NationStates Jolt Archive

America? Home of the brave and the free? Or just as totalitarian as current day Russia?

To me America has always been the lighthouse of the free and the brave, no longer… The light bulb broke and America seems incapable of fixing it, the worst part is… it is creating a short out worsening the situation.

America still claims to be the nation of the free and the brave, however when you look at the facts and ignore your patriotic feelings (which I am aware is something that is hard to do for even liberal Americans), the USA has less liberties then even ex-communist eastern European nations. Also in my opinion the USA has become something that is not much different from the ultra-conservative Iran but then based on the principals of Christianity instead of the Islam. In this essay I will bring to you my reasons for saying: “Europe, just drop the USA, it’s done for.”

In America these days the news is totally off, on one side the people from FOX news make it look as if anything left from the republican party directly is no better then communists. They even manage to twist things so much that they make a democratic speech about how good the democratic party is sound like a testimony that the Democratic party is no more then bullcrap. This is no different when it comes to the liberal news stations in the country. This means that if you were to get an accurate picture of the news you would have to tune into foreign news agencies. Of course they spin and twist as well but compared to even the most factual news station in the USA, they’re HIGHLY accurate.

Now lets turn to the American gun nuts, now I understand it’s a laugh to shoot your gun, I quite enjoy shooting of a few rounds myself, however I am strongly against private owned so I don’t have any of my own. So now you’ve got my understanding… What in gods name do you need military grade rifles, machine guns, cannons even rocket launchers for (Texas)? I don’t expect people to carry around a .50 cal machine gun for when they get robbed. Then Americans claim it’s for national defence… seriously… if anything defeats the American army in the USA itself (outside is possible but inside NO) then no rednecks are going to have the firepower to even dent that force.

To continue on the areas of rights and the bible etc. Most Americans are Christian, the lovely thing about that is that those Christians are also mostly conservative Christians but also interpret the bible selectively. I always love it when the Yanks go out on the street when a brain-dead person gets put off of life support screaming don’t play god. Now here comes the great part that those people are so dumb that they cant even understand that keeping them on life-support is playing god in the first place, letting nature take its course is NOT playing god. To continue, thou shall not kill. *Giggle*, the most Christian nation on earth is the one with the death penalty, need I go on? Gay rights also something very nice, it is up to god to decide who is right or wrong and not us Humans, and if god had hated gays then why does he allow it? If he truly is “god” then he can stop gayness too or is he just as selective about his powers as Christians are about how they interpret the bible? Christians then say that god punishes the gay rights activists. The Funny part is, that the nation that was the first to recognise things like gay marriage hasn’t seen natural disasters in over half a century + ditto for nations that followed suit and gave gays equal rights as well. Also the most humorous thing, the party that claims to be closest to the bible (the republicans) is actually the furthest away, the party that the republicans claim to be secular atheist extremists (Democrats) are actually closer to the bible. Why? Equal Education for all is prescribed by the bible this also goes for healthcare and poverty (you shall share with those that are worse off then you), on top of this I put things like the death penalty. To put a stress on all this, the USA currently has the worst educational system of the western world AND most of Eastern Europe, to detail this the vast majority of Americans get worse education the western world and all of eastern Europe, a small percentage (5%-10%) gets education that is on par with the West European AVAREGE. This figure has been stagnating and the quality of education is expected to fall with a few percent every single year until it is stopped. This does not mean the American education system is falling, it means it is not improving to modern standards while the rest of the world IS thus creating a bigger and bigger gap which will be more and more expensive to bridge when someone finally decides to do so, which is a must due to the fact that the US economy FLOATS on it’s innovation. Without a smart population, the US economy is expected to be on a 2nd world level within 1 generation (when the well educated are dead or on pensions and no longer contributing to the American economy and thus killing it). The American healthcare system is also in a terrible state, the American healthcare is better then ANYWHERE in the world, but only for LESS then 5% of its population, 67% of the Americans live above eastern European levels but bellow western European levels, the rest lives under the Eastern European levels. This is mainly due to the fact that Americans can no longer afford healthcare, in the USA a few hundred thousand die a year of diseases that can EASILY be treated EVEN in the 3rd world. Poverty is also a great problem, the USA’s poverty line is also twice as low as that of Europe, meaning that in the USA you are still considered middle class when you are considered poor in western Europe. The amount of help you get from the government in Europe is also substantially higher, in a nation that CLAIMS to be the richest of them all… this is a very sad fact. Now back to religion, I will go back to gay rights, euthanasia etc. the USA has a constitution written with liberties in mind, is it not amusing that a nation that prides itself for religious tolerance is also the nation that forces Christian beliefs and laws upon non-Christians? Why should I as a non Christian have to abide to YOUR!!! beliefs about gays, and euthanasia etc? By doing so, America is doing what Iran is doing: Enforcing Muslim laws on non Muslims.

On the international policy, the USA has been pushing away its allies, America is left with no strong allies, America only has traditional allies left who are only such because of the word traditional. In 2001, President George W. Bush threatened to invade an EU nation (the Netherlands) if it ever put an American in front of a court for war crimes, this statement has infuriated many European nations and was the starting point of Anti-American sentiments across the western world. After this the Iraq war came and many of the American allies refused to participate in this war, this lead to America saying things like: France and Germany are our enemies. Increasing the Anti-American sentiment, with American torture scandals popping up something dramatic has happened: In the EU only 64%!! are anti-American in a sence of dropping out of NATO etc. The EU has also set up a new defence force for EU members and EU candidates only that supersedes NATO. In South Korea the Majority of the South Koreans are anti-American and want the American armed forces to leave the country, this majority remained a majority even after the nuclear bomb of North Korea detonated. Yes even after. The sentiment is also rising in Japan however is not yet at Majority level, but close. Nations like Australia, just like the EU, have a majority anti-American sentiment and there is even talk about a breaking of ANZUS ties.

To add to all of this, possibly the worst part, it seems to be possible to buy your way into office. In America, there are huge sums of money going into presidential election campaigns, this in essence can get you most of you votes and also means that the president is not in the first place elected on his policy’s but that such a thing is only secondary to the amount of money they have to make their policy’s heard. This also means that the chance that you will miss out on the most brilliant politician ever is unheard of, due to the fact that you need the money to get your word across. There could be another JFK out there but will never see office because of his lack of class. It sort of reminds me of the middle ages of Europe.

Also the only things that still make Americans proud are actually gone, few have realised it yet but the USA has been economically surpassed by the EU. Even when ignoring that, the Economic situation in the EU has always been much brighter then in the USA, that is… for the last decade or 2. In the EU prices are much lower, so is the inflation so that gap will also widen even further. Something that you pay 1 international $ for in the EU will cost you 1,96 international $’s in the USA. The exact same product and shipping costs ignored. This also puts the USA’s military supremacy at risk. Due to the fact that the Europeans will have to pay less for the same high grade equipment. Sure the USA is still stronger, but the difference of 600 billion int. dollars (USA defence budget) vs 300 billion int. dollars (EU defence budget) is not 2 vs 1 but more 4 vs 3. Again 300 billion int. dollars defence budget for the EU is a lot more then 300 billion int. dollars defence budget for the USA. (this paragraph was all a side not on the bigger issue)

The question that now remains is, looking at this… Hasn’t the USA changed? While the USA was trying to figure out what to do it was surpassed by its allies on the field of education, healthcare, poverty and economy. At the same time the gap between the USA and its allies has never been so great and one should wonder if Europe, Japan, Australia, Canada and others will ever come to the USA’s rescue if it would ever need it. America dug a deep hole for itself, how will it get out?

No, you're right. Blind patriots won't like this. Neither will non-blind, cynical, atheist, Christian, Muslim, stingy, charitable, bull-headed, open-minded, or pretty much any other kind of American.

We've seen a hundred variants of this essay, and they're remarkable only in their similarities. Yes, the USA has problems, and you've highlighted some of the bigger ones. However, your stereotypical sorting of so many of us into neat pigeonholes may match the media presentation of America, but it's not the reality.

I've heard exactly this same diatribe from my Dutch cousins. Yet somehow when they come over for a visit, they marvel that the places we live are so unlike the "real America". They're perfectly capable of driving down a superhighway and pointing out ten things that match their stereotype view, whilst totally ignoring the 500 things that don't.

I don't see any suggestions, just a catalog of faults. Here's a clue for you: we know our faults. What we need is solutions.

Got any?

Sorry, I tuned out at the first "Most Americans".

Sorry, I tuned out at the first "Most Americans".

You got that far? I left after... as totalitarian as current day Russia.

For all it's failings, the US is still a pretty ok place to live in, especially given some alternatives in the world.

*yawn*

To play the devil's advocate. *ahem*

America is the greatest country in the world! Without us Europe would be Germanyvilletownship! Stupid communits would be eating off the queen's ass for dinner.

Der jukka our jobs!

There.

America? Home of the brave and the free? Or just as totalitarian as current day Russia?


While the US is clearly not perfect, your use of the word totalitarian doesn't seem to be entirely accurate, nor do your statistics seem to make much sense, for example, your claim that "in the USA a few hundred thousand die a year of diseases that can EASILY be treated EVEN in the 3rd world." is extremely questionable. The US death rate is 8.26/1000, meaning roughly 247,800 people die in the US each year. The vast bulk die from heart disease, lung diseases or whatnot, not "diseases that can EASILY be treated".

Or guns. I have no clue where you get your information on American gun ownership, or how you consider the liberty for the people to own guns totalitarian, but you are seriously misrepresenting the American gun owning population.

Seriously man, there's problems, but calling the US totalitarian and then using questionable statistics ain't helping anybody.

Or Fox News. How many people do you really think watch Fox? It's a meager portion of the market, that is continually falling. Most people realize that Fox has gone off the deep end and don't bother with it anymore.

Got any?
Smash the foundation; turn it inside out and build it from the bottom up.

It start with the people. The government that exists; in this form is too corrupt to follow through on legitimate reforms that would validate America as a strong power of righteousness.

The very constitution that makes up America needs to be amended for the 21st century; it needs to really embrace the concept that ALL men (and women) are indeed created equal and that nothing changes that.

Discrimination, whether intentional or not stands in the way and by breaking down the barriers it can the begin to once more grow.

The money used to fund the wars and military would be the first things to be slashed; health, education and civil infrastructure would be at the top of the list and it would help give anyone the chance to live the dream; live the American dream that anyone can be president when they grow up.

Yes the economy would take a blow, but for a viable economy, you need healthy, educated people. To get that, you need to invest in early childhood education and comprehensive healthcare.

To keep the wheels of the economic machine greased, you need childcare services to allow parents to work, and parents who can work can also invest in the economy.

People wouldn't need to pick between health and work; they could have both and keep the country ticking.

A country is only as strong as its weakest link.

