NationStates Jolt Archive

This may be a stupid question but I'm wondering how one knows that one has actual, clinical depression.

I know that the definition is not necessarily clear-cut and that there've been people who apparently suffered from depression for years without ever being diagnosed or realising there was something medically wrong with them. One can feel down and unmotivated, one can have bad days (or a bad few weeks, as it were) without necessarily being depressed.

So how does one know? At what point should one go to a doctor...and then how does a doctor know?

I would say when you find yourself staring several storeis down at the street, or imagining swallowing a bottle of sleeping pills its time to seek help.

This may be a stupid question but I'm wondering how one knows that one has actual, clinical depression.

I know that the definition is not necessarily clear-cut and that there've been people who apparently suffered from depression for years without ever being diagnosed or realising there was something medically wrong with them. One can feel down and unmotivated, one can have bad days (or a bad few weeks, as it were) without necessarily being depressed.

So how does one know? At what point should one go to a doctor...and then how does a doctor know?

According to drug commercials, you're depressed. Everyone is. :p

Really though, there's no scientific consensus - at least, not according to several articles on assisted suicide I once read. In one case, a woman was allowed to receive a mercy killing after the death of her husband and son caused her to be depressed for a six-month stretch, though she was perfectly healthy otherwise. So some doctors consider six months long enough to justify killing yourself. :p Really though, your local doctor would be making the decision, I think.

Really though, your local doctor would be making the decision, I think.
Well, I'm not about to kill myself. There's too many millions to make and too many cars to drive yet. I don't see the point.

But say I were to go to the doctor...how would he know what's going on in my head? And besides, I can't properly describe the symptoms anyways. Maybe I just need a girlfriend and everything will sort itself out...but then I thought the same thing when I was looking for my new car.

I'd assume that clinical depression relates to a regular/periodical 'feeling down' which has roots in the same or similar reasons.

Feeling down because you failed your exams, and later on feeling down because your grandma died. That sounds fairly natural. If someone was having trouble coping with such events and moving on, then that could be clinical depression. Could be other reasons as well: bad diet, not enough sun/SAD, genetics, not enough sleep, too much sleep, isolationism, not enough time to yourself/to think, and plenty of other things.

edit: Finding someone to talk would be a good place to start. Either someone you already know and trust or a councilor. Talking can be a good way to deal with problems, if you're having trouble getting past them on your own. Sometimes the other person doesn't even need to say much, but just let you know that they're still listening from time to time.

Well, I'm not about to kill myself. There's too many millions to make and too many cars to drive yet. I don't see the point.

But say I were to go to the doctor...how would he know what's going on in my head? And besides, I can't properly describe the symptoms anyways. Maybe I just need a girlfriend and everything will sort itself out...but then I thought the same thing when I was looking for my new car.

Your doctor has probably enjoyed at least a few steak dinners at the expense of the pharmaceutical companies - my provider is *very* liberal with drugs and diagnoses (AKA "preventive medicine"). They have posters all over the place telling customers to notify their 'primary care physician' of any *hint* of depression. So here, the antidepressants flow like water. That's all I can say from personal experience. Almost every woman over 40 I know takes antidepressants of some kind, just to give you the idea. ;)

At what point should one go to a doctor...

When one feels that one needs help.

and then how does a doctor know?

The DSM IV criteria for a single episode of major depressive disorder ("clinical depression" in common language) are:

A. The person experiences a single major depressive episode:

1. For a major depressive episode a person must have experienced at least five of the nine symptoms below for the same two weeks or more, for most of the time almost every day, and this is a change from his/her prior level of functioning. One of the symptoms must be either (a) depressed mood, or (b) loss of interest.
1. Depressed mood. For children and adolescents, this may be irritable mood.
2. A significantly reduced level of interest or pleasure in most or all activities.
3. A considerable loss or gain of weight (e.g., 5% or more change of weight in a month when not dieting). This may also be an increase or decrease in appetite. For children, they may not gain an expected amount of weight.
4. Difficulty falling or staying asleep (insomnia), or sleeping more than usual (hypersomnia).
5. Behavior that is agitated or slowed down. Others should be able to observe this.
6. Feeling fatigued, or diminished energy.
7. Thoughts of worthlessness or extreme guilt (not about being ill).
8. Ability to think, concentrate, or make decisions is reduced.
9. Frequent thoughts of death or suicide (with or without a specific plan), or attempt of suicide.

