NationStates Jolt Archive

http://youtube.com/watch?v=wvEuQ4R9AhI



That is just disturbing. Christian military members in livery giving a sermon in a provincial chinese village to convert people.

Supposedly China has 80+ million christians already with thousands converting every day. It is estimated that between 40 million to 100 million Chinese are Christian (or 3% to 4% of the Chinese population). Christianity is also the fastest growing religion in China. It is hard to keep an official count since many rural people or even people in cities keep their faith secret to avoid government reprecussions.
It went from about 500,000 in 1900 to reaching 100+ million now. That is more practicing christians then any country in europe has citizens..... Plus at the rate it's going now by 2100-2150 roughly half the chinese will be christians.
That's a nice prospect. The godstate China.......


Am I the only one who sort of wishes the Chinese would stick to Buddhism, Taoism and all that cool stuff instead of eating up christianity like starving children?

and the problem with this is?

Hey, if they want to have their government espouse Christianity, and flog it until everyone converts, that's the product of their one party government, isn't it?

You're saying something is wrong with the Chinese government?

Am I the only one who sort of wishes the Chinese would stick to Buddhism, Taoism and all that cool stuff instead of eating up christianity like starving children?

Well chinese folk religion isn't a fixed 'religion' like islam or christianity. As I understand it, it boils down to ancestor worship that varies from area to area. Some include buddhism, other taoism, others confucionism and some a bit of all. They'll just mesh parts of christianity into it.

I seem to recall that someone named Bush decided to invade Afghanistan and tell the people there how to live. Then he invaded Iraq, and tried to tell them how to live.

Now the OP wants to tell the Chinese how to live.

Here's your pack, and some ammo, and your rifle and a helmet. We'll be dropping you from a commercial airliner at 30,000 feet over China.

Good luck persuading them.

The Chinese, over the millenia, have absorbed and changed every culture they've met. The so-called conquerors have been, ultimately, made Chinese (except the Japanese during WWII - and that was only because the Japanese lost to the Allies). The same will happen to Christianity - 100 years from now, I wouldn't be surprised to find Christ and Buddha meshed into something new and strange.

oh fuck heavens gonna be crowded :eek:

maybe we should drop some Scientology pamphlets I'd love to see how that plays out with Chinas legal system :p

http://youtube.com/watch?v=wvEuQ4R9AhI



That is just disturbing. Christian military members in livery giving a sermon in a provincial chinese village to convert people.

Supposedly China has 80+ million christians already with thousands converting every day. It is estimated that between 40 million to 100 million Chinese are Christian (or 3% to 4% of the Chinese population). Christianity is also the fastest growing religion in China. It is hard to keep an official count since many rural people or even people in cities keep their faith secret to avoid government reprecussions.
It went from about 500,000 in 1900 to reaching 100+ million now. That is more practicing christians then any country in europe has citizens..... Plus at the rate it's going now by 2100-2150 roughly half the chinese will be christians.
That's a nice prospect. The godstate China.......


Am I the only one who sort of wishes the Chinese would stick to Buddhism, Taoism and all that cool stuff instead of eating up christianity like starving children?

Why? Their reactions to external events are still going to be dictated by resource pressure and economics, whether their Christian, Bhudist or animist.

That is to be expected. After all, chirstianity is the best religion for capitalism, and that is why its expreading so much over there.

Anyway, as said, China is a nation of nations. There are hundreds of cultures inside it, and they all change each other. China as it is wont change overnight, it will simply receive christianity and adapt it and to it.

That is to be expected. After all, chirstianity is the best religion for capitalism, and that is why its expreading so much over there.

Anyway, as said, China is a nation of nations. There are hundreds of cultures inside it, and they all change each other. China as it is wont change overnight, it will simply receive christianity and adapt it and to it.

I thought the Jews were the best capitalists?

I thought the Jews were the best capitalists?

Probabily, but they arent as cool as christians.

And also, to be a jew you have to cut your dick, something not many people are willing to.

To be a christian, all the requirements is that you´re alive and has an IQ smaller than 110.

yeah look at all the good it did to Africa *nods*

In Africa, it was enforced at gunpoint.

Anyway, christianity, just as any other religion, just sucks.

That is to be expected. After all, chirstianity is the best religion for capitalism, and that is why its expreading so much over there.

yeah look at all the good it did to Africa *nods*

Well chinese folk religion isn't a fixed 'religion' like islam or christianity. As I understand it, it boils down to ancestor worship that varies from area to area. Some include buddhism, other taoism, others confucionism and some a bit of all. They'll just mesh parts of christianity into it.

I seem to remember some kind of memorial place in China where they claim Jesus visited at one point.

