NationStates Jolt Archive

I'm feeling in my fascist mood again so don't freak out, I go back and forth with fascism and meritocracy, its kinda like Dr. Jekle Mr. Hyde. I've been hearing tons of crap about American parents maltreating their children, its more common than any other news here. In conclusion I think that since very few parents are capable of properly raising children I think every parent should pass certain tests in order to become a parent or if they already are and they fail all the children they are a "guardian" of are sent to special facilities where children are schooled (as in taught to read write ect, only they have a boot camp class to make them hardcore soldiers, I'll get to that in a bit) in the government for free. They will be raised by the government as soldiers that way the US will acquire a really large army just by rescuing all the abused children from their parents and conscripting them. For a plus the government should give them free counseling so that they become stable after all that abuse.

Thoughts? Comments?

I don't like the idea of forcing maltreated children to become soldiers. They have had enough stress for one lifetime.

crazy madness I say why can't you be a good little communist?

also I've been toying with the idea of having some military schooling in school just because it makes responsible folk of most people and because its a good deal of fun

...well I would of liked it...I think

I'm feeling in my fascist mood again so don't freak out, I go back and forth with fascism and meritocracy, its kinda like Dr. Jekle Mr. Hyde. I've been hearing tons of crap about American parents maltreating their children, its more common than any other news here. In conclusion I think that since very few parents are capable of properly raising children I think every parent should pass certain tests in order to become a parent or if they already are and they fail all the children they are a "guardian" of are sent to special facilities where children are schooled (as in taught to read write ect, only they have a boot camp class to make them hardcore soldiers, I'll get to that in a bit) in the government for free. They will be raised by the government as soldiers that way the US will acquire a really large army just by rescuing all the abused children from their parents and conscripting them. For a plus the government should give them free counseling so that they become stable after all that abuse.

Thoughts? Comments?So, being forcably conscipted into military service at a young age would be condusive to creating emotionaly and developmentaly stable adults?


Yeah.... that sounds well thought out...

Four years of compulsory national service between 18-22 is a most excellent idea. It has many benefits:

1. Reduces the unemployment figures far more cheaply than the current system of forcing everyone into pointless higher education.

2. Reduces health care costs by lowering the number of chronic fat asses and subjecting the entire population to a proper regime of diet, health care and exercise.

3. Provides - if done properly - the country with cheap infrastructure and land improvement projects.

4. Creates a large manpower reserve fit for military service at little cost.

5. Significantly lowers stranger on stranger violent crime and petty lawbreaking.

6. Forces integration across class and racial lines.

7. Creates a common national identity.

And those are just the highlights.

I really can't see why we don't do it. It's one thing the commies got right.

So, being forcably conscipted into military service at a young age would be condusive to creating emotionaly and developmentaly stable adults?


Yeah.... that sounds well thought out...

He they'll be disciplined, and they won't be corrupted by the messed up US culture, and all the anger pent up in them will make them good soldiers. Instead of running around killing American students in colleges they'll be killing America's enemies. Besides what I stated above as a proposal is what happens ICly in my nation. Thats a main reason people don't dare abuse children (they don't want GI Joe kicking down their door with a minigun barrel shoved in their face) and it makes my army larger, and most of my IC civs are kinda peace loving while my government wants the destruction of all the nation's enemies.

3. Provides - if done properly - the country with cheap infrastructure and land improvement projects.

4. Creates a large manpower reserve fit for military service at little cost.

I'd like to know what you consider cheap.

7. Creates a common national identity.

That is not a benefit at all.

Four years of compulsory national service between 18-22 is a most excellent idea. It has many benefits:

1. Reduces the unemployment figures far more cheaply than the current system of forcing everyone into pointless higher education.

2. Reduces health care costs by lowering the number of chronic fat asses and subjecting the entire population to a proper regime of diet, health care and exercise.

