NationStates Jolt Archive

Conservatives tend to talk about how they're against "Big Government" (TM), and how the government needs to stay out of people's lives. But then they try to pass laws on stuff like who you can marry, what you can put in your body, what you can do with your body, just where you can stick it, etc.

So I've finally figured out what the mean by Big Government (TM) Vs. Small Government (Which they are, of course, allegedly in favor of.)

So here's the breakdown:

BIG GOVERNMENT (TM)
Big Government (TM) deals with BIG issues, such as welfare, war, corruption, pollution, civil rights, gun control, and health care.

SMALL GOVERNMENT
Small Government deals with SMALL issues, such as flag burning, gay marriage, who you can marry, how many times you can marry, and premarital sex. It also tells you just where you can stick it, which it has a disturbing fixation with.

Questions?

Actually, war seems to paradoxically fall under "small" government. Just ask Ronnie "drown it in a bathtub" Raygun.

No, that clears things up for me. Thanks. ^_^

http://www.silgrad.com/wbb2/images/smilies/lmao.gif

Conservatives tend to talk about how they're against "Big Government" (TM), and how the government needs to stay out of people's lives. But then they try to pass laws on stuff like who you can marry, what you can put in your body, what you can do with your body, just where you can stick it, etc.

So I've finally figured out what the mean by Big Government (TM) Vs. Small Government (Which they are, of course, allegedly in favor of.)

So here's the breakdown:

BIG GOVERNMENT (TM)
Big Government (TM) deals with BIG issues, such as welfare, war, corruption, pollution, civil rights, gun control, and health care.

SMALL GOVERNMENT
Small Government deals with SMALL issues, such as flag burning, gay marriage, who you can marry, how many times you can marry, and premarital sex. It also tells you just where you can stick it, which it has a disturbing fixation with.

Questions?

You know, I never really thought about it before, but for a party of prudes they really do spend an inordinate amount of time thinking about 'the naughty'...

You know, I never really thought about it before, but for a party of prudes they really do spend an inordinate amount of time thinking about 'the naughty'...

Yes, and the "people marrying their cats" line seems to come up...inordinately often.

Yes, and the "people marrying their cats" line seems to come up...inordinately often.That reminds me of the "cat rape" libel that Tom Paine was plagued with in his later years. Thats what you get for deconstructing Christian fundamentalism.

Yes, and the "people marrying their cats" line seems to come up...inordinately often.

I'm always suspicious of anybody who brings up cat-marrying.

*Glares at Zarakon*

\It also tells you just where you can stick it, which it has a disturbing fixation with.


Yea, I never really thought of it that way, but I think you got something there.

I'm always suspicious of anybody who brings up cat-marrying.

*Glares at Zarakon*

Oblig. cat pic (http://www.flickr.com/photos/buro9/298996985/in/set-72157594379214637/).

Actually, war seems to paradoxically fall under "small" government. Just ask Ronnie "drown it in a bathtub" Raygun.
All US Presidents since Wilson have loved war; it's sort of a hobby like knitting, but with guns instead of knitting needles.

Conservatives tend to talk about how they're against "Big Government" (TM), and how the government needs to stay out of people's lives. But then they try to pass laws on stuff like who you can marry, what you can put in your body, what you can do with your body, just where you can stick it, etc.

So I've finally figured out what the mean by Big Government (TM) Vs. Small Government (Which they are, of course, allegedly in favor of.)

So here's the breakdown:

BIG GOVERNMENT (TM)
Big Government (TM) deals with BIG issues, such as welfare, war, corruption, pollution, civil rights, gun control, and health care.

SMALL GOVERNMENT
Small Government deals with SMALL issues, such as flag burning, gay marriage, who you can marry, how many times you can marry, and premarital sex. It also tells you just where you can stick it, which it has a disturbing fixation with.

Questions?

That's genius. I love it.

That's genius. I love it.

Thank you.

Conservatives tend to talk about how they're against "Big Government" (TM), and how the government needs to stay out of people's lives. But then they try to pass laws on stuff like who you can marry, what you can put in your body, what you can do with your body, just where you can stick it, etc.

So I've finally figured out what the mean by Big Government (TM) Vs. Small Government (Which they are, of course, allegedly in favor of.)

So here's the breakdown:

BIG GOVERNMENT (TM)
Big Government (TM) deals with BIG issues, such as welfare, war, corruption, pollution, civil rights, gun control, and health care.