In Africa, it was enforced at gunpoint.

yeah shoot the contraception that'll cure aids!

Anyway, christianity, just as any other religion, just sucks.

atheist I presume :p

It went from about 500,000 in 1900 to reaching 100+ million now. That is more practicing christians then any country in europe has citizens..... Plus at the rate it's going now by 2100-2150 roughly half the chinese will be christians.
Undeniable statistical fact - a country with over a billion people reproducing exponentially is going to have more anything than any other single country.

There are much worse things going on in China at the moment - poverty and human rights abuses.

There are much worse things going on in the UK at the moment - poverty and human rights abuses.

fixed! (I was tempted to put America but thats been done)

christianity isnt new to china.

the taiping rebellion (c. 1850) was run by a christian convert who declared himself to be the little brother of jesus (not unlike today's rev. sun myung moon in korea).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taiping_Rebellion

someone has to do something about this. we cant let people have faith. there has to be some type of UN law that prevents this. how dare those chineese people join a religion. especially a religion that has been so widely adopted in the west.

That is just disturbing. Christian military members in livery giving a sermon in a provincial chinese village to convert people.
...
Am I the only one who sort of wishes the Chinese would stick to Buddhism, Taoism and all that cool stuff instead of eating up christianity like starving children?
Racist much? Why must a mans race or nationality determine his faith?

Of all the things happening in China...this concerns you enough to post about it?

What about forced abortions, human rights abuses, and utter lack of political rights?

Meh. Nothing can be much worse than what some of the last few generations of Chinese have believed.

Mandate of Heaven, Taiping Rebellion, Cultural Revolution...

http://youtube.com/watch?v=wvEuQ4R9AhI



That is just disturbing. Christian military members in livery giving a sermon in a provincial chinese village to convert people.

Supposedly China has 80+ million christians already with thousands converting every day. It is estimated that between 40 million to 100 million Chinese are Christian (or 3% to 4% of the Chinese population). Christianity is also the fastest growing religion in China. It is hard to keep an official count since many rural people or even people in cities keep their faith secret to avoid government reprecussions.
It went from about 500,000 in 1900 to reaching 100+ million now. That is more practicing christians then any country in europe has citizens..... Plus at the rate it's going now by 2100-2150 roughly half the chinese will be christians.
That's a nice prospect. The godstate China.......


Am I the only one who sort of wishes the Chinese would stick to Buddhism, Taoism and all that cool stuff instead of eating up christianity like starving children?

I hate missionaries.

fixed! (I was tempted to put America but thats been done)

:rolleyes:

I didn't see anything disgusting. I just saw a guy preaching. Are you sure you posted the right video??

Probabily, but they arent as cool as christians.

And also, to be a jew you have to cut your dick, something not many people are willing to.

To be a christian, all the requirements is that you´re alive and has an IQ smaller than 110.

Circumcision is the most popular medical procedure in the world.


And the youtube-video isn't so exiting...

christianity isnt new to china.

Organised foreign funded evangelism is.

I actually sympathize with the the Chinese nativists.

I am not against Christianity or religious conversion to Christianity or any other religion for that matter. I myself have gone thru or identified with many sects/religious thoughts in my life. But I am against coerced/enticed mass conversion done by evangelists who are primarily funded by southern Christian orgs like the Southern Baptists etc. In fact, I hate them.

This is becoming a big problem in India too.

yeah look at all the good it did to Africa *nods*

I do love Archbishop Tutu's quote:

"When the white men came to Africa, they had the Bible and we had the land. Then they told us, 'Let us pray,' and we close dour eyes. When we opened them, we had the Bible and they had the land."

Sad truth with a veneer of humor...

Meh. Nothing can be much worse than what some of the last few generations of Chinese have believed.

Mandate of Heaven, Taiping Rebellion, Cultural Revolution...

The Hundred Flowers campaign...

I hope the government quickly clamps down on this and missionaries are dealt with accordingly. We have enough troublemaking Christians already. While not all are bad, a lot are.

I seem to remember some kind of memorial place in China where they claim Jesus visited at one point.

As the sign on a church near my home reads: Jesus is in all of us. If that is true then Jesus has been everywhere a man/woman has stepped. Yes, even the Moon.

There are much worse things going on in China at the moment - poverty and human rights abuses.

Of all the things happening in China...this concerns you enough to post about it?

What about forced abortions, human rights abuses, and utter lack of political rights?
QFT

If the title hadn't said the guy was a christian missionary, I would have thought it was the PLA going about rural villages to stir up patriotism or something to that effect. As for what religion a person chooses, what does it matter? Religion has little to no effect on how an individual acts, its the person themself, what kind of person they are, how they were raised, etc etc.

