NationStates Jolt Archive

Why do people get married?

Because we're greedy masochist who want to save on our taxes and gain marital tax and insurance benefits. ;);) j/k

It aids in security, be it financial, romantic, or securing a companion.

To fleece their partner in the divorce court.

Social mores dictated that monogamous marriage was the 'right' thing to do.

(I was also lucky enough to meet someone who - even 12 years on - makes me smile just by walking into view. Marrying her still seems like a great move to have made.)

:D

Why do people get married?

No idea. Finances, I guess. You know, tax breaks and everything...

Why do people get married?
Habit, I suppose. In my country, getting married is seen as the default. You're supposed to get married. If you aren't married by a certain age, people assume something is wrong with you.

I agree, it's finances: I make all the money, my wife spends it.

Edit: Similar to what Bottle said: I fell in love, and getting married was expected of me.

Are we the romantic bunch!

I think people are (generally) predisposed to liking ceremonies that celebrate cultural events. Graduations, weddings, coronations, parades, naming ceremonies…people like to gather together and do that kind of commemorative thing. I, off hand, can't think of a culture that doesn't have some kind of gathering/celebration for something. I could be wrong, though.

Are we the romantic bunch!
See? This is exactly the assumption I was talking about:

A person who looks at marriage critically is excluded from being "romantic."

"Romance" requires that one blindly accept the cultural norm of marriage.

To make my girlfriend happy and show her how commited I am to her. She has the fairytale image of a wedding in her mind and has her heart set on it. It would break my heart to deprive her of that

To make my girlfriend happy and show her how commited I am to her. She has the fairytale image of a wedding in her mind and has her heart set on it. It would break my heart to deprive her of that

Yes, but once the fairy tale is over and reality reasserts itself, what then?

To make my girlfriend happy and show her how commited I am to her. She has the fairytale image of a wedding in her mind and has her heart set on it. It would break my heart to deprive her of that
If somebody is still childish enough to buy into fairytale images, they are far too childish to be married.

Yes, but once the fairy tale is over and reality reasserts itself, what then?

Then she has had her day in the limelight with everyone celebrating her love and we can continue with what led me to want to be with her, my love for her, her ability to draw a hell of a lot of emotion out of me (most of them good emotions)

I have no wish to perpetuate the tradition that is marriage, but currently it does provide benefits that non-marriage does not in terms of financial/legal security. I wouldn't say to a partner that I would never get married, I just have no longterm goal to do it. Seems quite outdated to me, especially those who consider it for procreational objectives only.

If somebody is still childish enough to buy into fairytale images, they are far too childish to be married.

I would disagree but then I love her childlike ways

She was mature enough to put up with my depression and deal with it constructively even when I admitted my suicidal thoughts to her. Just because someone holds onto one fairytale image doesnt mean they live their lives based around those images

Then she has had her day in the limelight with everyone celebrating her love and we can continue with what led me to want to be with her, my love for her, her ability to draw a hell of a lot of emotion out of me (most of them good emotions)

I would disagree but then I love her childlike ways

She was mature enough to put up with my depression and deal with it constructively even when I admitted my suicidal thoughts to her. Just because someone holds onto one fairytale image doesnt mean they live their lives based around those images

You, sir, are a romantic, and I hope you remain so in spite of reality.

In my case, reality kicked the shit out of my sense of romance some time ago.

Then she has had her day in the limelight with everyone celebrating her love and we can continue with what led me to want to be with her, my love for her, her ability to draw a hell of a lot of emotion out of me (most of them good emotions)

And then it all falls apart, and because marriage makes it hard to just quietly go your seperate ways it becomes a lever, used to coerce the other person into doing what you want... There is no carrot, but divorce is the stick; Do what I say, or I shall divorce you, take everything, and destroy your life.
And if that isn't enough it comes to divorce itself, and it becomes a competition to do exactly that; hurt the other party as much as possible.

See? This is exactly the assumption I was talking about:

A person who looks at marriage critically is excluded from being "romantic."

"Romance" requires that one blindly accept the cultural norm of marriage.

No not at all, but when you see a group of people strip out the humanity out of a union of two people and turn it into a tax shelter it takes some of the romanticism out it.

I would disagree but then I love her childlike ways

She was mature enough to put up with my depression and deal with it constructively even when I admitted my suicidal thoughts to her. Just because someone holds onto one fairytale image doesnt mean they live their lives based around those images

Well said Dundee

You, sir, are a romantic, and I hope you remain so in spite of reality.

In my case, reality kicked the shit out of my sense of romance some time ago.

Don't worry i'm generally very cynical and pessimistic (probably helps lead to the depression) except for in her case. Yeah i'm a romantic but I can understand the reasons people have for not wanting to get married. Mine are based on nothing other than emotion

And then it all falls apart, and because marriage makes it hard to just quietly go your seperate ways it becomes a lever, used to coerce the other person into doing what you want... There is no carrot, but divorce is the stick; Do what I say, or I shall divorce you, take everything, and destroy your life.
And if that isn't enough it comes to divorce itself, and it becomes a competition to do exactly that; hurt the other party as much as possible.

You say it as if divorce is a certainty. I've been through enough with her to trust we will be fine when married. And if it doesn't work out at least i'll have done exactly what I wanted to. I've tried marriage and I did it for us. I couldn't regret that

I guess I belong to the group of unromantic people here.
I never saw any attraction in marriage whatsoever... it seems to be a huge big expensive deal, only to eventually become even huger and more expensive when the divorce comes around.

My BF wants to get married, and I guess if we're going to have kids it makes sense legally and financially, but I most certainly will not have any big, blown-up ceremony around it. I love him, and that's that, and no signature on any piece of paper has any influence on that whatsoever. :)

I guess I belong to the group of unromantic people here.
I love him, and that's that, and no signature on any piece of paper has any influence on that whatsoever. :)

That sounds pretty romantic to me.

That sounds pretty romantic to me.

*lol I guess that depends on how you define "romantic" ;)

You say it as if divorce is a certainty. I've been through enough with her to trust we will be fine when married. And if it doesn't work out at least i'll have done exactly what I wanted to. I've tried marriage and I did it for us. I couldn't regret that

No, divorce isn't a certainty. Or even the worst that can happen. An unhappy marriage can be much worse than divorce.

It's simple, one day a couple simply run out of things to talk about, there's an awkward pause as both of them struggle to think of something that hasn't been discussed before, the bloke hits upon the only way out of a deadlock, proposes, and they suddenly have something to talk about for the rest of their lives.:)

No, divorce isn't a certainty. Or even the worst that can happen. An unhappy marriage can be much worse than divorce.

I'll take the risk thanks

I'll take the risk thanks

Good luck.

If I ever get married it would be in my mind for no other reason than I think I'm in love with someone enough to live my whole life with them, to grow old by thier side, and die happy with the knowledge that there IS in fact true love. Or hell.. even the knowledge that there IS someone who won't use my trust to screw me over and hurt my already delicate fealings.

I fell in love? wait.....no, that's not right.......money!, well, not actually.......

I am not sure.




I did it a long time ago on a whim and it stuck.......yeah, that's it.

It's simple, one day a couple simply run out of things to talk about, there's an awkward pause as both of them struggle to think of something that hasn't been discussed before, the bloke hits upon the only way out of a deadlock, proposes, and they suddenly have something to talk about for the rest of their lives.:)

Not really the rest of their lives. Eventually the fact that life is boring and so are they eventually causes the conversation to either stop or drone on pointlessly forever. Once (if) a couple comes to terms with that reality, then they can have a long lasting marriage.

Why do people get married?

Because it's a statement of a serious comittment they want to have to each other. For the couple itself it actually may not make a difference for their relationship, but after all they are a part of the society and joining this tradition is a statement to the other people around.
Besides, I'm a sentimental romantic so I definitely want to marry my bf one day.

I guess it's romantic, making it official that you love somebody, etc. Plus it comes with legal protections.

If I ever get married it would be in my mind for no other reason than I think I'm in love with someone enough to live my whole life with them, to grow old by thier side, and die happy with the knowledge that there IS in fact true love. Or hell.. even the knowledge that there IS someone who won't use my trust to screw me over and hurt my already delicate fealings.

The questions is, if that's the case already, what do you need marriage for?

The questions is, if that's the case already, what do you need marriage for?

Because some people are still attached to essentially outdated social traditions?

And then it all falls apart, and because marriage makes it hard to just quietly go your seperate ways it becomes a lever, used to coerce the other person into doing what you want... There is no carrot, but divorce is the stick; Do what I say, or I shall divorce you, take everything, and destroy your life.
And if that isn't enough it comes to divorce itself, and it becomes a competition to do exactly that; hurt the other party as much as possible.

for immature people maybe. Anyone I ever saw in marital counseling who did that was also the type of idiot who would say things like "if you talk to that person then you can't be my best friend anymore"

there are people who get married for the wrong reason, and just about all of them get a divorce.

The questions is, if that's the case already, what do you need marriage for?

Nothing. You want it for some personal emotional reason devoid of logic

for immature people maybe. Anyone I ever saw in marital counseling who did that was also the type of idiot who would say things like "if you talk to that person then you can't be my best friend anymore"

there are people who get married for the wrong reason, and just about all of them get a divorce.

And there are couples who hate each other with a passion, who everybody tells to get a divorce as it would make both parties happier, but still don't...

I've seen lots of evidence that marriage makes you miserable, and very little that it makes you happier than if you'd remained unmarried.

