NationStates Jolt Archive

It may have even poisoned our food supply. Looks like they have foun melamine, the substance responsible for the poisonings, in several different products including rice protein and corn gluten. Some has been shipped to Africa, some has been used as pig feed in the US. The fact that so many different products have been contaminated leads some to believe that the poisoning was intentional because melamine contamination makes food test higher for protein.

So what's going to be done about China? They spy on our corporations and our military, violate patent laws, and now poison us. When are we seriously going to crack down and cripple their economy as punishment?

http://abcnews.go.com/Health/story?id=3058844&CMP=OTC-RSSFeeds0312

So what's going to be done about China? They spy on our corporations and our military, violate patent laws, and now poison us. When are we seriously going to crack down and cripple their economy as punishment?

http://abcnews.go.com/Health/story?id=3058844&CMP=OTC-RSSFeeds0312

That's becoming an increasingly empty threat.

Though they might well cripple ours if they put interest rates up too much.

That's becoming an increasingly empty threat.

Though they might well cripple ours if they put interest rates up too much.

Something has to be done, and it has to be done now. If we get into a trade war it will seriously hurt the US economy, but you can't get into a scrap and not expect to get hurt. Too bad investors in Walmart and Nike and other big name companies are too woried about their stock being hurt to stand up for their country.

Though they might well cripple ours if they put interest rates up too much.

Either way, they're in trouble. The Chinese economy's out of control, and unless they take some drastic measures it's going to overheat and crash a lot harder than Japan did back in the early 90's.

Lace your imports to China with sarin and kill off a few in revenge. >_>

I suppose we could go over to China and kill some of their pets if you really want some kind of proportional response. Crippling both of our economies won't make them any more ethical than they are now, it'll just make both our countries poorer.

I suppose we could go over to China and kill some of their pets if you really want some kind of proportional response. Crippling both of our economies won't make them any more ethical than they are now, it'll just make both our countries poorer.

And we should also violate their patents and steal their military and civilian technology, only problem is our technology is far ahead of theirs, so we need to do something different. Kicking their economy around a little and promising to hurt them even worse if they keep up their douchebaggery might get them to clean up their act. At the very least we should officially recognize Taiwan to show them that their actions have consequences that they won't like.

Okay children, how about we use some common sense here.

Why the fuck would they do that? Seriously. What possible reason would they have to do that? Surely you need to have some kind of motive in mind before you just go accusing people willy-nilly.

Okay children, how about we use some common sense here.

Why the fuck would they do that? Seriously. What possible reason would they have to do that? Surely you need to have some kind of motive in mind before you just go accusing people willy-nilly.

The reason was given in the article. Melamine makes food look richer in protein than it is. If added in small enough ammounts it would go unnoticed. Someone probably fucked up and added too much.

Oooh! *gasp* China are going to bring the US to it's knees! By poisoning puppies!

Good grief.....



So what's going to be done about China? They spy on our corporations and our military, violate patent laws, and now poison us. When are we seriously going to crack down and cripple their economy as punishment?

It's ok, naturally, for the US to do all these things, but by goodness, there will be hell to pay if somebody has the cheek to do it back.

Bad bad bad bad bad idea. Very bad idea

OK, why?

And we should also violate their patents and steal their military and civilian technology, only problem is our technology is far ahead of theirs, so we need to do something different. Kicking their economy around a little and promising to hurt them even worse if they keep up their douchebaggery might get them to clean up their act. At the very least we should officially recognize Taiwan to show them that their actions have consequences that they won't like.

Bad bad bad bad bad idea. Very bad idea

Oooh! *gasp* China are going to bring the US to it's knees! By poisoning puppies!

Good grief.....Right. Unethical business practices is really an inventive way of declaring war, is it?

Good Grief...It's ok, naturally, for the US to do all these things, but by goodness, there will be hell to pay if somebody has the cheek to do it back.Mostly because the US economy would implode if China did it.

Then again, that'd really kill their pet food exports, so why should they?

I suppose we could go over to China and kill some of their pets if you really want some kind of proportional response. Crippling both of our economies won't make them any more ethical than they are now, it'll just make both our countries poorer.
The Chinese government already kills off its citizens' pets anyway, didn't they kill thousands of dogs to stop a rabies outbreak?

