NationStates Jolt Archive

good for him. Personally I find accusing one of rape far more offensive than making a borderline racist comment.

Maybe this time, he's got a point. The Reverend Al Sharpton has been one of Don Imus's loudest detractors. Today, Imus asked when the Reverend was going to apologise to the exhonerated Duke lacrosse players. I agree, but I think it's unlikely. Your thoughts?

good for him. Personally I find accusing one of rape far more offensive than making a borderline racist comment.

Aye, but I think they should both just shut the hell up.

Also: Diplomacy?

Maybe this time, he's got a point. The Reverend Al Sharpton has been one of Don Imus's loudest detractors. Today, Imus asked when the Reverend was going to apologise to the exhonerated Duke lacrosse players. I agree, but I think it's unlikely. Your thoughts?

Dammit with the poll! :D

Aye, but I think they should both just shut the hell up.

Also: Diplomacy?

I checked my email, and all the junk folders, I didn't get anything.

Both need to shut the hell up.

I don't see Sharpton and Jackson calling for the dismissal of every rapper who's ever used the words, "Hoe" or "******" which is far more offensive than, "Nappy headed" in my opinion. They're both racist hypocrits.

They are both loud and annoying, people who open their mouth and spout nonsensical bullshit. Why anyone listens to them to begin with is beyond me.

Whatever.

Jesse Jackson may want to explain why he chose to offer to pay all of the false accuser's tuition costs with funds from his charity,regardless of the outcome.

As far as an apology from Sharpton? I'd rather he kept his mouth shut when the next potentially destructive event occurs,rather than try to make an opporotunity for himself.

Well, turnabout is fair play. I'd set up a press conference and say that, if he's so hasty to call people rapists, he might have something in his past himself. Newton's 3rd Law of Motion.

Turnabout doesn't work on African-Americans in the US - they're free to be racist and free to slur whoever they want in public - and get away with it over and over and over again.

Well, turnabout is fair play. I'd set up a press conference and say that, if he's so hasty to call people rapists, he might have something in his past himself. Newton's 3rd Law of Motion.

Turnabout doesn't work on African-Americans in the US - they're free to be racist and free to slur whoever they want in public - and get away with it over and over and over again.

Remember, it's OK to be a prejudiced bastard if you're prejudiced against white people!

Remember, it's OK to be a prejudiced bastard if you're prejudiced against white people!

Or if you're black and prejudiced against jews.

Why the network would take any guff from an anti semite and a pimp is beyond me. Weak stomachs and backs at MSNBC.

Turnabout doesn't work on African-Americans in the US - they're free to be racist and free to slur whoever they want in public - and get away with it over and over and over again.

Fred Phelps is a WASP and he gets away with much more. Regardless, the boys WOULD get away with a "Al Shaprton raped someone" innuendo, IF they did it right.

One says niggers, the other says rapists.

apples and oranges.

Turnabout doesn't work on African-Americans in the US - they're free to be racist and free to slur whoever they want in public - and get away with it over and over and over again.

True dat. Just look at Chris Rock

Here's the thing. Black "victims" of racism are going to be seen as victims. They are going to be associated with the victims of slavery and segregation and whathaveyou. White "victims" of racism are going to be associated with the Klan and other white supremacy groups. They're going to be seen as loud mouthed racists. However, if the white victim was a muslim or Jew or whatever, it might be different. But white Christian males are going to be seen as the oppressors. It's the product of a complex line of racism that, contrary to popular opinion, wasn't created by white people in the 1600s witht he start of the slave trade. Also, contrary to popular opinion, white people did not invent slavery in the 1600s. It's a combination of ignorance of not-recent history and not-ignorance of recent history. In short, it's caused by people who don't read history books and a media that strives for the next big story.

But white Christian males are going to be seen as the oppressors.

Well you know, there's kind of a reason for that.....

Both need to shut the hell up.

I don't see Sharpton and Jackson calling for the dismissal of every rapper who's ever used the words, "Hoe" or "******" which is far more offensive than, "Nappy headed" in my opinion. They're both racist hypocrits.
Well, it's hard to call for the dismissal of a rapper, considering that it's a performance art, and that the most you could hope to do is get a record label to drop someone, and perhaps get the radio stations to stop playing their music.

But keep it up with the bullshit comparisons, by all means.

True dat. Just look at Chris Rock

How is Chris Rock racist?

How is Chris Rock racist?

How is Imus?