America? Home of the brave and the free? Or just as totalitarian as current day Russia?

To me America has always been the lighthouse of the free and the brave, no longer… The light bulb broke and America seems incapable of fixing it, the worst part is… it is creating a short out worsening the situation.

America still claims to be the nation of the free and the brave, however when you look at the facts and ignore your patriotic feelings (which I am aware is something that is hard to do for even liberal Americans), the USA has less liberties then even ex-communist eastern European nations. Also in my opinion the USA has become something that is not much different from the ultra-conservative Iran but then based on the principals of Christianity instead of the Islam. In this essay I will bring to you my reasons for saying: “Europe, just drop the USA, it’s done for.”

In America these days the news is totally off, on one side the people from FOX news make it look as if anything left from the republican party directly is no better then communists. They even manage to twist things so much that they make a democratic speech about how good the democratic party is sound like a testimony that the Democratic party is no more then bullcrap. This is no different when it comes to the liberal news stations in the country. This means that if you were to get an accurate picture of the news you would have to tune into foreign news agencies. Of course they spin and twist as well but compared to even the most factual news station in the USA, they’re HIGHLY accurate.

Now lets turn to the American gun nuts, now I understand it’s a laugh to shoot your gun, I quite enjoy shooting of a few rounds myself, however I am strongly against private owned so I don’t have any of my own. So now you’ve got my understanding… What in gods name do you need military grade rifles, machine guns, cannons even rocket launchers for (Texas)? I don’t expect people to carry around a .50 cal machine gun for when they get robbed. Then Americans claim it’s for national defence… seriously… if anything defeats the American army in the USA itself (outside is possible but inside NO) then no rednecks are going to have the firepower to even dent that force.

To continue on the areas of rights and the bible etc. Most Americans are Christian, the lovely thing about that is that those Christians are also mostly conservative Christians but also interpret the bible selectively. I always love it when the Yanks go out on the street when a brain-dead person gets put off of life support screaming don’t play god. Now here comes the great part that those people are so dumb that they cant even understand that keeping them on life-support is playing god in the first place, letting nature take its course is NOT playing god. To continue, thou shall not kill. *Giggle*, the most Christian nation on earth is the one with the death penalty, need I go on? Gay rights also something very nice, it is up to god to decide who is right or wrong and not us Humans, and if god had hated gays then why does he allow it? If he truly is “god” then he can stop gayness too or is he just as selective about his powers as Christians are about how they interpret the bible? Christians then say that god punishes the gay rights activists. The Funny part is, that the nation that was the first to recognise things like gay marriage hasn’t seen natural disasters in over half a century + ditto for nations that followed suit and gave gays equal rights as well. Also the most humorous thing, the party that claims to be closest to the bible (the republicans) is actually the furthest away, the party that the republicans claim to be secular atheist extremists (Democrats) are actually closer to the bible. Why? Equal Education for all is prescribed by the bible this also goes for healthcare and poverty (you shall share with those that are worse off then you), on top of this I put things like the death penalty. To put a stress on all this, the USA currently has the worst educational system of the western world AND most of Eastern Europe, to detail this the vast majority of Americans get worse education the western world and all of eastern Europe, a small percentage (5%-10%) gets education that is on par with the West European AVAREGE. This figure has been stagnating and the quality of education is expected to fall with a few percent every single year until it is stopped. This does not mean the American education system is falling, it means it is not improving to modern standards while the rest of the world IS thus creating a bigger and bigger gap which will be more and more expensive to bridge when someone finally decides to do so, which is a must due to the fact that the US economy FLOATS on it’s innovation. Without a smart population, the US economy is expected to be on a 2nd world level within 1 generation (when the well educated are dead or on pensions and no longer contributing to the American economy and thus killing it). The American healthcare system is also in a terrible state, the American healthcare is better then ANYWHERE in the world, but only for LESS then 5% of its population, 67% of the Americans live above eastern European levels but bellow western European levels, the rest lives under the Eastern European levels. This is mainly due to the fact that Americans can no longer afford healthcare, in the USA a few hundred thousand die a year of diseases that can EASILY be treated EVEN in the 3rd world. Poverty is also a great problem, the USA’s poverty line is also twice as low as that of Europe, meaning that in the USA you are still considered middle class when you are considered poor in western Europe. The amount of help you get from the government in Europe is also substantially higher, in a nation that CLAIMS to be the richest of them all… this is a very sad fact. Now back to religion, I will go back to gay rights, euthanasia etc. the USA has a constitution written with liberties in mind, is it not amusing that a nation that prides itself for religious tolerance is also the nation that forces Christian beliefs and laws upon non-Christians? Why should I as a non Christian have to abide to YOUR!!! beliefs about gays, and euthanasia etc? By doing so, America is doing what Iran is doing: Enforcing Muslim laws on non Muslims.

On the international policy, the USA has been pushing away its allies, America is left with no strong allies, America only has traditional allies left who are only such because of the word traditional. In 2001, President George W. Bush threatened to invade an EU nation (the Netherlands) if it ever put an American in front of a court for war crimes, this statement has infuriated many European nations and was the starting point of Anti-American sentiments across the western world. After this the Iraq war came and many of the American allies refused to participate in this war, this lead to America saying things like: France and Germany are our enemies. Increasing the Anti-American sentiment, with American torture scandals popping up something dramatic has happened: In the EU only 64%!! are anti-American in a sence of dropping out of NATO etc. The EU has also set up a new defence force for EU members and EU candidates only that supersedes NATO. In South Korea the Majority of the South Koreans are anti-American and want the American armed forces to leave the country, this majority remained a majority even after the nuclear bomb of North Korea detonated. Yes even after. The sentiment is also rising in Japan however is not yet at Majority level, but close. Nations like Australia, just like the EU, have a majority anti-American sentiment and there is even talk about a breaking of ANZUS ties.

To add to all of this, possibly the worst part, it seems to be possible to buy your way into office. In America, there are huge sums of money going into presidential election campaigns, this in essence can get you most of you votes and also means that the president is not in the first place elected on his policy’s but that such a thing is only secondary to the amount of money they have to make their policy’s heard. This also means that the chance that you will miss out on the most brilliant politician ever is unheard of, due to the fact that you need the money to get your word across. There could be another JFK out there but will never see office because of his lack of class. It sort of reminds me of the middle ages of Europe.

Also the only things that still make Americans proud are actually gone, few have realised it yet but the USA has been economically surpassed by the EU. Even when ignoring that, the Economic situation in the EU has always been much brighter then in the USA, that is… for the last decade or 2. In the EU prices are much lower, so is the inflation so that gap will also widen even further. Something that you pay 1 international $ for in the EU will cost you 1,96 international $’s in the USA. The exact same product and shipping costs ignored. This also puts the USA’s military supremacy at risk. Due to the fact that the Europeans will have to pay less for the same high grade equipment. Sure the USA is still stronger, but the difference of 600 billion int. dollars (USA defence budget) vs 300 billion int. dollars (EU defence budget) is not 2 vs 1 but more 4 vs 3. Again 300 billion int. dollars defence budget for the EU is a lot more then 300 billion int. dollars defence budget for the USA. (this paragraph was all a side not on the bigger issue)

The question that now remains is, looking at this… Hasn’t the USA changed? While the USA was trying to figure out what to do it was surpassed by its allies on the field of education, healthcare, poverty and economy. At the same time the gap between the USA and its allies has never been so great and one should wonder if Europe, Japan, Australia, Canada and others will ever come to the USA’s rescue if it would ever need it. America dug a deep hole for itself, how will it get out?

It isn't all that bad. Not all of America feels this way. The liberals up here in New England, like me, are trying to stop that from happening completely.

On a barely related note, I'm going to be in a Memorial Day Parade! :)

On a barely related note, I'm going to be in a Memorial Day Parade! :)

We all need a little Goofball in a good parade!

To play the devil's advocate. *ahem*

America is the greatest country in the world! Without us Europe would be Germanyvilletownship! Stupid communits would be eating off the queen's ass for dinner.

Der jukka our jobs!

There.

It's the only way England would ever win a penalty shoot-out. How dare you yanks scupper the long term English plan for footballing glory.

I don't see any suggestions, just a catalog of faults. Here's a clue for you: we know our faults. What we need is solutions.
Got any?Yes I have
(but the warning still apply.. many Patriots wont like it)

its unpleasant.. like going on a diet.
its painful.. like multiple vaccines.

It's the only way England would ever win a penalty shoot-out. How dare you yanks scupper the long term English plan for footballing glory.LOL.. this reminds me of some animated mouse movie.. with ninja frogs!!

The whole world sucks. "America" (USA) sucks a bit less.

*yawn*
Also *yawn*.

On a barely related note, I'm going to be in a Memorial Day Parade! :)... Make it a Memorial Day Parade NO ONE will ever forget! :cool:

and post vids! :D

I think that it's good to be introspective, but the item I was hoping to see in the essay and didn't is the overlegislation of Americans. Almost every aspect of American life has laws associated with it on some level paired with State or Federal regulations.

The worst part about it is that this shows no sign of slowing down. Politicians who want to create the appearance of dilligence and concern for their constituents are always looking for a new bill to sign or an industry to regulate.

Somebody die in a car accident? Pass more traffic laws! Regulate maufacturers and make them build cars with more safety equipment (whether it really works or not)

Someone buying prescription drugs at a reasonable price? Secure the Canadian border and pass laws to make the practice illegal! After all, a free market is only a good thing when it's American companies generating profits!

Got ambitions to get elected to office? Promise to pass new laws when you get there! Favorite targets include: Big business (regardless of services offered), Utility companies (regardless of local restrictions), teenagers (they can't vote anyway and usually annoy people), ex convicts (especially when sex crimes are involved, regardless of their level of severity, or how long ago) and of course, drugs dealers (the root of all evil, if you listen to the talking heads). Use favorite catch phrases like "Think of the children" and "tough on crime."

There's a reason lawyers are becoming more and more specialized. The same reason doctors do: the field has simply grown too large and complex to do otherwise.

I literally have to worry about breaking the law with almost every move I make these days. Buying a house? Better make sure no local ordinances are broken. Buying a car? Better make sure you've got all your paperwork for the DMV settled.

Here's an example:

Every morning I wake up and turn on th etelevision so I can listen to the weather and traffic. It's a tv news station that has to comply with levels of regulations under the FCC. The TV set itself has to comply with licensing requirements and UL listing.

I then get into the shower. In some areas, the amount of water I can use is limited by local water usage laws, but lucky for me I don't live in one. The water purity and content is also regulated by state and federal EPA regulations.

I then get dressed in clothing that must meet requirements for decency in the area I live in (a minor point, but some cultures do not have this problem) and head downstairs for breakfast where I have a glass of orange juice produced by farmers who are heavily regulated in the prices they can set as well as pesticides and water usage.