The Chinese government already kills off its citizens' pets anyway, didn't they kill thousands of dogs to stop a rabies outbreak?

And they FINALLY rid themselves of that pesky fresh-water dolphin problem. Phew, I'm glad that's finally been settled.

OK, why?

Aside from the fact that our economy is tied in with theirs and whatever we do to their economy will have a negative impact on our own?

How would you suggest we put China in its place without shooting ourselves in the foot? Not that I think that China did this intentionally btw

*shrug*

Well, simple. Give your pets fresh chicken, beef, fish etc and check with vet to make sure they're getting balanced nutrition. No more pet food purchases, no more worrying about pets getting poisoned.

I'm waiting for humans to be sickened -- who says all the wheat and rice gluten sold to us was livestock grade? BTW I don't think this is "Let's kill their pets" so much as "We are completely unethical in our business practices."

Aside from the fact that our economy is tied in with theirs and whatever we do to their economy will have a negative impact on our own?

Yeah, aside from that. I already said that we should expect some damage to our own economy.

Bad bad bad bad bad idea. Very bad ideaI concur. Officially reconising Taiwan is the same as China invading Taiwan. The former does not come without the latter. At which point the USA can prove it's impotence on the world stage by doing nothing or it can get itself into a war with China as per its treaty obligations (I think).

I concur. Officially reconising Taiwan is the same as China invading Taiwan. The former does not come without the latter. At which point the USA can prove it's impotence on the world stage by doing nothing or it can get itself into a war with China as per its treaty obligations (I think).

As long as it doesn't go nuclear I'm cool with it.

If you want to piss off China then you invade the corrupt regimes in Africa that it's been getting chummy with and set up your own regime and then via backroom diplomacy you let China know why you did this. Thus you damage China's economic prospects whilst potentially benefiting your own.

If you want to piss off China then you invade the corrupt regimes in Africa that it's been getting chummy with and set up your own regime and then via backroom diplomacy you let China know why you did this. Thus you damage China's economic prospects whilst potentially benefiting your own.

Sounds good to me. Let's overthrow Sudan's government. End a genocide and fuck up China's investments. Two birds, one stone.

If we're having problems with Iraq, what will happen when we take on the largest standing army in the world? And it probably wouldn't go nuclear they don't have the delivery capabilities

Standing armies we can deal with. Insurgents hiding among civilians that we don't want to massacre on a genocidal scale tends to be a problem for us. Our military is the perfect tool for destroying a numerically superior army, navy and air force.

As long as it doesn't go nuclear I'm cool with it.

If we're having problems with Iraq, what will happen when we take on the largest standing army in the world? And it probably wouldn't go nuclear they don't have the delivery capabilities

As long as it doesn't go nuclear I'm cool with it.I don't think you understand just quite what war with China would mean. Roughly 20% of USA trade would disappear overnight. If not more. A war with China would be costly and prolonged, and I could easily see the war escalating and pulling in other coutries. Japan would be pulled into such a war almost immediately. War with China is not a good thing at all.

Who's to say their won't be Chinese insurgents? A billion of them.

In Taiwan? I'm not saying we'd invade China, just repel their invasion of Taiwan through naval and air superiority.

Standing armies we can deal with. Insurgents hiding among civilians that we don't want to massacre on a genocidal scale tends to be a problem for us. Our military is the perfect tool for destroying a numerically superior army, navy and air force.

Who's to say their won't be Chinese insurgents? A billion of them.

You don't think that a Chinese invasion wouldn't spread? I doubt that such a thing would stay in one place, and the war would eventually have to be taken to some sort of mainland

Spread to where? Russia? Pakistan? North Korea? The Chinese lack the ability to project force with their navy, which would be on the bottom of the sea if they tried to invade Taiwan and the US fought back. They could only march troops and drive tanks into neighboring countries, which would only result in them fighting their neighbors, not threatening the US.

In Taiwan? I'm not saying we'd invade China, just repel their invasion of Taiwan through naval and air superiority.

You don't think that a Chinese invasion wouldn't spread? I doubt that such a thing would stay in one place, and the war would eventually have to be taken to some sort of mainland

In Taiwan? I'm not saying we'd invade China, just repel their invasion of Taiwan through naval and air superiority.Hmm, the Chinese are very paranoid about the USA turning Taiwan into floating aircraft carrier - and then being threatened by such a military base. They would most likely nuke Taiwan rather than let the US annex Taiwan.

edit: This is one of the major reasons why they don't want a Taiwanese state reconised, because it could then allow US military bases on its soil.