I know to many people it may seem like a dated viewpoint, but some people get married for religious reasons... I'm surprised that that hasn't come up yet.

Society tells us to get married? It is the ultimate proof that you really love the person you are with? A way for gold diggers not to get real jobs?

And there are couples who hate each other with a passion, who everybody tells to get a divorce as it would make both parties happier, but still don't...

I've seen lots of evidence that marriage makes you miserable, and very little that it makes you happier than if you'd remained unmarried.

marriage isn't for making you happy. people who think that marriage will make them happy are people who are going to be miserable.

And there are couples who hate each other with a passion, who everybody tells to get a divorce as it would make both parties happier, but still don't...

I've seen lots of evidence that marriage makes you miserable, and very little that it makes you happier than if you'd remained unmarried.

Marriage itself makes people miserable or people who are miserable are sometimes married?

there are people who get married for the wrong reason, and just about all of them get a divorce.

Interesting. What would you say is the "right reason"?

Marriage itself makes people miserable or people who are miserable are sometimes married?

It makes people more miserable than they might otherwise have been.

Interesting. What would you say is the "right reason"?

because you want to commit to someone and spend your life with them.

not because you think it will make you happy, or because they are "the person of your dreams", or because "we have been dating for a long time and we have to get married now", or "because I want a wedding", or "because we can get tax breaks", or "because everyone else did it", or even "because they want to"

because you want to commit to someone and spend your life with them.

And why does that require marriage?

And why does that require marriage?

it doesn't.

I think people unwilling to get married may be less committed, but I don't really have any proof of that, nor is there any way to prove it, it's just my opinion.

Interesting. What would you say is the "right reason"?

Because you love the person and you want to commit yourself to them through a union that binds you two together in a significant way that says, "you're the only for me."

The questions is, if that's the case already, what do you need marriage for?

1. I said IF I do, never once said I need it

2. Why should you care about my reason anyway, want to marry me? :p

It makes people more miserable than they might otherwise have been.

Isn't that an argument for easier divorce rather than against marriage itself

Isn't that an argument for easier divorce rather than against marriage itself

But then it comes down to "prevention is better than cure".

And why does that require marriage?

It doesn't but it can be a personal gesture between a couple

Marriage itself makes people miserable or people who are miserable are sometimes married?

I think both can be true.
Marriage certainly made my mother VERY miserable, and social pressure made sure she stayed that way for over a decade.
She once said to me : "Imagine you're in a lovely house, with a beautiful garden. You've got everything you need, everything you could possibly want, you're just utterly contend and happy in that house. When you look out of the window, you can see that outside it's cold and windy and raining, it's horrible and everytime you take a look you shudder and are glad that you're inside.
That's being in love.

Getting married is like somebody closing the door, locking it and taking the key away.
You're still in the same house, everything might still be as nice inside and as horrible outside as it was before, but you can't help thinking about getting that key again..."

I can do that perfectly well without marriage, though....

Some people can't.

because you want to commit to someone and spend your life with them.

not because you think it will make you happy, or because they are "the person of your dreams", or because "we have been dating for a long time and we have to get married now", or "because I want a wedding", or "because we can get tax breaks", or "because everyone else did it", or even "because they want to"

I can do that perfectly well without marriage, though....

I can do that perfectly well without marriage, though....

I am sure you can. I am sure a lot of people can. I just know a lot of people who can't do it at ALL who thought getting married would fix that and force them to.

Because you love the person and you want to commit yourself to them through a union that binds you two together in a significant way that says, "you're the only for me."

*lol

We're planning on being Swingers for as long as we can, though ;)

I'm not committing by putting a signature on a piece of paper. That's for the tax breaks and legal protection and all that.
I committ by living with a person, loving that person, cherishing his presence, solving conflicts with that person and growing with him.

So can everyone who has a good, lasting marriage. The commitment argument is a flawed one. Its a gesture (a constant one i suppose) to your partner. There are other ways of making that gesture but two people may feel that marriage is the most appropriate one for them

^what he said. ;)

I can do that perfectly well without marriage, though....

So can everyone who has a good, lasting marriage. The commitment argument is a flawed one. Its a gesture (a constant one i suppose) to your partner. There are other ways of making that gesture but two people may feel that marriage is the most appropriate one for them

*lol

We're planning on being Swingers for as long as we can, though ;)

I'm not committing by putting a signature on a piece of paper. That's for the tax breaks and legal protection and all that.
I committ by living with a person, loving that person, cherishing his presence, solving conflicts with that person and growing with him.

Snap ;)

But then it comes down to "prevention is better than cure".

or the risks can be worth the benefits

I am sure you can. I am sure a lot of people can. I just know a lot of people who can't do it at ALL who thought getting married would fix that and force them to.

Yep, I know some of those cases myself. Although, to be perfectly honest, I suspect they'd be in miserable and abusive relationships if they were married or not... it's just that being married means they're wasting an awful lot of money, first on getting married, then on getting counselling, and then on the divorce.

The funny thing is, I know a few people who will go through all that, and then start the same thing all over, again and again (a friend of my mom is married for the 4th time now). Makes you wonder.

Yep, I know some of those cases myself. Although, to be perfectly honest, I suspect they'd be in miserable and abusive relationships if they were married or not... it's just that being married means they're wasting an awful lot of money, first on getting married, then on getting counselling, and then on the divorce.

The funny thing is, I know a few people who will go through all that, and then start the same thing all over, again and again (a friend of my mom is married for the 4th time now). Makes you wonder.

I had a couple in marriage counseling once, who were marrying each other for the third time, they had been married and divorced twice already, and now they wanted to get married again. I asked "what makes you think you are going to make it work this time?" and they said "because you are going to fix us"

:( I had to explain that I don't fix anyone, and that if they can't be married they can't be married.

They went through the whole pre-marital counseling thing, then the marital counseling thing for like a year, and got married (again) and then 7 weeks later, divorced, again.

I think both can be true.
Marriage certainly made my mother VERY miserable, and social pressure made sure she stayed that way for over a decade.
She once said to me : "Imagine you're in a lovely house, with a beautiful garden. You've got everything you need, everything you could possibly want, you're just utterly contend and happy in that house. When you look out of the window, you can see that outside it's cold and windy and raining, it's horrible and everytime you take a look you shudder and are glad that you're inside.
That's being in love.

Getting married is like somebody closing the door, locking it and taking the key away.
You're still in the same house, everything might still be as nice inside and as horrible outside as it was before, but you can't help thinking about getting that key again..."

But thats not so much a problem with marriage as a problem with social views on divorce. At least in my opinion (which doesnt count for much)

Yep, I know some of those cases myself. Although, to be perfectly honest, I suspect they'd be in miserable and abusive relationships if they were married or not... it's just that being married means they're wasting an awful lot of money, first on getting married, then on getting counselling, and then on the divorce.

The funny thing is, I know a few people who will go through all that, and then start the same thing all over, again and again (a friend of my mom is married for the 4th time now). Makes you wonder.
That's why I like the idea of common-law marriage. If you can make it work, why not go the whole nine yards?

Living with someone for a year and dating almost four should be enough time to know the person and be able to tell if you truly want to spend the rest of your life together.

Of course, people change later on but if you don't rush in and you take your time, you're less likely to have a marriage that fails. You need trust, respect, love and the rest will fall into place.

If you don't have trust, nothing else matters because the relationship will fail in the end because trust matters the most.

I've always believed trust was important.

Two of my future grand-parents-in-law have both said that trust is the most important thing to making marriage last. I'm inclined to believe it then. When someone married a hell of a long time tells you trust is fundamental, you shouldn't take as a grain of salt.

That's why I like the idea of common-law marriage. If you can make it work, why not go the whole nine yards?

Living with someone for a year and dating almost four should be enough time to know the person and be able to tell if you truly want to spend the rest of your life together.

Of course, people change later on but if you don't rush in and you take your time, you're less likely to have a marriage that fails. You need trust, respect, love and the rest will fall into place.

If you don't have trust, nothing else matters because the relationship will fail in the end because trust matters the most.

I don't know if it's really trust or 100% honesty.

As far as common law marriages though, here if you are common law married, you really have to get a real life paper divorce when you split. I think most of the "I am not going to sign a piece of paper" people are really just trying to avoid the divorce anyway.....so I don't know how a common law marriage will help any.

I don't know if it's really trust or 100% honesty.

As far as common law marriages though, here if you are common law married, you really have to get a real life paper divorce when you split. I think most of the "I am not going to sign a piece of paper" people are really just trying to avoid the divorce anyway.....so I don't know how a common law marriage will help any.

Ok, trust AND honesty. :)

Here, you only need to sign papers if you try and divide assets, AFAIK. You don't have to do any paper work unless you've made joint purchases and you want half the assets or something like that. I think that paper work is also involved if you have children.

Ok, trust AND honesty. :)
yeah. although, I was thinking that if someone was lying to you continually you wouldn't be able to trust them, and if they always told you the truth you would.......so, maybe just trust. ;)

Here, you only need to sign papers if you try and divide assets, AFAIK. You don't have to do any paper work unless you've made joint purchases and you want half the assets or something like that. I think that paper work is also involved if you have children.
that's interesting.

I don't like the idea of common-law marriage... Having this nasty, sinister thing sneak up on you and bite you on the arse because you weren't watching the calendar.
Nothing to sign, no warning, not even a party... Just your implicit acceptance because you decided to share a house. And you're still just as fucked as if you'd gone the whole hog in a cathedral. Nasty.

because you want to commit to someone and spend your life with them.

not because you think it will make you happy, or because they are "the person of your dreams", or because "we have been dating for a long time and we have to get married now", or "because I want a wedding", or "because we can get tax breaks", or "because everyone else did it", or even "because they want to"
I agree with all your stated "don't" reasons, though I take it a step further.