3. Provides - if done properly - the country with cheap infrastructure and land improvement projects.

4. Creates a large manpower reserve fit for military service at little cost.

5. Significantly lowers stranger on stranger violent crime and petty lawbreaking.

6. Forces integration across class and racial lines.

7. Creates a common national identity.

And those are just the highlights.

I really can't see why we don't do it. It's one thing the commies got right.

How about because it isn't the government's job to tell me what I should or should not be doing, unless I am harming someone else?

He they'll be disciplined, and they won't be corrupted by the messed up US culture, and all the anger pent up in them will make them good soldiers. Instead of running around killing American students in colleges they'll be killing America's enemies. Besides what I stated above as a proposal is what happens ICly in my nation. Thats a main reason people don't dare abuse children (they don't want GI Joe kicking down their door with a minigun barrel shoved in their face) and it makes my army larger, and most of my IC civs are kinda peace loving while my government wants the destruction of all the nation's enemies.Maybe you should just leave it in RP then. Because in real life, destruction of all your nations enemys means death and suffering for lots of innocents and the mindset that makes up a 'good soldier doesn't usually equal a person capable of functioning in a normal society (outside of the military).

But I ICly train the rescued children for both. That way when they leave they will fit in with society.

You can't train people to fit in with society (especially combined with military training), all you would be doing is manipulating society.

Maybe you should just leave it in RP then. Because in real life, destruction of all your nations enemys means death and suffering for lots of innocents and the mindset that makes up a 'good soldier doesn't usually equal a person capable of functioning in a normal society (outside of the military).

But I ICly train the rescued children for both. That way when they leave they will fit in with society.

1. Reduces the unemployment figures far more cheaply than the current system of forcing everyone into pointless higher education.

yes because an educated population isn't profitable at all and all this talk of skilled job sectors being the only conceivable economic future for the west is utter tripe :rolleyes:

How about because it isn't the government's job to tell me what I should or should not be doing, unless I am harming someone else?

Apparently, that's exactly the governments job though. Who you do or do not harm is largely irrelevant.

The benefits of such a scheme, properly run, would be enormous. I really don't see the downside other than a few abstract objections about rights which are largely illusory anyway.

But I ICly train the rescued children for both. That way when they leave they will fit in with society.Sounds nice, but it dosen't work that way in real life. The reality would be children even more screwed up than when you started with them. Hence my comment about leaving it in RP.

You can't train people to fit in with society (especially combined with military training), all you would be doing is manipulating society.

Well the US society needs cleaning up, it needs to go back to a time where people didn't need to live in fear of crime and incompetence, it needs to go back to a time of simplicity, trust, justice and a time where locks were not required. It needs to go back to a time where there were no shootings, no sociopaths running rampant under liberal protection damaging stuff at the expense of hard working tax payers.

Well the US society needs cleaning up, it needs to go back to a time where people didn't need to live in fear of crime and incompetence, it needs to go back to a time of simplicity, trust, justice and a time where locks were not required. It needs to go back to a time where there were no shootings, no sociopaths running rampant under liberal protection damaging stuff at the expense of hard working tax payers.

um BS crime has fallen everywhere and always has, the media is just reporting it more now (hence why prisons turned into torture chambers during the late 1800's)

ah the glory days when you could be killed and your family raped if you traveled outside the town border :rolleyes:

um BS crime has fallen everywhere and always has, the media is just reporting it more now (hence why prisons turned into torture chambers during the late 1800's)

ah the glory days when you could be killed and your family raped if you traveled outside the town border :rolleyes:


Of course all the bad things from the old times would be left out because the manipulated society would only have the past's good properties and try to eliminate as many bad ones as they can.

Well the US society needs cleaning up, it needs to go back to a time where people didn't need to live in fear of crime and incompetence, it needs to go back to a time of simplicity, trust, justice and a time where locks were not required. It needs to go back to a time where there were no shootings, no sociopaths running rampant under liberal protection damaging stuff at the expense of hard working tax payers.