Spread to where? Russia? Pakistan? North Korea? The Chinese lack the ability to project force with their navy, which would be on the bottom of the sea if they tried to invade Taiwan and the US fought back. They could only march troops and drive tanks into neighboring countries, which would only result in them fighting their neighbors, not threatening the US.

No, the war I think would eventually come to mainland China. The US would likely target them to cripple their navy and air force further

Dear God, this means war!

Well, anyway, hypothetical war aside, China hasn't done anything any different in spirit than what corporations in other countries including the US have done and are doing. The only difference is that they bungled it and got caught

Corporations that infringe on patents or place toxic industrial chemicals in food in the US get prosecuted and sued. Corporations that infringe on patents in China, well, nothing serious happens to them. Let's see what they do about the poisonings. I suspect they won't do much.

Well, anyway, hypothetical war aside, China hasn't done anything any different in spirit than what corporations in other countries including the US have done and are doing. The only difference is that they bungled it and got caught

Who's to say their won't be Chinese insurgents? A billion of them.

We can Great Leap Forward their asses. If there's ever been an argument for human culling, it's China and India.

I don't think you understand just quite what war with China would mean. Roughly 20% of USA trade would disappear overnight. If not more. A war with China would be costly and prolonged, and I could easily see the war escalating and pulling in other coutries. Japan would be pulled into such a war almost immediately. War with China is not a good thing at all.

It is in the long run. China is a massive, massive threat to ever single other country in the world. If they're not halted soon, they'll make Hitler's attempt at world domination a footnote in history.

Does it matter whether China poisoned the pet food on purpose? The fact is, they DID poison the food, whether accidently or otherwise. The proper response, IMHO, is to quit buying their poison! Period! If they decide to start an economic war over that, I'm sure we can add a lot more Chinese products to that list. Yes, it would hurt us, but it would hurt them too, and they know it.

Starting a shooting war over this is stupid.

As long as it doesn't go nuclear I'm cool with it.

I'm almost definitely wrong, but I swear that I read somewhere that China has no real delivery system.

Corporations that infringe on patents or place toxic industrial chemicals in food in the US get prosecuted and sued. Corporations that infringe on patents in China, well, nothing serious happens to them. Let's see what they do about the poisonings. I suspect they won't do much.

I believe earlier in the thread that it was pointed out that what China added was not toxic in the right amounts. They bungled it and got caught. As far as Chinese corporations being punished for it, well yeah that's not going to happen. It's China, remember?

We can Great Leap Forward their asses. If there's ever been an argument for human culling, it's China and India.

Dude, that's just fucked up. The majority of Chinese citizens are just working people dealing with a corrupt and uncaring government and struggling to work under unsafe and difficult conditions. India has it's problems, like bonded child labor and widespread poverty, but it's picking itself up and becoming a modern nation. It's also a very democratic country.

I'm almost definitely wrong, but I swear that I read somewhere that China has no real delivery system.

I believe that you're right. They have nukes but no way of sending them anywhere other than regional

Dude, that's just fucked up. The majority of Chinese citizens are just working people dealing with a corrupt and uncaring government and struggling to work under unsafe and difficult conditions. India has it's problems, like bonded child labor and widespread poverty, but it's picking itself up and becoming a modern nation. It's also a very democratic country.

agreed

We can Great Leap Forward their asses. If there's ever been an argument for human culling, it's China and India.
You just get more bigoted every day, don't you?

It is in the long run. China is a massive, massive threat to ever single other country in the world. If they're not halted soon, they'll make Hitler's attempt at world domination a footnote in history.Plenty of countries still have enough nuclear weapons to exterminate the human race several times over. No country in the near future is going to be making a grab for power like Nazi Germany any time soon.

We can Great Leap Forward their asses. If there's ever been an argument for human culling, it's China and India.... Yes... Thank you for sharing your opinions, but perhaps they would be best kept to yourself next time.

It may have even poisoned our food supply. Looks like they have foun melamine, the substance responsible for the poisonings, in several different products including rice protein and corn gluten. Some has been shipped to Africa, some has been used as pig feed in the US. The fact that so many different products have been contaminated leads some to believe that the poisoning was intentional because melamine contamination makes food test higher for protein.