SMALL GOVERNMENT
Small Government deals with SMALL issues, such as flag burning, gay marriage, who you can marry, how many times you can marry, and premarital sex. It also tells you just where you can stick it, which it has a disturbing fixation with.

Questions?

You don't mind if I post this somewhere else on the Internet and give you credit, do ya?

You don't mind if I post this somewhere else on the Internet and give you credit, do ya?

Not at all. Just give the link to the original site, I guess.

All US Presidents since Wilson have loved war; it's sort of a hobby like knitting, but with guns instead of knitting needles.

Too bad you don't get a quilt out of the deal.

yeah big government is just a slogan thing. when you have 300,000,000 people you cant help but have a big government.

the 2 parties take turns whittling away at our freedoms. neither one is the party of freedom. they just have different opinions of how the government must run your life.

In a country run by a small government, the amount of freedom people have is proportional to the amount of money they earn.

In a country run by a small goverment, the amount of freedom people have is proportional to the amount of money they earn.

Thus completing ignoring the semi-serious sarcasm :p

Conservatives tend to talk about how they're against "Big Government" (TM), and how the government needs to stay out of people's lives. But then they try to pass laws on stuff like who you can marry, what you can put in your body, what you can do with your body, just where you can stick it, etc.

So I've finally figured out what the mean by Big Government (TM) Vs. Small Government (Which they are, of course, allegedly in favor of.)

So here's the breakdown:

BIG GOVERNMENT (TM)
Big Government (TM) deals with BIG issues, such as welfare, war, corruption, pollution, civil rights, gun control, and health care.

SMALL GOVERNMENT
Small Government deals with SMALL issues, such as flag burning, gay marriage, who you can marry, how many times you can marry, and premarital sex. It also tells you just where you can stick it, which it has a disturbing fixation with.

Questions?

i would disagree. not that you're wrong, but you're taking about american conservatism.

i think in america, compared to over here, the concept of liberty is very different. in the US it seems that 'liberty' refers to economic freedom. personal or social freedoms seem to be less important in people's minds as far as my personal observations go.

in comparison, here social freedoms are highly valuable and important to us, and economic freedoms are more easily put aside.

what this means is the terms 'big govt' and 'small govt' are different between europe and the states. i think in europe it is simpler: a big govt will take more of a role in the economy, "taking" more economic freedoms. wheras in the US the term is more ambiguous with economic freedoms so sacrosanct.


just my opinion anyhoo :)

And "economic freedom" seems to refer solely to the freedom of the rich to exploit the poor. For the poor, this "economic freedom" amounts to the freedom to starve. In my opinion, true economic freedom is a combination political and social freedom in the workplace, or industrial democracy and the freedom to have a good life.

Who goes with my hunch that there's animal porn hidden in the Capitol Building? Let's go treasure hunting!

Anyway, yeah. I've always wondered why gay rights gets so much attention from Washington rather than some decent reforms to our system.

Not at all. Just give the link to the original site, I guess.

Okay, kewl. I'll just put in an HTML file for now.

Wouldn't bringing an end to legal anti-gay discrimination count as a 'decent reform?':rolleyes:

Thus completing ignoring the semi-serious sarcasm :p

I was beeing serious.

I was beeing serious.

But not spelling stuff right.

Zarakon seems to assume that conservatives are against big government all the time, which is understandable, because that how they talk, its not how they act.

Conservatives are against big government ... when the other lot are in office.

Everyone is against big government when the other lot are in office, its a little more difficult to notice when conservatives are in office because they love to talk about opposing big government while lefties love to talk about big government solving problems, so when we see a Republican Congress giving a Democrat President heat over the size of the budget, we think "this makes sense, Republicans hate big government, so they are opposing it now."

When conservatives are in office, they are all for big government, they just talk about small government.

All US Presidents since Wilson have loved war; it's sort of a hobby like knitting, but with guns instead of knitting needles.

Virtually all US presidents since Washington have used war as a legitimate political tool.

Conservatives tend to talk about how they're against "Big Government" (TM), and how the government needs to stay out of people's lives. But then they try to pass laws on stuff like who you can marry, what you can put in your body, what you can do with your body, just where you can stick it, etc.

So I've finally figured out what the mean by Big Government (TM) Vs. Small Government (Which they are, of course, allegedly in favor of.)

So here's the breakdown:

BIG GOVERNMENT (TM)
Big Government (TM) deals with BIG issues, such as welfare, war, corruption, pollution, civil rights, gun control, and health care.