You mean a time when white people didn't need to live in fear, because if not, I can't think of a time you're talking of.

yes because an educated population isn't profitable at all and all this talk of skilled job sectors being the only conceivable economic future for the west is utter tripe :rolleyes:

I've got nothing against a skilled workforce. In fact there is a shortage of skilled workers.

But banging as many people as possible into college isn't the best way to get it. All it does is dilute the value of actual university degrees, while failing to actually produce people with many of the skills we need. (Hence the thriving H1B visa program). It's also costly and inefficient. Not to mention that it leaves many people with debts that it will take them a substantial portion of their lives to repay these days.

Frankly, the only real beneficiaries of the current system are the universities and the government (through lower unemployment).

I'm also quite sure that a properly run national service system would have some from of artificer program which would provide skilled workers anyway. And of course, there would still be the option of university - for free with the money saved no doubt - for people who really needed it afterwards.

As to many of the supposed intangible benefits of higher education (reliability, seeing things through yadda, yadda, yadda ..... well I'm fairly sure that they are just a product of maturity rather than actually because someone hung around ivy covered walls for four years).

um BS crime has fallen everywhere and always has, the media is just reporting it more now (hence why prisons turned into torture chambers during the late 1800's)

ah the glory days when you could be killed and your family raped if you traveled outside the town border :rolleyes:

Crime has fallen in the US because we lock so many people up in frankly inhuman conditions.

Unsupervised young men are most likely to commit crimes, and once you are in the system its a blight on the rest of your life.

National service would ameliorate this considerably, and without the impact or cost of the current immoral incarceration rate.

You mean a time when white people didn't need to live in fear, because if not, I can't think of a time you're talking of.

It'll be improvised so no one needs to live in fear.

It'll be improvised so no one needs to live in fear.

Then why not improvise on the present....ammm, which is what we're doing?

When was the time we didn't live in fear?

Of course all the bad things from the old times would be left out because the manipulated society would only have the past's good properties and try to eliminate as many bad ones as they can.
So you're going to brainwash people into thinking the past was all fine and dandy and encourage them to regress.

Wow. You should write dystopian books.

Wow. You should write dystopian books.

Accidentally.

I'm feeling in my fascist mood again so don't freak out, I go back and forth with fascism and meritocracy, its kinda like Dr. Jekle Mr. Hyde. I've been hearing tons of crap about American parents maltreating their children, its more common than any other news here. In conclusion I think that since very few parents are capable of properly raising children I think every parent should pass certain tests in order to become a parent or if they already are and they fail all the children they are a "guardian" of are sent to special facilities where children are schooled (as in taught to read write ect, only they have a boot camp class to make them hardcore soldiers, I'll get to that in a bit) in the government for free. They will be raised by the government as soldiers that way the US will acquire a really large army just by rescuing all the abused children from their parents and conscripting them. For a plus the government should give them free counseling so that they become stable after all that abuse.

Thoughts? Comments?

Don't worry. There are times where I feel totalitarianism is best, despite that I am usually an anti-authoritarian communist

I am fundamentally opposed to both fascism and meritocracy. I think your idea of sending children to government boot camps could make a great dystopian novel. I agree that children should not be left in the care of the unprepared and unwilling- but there are far better ways to deal with this problem than making children subservient wards of the state.

Like the institution of meritocracy itself, such a system in ripe with potential abuses and crimes against the human will.

edit: Wow, I wasnt the only one who read this and thought it sounded like the plot of a dystopian novel.

Well the US society needs cleaning up, it needs to go back to a time where people didn't need to live in fear of crime and incompetence, it needs to go back to a time of simplicity, trust, justice and a time where locks were not required. It needs to go back to a time where there were no shootings, no sociopaths running rampant under liberal protection damaging stuff at the expense of hard working tax payers.

Yes, like the good old days- we should have extensive citizen training, compulsory military service, intolerance for the breaking of social conventions, and strict government oversight on all aspects of life.