So what's going to be done about China? They spy on our corporations and our military, violate patent laws, and now poison us. When are we seriously going to crack down and cripple their economy as punishment?

http://abcnews.go.com/Health/story?id=3058844&CMP=OTC-RSSFeeds0312


taking the post at face value....

its not "the chinese" who put poison into products to cheaply boost their score on a test for protein but an unethical chinese business that did so.

in their rush to privatize their economy, the chinese have lagged behind on things that we take for granted. this includes business ethics and food safety measures/testing.

whoever decided to add poison to gluten will probably end up being executed by the chinese govt.

China relies on the EU, Canada and the US as its primary targets for exporting. The EU is seeking to limit the ability for China to export its crap so readily.

Given this, I think the easiest way to take it down economically is for the US, Canada and Mexico (since it's also in NAFTA) to join in a similar pact with the EU to make it easier for the two economic regions to import and export goods to each other with fewer economic repercussions, while sending a strong message to China by imposing strong crippling tariffs.

No, sanctions don't work as effectively. Tariffs would hurt more because the cost of doing business will go up. They can still export their goods elsewhere but the consumer markets would have less money per capita and unable to give China the same level of business as the western markets.

At the same time, reward companies who keep their businesses within member nations, whether in the EU, Canada, US or Mexico.

This would make outsourcing to China unprofitable because of the tariffs levied against any goods manufactured there.

EDIT - other 'rich' nations such as Australia and Japan would be included.

And we should also violate their patents and steal their military and civilian technology, only problem is our technology is far ahead of theirs, so we need to do something different. Kicking their economy around a little and promising to hurt them even worse if they keep up their douchebaggery might get them to clean up their act. At the very least we should officially recognize Taiwan to show them that their actions have consequences that they won't like.

The part about the US having better technology is bull, I went to Taiping by plane to board another plane en route to the Philipines. They're airports were like the USS Enterprisee while after I got back to the US three months later the US airport looked like something primitive, the elevator didn't talk to you at all. In Hong Kong there are tons of lights replaced everyday, with enough money to waste on lights logistically after reading some articles on China about how they are building up big time they have more than enough for innovating technology. They've recently created a new aircraft called the Jian-10 (the number maybe wrong) They have advanced electronics, they have a government division for studying space. And even if America is advanced now at the rate the US is going soon we'll be inferior to them. We are living in the time of China, the time for America has passed.

I believe that you're right. They have nukes but no way of sending them anywhere other than regional

China has a credible ICBM delivery option with enough numbers (known figures of 2 dozens) and accuracy to hit west coast US.

We can Great Leap Forward their asses. If there's ever been an argument for human culling, it's China and India.

I see an insecure person who dreads competing with Chinese and Indians in a level playing field. :cool:

Either way, they're in trouble. The Chinese economy's out of control, and unless they take some drastic measures it's going to overheat and crash a lot harder than Japan did back in the early 90's.

Why? Sure it's growing fast, but the PBOC knows that and are moving to moderate it. And they have currency reserves beyond belief at this point.

Yes, the shanghai composite is out of whack, but it is a tiny, tiny index compared to the relative size of the nikkei in 1989. I don't think the two cases are even remotely similar; not least because it doesn't have the amount of leverage. And certainly, their situation is far better than the US's at the moment so at least they have the money to weather a recession.

And people have said china is overheating for years. They've said this about it since before the US's last stock bubble. Yet nothing happens. You have to remember the China is still not complaint with IFRS (in fact they are short of accountants and finance people to help them come into the system, so maybe there is an opportunity for someone like you) so it's difficult to really judge how 'bad' things are by the usual metrics.

It is possible that china is a black swan.

Also, the fastest way to piss china off is not with a trade war.

All the US has to do is tell the Taiwanese, the South Koreans and the Japanese that while we are still their allies, military overstretch means that we can no longer guarantee their security as we once did.

I'd guess that within twelve months there would be three new nuclear powers with orbital capability. That would give china a thing or two to chew on, while we could pretend we are the good guys by 'reducing' our influence in the west pacific region like they want.