SMALL GOVERNMENT
Small Government deals with SMALL issues, such as flag burning, gay marriage, who you can marry, how many times you can marry, and premarital sex. It also tells you just where you can stick it, which it has a disturbing fixation with.

Questions?

You're forgetting something.

Congress = government.
President = administration.

They like small government, but big administration. As long as they're the administration. That's why Congress has been so consistently marginalized since Bush took office, but he has expanded the bureaucracy so much. He hasn't been promoting big government. He's been promoting big administration.

Reagan was the same, that's why instead of raising taxes to pay for subversive insurgencies to overthrow foreign governments he simply smuggled cocaine and sold missiles to our enemies.

But not spelling stuff right.

Buhu, I forgot an en in Government.

Buhu, I forgot an en in Government.

And added an extra "e" in being.


And spelled boo-hoo with "u"s.

And added an extra "e" in being.


And spelled boo-hoo with "u"s.

Who said I wrote buhu in English? I can write buhu however I want and I choose to write it as I pronounce it. Boo-hoo just sounds ugly.

Buhu, I forgot an en in Government.

I actually meant you had an extra "e" in "being".

Conservatives tend to talk about how they're against "Big Government" (TM), and how the government needs to stay out of people's lives. But then they try to pass laws on stuff like who you can marry, what you can put in your body, what you can do with your body, just where you can stick it, etc.

Well, more fodder showing the meaninglessness of "liberal" and "conservative." You are confusing fiscal conservatives and social conservatives. Although some people are both, many are not. Fiscal conservatives oppose big government, because it means big taxes. Social conservatives try to regulate the way you live to preserve their moral perspective.

Actually, it doesn't matter whether we're talking about fiscal or social conservatives. Social conservatives are worried about "where you can stick it", fiscal conservatives are worried about their wallets, and people who aren't conservatives are the ones actually worried about people. People = the big issue of running a nation, hence, big government = takes care of big issues.

Conservatives tend to talk about how they're against "Big Government" (TM), and how the government needs to stay out of people's lives. But then they try to pass laws on stuff like who you can marry, what you can put in your body, what you can do with your body, just where you can stick it, etc.

Easy.

They're not really conservatives.

A true conservative realizes that, as an individual, I exist for my own sake and have no obligation to provide for others just as others have no obligation to provide for me.

Therefore, both my wallet and my lifestyle are my own business.

Ron Paul in '08!

Easy.

They're not really conservatives.

A true conservative realizes that, as an individual, I exist for my own sake and have no obligation to provide for others just as others have no obligation to provide for me.

Therefore, both my wallet and my lifestyle are my own business.

Ron Paul in '08!

Conservative actually means social conservative. The original conservatives were advocates of the monarchy and the class system. The core of the conservative ideology even today is an appeal to tradition and the desire to protect the historic values of a society.

The views you are espousing here are actually the old form of liberalism, recently resurrected as libertarianism, aka. "fiscal conservatism".

Modern liberalism is actually a result of a revision to the old form of liberalism in response to the criticisms of communists and anarchists that the free market advocated by the old form of liberalism creates a new privileged property owning class and a new surf /working class.

Libertarianism thus falls a part as a philosophy as it rests on the false idea that human beings are independent beings (rather than social creatures) which can manage themselves without governance.

And now you know!

Libertarianism thus falls a part as a philosophy as it rests on the false idea that human beings are independent beings (rather than social creatures) which can manage themselves without governance.

This is based on a misunderstanding of libertarianism. That man is a social creature does not in any way conflict with libertarianism.

What libertarianism asserts is not that man is an entirely independent creature, but that an individual's relations with other individuals are best determined by mutual consent, rather than force.

people who aren't conservatives are the ones actually worried about people.

"Liberals" are not worried about people either, they are worried about getting power and keeping it.

People = the big issue of running a nation, hence, big government = takes care of big issues.

No, big government simply means a government that is either large (depending on what measure you use, the main one used is the budget relative to GDP), and/or government that interferes in relations in more parts of society relative to other governments.

Easy.

They're not really conservatives.

A true conservative realizes that, as an individual, I exist for my own sake and have no obligation to provide for others just as others have no obligation to provide for me.

Therefore, both my wallet and my lifestyle are my own business.

Ron Paul in '08!

That's not true conservative thinking, that's classic liberal or neo-liberal(or whatever you wanna call it) thinking.

