullshit. She doesn't know that. Some of us are perfectly happy sharing our finances with another.

Then, she basically touts her way of doing things as the only way that both people can "feel like they are being treated fairly and not taken advantage of". Again, utter bullshit. That might be the only way she will feel that way, but others are not her.

This makes no more sense than someone stating that all women really want to have babies and stay home with them and that all men want to be primary breadwinners. It simply isn't true and it is condescending and harmful to suggest that it is. And because Bottle generally recognizes this sort of thing, I am rather disappointed to see her stomping all over it now.

Whoa, that's quite some fascination with money in that list.
I can see these two (well, the first one is necessary, really):
Question 1: What percentage of our income are we prepared to spend to purchase and maintain our home on a monthly or annual basis?

Question 5: What are our categories of expense (rent, clothing, insurance, travel)? How much do we spend monthly, annually, in each category? How much do we want to be able to spend?

But these?? :
Question 3: How much money do we earn together? Now? In one year? In five years? Ten? Who is responsible for which portion? Now? In one year? Five? Ten?

Question 4: What is our ultimate financial goal regarding annual income, and when do we anticipate achieving it? By what means and through what efforts?
Sheesh. Are we a couple or a company?

Now, of course we both understand the benefits of knowing each other's favourite colour (helps in picking out gifts and the such); however, we're concerned with growing deeper with each other, and you can't really do that when questions consist of "What's your favourite movie?" or "What's your partner's middle name?" I mean, come on. If two people who are planning to get married don't even know their respective partner's middle name, something is amiss. I should think it's implied that people should already know the answers to such surface-level questions before they even THINK of getting married.



I dunno. I've heard of people getting married without knowing the FIRST name of the partner. That usually happens in Vegas after a wild party. :)

Seriously, I suspect that when my GF reels me in, we'll probably have a "his" "hers" "ours" setup. Most of the money will probably go to "ours", but I'll have enough private money for my stuff, and she'll have enough for hers.