My wife and I then get into the car which, by law must be insured and registered with the MVA. It must have 2 license plates and have passed federal emmissions and state safety inspection. We are required by law to buckle our seatbelts and not disarm the airbags. These laws come from both the state and federal levels. Whichever one of us drives must, of course, be licensed to drive as required by law.

I then drive toward her job, which means getting out onto Maryland state roads which means I must, by state law, maintain a certain speed and obey a number of sometimes arbitrary traffic laws. These laws cover not only how I operate the car but specific activities I engage in while driving. There is a new law being proposed that will make it illegal for me to wear a cell phone headset while I drive.

At some point I turn on the radio which is regulated by a series of federal laws broadcast by a station that must, by law, be licensed to do so.

At some point we cross the border into Washington DC where a different set of traffic laws now apply which I am expected to know all about. I drop her off at work and then head to my job.

On the way to my job I cross another border into Virginia where yet another set of traffic laws must be observed. Mind you, these different sets of traffic laws aren't different from each other for the most part (some exceptions do exist), but should I break one in ignorance I will not be given any leeway.

I walk from the parking garage to the office where I must observe pedestrian laws that govern when and where I can cross the street. Luckily I've parked my car in a garage or otherwise I'd have to observe the city's complex and difficult parking regulations, and many city parking enforcement cars are around to ensure that should I err, I will know it.

While at work, many laws are working behind the scenes. My employer has legal obligations to provide me with time for breaks, he must have insurance as well as payroll taxes. The amount of money I'm earning is impacted by laws requiring me to pay into Social Security (despite the unlikelihood that this money will be there for me when I reture), medicare and medicaid (Even though I have my own insurance) as well as state and federal taxes which if I dont pay now I will be forced to pay next April.

Now, I know that many of these laws and ordinances are good things. Otherwise there would be anarchy. You could even maybe make a case for any individual law or we could debate them. But just look at the vast number of laws and ordinances that oversee every stage of even the most mundane day in a person's life.

The whole world sucks. "America" (USA) sucks a bit less.I agree..

There is room for improvement.

America is the most Christian nation on earth?

(points at Vatican City)

I didn't read it but can I give a summary based on intuition?

Americans are fat, lazy bastards who are all right-wing Christian fundamentalists and our nation has less freedoms than Nazi Germany. Also we still practice slavery.

I didn't read it but can I give a summary based on intuition?

Americans are fat, lazy bastards who are all right-wing Christian fundamentalists and our nation has less freedoms than Nazi Germany. Also we still practice slavery.

We eat babies too. Delicious, nutritious babies. Great in a Stew.

Sorry, I tuned out at the first "Most Americans".

I managed as far as halfway through the big paragraph.

America still claims to be the nation of the free and the brave, however when you look at the facts and ignore your patriotic feelings (which I am aware is something that is hard to do for even liberal Americans), the USA has less liberties then even ex-communist eastern European nations

"Free and the brave" are song lyrics, not a measure of national success.


In America these days the news is totally off, on one side the people from FOX news make it look as if anything left from the republican party directly is no better then communists. They even manage to twist things so much that they make a democratic speech about how good the democratic party is sound like a testimony that the Democratic party is no more then bullcrap. This is no different when it comes to the liberal news stations in the country. This means that if you were to get an accurate picture of the news you would have to tune into foreign news agencies. Of course they spin and twist as well but compared to even the most factual news station in the USA, they’re HIGHLY accurate.

100% bullshit. Do tell me, what you consider "the most factual news station in the USA." I'm guessing you have no idea. You went from talking about FOX, then generalized to "liberal news stations," and then of course, to every single one.

Now lets turn to the American gun nuts, now I understand it’s a laugh to shoot your gun, I quite enjoy shooting of a few rounds myself, however I am strongly against private owned so I don’t have any of my own. So now you’ve got my understanding… What in gods name do you need military grade rifles, machine guns, cannons even rocket launchers for (Texas)? I don’t expect people to carry around a .50 cal machine gun for when they get robbed. Then Americans claim it’s for national defence… seriously… if anything defeats the American army in the USA itself (outside is possible but inside NO) then no rednecks are going to have the firepower to even dent that force.


What do you NEED the internet for? What do you NEED freedom for? What do you NEED fast food for? Don't tell me you don't have any of those things. Apparently, legality is not solely concerned with what is absolutely necessary.

And supporting gun ownership doesn't make one a "gun nut" nor a "redneck." Your generalizations are quite silly.


To continue on the areas of rights and the bible etc. Most Americans are Christian, the lovely thing about that is that those Christians are also mostly conservative Christians

That's interesting. You just said most Americans are "conservatives." I wonder what your definition of "conservative" is. It's probably as laughably stupid as everyone else's. That tired dichotomy needs to be retired; even non-Americans are burning so many strawmen with it you're contributing to global climate change.

but also interpret the bible selectively. I always love it when the Yanks go out on the street when a brain-dead person gets put off of life support screaming don’t play god. Now here comes the great part that those people are so dumb that they cant even understand that keeping them on life-support is playing god in the first place, letting nature take its course is NOT playing god. To continue, thou shall not kill. *Giggle*, the most Christian nation on earth is the one with the death penalty, need I go on?

I'm not a Christian, but if I was, I would be very offended at your pigeonholing them all into the same group. Apparently, to you, Fred Phelps represents a majority of Christians and Christians represent a majority of Americans.

And the "most Christian nation" on earth? On what basis?

the USA currently has the worst educational system of the western world AND most of Eastern Europe

the vast majority of Americans get worse education the western world and all of eastern Europe,

a small percentage (5%-10%) gets education that is on par with the West European AVAREGE.

This figure has been stagnating

and the quality of education is expected to fall with a few percent every single year until it is stopped.

Without a smart population, the US economy is expected to be on a 2nd world level within 1 generation (when the well educated are dead or on pensions and no longer contributing to the American economy and thus killing it).

These figures come from where, exactly?

If this was a real "essay," you would have cited sources other than generalizations originating somewhere in the confines of your asshole.

And frankly, "education" doesn't translate to "smart." Which you already know, because you're so well-educated compared to us American stupids, yes?

in the USA a few hundred thousand die a year of diseases that can EASILY be treated EVEN in the 3rd world.

Source?


The amount of help you get from the government in Europe is also substantially higher, in a nation that CLAIMS to be the richest of them all… this is a very sad fact.

Taxation in Europe is also substantially higher. How about that!

I guess you missed this whole bit where Europe is generally more socialist than the US? You know, the last hundred years of history.

Sad indeed, but not in the way you seem to think it is.

the nation that forces Christian beliefs and laws upon non-Christians?

Very amusing. I'm an atheist Jew, do tell me what Christian beliefs are "forced" upon me?

Why should I as a non Christian have to abide to YOUR!!! beliefs about gays, and euthanasia etc? By doing so, America is doing what Iran is doing: Enforcing Muslim laws on non Muslims.

Ah yes, the USA = Iran comparison. Specious at best.

You need more education.

On the international policy, the USA has been pushing away its allies, America is left with no strong allies, America only has traditional allies left who are only such because of the word traditional. In 2001, President George W. Bush threatened to invade an EU nation (the Netherlands) if it ever put an American in front of a court for war crimes, this statement has infuriated many European nations and was the starting point of Anti-American sentiments across the western world. After this the Iraq war came and many of the American allies refused to participate in this war, this lead to America saying things like: France and Germany are our enemies. Increasing the Anti-American sentiment, with American torture scandals popping up something dramatic has happened: In the EU only 64%!! are anti-American in a sence of dropping out of NATO etc. The EU has also set up a new defence force for EU members and EU candidates only that supersedes NATO. In South Korea the Majority of the South Koreans are anti-American and want the American armed forces to leave the country, this majority remained a majority even after the nuclear bomb of North Korea detonated. Yes even after. The sentiment is also rising in Japan however is not yet at Majority level, but close. Nations like Australia, just like the EU, have a majority anti-American sentiment and there is even talk about a breaking of ANZUS ties.

Yep, our foreign policy is terrible. No argument here.

To add to all of this, possibly the worst part, it seems to be possible to buy your way into office. In America, there are huge sums of money going into presidential election campaigns, this in essence can get you most of you votes and also means that the president is not in the first place elected on his policy’s but that such a thing is only secondary to the amount of money they have to make their policy’s heard. This also means that the chance that you will miss out on the most brilliant politician ever is unheard of, due to the fact that you need the money to get your word across. There could be another JFK out there but will never see office because of his lack of class. It sort of reminds me of the middle ages of Europe.

It is NOTHING like the middle ages. It's NOTHING about "class;" you'd do well to drop such pseudo-Marxist tripe right now. The middle ages were characterized by extreme localism, strongarmism, warlordism, zero economic, social or political mobility, feudalism and manoralism. The US political system is characterized by high social, economic and political mobility, mass media, a huge super-state governing many smaller (but quite large) states, democracy, peace and rule of law.

So maybe the one reminds you of the other, but I'm just going to suggest that maybe you didn't study much in history. Thanks to your obviously poor education.

Also the only things that still make Americans proud are actually gone, few have realised it yet but the USA has been economically surpassed by the EU.

"Having more GDP than all of Europe" is not a source of national pride to very much of anyone *I* know. But hey, I'm an American, so maybe I don't know as many Americans as you do.

Even when ignoring that, the Economic situation in the EU has always been much brighter then in the USA, that is… for the last decade or 2. In the EU prices are much lower, so is the inflation so that gap will also widen even further. Something that you pay 1 international $ for in the EU will cost you 1,96 international $’s in the USA. The exact same product and shipping costs ignored.

Economies go up, economies go down. I'm still waiting for the dramatic crash that you seem to think will make the US "done for," but transform the EU into some kind of paradise. An exchange rate, inflation rate, or the economy overall are not, again, sources of national pride for the US. And if they are, the EU has been around for so short a time that your cawing about how superior it is seems premature egotism. Why do YOU care about superiority?

The question that now remains is, looking at this… Hasn’t the USA changed?

Everything always changes. Nothing stays the same. If you were looking for the US to remain completely stagnant, then perhaps it's you who's the conservative here clinging to your ideas of the comforting and familiar past.

But no nation doesn't change.

While the USA was trying to figure out what to do it was surpassed by its allies on the field of education, healthcare, poverty and economy.

By the combined collective power of the EU. You're making it sound as if each individual nation in the EU has drastically surpassed the US, which seems disingenious.

At the same time the gap between the USA and its allies has never been so great and one should wonder if Europe, Japan, Australia, Canada and others will ever come to the USA’s rescue if it would ever need it. America dug a deep hole for itself, how will it get out?

You failed to show how this is a "deep hole" for the US, or present any viable scenarios in which the US will need "rescue."

