NationStates Jolt Archive

Basically, name your villain, describe him a bit (or give a link to a description), and why he is so great.

I nominate Sylar (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sylar) of Heroes. He is a serial killer with superpowers, who targets others with superpowers. After using telekinesis to slice open their skulls, he removes their brains, and in doing so steals their powers. He is totally evil, totally determined, and not only is he almost unstoppable, but when he does get stopped, it is going to be so awesome.

Darth Vader (NOT HAYDEN CHRISTENSON!)

Refutation:
Vader is a classic villain, but he has a sense of duty to the Empire and to his master. Sylar cares only about himself. Also, Vader has only been seen to kill enemies and subordinates. Sylar kills innocents, and, frankly, while force choking to death is cool, it doesn't hold a candle to SLICING SOMEONE'S HEAD OPEN WITH TELEKINESIS.

Refutation:
Vader is a classic villain, but he has a sense of duty to the Empire and to his master. Sylar cares only about himself. Also, Vader has only been seen to kill enemies and subordinates. Sylar kills innocents, and, frankly, while force choking to death is cool, it doesn't hold a candle to SLICING SOMEONE'S HEAD OPEN WITH TELEKINESIS.

Caring about only about yourself doesn't make you a cool villian. I'd vote fo Napoleon for the best real-life villian. Maglomaniac, Genius, attempting to take over the world. And yet still along the way he reforms his conquered nations and although he's a dictator he stood for freedom to many people. Comparable in many ways to Marvel's Doctor Doom.

For the most evil fictional? Your silly Sylar doesn't hold a candle to D.C.'s Joker. The Joker in the movies and cartoons gives a mere taste of the REAL Joker. Another choice is Minos, the arch-enemy of Theseus. After his daughter cofessed she was raped in tears, he kicked her to death saying that she probably liked it. After he got bored of his numerous wives and lovers, he kidnapped boys for his own peverted pleasure, puttinmg them to death when they reached age ten. Later, he attack Athens and demanded tribute of 7 maidens and 7 boys each year for sacrifice to his monster, the Minotaur. This is where Theseus steps in...

http://metaphorge.cyber1a.net/unicron/unicron2005poster.jpg

...the date is a bit off, but you get the idea. :p

I nominate the UNBEATABLE, INDESTRUCTABLE, UNWAVERING, ULTRA- INTELLIGENT, DASHING, and of course who could forget smashing

DR. Evil

Hmm... I feel this urge to nominate a science fiction villain... but most sci-fi villains are too campy to really qualify (see Star Wars, Stargate, and Star Trek)... the Cylons don't really fit... Babylon 5 didn't really have villains as such... am I missing someone?... wait, I know!

EX-TER-MI-NATE!

EX-TER-MI-NATE!

EX-TER-MI-NATE!

EX-TER-MI-NATE!

Need I say more?

it all depends on the Definition of Greatest.

for me, it's power, style. honor, and class. so Joker, while a manical genius, lacks the Honor.

Classic Magneto however, has a goal and he always kept that goal in mind and held everyone to his standards... including himself. Example: When he almost killed Kitty Pryde, he actually stop the fight, he then realized that he was acting like those that he was fighting against, and just fled. even tho he was winning, because he did something that he abhorred, gave up that fight.

Ras Al Ghul one of the few villans who discovered Batman's secret Identity. However, that knowledge he kept a secret from other villans. As long as Batman was the one that chased Ras, then Batman was the one he faced. But should Bruce Wayne come after Ras, then Bruce Wayne would be his opponent. Also, he also had the dignity to come to Batman when he needed help.

Murdock from McGuyver. For Him, killing McGuyver was personal. but he always kept it sportmanlike in his conduct.

Thanos another villan with Class. with Thanos, you never know what he'll be getting out of any assistance he gives you. And Thanos always keeps his word.

Reinhard Von Lohengrim and Yang Wen-Li not villians per se. but key figures in Ginga eiyû densetsu (Legends of the Galactic Heroes) Each belonged to the opposing military, when their fleets met in combat, the dance of tactics makes it artistic and each considers the other their equal. when they finally met face-to-face, that to was a brilliant dance of diplomacy that left both men feeling more like friends instead of enemies.

the greatest hasn't yet made it to movies or TV.

The second greatest however, is the jerk who decided Data needed to die and so wrote it into the script of Star Trek Nemisis. that replacement is just phony.