An example:
A muslim in Afghanistan straps bombs to his chest, blows himself up in a crowded street in an attempt to kill an infidel, takes a few of his own people with him.

A muslim in Afghanistan dons the uniform of the ANA, gets issued a kalashnikov, and fights to defend his nascent democracy against the infidels strapping bombs to their chests and blowing up their own people.

To be a christian, all the requirements is that you´re alive and has an IQ smaller than 110.
hmm......

*tries to dumb herself down enough to believe that*

Organised foreign funded evangelism is.

I actually sympathize with the the Chinese nativists.

I am not against Christianity or religious conversion to Christianity or any other religion for that matter. I myself have gone thru or identified with many sects/religious thoughts in my life. But I am against coerced/enticed mass conversion done by evangelists who are primarily funded by southern Christian orgs like the Southern Baptists etc. In fact, I hate them.

This is becoming a big problem in India too.

you hate Southern Baptist missionaries? why?

http://youtube.com/watch?v=wvEuQ4R9AhI



That is just disturbing. Christian military members in livery giving a sermon in a provincial chinese village to convert people.

Supposedly China has 80+ million christians already with thousands converting every day. It is estimated that between 40 million to 100 million Chinese are Christian (or 3% to 4% of the Chinese population). Christianity is also the fastest growing religion in China. It is hard to keep an official count since many rural people or even people in cities keep their faith secret to avoid government reprecussions.
It went from about 500,000 in 1900 to reaching 100+ million now. That is more practicing christians then any country in europe has citizens..... Plus at the rate it's going now by 2100-2150 roughly half the chinese will be christians.
That's a nice prospect. The godstate China.......


Am I the only one who sort of wishes the Chinese would stick to Buddhism, Taoism and all that cool stuff instead of eating up christianity like starving children?

People like you sicken me! :mad: OOOH! It's Christian it is ergo the epitome of "evil". For smeg sake whats up with you people hating ALL Christians, I can understand hating the bad corrupt and brainwashy ones that hate science and progress but saying they're all the same is like saying that all Germans are the same. And from what I know of popular opinion on NSG generalizing is bad. And thus any NSGer that generalizes is a hypocrite. And you must also consider that Asians are not as innately evil and childish as westerners thus their version of Christianity would be probably the least oppressive and the most sane of all of them. I'm glad to hear that people are massively converting in China, after all it'll be the next top national power, I'd rather have the world ran by Christians than triggerhappy commies.

Thats what I have to say about this.

People like you sicken me! :mad: OOOH! It's Christian it is ergo the epitome of "evil". For smeg sake whats up with you people hating ALL Christians, I can understand hating the bad corrupt and brainwashy ones that hate science and progress but saying they're all the same is like saying that all Germans are the same. And from what I know of popular opinion on NSG generalizing is bad. And thus any NSGer that generalizes is a hypocrite. And you must also consider that Asians are not as innately evil and childish as westerners thus their version of Christianity would be probably the least oppressive and the most sane of all of them. I'm glad to hear that people are massively converting in China, after all it'll be the next top national power, I'd rather have the world ran by Christians than triggerhappy commies.

Thats what I have to say about this.
oh, but no, Christians are evil, and we are stupid, and we are trying to ruin everyone's life. don't you know? every single one of us are deserving of all the hate that the world can dish out, just because we are Christian.

I'd agree, but missionaries are bad, not Christians in particular. The whole concept reeks of talking down to the inferior foreigners. Perhaps not in this day, but 'missionary' has been irrepairably stained by all their ridiculous doings in Africa and suchlike. Can't they just keep themselves to themselves?

...Supposedly China has 80+ million christians already with thousands converting every day...

Jesus Chlist!

Jesus Chlist!
:p

I'd agree, but missionaries are bad, not Christians in particular. The whole concept reeks of talking down to the inferior foreigners. Perhaps not in this day, but 'missionary' has been irrepairably stained by all their ridiculous doings in Africa and suchlike. Can't they just keep themselves to themselves?

all of the missionaries I know are service missionaries, meaning they go into the countries and feed, clothe, etc people who are extremely needy. They are there to help, because that's what Christ said to do. None of them ever speak about their religion unless they are directly asked. There have been Bible studies, and stuff, but it's always started by someone local, never by the missionaries themselves. It's important not to go in and say "this is what we believe and you are going to hell" mostly because it's rude, and it's not very effective. I know 21 missionary families, and 16 single missionaries, all of them are from the SBC and they are in countries all over the world, teaching, feeding, clothing, and helping people who aren't getting any help from their government and aren't able to help themselves. I do a fair amount of disaster relief in my own area, and we go through the same basic mission training, and I have never once said anything about my faith unless someone asks me first. I am there to help, that's it.

oh, but no, Christians are evil, and we are stupid, and we are trying to ruin everyone's life. don't you know? every single one of us are deserving of all the hate that the world can dish out, just because we are Christian.