Wait...were the 'good old days' last week in China?

Four years of compulsory national service between 18-22 is a most excellent idea. It has many benefits:

1. Reduces the unemployment figures far more cheaply than the current system of forcing everyone into pointless higher education.

2. Reduces health care costs by lowering the number of chronic fat asses and subjecting the entire population to a proper regime of diet, health care and exercise.

3. Provides - if done properly - the country with cheap infrastructure and land improvement projects.

4. Creates a large manpower reserve fit for military service at little cost.

5. Significantly lowers stranger on stranger violent crime and petty lawbreaking.

6. Forces integration across class and racial lines.

7. Creates a common national identity.

And those are just the highlights.

I really can't see why we don't do it. It's one thing the commies got right.Four years? Fuck that. I might not be all that adverse to a national service of some sort, but it wouldn't be solely focused on the military. On the contary it could be focused on actual social projects in need of extra manpower. There could be various options to choose where you do your service. You could work as an ambulance crew or an auxilary nurse, but various occupations that require high levels of fitness, but relatively low levels of training.

Well the US society needs cleaning up, it needs to go back to a time where people didn't need to live in fear of crime and incompetence, it needs to go back to a time of simplicity, trust, justice and a time where locks were not required. It needs to go back to a time where there were no shootings, no sociopaths running rampant under liberal protection damaging stuff at the expense of hard working tax payers.

...a time when everyone was a state serving automoton...

Why don't make the entore population robots only existing to serve the government??

Considering how many posters have called you out on the "highly inadvisable" nature of many of your suggestions, where's the option for "another idiotic idea from me"?

Crime has fallen in the US because we lock so many people up in frankly inhuman conditions.

Unsupervised young men are most likely to commit crimes, and once you are in the system its a blight on the rest of your life.

Abortion seems to be more responsible for that that drop in crime than excessive incarceration.

As evidence for their findings, the researchers point to data regarding the timing of the crime drop: the first generation of pregnancies terminated under legalized abortion would have otherwise resulted in children who reached the peak ages for criminal activity, 18 to 24, in the early 1990s. Increases in 1970s abortions by high-risk mothers may have lowered the number of potential criminals coming of age in the 1990s.

The study also reports that states such as California and New York, which legalized abortion before 1973, experienced a drop in their crime rates before the rest of the nation. Furthermore, empirical evidence suggests states with higher abortion rates have seen more dramatic decreases in crime since 1985, and those drops in crime have been concentrated among individuals under age 25 in 1997––precisely the group possibly affected by abortion legalization in 1973.
[1 (http://chronicle.uchicago.edu/990812/abortion.shtml)]

We offer evidence that legalized abortion has contributed significantly to recent crime reductions. Crime began to fall roughly 18 years after abortion legalization. The 5 states that allowed abortion in 1970 experienced declines earlier than the rest of the nation, which legalized in 1973 with Roe v. Wade. States with high abortion rates in the 1970s and 1980s experienced greater crime reductions in the 1990s. In high abortion states, only arrests of those born after abortion legalization fall relative to low abortion states. Legalized abortion appears to account for as much as 50 percent of the recent drop in crime.[2 (http://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=174508)]

National service would ameliorate this considerably, and without the impact or cost of the current immoral incarceration rate.

Considering that forced servitued is a form of immoral incarceration, your statement is oximoronic.

Why don't make the entore population robots only existing to serve the government??Because we've already hit peak oil, and researching alternative energy sources is just too damn expensive (plus, robots with a quietly humming electric motor just don't make the same as a loud, blaring, smokin one).

So humans win out. Now on your knees and kiss whatever currency's in your pocket.

I have a hard time with idiots breeding. Idealistically, they shouldn't be allowed. Realistically, I'd never want to live in a country that stopped them.

I really can't see why we don't do it. It's one thing the commies got right.

Feudalists. It was the kings that got this idea first.