If I got married to somebody, it would be because I was ALREADY committed to them, and to spending my life with them. The commitment would come first. The marriage would simply be one manifestation of the existing commitment.

I also don't think there's necessarily anything wrong with getting married "because they want to," to a certain point.

For instance, I don't particularly want to get married, but I also don't have any particular objection to getting married (in theory). I can be committed without marriage, but I could also be committed within a marriage.

My partner cares more about getting married than I do. It is important to him. So, while I would not feel compelled to seek out marriage for my own sake, I'm more than willing to consider it because it is important to my partner.

Or, to put it another way, it's kind of like when you get a gift for your partner. Like how I sometimes give him flowers. I don't personally go for flowers, but he does, and he likes when I use flowers to express my affection for him. My affection is the same regardless of what gift I give him, but I know there are certain things he especially likes and so I personalize my gestures to show him that I care about him.

My feelings for him will be the same whether or not we marry. However, agreeing to marry him (eventually) would be a gesture that would let him know it, in a way that would make him extremely happy.

I agree with all your stated "don't" reasons, though I take it a step further.

If I got married to somebody, it would be because I was ALREADY committed to them, and to spending my life with them. The commitment would come first. The marriage would simply be one manifestation of the existing commitment.
100% agreed. sorry I wasn't clear.

I also don't think there's necessarily anything wrong with getting married "because they want to," to a certain point.

For instance, I don't particularly want to get married, but I also don't have any particular objection to getting married (in theory). I can be committed without marriage, but I could also be committed within a marriage.

My partner cares more about getting married than I do. It is important to him. So, while I would not feel compelled to seek out marriage for my own sake, I'm more than willing to consider it because it is important to my partner.

Or, to put it another way, it's kind of like when you get a gift for your partner. Like how I sometimes give him flowers. I don't personally go for flowers, but he does, and he likes when I use flowers to express my affection for him. My affection is the same regardless of what gift I give him, but I know there are certain things he especially likes and so I personalize my gestures to show him that I care about him.

My feelings for him will be the same whether or not we marry. However, agreeing to marry him (eventually) would be a gesture that would let him know it, in a way that would make him extremely happy.
it's important to ask "why" it's important to them......weed out the bad answers ;)

"why do you want to get married?"
"because it will prove your love to me"

wrong.

"why do you want to get married?"
"I like ice sculpture"

wrong.

"why do you want to get married?"
"it's the only way I can be happy"

wrong.

My feelings for him will be the same whether or not we marry. However, agreeing to marry him (eventually) would be a gesture that would let him know it, in a way that would make him extremely happy.

You've said exactly what i've been trying to in a much more elegant way

or the risks can be worth the benefits

Roughly 50% chance of divorce, and all the costs, lawyers, fun and games that entails.
In my experience, of those couples that don't divorce, you've got roughly 50% chance of living in misery.

I can't see any benefits of marriage, let alone any that warrant a 25% chance of non-failure. Especially when failure can be so bad.

it's important to ask "why" it's important to them......weed out the bad answers ;)

"why do you want to get married?"
"because it will prove your love to me"

wrong.

"why do you want to get married?"
"I like ice sculpture"

wrong.

"why do you want to get married?"
"it's the only way I can be happy"

wrong.
I have to be honest...if I asked, "Why do you want to get married?" and he replied, "I like ice sculpture," I think I would immediately start booking the hall and picking out flower arrangements. :D

Seriously, though, you're spot-on.

Roughly 50% chance of divorce, and all the costs, lawyers, fun and games that entails.
In my experience, of those couples that don't divorce, you've got roughly 50% chance of living in misery.

I can't see any benefits of marriage, let alone any that warrant a 25% chance of non-failure. Especially when failure can be so bad.

You're making up statistics i assume? I have no clue what the divorce rates are but if you're going to state percentages at least do me the courtesy of making them accurate so I can learn something.

You don't see any benefits but I do. Its a personal, emotional thing. This argument is going to go down the same route that religious debates go down. We're arguing from two completely different opinions weighting different factors in different ways. Our only option is to agree to disagree

Benefits, duh.

I have to be honest...if I asked, "Why do you want to get married?" and he replied, "I like ice sculpture," I think I would immediately start booking the hall and picking out flower arrangements. :D

Seriously, though, you're spot-on.

I love it when we get along! :)

hey, I got called a fem-nazi yesterday! I was so proud of myself.

I can't see any benefits of marriage,
Now, now, let's be a bit more clear-headed about this.

There are over a thousand legal rights that go along with legal marriage in the US. You might not personally think that getting those rights is worth the "cost" of getting married, but you have to acknowledge that they are benefits. The monetary cost of trying to obtain each of these rights through other means would be huge. Thousands of dollars of lawyer fees, many many hours of work, and you'd still be left with a lot less legal security than you could have had for simply signing a marriage contract.

tax reasons and the security of knowing that when you split up you can potentially get back what you put into the relationship. i've no idea why people agree to signing pre-nuptuals though.

You're making up statistics i assume? I have no clue what the divorce rates are but if you're going to state percentages at least do me the courtesy of making them accurate so I can learn something.

Making up, no. Approximating. The divorce rate is in the region of 50%. Maybe it's only 40%, maybe it's different where you are and where I am.

The other bit was, as I said, "in my experience". Of people I know. Maybe everybody you know got married and lived happily ever after?

Now, now, let's be a bit more clear-headed about this.

There are over a thousand legal rights that go along with legal marriage in the US. You might not personally think that getting those rights is worth the "cost" of getting married, but you have to acknowledge that they are benefits.

In the UK there are, as far as I know, many fewer 'benefits'. And I would consider some of those closer to burdens, truth be told...

Making up, no. Approximating. The divorce rate is in the region of 50%. Maybe it's only 40%, maybe it's different where you are and where I am.

The other bit was, as I said, "in my experience". Of people I know. Maybe everybody you know got married and lived happily ever after?



So no hard facts or studies and just your own personal experiences? Fair enough

In the UK there are, as far as I know, many fewer 'benefits'. And I would consider some of those closer to burdens, truth be told...
Fine, but there still are benefits.

I'm not trying to be a brat, I simply think it's not a good idea to pretend there are no benefits to getting married. There are plenty of rational reasons why people choose to get married, and plenty of concrete benefits they can enjoy for doing so.

Whether or not you, or I, personally AGREE with their choice, or think it is the best net outcome, is a whole other story.

"why do you want to get married?"
"because it will prove your love to me"

wrong.

"why do you want to get married?"
"I like ice sculpture"

wrong.

"why do you want to get married?"
"it's the only way I can be happy"

wrong.

Want real comedy? Replace "why do you want to get married" with "why do you want to have kids."

Well, not so much funny as sad, because you'll get the same answers.

I'll be married a year come October...and I still have no idea why. I think I did it for the vacation, to be honest.

I agree with all your stated "don't" reasons, though I take it a step further.

If I got married to somebody, it would be because I was ALREADY committed to them, and to spending my life with them. The commitment would come first. The marriage would simply be one manifestation of the existing commitment.

I also don't think there's necessarily anything wrong with getting married "because they want to," to a certain point.

For instance, I don't particularly want to get married, but I also don't have any particular objection to getting married (in theory). I can be committed without marriage, but I could also be committed within a marriage.

My partner cares more about getting married than I do. It is important to him. So, while I would not feel compelled to seek out marriage for my own sake, I'm more than willing to consider it because it is important to my partner.

Or, to put it another way, it's kind of like when you get a gift for your partner. Like how I sometimes give him flowers. I don't personally go for flowers, but he does, and he likes when I use flowers to express my affection for him. My affection is the same regardless of what gift I give him, but I know there are certain things he especially likes and so I personalize my gestures to show him that I care about him.

My feelings for him will be the same whether or not we marry. However, agreeing to marry him (eventually) would be a gesture that would let him know it, in a way that would make him extremely happy.

OMFG, you're like my older woman-clone!:eek: At least on this issue. :p

Which reminds me: I should be despairing over ring issues. :( I may not be on NS much anymore, but I still don't usually have a life....

Legally, I'd say its because my husband and I have already begun to build our life together, but we had fewer legal protections for that life without the legal marriage license. We have less to worry about now when the, "What if something happens to me?" type questions come up, and it's less of a hassle when you don't have to worry about who "officially" owns what. After all, as far as we're concerned, we share all of it anyways.

Emotionally, the official act of getting married was a public acknowledgment of the commitment we'd already made. Getting married, officially, brought our friends and family out to celebrate our love and devotion to one another and made them a part of our decision.

Socially, it is expected. The social reasons were pretty far down on the list, but it was important to our families that we eventually get married. And when we decide to have children, it will be even more important to them that we are married.

I have to be honest...if I asked, "Why do you want to get married?" and he replied, "I like ice sculpture," I think I would immediately start booking the hall and picking out flower arrangements. :D

Seriously, though, you're spot-on.
What if he said that because he had a weird sense of humor?
Benefits, duh.