Really though, I would have to go with Q, the one John de Lancie plays. Not that Q is actually Evil, but, well, in a way he is. The point is, very few have ever inspired such outrage in me, at myself. The Crimes and deeds we have commited, Q was right, we do deserve to be destroyed, and we're doing a jolly good job at destroying ourselves too.

Other than that, I go with the Borg.

Hmm... I feel this urge to nominate a science fiction villain... but most sci-fi villains are too campy to really qualify (see Star Wars, Stargate, and Star Trek)... the Cylons don't really fit... Babylon 5 didn't really have villains as such... am I missing someone?... wait, I know!

EX-TER-MI-NATE!

EX-TER-MI-NATE!

EX-TER-MI-NATE!

EX-TER-MI-NATE!

Need I say more?

yup. you do.
you missed The Master, who surely rates up there alongside the Daleks.

Darth Vader's a fucking G.

Oh, and that Sylar guy looks like a drunk fratboy.

You're greatest villain is your hero

The most fearsome villain is the guy who could be anyone, a tortured soul, or a heartbroken nematoad.
The worst villain of all, is the bad guy you feel sympathy for by the end of the movie when the hero kills him.
The most evil villain is when you see yourself inside that villain, and you think...what made him so evil?
The greatest villain of all is the guy you want to love, but just can't...he's the real hero...when John Wayne goes riding off into the sunset you're more worried about the Indian, or the outlaw he left at the river bank to die...

All those "bad guys" you saw in movie when you were a kid were just cotton fluff so you would copp a feel for what was suppose to be the epitome of the upstanding citizen was like...well now that we're all a little older I think we can really think about the real villains, that person deep inside who realizes there is no such thing as a hero...so than what the hell is a villain?

Hannibal Lector. A remorseless cannibal who feels no guilt. How evil can you get? Also, he likes liver - ew.

Murdock from McGuyver. For Him, killing McGuyver was personal. but he always kept it sportmanlike in his conduct.


Seconded. Just this morning (literally) I watched the episode where MacGyver is rock-climbing and breaks that chick's heart and she ends up falling. Then Mac stays at that cabin near there and Murdock shows up with a flame-thrower. Good times.

Also, Mr Burns.

My favorite is Hannibal Lecter.

I liked George Stark from King's book 'The Dark Half'. (If there's a movie, I haven't seen it, so I can't tell you what the comparison is.) George is the ghost (?) of a writer's pseudonym (and also maybe of the writer's twin brother that was absorbed in utero) who is really just quite good at slicing people into little tiny bits. Determined and goal-oriented, he carves a path through flesh and blood to get to his target.

I liked Tim Curry's portrayal of Darkness in the movie Legend. (http://imdb.com/title/tt0089469/) That's not so much as a complex or particularly durable character, as he is just really really really really cool.

I like Annie from Misery (http://imdb.com/title/tt0100157/) cause she didn't need powers or monsters or anything 'extra' to make her amazingly scary. She was the first time I saw a female bad guy in a movie, too.

And, lastly, someone has already mentioned Hannibal Lector. He's brilliant, he's charismatic, he's even friendly at times. But somewhere in his head is something that makes him want to share a dinner table with peoples when it's their own brain on the menu. Even when he's in no posistion to do so, he bargains and comes out on top. A real 'long term' villian, one could say.

I don't have a best of the best, I just have villians that I really like for different reasons. :)

Sauron. Divine persistent evil. Unfortunately Melkor has not appeared in a movie yet.


And of course in every movie adaption of any biblical story the biblical god is the supreme villain.

Hannibal Lector. A remorseless cannibal who feels no guilt. How evil can you get? Also, he likes liver - ew.


http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a296/bassistsartori/182881mrTQ_w.jpg

Mmmmm... nothing like liver...

Mhh...

Star Wars: Vader isn't a "baddie", he's the protagonist of the cycle. I'd say that Emperor Palpatine qualifies, but Tarkin is probabily the best SW villain. He doesn't even enter direct confrontation!

LotR: Denethor. A great character, and ultimately a villain - by refusing the Hope (yes, capitalised because it is a theological virtue) symbolised by Gandalf and committing suicide instead of fighting, he is the ultimate human sinner in Tolkien's catholic view.
(I'd like to add Maeglin from the Silmarillion; son of Eöl the Dark-Elf, betrayer of the elven city of Gondolin; and even Fëanor, the responsible of ultimate hybris, he could be the protagonist of a greek tragedy. Luckily Peter Jackson hasn't ruined the Silmarillion... yet.)

DC: the Penguin. Without any doubt. He beats even the Joker; he's a tragical figure, a villain with a reason to be a villain and a great anger. Also Lex Luthor - a baddie with a functioning brain, plus being played by Gene Hackman is a huge bonus.