The part about the US having better technology is bull, I went to Taiping by plane to board another plane en route to the Philipines. They're airports were like the USS Enterprisee while after I got back to the US three months later the US airport looked like something primitive, the elevator didn't talk to you at all. In Hong Kong there are tons of lights replaced everyday, with enough money to waste on lights logistically after reading some articles on China about how they are building up big time they have more than enough for innovating technology. They've recently created a new aircraft called the Jian-10 (the number maybe wrong) They have advanced electronics, they have a government division for studying space. And even if America is advanced now at the rate the US is going soon we'll be inferior to them. We are living in the time of China, the time for America has passed.

We put men on the moon in the sixties, they're just now getting a manned mission to space together. We've had anti satellite missiles for decades, they just recently figured out how to take down a satellite. They constantly try to steal our advanced military technology. Why? Because it's the only way that their next generation of military equipment will be able to match up to ours. If they're so advanced, why are they just now doing things we've been able to do for decades? Why do they need to steal and copy our technology?

EDIT: BTW, the J-10 is a Chinese knock-off of an Israeli fighter design that was abandoned.

We put men on the moon in the sixties, they're just now getting a manned mission to space together. We've had anti satellite missiles for decades, they just recently figured out how to take down a satellite. They constantly try to steal our advanced military technology. Why? Because it's the only way that their next generation of military equipment will be able to match up to ours. If they're so advanced, why are they just now doing things we've been able to do for decades? Why do they need to steal and copy our technology?

I'm sure some of the English felt this way about the US 150 years ago. But then again, I'm sure the vast majority of them were either too busy getting rich off the relationship, or too wrapped up in jingoism to know or care.

I imagine the US is only just beginning its efforts at global hegemony, and all of them will come to naught like the british empires did, because they it sees the world as it wants it to be, not as it is.

The reality is however, as long as you miss eating poison china food, it won't really impact you much during your lifetime. Well, apart from the continually declining standard of living.

I'm sure some of the English felt this way about the US 150 years ago. But then again, I'm sure the vast majority of them were either too busy getting rich off the relationship, or too wrapped up in jingoism to know or care.

I imagine the US is only just beginning its efforts at global hegemony, and all of them will come to naught like the british empires did, because they it sees the world as it wants it to be, not as it is.

The reality is however, as long as you miss eating poison china food, it won't really impact you much during your lifetime. Well, apart from the continually declining standard of living.

It doesn't have to be that way. We could get our heads out of our asses and insist that nations that want to engage in trade play on a truly level playing field with serious consequences for those that don't. Too bad it will never happen.

It doesn't have to be that way. We could get our heads out of our asses and insist that nations that want to engage in trade play on a truly level playing field with serious consequences for those that don't. Too bad it will never happen.

Well of course it doesn't have to be that way. But the fact is, in Nov. 2008, people are going to go to the polls and vote for a Goldman Sachs or a Walmart candidate for president, and then congratulate themselves for doing so. And both GS and Walmart have an interest in the current imbalance.

This is why I don't support people voting. Politicians can do what they want, but I'll by damned if they get my tacit approval for it.

Well of course it doesn't have to be that way. But the fact is, in Nov. 2008, people are going to go to the polls and vote for a Goldman Sachs or a Walmart candidate for president, and then congratulate themselves for doing so. And both GS and Walmart have an interest in the current imbalance.

This is why I don't support people voting. Politicians can do what they want, but I'll by damned if they get my tacit approval for it.

Funny, that's the same reason why I generally vote for leftist 3rd Party candidates

I wouldn't worry about the Chinese - in the next five hours Jack Bauer is going to seriously fuck them up.

I wouldn't worry about the Chinese - in the next five hours Jack Bauer is going to seriously fuck them up.

Hell yeah!!!! Or at least just the one that's holding Audrey

Funny, that's the same reason why I generally vote for leftist 3rd Party candidates

Dennis Kucinich is actually pretty anti banking. He has the chops to prove it too. He'll never be the candidate though. :(

Or Ron Paul.

At this point it isn't about promises, but about independence. And those are the only two who seem to have it.

Dennis Kucinich is actually pretty anti banking. He has the chops to prove it too. He'll never be the candidate though. :(

Or Ron Paul.

At this point it isn't about promises, but about independence. And those are the only two who seem to have it.