However, if you're non-American, you have successfully shown how egotistical foreigners seem to get a near-orgasmic joy about thumping their superiority and burning media strawmen.

Epic. Ownage.

I wouldn't call it epic really...It's more like, he puts all this effert into this, and NSG gives a collective 'Meh'. It's sad, more than anything.

Yeah, I guess. That happened to a story I was recently writing.

Epic. Ownage.

I wouldn't call it epic really...It's more like, he puts all this effert into this, and NSG gives a collective 'Meh'. It's sad, more than anything.

I'm not sure which is saddest:

A) The article itself.

B) The people geniunely replying to the article.

or

C) The people who are here because their other suscribed threads are grey right now.

I managed as far as halfway through the big paragraph.

Am I the only one who read the whole thing?

To play the devil's advocate. *ahem*

America is the greatest country in the world! Without us Europe would be Germanyvilletownship! Stupid communits would be eating off the queen's ass for dinner.

Der jukka our jobs!

There.

Just an observation: that's not being Devil's Advocate; that's being sterotypical American asshole. :D

And funny, *I* always thought the most Christian nation on Earth was Vatican City!

And the "most Christian nation" on earth? On what basis?By the combined collective power of the EU. You're making it sound as if each individual nation in the EU has drastically surpassed the US, which seems disingenious.

However, if you're non-American, you have successfully shown how egotistical foreigners seem to get a near-orgasmic joy about thumping their superiority and burning media strawmen.Apparently he was not counting the Vatican.:D

As well, thank you for pointing this person out who does not really know where he is coming from and you have presented an arugement which is going to be very VERY hard to overcome.

Apparently he was not counting the Vatican.:D

As well, thank you for pointing this person out who does not really know where he is coming from and you have presented an arugement which is going to be very VERY hard to overcome.

I haven't actually made an argument really, just addressed some glaring concerns that popped out at me from the OP's argument.

[snip] nice breakdown GT. glad someone did it, really didn't feel like tackling something like this today... :cool:

I never dreamed this thread would turn into another Christian/Catholic thread.

NSG: Expect the unexpected. also, cocks

For once I'm with OcceanDrive. Let's spam it to death.

I never dreamed this thread would turn into another Christian/Catholic thread.

NSG: Expect the unexpected. also, cocks

Well the OP was pretty much destroyed on the first page so what the hell are we supposed to do?

I never dreamed this thread would turn into another Christian/Catholic thread.

NSG: Expect the unexpected. also, cocks

Seems to me that almost everybody on here is obsessed with religion and how good/bad it is... seems a pretty dull discussion topic to me.

Anyway, to get back to the point, one of the main reasons pretty much the whole world doesn't like America is their national overabundance of ignorance and patriotism, which mix together to form an extreme arrogance. For a nation full of people who couldn't find Vietnam on a map and think 'Australia is great, just like the rest of Europe', the USA has an extremely active 'world police' policy. America's foreign policy of 'interfere for the sake of freedom' is making a lot of people unfriendly toward them. But what irks me the most about America is the fact that they think they are the absolute pinnacle of civilisation, basically the attitude that Washington D.C is the capital of the world. American author Tom Wolfe summed it up well in his book Hooking Up:

"American superiority in all matters of science, economics, industry, politics, business, medicine, engineering, social life, social justice, and, of course, the military was total and indisputable. Even Europeans suffering the pangs of wounded chauvinism looked on with awe at the brilliant example the United States had set for the world as the third millennium began."

This statement is not just sickeningly patriotic but completely incorrect, too. I think it is the Americans' extremely inflated (past the point of deluded) opinion of themselves that makes the world dislike them most. There is a belief that they don't need to learn from the rest of the world, beause the rest of the world should be learning from them. Just look at the Metric System. How can America honestly take itself seriously when they still use the Imperial system?!?

Seems to me that almost everybody on here is obsessed with religion and how good/bad it is... seems a pretty dull discussion topic to me.

Anyway, to get back to the point, one of the main reasons pretty much the whole world doesn't like America is their national overabundance of ignorance and patriotism, which mix together to form an extreme arrogance. For a nation full of people who couldn't find Vietnam on a map and think 'Australia is great, just like the rest of Europe', the USA has an extremely active 'world police' policy. America's foreign policy of 'interfere for the sake of freedom' is making a lot of people unfriendly toward them. But what irks me the most about America is the fact that they think they are the absolute pinnacle of civilisation, basically the attitude that Washington D.C is the capital of the world. American author Tom Wolfe summed it up well in his book Hooking Up:

"American superiority in all matters of science, economics, industry, politics, business, medicine, engineering, social life, social justice, and, of course, the military was total and indisputable. Even Europeans suffering the pangs of wounded chauvinism looked on with awe at the brilliant example the United States had set for the world as the third millennium began."

This statement is not just sickeningly patriotic but completely incorrect, too. I think it is the Americans' extremely inflated (past the point of deluded) opinion of themselves that makes the world dislike them most. There is a belief that they don't need to learn from the rest of the world, beause the rest of the world should be learning from them. Just look at the Metric System. How can America honestly take itself seriously when they still use the Imperial system?!?

Seems to me you have a reading comprehension problem, as no one is discussing whether religion is good or bad, but correcting a silly belief that Catholics are not Christians.

Seems also like you are spouting the same old "Americans are ignorant, Americans are arrogant, Americans are stupid" crap that gets parroted here so often as well.

It would be sad if it weren't a caricature of a caricature.

America? Home of the brave and the free? Or just as totalitarian as current day Russia?

To me America has always been the lighthouse of the free and the brave, no longer… The light bulb broke and America seems incapable of fixing it, the worst part is… it is creating a short out worsening the situation.

America still claims to be the nation of the free and the brave, however when you look at the facts and ignore your patriotic feelings (which I am aware is something that is hard to do for even liberal Americans), the USA has less liberties then even ex-communist eastern European nations. Also in my opinion the USA has become something that is not much different from the ultra-conservative Iran but then based on the principals of Christianity instead of the Islam. In this essay I will bring to you my reasons for saying: “Europe, just drop the USA, it’s done for.”

In America these days the news is totally off, on one side the people from FOX news make it look as if anything left from the republican party directly is no better then communists. They even manage to twist things so much that they make a democratic speech about how good the democratic party is sound like a testimony that the Democratic party is no more then bullcrap. This is no different when it comes to the liberal news stations in the country. This means that if you were to get an accurate picture of the news you would have to tune into foreign news agencies. Of course they spin and twist as well but compared to even the most factual news station in the USA, they’re HIGHLY accurate.

Now lets turn to the American gun nuts, now I understand it’s a laugh to shoot your gun, I quite enjoy shooting of a few rounds myself, however I am strongly against private owned so I don’t have any of my own. So now you’ve got my understanding… What in gods name do you need military grade rifles, machine guns, cannons even rocket launchers for (Texas)? I don’t expect people to carry around a .50 cal machine gun for when they get robbed. Then Americans claim it’s for national defence… seriously… if anything defeats the American army in the USA itself (outside is possible but inside NO) then no rednecks are going to have the firepower to even dent that force.

To continue on the areas of rights and the bible etc. Most Americans are Christian, the lovely thing about that is that those Christians are also mostly conservative Christians but also interpret the bible selectively. I always love it when the Yanks go out on the street when a brain-dead person gets put off of life support screaming don’t play god. Now here comes the great part that those people are so dumb that they cant even understand that keeping them on life-support is playing god in the first place, letting nature take its course is NOT playing god. To continue, thou shall not kill. *Giggle*, the most Christian nation on earth is the one with the death penalty, need I go on? Gay rights also something very nice, it is up to god to decide who is right or wrong and not us Humans, and if god had hated gays then why does he allow it? If he truly is “god” then he can stop gayness too or is he just as selective about his powers as Christians are about how they interpret the bible? Christians then say that god punishes the gay rights activists. The Funny part is, that the nation that was the first to recognise things like gay marriage hasn’t seen natural disasters in over half a century + ditto for nations that followed suit and gave gays equal rights as well. Also the most humorous thing, the party that claims to be closest to the bible (the republicans) is actually the furthest away, the party that the republicans claim to be secular atheist extremists (Democrats) are actually closer to the bible. Why? Equal Education for all is prescribed by the bible this also goes for healthcare and poverty (you shall share with those that are worse off then you), on top of this I put things like the death penalty. To put a stress on all this, the USA currently has the worst educational system of the western world AND most of Eastern Europe, to detail this the vast majority of Americans get worse education the western world and all of eastern Europe, a small percentage (5%-10%) gets education that is on par with the West European AVAREGE. This figure has been stagnating and the quality of education is expected to fall with a few percent every single year until it is stopped. This does not mean the American education system is falling, it means it is not improving to modern standards while the rest of the world IS thus creating a bigger and bigger gap which will be more and more expensive to bridge when someone finally decides to do so, which is a must due to the fact that the US economy FLOATS on it’s innovation. Without a smart population, the US economy is expected to be on a 2nd world level within 1 generation (when the well educated are dead or on pensions and no longer contributing to the American economy and thus killing it). The American healthcare system is also in a terrible state, the American healthcare is better then ANYWHERE in the world, but only for LESS then 5% of its population, 67% of the Americans live above eastern European levels but bellow western European levels, the rest lives under the Eastern European levels. This is mainly due to the fact that Americans can no longer afford healthcare, in the USA a few hundred thousand die a year of diseases that can EASILY be treated EVEN in the 3rd world. Poverty is also a great problem, the USA’s poverty line is also twice as low as that of Europe, meaning that in the USA you are still considered middle class when you are considered poor in western Europe. The amount of help you get from the government in Europe is also substantially higher, in a nation that CLAIMS to be the richest of them all… this is a very sad fact. Now back to religion, I will go back to gay rights, euthanasia etc. the USA has a constitution written with liberties in mind, is it not amusing that a nation that prides itself for religious tolerance is also the nation that forces Christian beliefs and laws upon non-Christians? Why should I as a non Christian have to abide to YOUR!!! beliefs about gays, and euthanasia etc? By doing so, America is doing what Iran is doing: Enforcing Muslim laws on non Muslims.

On the international policy, the USA has been pushing away its allies, America is left with no strong allies, America only has traditional allies left who are only such because of the word traditional. In 2001, President George W. Bush threatened to invade an EU nation (the Netherlands) if it ever put an American in front of a court for war crimes, this statement has infuriated many European nations and was the starting point of Anti-American sentiments across the western world. After this the Iraq war came and many of the American allies refused to participate in this war, this lead to America saying things like: France and Germany are our enemies. Increasing the Anti-American sentiment, with American torture scandals popping up something dramatic has happened: In the EU only 64%!! are anti-American in a sence of dropping out of NATO etc. The EU has also set up a new defence force for EU members and EU candidates only that supersedes NATO. In South Korea the Majority of the South Koreans are anti-American and want the American armed forces to leave the country, this majority remained a majority even after the nuclear bomb of North Korea detonated. Yes even after. The sentiment is also rising in Japan however is not yet at Majority level, but close. Nations like Australia, just like the EU, have a majority anti-American sentiment and there is even talk about a breaking of ANZUS ties.