How is Chris Rock racist?

I guess you haven't heard his performance where he says there are two kinds of black people - blacks and niggaz... and the niggaz got to go....

Nothing nice to say about a lot of black people when he talks.

And yet he's black.

If he were merely criticizing members of the black community who are unsavory to him in some way, that would be one thing.

But he's using the term in a derogatory fashion to make his point.

Well, it's hard to call for the dismissal of a rapper, considering that it's a performance art, and that the most you could hope to do is get a record label to drop someone, and perhaps get the radio stations to stop playing their music.

But keep it up with the bullshit comparisons, by all means.

Is that really all that much different from what happened here - where a broadcaster decided to no longer broadcast the show?

How is Imus?

I don't particularly see this as him being racist, so much as him saying racist things. I still fail to see why this is news, though.

Also, just sent you an email that (hopefully) made it through. You get it?

Here's the thing. Black "victims" of racism are going to be seen as victims. They are going to be associated with the victims of slavery and segregation and whathaveyou. White "victims" of racism are going to be associated with the Klan and other white supremacy groups.

I take it by saying "victims" instead of victims, you don't actually think anyone can be a victim of racism?

Sounds like you have an issue with the English language.

But white Christian males are going to be seen as the oppressors.

Historically, they are.

It's the product of a complex line of racism that, contrary to popular opinion, wasn't created by white people in the 1600s witht he start of the slave trade.

Strawman. Yeah, no shit, racism wasn't invented in the 1600's by white people.

Find someone who actually claims that, or do you just enjoy bashing strawmen so you can whine about the poor white people being unfairly portrayed?

Also, contrary to popular opinion, white people did not invent slavery in the 1600s.

Strawman. Yeah, no shit. See above.

It's a combination of ignorance of not-recent history and not-ignorance of recent history. In short, it's caused by people who don't read history books and a media that strives for the next big story.

Ah yes... all your strawmen served the purpose... of ANOTHER logical fallacy, that of ad hominem. "People I disagree with, are IGNORANT!"

Not a very good argument you have there. But I'm used to that from your kind.

Here's the thing. Black "victims" of racism are going to be seen as victims. They are going to be associated with the victims of slavery and segregation and whathaveyou. White "victims" of racism are going to be associated with the Klan and other white supremacy groups. They're going to be seen as loud mouthed racists. However, if the white victim was a muslim or Jew or whatever, it might be different. But white Christian males are going to be seen as the oppressors. It's the product of a complex line of racism that, contrary to popular opinion, wasn't created by white people in the 1600s witht he start of the slave trade. Also, contrary to popular opinion, white people did not invent slavery in the 1600s. It's a combination of ignorance of not-recent history and not-ignorance of recent history. In short, it's caused by people who don't read history books and a media that strives for the next big story.

Would you be talking about Anthony Johnson? The first man to own a slave in America, who was black. Before this, blacks were brought to America like other groups of people ... as indentured servants. After "X" amount of years when the servant had paid back the buyer who brought him to America, he/she was free from servitude. Often times they would be given a small piece of land (depending on who brought you here) once freed from their servitude as well.

Anthony Johnson was the first freed indentured servant to bring others here and claim he, and I quote, "had ye Negro for his life". He convinced the courts of this in 1654, creating slavery in Virginia (Jamestown) which also made him the first man in America to own a slave.

lol I love how irnoy works sometimes ...

Well, it's hard to call for the dismissal of a rapper, considering that it's a performance art, and that the most you could hope to do is get a record label to drop someone, and perhaps get the radio stations to stop playing their music.

But keep it up with the bullshit comparisons, by all means.

But Imus isn't allowed to say "******" on the raido and a rapper is simply because he/she does it to a musical beat? Freedom of speech is freedom of speech. There are no clauses to this.

Keep up the bullshit arguments, by all means.

Would you be talking about Anthony Johnson? The first man to own a slave in America, who was black. Before this, blacks were brought to America like other groups of people ... as indentured servants. After "X" amount of years when the servant had paid back the buyer who brought him to America, he/she was free from servitude. Often times they would be given a small piece of land (depending on who brought you here) once freed from their servitude as well.

Anthony Johnson was the first freed indentured servant to bring others here and claim he, and I quote, "had ye Negro for his life". He convinced the courts of this in 1654, creating slavery in Virginia (Jamestown) which also made him the first man in America to own a slave.

lol I love how irnoy works sometimes ...

why, the first man to own a slave in the colonies was black, that TOTALLY invalidates 200 years of white oppression and slave owning.

