NationStates Jolt Archive

EDIT:
POSSIBLE LABELS
Hydesland, Jello Biafra suggests--Centrist,
Entropic Creation suggests--Christian Democrat.
Dashanzi (UK)--Suggests--Labour


I was thinking about politics, social ideas, issues that type of thing.

By the way excuse my pooor grammar I know I am a bad and yes, I am taking a class for it in the fall.

Anyway, back to my topic.

I was thinking about all this stuff, I note the political tests around here(I dont take them seriously but you see the idea behind them...label), i note how polarized it can be around here.

So I myself have always considered myself a conservative.
Not a republican, a conservative.

But I am not completely certain that fits...even fits better then anything else.

But I dont think that Liberal fits...but it doesnt not fit.

I had made a long list based on presidential issues as to what my opinion was but feck that.

I will list some things that come to mind and answer questions and I would like you folks to help me determine what political wing or arm or whatever fecking label it is I am supposed to have strapped to my back.

And by helping me we will better define at least what the people around actually believe something is instead of just using the labels.

I am really just curious.

here we go.

1. The United States needs some type of National Health Care System.

2. Social Security as we know it can be saved, it can have some minor reforms and it can work. But one key thing is that the money can not be touched for anything but Social Security.

3. The United States Military needs to be restructured for the modenr field of war, we need to move away from cold war thinking.

4. The current state of US foreign policy is nil, we have none. Or at least it is as much foreign policy as having a chimp throw its own feces at other countries leaders, ideals, and rights.

5. Civil rights under the patriot act and other policies related to the "War on Terror" have been eroded to a dangerous level and this trend must be reveresed, immediately and executive power must be curtailed.

6. Illegal immigration needs blanket reform, A free flow of Labor as control by the market and not old rich white men and xenophobic hystericals is required.
Brown people are no threat to American Values. The United States has never had an Official Language, it shouldnt have an Official language...that way the language can reflect the people, or more clearly...learn spanish you dumb fucks its the number one spoken language on North America...and it wouldnt kill you to expand your horizons a little bit.

7. I am against Abortion. Iwill nto say "Pro-Life" because that implies the opposition is "Pro-Death", nor will I justify the "Pro-Choice" crowd because that implies the opposition is "Anti-Choice". I do not feel abortion should be an Optional Procedure, the lfe of the mother must be indirect danger, physical danger. She must the victim of rape, or incest. To accomadate this Doctors should be allowed to represent young women in lieu of their parents so as to protect the child from potential abuse. A young girl who is potentially subject to an icestuous father or other relative should not be forced to go to these people for help or consent. Neither should she be expected to go to the police for the rape, I know I know the doctor is under obligation to report it...that would need to be changed. He should be forced to request permission of the patient. This enables the Doctor to cooly administer care to his patient without worry of the patient being drven away by legal bullshit. Not a popular idea around here I am sure.

8.The seperation of Church and State exists for a reason.
No where does it say politicians can not use thier faith as their guiding light, to temper their judgement. But they can not legislate based on religious doctrine. Religious doncrtine should be legislated, that leads down a dangerous slippery slope.

9. Taxes suck. But we need them, so suck it up.
Spending must be reduced and taxes at the very least can not be cut, for a very long time.

Thats all I could think of of the top of my head...I will answer any questions honestly without passion or restraint.

I siply ask that you who are judgin this...and that is what I am asking you to do.
Keep in mind I am not looking for a debate...I know people dont agree with me. I asking you to take all the points I offer and put them together to say what I am; Left-wing, Right-wing, Conservative, Liberal...what ever.

If you cant get passed a single issue because you are passionate about it...then exclude the issue from your opinion and ask a question about another issue.

YES, I am fecking bored.

I'd call you a centrist. Can't really think of anything else that fits. Maybe you should look at right libertarianism.

Must everything be about the USA?

Must everything be about the USA?

Pretty much. :)

Must everything be about the USA?

...I live in the USA. why would my politics be about Tabago or Chile if I live in the USA. Why should my Politics include Lesotho if I live in the USA.

What difference does my opinion on French Guianna make since i live in the USA.

Or are you just being picky because I wasnt talking about Europe?

How about since I said I would answer questions you ask me question about more details about my atittudes towards certain european issues?

A political label can't describe all opinions a person holds because real people are usually not exact copies of stereotypes. When you don't have time to explain all your different opinions just pick the stereotype you want people to assume you agree with. Scales like left-right or libertarian-authoritarian aren't good measurements either. I'm all over the scales, right on some issues but left on others.