It's the sex. ;)
Not really, but she won't until then, so kinda. She admits to it, too, though. lol Definitely one of the things she's looking forward to. :p Which is true for some who refuse because of religious beliefs. Children. Not a good reason, in my opinion. Seems to me the best condition for getting married is not needing to at all, but simply wanting to because of what that means to your lover. Otherwise, marriage wouldn't be an issue for me at all. I'll only do it for her. I feel it wouldn't change me in any essential way, so I wouldn't need it. But she does.
And yes, I have turned this into my own personal ramble with little contribution to the thread itself. :p

Why do people get married?

Lots of reasons, I got married, coz I love my wife. Is that too simple a reason?:D

Why do people get married?

Lots of reasons, I got married, coz I love my wife. Is that too simple a reason?:D

When my husband and I met with the reverend prior to getting married, she asked why we wanted to get married. It took both of us a while to come up with an answer, because it seemed so self-evident, and "I love him and I want to spend the rest of my life with him," seemed too simple. =)

Why do people get married?

Lots of reasons, I got married, coz I love my wife. Is that too simple a reason?:D

I'm afraid so.
*carts Peepelonia off to a ghulag*

Why do people get married?

for the massive party and a good excuse to take an expensive vacation somewhere. at least, that would be my reasoning should i ever go through with the marriage thing.

Why do people get married?

For the wedding gifts. Also some people feel that with a promise of togetherness forever they can feel secure. Also, tax reasons. Some do it so they don't get shit from family members or their churches I suppose.

I'm afraid so.
*carts Peepelonia off to a ghulag*

Umm they have beer there yeah?:p

To make repeated, unprotected sex socially acceptable.

Why do people get married?

Lots of reasons, I got married, coz I love my wife. Is that too simple a reason?:D

Would you have been unable to love her without getting married, or was it as a display of love?

Roughly 50% chance of divorce, and all the costs, lawyers, fun and games that entails.
In my experience, of those couples that don't divorce, you've got roughly 50% chance of living in misery.

I can't see any benefits of marriage, let alone any that warrant a 25% chance of non-failure. Especially when failure can be so bad.

isnt that more of a reason to avoid long term relationships of all sorts? its not the getting married part that makes you miserable. its your crappy relationship.

isnt it?

I love it when we get along! :)

hey, I got called a fem-nazi yesterday! I was so proud of myself.

ooooooo youve hit the big time!

what terrible thing did you do to deserve such an epithet?

isnt that more of a reason to avoid long term relationships of all sorts? its not the getting married part that makes you miserable. its your crappy relationship.

isnt it?

If it's just a crappy relationship you can just split up and move on. There's nothing trying to prevent that. And when you do, you don't have to worry about a spiteful ex nicking stuff.

ooooooo youve hit the big time!

what terrible thing did you do to deserve such an epithet?

I defended my friend's husband. They were having a debate of sorts in front of me and she asked my opinion, after I said that she didn't want it, and she said "no, you tell him I am right" and I said "actually he is right, either you are equal or you are not, and you have to choose, if you want to whine and complain and act like you are the weaker sex, then he is going to treat you like that, if you want to be treated as an equal you have to act as an equal"

she didn't like that. She called me "one of those people" to which my husband replied "feminist?" and she said "fem-nazi" and then went into a rant about how I was "ruining everything" and how I was "not feminine" enough......I think mostly she was pissed that I was right.

After a while hubby told her to shut up and grow up.

If it's just a crappy relationship you can just split up and move on. There's nothing trying to prevent that. And when you do, you don't have to worry about a spiteful ex nicking stuff.

as if its not painful to split up and move on?

as if ex girlfriends dont take your stuff? at least with divorce a judge will decide what she gets. if youve been living together for a long time, she can take whatever she can drag out the door and the courts arent likely to care. only those things that require legal title can be kept out of the hands of a vengeful ex.

Why do people get married?

first off, im gay, here in the states, means i cant get married. :(

i would like to marry a guy; i would do it so that he *and the kids?* can hopefully continue on after ive died.

on the flip-side of the coin, just because im gay does not mean i want special rights. i personally do NOT want one benefit more or less then the heterosexual couples.

i remember the holocaust by lighting a candle, not biaching to my gov't saying because of a bloody past, i want a red-carpet future.

Rafe
I.C. - Yes, a gay guy as leader of a country, and openly. :)

as if its not painful to split up and move on?
Painful, maybe, but you don't need a court's say-so.

as if ex girlfriends dont take your stuff? at least with divorce a judge will decide what she gets. if youve been living together for a long time, she can take whatever she can drag out the door and the courts arent likely to care. only those things that require legal title can be kept out of the hands of a vengeful ex.

Exactly... It's not like you'd stand there and let her take everything, is it? And if she managed to steal it you'd go and get it back. If you're really concerned you can plan accordingly; have the locks changed whilst she's at work, for instance. Obviously this wouldn't be necessary in any sensible situation, but we're dealing with humans here so best to plan for the worst.
Wheras if the judge decides that she should have something of yours, what're you going to do about it?

I defended my friend's husband. They were having a debate of sorts in front of me and she asked my opinion, after I said that she didn't want it, and she said "no, you tell him I am right" and I said "actually he is right, either you are equal or you are not, and you have to choose, if you want to whine and complain and act like you are the weaker sex, then he is going to treat you like that, if you want to be treated as an equal you have to act as an equal"

she didn't like that. She called me "one of those people" to which my husband replied "feminist?" and she said "fem-nazi" and then went into a rant about how I was "ruining everything" and how I was "not feminine" enough......I think mostly she was pissed that I was right.

After a while hubby told her to shut up and grow up.

oh good lord how do you keep your temper?

you warned her that she didnt want your opinion!

dunno if this has been said or not


shits and giggles

as if its not painful to split up and move on?

as if ex girlfriends dont take your stuff? at least with divorce a judge will decide what she gets. if youve been living together for a long time, she can take whatever she can drag out the door and the courts arent likely to care. only those things that require legal title can be kept out of the hands of a vengeful ex.

Not to mention the fact that if you've lived together long enough, ownership may not be clear anyways. One person may say the other is "nicking stuff" while that other person simply feels that they own it in the first place.

Even in roommate situations, ownership issues can get blurry. This is even more likely in a long-term relationship.

Why do people get married?

first off, im gay, here in the states, means i cant get married. :(

i would like to marry a guy; i would do it so that he *and the kids?* can hopefully continue on after ive died.

on the flip-side of the coin, just because im gay does not mean i want special rights. i personally do NOT want one benefit more or less then the heterosexual couples.

i remember the holocaust by lighting a candle, not biaching to my gov't saying because of a bloody past, i want a red-carpet future.

Rafe
I.C. - Yes, a gay guy as leader of a country, and openly. :)


"i would do it so that he and the kids can hopefully continue on after ive died"

what does that mean?

Not to mention the fact that if you've lived together long enough, ownership may not be clear anyways. One person may say the other is "nicking stuff" while that other person simply feels that they own it in the first place.

Even in roommate situations, ownership issues can get blurry. This is even more likely in a long-term relationship.

i guess i watch "judge judy" too often but over and over again people fight about whether something was a gift or not after they break up. its so impossible to tell (except for certain obvious gifts like jewelry and clothing) that the judge refuses to deal with it. what court would you even take it to if your ex gf took your playstation3 and big screen tv? unless you keep every receipt for every large purchase you make, how do you prove you bought it?

at least in a divorce its assumed to belong to both of you, with specific rules for when its not and is divided up on a more or less reasonable basis.

I'll do it eventually so I can have kids in some sort of stable environment (in theory... or at least so I won't have to raise them by myself) and so I don't wind up dying alone and being eaten by my 27 cats before the neighbours notice the smell.

Not to mention the fact that if you've lived together long enough, ownership may not be clear anyways. One person may say the other is "nicking stuff" while that other person simply feels that they own it in the first place.

Even in roommate situations, ownership issues can get blurry. This is even more likely in a long-term relationship.

Well, the minor things like "who bought the kettle", yes. But they're not really important. The important things; to me, my computer for instance, or my kitchen knife or saucepans (yes, really) will be remembered. I probably have receipts for anything important that wasn't a present, anyway. So the important things will be easy to divide up.

Room-mates? Ugh... I still praise Loki that I had a single room in my halls at university. I find the idea of sharing a room with an unknown stranger disturbing. Flat-mates you were already friends with could be bad enough...

what court would you even take it to if your ex gf took your playstation3 and big screen tv? unless you keep every receipt for every large purchase you make, how do you prove you bought it?

Who wouldn't keep the receipt for something like that?
Although if somebody was going to behave in that manner I'd feel no moral obligations towards them, and would simply treat them as any other thief.

Why do people get married?

first off, im gay, here in the states, means i cant get married.

Bullshit. You're either mistaken or a liar. I chose to believe it is the former and not the latter.

Who wouldn't keep the receipt for something like that?
Although if somebody was going to behave in that manner I'd feel no moral obligations towards them, and would simply treat them as any other thief.


i dont know what you mean by that but the police are not going to arrest your ex gf for "stealing" your stuff.

if she has it in her new home and you break in and take it back, the police will arrest YOU for breaking and entering.

all im saying is that you cant avoid psycho exes by not getting married. any long term relationship that fails will be troublesome no matter what your legal status.

I want to get married because I want to be with my best friend.
The legal protections are just a good by-product.

Being able to make emergency decisions regarding the health care of your loved one without having to wait for other next of kin is an unpleasant but sometimes necessary process.

"i would do it so that he and the kids can hopefully continue on after ive died"

what does that mean?

Getting married to someone usually makes them your next of kin and legal guardian to any kids you might have, so they can be the beneficiaries of life assurance polices and things of that nature.