2. The persons' symptoms do not indicate a mixed episode.

3. The person's symptoms are a cause of great distress or difficulty in functioning at home, work, or other important areas.

4. The person's symptoms are not caused by substance use (e.g., alcohol, drugs, medication), or a medical disorder.

5. The person's symptoms are not due to normal grief or bereavement over the death of a loved one, they continue for more than two months, or they include great difficulty in functioning, frequent thoughts of worthlessness, thoughts of suicide, symptoms that are psychotic, or behavior that is slowed down (psychomotor retardation).

B. Another disorder does not better explain the major depressive episode.

C. The person has never had a manic, mixed, or a hypomanic Episode (unless an episode was due to a medical disorder or use of a substance).

There are several diagnostic tools that help with the diagnosis, such as enquêtes and score sheets - a thorough anamnesis being however always central.

Finding someone to talk would be a good place to start. Either someone you already know and trust or a councilor. Talking can be a good way to deal with problems, if you're having trouble getting past them on your own. Sometimes the other person doesn't even need to say much, but just let you know that they're still listening from time to time.
I would agree, but without trying to turn this into too much of a "me" thread (hehe, fat chance), I've found that few people care. Most of my friends from highschool have moved away, and at uni it's hard to get to know anyone close enough to start talking about personal issues, nor would I feel comfortable with some stranger who just happens to be a councillor.

You know in "The Sims" if you live alone and you never interact with other sims how the "Social Life" bar goes low and the silly thing starts getting all upset? That's how I feel - the weird thing is just that every time I get invited to go into the city or something I don't go because I just don't enjoy pubs, nightclubs and all that stuff. One can't help wondering whether something is wrong and what to do about it.

When one feels that one needs help.
Help? Probably. But I don't think it's the sort of help a doctor can provide.

The DSM IV criteria for a single episode of major depressive disorder ("clinical depression" in common language) are...
Hmm, doesn't look like it then. I might have a few of those, but not five. Thanks. :)

I would agree, but without trying to turn this into too much of a "me" thread (hehe, fat chance), I've found that few people care. Most of my friends from highschool have moved away, and at uni it's hard to get to know anyone close enough to start talking about personal issues, nor would I feel comfortable with some stranger who just happens to be a councillor.
Why not? Sure, they'd be a stranger to begin with, but why avoid seeking professional help if you feel you need it? Even if it isn't help you're after, and just an answer to your questions, it should be beneficial.

You know in "The Sims" if you live alone and you never interact with other sims how the "Social Life" bar goes low and the silly thing starts getting all upset? That's how I feel - the weird thing is just that every time I get invited to go into the city or something I don't go because I just don't enjoy pubs, nightclubs and all that stuff. One can't help wondering whether something is wrong and what to do about it.
Yes, I feel that way too often. Would it not be prudent to find out why you feel that way though? Dragging me down to a club when in one of those moods would just make me even more uncomfortable, speaking from experience. Certain people are simply more introverted than others, and this need not be associated with depression.

Help? Probably. But I don't think it's the sort of help a doctor can provide.

You may be surprised.

Hmm, doesn't look like it then. I might have a few of those, but not five. Thanks. :)

Just let it be clear that I did not urge or condone self-diagnosis, I just answered your question.

By the way, a tip: when you are invited to social venues that you do not particularly appreciate but feel that it may facilitate continued socialising in other areas (this thing we call "friendship"), perhaps you should suck it up and go to them anyway to get onto that path. You won't gain any friends by being a stick in the mud that never goes anywhere or does anything.

According to drug commercials, you're depressed. Everyone is. :p


I know you mean to say this light-heartedly, but even as satire, only idiots take drug commercials of that nature to heart. Without drug companies medicine to immunise your babies would not exist, smallpox would still be around, your headaches would lend yourself to consider suicide rather than be a common day nuisance.