Marvel: Magneto, of course, just out of sheer complexity of the character. But also Mystica scores some good points. Von Doom... meh... somewhat excessive.

Star Trek: Kirk. He sends hundreds of red shirts to terrible deaths without even losing his smile. ;) Humans are evil, that's why humans win!

Baywatch: Pamela Anderson. She has caused inferiority complexes in young women all around the world, and permanent sight damage due to excessive masturbation in young men all around the world.:headbang:

Hmm... I feel this urge to nominate a science fiction villain... but most sci-fi villains are too campy to really qualify (see Star Wars, Stargate, and Star Trek)... the Cylons don't really fit... Babylon 5 didn't really have villains as such... am I missing someone?... wait, I know!

EX-TER-MI-NATE!

EX-TER-MI-NATE!

EX-TER-MI-NATE!

EX-TER-MI-NATE!

Need I say more?

IF THEY ARE SU-PREME, WHY ARE THEY NOT VIC-TOR-I-OUS!

Probabily the best movie villain EVER:

Sentenza (played by Lee Van Cleef) from Sergio Leone's "Il buono, il brutto, il cattivo".

I was going to say Galactus, because he is pretty big, but Unicron is indeed bigger.

Seconded. Just this morning (literally) I watched the episode where MacGyver is rock-climbing and breaks that chick's heart and she ends up falling. Then Mac stays at that cabin near there and Murdock shows up with a flame-thrower. Good times.

Also, Mr Burns.

Widowmaker if I'm not mistaken.

Probabily the best movie villain EVER:

Sentenza (played by Lee Van Cleef) from Sergio Leone's "Il buono, il brutto, il cattivo".

Good, but not the best.

"NO, ANGEL EYES!"

Sauron. Divine persistent evil.

Ya gotta love it.

Unfortunately Melkor has not appeared in a movie yet.

The Silmarillion is not suited to a film adaptation, so "unfortunately" is not the term I would use.

Then again...

http://www.gamerevolution.com/images/misc/lord_of_the_rings_melkor.jpg

That would be nice to see. :D


LotR: Denethor. A great character, and ultimately a villain - by refusing the Hope (yes, capitalised because it is a theological virtue) symbolised by Gandalf and committing suicide instead of fighting, he is the ultimate human sinner in Tolkien's catholic view.

...there are a lot of characters from LOTR that I'd put ahead of Denethor in terms of villainy. The Palantir had a lot to do with Denethor's fall...and that can be tied directly to Sauron.

(I'd like to add Maeglin from the Silmarillion; son of Eöl the Dark-Elf, betrayer of the elven city of Gondolin; and even Fëanor, the responsible of ultimate hybris, he could be the protagonist of a greek tragedy.)

Maeglin is a good one, but I'd put Thingol ahead of Feanor if we're going to single out an elf as a villain.

The White Rabbit of Monty Python and the Holy Grail. A creature, so foul, so cruel, that no man yet has fought with it and lived!



/nasty big pointy teeth

Palpatine FTW!

Not a TV or movie villain, but Darth Nilhius from KOTOR 2 kicked ass.

There can only be one...

Joy in the first season of "My name is Earl" takes the spot.

Darth Vader.

Palpatine, in the pre-Empire days. He was such a sneaky guy, playing the entire galaxy like some kind of... Player.

Vader, even after Episodes 1-3, actually, even more so. Now you know why he fell to the dark side and I think that makes him all the more scarier as a villain because one can so easily see oneself doing the exact same thing for someone you love.

For just out right worse villain though, The Joker. He is absolutely insane. He will kill you for no reason, he will spare you for no reason, he is chaos embodied.

For just out right worse villain though, The Joker. He is absolutely insane. He will kill you for no reason, he will spare you for no reason, he is chaos embodied.He even killed himself to screw Batman:eek:

Magneto and Darth Vader ranks high in my list. However, they are just "fallen angels", and not an expression of monolithic evil, like Sauron, or Morgoth, or the devil itself.

Some movies with the devil show a rather consistent form of monolithic evil. There is a movie where Christopher Walken plays an evil Archangel Gabriel. That evilarchangel was awesome.

Oh, and any villain played by Gary Oldman is pretty good. And speaking of Gary Oldman, the raging evil planet of "The Fifth Element" is a nice villain too. And speaking of Luc Besson, the devil that appears in "Joan D'Arc" played by Dustin Hoffman is cool.

