NationStates Jolt Archive

A group of seven show-pigeon breeders were accused of killing scores of birds of prey, and apprehended by the Fish and Wildlife services about a week ago:

http://www.pe.com/localnews/environment/stories/PE_News_Local_D_hawks25.3e9ca9f.html

I only wish that everyone that perpetrated these types of crimes could be caught.. not only are raptors beautiful birds, but they're protected for a reason. They're important parts of any ecosystem, weeding out vermin, and their position as top level predators means that, if there's a contaminant in the food chain, raptors are a good place to look for it.

It's a bittersweet story, though; these men may have been caught, but there are many more out there like them, and no sentence can ever undo what's already been done:

In this particular case, the raptors were shot in traps, beaten or suffocated after being sprayed with a bleach and ammonia solution that created a poisonous chlorine gas, according to court records. Bullet-riddled hawk carcasses were recovered from some of the homes and one defendant told an undercover agent that he had filled a five-gallon bucket with talons that he had cut from slain hawks.

http://www.pe.com/imagesdaily/2007/05-25/hawks25a_400.jpg

I implore anyone here, if they know of people doing or planning such things, to contact their local authorities. Prove to me that you got someone convicted and I will personally send you fifty dollars!

What about the pigeons?

What about the pigeons?

You can't tell a hawk not to eat a pigeon, especially when said pigeon is bred to be functionally retarded:

He called the crimes ironic because pigeon hobbyists inbreed a genetic defect that causes the birds to seize up and tumble in flight. He said that makes them appear to be distressed and an easy target for predators.

"These hobbyists are breeding hawk and falcon food," he said.

If you're getting into a hobby that involves taking bird food outside and swinging it around, expect to lose that food. The raptors are doing what comes naturally to them; if you walk into a lion enclosure wearing raw meat, you should expect to be eaten.

Moreover, it's against the law to shoot them to begin with, so "What about the pigeons?" isn't a valid excuse.

What about the pigeons?

They'll get eaten by predators, or just die.

They'll get eaten by predators, or just die.

What Ifreann said. Pigeons, even if they are cute, are a prey species, foremost the target of falcons and, to a lesser extent, hawks. Again, if you're going to breed them, find a place that doesn't have a raptor population, or be prepared to take heavy losses.

What Ifreann said. Pigeons, even if they are cute, are a prey species, foremost the target of falcons and, to a lesser extent, hawks. Again, if you're going to breed them, find a place that doesn't have a raptor population, or be prepared to take heavy losses.

Are there any nonlethal ways to protect pigeons from raptors?

Are there any nonlethal ways to protect pigeons from raptors?

Breed them somewhere with no or very few raptors.

You can't tell a hawk not to eat a pigeon, especially when said pigeon is bred to be functionally retarded:

You also can't tell a fox not to eat chickens.



If you're getting into a hobby that involves taking bird food outside and swinging it around, expect to lose that food.


If you're getting into a hobby that involves taking fox food outside and swinging it around, expect to lose that food.

Applies to free range chickens.

You also can't tell a fox not to eat chickens.




If you're getting into a hobby that involves taking fox food outside and swinging it around, expect to lose that food.

Applies to free range chickens.

You can protect the chickens with a sturdy, high fence and/or a mesh 'ceiling'. I believe, in this case, the pigeons were taken while being trained outdoors.

I also wouldn't call chicken farming a hobby, as in most cases it's done to make a living.

Hear hear. Kudos to the judge, jury and police who brought these felons to justice.

The most disgusting thing about this case is that not only where these protected and endangered birds being hunted, but brutalised and mangled. These men are quite twisted minded.

Hear hear. Kudos to the judge, jury and police who brought these felons to justice.

The most disgusting thing about this case is that not only where these protected and endangered birds being hunted, but brutalised and mangled. These men are quite twisted minded.

It's good to see a like-minded individual who shares my distaste for such things. :D

You can protect the chickens with a sturdy, high fence and/or a mesh 'ceiling'. I believe, in this case, the pigeons were taken while being trained outdoors.

I also wouldn't call chicken farming a hobby, as in most cases it's done to make a living.