People want universal healthcare, the government to cover all trips to the doctor; imagine what sort of government debt is going to arise if such a thing occurs, alongside the need for government to manufacture the drugs too. Pharmaceutical companies might make bad choices like bad commercials, but generalisations should never be made, and I am absolutely sure you will need them one day in the future. I suppose you would call it the price of capitalism.


how would he know what's going on in my head


Your doctor might not, but a good psychologist will get most of it, and I stress, good psychologist, not some hobo with a knowledge in cold reading, or a qualified psychologist who graduated into the most obscure college out of shear luck considering his/her dismal SAT's. You deserve the best treatment, be selective about medical practitioners as they delve into your privacy, and perhaps more importantly, your well-being.

The mind is a fickle thing; the strangest things can occur in people's minds, you should ask people who have studied neuropharmacology, WOW! In any case, if you're asking because you wonder if you're suffering from depression, talk to someone who can make referrals. If you're asking because you wonder about someone who has depression tell them to see a doctor, and if you're asking to find out what kind of drugs you can get.... :rolleyes:

YES... I forgot... I must remember context. So you type this in a nationstates.net forum, so this might mean you are actually interested in the subject. I'd say check up on websites from genuine organisations that help people with depression - find medical websites. The likely chances of an MD, reading this thread, and then commenting on it, I think could be astronomical. In any case, they might just give you a text book answer.

Find a good GP! He or she can help you out in the best of times. Probably the reason they became doctors in the first place.

I would agree, but without trying to turn this into too much of a "me" thread (hehe, fat chance), I've found that few people care. Most of my friends from highschool have moved away, and at uni it's hard to get to know anyone close enough to start talking about personal issues, nor would I feel comfortable with some stranger who just happens to be a councillor.What about family?

The nice thing about councilors though is that they treat whatever you say in confidence. So if it all turns out to be a total disaster and you never want to see them again, then you don't have to, and they won't say a thing.

You know in "The Sims" if you live alone and you never interact with other sims how the "Social Life" bar goes low and the silly thing starts getting all upset? That's how I feel - the weird thing is just that every time I get invited to go into the city or something I don't go because I just don't enjoy pubs, nightclubs and all that stuff. One can't help wondering whether something is wrong and what to do about it.Pfft, even if I had more than one they'd still get depressed if I didn't make them super playful.

How do you usually like to interact with other people. I mean, what activity do you share?

Meh, and I don't mind if this thread focuses on you. You made the thread to talk about how you're feeling low (now or recently). So let's not beat around the bush talking about hypothetical situations or friends. :p

By the way, a tip: when you are invited to social venues that you do not particularly appreciate but feel that it may facilitate continued socialising in other areas (this thing we call "friendship"), perhaps you should suck it up and go to them anyway to get onto that path. You won't gain any friends by being a stick in the mud that never goes anywhere or does anything.But the opposite can just as easily be true too.

I hate nightclubs, I really do. Loathe them even. It's something about the music being too loud and penetrating my mind so I can't even think properly. I don't like it. That together with the fact that I'm quiet spoken and can never make myself heard at a nightclub. Well... yeah. I don't like nightclubs.

In essence you need to decide on which activities you don't actually like doing, and which you just don't feel like doing. And then make sure you don't let how you feel at the time get in the way of what you're do. If you think you honnestly made a good effort to try and enjoy yourself, then don't be afraid to excuse yourself early.

It's complicated and ultimately only you can provide the answers you're looking for. Any advice given is typically what the advice giver would do in your situation, and not necessarily what you should do...

Feel free to send me a TM, if you want to that is.

What about family?
Hehe, let's just say "no". I think I can say with confidence that whatever had been left of this family was thoroughly shredded by four years of unemployment. This is just a house with four people who happen to live together but everyone just plans on how to best get out of here. :p

How do you usually like to interact with other people. I mean, what activity do you share?
Well, I like going to the movies, or just sitting around in a café some place and discussing stuff...like politics and so on. These days I obviously enjoy car stuff as well, so I'm already trying to make contacts in that scene in the area.