But Imus isn't allowed to say "******" on the raido and a rapper is simply because he/she does it to a musical beat? Freedom of speech is freedom of speech. There are no clauses to this.

Keep up the bullshit arguments, by all means.

do you even know what "freedom of speech" means?

Seriously, who the hell came up with the concept that freedom of speech means that you're never allowed to have anything bad happen to you for anything you say, ever?

im all for imus on this one. it is time someone nationally puts sharpton in his place.

think how foolish the black panthers must feel. i mean more than ussual. they marched on this and spread their racism about the subject. and it turns out to be a haox.

why, the first man to own a slave in the colonies was black, that TOTALLY invalidates 200 years of white oppression and slave owning.

Great way of thinking outside the box. Blacks blame white people for bringing slavery to America instead of acknowledging that it was black people who sold themselves to the Portuguese to be sold as slaves and that the first person to bring slavery to America, the famous basis for black rage, was a black person himself. And newsflash ... blacks aren't the only people to have ever been slaves. Excuse me for not shedding a tear ...

do you even know what "freedom of speech" means?

Seriously, who the hell came up with the concept that freedom of speech means that you're never allowed to have anything bad happen to you for anything you say, ever?

I never said you aren't responsible for your actions. That is a true strawman arguement right there. Simply that it is a double standard to get mad when person 'X' says "Nappy headed hoes" but not when person 'Y' says the same exact thing. You either limit and curtail everyones freedom of speech or you leave it be. They get mad at Imus for what he says but rappers say that stuff all the time and I don't see Sharpton getting all up in a rage about it. It's a double standard. Simple as that.

Great way of thinking outside the box. Blacks blame white people for bringing slavery to America instead of acknowledging that it was black people who sold themselves to the Portuguese to be sold as slaves and that the first person to bring slavery to America, the famous basis for black rage, was a black person himself.

I don't think most people blame white for bringing slavery to america as much as they blame for the fact that they kept bringing slaves to america

And newsflash ... blacks aren't the only people to have ever been slaves. Excuse me for not shedding a tear

You really are clueless...

You either limit and curtail everyones freedom of speech or you leave it be.

Lemme ask a few brief questions

Where do we find the articulation of this right of free speech, exactly? Where is it written? What does it say, specifically? How has that right been violated or curtailed?

But Imus isn't allowed to say "******" on the raido and a rapper is simply because he/she does it to a musical beat? Freedom of speech is freedom of speech. There are no clauses to this.

Keep up the bullshit arguments, by all means.

For starters, if Imus wanted to say that on the air, and his bosses had no problems with it, and there's no FCC regulation against it, then he can say it. What part of that don't you understand? The problem for Imus isn't that he's forbidden by some law (unless there's an FCC reg I don't know about)--it's that his advertisers don't want to be associated with him, at least on the MSNBC simulcast, and in the commercial radio business, advertisers rule. And if advertisers on radio stations that play music with those lyrics complained, or threatened to take their business elsewhere, those songs would be gone--period. There's no freedom of speech issue here. It's all business, and the sooner you learn the difference, the better off you'll be.

-snip-

no no, don't help him, he'll never learn that way.

Great way of thinking outside the box. Blacks blame white people for bringing slavery to America instead of acknowledging that it was black people who sold themselves to the Portuguese to be sold as slaves and that the first person to bring slavery to America, the famous basis for black rage, was a black person himself. And newsflash ... blacks aren't the only people to have ever been slaves. Excuse me for not shedding a tear ...

Are you under the impression that every slave sold himself into slavery? Seems to me that doing so (with the possible exception of indentured servitude) was a fairly rare occurrence.

Or was it that you were trying to suggest that some people sold other people and you have decided that they're all the same?

Meanwhile, most people aren't angry that white people brought slavery to America. It is more the problem of the fact that the white people in power perpetuated it and then treated the freed slaves like shit.

Soooooo, history lessons aside, what about Sharpton apologising?

Soooooo, history lessons aside, what about Sharpton apologising?

Sounds good. Why not? People should play nice with one another.

Fred Phelps is a WASP and he gets away with much more. Regardless, the boys WOULD get away with a "Al Shaprton raped someone" innuendo, IF they did it right.

I think steve pagones and yankel rosenbaum would disagree that fred phelps gets away with far more.