Conservatives tend to talk about how they're against "Big Government" (TM), and how the government needs to stay out of people's lives. But then they try to pass laws on stuff like who you can marry, what you can put in your body, what you can do with your body, just where you can stick it, etc.

So I've finally figured out what the mean by Big Government (TM) Vs. Small Government (Which they are, of course, allegedly in favor of.)

So here's the breakdown:

BIG GOVERNMENT (TM)
Big Government (TM) deals with BIG issues, such as welfare, war, corruption, pollution, civil rights, gun control, and health care.

SMALL GOVERNMENT
Small Government deals with SMALL issues, such as flag burning, gay marriage, who you can marry, how many times you can marry, and premarital sex. It also tells you just where you can stick it, which it has a disturbing fixation with.

Questions?


This is good point but somehat confused. This is a dichotomy between Republicans and Democrats instead of liberals and conservatives.

A conservative approach is truly small government. The Republican party's approach is small government in the area of regulation of the economy and less expense. However they (or at least the damn christian component) want more government involvement in certain areas like reproduction and sexual orientation issues.

Liberalism used to mean conservatism (its root word is liberty after all which implies liberty restrictions upon the role of government). It is all very confusing. Today conservatism seems to mean what classical liberalism meant and liberalism means progressivism.

A true conservative movement such as libertarianism is in my mind the best example of a pretty thoroughly conservative liberty-oriented smaller government philosophy that is not too extreme to be impractiable.

Conservatives tend to talk about how they're against "Big Government" (TM), and how the government needs to stay out of people's lives. But then they try to pass laws on stuff like who you can marry, what you can put in your body, what you can do with your body, just where you can stick it, etc.

So I've finally figured out what the mean by Big Government (TM) Vs. Small Government (Which they are, of course, allegedly in favor of.)

So here's the breakdown:

BIG GOVERNMENT (TM)
Big Government (TM) deals with BIG issues, such as welfare, war, corruption, pollution, civil rights, gun control, and health care.

SMALL GOVERNMENT
Small Government deals with SMALL issues, such as flag burning, gay marriage, who you can marry, how many times you can marry, and premarital sex. It also tells you just where you can stick it, which it has a disturbing fixation with.

Questions?

You're mixing social conservatism with ecenomic conservatism.

It is indeed true that many conservatives spend most of their time ranting and raving with a hideous amount of anger, hate and bile against "big government". Anyone who's ever listened to Newt Gingrich screaming with rage on the floor of the House of Representatives can no doubt understand what I mean by this.

However, to take Mr. Gingrich as a prime example of the hypocrisy involved, consider his home county (Cobb county - I forget which state that is, sorry). Lockheed Martin (one of the biggest defence contractors in the USA) is based there. I mention that to further illustrate my point.

Nearly all the major defense contractors are owned / run by conservatives, or the deeply conservative Carlyle Group (a consortium of defence contractors). In fact, you don't necessarily need to single out defense contractors - you could also consider Oil companies, power companies, steel companies, mining companies - the list goes on. If you're an executive or CEO of one of these, the chances are that you're a conservative. Why? Because conservatives hate big government, meaning they hate being taxed. As a general rule, the more you earn, the more the government wants to tax you (although thanks to the unbelievably regressive Bush tax cuts, this has gone the other way). So if you're a high earning executive or CEO, it is in your best interest to support the anti tax - hate the government conservative ideology.

However, when it comes to getting government contracts (which ultimately must be paid for by the taxpayer), conservatives are usually willing to drop their hate-the-government ideology in order to get a hefty slice of the action. It seems that they really rather like "big government" when they are on the receiving end of corporate welfare. The Bushg administration seems to have an implicit policy of "leave no defense contractor behind", for example.

It's not just straight handouts either - many industries benefit directly from what "big government" does - the steel industry is a prime example, if it weren't for the government imposed steel tariffs, the industry would have died (or at least would have been forced to make itself efficient) a long time ago.

ExxonMobil is another example. Everyone has probably heard about the $5 million fine they got whacked with as a result of the Exxon Valdez leaking 11 million barrels of oil into Prince William Sound, Alaska. What you probably don't know is that they haven't paid a dime of it, largely thanks to making friends (and placing friends) within the government to protect them.

I could give many other examples, but you get the idea. Conservative anti-government bluster is largely a complete load of hypocritical bullshit.

Virtually all US presidents since Washington have used war as a legitimate political tool.

War is a legitimate political tool, if you're a psychohistorian or otherwise place little value on the individual in society, as all those in power do.