Though I have to say some of my best "social moments" were probably just before we all turned 18 at the very end of some houseparty in that post-drunken state when people would just talk about anything. Though quite often there'd be a joint making the rounds as well, so I'm not sure that even counts. ;)

umm.. I wonder the same thing.. when is one clinicaly depressed?

I get down lots but what I do is sulk around a bit.. listen to some powerful music (AC/DC for ex.) and then I get some sleep and (almost force to) get myself into a good mood.

this works for me..

the best thing is to socialize I suppose (get a girlfriend.. although this sometimes becomes a source of troubles :P) ---keep busy and motivated

unless it becomes unbearable I would just chill till it blows away (the more you worry/think about it the better it grips around you and the deeper in it becomes)

Chin up mate

you know you are clinically depressed when your doctor tells you so.

if you are at the point where you are wondering if you are clinically depressed you need to consult a doctor.

My boyfriend said it's like physical pain (he described it as spikes driving into your head) that overwhelms everything until all you can think of is the pain and how you want it to end. It's not like just having a bad day.

Help? Probably. But I don't think it's the sort of help a doctor can provide.

I thought the same thing. Happily, I was proven wrong.

Your doctor has probably enjoyed at least a few steak dinners at the expense of the pharmaceutical companies - my provider is *very* liberal with drugs and diagnoses (AKA "preventive medicine"). They have posters all over the place telling customers to notify their 'primary care physician' of any *hint* of depression. So here, the antidepressants flow like water. That's all I can say from personal experience. Almost every woman over 40 I know takes antidepressants of some kind, just to give you the idea. ;)

Yeah. My dad says that doctors prescribe way too many drugs just to give the illusion that they are helping.

Yeah. My dad says that doctors prescribe way too many drugs just to give the illusion that they are helping.

They certainly do when dealing with me, my family, and people I've met. Not that I mind too much - pills have their uses. :p Although there are some crazy backfires with some of them.

You may be surprised.



Just let it be clear that I did not urge or condone self-diagnosis, I just answered your question.

By the way, a tip: when you are invited to social venues that you do not particularly appreciate but feel that it may facilitate continued socialising in other areas (this thing we call "friendship"), perhaps you should suck it up and go to them anyway to get onto that path. You won't gain any friends by being a stick in the mud that never goes anywhere or does anything.
I'd agree here...a) getting out and getting your mind off everything can help and b) being together with people is how you become friends. I'd say either just go to the pub with them or come up with a good alternative option...movies or something, and invite them along

They certainly do when dealing with me, my family, and people I've met. Not that I mind too much - pills have their uses. :p Although there are some crazy backfires with some of them.

Yeah. My dad's a very traditional doctor. He hates that. Fortunately, because he's a heart surgeon, he doesn't deal with it much.

I'd agree here...a) getting out and getting your mind off everything can help and b) being together with people is how you become friends. I'd say either just go to the pub with them or come up with a good alternative option...movies or something, and invite them along

and if you cant bring yourself to do that and no matter how hard you suck it up you never feel better, you need to go to a doctor.

everyone gets depressed now and then, if you are always depressed there is something wrong.

I went to seek medical help at the advice of friends. When one is depressed, it is remarkably difficult to analyse one's actions and thoughts with any lucidity.

Self-harming's a good indicator as well.

I would say not to trust self-diagnosis, it's very easy to exaggerate some feelings and ignore others in order to pigeonhole yourself into something. Having said that, if you find yourself reading depression-related websites (diagnosis criteria, advice, stories of others' experiences), then that may be a good indicator that you are depressed (or maybe that you want to be called depressed to somehow explain yourself and make others care more).

I think going to a doctor should be an option only if you find you cannot control it and it is really negatively affecting your work/life/relationships. You would want to be prescribed antidepressants? or would that make you not you anymore?

Sounds like loneliness is a major factor. Perhaps you should organise a film night, either at someone's house or a cinema, get a takeaway/eat out, with a small number of friends. Try finding a sports club/other activity club that you're genuinely interested in and that meet regularly near you.

There are many things. Fass has it pretty well covered.


I lived with a Manic Depressive. There are many events and many levels of things that show it.

Being depressed is ok. Being depressed most of the time is not. It could be a rut where it feels like you have condition. Then it stops.