To add to all of this, possibly the worst part, it seems to be possible to buy your way into office. In America, there are huge sums of money going into presidential election campaigns, this in essence can get you most of you votes and also means that the president is not in the first place elected on his policy’s but that such a thing is only secondary to the amount of money they have to make their policy’s heard. This also means that the chance that you will miss out on the most brilliant politician ever is unheard of, due to the fact that you need the money to get your word across. There could be another JFK out there but will never see office because of his lack of class. It sort of reminds me of the middle ages of Europe.

Also the only things that still make Americans proud are actually gone, few have realised it yet but the USA has been economically surpassed by the EU. Even when ignoring that, the Economic situation in the EU has always been much brighter then in the USA, that is… for the last decade or 2. In the EU prices are much lower, so is the inflation so that gap will also widen even further. Something that you pay 1 international $ for in the EU will cost you 1,96 international $’s in the USA. The exact same product and shipping costs ignored. This also puts the USA’s military supremacy at risk. Due to the fact that the Europeans will have to pay less for the same high grade equipment. Sure the USA is still stronger, but the difference of 600 billion int. dollars (USA defence budget) vs 300 billion int. dollars (EU defence budget) is not 2 vs 1 but more 4 vs 3. Again 300 billion int. dollars defence budget for the EU is a lot more then 300 billion int. dollars defence budget for the USA. (this paragraph was all a side not on the bigger issue)

The question that now remains is, looking at this… Hasn’t the USA changed? While the USA was trying to figure out what to do it was surpassed by its allies on the field of education, healthcare, poverty and economy. At the same time the gap between the USA and its allies has never been so great and one should wonder if Europe, Japan, Australia, Canada and others will ever come to the USA’s rescue if it would ever need it. America dug a deep hole for itself, how will it get out?

I have a revolutionary new idea that could make you a lot of money. How about you record yourself on audio tape and sell them as cures for chronic insomnia?

Snip

Very well. Next time I see a Catholic worshipping Mary or going into a confessional I will say "Stop! You're a Christian! Christians don't do that". Good? After all, there really isn't any point of distinguishing between the two because they have some beliefs in common.

Seems to me you have a reading comprehension problem, as no one is discussing whether religion is good or bad, but correcting a silly belief that Catholics are not Christians.

Seems also like you are spouting the same old "Americans are ignorant, Americans are arrogant, Americans are stupid" crap that gets parroted here so often as well.

It would be sad if it weren't a caricature of a caricature.


Alright alright, so I'm using generalisations and stereotypes. But does that automatically make them unfair? What is america doing to refute these stereotypes?

And if America really isn't ignorant then what's with the adamant refusal to learn anything from the rest of the world? Can't use the metric system, because it's french, can't make fuel-efficient and properly-engineered cars, that's too german and japanese, can't start teaching firefighters safe and practical methods of fire-fighting, that's too european, can't bring in decent minimum wage laws, that's too foreign, can't implement some decent gun control to stop all these shootings, that's too australian and european, can't subsidise healthcare so that poor people can afford proper medical treatment, that's too australian, can't lower our excessive military budget and spend the money on foreign aid rather than bullets to shoot foreigners with, can't repair the electoral system so that this stuff isn't perpetuated by ignorant presidents... etc etc, all the usual 'parroted crap' that still hasn't been fixed. I know the smarter portion of america's population hates these things just as much as the rest of the world, but somebody voted for Bush, didn't they? (Yes, I know that is 'parroting', but it's true)

And on the catholic debate (sorry about my 'comprehension problem', I just don't see why almost every general discussion has to end up on a religious topic), catholics ARE christians, to say they aren't is just stupid. I don't agree with their obsession with the Virgin Mary, and the whole Pope idea, but they are unarguably christians, because they believe that jesus is their saviour, and that's the only real defining criteria of christianity. But that's just my two cents.

And if America really isn't ignorant then what's with the adamant refusal to learn anything from the rest of the world? Can't use the metric system, because it's french,
Thats up to the Government/Board of Education.

can't make fuel-efficient and properly-engineered cars, that's too german and japanese,
I see someone gets their information from bad sources. Many Americans if not most, want fuel-effiect and hybrid vehicles, but again its out of the populaces hands, it is up to manufacturers and to a small degree, the government.

can't start teaching firefighters safe and practical methods of fire-fighting, that's too european,
What? How do you figure that?

can't bring in decent minimum wage laws, that's too foreign,
What do you consider decent? We recently raised it to $7.00 and some change.

can't implement some decent gun control to stop all these shootings, that's too australian and european, can't subsidise healthcare so that poor people can afford proper medical treatment, that's too australian, can't lower our excessive military budget and spend the money on foreign aid rather than bullets to shoot foreigners with, can't repair the electoral system so that this stuff isn't perpetuated by ignorant presidents... etc etc, all the usual 'parroted crap' that still hasn't been fixed. I know the smarter portion of america's population hates these things just as much as the rest of the world, but somebody voted for Bush, didn't they? (Yes, I know that is 'parroting', but it's true)
You know, its easier to just say you get all your information from bad sources or think each individual in America can change everything in a day.

For once I'm with OcceanDrive. Let's spam it to death.

How about an iPod shuffle made out of SPAM? http://www.finkbuilt.com/static/images/articles/spam1.jpg

Condensed Cream of SPAM soup? http://www.cs.berkeley.edu/~ddgarcia/gifs/CreamOfSpam.jpg

What about a SPAM sandwich? BOING! http://unknowngenius.com/blog/pix/post609/spam_sandwich.jpg

I would ask the OP to travel to some third world countries and see what a true crappy place is. For all the problems America does have it still in my opinion the best out there.

I am American.
I hate the President, refused to vote in the last election because I hated everyone, I believe in abortion, evolution, stem cell research, gay marriage, world peace, and a cure for AIDS. I also dropped out of High School because I could get my GED in (literally) 2 weeks and not have to listen to the dumbasses drone on anymore about the Revolutionary War, and I think big guns rule.


With this in mind:
Our economy sucks.
We need to globalize.
The Metric system rules.
I envy Canada's free health care.
I would rather have a man named "Obama" in as President while we fight against the entirity of the Middle East than to let that pandering *insert your favorite explitive here* Hillary Clinton get in and drive us deeper into Hell.

Random Fun Facts about America (RFFAA):

The FCC is ridiculous. The US (being big and free) is the only nation on Earth that censors it's television.

"The South" isn't all full of morons, but there are an abnormally high concentration of them, and they fall right into your hand if you suck up to them just enough, and they will be the death of what America once was.

New York, despite popular belief, isn't a city. It's a state. That state has open fields, grasslands, and farms. It also has slums, shopping districts, theatre, rural areas, cities, and homeless people. So does my state.

Americans don't all swigg whiskey and wear big belt buckles while listening to rap music and cursing Gihad. That's how we come off to the rest of the world because: 1. We're diverse. 2. Our President is an idiot. 3. The South likes to breed.


I hope the rest of the world found this informative, and America is now pissed at me and will flame me endlessly. Or, more genuinely: I hope my statements can be taken seriously, with only a hint of jest, and can be debated with both facts and opinions, developing a deep conversation, divulging more information on the world as a whole, and how people view each other.

But let's be realistic.
I'm gonna get flamed, and then someone will bring up religion.

Snip

That was dead on...but I disagree with globalization.

I'm gonna get flamed,

Lol, this thread is powered by energizer.

Globalization is the logical next step.
First there were individuals, which banded together to make
tribes, which grew larger and formed
civilizations, which grew in power and technology, and became
nations. These nations began to trade with each other peacefully, leading to
globalization. Everyone focus' on their expertise and specializes what their nation does, leading to a world in which every piece of the puzzle is crucial, and all the peoples become one, and there is no more need for war.

As time continues to progress, man will venture into space to colonize other planets, which will all globalize as well, and then these seperate planets will begin to produce on their own, and interplanetary trade will be established.

It's a long way off, but globalization is going to happen.
It's already happening.
Your forks were made in China and your car is a Volkswagon.
You watch a Toshiba television watching Monty Python, and then pop in some Rocky 3 to watch him get his ass kicked by Apollo.

And there we have it. All the world touches your daily life.
So far globalization has hurt many people, thats why I disagree with it. If the world suddenly developed *gasp* real ethics for operating a business on foreign soil I would be ok with it.

That was dead on...but I disagree with globalization.

Globalization is the logical next step.
First there were individuals, which banded together to make
tribes, which grew larger and formed
civilizations, which grew in power and technology, and became
nations. These nations began to trade with each other peacefully, leading to
globalization. Everyone focus' on their expertise and specializes what their nation does, leading to a world in which every piece of the puzzle is crucial, and all the peoples become one, and there is no more need for war.

As time continues to progress, man will venture into space to colonize other planets, which will all globalize as well, and then these seperate planets will begin to produce on their own, and interplanetary trade will be established.

It's a long way off, but globalization is going to happen.
It's already happening.
Your forks were made in China and your car is a Volkswagon.
You watch a Toshiba television watching Monty Python, and then pop in some Rocky 3 to watch him get his ass kicked by Apollo.

And there we have it. All the world touches your daily life.

So far globalization has hurt many people, thats why I disagree with it. If the world suddenly developed *gasp* real ethics for operating a business on foreign soil I would be ok with it.

Firstly, governments need to realize that they can't moderate business. They can only make sure it operates within the boundaries of the law.

Secondly, people (nations) need to acknowledge that just because a business grows in one nation's soil doesn't mean that business is that nation.

Nintendo is a good example of that.
A small Japanese company hit it big selling an "Entertainment System", and eventually became an international name. You don't think "That there Japanese video game company". It's Nintendo. Just a business like any other.


The American government is a real bitch when it comes to business' and religions and their policies, but other nations of the world are smarter and more accepting. Globalization just needs more time to grow.

Thats up to the Government/Board of Education.


I see someone gets their information from bad sources. Many Americans if not most, want fuel-effiect and hybrid vehicles, but again its out of the populaces hands, it is up to manufacturers and to a small degree, the government.


What? How do you figure that?


What do you consider decent? We recently raised it to $7.00 and some change.


You know, its easier to just say you get all your information from bad sources or think each individual in America can change everything in a day.

I have to admit, at least America is making progress in some areas. You sensible thinkers must be doing your jobs! But my point is America needs to start learning from other's mistakes, rather than waiting for the same thing to happen to them and then working on it. I'm not saying America isn't a great country, it's just not nearly as great as it says it is.