I honestly do not understand why the media pays any attention to Sharpton, given his history.

(Well, I do actually, but they should stop pretending that it is news and just admit that it is ratings driven entertainment. He's not a serious person).

How is Imus?
Well... (http://colorado.mediamatters.org/items/200704110004)
As Media Matters for America has extensively documented, Imus' April 4 remark was not just "coarse frat-boy humor," but part of a lengthy history of racially offensive and inflammatory comments that has continued in recent months. For instance, Imus on February 8 told Bill Richardson, the Mexican-American governor of New Mexico, to "besa mi culo," which loosely translates to "kiss my ass." Imus' executive producer, Bernard McGuirk, suggested on the March 6 broadcast that that "bitch" Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton (D-NY) would pander to African-Americans by wearing "cornrows and gold teeth." And as the Forward newspaper reported in a December 8, 2006, online article, Imus during his November 30 broadcast referred to the "Jewish management" of CBS Radio as "money-grubbing bastards."

Additionally, as noted in a July 18, 2000, article in The Village Voice, Imus referred to former Defense Secretary William Cohen as "the Mandingo" and to Cohen's African-American wife as "a ho." As The Boston Globe noted in a March 27, 2004, article, " 'Mandingo' is also the title of a 1975 movie in which a black male slave is paired intimately with a white female slave master." That article reported that frequent Imus guest Mike Barnicle had apologized for similarly using the term on his own radio show to refer to Cohen's wife, Janet Langhart. The Village Voice article described other racially charged insults that Imus has made about specific individuals:

The muckraker Philip Nobile has been tracking Imus's racist rap in a series for the webzine tompaine.com. When you take this patter out of laff-riot context, it's strikingly similar to the drollery of David Duke. Imus and his buds have called O.J.'s lead attorney "chicken wing Johnny Cochran," Sammy Davis Jr. "a one-eyed lawn jockey," Patrick Ewing "Mighty Joe Young," Defense Secretary William Cohen "the Mandingo," and his black wife "a 'ho."

In an appearance on the April 9 edition of CNN's The Situation Room, Cohen noted that "at one point when we married -- they played 'Jungle Fever' " on Imus in the Morning and that Langhart "was referred to as 'brown sugar' " on the show.

A May 26, 2000, article in The Washington Post (accessed through the Nexis database) similarly reported that "sometime around 1995, when the New York Times hired African-American journalist Gwen Ifill to cover the White House, Imus reportedly said: 'Isn't the Times wonderful? It lets the cleaning lady cover the White House.' " The article further stated that Imus "doesn't deny the Ifill comment, but says he can't find a record of it," and added, "Whether he said it or not, Imus apologized to Ifill on the air after he was criticized."

On the April 10 edition of Imus in the Morning, Imus asserted, "I never said anything about Gwen Ifill. This was a comedy routine where we make up the news which we've been doing since 1968 on the radio." Later in the program, Imus said "it was intended to reflect the absurd philosophy we perceived of, I guess it was the Reagan administration -- not that we thought the Reagan administration was a bunch of racists, that's not the point." On the April 9 edition of the program, Imus said that "I did not say that, and obviously there are ways to check that. I didn't say that."

Furthermore, on the July 19, 1998, broadcast of CBS News' 60 Minutes, Imus reportedly admitted to reporter Mike Wallace that McGuirk was on his show "to do '******' jokes" and admitted to using the word "******" himself.

MIKE WALLACE: You told Tom ANDERSON, the producer, in your car coming home that Bernard McGuirk is there to do "******" jokes.

DON IMUS: Well I've n -- I never use that word.

MIKE WALLACE: Tom?

TOM ANDERSON: I'm right here.

DON IMUS: Did I use that word?

TOM ANDERSON: I recall you using that word.

DON IMUS: Oh, okay, well then I used that word, but I mean -- of course that was an off the record conversation -- [LAUGHTER]

MIKE WALLACE: The hell it was!


Both need to shut the hell up.

I don't see Sharpton and Jackson calling for the dismissal of every rapper who's ever used the words, "Hoe" or "******" which is far more offensive than, "Nappy headed" in my opinion. They're both racist hypocrits.
The News' observation about the language in rap music echoes Imus' own defense, noted by Media Matters, that the slur he used "originated in the black community." He stated: "I may be a white man, but I know that ... young black women all through that society are demeaned and disparaged and disrespected ... by their own black men and that they are called that name." As Media Matters noted, Rev. Al Sharpton objected to this defense, saying, "We have said that we are against the degrading that is done even by blacks. ... Wherever he says this originated from does not give him the right to use it."