If you find you just want to sulk all the time, it could be you are. If you are reduced to inaction.

At the least a Doctor can evaluate if it's a chemical imbalance. A "shrink" can help if it's just life gone bad.

If it really bothers you, nothing wrong with checking it out.

This may be a stupid question but I'm wondering how one knows that one has actual, clinical depression.

I know that the definition is not necessarily clear-cut and that there've been people who apparently suffered from depression for years without ever being diagnosed or realising there was something medically wrong with them. One can feel down and unmotivated, one can have bad days (or a bad few weeks, as it were) without necessarily being depressed.

So how does one know? At what point should one go to a doctor...and then how does a doctor know?

Doctors do *not* know! That's just the thing. A guy in a white coat who went to medical school, does this mean he's a psychologist? NO. People continue to assume this, and that's why all you have to do if you want some drugs is to go to your doctor, tell him you have some sort of disorder and he'll prescribe them to you.

Only psychologists could really make a proper diagnosis. But if they did, that's how you know. You won't "know" you have depression (or anything) until and unless you find out from someone trained to diagnose it. Self-diagnosis is bad.

I went to seek medical help at the advice of friends. When one is depressed, it is remarkably difficult to analyse one's actions and thoughts with any lucidity.

Self-harming's a good indicator as well.

I think the counsellors got a bit concerned when they asked how I relax and my answer was skydiving.

General crankiness is your first indicator.

This may be a stupid question but I'm wondering how one knows that one has actual, clinical depression.

I know that the definition is not necessarily clear-cut and that there've been people who apparently suffered from depression for years without ever being diagnosed or realising there was something medically wrong with them. One can feel down and unmotivated, one can have bad days (or a bad few weeks, as it were) without necessarily being depressed.

So how does one know? At what point should one go to a doctor...and then how does a doctor know?

i had been suffering from depression for the best part of 2 years by the time i finally broached the subject with my parents, at which time my mum assured me i wasn't depressed and told me to stop worrying. months later after dropping out of uni, it became quite clear to them what i was going through, they took me to the docs for meds and therapy (of which there was none available) and... stuff. point is, its probably best to talk to someone who's been through depression themselves, or has some kind of personal experience with it, as most normal people don't know squat :P

i'd say if you find yourself feeling down more than you feel happy, find yourself unable to feel happy at things that you once found joy in, and/or find yourself thinking along the lines of "its all too hard - i may as well give up", or longing for some natural disaster to come along, or for death in any other way, then you probably have a problem.

personally, for me, the big way to tell is the not-enjoying-things-i-used-to-enjoy thing. i've recently come off my meds for depression, quite by accident. my moods are totally unpredictable and i haven't really noticed the slide back into (some) depression as its been very gradual, but that's the real tell-tale for me.

This may be a stupid question but I'm wondering how one knows that one has actual, clinical depression.

I know that the definition is not necessarily clear-cut and that there've been people who apparently suffered from depression for years without ever being diagnosed or realising there was something medically wrong with them. One can feel down and unmotivated, one can have bad days (or a bad few weeks, as it were) without necessarily being depressed.

So how does one know? At what point should one go to a doctor...and then how does a doctor know?


Hmmmmmm. "Feeling down and not motivated" not so much so. Its when you don't do, rather than feel like not doing. I'd say go see the Doc. Hes ethically bound to keep his trap shut, and no one need know you've been.
(I've had it for over 20 years now)

This may be a stupid question but I'm wondering how one knows that one has actual, clinical depression.

I know that the definition is not necessarily clear-cut and that there've been people who apparently suffered from depression for years without ever being diagnosed or realising there was something medically wrong with them. One can feel down and unmotivated, one can have bad days (or a bad few weeks, as it were) without necessarily being depressed.

So how does one know? At what point should one go to a doctor...and then how does a doctor know?

Clinical depression is chronic and severe enough to interfere with daily functioning. Having the condition for years without a diagnosis is not uncommon, unfortunately. That's what happened to me. I'd been depressed for most of my life, but was only diagnosed four years ago. It then took another year and a half to get me on the proper meds.