I hope your being sarcastic. I got creamed here for saying that ALL Baptists were bad and by saying ALL liberals were evil brainsuckers. "No Generalizing" is liek an unwritten law of NSG. It applies to everyone. And you must also admit there are a few cool Christians here like Zilam for example. And Wilgrove too.

Undeniable statistical fact - a country with over a billion people reproducing exponentially is going to have more anything than any other single country.
actually, they're not reproducing exponentially. Last report I read, it was down to under 1.8children per woman (of child-bearing age).
2.1 children per woman is the minimum level to maintain population.
Factor in that most children born (or at least kept alive after birth) are boys, and the fear of a massive over-populated China spilling out onto the world lessens somewhat.

As for the OP: ohhhh....Missionaries in uniform are so scary:
http://k43.pbase.com/g3/90/447790/2/53083605.TheSalvationArmy.jpg
run, run! he might go at you with his tuba!


China:
Where they have 60+ crimes which are punishable by death
Where they have a 99+% conviction rate (so if you're arrested, you're screwed)
Where they have increasing social unrest barely kept at bay through brutal police tactics, where they lack freedom of speech
Where massive uncontrolled pollution is fucking up not only their lives but contributing to Global warming (and thus fucking up everyone else's life)
Where 30 million of them live on less than $100US a year - and another 300 million on less than $300US /year
Where Falun Gong members are rounded up, imprisoned and their organs used for transplants (including heart, liver, lungs)
Where Tibetan Monks are beaten to death simply for carrying a picture of the Dalai Lama
Where Tibetans are shot like dogs when trying to escape across the Himalayas into India
etc etc etc

..and what upsets the OP's most of all is that there's some Xtians in uniforms there.

you hate Southern Baptist missionaries? why?

Their activities in North-East India in particular and India in general. Effing idiots.

The nerve. I will gladly put them behind bars if I am in any position to do so. :)

Would you like me to fund a missionary group who distribute literature that Jesus is a false God and Christianity is the cause of all evil in US and denigrate Christianity in the basest way possible and get a significant population of a state converted by luring with money and hoax "miracles" and then fuel an armed struggle for secession ?

I guess not.

I understand you are a Christian and quite possibly with the Baptist church. I do not hate you personally. But if you take part in (monetarily or otherwise) and support the missionary activities of the baptists in India, then yeah...I have no respect for you.

South Lizasauria... you're complaining that people stereotype Christians but admitting that you said all Baptists and liberals were bad?

Well, there are plenty of missionaries who simply go out and convert, as well as blackmailing people into joining up so they can get aid. Of course there are service missionaries, which is fine, but like I said I just think 'missionary' has negative connotations now. I'd be more inclined to consider missionaries who don't preach just aid workers.

South Lizasauria... you're complaining that people stereotype Christians but admitting that you said all Baptists and liberals were bad?

Well, there are plenty of missionaries who simply go out and convert, as well as blackmailing people into joining up so they can get aid. Of course there are service missionaries, which is fine, but like I said I just think 'missionary' has negative connotations now. I'd be more inclined to consider missionaries who don't preach just aid workers.


I said I got creamed for saying that and that's why I stopped generalizing.

Originally Posted by Smunkeeville View Post
you hate Southern Baptist missionaries? why?

I do and for good reason, they tried to blackmail and brainwash me into their religion and these ones (http://www.foxnews.com/printer_friendly_story/0,3566,252747,00.html) hate America.

http://www.religioustolerance.org/hallo_he.htm

I do and for good reason, they tried to blackmail and brainwash me into their religion and these ones (http://www.foxnews.com/printer_friendly_story/0,3566,252747,00.html) hate America.

http://www.religioustolerance.org/hallo_he.htm

To be fair, The Westboro Baptist Church is an extremist organization. There's a reason why other Baptist Churches has greatly distance themselves from WBC.

To be fair, The Westboro Baptist Church is an extremist organization. There's a reason why other Baptist Churches has greatly distance themselves from WBC.