Yeah, probably not. Hopefully it will at least be an entertaining election. I'd like to see Romney's campaign crash and burn

I see an insecure person who dreads competing with Chinese and Indians in a level playing field. :cool:

No, I'm a person who dreads being in a Chinese labour camp.

You just get more bigoted every day, don't you?

Listen, am I the only one who's seriously worried that two countries have a billion, read, a BILLION, people, while the next biggest has, what, 300 million? It's a serious fuck up to the balance of power.

The West is going to be the next Africa... :(

Lace your imports to China with sarin and kill off a few in revenge. >_>
Wait we IMPORT to China? Or do you mean bonds and cash?

Wait a sec...

When their economy crashes they'll need money...

China owns a large about of Treasury Bonds...

They'll cash them to get money because they will have none...

We have no money either...

They will demand the money we DON'T have... And our government goes bankrupt...
.
.
.
Well that sucks.

So what's going to be done about China? They spy on our corporations and our military, violate patent laws, and now poison us. When are we seriously going to crack down and cripple their economy as punishment?

http://abcnews.go.com/Health/story?id=3058844&CMP=OTC-RSSFeeds0312

I would hope so. China is a serious threat to pretty much everyone else in the world and its time people realise that. Everyone so focused on the middle east as a threat, but thats not a threat. China is, and that will be clear in 5 to 10 years.

So what's going to be done about China? They spy on our corporations and our military, violate patent laws, and now poison us. When are we seriously going to crack down and cripple their economy as punishment?
Isn't the USD pretty much owned by the Yuan?

Fucking up China's economy would probably fuck up the US one.

Listen, am I the only one who's seriously worried that two countries have a billion, read, a BILLION, people, while the next biggest has, what, 300 million? It's a serious fuck up to the balance of power.

The West is going to be the next Africa... :(

Do your part. Get out there and plant your seed.

Do your part. Get out there and plant your seed.

Damn, I wish it was that easy.

lol guys we should totally bombzorz them chinese bastards fer poisoning our pet foods lol
die china man die :sniper: :mp5: :sniper: :gundge:

Listen, am I the only one who's seriously worried that two countries have a billion, read, a BILLION, people, while the next biggest has, what, 300 million? It's a serious fuck up to the balance of power.

The West is going to be the next Africa... :(China and India are both becoming capitalistic corporate paradises at a phenomenal rate. We're more likely on our way to becoming a world dominated by huge corporate powers than we are to one dominated by Chinese or Indian political or military systems.

Do your part. Get out there and plant your seed.

LOL, I may just use that in my sig.

Wait we IMPORT to China? Or do you mean bonds and cash?

Wait a sec...

When their economy crashes they'll need money...

China owns a large about of Treasury Bonds...

They'll cash them to get money because they will have none...

We have no money either...

They will demand the money we DON'T have... And our government goes bankrupt...
.
.
.
Well that sucks.

A government really can't default on a bond denominated in its own currency. It can always just "print" more money.

No, I'm a person who dreads being in a Chinese labour camp.

I hear that there is a lovely alternative resort at the edge of cuba.

Other than that, I am rather baffled with this entire fear of "the yellow peril".

The chinese have always been a nation that could care less about the outside world and their imperialistic tendencies have been alot less agressive when compared to other nations.

Economic collapse? A small chance. Their banks are slowly developing solvency and to scream "over-heating" merely because they run good numbers is a display of a lack of economical knowledge.

Dreams of militairy conquest? Hardly, they are happy with the state of their borders and have no militairy slights to settle.

They're biggest worry is probably to awfull state of their ecology but that is an internal problem thanks to the death of the kyoto protocol.

I would hope so. China is a serious threat to pretty much everyone else in the world and its time people realise that. Everyone so focused on the middle east as a threat, but thats not a threat. China is, and that will be clear in 5 to 10 years.


Nations become threats when interrests collide and their behaviour becomes unpredicatable. One can say many things about China, but their interrests are intertwined with both european and american ones when it concerns the global economy of which they are a major winner.

They have been predicatable players on the world stage for the last 30 years or so.

Try saying the same thing of the middle east which is trying to handle it's culture of shame which they need to disprouve by standing up to the west. They goverments are hardly predictable and trustworthy and American interrest surely doesn't easily harmonize with many middle eastern nations.

This fear for china is only understandable from a psychological point of view, namely that a previous dominant force that is losing power fears any rivals that might upsurp it.