Don't worry about it. It's ok to not be an exact copy of any specific stereotype.

I was thinking about politics, social ideas, issues that type of thing.

By the way excuse my pooor grammar I know I am a bad and yes, I am taking a class for it in the fall.

Anyway, back to my topic.

I was thinking about all this stuff, I note the political tests around here(I dont take them seriously but you see the idea behind them...label), i note how polarized it can be around here.

So I myself have always considered myself a conservative.
Not a republican, a conservative.

But I am not completely certain that fits...even fits better then anything else.

But I dont think that Liberal fits...but it doesnt not fit.

I had made a long list based on presidential issues as to what my opinion was but feck that.

I will list some things that come to mind and answer questions and I would like you folks to help me determine what political wing or arm or whatever fecking label it is I am supposed to have strapped to my back.

And by helping me we will better define at least what the people around actually believe something is instead of just using the labels.

I am really just curious.

here we go.

1. The United States needs some type of National Health Care System.

2. Social Security as we know it can be saved, it can have some minor reforms and it can work. But one key thing is that the money can not be touched for anything but Social Security.

3. The United States Military needs to be restructured for the modenr field of war, we need to move away from cold war thinking.

4. The current state of US foreign policy is nil, we have none. Or at least it is as much foreign policy as having a chimp throw its own feces at other countries leaders, ideals, and rights.

5. Civil rights under the patriot act and other policies related to the "War on Terror" have been eroded to a dangerous level and this trend must be reveresed, immediately and executive power must be curtailed.

6. Illegal immigration needs blanket reform, A free flow of Labor as control by the market and not old rich white men and xenophobic hystericals is required.
Brown people are no threat to American Values. The United States has never had an Official Language, it shouldnt have an Official language...that way the language can reflect the people, or more clearly...learn spanish you dumb fucks its the number one spoken language on North America...and it wouldnt kill you to expand your horizons a little bit.

7. I am against Abortion. Iwill nto say "Pro-Life" because that implies the opposition is "Pro-Death", nor will I justify the "Pro-Choice" crowd because that implies the opposition is "Anti-Choice". I do not feel abortion should be an Optional Procedure, the lfe of the mother must be indirect danger, physical danger. She must the victim of rape, or incest. To accomadate this Doctors should be allowed to represent young women in lieu of their parents so as to protect the child from potential abuse. A young girl who is potentially subject to an icestuous father or other relative should not be forced to go to these people for help or consent. Neither should she be expected to go to the police for the rape, I know I know the doctor is under obligation to report it...that would need to be changed. He should be forced to request permission of the patient. This enables the Doctor to cooly administer care to his patient without worry of the patient being drven away by legal bullshit. Not a popular idea around here I am sure.

8.The seperation of Church and State exists for a reason.
No where does it say politicians can not use thier faith as their guiding light, to temper their judgement. But they can not legislate based on religious doctrine. Religious doncrtine should be legislated, that leads down a dangerous slippery slope.

9. Taxes suck. But we need them, so suck it up.
Spending must be reduced and taxes at the very least can not be cut, for a very long time.

Thats all I could think of of the top of my head...I will answer any questions honestly without passion or restraint.

I siply ask that you who are judgin this...and that is what I am asking you to do.
Keep in mind I am not looking for a debate...I know people dont agree with me. I asking you to take all the points I offer and put them together to say what I am; Left-wing, Right-wing, Conservative, Liberal...what ever.

If you cant get passed a single issue because you are passionate about it...then exclude the issue from your opinion and ask a question about another issue.

YES, I am fecking bored.

Why label yourself?

Seems like you are a centrist democrat with the exception of abortion.

1. Implementing NHS is a very leftists plan.

2. SS needing reform is everyone; making even minor changes can lead to political death so that is why it is never reformed as no politician really wants to push hard on it and risk killing his career. no directional change.

3. Modernizing the military is another universal issue - the only debates are on the practicalities of how to accomplish it. Defense contractors have enough lobbying strength plus those cold-war type projects are boondoggles to pay off a politician by spending in their district. no directional change.

4 & 5. All but the neo-cons and scared soccer-moms (who tend to be lefties) agree. Thus its a wash.

6. Only union workers and rednecks disagree with better immigration - once again there are significant elements on both sides. Unless you are advocating completely uncontrolled borders - that puts you in the realm of 'looney who doesnt put any actual thought into an idea'.

7. that is very christian-right. the individual rights and personal responsibility contingent of the right strongly disagrees that its your decision to make, but the religious nuts will love you until you lose them with...

8. fairly universal, only religious fundamentalist types disagree.