Pigeons are also sometimes traded for money.

My father had 2 cats in Moldova when he was a child that were killed by pigeon raisers (I don't know the proper name) because they were at the time afraid of cats for the same reasons.

Pigeons are also sometimes traded for money.

My father had 2 cats in Moldova when he was a child that were killed by pigeon raisers (I don't know the proper name) because they were at the time afraid of cats for the same reasons.

"Sometimes traded for money" does not equate to a family-supporting income; besides, those in the article were hobbyists, breeding pigeons to do acrobatic stunts.

And then selling them?

And then selling them?

No, and then entering into competitions with them. And before you say it, the prize money isn't anywhere near substantial enough to support someone, even if they were to win more than once. It's much more akin to dog shows.

In my opinion, the pigeon handlers brought it onto themselves. Not only did they purposely breed in pigeons so that they would be less effective in flight, they bred them in an area were any number of predators can catch and kill them.

What about the pigeons?

who care's? they aren't endangered, they are vermin. and they are prey.

No, and then entering into competitions with them. And before you say it, the prize money isn't anywhere near substantial enough to support someone, even if they were to win more than once. It's much more akin to dog shows.

The point is, the pigeons are worth a lot of money and effort.

It's understandable that people want to protect them.

The point is, the pigeons are worth a lot of money and effort.

It's understandable that people want to protect them.

That's too bad, to be perfectly frank. Raptors are far more endangered than pigeons.

The point is, the pigeons are worth a lot of money and effort.

It's understandable that people want to protect them.

There's a difference between protecting group A from group B...

... and purposefully exterminating and mutilating group B so group A is never hurt.

Yeah, like people carry out massive wolf hunts and bear hunts.

I really could care less about the pigeons or the hawks, it's the people I am interested in.

Yeah, like people carry out massive wolf hunts and bear hunts.

I really could care less about the pigeons or the hawks, it's the people I am interested in.

pigeon fanciers are morons.

The point is, the pigeons are worth a lot of money and effort.

It's understandable that people want to protect them.

They're little more than rats. That they get eaten by more useful animals is scarcely a tragedy.

Yeah, like people carry out massive wolf hunts and bear hunts.

I really could care less about the pigeons or the hawks, it's the people I am interested in.

Then you're interested in fools. Far more people benefit from having the hawks around as an ecological indicator and pest eradicator, not to mention as a source of entertainment (they're quite a sight to watch), then these pigeon-obsessed idiots would benefit from not having them around.

They're little more than rats. That they get eaten by more useful animals is scarcely a tragedy.

Look, I carry no portfolio for pigeons as a species. Or rats.

But had you been raising Very Expensive Rats Of Doom and cats tried to eat them, wouldn't you have been... angry?

Then you're interested in fools. Far more people benefit from having the hawks around as an ecological indicator and pest eradicator, not to mention as a source of entertainment (they're quite a sight to watch), then these pigeon-obsessed idiots would benefit from not having them around.

Mmmm, I thought you liked all birds.

Mmmm, I thought you liked all birds.

I like rats. I think they're cute. They're also technically vermin.

I like rats, but I wouldn't exterminate all the Ospreys in Scotland so they'd never get eaten. I also wouldn't live in a cabin breeding rats right next to an Osprey reserve.

Mmmm, I thought you liked all birds.

I do, but hawks killing pigeons for food is natural; people mangling hawks because they're stupid enough to fly retarded pigeons around them is not.

That's too bad, to be perfectly frank. Raptors are far more endangered than pigeons.
Plus, pigeons suck. Even in the "wild," all they do is crap and eat things, in that order.

Look, I carry no portfolio for pigeons as a species. Or rats.

But had you been raising Very Expensive Rats Of Doom and cats tried to eat them, wouldn't you have been... angry?

I love birds. I'd love to have a couple of budgies or finches.. but do you know why I don't? Because I have three cats. Yes, it's disappointing that I can't have birds. But you know what? It's also smart not to bring small, edible birds into a house full of big, hungry cats. In fact, it's not just smart, it's common sense.