The Silmarillion is not suited to a film adaptation, ....That's what they said about LotR as well. I do think that the Silmarillion could be made into a movie series. But not by Peter Jackson, of course....

That's what they said about LotR as well.

I do think that the Silmarillion could be made into a movie series. But not by Peter Jackson, of course....

I think Tolkiens works are far more suited to, say, a HBO mini-series than a theatrical release.

The Silmarillion suffers in that it reads more like a history text than a novel. That and the fact that the book covers a timespan of several thousand years...

...I would be perfectly happy if it were never adapted to film. From what I understand, Christopher Tolkien has stated that there will be no such film.

Feathers McGraw

Agent Smith from the Matrix series. Absolutely brilliant in the first movie, and the only part worth watching in the sequels. "Do you hear that, Mister Anderson? That is the sound of... inevitability."

And his "It's all about Me" routine in Reloaded was just perfect. Too bad the rest of the film sucked.

Hans Gruber from Die Hard. Smart, effective, ruthless and a man who knows his limits. He doesn't want to rule the world - he just wants a hundred million dollars!

"You're just a thief!"

"Not 'just' a thief - I am an exceptional thief!"

Pyramid Head. (http://www.whatthefun.net/sh/visuals/php.jpg)

agent smith for physical menace, colonel kurtz for psycholgical impact.

Sentenza aka Angel Eyes

:D
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/2/28/Ming.gif

the mysterons (http://www.bbc.co.uk/cult/anderson/scarlet/mysterons.shtml)! they had the best theme tune too. well, the best theme sounds.

1) Unicron
2) Borg
3) Dark Phoenix

Darth Vader (NOT HAYDEN CHRISTENSON!)

Absolutely! Vader (with the James Earl Jones voice) is the greatest villain of all time.

This crap about slicing people's heads open for no reason? That's a psycho. A real villain has some character behind him, not just "Whee! I like killing people!"

If that's the way your childish mind works, I'm surprised you didn't go with Freddy Krueger.

Oh wait...children don't know him. That was too long ago.

EX-TER-MI-NATE!

EX-TER-MI-NATE!

EX-TER-MI-NATE!

EX-TER-MI-NATE!

Need I say more?

Daleks do rock, though. :cool:

Vader, even after Episodes 1-3, actually, even more so. Now you know why he fell to the dark side and I think that makes him all the more scarier as a villain because one can so easily see oneself doing the exact same thing for someone you love.

For just out right worse villain though, The Joker. He is absolutely insane. He will kill you for no reason, he will spare you for no reason, he is chaos embodied.

But, you see, it's the humanity of a villain that makes him scary -- the idea that, well, shit, we could end up just like him. Understanding why one becomes a villain scares us, because we realise we're not that far from becoming one ourselves, just one life-changing moment and BANG.

Insane characters like the Joker, while fun and entertaining, just don't climb to the level of villains like Vader.

Keyser Soze ('http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Keyser_S%C3%B6ze')

But, you see, it's the humanity of a villain that makes him scary -- the idea that, well, shit, we could end up just like him. Understanding why one becomes a villain scares us, because we realise we're not that far from becoming one ourselves, just one life-changing moment and BANG.
I agree with you :)

...and lament the fact that Lucas, in my mind, missed the great opportunity to show that slide of humanity in episode 1-3. I honestly feel that he fucked that up completely... Oh the potential! :(

Also, Alonzo (http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0000243/)in Training Day is a good villain.

I am shocked, well not that shocked that this guy wasn't mentioned. (http://www.kensforce.com/bigtroublelittlechina1.jpg)

I am shocked, well not that shocked that this guy wasn't mentioned. (http://www.kensforce.com/bigtroublelittlechina1.jpg)

he got killed by a sidekick... not much of a villian.

But, you see, it's the humanity of a villain that makes him scary -- the idea that, well, shit, we could end up just like him. Understanding why one becomes a villain scares us, because we realise we're not that far from becoming one ourselves, just one life-changing moment and BANG.

There's even a scene to that effect in The Empire Strikes Back

Daleks do rock, though. :cool:

Have you seen the new episodes?

Dr Claw.

http://www.geocities.com/Hollywood/Screen/7219/23.jpg

How can you go past Lex Luthor, i mean they cut his head off and hes stilli up to evil deeds. Apart from being practically immortal he has no super powers, just his mind and his money. He throws money at problems until the go away, and they do. When he was beheaded it was symbolic, because he fights with his mind, not his skills, or powers or physique :)

he got killed by a sidekick... not much of a villian.