9. libertarians are the only ones that disagree there, and most of us still acknowledge that the government must perform some function and thus will need some income, but if you cut away all the crap that is a low enough number not to tax the hell out of everyone.


If I had to use those issues to label you, I would call you a Christian Democrat. (Non-Americans take note: there is no Christian Democrat party, this is a Democrat with a political stance influenced by 'Christian values').

I dont know why someone suggested right libertarian as you are quite opposed to libertarian ideals especially with 1, 2, and 7.

...I live in the USA. why would my politics be about Tabago or Chile if I live in the USA. Why should my Politics include Lesotho if I live in the USA.

What difference does my opinion on French Guianna make since i live in the USA.

Or are you just being picky because I wasnt talking about Europe?

How about since I said I would answer questions you ask me question about more details about my atittudes towards certain european issues?

Who said that I'm European?

There are such things as global issues, you know. And yes I do have opinions on what happens in other countries, the opinions on the inner workings of the USA of its citizens is just as unimportant as those outside of it.

Okay, I'll bite.

1. The United States needs some type of National Health Care System.
Socialism is terrific, but only on a very small scale. The fact that medium- and large-scale socialism is unworkable has repeatedly been empirically demonstrated.

The problem with the health care system is not that it doesn't have enough government in it, but that it has too much.

2. Social Security as we know it can be saved, it can have some minor reforms and it can work.
Social Security is doomed; it's not a controversial issue, it's a simple matter of mathematics. If you're 40 or younger, you're not going to see a penny of what you're paying in. These days it's simply an Old People Tax.

3. The United States Military needs to be restructured for the modenr field of war, we need to move away from cold war thinking.
The United States military needs to be privatized.

4. The current state of US foreign policy is nil, we have none. Or at least it is as much foreign policy as having a chimp throw its own feces at other countries leaders, ideals, and rights.
Okay.

5. Civil rights under the patriot act and other policies related to the "War on Terror" have been eroded to a dangerous level and this trend must be reveresed, immediately and executive power must be curtailed.
Have your secretary type it up and I'll sign it.

6. Illegal immigration needs blanket reform, A free flow of Labor as control by the market and not old rich white men and xenophobic hystericals is required.
The driving factors behind illegal immigration are the minimum wage and entitlements for the poor. Both should be abolished.

7. I am against Abortion.
Me too (I believe it's tantamount to murder), but I have yet to see a law prohibiting it that I thought A) would do the job, and B) wouldn't have appalling unintended consequences.

8.The seperation of Church and State exists for a reason.
Yes, but I'll go further. The separation of church and state isn't a legal matter, it's a simple requirement of the general nature of things. If you combine church and state, your church ceases to have anything spiritual or moral about it and becomes the state.

9. Taxes suck. But we need them, so suck it up.
Taxation is theft. Taxes are unnecessary and immoral.

How's that?

Who said that I'm European?

There are such things as global issues, you know. And yes I do have opinions on what happens in other countries, the opinions on the inner workings of the USA of its citizens is just as unimportant as those outside of it.

It depends when you're on. When you're on at the right time people will discuss British or European issues, or at another time Australian issues. Having his issues be relevant to where he lives isn't unreasonable. Not every thread can encompass or be relevant to everybody. That's why the front page is so long.

Why label yourself?

Labels are great! Imagine how difficult how it would be to discuss topics without a scapegoat or gross misrepresentation of the other person. If there were no labels, critical thought would become an unbearable burden.

A political label can't describe all opinions a person holds because real people are usually not exact copies of stereotypes. When you don't have time to explain all your different opinions just pick the stereotype you want people to assume you agree with. Scales like left-right or libertarian-authoritarian aren't good measurements either. I'm all over the scales, right on some issues but left on others.

Don't worry about it. It's ok to not be an exact copy of any specific stereotype.

You're absolutely correct and I am not worried about it. But dont you think that having people actually sit down and attempt to quantify what someone is based on the sum of their beliefs aids in dispelling the concepts that have polarized our society?

I mean I realize this is tedious, but truly, I call myself a conservative...but am I? Not by that list of 9 things. Yet on a single issue one might try to pigeon hold me into that role...then everytime I speak all they will is their polarized opposite, their adversary yet there is no real reason for there to be an adversarial nature between two people or two groups of people because as you stated...no one fits the cookie cutter exactly.

Just trying to have a fun exercise in killing generalizations.

Most people don't fit neatly into one category. Like, I'm pro-choice and support gay marriage, two stereotypically liberal positions, but I'm also very staunchly pro death penalty, a stereotypically conservative position.