(By the way, Australia's minimum wage is $10.50 US, most of Europe's is $10 to $10.80. An increase to $7.00 isn't saying much) (And the firefighting example, I just thought I'd throw that in because I was recently talking to a firefighter friend of mine, and he mentioned that during a training session they watched a video of American firefighting techniques, and were dumbfounded by some of the stupid things they did (kicking open a hot door, ignoring the critical sign of when a fire starts to suck in air, blasting water everywhere like maniacs, etc etc))

(And the firefighting example, I just thought I'd throw that in because I was recently talking to a firefighter friend of mine, and he mentioned that during a training session they watched a video of American firefighting techniques, and were dumbfounded by some of the stupid things they did (kicking open a hot door, ignoring the critical sign of when a fire starts to suck in air, blasting water everywhere like maniacs, etc etc))

They're idiots. That video was made by tardcakes.
I'm the son of a woman whose brother was once a trustee in a volunteer fire company, and I probably know more than that video could ever hope to teach.

It probably told them to spray the tips of the flames and to go straight up the middle.

Seriously.
BTW: Volunteer > Paid

Just look at the Metric System. How can America honestly take itself seriously when they still use the Imperial system?!?

The metric system sucks ass! Imperial systems pwns it. Just look at the name: IMPERIAL. Its what we've always used, continue to use, and always will use. The metric system can burn in hell.
:upyours: the metric system!

I haven't actually made an argument really, just addressed some glaring concerns that popped out at me from the OP's argument.You wrote and the intended message is your design.

But, it was still dang good and you deserve a cookie.

*Gives Greater Trostia a bag of cookies Scandinvans stole from the Devil*

Aezkami, I think your post quite clearly demonstrates the condescending, smug attitude stemming from Europe towards America that most Americans despise. Pretty ironic since you berate Americans for having overinflated egos, huh?

Globalization is the logical next step.
First there were individuals, which banded together to make
tribes, which grew larger and formed
civilizations, which grew in power and technology, and became
nations. These nations began to trade with each other peacefully, leading to
globalization. Everyone focus' on their expertise and specializes what their nation does, leading to a world in which every piece of the puzzle is crucial, and all the peoples become one, and there is no more need for war.

As time continues to progress, man will venture into space to colonize other planets, which will all globalize as well, and then these seperate planets will begin to produce on their own, and interplanetary trade will be established.

It's a long way off, but globalization is going to happen.
It's already happening.
Your forks were made in China and your car is a Volkswagon.
You watch a Toshiba television watching Monty Python, and then pop in some Rocky 3 to watch him get his ass kicked by Apollo.

And there we have it. All the world touches your daily life.


Your logic is flawed. 'civilizations' are no more advanced than tribes. In fact, tribes had much more social advantages than 'civilization': no class issues, no sexism, no race issues (well, tribes rarely came into contact with other tribes from very far away), etc. Civilizations have only been around for several thousand years. Tribal societies have been around for over 50,000. I'd wager the tried and true method is probably best for mankind: Tribes, or other small groups. Tribal societies and hunter/gatherer societies (many times are the same) were the most eqalitarian societies in history, and lasted the longest.
The so called advanced civilizations brought slavery, disrimination, war, rich/poor divide, etc. Which would you choose?

(By the way, Australia's minimum wage is $10.50 US, most of Europe's is $10 to $10.80. An increase to $7.00 isn't saying much)
Europe is much more expensive than America (if the article I read was accurate), so $7.00 an hour would probably equal out to your $10.80 in terms of the quality of life one could obtain on it.

The so called advanced civilizations brought slavery, disrimination, war, rich/poor divide, etc. Which would you choose?
The one that offers major advancements while trying to fix the rich/poor divide and eliminate wars/discrmination.

Tribal societies have been around for over 50,000. I'd wager the tried and true method is probably best for mankind: Tribes, or other small groups. Tribal societies and hunter/gatherer societies (many times are the same) were the most eqalitarian societies in history, and lasted the longest.

So did dinosaurs.

Tribal societies fought each other incessantly.

Give peace a chance

(By the way, Australia's minimum wage is $10.50 US, most of Europe's is $10 to $10.80. An increase to $7.00 isn't saying much) (And the firefighting example, I just thought I'd throw that in because I was recently talking to a firefighter friend of mine, and he mentioned that during a training session they watched a video of American firefighting techniques, and were dumbfounded by some of the stupid things they did (kicking open a hot door, ignoring the critical sign of when a fire starts to suck in air, blasting water everywhere like maniacs, etc etc))

Wow one video. :rolleyes:

Did you friend even describe the situation of why they were suggesting that?

My uncle is a station chief and there is a little more training then watching a video......

I agree 100%, our volunteer bush firefighters are far more experienced and skilled than the full-time city firefighters. Anyway, to clarify my position: Most Americans are not complete idiots, just like most Australians don't wear akubras, carry stockwhips and own a pet kangaroo. But it would be really nice if Americans stopped thinking they know better than the rest of the planet, and if they already have, then three cheers for Uncle Sam.

Now you are going to tell me that you all don't drink Fosters and have shrimp on the barby? :eek:

:p

They're idiots. That video was made by tardcakes.
I'm the son of a woman whose brother was once a trustee in a volunteer fire company, and I probably know more than that video could ever hope to teach.

It probably told them to spray the tips of the flames and to go straight up the middle.

Seriously.
BTW: Volunteer > Paid

I agree 100%, our volunteer bush firefighters are far more experienced and skilled than the full-time city firefighters. Anyway, to clarify my position: Most Americans are not complete idiots, just like most Australians don't wear akubras, carry stockwhips and own a pet kangaroo. But it would be really nice if Americans stopped thinking they know better than the rest of the planet, and if they already have, then three cheers for Uncle Sam.

Aezkami, I think your post quite clearly demonstrates the condescending, smug attitude stemming from Europe towards America that most Americans despise. Pretty ironic since you berate Americans for having overinflated egos, huh?

Perhaps you should know I am AUSTRALIAN. You know, that place where koalas and Arnold Schwarzenegger came from ;) ? We're the poor suckers who are actually helping you in Iraq, remember? The reasons we dislike America are pretty much summed up by the Simpsons episode 'Bart vs Australia'. Talk about smug and condescending! (If we made something like that trying to portray your country, wouldn't you hate us too?)

Perhaps you should know I am AUSTRALIAN. You know, that place where koalas and Arnold Schwarzenegger came from ;) ? We're the poor suckers who are actually helping you in Iraq, remember? The reasons we dislike America are pretty much summed up by the Simpsons episode 'Bart vs Australia'. Talk about smug and condescending! (If we made something like that trying to portray your country, wouldn't you hate us too?)

Damn, I knew there was a chance you'd be from outside Europe, but you didn't have your location posted.

maybe this can be best summed up in that we're both smug and condescending towards each other? I actually envision Europeans as more smug than Americans who I envision as more loudly ignorant. Eg:

http://images.wikia.com/uncyclopedia/images/8/82/Morans2.jpg

Basically, I absolutely despise European (and Australian ;)) condescending elitism towards Americans and American ignorance about the rest of the world (believe me, it does get frustrating at times when conversing with my peers).

Perhaps you should know I am AUSTRALIAN. You know, that place where koalas and Arnold Schwarzenegger came from ;) ? We're the poor suckers who are actually helping you in Iraq, remember? The reasons we dislike America are pretty much summed up by the Simpsons episode 'Bart vs Australia'. Talk about smug and condescending! (If we made something like that trying to portray your country, wouldn't you hate us too?)

Depends if it was funny!

You mentioned the Simpsons. Well much of what goes on in it, pokes fun at us.

South Park does the same.

Depends if it was funny!

You mentioned the Simpsons. Well much of what goes on in it, pokes fun at us.

South Park does the same.

Yeah...I'm pretty sure that Simpsons episode was probably satirizing the US more than it was Australia. South Park is more inclined, however, to side with the US more (see Team America) although it still satirizes elements of American culture.

Depends if it was funny!

You mentioned the Simpsons. Well much of what goes on in it, pokes fun at us.

South Park does the same.

What I want to know is, where did the whole 'booting' thing come from? I'd never even heard of anything like it. And why oh why do you give Australians british cockney accents all the time?:confused: (I suppose you could ask why we give you Texan accents all the time ;) ... that I don't know)

Just goes to show: don't make judgements about a country until you've actually lived there. I plead guilty to this charge, and I'm sorry to any americans I've offended.

Europe is much more expensive than America (if the article I read was accurate), so $7.00 an hour would probably equal out to your $10.80 in terms of the quality of life one could obtain on it.


The one that offers major advancements while trying to fix the rich/poor divide and eliminate wars/discrmination.

Ah, but can technological advancements and fixing the rich/poor divide coexist? Personally I don't think they can! Besides, are advancements necessary? Just make mankind complacent, lazy, greedy, and self absorbed, while covering the fact up with fancy, unnecessary gadgets and longer lifespans. While many would argue that longer lifespans are good (and they are), but is a long, empty, and meaningless life better than a shorter, active, and fruitful life?

What I want to know is, where did the whole 'booting' thing come from? I'd never even heard of anything like it.

I think it was supposed to be a parody of the caning incident in Singapore.

And why oh why do you give Australians british cockney accents all the time?:confused:


Because you limies are all right! ;)

(I suppose you could ask why we give you Texan accents all the time ;) ... that I don't know)

Just goes to show: don't make judgements about a country until you've actually lived there. I plead guilty to this charge, and I'm sorry to any americans I've offended.

No worries. You have to have thick skin to hang out here on the general. :)

Ah, but can technological advancements and fixing the rich/poor divide coexist? Personally I don't think they can!
Socialism, baby.

Besides, are advancements necessary? Just make mankind complacent, lazy, greedy, and self absorbed, while covering the fact up with fancy, unnecessary gadgets and longer lifespans.
Yes, how horrible that we communicate with people across the globe and that children no longer die from colds or the flu.

While many would argue that longer lifespans are good (and they are), but is a long, empty, and meaningless life better than a shorter, active, and fruitful life?
Empty and meaningless? How wonderful that you can tell people how they currently feel. I also fail to see how working in a tribal enviroment never knowing the outside world is fruitful.

Socialism, baby.


Yes, how horrible that we communicate with people across the globe and that children no longer die from colds or the flu.


Empty and meaningless? How wonderful that you can tell people how they currently feel. I also fail to see how working in a tribal enviroment never knowing the outside world is fruitful.