Kurt Russel was hardly the side kick. Besides, awesome way to go though. :D

"This is a nice knife Mr. Burton, good bye."

Keyser Soze ('http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Keyser_S%C3%B6ze')

I am Keyser Soze.

Darth Vader.

This debate can now end.

The Lab Monkeys in 28 Days Later, of course!

Palpatine.

He was ultimate evil villain. He was smart, cunning, treachorous. He manipulated everybody till he got to the position of Emperor, basically of all galaxy. Also he had a Force and he knew how to use it.

Feathers McGraw

seconded

You know I am shocked no-one named THIS (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fu_manchu) guy. Also James Moriarty is high on the list.

Hook doesn't hold a candle to most of the villains here, from Sylar to Hannibal Lecter.

Let me explain a bit of what Sylar's motivations are. He's basically a narcissistic psychopath - he's a serial killer. The difference, and half of what makes him cool, between him and an ordinary serial killer, is that he uses telekinesis. That, and he didn't have a troubled childhood, nor is there any sexual aspect to his killings (though he has killed two girls in their teens, and is hunting a third). He wants power - literally, as in superpowers - so he kills to get it.

I agree that there are many other cool villains. However, another part of what makes Sylar such a good villain is his attitude - calm, composed, almost relaxed at times. He is Sinister and Everyman at the same time.

In addition (entering superfight mode), he would make mincemeat out of 90% of the villains mentioned earlier. Magneto? Head-slice, Magneto screams his lungs out, Sylar now controls metal. Vader or Palpatine? It would be a tougher fight, given that they have lightsabers and the Force, but Sylar's skill with telekinesis is unequaled. After stealing/destroying their lightsabers, he'd be all over them. And any villain without superpowers is doomed.

Hook doesn't hold a candle to most of the villains here, from Sylar to Hannibal Lecter.

Let me explain a bit of what Sylar's motivations are. He's basically a narcissistic psychopath - he's a serial killer. The difference, and half of what makes him cool, between him and an ordinary serial killer, is that he uses telekinesis. That, and he didn't have a troubled childhood, nor is there any sexual aspect to his killings (though he has killed two girls in their teens, and is hunting a third). He wants power - literally, as in superpowers - so he kills to get it.

I agree that there are many other cool villains. However, another part of what makes Sylar such a good villain is his attitude - calm, composed, almost relaxed at times. He is Sinister and Everyman at the same time.

In addition (entering superfight mode), he would make mincemeat out of 90% of the villains mentioned earlier. Magneto? Head-slice, Magneto screams his lungs out, Sylar now controls metal. Vader or Palpatine? It would be a tougher fight, given that they have lightsabers and the Force, but Sylar's skill with telekinesis is unequaled. After stealing/destroying their lightsabers, he'd be all over them. And any villain without superpowers is doomed.

wrong...

Magneto will freeze his blood by controlling the iron content in Sylar's blood. (as seen in Uncanny X-Men comics.)

Vader/Palpatine? not likely. and Sylar's telekinesis is not unequaled.
Jean Grey/Psylocke would make mincemeat of him. Pheonix? he would be mindmush.

and then there is Molecule Man.

the only advantage Sylar has is the fact that most people don't know what he looks like (only two people in the series know who Sylar is.)

Kurt Russel was hardly the side kick. Besides, awesome way to go though. :D

"This is a nice knife Mr. Burton, good bye."

LOL... for that movie, Kurt Russell was the Side Kick! the studio was puzzled why the 'Hero' was so incompetent while the 'Side Kick' was doing most of the action. the whole movie was in the POV of the sidekick, not the hero.

LOL... for that movie, Kurt Russell was the Side Kick! the studio was puzzled why the 'Hero' was so incompetent while the 'Side Kick' was doing most of the action. the whole movie was in the POV of the sidekick, not the hero.

I always thought they had equal parts, well whatever, Lo-Pan is just plain cool.

R'as Al Ghul is awesome...

Also I like Venom.

wrong...

Magneto will freeze his blood by controlling the iron content in Sylar's blood. (as seen in Uncanny X-Men comics.)

Vader/Palpatine? not likely. and Sylar's telekinesis is not unequaled.
Jean Grey/Psylocke would make mincemeat of him. Pheonix? he would be mindmush.

and then there is Molecule Man.

the only advantage Sylar has is the fact that most people don't know what he looks like (only two people in the series know who Sylar is.)