But still, I was emotionally and psychologically tortured by some just because I didn't want to join them. They tried to use mind tricks to convince me I was a hardcore sexual pervert and that only their religion could "save" me. They even got the whole private school to label me "stalker" just for that cause even though I'm not! :mad: :mp5: :sniper: :headbang:

But still, I was emotionally and psychologically tortured by some just because I didn't want to join them. They tried to use mind tricks to convince me I was a hardcore sexual pervert and that only their religion could "save" me. They even got the whole private school to label me "stalker" just for that cause even though I'm not! :mad: :mp5: :sniper: :headbang:

I'm sorry that happened to you, and I would like to believe that those type of Christians are in the minority.

I'm sorry that happened to you, and I would like to believe that those type of Christians are in the minority.

too bad they aren't :(

Am I the only one who sort of wishes the Chinese would stick to Buddhism, Taoism and all that cool stuff instead of eating up christianity like starving children?

No, your not the only one.

That being said, China has far larger problems to worry about.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=wvEuQ4R9AhI



That is just disturbing. Christian military members in livery giving a sermon in a provincial chinese village to convert people.

Supposedly China has 80+ million christians already with thousands converting every day. It is estimated that between 40 million to 100 million Chinese are Christian (or 3% to 4% of the Chinese population). Christianity is also the fastest growing religion in China. It is hard to keep an official count since many rural people or even people in cities keep their faith secret to avoid government reprecussions.
It went from about 500,000 in 1900 to reaching 100+ million now. That is more practicing christians then any country in europe has citizens..... Plus at the rate it's going now by 2100-2150 roughly half the chinese will be christians.
That's a nice prospect. The godstate China.......


Am I the only one who sort of wishes the Chinese would stick to Buddhism, Taoism and all that cool stuff instead of eating up christianity like starving children?

I really fail to see the concern in this...

I said I got creamed for saying that and that's why I stopped generalizing.

too bad they aren't :(

:headbang:

I seem to remember some kind of memorial place in China where they claim Jesus visited at one point.

would'nt be suprised. either he got inspiration or in fact he was chinese......

What I meant was not that there are christians in China. But merely the missionary activities which seek to convert native populations from their faiths. That is my problem with it. I doubt that many Chinese would be christians if there wouldn't be some serious missionary activity going on there.
On that matter I am also against Saudi Arabia financing the spread if Islam to other native populations.
I believe faith should be something personal, not harrassed onto you by missionaries.

What I meant was not that there are christians in China. But merely the missionary activities which seek to convert native populations from their faiths. That is my problem with it. I doubt that many Chinese would be christians if there wouldn't be some serious missionary activity going on there.
On that matter I am also against Saudi Arabia financing the spread if Islam to other native populations.
I believe faith should be something personal, not harrassed onto you by missionaries.

QFT.

Let me explain a particular strategy used by evanjihadis in tribal areas in India. I saw this in person, while I was camping near Bhuvaneshwar, Orissa.

There were some white 40 something folks setting up another camp. I inquired and they said they were "aid workers". I actually thanked them for their help and all.

My friend, a local, then explained the treachery these fuckers do in the name of "aid". They setup a box called "miracle box" and have the tribals say something that they want (like a tool or a bicycle or something) and voila the next week it is there as a gift from God. Then the evanjihadi explains how he is "lost" in hinduism/animism and everything would be peachy if he just converted to the "true faith" and accepted Jesus as the savior.

He uses all the tricks in the book - inducing fear of hell, misrepresenting his current belief system as the cause of his poor situation, using money etc. It is precisely due to these evanjihadis, many states in India have started banning forced conversions. Christian orgs were the only ones to protest. I wonder why. :rolleyes:

These are not isolated incidents. There is a very organized activity going one.

Google about Joshua project.

China is going to be Christian, slant eyed Jesus or whatever, its gotta be better than the current communist one.
Interesting to see if it ever goes after Islam which would attack it for being its arch enemy.

I hope your being sarcastic. I got creamed here for saying that ALL Baptists were bad and by saying ALL liberals were evil brainsuckers. "No Generalizing" is liek an unwritten law of NSG. It applies to everyone. And you must also admit there are a few cool Christians here like Zilam for example. And Wilgrove too.
You still generalize plenty. I was being sarcastic. I actually am a Christian, even worse I am Baptist.
Their activities in North-East India in particular and India in general. Effing idiots.

The nerve. I will gladly put them behind bars if I am in any position to do so. :)
are you sure you are talking about Southern Baptist missionaries in specific, or generic missionaries from other churches and denominations. If you are talking about SBC missionaries I would like to know what exactly you are talking about and where so I can investigate it.

Would you like me to fund a missionary group who distribute literature that Jesus is a false God and Christianity is the cause of all evil in US and denigrate Christianity in the basest way possible and get a significant population of a state converted by luring with money and hoax "miracles" and then fuel an armed struggle for secession ?