People do not need to know the outside world, much less communicate with it. While I agree modern medicine are a benift, they are also a curse. Also, medicines stall evolution by denying natural selection. A life spent within a tribe, hunting for food, providing for the community and actually being useful seems like a much better life than say, being a stockbroker. In tribal societies every member contributes to the survival of the tribe

People do not need to know the outside world, much less communicate with it. While I agree modern medicine are a benift, they are also a curse. Also, medicines stall evolution by denying natural selection. A life spent within a tribe, hunting for food, providing for the community and actually being useful seems like a much better life than say, being a stockbroker. In tribal societies every member contributes to the survival of the tribe
I consider that to be meh. If I don't like it, you would be making me unhappy, therefore defeating the purpose of reverting ourselves.

I consider that to be meh. If I don't like it, you would be making me unhappy, therefore defeating the purpose of reverting ourselves.

What?

What?
If the whole purpose of reverting ourselves to tribal like civiliations is to make us feel happy and fullfilled, but I and others did not feel that way, then reverting back to tribal civilizations would have been a bad idea.

If the whole purpose of reverting oursevles to tribal like civiliations is to make us feel happy and fullfilled, but I and others did not feel that way, then reverting back to tribal civilizations would have been a bad idea.

Your choice of 'reverting' shows the bias and superior attitude of 'civilization'. But, if you truly did find yourself unhappy, you could always try to recreate civilization with like minded individuals. But, with depression levels steadily increasing, suicide rates climing (kinda pulling this out of my ass, but this seems true) wouldn't you say there is something wrong in society? Perhaps you, and many others would find tribal life happier and more fullfilling.

Your choice of 'reverting' shows the bias and superior attitude of 'civilization'.
What do you consider going from being able to cure illness and travel easily to living in tribes with no medicine and technology?

But, if you truly did find yourself unhappy, you could always try to recreate civilization with like minded individuals.
Sacrifice the happiness of many for the few? Isn't that what your utopia is trying to stop?

But, with depression levels steadily increasing, suicide rates climing (kinda pulling this out of my ass, but this seems true) wouldn't you say there is something wrong in society? Perhaps you, and many others would find tribal life happier and more fullfilling.
Thats something that can be fixed by adressing the causes, the answer is not throwing away every advancement we have made so we can live in huts and caves.

I may find living in a tribe fun for a few weeks, but I would not want an entire world like that, and many would not find it fun period.

What do you consider going from being able to cure illness and travel easily to living in tribes with no medicine and technology?


Sacrifice the happiness of many for the few? Isn't that what your utopia is trying to stop?


Thats something that can be fixed by adressing the causes, the answer is not throwing away every advancement we have made so we can live in huts and caves.

I may find living in a tribe fun for a few weeks, but I would not want an entire world like that, and many would not find it fun period.

Tribal societies did have medicine, not as advanced as modern medicine, but still surpisinly effective.

There is no way I would force people to live in a way I would not want them to, well, not real people anyway, the people in my virtual country bow to my whimsical fancies! :)
Whats wrong with huts and caves! I've seen some very cozy looking caves! I know its not for everyone but I'm seriously contemplating going out into the woods and not coming back! (well, come back periodically probably)

Tribal societies did have medicine, not as advanced as modern medicine, but still surpisinly effective.
Not effective enough to keep people dieing from stuff we consider trivial now.

There is no way I would force people to live in a way I would not want them to, well, not real people anyway, the people in my virtual country bow to my whimsical fancies! :)
Oh, a personal utopia. I was under the impression we were talking about subjugating people to your will.

Whats wrong with huts and caves! I've seen some very cozy looking caves! I know its not for everyone but I'm seriously contemplating going out into the woods and not coming back! (well, come back periodically probably)
Bugs, rats, thermal cracks, lack of protection against hypothermia during the winter etc. etc.

Not effective enough to keep people dieing from stuff we consider trivial now.


Oh, a personal utopia. I was under the impression we were talking about subjugating people to your will.


Bugs, rats, thermal cracks, lack of protection against hypothermia during the winter etc. etc.

That's what a fire is for! And you wouldn't exactly be out there naked! You'd where animal hides!

Long-winded and idiotic. Trostia did a nice little job of demolishing this "insight".

The US (being big and free) is the only nation on Earth that censors it's television.

ROFLMAO

America?
“Europe, just drop the USA, it’s done for.”

No. I don't like the current state of the US - nor do I like its political and economical model. But we Europeans cannot "drop" the US altogether. And not because we need them: the EU is the major economical power in the world, has a huge internal market, a sound military power etc etc. No. I think that we must help the US out of the "hole they dug for themselves", because we Europeans care for other people and other countries.


In America these days the news is totally off, on one side the people from FOX news make it look as if anything left from the republican party directly is no better then communists.
Hey! I am a communist! If feel insulted by this! ;)


The EU has also set up a new defence force for EU members and EU candidates only that supersedes NATO.

Check the WEU... NATO members aren't compelled to send MILITARY help to member countries under attack. WEU members are.

Tribal societies did have medicine, not as advanced as modern medicine, but still surpisinly effective.

There is no way I would force people to live in a way I would not want them to, well, not real people anyway, the people in my virtual country bow to my whimsical fancies! :)
Whats wrong with huts and caves! I've seen some very cozy looking caves! I know its not for everyone but I'm seriously contemplating going out into the woods and not coming back! (well, come back periodically probably)

You should do that.
I'm not being rude or dismissive, I genuinely encourage you to try it. Take a big bag of rice ('cos starving kind of sucks) and some thick boring books (you wouldn't believe how bored you can get, and difficult books last longer.)

If you can stick two weeks, you're doing better than I ever did.

You should do that.
I'm not being rude or dismissive, I genuinely encourage you to try it. Take a big bag of rice ('cos starving kind of sucks) and some thick boring books (you wouldn't believe how bored you can get, and difficult books last longer.)

If you can stick two weeks, you're doing better than I ever did.

Wait...are you talking about the guy who did exactly that and died up in Alaska a while ago...?

Anyways, I wouldn't take rice. I don't like rice. I'd hunt for my food, and gather wild fruits and things of that sort.

Wait...are you talking about the guy who did exactly that and died up in Alaska a while ago...?

Anyways, I wouldn't take rice. I don't like rice. I'd hunt for my food, and gather wild fruits and things of that sort.

Good luck with that. Enjoy your 30 year life expectancy.

Good luck with that. Enjoy your 30 year life expectancy.

Why thank you. It will be a wild and free 30 years.

I think Im going to have to explain my anger, I watched fox trashing on my country again. But I've lived there, and to an extent what I am saying is pretty accurate. Check on www.nationmaster.com or the statistical database of the UN, you'll find the American educational, social services and healthcare are below the european standards, you'll also find out that you can get into office of presidency with a 180 million presidential campaign, and the electoral system is such that if you have a majority in votes in a state, you get all votes, meanining you can win presidency theoretically with millions of votes less.

When I lived in the USA, I was taken to the hospital once, before they got a letter from the dutch Embassy that we were covered they REFUSED to treat. From what I've seen money stands above lives.

The nation lowers its standards like trying to adjust the geneva convention just because it's enemys do, the nation threatens to invade my nation in 2001 (a principal allie of the USA even!!) if it were ever to prosecute americans for violating international law, while the USA totally freaks out if other nations do it. Im sorry if I offend you for being disgusted by all that.

America is the most Christian nation on earth?

(points at Vatican City)

No kidding. He fails to point out that America differs from the almighty Western Europe in that America doesn't publically fund anything that has anything to do with religiosity, for example construction of churches, or private religious schools. Also against the constitution is a religious 'tax' so to speak, where the state publically collects taxes for private denominations of religious institutions.
Link to Germany's system, for example. (http://www.state.gov/g/drl/rls/irf/2004/35456.htm)

America? Home of the brave and the free? Or just as totalitarian as current day Russia?

Russia is in far worse shape. Anyone with eyes to see can tell you that.

BTW: This has been posted before.

Check the WEU... NATO members aren't compelled to send MILITARY help to member countries under attack. WEU members are.

Article 5 of the NATO Charter states that an attack on one is an attack on all.

[thread hijack]Why is it when I make an intelligent post (back on page one for those interested) it gets totally ignored? Fris said that yes America has faults but people tend to not offer solutions. I offered one... you may return to your daily lives now that I've whined at you. [/thread hijack]

Article 5 of the NATO Charter states that an attack on one is an attack on all.

Not complete. from www.nato.int :


Article 5

The Parties agree that an armed attack against one or more of them in Europe or North America shall be considered an attack against them all and consequently they agree that, if such an armed attack occurs, each of them, in exercise of the right of individual or collective self-defence recognised by Article 51 of the Charter of the United Nations, will assist the Party or Parties so attacked by taking forthwith, individually and in concert with the other Parties, such action as it deems necessary, including the use of armed force, to restore and maintain the security of the North Atlantic area.


"Such action as it (the member country) deems necessary, including the use of armed force".
That is, a member country could "deem necessary" to use diplomacy instead of military force. Or just sending humanitarian aid.

from www.weu.int :


ARTICLE V

If any of the High Contracting Parties should be the object of an armed attack in Europe, the other High Contracting Parties will, in accordance with the provisions of Article 51 of the Charter of the United Nations, afford the Party so attacked all the military and other aid and assistance in their power.

This article binds the WEU members to reciprocal military aid. Note that the USA isn't a High Contracting Party of WEU.

Not complete. from www.nato.int :



"Such action as it (the member country) deems necessary, including the use of armed force".
That is, a member country could "deem necessary" to use diplomacy instead of military force. Or just sending humanitarian aid.

from www.weu.int :



This article binds the WEU members to reciprocal military aid. Note that the USA isn't a High Contracting Party of WEU.

And half of the WEU is in? Anyone? NATO!!!

And half of the WEU is in? Anyone? NATO!!!

If you care to read the WEU treaty, the WEU is definied as a sort of an "hard core" inside of the NATO frame; imho, this WEU hard core was created because the NATO treaty was deemed somewhat weak, as it left the choice of military aid to the free will of each member country.

Add: note that not all WEU is NATO...

America? Home of the brave and the free? Or just as totalitarian as current day Russia?

To me America has always been the lighthouse of the free and the brave, no longer… The light bulb broke and America seems incapable of fixing it, the worst part is… it is creating a short out worsening the situation.

America still claims to be the nation of the free and the brave, however when you look at the facts and ignore your patriotic feelings (which I am aware is something that is hard to do for even liberal Americans), the USA has less liberties then even ex-communist eastern European nations... [etc ad nauseam]

Anybody put polonium in your coffee yet?

Add: note that not all WEU is NATO...

Note: I did not say that they were. :rolleyes:

-snip-


A really well written essay. I wish more people in the USA could be like you, that is have enough brains to be able to critize their country and their politicians. Then the world would be a much better place to live in because USA would still be the most powerful nation in the world. The only difference would be that it would be using its power to make the world a better place instead of just protecting its own interests and don't give a shit about the misery it's creating.