Getting married to someone usually makes them your next of kin and legal guardian to any kids you might have, so they can be the beneficiaries of life assurance polices and things of that nature.

oh ok. that makes good sense

I want to get married because I want to be with my best friend.
The legal protections are just a good by-product.

Being able to make emergency decisions regarding the health care of your loved one without having to wait for other next of kin is an unpleasant but sometimes necessary process.

actually that is one of my new reasons.......I don't want my next of kin making any medical decisions for me, they are all a bunch of idiots and would not respect my wishes, hubby on the other hand, knows exactly why I want things done how I want them done and not only does he respect that, he agrees with me. ;)

Umm they have beer there yeah?:p
No. Only farming! Back to work, slave! *cracks whip*
isnt that more of a reason to avoid long term relationships of all sorts? its not the getting married part that makes you miserable. its your crappy relationship.

isnt it?
I would imagine it's the crappy relationship. I think sometimes it's that neither really knew the other as well as they thought, and they just couldn't manage to live together. They learned more than they liked.
Painful, maybe, but you don't need a court's say-so.
That's one part that I don't like. Legally, two people can be married, but one might have abandoned the other long ago. Or left an abusive situation. Or... etc...
I'll do it eventually so I can have kids in some sort of stable environment (in theory... or at least so I won't have to raise them by myself) and so I don't wind up dying alone and being eaten by my 27 cats before the neighbours notice the smell.

Oh, so you want to die with him, and be half-eaten by your 27 cats before the neighbors notice the smell. Gotcha. :p

Well, 1. My wife and I fell in love and we're old fashioned enough to want a wedding.

2. My wife wanted an American wedding to show off to her Japanese family and get them to do the chicken dance.

3. Legal protections for the both of us. Japanese society is FAR more conservative than US society and since we both want children; we more or less needed to be married for certain services for our kids to kick in (Little things like citzenship for example).

4. We don't want to be split up and neither Japan nor the US gives high priority for immigration visas for boyfriends or girlfriends of nationals. Husbands and wives are a different story though.

First off, I just want to say that I work for a major electronics retailer and have seen my fair share of stupid questions. This is not one of them.


Some want to do it for religious reasons. Some want to do it for tax purposes. Some want to do it to make it socially acceptable to have children. Some want to share the wealth. Some do it because society tells them they should, and others because they think it'll make them happy. Really, that's all fine and dandy with me, but none of them are the reason that I personally want to get married. That reason is:

I want to make a commitment. I want to commit my love undying and eternal to my future wife, to let her know that I'm willing to take care of her no matter what goes wrong. I'm making a commitment to her family, telling them that their daughter is safe in my hands, and that I'll never mistreat her. I'm making a commitment to all of her friends, so that they know that she's got someone to hang on to when they're not there. I'm making a commitment to my society, stating that the woman I'm with is the woman I'll be with forever. Sorry folks, we're off the market. We have found the people that we really like being around. She makes me smile when she walks in the room. She makes me think when she speaks. She makes a hell of a cheesy rice/chicken casserole. Most importantly, she appreciates me back.

So, folks, that's why people get married, right there. For everyone who tells me I'm deluded, thanks, but we're all playing a game where we are soverign dictators only to go back to our part time jobs and mediocre wages. Real life sucks, but you know what? She makes my real life suck a whole lot less when she's around.

Why are my fiancee and I getting married? Like many have said before, it's because a) we're best friends, b) we want to spend the rest of our lives with each other, c) religious reasons, and d) we want to make a public statement regarding our lifelong commitment to each other.

And also, as many have again said before, the legal benefits are, to us, simply a nice by-product.

On another note, two points/questions:

a) to the people who are citing divorce statistics as a reason not to get married: certainly the divorce statistics are pretty high these days. I've heard 40%, 50%, and in discussions with my colleagues, as high as 60% of marriage end in divorce. But certainly divorce isn't an inherent quality of a marriage, and certainly those percentages aren't set in stone like, say, the percentages of a coin flip. When a marriage occurs, it's not that there a 50% chance it'll end in divorce; the statistics are only regarding past divorce rates and cannot be applied to the future without acknowledging that they are merely descriptors, not predictors. (That was a point, not a question.)

b) Regarding those who do end up getting married for whatever reason, a question: I (perhaps incorrectly, I don't know) assume that most marriage ceremonies include the saying of vows to each other. My question is, if people don't mean them, why bother saying them? If you're of the mindset that "if this marriage doesn't work out, we'll just get a divorce and marry someone else", why bother saying things like "for richer or poorer", "in good times and bad", or "till death do us part"? Who are these people trying to fool? God (if they believe in God)? That's not very wise. Themselves? That's not very much wiser. The spouse or in-laws? That's treacherous and dishonest.

I mean, marriage HAS to be more than just "being in love", because if love is the whole thing, then the promise adds nothing. And if it adds nothing, why make it?

Besides that, the vows, made when a person's in love and because they're in love - to be true to the beloved as long as they live - commits them to being true even if they cease being in love. I mean, think about it: a promise must be made about actions that can be performed; no one can promise to go on feeling a certain way, any more than someone can promise never to feel hungry or never to have a headache.

Why do people get married?

So they can have sex all day, every day.

So they can have sex all day, every day.

You can't do that without marriage? Where would the fun be in that

I married Mrs Frisky for the presents and uncomplicated :fluffle: no need to go out and try :headbang:

Not to mention the fact that if you've lived together long enough, ownership may not be clear anyways. One person may say the other is "nicking stuff" while that other person simply feels that they own it in the first place.

Even in roommate situations, ownership issues can get blurry. This is even more likely in a long-term relationship.
That's one of the appeals of clear contracts, to me. Well-meaning people can sometimes end up fighting because they had different assumptions about a situation. Neither one was really wrong, they just weren't clear enough about how things were going to work.

My partner and I have a Mine, Yours, Ours system. Whenever a significant purchase is made, or some cool new toy enters our household, we identify if it is Mine, Yours, or Ours from the very beginning. Anything we owned prior to moving in together is considered our own stuff, and is assumed to belong to the individual it arrived with.

It's super simple, but we've actually found that it's really important to be clear about this stuff right away.

Why do people get married?

I am nearly 2 years into my marriage. Here are some reasons why:
-Dependability
-Financial
-Loyal Companion
-Romance
-Stability
-Solid foundation for family building

These are some of my reasons. Obviously they are different from person to person.

I am nearly 2 years into my marriage. Here are some reasons why:
-Dependability
-Financial
-Loyal Companion
-Romance
-Stability
-Solid foundation for family building

These are some of my reasons. Obviously they are different from person to person.

Totally don't mean any offense but reading 'Loyal Companion' makes me think of owning a dog and when I apply that to the rest of your reasons, well, it makes me giggle.

I'm childish that way.

That's one of the appeals of clear contracts, to me. Well-meaning people can sometimes end up fighting because they had different assumptions about a situation. Neither one was really wrong, they just weren't clear enough about how things were going to work.

My partner and I have a Mine, Yours, Ours system. Whenever a significant purchase is made, or some cool new toy enters our household, we identify if it is Mine, Yours, or Ours from the very beginning. Anything we owned prior to moving in together is considered our own stuff, and is assumed to belong to the individual it arrived with.

It's super simple, but we've actually found that it's really important to be clear about this stuff right away.

It may be important to you guys, but it really isn't to my husband and I. We are content with sharing just about everything - whether we had it before moving in together or not. I don't think of the car I bought as "my" car. It is our car. Our books have simply gotten mingled - we'd have a difficult time splitting the ones that aren't clearly related to our fields or individual interests up. And so on. We have no need for a yours, mine, and ours system because we share pretty much everything - and what we don't share, only one of us is interested in anyways.

It may be important to you guys, but it really isn't to my husband and I. We are content with sharing just about everything - whether we had it before moving in together or not. I don't think of the car I bought as "my" car. It is our car. Our books have simply gotten mingled - we'd have a difficult time splitting the ones that aren't clearly related to our fields or individual interests up. And so on. We have no need for a yours, mine, and ours system because we share pretty much everything - and what we don't share, only one of us is interested in anyways.
My partner and I are two very different people, personality-wise, but we share almost exactly the same interests. This makes for an awesome friendship, but also a lot of hassles.

Example: videogames.

I have this thing about leaving video game disks out of cases. I can't stand it. I've had favorite games get scratched and ruined because they weren't put away. Drives me nuts.

If there's a game he likes to play a lot, he'll usually just pop it out of the PS2 and set it on top of the console whenever we want to use it to run a DVD, and then pop the game disk back in when we're done.

Drives. Me. Nuts.

Personal quirk.

Our solution is that we know which games are mine and which are his. His games, he can leave out. My games, he puts away. We still share them, in that he never has to ask for permission to play my games, but he respects my quirk when it comes to my stuff.

We've found this is great because it allows us each to feel like we have our own "space" within our shared household. Plus, neither of us feel like we have to give up our personal comfort level!

Oh, so you want to die with him, and be half-eaten by your 27 cats before the neighbors notice the smell. Gotcha. :p

YEAH

wow, you really do understand marriage!

Why do people get married?

For me, it's gonna be two reasons:

1) To cement my love with Richard as a life-long and serious thing, and

2) To get him citizenship in this country so we can live together and get him a job immediately.