I guess not.
I wouldn't like it, it would be your right. I don't have to like things to realize that people have a right to do them......well, except for the armed struggle for succession, but again I would like a source on that.

I understand you are a Christian and quite possibly with the Baptist church. I do not hate you personally. But if you take part in (monetarily or otherwise) and support the missionary activities of the baptists in India, then yeah...I have no respect for you.
you don't hate me personally but you hate me generally? I would like a source that the problems in India are being caused by SBC missionaries.
I do and for good reason, they tried to blackmail and brainwash me into their religion and these ones (http://www.foxnews.com/printer_friendly_story/0,3566,252747,00.html) hate America.

http://www.religioustolerance.org/hallo_he.htm
Just because someone says they are Baptist doesn't mean they are with the SBC. In fact, Westboro is not. SBC missionaries are funded through all SBC churches and thus are under tight controls of what they can and can not do.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=wvEuQ4R9AhI



That is just disturbing. Christian military members in livery giving a sermon in a provincial chinese village to convert people.

Supposedly China has 80+ million christians already with thousands converting every day. It is estimated that between 40 million to 100 million Chinese are Christian (or 3% to 4% of the Chinese population). Christianity is also the fastest growing religion in China. It is hard to keep an official count since many rural people or even people in cities keep their faith secret to avoid government reprecussions.
It went from about 500,000 in 1900 to reaching 100+ million now. That is more practicing christians then any country in europe has citizens..... Plus at the rate it's going now by 2100-2150 roughly half the chinese will be christians.
That's a nice prospect. The godstate China.......


Am I the only one who sort of wishes the Chinese would stick to Buddhism, Taoism and all that cool stuff instead of eating up christianity like starving children?

Good. I'm glad this is happening. There is nothing wrong with what is happening here provided China does not interfere with said missions.

so the future holds a christian south east asia.
a muslim europe
an athiest america

now all we need is a buddhist middle-east

I hope the government quickly clamps down on this and missionaries are dealt with accordingly. We have enough troublemaking Christians already. While not all are bad, a lot are.

I see, OK to bash Christians, not OK to bash Muslims.

so the future holds a christian south east asia.
a muslim europe
an athiest america

now all we need is a buddhist middle-east

not really. The Chinese are a pretty animistic people, (way generalized) so basically what you get is they just "add Jesus" to all the other things they already do.....most of them don't really understand Christianity proper, they just do what they already do and have a new person to consider.....

*waits for the flames*

To be a christian, all the requirements is that you´re alive and has an IQ smaller than 110.

:rolleyes:

all of the missionaries I know are service missionaries, meaning they go into the countries and feed, clothe, etc people who are extremely needy. They are there to help, because that's what Christ said to do. None of them ever speak about their religion unless they are directly asked. There have been Bible studies, and stuff, but it's always started by someone local, never by the missionaries themselves. It's important not to go in and say "this is what we believe and you are going to hell" mostly because it's rude, and it's not very effective. I know 21 missionary families, and 16 single missionaries, all of them are from the SBC and they are in countries all over the world, teaching, feeding, clothing, and helping people who aren't getting any help from their government and aren't able to help themselves. I do a fair amount of disaster relief in my own area, and we go through the same basic mission training, and I have never once said anything about my faith unless someone asks me first. I am there to help, that's it.

Good for you Smunkeeville :) May God Bless your hard work :)

What I meant was not that there are christians in China. But merely the missionary activities which seek to convert native populations from their faiths. That is my problem with it. I doubt that many Chinese would be christians if there wouldn't be some serious missionary activity going on there.
On that matter I am also against Saudi Arabia financing the spread if Islam to other native populations.
I believe faith should be something personal, not harrassed onto you by missionaries.

And you have proof that they are being harrassed?

not really. The Chinese are a pretty animistic people, (way generalized) so basically what you get is they just "add Jesus" to all the other things they already do.....most of them don't really understand Christianity proper, they just do what they already do and have a new person to consider.....

*waits for the flames*

i know smunkie. I just see this thread going this way. Just like the "in 50 years europe will be islam" and "athiesism is taking over the US" and so on.

I agree, if anything the local religions will simply adopt parts of christianity that they like.

as a side bit, I was approached by 2 missionaries a few days before easter. I think they were part of the "Church of Jesus & the later day saints" or something like that. Very friendly gentleman who handed me a leaflet saying that if it was of any interest, myself and my girlfriend were more than welcome to come by on X date to hear about how Jesus than what have you and how it benefits us all.

Very nice, very friendly and not pushy at all.

hmm......