A really well written essay. I wish more people in the USA could be like you, that is have enough brains to be able to critize their country and their politicians.

Nice bit of trolling there.

Christ, what is with you people. "Aha! Americans are stupid! Stupid! STUUUUPID!" You cheerfully gloat - based on nothing whatsoever - and then you congratulate each other for being so incredibly intelligent.

Meanwhile, you ignore everything anyone writes, all logic and reason and FACTS.

That doesn't sound very intelligent, and if you think the OP was just "having enough brains to criticize their country and their politicians" you apparently didn't even read THAT.

Why don't one of you oh-so-fucking-smart and oh-so-terribly-superior and oh-so-self-righteous-compared-to-American-fucktards folks actually READ something - like when I tear apart your ignorant arguments?

Don't give me that "english is not my first language" thing either. I know ESL students who, whatever their position, can at least have the courtesy to READ instead of just making unsupported, ignorant and hostile assumptions.

We all need a little Goofball in a good parade!

And we need him to be in that parade, naked, while dancing with a koala.

A really well written essay. I wish more people in the USA could be like you, that is have enough brains to be able to critize their country and their politicians. Then the world would be a much better place to live in because USA would still be the most powerful nation in the world. The only difference would be that it would be using its power to make the world a better place instead of just protecting its own interests and don't give a shit about the misery it's creating.

Oh brother. If you actually believe half the shit in that article then you are dumber than a door knob.

the USA has less liberties then even ex-communist eastern European nations.?

I stopped reading when I came to this point. You clearly have never heard of history.

Basically, I absolutely despise European (and Australian ;)) condescending elitism towards Americans and American ignorance about the rest of the world (believe me, it does get frustrating at times when conversing with my peers).

Funny story about how poorly geography is taught in America. I was 6 at the time, and I told my friends that my parents came from India. Someone pointed to a map of the US, and pointed at Indiana. Oddly enough, Homer Simpson made that same mistake once.

The USA is an empire in decline, it's going to die, theirs no point in beating the poor horse.

Oh brother. If you actually believe half the shit in that article then you are dumber than a door knob.

It may have been written in a bias-manner but the fact is, America needs big time improvement and it can't get it if it keeps pumping money into futile militaristic endeavours. It has curbed freedoms and the fine line between the separation of church and state is almost non-existent, leaving some people out in the cold. The government talks big but doesn't ante up.

The War on Drugs and Terror have achieved very little if anything. Don't give me the "but America hasn't been attacked since 9/11" line because you know what? The terrorists have America exactly where they want it; paranoid and jumpy and thinking that another attack will happen. They don't need to attack again because they have America living in fear of terrorism.

America was a good country once upon a time. An aggressive foreign policy wrecked it international credibility.

It may have been written in a bias-manner...

understatement of the century there.

understatement of the century there.

Everything has a bias. I say find three news article on the same topic, and there will be wording that makes it bias in some way.

Everything has a bias. I say find three news article on the same topic, and there will be wording that makes it bias in some way.

Exactly. That article goes far beyond any normal "bias" you will see in political papers.

Funny story about how poorly geography is taught in America. I was 6 at the time, and I told my friends that my parents came from India. Someone pointed to a map of the US, and pointed at Indiana. Oddly enough, Homer Simpson made that same mistake once.

...but they were 6 years old...I think you would've been better off telling a story about how kids in high school don't know where India is.

No, you're right. Blind patriots won't like this. Neither will non-blind, cynical, atheist, Christian, Muslim, stingy, charitable, bull-headed, open-minded, or pretty much any other kind of American.

We've seen a hundred variants of this essay, and they're remarkable only in their similarities. Yes, the USA has problems, and you've highlighted some of the bigger ones. However, your stereotypical sorting of so many of us into neat pigeonholes may match the media presentation of America, but it's not the reality.

I've heard exactly this same diatribe from my Dutch cousins. Yet somehow when they come over for a visit, they marvel that the places we live are so unlike the "real America". They're perfectly capable of driving down a superhighway and pointing out ten things that match their stereotype view, whilst totally ignoring the 500 things that don't.

I don't see any suggestions, just a catalog of faults. Here's a clue for you: we know our faults. What we need is solutions.

Got any?
Thanks for saying what needed to be said.

Nice bit of trolling there.

Christ, what is with you people. "Aha! Americans are stupid! Stupid! STUUUUPID!" You cheerfully gloat - based on nothing whatsoever - and then you congratulate each other for being so incredibly intelligent.
Why do you insist on making sense? Don't you realize you're depriving them their chance to (pseudo)intellectuality? It's not just non-Americans though. ;)

Why do you insist on making sense? Don't you realize you're depriving them their chance to (pseudo)intellectuality? It's not just non-Americans though. ;)

Of course it isn't. As with intelligence, no country has a monopoly on stupidity. Stupidity is one of the most widely-traded goods, despite what one would assume are effective trade barriers...

Of course it isn't. As with intelligence, no country has a monopoly on stupidity. Stupidity is one of the most widely-traded goods, despite what one would assume are effective trade barriers...

Trade? Stupidity is a naturally occuring substance produced within the brains of homo sapian sapians and in homo sapian neanderthalus, though the latter's brain produces lower quantities. Strangely, it is not produced in non-sapians. Not even Canis Lupus Familiarus. It is a naturally occuring substance that is responsible for four out of every three acts of mankind.

Why do you insist on making sense? Don't you realize you're depriving them their chance to (pseudo)intellectuality? It's not just non-Americans though. ;)


People making sense on the general boards????

Isn't that some kind of oxymoron? ;)

...but they were 6 years old...I think you would've been better off telling a story about how kids in high school don't know where India is.

German Nightmare told me they teach geography at that age in most other countries. Basic geography, like there are other countries besides Canada. And unlike some other European posters, he's no elitist asshat.

America is the greatest country in the world!Maybe. And yet you have Bush, Phelps, Cruise, and Barney.

Trade? Stupidity is a naturally occuring substance produced within the brains of homo sapian sapians and in homo sapian neanderthalus, though the latter's brain produces lower quantities. Strangely, it is not produced in non-sapians. Not even Canis Lupus Familiarus. It is a naturally occuring substance that is responsible for four out of every three acts of mankind.

Of course it's traded. That's why although one person may be stupid, and another may be stupid, put them together and they are in fact more than twice as stupid. The synergizing effect of trade.

The US should stop putting it's nose where it doesn't belong.
Having problems with raining airplanes...?
Butt out of everyone else's buisness, and you'll do just fine.
Besides, the US is only the rest of the worlds crap that moved over there when they got smart enough to use boats.

The US should stop putting it's nose where it doesn't belong.
Having problems with raining airplanes...?
Butt out of everyone else's buisness, and you'll do just fine.
Besides, the US is only the rest of the worlds crap that moved over there when they got smart enough to use boats.

Good job. You just proved Greator Trostia is correct.

I agree with some of the sentiments expressed here, but you contradict yourself several times with your "America is totalitarian" line.
America? Home of the brave and the free? Or just as totalitarian as current day Russia?
...

America still claims to be the nation of the free and the brave, however when you look at the facts and ignore your patriotic feelings (which I am aware is something that is hard to do for even liberal Americans), the USA has less liberties then even ex-communist eastern European nations. Also in my opinion the USA has become something that is not much different from the ultra-conservative Iran but then based on the principals of Christianity instead of the Islam. In this essay I will bring to you my reasons for saying: “Europe, just drop the USA, it’s done for.”

In America these days the news is totally off, on one side the people from FOX news make it look as if anything left from the republican party directly is no better then communists. They even manage to twist things so much that they make a democratic speech about how good the democratic party is sound like a testimony that the Democratic party is no more then bullcrap. This is no different when it comes to the liberal news stations in the country. This means that if you were to get an accurate picture of the news you would have to tune into foreign news agencies. Of course they spin and twist as well but compared to even the most factual news station in the USA, they’re HIGHLY accurate.
Isn't the fact that the press has the ability to distort and malign politicians on both sides of the spectrum proof that it is free, however?

Now lets turn to the American gun nuts, now I understand it’s a laugh to shoot your gun, I quite enjoy shooting of a few rounds myself, however I am strongly against private owned so I don’t have any of my own. So now you’ve got my understanding… What in gods name do you need military grade rifles, machine guns, cannons even rocket launchers for (Texas)? I don’t expect people to carry around a .50 cal machine gun for when they get robbed. Then Americans claim it’s for national defence… seriously… if anything defeats the American army in the USA itself (outside is possible but inside NO) then no rednecks are going to have the firepower to even dent that force.
Isn't the fact that Americans are able to possess highly powerful firearms proof that our citizens have more extensive liberties than the citizens of European countries in this respect, for better or for worse?

To continue on the areas of rights and the bible etc. Most Americans are Christian, the lovely thing about that is that those Christians are also mostly conservative Christians but also interpret the bible selectively. I always love it when the Yanks go out on the street when a brain-dead person gets put off of life support screaming don’t play god. Now here comes the great part that those people are so dumb that they cant even understand that keeping them on life-support is playing god in the first place, letting nature take its course is NOT playing god. To continue, thou shall not kill. *Giggle*, the most Christian nation on earth is the one with the death penalty, need I go on?
While the majority of the United States' population profess to be Christians, our government is decidely separate from our churches. While laws are sometimes made with a religious basis (unjustly), we nevertheless do not have a state-sponsored church, and people are allowed to practice their respective religions even if they do not practice Christianity. I'd say that made us pretty different from a little of nations in the world, nonetheleast the European nations that have state churches. Further, your "braindead person" line is misleading: in the widely-publicizied Terri Schiavo case, by a margin of 63% to 28%, the public supported the removal of her feeding tube (http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/PollVault/story?id=599622). The movement against doing so simply represented a fringe group in our society.

Gay rights also something very nice, it is up to god to decide who is right or wrong and not us Humans, and if god had hated gays then why does he allow it? If he truly is “god” then he can stop gayness too or is he just as selective about his powers as Christians are about how they interpret the bible? Christians then say that god punishes the gay rights activists. The Funny part is, that the nation that was the first to recognise things like gay marriage hasn’t seen natural disasters in over half a century + ditto for nations that followed suit and gave gays equal rights as well.
The United States is not great when it comes to gay rights, but I'd say we were a little better than say Iran, where homosexual acts are banned altogether. For the record, only a few televangelists discussed natural disasters in relation to gays.

I agree with many of your points, however, about our education system, for starters. We have a ways to go, but I'm optimistic for the future. We still have a lot of smart people in this country.

Yeah...I'm pretty sure that Simpsons episode was probably satirizing the US more than it was Australia. South Park is more inclined, however, to side with the US more (see Team America) although it still satirizes elements of American culture.

Erm, correct me if i'm wrong, but i don't remember a single joke from Team America that didn't satirize America?