It may be important to you guys, but it really isn't to my husband and I. We are content with sharing just about everything - whether we had it before moving in together or not. I don't think of the car I bought as "my" car. It is our car. Our books have simply gotten mingled - we'd have a difficult time splitting the ones that aren't clearly related to our fields or individual interests up. And so on. We have no need for a yours, mine, and ours system because we share pretty much everything - and what we don't share, only one of us is interested in anyways.

I totally couldn't go that far. Our money? fine. Our house? great. My car. My movies. My IRA. I can handle a fair amount of sharing........but some things are mine, and some things are his. Even when his car broke and we sold it, it was MY JEEP, even if I let him use it freely and stuff, it was MINE!*

*you can chalk most of that up to me growing up in a house where everything was "ours" which meant that nothing was mine and the things I thought were mine got sold while I was at school for drugs.

I totally couldn't go that far. Our money? fine. Our house? great. My car. My movies. My IRA. I can handle a fair amount of sharing........but some things are mine, and some things are his. Even when his car broke and we sold it, it was MY JEEP, even if I let him use it freely and stuff, it was MINE!*

*you can chalk most of that up to me growing up in a house where everything was "ours" which meant that nothing was mine and the things I thought were mine got sold while I was at school for drugs.

which is why successful marriages take the individual into consideration. there is no one "correct" way to do things. what works for the people involved is what works.


you even have specific MOVIES?

which is why successful marriages take the individual into consideration. there is no one "correct" way to do things. what works for the people involved is what works.
yeah. ;)


you even have specific MOVIES?
well, they are all alphabetized and he doesn't keep his in much order so he has his movie folders and I have mine.....most of the movies were bought with his money, even most of mine since they were gifts. We don't really have to ask permission or anything, only just respect each other's movies.......like we are supposed to do with everything, but I don't loan out his movies and he doesn't loan out mine, and stuff like that.

*speaking of his money, after savings, bills, etc. we split up some of the stash to have "my own money" and so, he spends some of his on me, and I spend some of mine on him, and the kids stockpile theirs.......

*speaking of his money, after savings, bills, etc. we split up some of the stash to have "my own money" and so, he spends some of his on me, and I spend some of mine on him, and the kids stockpile theirs.......
My parents have always maintained separate checking accounts.

They have joint savings, and a lot of joint investments, of course, but they also both have their own accounts.

They've been together 30 years, so I figure it's an idea worth considering. :D

My parents have always maintained separate checking accounts.

They have joint savings, and a lot of joint investments, of course, but they also both have their own accounts.

They've been together 30 years, so I figure it's an idea worth considering. :D

we are kinda backwards on that........we have joint checking, then I have my own checking and he has his own checking and we have separate savings and stocks.

No idea. Finances, I guess. You know, tax breaks and everything...
You people are retarded. While a greedy few people may marry for tax breaks or the significant other's bling, marriage should be about finding a companion of the opposite sex, who you want to completetely open up to and consecrate yourself to.

we are kinda backwards on that........we have joint checking, then I have my own checking and he has his own checking and we have separate savings and stocks.
My folks always taught me that it's good and healthy for a couple to maintain some individual space, no matter how loving and close they are.

My mother, in particular, encouraged me to be very suspicious of people who talk about wanting to "become one" or "share everything." You aren't "one." You are two, individual, people. You are sharing a life together, and that's a whole lot to share, but you will always be separate people.

My dad helpfully put this lesson in terms I could understand even as a young child.

"See, honey, a marriage is kind of like Voltron. When things are serious, the Voltron lions come together and combine to form one super powerful robot. That robot is unstoppable and awesome. But they don't stay merged together as Voltron all the time."

That's how I look at my own relationship. We're always a team, but sometimes we're Him and Me and sometimes we're Us. We always are fighting the forces of evil (damn you, Prince Lotor!!), but we don't always merge into a single fighting unit. Sometimes we move around on our own.

My folks always taught me that it's good and healthy for a couple to maintain some individual space, no matter how loving and close they are.

My mother, in particular, encouraged me to be very suspicious of people who talk about wanting to "become one" or "share everything." You aren't "one." You are two, individual, people. You are sharing a life together, and that's a whole lot to share, but you will always be separate people.

My dad helpfully put this lesson in terms I could understand even as a young child.

"See, honey, a marriage is kind of like Voltron. When things are serious, the Voltron lions come together and combine to form one super powerful robot. That robot is unstoppable and awesome. But they don't stay merged together as Voltron all the time."

That's how I look at my own relationship. We're always a team, but sometimes we're Him and Me and sometimes we're Us. We always are fighting the forces of evil (damn you, Prince Lotor!!), but we don't always merge into a single fighting unit. Sometimes we move around on our own.

I totally get what you are saying. We refer to the family as "team <our last name>"

I can't stand the couples who think that if I go on a trip with my friends that "something is wrong in the marriage"

he can go out with the guys, I can go out with the girls........we aren't fighting, I don't know how hard that is to understand.

My folks always taught me that it's good and healthy for a couple to maintain some individual space, no matter how loving and close they are.

My mother, in particular, encouraged me to be very suspicious of people who talk about wanting to "become one" or "share everything." You aren't "one." You are two, individual, people. You are sharing a life together, and that's a whole lot to share, but you will always be separate people.

My dad helpfully put this lesson in terms I could understand even as a young child.

"See, honey, a marriage is kind of like Voltron. When things are serious, the Voltron lions come together and combine to form one super powerful robot. That robot is unstoppable and awesome. But they don't stay merged together as Voltron all the time."

That's how I look at my own relationship. We're always a team, but sometimes we're Him and Me and sometimes we're Us. We always are fighting the forces of evil (damn you, Prince Lotor!!), but we don't always merge into a single fighting unit. Sometimes we move around on our own.

Maybe I simply don't see our possessions as tied to our individuality. We share a lot of common interests and friends, but we aren't attached at the hip or anything. We have our own space, our own time, etc. In a sense, there are things that might seem to be just his or just mine because the other has little to no interest in them. But, with possessions, we just don't seem to need any active delineation.

Maybe I simply don't see our possessions as tied to our individuality. We share a lot of common interests and friends, but we aren't attached at the hip or anything. We have our own space, our own time, etc. In a sense, there are things that might seem to be just his or just mine because the other has little to no interest in them. But, with possessions, we just don't seem to need any active delineation.

what happens if all hell breaks loose and you need some cash? I mean seriously I love my boy, but I refuse to give up my IRA and he totally gets that....in fact, he contributes to it often, just so I have some plush in case everything breaks down (not that we plan on it)

as far as possessions, is that make-up yours or "ours"? wouldn't you be slightly miffed if you woke up in the middle of the night and he was using your lipstick to draw on the wall?

I can't stand the couples who think that if I go on a trip with my friends that "something is wrong in the marriage"

he can go out with the guys, I can go out with the girls........we aren't fighting, I don't know how hard that is to understand.

Some of my family found it really odd that I go out dancing and drinking with some of my male friends (although they found it slightly less odd when they realized 2 of them are gay). I don't know if they thought that my husband should go even though he really isn't interested in doing so or that I should stay home because he wasn't going. Either would seem goofy to me.

My folks always taught me that it's good and healthy for a couple to maintain some individual space, no matter how loving and close they are.

My mother, in particular, encouraged me to be very suspicious of people who talk about wanting to "become one" or "share everything." You aren't "one." You are two, individual, people. You are sharing a life together, and that's a whole lot to share, but you will always be separate people.

My dad helpfully put this lesson in terms I could understand even as a young child.

"See, honey, a marriage is kind of like Voltron. When things are serious, the Voltron lions come together and combine to form one super powerful robot. That robot is unstoppable and awesome. But they don't stay merged together as Voltron all the time."

That's how I look at my own relationship. We're always a team, but sometimes we're Him and Me and sometimes we're Us. We always are fighting the forces of evil (damn you, Prince Lotor!!), but we don't always merge into a single fighting unit. Sometimes we move around on our own.

Your father just single-handedly destroyed the entire genre of relationship help books...and using an anime predecessor in the analogy no less.

Now if only the rest of the world could get that thru their heads. It's somewhat annoying the idea that you give up everything that makes you "you" by getting married.

what happens if all hell breaks loose and you need some cash?

If I need some cash and can't get it, that means we're both in trouble. Most likely, then, his parents or mine would help us out.

I mean seriously I love my boy, but I refuse to give up my IRA and he totally gets that....in fact, he contributes to it often, just so I have some plush in case everything breaks down (not that we plan on it)

One shouldn't give up an IRA until one is ready to retire anyways. But when you're old and grey, if you guys need to pull that cash to live on, is it going to be "yours", or are you both going to use it?

as far as possessions, is that make-up yours or "ours"? wouldn't you be slightly miffed if you woke up in the middle of the night and he was using your lipstick to draw on the wall?

He's not interested in wearing makeup, so that would be one of the things that would be essentially mine. But, in reality, it was bought with our money, so it is ours. I would be miffed if he was drawing on the wall with it, but it wouldn't be a matter of, "ZOMG! You used my stuff!" It would be more like, "Why are you ruining the wall and leaving me with no makeup to put on tomorrow?"

One shouldn't give up an IRA until one is ready to retire anyways. But when you're old and grey, if you guys need to pull that cash to live on, is it going to be "yours", or are you both going to use it?
it's mine until I decide to do something else with it. If we need money later, I will choose what to do with it. It's not that I never share with him, it's that I do so willingly. (which is basically what you do, only you are more willing)

we are kinda backwards on that........we have joint checking, then I have my own checking and he has his own checking and we have separate savings and stocks.
Don't see what's wrong with that. My wife and I plan to do the same when we get back to the States (Japan has different views on household spending and I've given up fighting them).