*tries to dumb herself down enough to believe that*

Be careful... you might become just like him. :)

as a side bit, I was approached by 2 missionaries a few days before easter. I think they were part of the "Church of Jesus & the later day saints" or something like that. Very friendly gentleman who handed me a leaflet saying that if it was of any interest, myself and my girlfriend were more than welcome to come by on X date to hear about how Jesus than what have you and how it benefits us all.

Very nice, very friendly and not pushy at all.

don't ever let them in your house. ;) I got stuck in Bible studies with them for a few weeks back in the day.....horrible. Now, it's better because I have actually read the Bible, but back then, I was happy being an angry atheist, although not angry enough to get them to go away.

An Irish Catholic charity worker/missionary came to my door the other day (brave work in Glasgow!!). We got a little silver pendant of Momma Mary, which is supposedly blessed.

Although I'm not interested in his message, I hope he doesn't go to the wrong house and get chibbed. :(

are you sure you are talking about Southern Baptist missionaries in specific, or generic missionaries from other churches and denominations. If you are talking about SBC missionaries I would like to know what exactly you are talking about and where so I can investigate it.

Both. Baptists and other missionaries.


National Liberation Front of Tripura, for starters, is a Baptist terrorist organization funded by Baptists. Google is your friend.


I wouldn't like it, it would be your right. I don't have to like things to realize that people have a right to do them......well, except for the armed struggle for succession, but again I would like a source on that.


Google on terrorist orgs North East India. Most of them are Christian (except ULFA and a muslim one).

www.satp.org is a good resource.


Would you like it if I distributed pamphlets to residents in your community that Christians are lost and Jesus is a hoax ?

Is it still my right, if (hypothetically), I get foreign funds and hire local converts to my religion to do a mass campaign denigrating Christianity?

Is it still my right, if these converts then form a militant group trying mounting an armed campaign against the state and declaring that the place where they live is now only for those who now believe in the converted religion?

When things have come to this stage, it is no longer individual freedom. The Indian constitution allows freedom of religion. Not freedom to mass convert and secession. That is what the missionaries are doing. That is not a "right".

That is a criminal act. Many states have banned forced conversions and in spite of that missionaries are doing it illegally.

you don't hate me personally but you hate me generally?

Did you notice the if in that post of mine ?

so, do you support the missionary activity to undermine the society and state of India. If yes, then yeah I do hate you. I am still a citizen of India and bound by my moral and constitutional obligations to oppose these activities.

SBC missionaries are funded through all SBC churches and thus are under tight controls of what they can and can not do.

Oh, it is SBC. It is the richest baptist org and it is funding a lot of missionary activities in India.

Here's an example of SBC wisdom.

http://www.rediff.com/us/2000/mar/31us2.htm
The anti-Hindu booklet released by the Southern Baptist Convention, the ultimate religious authority for the Southern Baptists, was sent to thousands of their churches during the Diwali season. Among other things, the booklet said Hindus continued to live in darkness, despite the Diwali lamps, because they did not embrace Christ and they worshipped idols.

I'm glad to see we have our priorities straight here. People becoming Christians is far more disturbing and despicable than prisoners being killed for their organs.

not really. The Chinese are a pretty animistic people, (way generalized) so basically what you get is they just "add Jesus" to all the other things they already do.....most of them don't really understand Christianity proper, they just do what they already do and have a new person to consider.....

*waits for the flames*

Heh, that reminds of a conversion method that got the Jesuits in trouble back in the day. They attmpted to adapt Catholicism so that while not changing any major part other parts were fitted to the culture. For example they took the practices around respecting anscestors and related it to the Cult of the Saints. Yeah, this is real oof topic...

edit:and when you think about it that isn't to diffrent from what was done in Europe...

I see, OK to bash Christians, not OK to bash Muslims.

No, it's OK to bash ALL religious people, because most of them are crazy.

No, it's OK to bash ALL religious people, because most of them are crazy.

Some are indeed crazy. Luckily, most us are not.

for you Smunkee,

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/south_asia/953200.stm
Separatist group bans Hindu festivities

The leading separatist group in the north-east Indian state of Tripura has ordered indigenous tribespeople to stay away from celebrations of the Hindu festival Durga Puja.

The outlawed National Liberation Front of Tripura warned that any tribal members seen taking part in the festival would be killed.

In a statement, the NLFT said it wanted all tribespeople in Tripura to become Christians because the practice of Hinduism has led to them being marginalised by people of Bengali origin living in the state.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/south_asia/717775.stm
The government in India's north-eastern state of Tripura says it has evidence that the state's Baptist Church is involved in backing separatist rebels.

Tripura Chief Minister Manik Sarkar said state police had uncovered details of the alleged link after questioning a church leader.