I'm not going to take sides in this but,
Spoilers:

Five years into the future he can shapeshift as well

Feathers McGraw

Have you seen this chicken?

http://wwwbroy.informatik.tu-muenchen.de/~stenzg/wt26.gif

Maeglin is a good one, but I'd put Thingol ahead of Feanor if we're going to single out an elf as a villain.

Thingol? Elwë Singollo? A villain? Of course he's proud and jealous - and gets killed by his own stupidity, but I wouldn't put the husband of Melian in the host of villains. Some of the sons of Fëanor, maybe (like Caranthir), but Thingol? Why?

Amon Goeth in Schindler's List. On the basis that he really existed. The banality of evil somehow plunges even greater depths.

"Earth, a garden of eden, a garden of flesh." (http://www.cenobite.com/pix/hr2-poster-art.jpg)

So very evil and heartless it's chilling.

http://www.evangelicalright.com/murdoch_rupert170x220.jpg

I'm not going to take sides in this but,
Spoilers:

Five years into the future he can shapeshift as well

only if he gets what's her name's power of casting illusions. ;) it's not shapeshifting. but illusions.

Only one other has mentioned |Agent Smith.
You all fail.
Agent Smith is the best part in all three movies. By far the best actor in the films (that's not saying much, but still), he approachs his duty with a merciless determination.
His speech toward the end, when he crushes Neo, was for me, absolutely awesome.
The power, the intelligence, and in the end, the utter coolness: Smith is the best villian.

Unicron eats your Agent Smith, along with the entire planet.

Hook doesn't hold a candle to most of the villains here, from Sylar to Hannibal Lecter.

Let me explain a bit of what Sylar's motivations are. He's basically a narcissistic psychopath - he's a serial killer. The difference, and half of what makes him cool, between him and an ordinary serial killer, is that he uses telekinesis. That, and he didn't have a troubled childhood, nor is there any sexual aspect to his killings (though he has killed two girls in their teens, and is hunting a third). He wants power - literally, as in superpowers - so he kills to get it.

I agree that there are many other cool villains. However, another part of what makes Sylar such a good villain is his attitude - calm, composed, almost relaxed at times. He is Sinister and Everyman at the same time.

In addition (entering superfight mode), he would make mincemeat out of 90% of the villains mentioned earlier. Magneto? Head-slice, Magneto screams his lungs out, Sylar now controls metal. Vader or Palpatine? It would be a tougher fight, given that they have lightsabers and the Force, but Sylar's skill with telekinesis is unequaled. After stealing/destroying their lightsabers, he'd be all over them. And any villain without superpowers is doomed.

I enjoy watching Heroes, but sometimes the series' plot holes can get a little ridiculous ... spoiler ... for example, the protagonists have had the opportunity to kill Sylar several times, but don't. The Haitian, who for some inexplicable reason was not granted a name other than "The Haitain" seems to block some abilities but not others. And if Peter Petrelli has the ability to stop time, defeating Sylar in combat should have been ridiculously easy for him.

I enjoy watching Heroes, but sometimes the series' plot holes can get a little ridiculous ... spoiler ... for example, the protagonists have had the opportunity to kill Sylar several times, but don't. The Haitian, who for some inexplicable reason was not granted a name other than "The Haitain" seems to block some abilities but not others. And if Peter Petrelli has the ability to stop time, defeating Sylar in combat should have been ridiculously easy for him.


Rebuttal: Only future Peter has been shown to have Hiro's power, current Peter has yet to manifest it. Presumably that is why Future Hiro kept his exposure to Peter short, to minimize the chance that idiot would absorb his power. For a mimic he's really a putz.

Magneto by six million miles.

You all have nothing on Dick Dastardly.

Feathers McGraw

Thirded. That is one scary penguin.

Not sure if it's already been mentioned or not, but the T1000 scared the shit out of me as a kid.

Rebuttal: Only future Peter has been shown to have Hiro's power, current Peter has yet to manifest it. Presumably that is why Future Hiro kept his exposure to Peter short, to minimize the chance that idiot would absorb his power. For a mimic he's really a putz.

Possibly, but I was also referring to future Peter's battle with future Sylar. But I agree, Peter is a bit of a putz.

OMG, there is nothing in my post.

Hannibal Lecter.

wrong...
Magneto will freeze his blood by controlling the iron content in Sylar's blood. (as seen in Uncanny X-Men comics.)
Also, Mag's helmet protects him from all forms of telepathic assault (which is why Xavier can't stop him). So it's likely that it would protect him from his brain being removed via telekenisis.
Plus, Magneto's a friggin' genius who plans his attacks thoroughly. He knows his enemies strengths and weakenesses intricately and so would already have the means to dispose of Sylar before they even meet.
Magneto vs some fat frat boy?
no contest.