Besides, it makes sense. Keep the joint for all those bills that need to be paid (Little things like the house morgage) and for food/kids and keep the seperate accounts for your own spending money.

If nothing else, it makes keeping the birthday/Christmas/Valentine's Day/annie presents a surprise MUCH easier.

You people are retarded. While a greedy few people may marry for tax breaks or the significant other's bling, marriage should be about finding a companion of the opposite sex, who you want to completetely open up to and consecrate yourself to.Why should any of what you said be limited to the opposite sex?

That's one of the appeals of clear contracts, to me. Well-meaning people can sometimes end up fighting because they had different assumptions about a situation. Neither one was really wrong, they just weren't clear enough about how things were going to work.

My partner and I have a Mine, Yours, Ours system. Whenever a significant purchase is made, or some cool new toy enters our household, we identify if it is Mine, Yours, or Ours from the very beginning. Anything we owned prior to moving in together is considered our own stuff, and is assumed to belong to the individual it arrived with.

It's super simple, but we've actually found that it's really important to be clear about this stuff right away.
Simple and effective: me likes.

My partner and I are two very different people, personality-wise, but we share almost exactly the same interests. This makes for an awesome friendship, but also a lot of hassles.

Example: videogames.

I have this thing about leaving video game disks out of cases. I can't stand it. I've had favorite games get scratched and ruined because they weren't put away. Drives me nuts.

If there's a game he likes to play a lot, he'll usually just pop it out of the PS2 and set it on top of the console whenever we want to use it to run a DVD, and then pop the game disk back in when we're done.

Drives. Me. Nuts.

Personal quirk.

Our solution is that we know which games are mine and which are his. His games, he can leave out. My games, he puts away. We still share them, in that he never has to ask for permission to play my games, but he respects my quirk when it comes to my stuff.

We've found this is great because it allows us each to feel like we have our own "space" within our shared household. Plus, neither of us feel like we have to give up our personal comfort level!
I have the same issues with discs. >.<

YEAH

wow, you really do understand marriage!
Why, thank you! ;)
My folks always taught me that it's good and healthy for a couple to maintain some individual space, no matter how loving and close they are.

My mother, in particular, encouraged me to be very suspicious of people who talk about wanting to "become one" or "share everything." You aren't "one." You are two, individual, people. You are sharing a life together, and that's a whole lot to share, but you will always be separate people.

My dad helpfully put this lesson in terms I could understand even as a young child.

"See, honey, a marriage is kind of like Voltron. When things are serious, the Voltron lions come together and combine to form one super powerful robot. That robot is unstoppable and awesome. But they don't stay merged together as Voltron all the time."

That's how I look at my own relationship. We're always a team, but sometimes we're Him and Me and sometimes we're Us. We always are fighting the forces of evil (damn you, Prince Lotor!!), but we don't always merge into a single fighting unit. Sometimes we move around on our own.
*worships Bottle and her father*

Your father just single-handedly destroyed the entire genre of relationship help books...and using an anime predecessor in the analogy no less.

Now if only the rest of the world could get that thru their heads. It's somewhat annoying the idea that you give up everything that makes you "you" by getting married.

QFT

Habit, I suppose. In my country, getting married is seen as the default. You're supposed to get married. If you aren't married by a certain age, people assume something is wrong with you.

Well, virtually every society in all of human history has some form of marriage. Yes, the whole "one man one woman for the purpose of creating children," is pretty much in the minority, but one member of that minority happened to gain the technological power to take over the world and impose its view of marriage (and almost everything else) on other societies.

Marriage of some sort is almost universal, and it appears that it's an expression of a natural drive that human beings have. It's just that society shapes that drive so that when we think "marriage," we tend not to think "a bunch of women who join together for security and keep a man or two around to protect the kids and perform the occasional carnal favor." We tend to think one man and one woman gaining kids, weight, and boredom.

Maybe I simply don't see our possessions as tied to our individuality. We share a lot of common interests and friends, but we aren't attached at the hip or anything. We have our own space, our own time, etc. In a sense, there are things that might seem to be just his or just mine because the other has little to no interest in them. But, with possessions, we just don't seem to need any active delineation.
I've already given you the example of our videogame disks. I don't really think about it as being "tied to our individuality" so much as "we have different personal quirks, and our quirks impact how we move through the physical world and interact with physical stuff."

That said, I think having your own space with a relationship is tied to your individuality. Having your own stuff is one facet of this. It's not the most important one (in my opinion), but it's important nonetheless.

Mainly because the "stuff" issues are usually those little trivial ones that gradually become pet peeves and eventually become festering bothers that start cropping up during fights about completely unrelated subjects. :D

Our relationship needs a lot more clear delineation because our interests overlap so much. For instance, if both of us decided to spend Saturday around the house doing whatever we feel like, odds are extremely high that we would--independently--choose to do exactly the same things.

This is great because it gives us so much in common, and we never have to strive to find things to do together.

This is not so great because it means that we have often found ourselves spending every waking hour together because we always seem to be wanting to do the same thing at the same time, and sometimes you need to have some time or space to yourself. It's hard to express that to the person you love without sounding mean. It's much easier when you've already sorted out that you each get your own space, into which you can quietly retreat when you need alone time.

You people are retarded. While a greedy few people may marry for tax breaks or the significant other's bling, marriage should be about finding a companion of the opposite sex, who you want to completetely open up to and consecrate yourself to.

What's THAT got to do with marriage??? :confused:
I've got a partner like that, but we're not married. We will get married once we decide to have kids, just to make the legal and financial bits a bit easier, but that's it.

I have been married, had the nice dress and the big party and I have also been an adulterous harlot living in sin and fornication. I like the second one better, because the wedding was only one day, it cost a lot and after a few years we realised that we didn't really like each other that much anymore. (well I mainly decided that he was a knob) and got divorced, which took 3 years and LOTS and LOTS of money (it cost me almost £50,000, I don't know what it cost him)....I don't want to do that again in a hurry. That said, I love and adore my boyfriend, we live together very happily, share chores, pool our money, take equal responsibility and even though we don't have the bit of paper from the state, we have a marriage of minds, soul, bodies and hearts...which to be honest is more than good enough for me.

I have mentioned before I think that we have thought of doing a hand fasting ceremony at the local neolithic standing stones one day....in lieu of the bit of paper.

Hospital visitation rights.

Still looking for honest answers:

Regarding those who do end up getting married for whatever reason, a question: I (perhaps incorrectly, I don't know) assume that most marriage ceremonies include the saying of vows to each other. My question is, if people don't mean them, why bother saying them? If you're of the mindset that "if this marriage doesn't work out, we'll just get a divorce and marry someone else", why bother saying things like "for richer or poorer", "in good times and bad", or "till death do us part"? Who are these people trying to fool? God (if they believe in God)? Themselves? Their spouse or in-laws? To me, that would seem quite foolish at best and rather treacherous and dishonest at worst.

Besides that, the vows, made when a person's in love and because they're in love - to be true to the beloved as long as they live - commits them to being true even if they cease being in love. I mean, think about it: a promise must be made about actions that can be performed; no one can promise to go on feeling a certain way, any more than someone can promise never to feel hungry or never to have a headache.

I mean, marriage HAS to be more than just "being in love", because if love is the whole thing, then the vows add nothing. But the question remains: if the vows add nothing, why make them at all?

Still looking for honest answers:

My guess is, simply because they're part of the ceremony. A surprisingly large number of people get married just for the ceremony, and those vows are part of that.

I met a woman yesterday who was so obssesed with the idea that she had to be married that she was already on the lookout for a new man 1 month after her husband died in a car accident... she'd tell anyone that talked to her for more than a second about her 7 year old daughter and all the other details. About how she was looking to meet a great guy and get married again.. scared the hell out of me with how insistent she was about remarriage...
Which of course made me ask the question why do I have to be nice?

I mean, marriage HAS to be more than just "being in love", because if love is the whole thing, then the vows add nothing. But the question remains: if the vows add nothing, why make them at all?
It makes the conservatives and old people happy. Hows that?

Hospital visitation rights.
I like that answer too

Clearly, the people involved had 55 hours to kill.

Regarding those who do end up getting married for whatever reason, a question: I (perhaps incorrectly, I don't know) assume that most marriage ceremonies include the saying of vows to each other. My question is, if people don't mean them, why bother saying them? If you're of the mindset that "if this marriage doesn't work out, we'll just get a divorce and marry someone else", why bother saying things like "for richer or poorer", "in good times and bad", or "till death do us part"? Who are these people trying to fool? God (if they believe in God)? That's not very wise. Themselves? That's not very much wiser. The spouse or in-laws? That's treacherous and dishonest.

I mean, marriage HAS to be more than just "being in love", because if love is the whole thing, then the promise adds nothing. And if it adds nothing, why make it?

Besides that, the vows, made when a person's in love and because they're in love - to be true to the beloved as long as they live - commits them to being true even if they cease being in love. I mean, think about it: a promise must be made about actions that can be performed; no one can promise to go on feeling a certain way, any more than someone can promise never to feel hungry or never to have a headache.
we wrote our own vows........

I promise to respect you, and to treat you like I want to be treated, I promise to listen before I judge and think before I speak, and I promise to talk to you before it's too late.

something like that, but more flowery.

as far as "being in love" I don't really think that what most people call love is love, it's more like a chemical reaction.......if you truly love someone you will treat them with respect even if you are pissed at them.