Who said that I'm European?

There are such things as global issues, you know. And yes I do have opinions on what happens in other countries, the opinions on the inner workings of the USA of its citizens is just as unimportant as those outside of it.

Yes there are. Note you didnt ask a question you just kept ranting.
Well, if you live in the USA and you dont care about its inner workings then you are stupid, and you deserve what ever society hands you. Period.
However, if you are not in the USA then why care? I dont expect anyone who isnt int he USA to give a damn about US internals...which is why most wouldnt even bother posting. I didnt ask you to waste your time jabbering about something you thought was meaningless and unimportant...you wasted that time all by yourself. So now, yet again if you have anything even remotely related to the thread, then by all means. If want to continue to waste your time...feel free but I dont see the point.

Oh, that reminds me.

I am very much in favor of a punitive gas tax to force change in the market.
The petroleum dependence and gluttony in the US wont end until it is taxed to death.

BIodiesels and electrics, and alternate power i am very much PRO.

The Death Penalty iam also very much pro...I think appeals should be limited and five years should be a long time on death row.

I also believe Rape where force is used should be punished by execution as well as pedophiles, children under 14 can not be considered to have consented in any real way.

Seems like you are a centrist democrat with the exception of abortion.

1. Implementing NHS is a very leftists plan.

2. SS needing reform is everyone; making even minor changes can lead to political death so that is why it is never reformed as no politician really wants to push hard on it and risk killing his career. no directional change.

3. Modernizing the military is another universal issue - the only debates are on the practicalities of how to accomplish it. Defense contractors have enough lobbying strength plus those cold-war type projects are boondoggles to pay off a politician by spending in their district. no directional change.

4 & 5. All but the neo-cons and scared soccer-moms (who tend to be lefties) agree. Thus its a wash.

6. Only union workers and rednecks disagree with better immigration - once again there are significant elements on both sides. Unless you are advocating completely uncontrolled borders - that puts you in the realm of 'looney who doesnt put any actual thought into an idea'.

7. that is very christian-right. the individual rights and personal responsibility contingent of the right strongly disagrees that its your decision to make, but the religious nuts will love you until you lose them with...

8. fairly universal, only religious fundamentalist types disagree.

9. libertarians are the only ones that disagree there, and most of us still acknowledge that the government must perform some function and thus will need some income, but if you cut away all the crap that is a low enough number not to tax the hell out of everyone.


If I had to use those issues to label you, I would call you a Christian Democrat. (Non-Americans take note: there is no Christian Democrat party, this is a Democrat with a political stance influenced by 'Christian values').

I dont know why someone suggested right libertarian as you are quite opposed to libertarian ideals especially with 1, 2, and 7.

Interesting. Do have any questions that migh further that opinion or dispell it?

Oh, that reminds me.

I am very much in favor of a punitive gas tax to force change in the market.
The petroleum dependence and gluttony in the US wont end until it is taxed to death.

BIodiesels and electrics, and alternate power i am very much PRO.

The Death Penalty iam also very much pro...I think appeals should be limited and five years should be a long time on death row.

I also believe Rape where force is used should be punished by execution as well as pedophiles, children under 14 can not be considered to have consented in any real way.


Execution of paedophiles...no matter how disgusting the act may be, there's no way in hell it warrants a death penalty unless it turns into a murder case.

Execution of paedophiles...no matter how disgusting the act may be, there's no way in hell it warrants a death penalty unless it turns into a murder case.

...did you bother to read the OP?

I am not going to discuss the issue I gave my stance.

Must everything be about the USA?Well, good luck finding something out of the reach of capitalism and the pseudo-morality dagger it's been gleaning for so long.

I'd agree that you're a centrist Democrat, except on the kneejerk pedophilia issue.

I'd agree that you're a centrist Democrat, except on the kneejerk pedophilia issue.

I have four kids.
I have family member serving what amounts to 150 year sentence for raping children...other family members.


My reaction is not knee jerk. I loved my cousin, and I would put a bullet in his brain myself.


Extermination is the only logical alternative in my book.

However thank for your input. I appreciate your opinion. And, also for keeping on track with the idea of the thread.

If you were in the UK in the 1960's, you'd be firmly in the Labour camp. Left-leaning economic policy alongside social conservatism. The case for social liberalism was only successfully made (in Britain at least) in more recent times.

I'd say you're the kind of person the Democrats should be trying to win over if they have any hope of winning the next US election.

Nice.
A foreign perspective based on what amounts to US issues...that you for your input. I appreciate you commenting especially given its on non-issues to you.