However, all get pawned by these two guys:
http://www.icicom.up.pt/blog/take2/Blackadder.jpg
"I have a cunning plan, my lord!"
"I have a plan so cunning, you could put a tail on it and call it a weasel!"

(I'm not reading all of these)

Shredder anyone?

TURTLLLES!

yup. you do.
you missed The Master, who surely rates up there alongside the Daleks.

Yes, but Roger Delgado's Master, or Anthony Ainley's?

You all have nothing on Dick Dastardly.

Rip-off (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Waluiginintendo.jpg)

Hmm... I feel this urge to nominate a science fiction villain... but most sci-fi villains are too campy to really qualify (see Star Wars, Stargate, and Star Trek)... the Cylons don't really fit... Babylon 5 didn't really have villains as such... am I missing someone?... wait, I know!

EX-TER-MI-NATE!

EX-TER-MI-NATE!

EX-TER-MI-NATE!

EX-TER-MI-NATE!

Need I say more?

Correct.

Thingol? Elwë Singollo? A villain? Of course he's proud and jealous - and gets killed by his own stupidity, but I wouldn't put the husband of Melian in the host of villains. Some of the sons of Fëanor, maybe (like Caranthir), but Thingol? Why?

Thingol's pride is central to his character. All one has to do is look at what he put Beren through just to gain his approval.

He was arrogant enough to assume he was not subject to the Curse of Feanor, even as he possessed a Silmaril. His pride led directly to the estrangement of the Elves and Dwarves.

Perhaps "villain" is not the correct term, but it is hardly applicable to Feanor either. His sons, perhaps, but early on this was not apparent, and later events had brought the Curse to the point of resolution...so one could argue that they had no choice in the matter.

The reason I rank Thingol higher than Feanor is that Feanor, in the end, saw the rashness, evil, and futility in his deeds. Thingol did no such thing. He died as he lived...arrogant and prideful to the end.

"Earth, a garden of eden, a garden of flesh." (http://www.cenobite.com/pix/hr2-poster-art.jpg)

So very evil and heartless it's chilling.

Ooooo.....another good one! :cool:

In addition (entering superfight mode), he would make mincemeat out of 90% of the villains mentioned earlier.

Pinhead would most definately fall in the 10% range. *nods*

Thingol's pride is central to his character. All one has to do is look at what he put Beren through just to gain his approval.

He was arrogant enough to assume he was not subject to the Curse of Feanor, even as he possessed a Silmaril. His pride led directly to the estrangement of the Elves and Dwarves.

Perhaps "villain" is not the correct term, but it is hardly applicable to Feanor either. His sons, perhaps, but early on this was not apparent, and later events had brought the Curse to the point of resolution...so one could argue that they had no choice in the matter.

The reason I rank Thingol higher than Feanor is that Feanor, in the end, saw the rashness, evil, and futility in his deeds. Thingol did no such thing. He died as he lived...arrogant and prideful to the end.


Note that some Dwarves, east of the Misty Mountains, were already under the power of Morgoth. Anyway, about the Dwarves of Belegost and Nogrod, the dwarven jewelsmiths did lay a claim on the Nauglamir, but only after they had joined the Silmaril in it, so their lust for gems also played a major part in the estrangement of the races, and it was them who choose to slay Thingol - he only bade them to leave.

I see Thingol more as a victim of his own pride - remember that he also was moved by the plight of Beren and Luthien in the end. Fëanor, instead, had the choice to avoid vengeance, and was warned by the Valar to avoid it. He choose hybris by revolting against the "gods" and by committing the First Kinslaying - leading to the Fate of Mandos. Also, Fëanor did not repent his deeds, because, just before dying, he told his sons that they were bound by the Oath, even if he knew it was impossible for the Elves to defeat Morgoth. This insane drive for vengeance makes Fëanor more "villain" than Thingol, in my opinion.

About the sons of Fëanor, Caranthir is clearly a villain - and a coward to boot. Maedhros, instead, is basically a good person (he remembered his cousins left on the Western Shore while his father bade his followers to burn the ships at Losgar), although bound by a tragic fate he had to bear because of his loyalty to his family.

My, what geeks we are.:D

Note that some Dwarves, east of the Misty Mountains, were already under the power of Morgoth.