It would take a while to find a more direct quote.

Imus has just been fired (http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/18072804/?GT1=9246). Someone else will have to take up the mantle of Sharpton gadfly. . .

Maybe this time, he's got a point. The Reverend Al Sharpton has been one of Don Imus's loudest detractors. Today, Imus asked when the Reverend was going to apologise to the exhonerated Duke lacrosse players. I agree, but I think it's unlikely. Your thoughts?

...are you thinking what I'm thinking?

Al Sharpton. Don Imus. Thunderdome. :)

...are you thinking what I'm thinking?

Al Sharpton. Don Imus. Thunderdome. :)

ZOMG! A Sharpton / Imus Mud-wrestling Match for Idiot Supremacy! Woot! Somebody call the WWE . . .

I guess you haven't heard his performance where he says there are two kinds of black people - blacks and niggaz... and the niggaz got to go....

Nothing nice to say about a lot of black people when he talks.

And yet he's black.

If he were merely criticizing members of the black community who are unsavory to him in some way, that would be one thing.

But he's using the term in a derogatory fashion to make his point.
I've not only heard it, I own it and I know the thing practically by heart--and there's nothing racist about it. He's doing the equivalent of white comics talking shit about rednecks. Is that racist?

Maybe this time, he's got a point. The Reverend Al Sharpton has been one of Don Imus's loudest detractors. Today, Imus asked when the Reverend was going to apologise to the exhonerated Duke lacrosse players. I agree, but I think it's unlikely. Your thoughts?

Good luck. I'm pretty sure he still hasn't apologized for Tawana Brawley.

The sentiment is valid as a comment on Sharpton's hypocrisy, but not a defense of Imus' behavior.

I've not only heard it, I own it and I know the thing practically by heart--and there's nothing racist about it. He's doing the equivalent of white comics talking shit about rednecks. Is that racist?

Not to mention that Toni Morrison said almost exactly the same thing in a more scholarly, but less funny, fashion in "The Bluest Eye." Except in the period she was writing the polite term was "Colored Folk."

I agree completely. But how do we get Al Sharpton fired, too?

Monica Lewinsky. Back in action.

Good luck. I'm pretty sure he still hasn't apologized for Tawana Brawley.

The sentiment is valid as a comment on Sharpton's hypocrisy, but not a defense of Imus' behavior.

I agree completely. But how do we get Al Sharpton fired, too?

The following people that the world needs to tell 'to go sit in a corner, and shut the fuck up':

Fred Phelps
Al Sharpton
Jesse Jackson
Don Imus
All and any Artist who likes to use the N words, bitches, hos etc.
Opportunist
Rush Limbaugh
The President of Iran
Any advertisement who support the above

Yeah, the pres. of Iran, Mahmoud Ahmadinejad... isn't he the one who apparently criticizes the events of the holocaust? I believe he questioned its actual existence on television, if I am correct. On another interview he commented on how "the Jewish weren't the only people affected by the holocaust" Which is definitely true, Hitler targeted many, many more people than just the Jewish. Yes, the death rates of the Jews were dwarfed by some of the other atrocities he did to the handicapped or people with some sort of genetic flaw (by genetic, meaning what we knew at the time), but it is important to know that they were the ones who were targeted first, due to the economic disaster that was going on in germany at the time, and due to the misconceptions that the Jewish were "doing better than they were" Or "All of germany is poor because of those penny pinching Jews", Hitler used them as a scapegoat for an only-god-knows-what reason in the holocaust. but I believe he also said that the holocaust was "severely overblown" and "A result of British propaganda efforts". Well, historically, propaganda was spread around, but that does not compare to the eyewitness statements of the survivors and their families, or the confessions of the Gestapo. One does not even have to take a 5 minute drive to find a mass grave somewhere or other. I don't believe the British would go to such efforts of propaganda, even during a war.

So in a roundabout way of finishing this statement, which has very little to do with Imus directly; I'm reading a book "the Voice of Modern Hatred: Tracing the rise of Neo-Fascism in Europe" by Nicholas Fraser, and apparently there are still an alarming amount of anti-Semites in Europe, and they flat out believe the holocaust ever happened, even though it happened a mere half-century ago! Racism and Fascism is something I find very intriguing and disturbing at the same time