See? This is exactly the assumption I was talking about:

A person who looks at marriage critically is excluded from being "romantic."

"Romance" requires that one blindly accept the cultural norm of marriage.
:fluffle:Yips, that seems pretty unfair!:upyours:

See? This is exactly the assumption I was talking about:

A person who looks at marriage critically is excluded from being "romantic."


If romance is measured by the general consensus of what is and isn't romantic, then your views about marriage are not romantic. Deal with it.

If romance is measured by the general consensus of what is and isn't romantic, then your views about marriage are not romantic. Deal with it.
Darling, I've "dealt with" that idea. By concluding that, naturally, "romance" isn't measured by the general consensus, since I'm not remotely interested in romancing the general consensus. :D

we wrote our own vows........

I promise to respect you, and to treat you like I want to be treated, I promise to listen before I judge and think before I speak, and I promise to talk to you before it's too late.

something like that, but more flowery.

My folks did this as well. Their vows were about pledging to be dedicated, loyal, and loving companions, and to build a life together. Which they were already, of course, so the vows just sort of let the guests know about it. :)

Personally, if I ever were to get married, there would be a rule for the ceremony: the words "forever," "everlasting," and "eternal" cannot be used anywhere in the ceremony. We're mortal. Our love is not going to last forever, because we aren't going to last forever. I don't want to start off my marriage with a bunch of flowery lies.


as far as "being in love" I don't really think that what most people call love is love, it's more like a chemical reaction.......if you truly love someone you will treat them with respect even if you are pissed at them.
Oh man, do I ever agree with this!!!

Most people mistake infatuation for love. Infatuation is great, don't get me wrong, and it's certainly nothing to be ashamed of, but it's not love. Confusing the two is a great way to find yourself married and divorced within three years of meeting a person.

Most people mistake infatuation for love. Infatuation is great, don't get me wrong, and it's certainly nothing to be ashamed of, but it's not love. Confusing the two is a great way to find yourself married and divorced within three years of meeting a person.

I agree. I found it ridiculous when a friend told me he had proposed withing 2 months of meeting his future wife. Surely the marriage ceremony will mean even more if you wait a while to ensure it is the right choice for you

I agree. I found it ridiculous when a friend told me he had proposed withing 2 months of meeting his future wife. Surely the marriage ceremony will mean even more if you wait a while to ensure it is the right choice for you

I got married 5 weeks after my first date with hubby.....seems to be working out for us.

I figure we are the exception and not the rule though. ;)

I got married 5 weeks after my first date with hubby.....seems to be working out for us.

I figure we are the exception and not the rule though. ;)

Yeah some people get lucky that way but it is definitely risky :p

I got married 5 weeks after my first date with hubby.....seems to be working out for us.

I figure we are the exception and not the rule though. ;)

3 years 10 months and 20 days ;)

Yeah some people get lucky that way but it is definitely risky :p

yeah. It def. was.

everyone was saying "they won't make it 6 months" then we did and "they won't make it 2 years" and we did, and "they won't make it 5 years" and we did.

now they say "they are probably staying together to prove us wrong" :p

yeah. It def. was.

everyone was saying "they won't make it 6 months" then we did and "they won't make it 2 years" and we did, and "they won't make it 5 years" and we did.

now they say "they are probably staying together to prove us wrong" :p

You're lucky. My friends and family decided within a couple of months that my girlfriend and I were going to be together forever. Was very irritating when I hadn't decided that yet. Now we feel like breaking up just to spite them lol

yeah. It def. was.

everyone was saying "they won't make it 6 months" then we did and "they won't make it 2 years" and we did, and "they won't make it 5 years" and we did.

now they say "they are probably staying together to prove us wrong" :p

Pssh. If it wasn't how soon after you got together they'd think of something else.

For my family it started with how young we were, then how we were still in college, then when we graduated it was how we'd just graduated...and all this was before we were married.

After it was back to how young we were and at least one person asked why I was married if I didn't want children.

It's amazing how people will find whatever reason they can to think a marriage won't work.

I agree. I found it ridiculous when a friend told me he had proposed withing 2 months of meeting his future wife. Surely the marriage ceremony will mean even more if you wait a while to ensure it is the right choice for you

I'd instantly break up with anybody who proposed to me if we'd known each other less than five years. Nobody can possibly have learned about all my annoying habits in only a few years, and if they want to marry me they'd better be prepared and know exactly what they're getting into. :D

Pssh. If it wasn't how soon after you got together they'd think of something else.

For my family it started with how young we were, then how we were still in college, then when we graduated it was how we'd just graduated...and all this was before we were married.

After it was back to how young we were and at least one person asked why I was married if I didn't want children.

It's amazing how people will find whatever reason they can to think a marriage won't work.

one of my family members actually got my husband off to the side before we married and explained to him how I was "too independent" and how I was "probably a lesbian" because I "didn't bake" and tried to tell him he should marry someone else.......:mad: He explained to them that he liked my independence, and that if I was a lesbian he would hang with me anyway and also that he doesn't care much for cakes and cookies. :p

everyone was saying "they won't make it 6 months" then we did and "they won't make it 2 years" and we did, and "they won't make it 5 years" and we did.

now they say "they are probably staying together to prove us wrong" :p

Not implying anything about your relationship, but staying together proves nothing; my parents have been married for about thirty years, and either would kill the other if they thought they could get away with it.

I'd instantly break up with anybody who proposed to me if we'd known each other less than five years. Nobody can possibly have learned about all my annoying habits in only a few years, and if they want to marry me they'd better be prepared and know exactly what they're getting into. :D

It would take me about 5 years to get the money together for a wedding so i'm at no risk there. Stupid rings, etc.

Not implying anything about your relationship, but staying together proves nothing; my parents have been married for about thirty years, and either would kill the other if they thought they could get away with it.

yeah, I know. I promise you our relationship is fine. ;)

It would take me about 5 years to get the money together for a wedding so i'm at no risk there. Stupid rings, etc.

If the ring costs more than $300 USD, you're spending too much. I don't care what anyone says.

As for the wedding itself...well that's what daddy-in-law is for, gotta love tradition.

Not implying anything about your relationship, but staying together proves nothing; my parents have been married for about thirty years, and either would kill the other if they thought they could get away with it.
Yeah, that's something I hate about the US culture right now. Divorce automatically equals FAILURE!!!! Staying married equals success.

Fuck that noise. I consider my parents' marriage a success because they have stayed together over 30 years...and still actually LIKE each other. They still like to hang out together. They still cuddle (and probably other things I don't want to think about) and joke around and have fun.

And they still fight, of course. But they taught me how you can fight with a person and still love them. You can be angry and still respect somebody and be fair to them.

I know that my parents would divorce if they didn't want to be with each other any more. They don't see "being married" as something they must cling to, in and of itself.

It would take me about 5 years to get the money together for a wedding so i'm at no risk there. Stupid rings, etc.
Pfft, I won't even wear an engagement ring, and I'd only wear a simple metal band for a wedding ring. If my partner wants to give me a present if/when we get engaged, he can get me a PSP.

If the ring costs more than $300 USD, you're spending too much. I don't care what anyone says.

As for the wedding itself...well that's what daddy-in-law is for, gotta love tradition.

I'm going by the percentages tradition (although i'm still not sure what percentage of your income you're meant to spend) but i'm lucky in that i'm a bit of a rich kid (and have now automatically disqualified myself from a lot of debates by admitting that) so I can afford a bit more

I'm going by the percentages tradition (although i'm still not sure what percentage of your income you're meant to spend) but i'm lucky in that i'm a bit of a rich kid (and have now automatically disqualified myself from a lot of debates by admitting that) so I can afford a bit more

Afford is one thing. If you've got the money, how you want to blow it is your choice. But the idea that you have to spend 3 months salary for the ring is idiotic.

I got called cheap when I mentioned how much her ring cost...then they actually saw it. 1/3 karot makes for a nice stone.

Pfft, I won't even wear an engagement ring, and I'd only wear a simple metal band for a wedding ring. If my partner wants to give me a present if/when we get engaged, he can get me a PSP.

Apparently the DS lite is the way to my womans heart :p

Apparently the DS lite is the way to my womans heart :p

God, where do you people find these women? Between you and Bottle I'm starting to think I got the short end of the stick. :p

Afford is one thing. If you've got the money, how you want to blow it is your choice. But the idea that you have to spend 3 months salary for the ring is idiotic.

I got called cheap when I mentioned how much her ring cost...then they actually saw it. 1/3 karot makes for a nice stone.

The price wouldn't be my main priority when choosing the ring. If it was cheaper but mroe aesthetically pleasing i'd definitely get it and I have a real problem with people who could possibly judge the worth of a persons love by the jewellery they give.

Yeah, that's something I hate about the US culture right now. Divorce automatically equals FAILURE!!!! Staying married equals success.

Not just the US... And it's funny, because my mother would've been happy not getting married in the first place.
I don't think divorce == failure is the reason, it's that they both think that divorce would wind up as Mutually Assured Destruction of Cold-War-paranoia proportions. And, probably, it would.

The price wouldn't be my main priority when choosing the ring. If it was cheaper but mroe aesthetically pleasing i'd definitely get it and I have a real problem with people who could possibly judge the worth of a persons love by the jewellery they give.

I live in the US. Everything is determined by how much I spend.

Apparently the DS lite is the way to my womans heart :p
I sure love mine.

But I also love my PS2 and my Wii. I love all my "children" equally.