I wasn't aware of that, but I haven't read the Histories of Middle Earth, so it's probably in there. :p

Anyway, about the Dwarves of Belegost and Nogrod, the dwarven jewelsmiths did lay a claim on the Nauglamir, but only after they had joined the Silmaril in it, so their lust for gems also played a major part in the estrangement of the races, and it was them who choose to slay Thingol - he only bade them to leave.

I recall it being somewhat more insulting than that...something about petty thieves and stunted people.

Not that the dwarves don't share in the blame...they did sack Menegroth, but it was Thingol who felt himself to be "above" the Curse. His pride led him to keep the Silmaril when all wisdom advised against it.

I see Thingol more as a victim of his own pride - remember that he also was moved by the plight of Beren and Luthien in the end.

Perhaps...but he kept the Silmaril regardless, even though it still wound up with Beren and Luthien after his death.

A victim maybe, but there were plenty of chances for him to take a different path, and he never did.

Fëanor, instead, had the choice to avoid vengeance, and was warned by the Valar to avoid it. He choose hybris by revolting against the "gods" and by committing the First Kinslaying - leading to the Fate of Mandos. Also, Fëanor did not repent his deeds, because, just before dying, he told his sons that they were bound by the Oath, even if he knew it was impossible for the Elves to defeat Morgoth. This insane drive for vengeance makes Fëanor more "villain" than Thingol, in my opinion.

Feanor wasn't reiterating his sons oath because he desired vengance...he was reiterating it because his sons also took the oath. He was reminding them that they too were caught up in the curse that had claimed his life.

About the sons of Fëanor, Caranthir is clearly a villain - and a coward to boot. Maedhros, instead, is basically a good person (he remembered his cousins left on the Western Shore while his father bade his followers to burn the ships at Losgar), although bound by a tragic fate he had to bear because of his loyalty to his family.

Regarding Maedhros, don't forget his being chained to Thangorodrim...he was well renowned as the fiercest of Morgoths foes for some time.

The sons of Feanor, aside from Maedhros and Maglor (and Amras, who died at the burning at Losgar), are certainly villanous. I don't think there is any doubt of that.

Maglor still lives. ;)

My, what geeks we are.:D

Indeed. :p

I recall it being somewhat more insulting than that...something about petty thieves and stunted people.

Well, that's what you get when you quarrel preposterously with a firstborn king in his own house... and the dwarves are a bunch of stunted people indeed ;)


Not that the dwarves don't share in the blame...they did sack Menegroth, but it was Thingol who felt himself to be "above" the Curse. His pride led him to keep the Silmaril when all wisdom advised against it.
Yup, correct. Even Melian told him not to take the Silmaril.

A victim maybe, but there were plenty of chances for him to take a different path, and he never did.


Feanor wasn't reiterating his sons oath because he desired vengance...he was reiterating it because his sons also took the oath. He was reminding them that they too were caught up in the curse that had claimed his life.
Still, I guess that Tolkien - being extremely catholic - would have had the Valar, or at least the One, grant pardon to repentant sinners.



Regarding Maedhros, don't forget his being chained to Thangorodrim...he was well renowned as the fiercest of Morgoths foes for some time.
The sons of Feanor, aside from Maedhros and Maglor (and Amras, who died at the burning at Losgar), are certainly villanous. I don't think there is any doubt of that.
The burning at Losgar happened before the chaining of Maedhros, and he told his father not to abandon the other Noldor. So, he was already a non-villain.
Also, I'm quite sure that Amras didn't die at Losgar, maybe you're mixing the events.


Maglor still lives. ;)

:)

Looks like we managed to hijack this thread almost entirely.

I'm quite sure that Amras didn't die at Losgar, maybe you're mixing the events
No, together with his brother Amrod he ruled the area of Estolad between the Celon river and the upper course of Gelion.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/d/dd/Realms_of_bel_swj.jpg

However "Umbarto" proved to be a prophetic name, for Amras was accidentally killed in the swan ships of the Teleri, when his father ordered them to be burnt at Losgar.[1]

...In the morning [after the burning of the ships] the host was mustered, but of Fëanor’s seven sons only six were to be found. Then Ambarussa went pale with fear. ‘Did you not then rouse Ambarussa my brother (whom you called Ambarto)?’ he said. ‘He would not come ashore to sleep (he said) in discomfort.’ But it is thought (and no doubt Fëanor guessed this also) that it was in the mind of Ambarto to sail his ship back [afterwards] and rejoin Nerdanel; for he had been much [shocked] by the deed of his father.

That's from The People's of Middle Earth...it was a late addition by J.R.R., and Christopher decided not to alter the previous versions for The Silmarillion.

So yeah...he be dead. :p