Well it is my understanding that they eat what we would call pets there.:p

To the wicked, everything serves as pretext. ~Voltaire

Well it is my understanding that they eat what we would call pets there.:p

I have seen it for myself.

Well it is my understanding that they eat what we would call pets there.:p

And you eat what we call holy. :p

Isn't the USD pretty much owned by the Yuan?

Fucking up China's economy would probably fuck up the US one.

Actually the Yuan is what is pegged to USD.

And the reverse is also true for the second statement. Reason why I am confident that we will see a lot of posturing and some proxy wars at best but no direct conflicts.

Nations become threats when interrests collide and their behaviour becomes unpredicatable. One can say many things about China, but their interrests are intertwined with both european and american ones when it concerns the global economy of which they are a major winner.

They have been predicatable players on the world stage for the last 30 years or so.

Try saying the same thing of the middle east which is trying to handle it's culture of shame which they need to disprouve by standing up to the west. They goverments are hardly predictable and trustworthy and American interrest surely doesn't easily harmonize with many middle eastern nations.

This fear for china is only understandable from a psychological point of view, namely that a previous dominant force that is losing power fears any rivals that might upsurp it.

China is just using the Americans and Europeans until their economy and military is strong enough to work without them(and that won't be long). Then China will turn on them. Say what you will about the middle east but they are far more religious than the Chinese and their actions will be held in check because of this. The Chinese, as atheist Communists have no one to answer to and are more unpredictable than middle eastern states.

Funny, that's the same reason why I generally vote for leftist 3rd Party candidates

Proportional Representation FTW.

China is just using the Americans and Europeans until their economy and military is strong enough to work without them(and that won't be long). Then China will turn on them. Say what you will about the middle east but they are far more religious than the Chinese and their actions will be held in check because of this. The Chinese, as atheist Communists have no one to answer to and are more unpredictable than middle eastern states.

Yes, I certainly remember when North Korean terrorists funded and trained by China flew airliners into the World Trade Center in the name of the international proletarian revolution.

[QUOTE=Soviestan;12571713] Say what you will about the middle east but they are far more religious than the Chinese and their actions will be held in check because of this. QUOTE]

Listen to your self. Since when were religeous fanatics ever good at holding their actions in check? I'd chose egocentric heathens over fanatics everday, because at least the communists are predictable.

Something has to be done, and it has to be done now. If we get into a trade war it will seriously hurt the US economy, but you can't get into a scrap and not expect to get hurt. Too bad investors in Walmart and Nike and other big name companies are too woried about their stock being hurt to stand up for their country.

My suggestion is to make it favorable for business to operate in the U.S. Getting rid of the IRS and replacing the income taxes with the retail sales tax would be one way to do that.

Yes, I certainly remember when North Korean terrorists funded and trained by China flew airliners into the World Trade Center in the name of the international proletarian revolution.
stupid terrorists, always jumping on the latest bandwagon

wait... from the article

"Melamine, which is used to make plastics in the United States and as a fertilizer in Asia."

fertilizer is found in a food product.

now i'm not a legal man but isn't it possible, just maybe that the melanine got into the food products in a inocous way, like say... being sprayed on it as a fertilizer or in an animals feed?

My suggestion is to make it favorable for business to operate in the U.S. Getting rid of the IRS and replacing the income taxes with the retail sales tax would be one way to do that.

Maybe the fair tax with it's rebates for the poor, but definitely not just a sales tax. Since the poor spend a much higher percentage of their income a straight sales tax would be very regressive and hit poor folks hardest.

Say what you will about the middle east but they are far more religious than the Chinese and their actions will be held in check because of this.

Yes, yes, the old McCarthyism back again eh? What's the matter? Not enough people painting Islamic extremists as saints?

As for religious people being held in check, yeah right. What better excuse to commit atrocities than "God/Allah demands it and will give me a place in heaven for it"?

Maybe the fair tax with it's rebates for the poor, but definitely not just a sales tax. Since the poor spend a much higher percentage of their income a straight sales tax would be very regressive and hit poor folks hardest.
That's what I meant.

As an aside, the term "Fair Tax" has become so popular in Georgia, that a bill calling itself a "Fair Tax" will be introduced next session. It doesn't even resemble the Linder-sponsored bill, but it has the advantage of name recognition.