Nagmanlal Halam, secretary of the Noapara Baptist Church in Tripura, was arrested late on Monday with a large quantity of explosives.

Mr Sarkar said that allegations about the close links between the state's Baptist Church and the rebel National Liberation Front of Tripura (NLFT) have long been made by political parties and police.

Now for the first time, he said, hard evidence supporting the allegations had been found.

Explosives

Mr Sarkar told the BBC that Mr Halam was found in possession of more than 50 gelatine sticks, 5kg of potassium and 2kg of sulphur and other ingredients for making explosives.


Chief Minister Sarkar says he has proof
He said that two other junior members of the same church, arrested last week, had tipped the police off about the explosives which were meant for the NLFT rebels.

The chief minister said that Mr Halam confessed to buying and supplying explosives to the NLFT for the past two years.

Another church official, Jatna Koloi, was arrested in south Tripura last week.

Police say Mr Koloi had received training in guerrilla warfare at an NLFT base last year.

Conversion

Guards have been placed outside the headquarters of the Baptist Church in Tripura's capital, Agartala, to prevent possible attacks on it once the news of Mr Halam's arrest spread.

The NLFT is accused of forcing Tripura's indigenous tribes to become Christians and give up Hindu forms of worship in areas under their control.

Last year, they issued a ban on the Hindu festivals of Durga Puja and Saraswati Puja.

The NLFT manifesto says that they want to expand what they describe as the kingdom of God and Christ in Tripura.

The Baptist Church in Tripura was set up by missionaries from New Zealand 60 years ago.

It won only a few thousand converts until 1980 when in the aftermath, of the state's worst ethnic riot, the number of conversions grew.

What we need to do is send out a bunch of missionaries to convert people to the "church" of freakkin' REALITY.

http://sify.com/news/fullstory.php?id=14413176
Christian missionaries taken into custody
Dharwad (Karnataka): Twenty-two Christian missionaries from Andhra Pradesh were on Tuesday taken into custody amidst tension over their alleged attempts to convert people at Baad in Dharwad district, police said.

Local residents objected to the distribution of pamphlets by the missionaries. They alleged that the missionaries were trying to convert people to Christianity.

Police took them into custody and seized the materials in their possession.

According to police, the missionaries were appealing to villagers to become Christians to lead a happy life and to attend a meeting on Friday.

All of them were produced before the magistrate in Dharwad.

http://tripurainfo.com/insurgency/sekhar3.shtml
Significantly , most of the leaders and cadres of NLFT are Baptist Christians and unless one converts to the Baptist variety of the faith no cadre or activist is given arms or training. The NLFT have also been regularly interfering with threligious faith and practices of the Hindu tribals and non-tribals and converting people at gun-point.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/south_asia/1089578.stm
Tripura tribal leader killed
Police in the northeastern Indian state of Tripura say a leading Hindu religious leader, who was kidnapped by suspected separatist rebels on Monday, has been found dead.

Police say the body of the man, Labh Kumar Jamatia, was discovered in a forest in Dalak village in southern Tripura.

He was the leader of the state's second largest Hindu group.

According to police, rebels from the National Liberation Front of Tripura wanted Mr Jamatia to convert to Christianity - but he refused.

The spritual chief of his tribe Bikram Bhadur Jamatia has called on the Indian police to provide protection for Hindu tribal leaders in Tripura.

From the newsroom of the BBC World Service

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/south_asia/899422.stm
A tribal Hindu spiritual leader has been killed by separatist rebels in the northeastern Indian state of Tripura.

Police say about ten guerrillas belonging to the outlawed National Liberation Front of Tripura ,the NLFT, broke into a temple near the town of Jirania on Sunday night and shot dead Shanti Tripura, a popular Hindu preacher popularly known as Shanti Kali.

The separatist group says it wants to convert all tribespeople in the state to Christianity.

The BBC correspondent in the region says the killing has created tension between the majority of tribals, who are Hindu or Buddhist, and the small number of Christian converts.

http://www.rediff.com/news/2001/aug/02trip.htm
Tribal Hindus in Tripura have formed vigilante groups to thwart attempts by separatist militants to convert people to Christianity at gunpoint, community leaders said on Thursday.

"It is a very serious threat to Hinduism with armed militants of the outlawed National Liberation Front of Tripura forcibly converting tribal villagers to Christianity," said Rampada Jamatia, a leader of the Jamatia tribe.

"We believe up to 5,000 tribal villagers were converted to Christianity by the NLFT in the past two years," Jamatia told IANS in Jirania, 25 km east of Agartala.

At least 20 Hindu tribals, including a senior priest of the Jirania Ashram, Santi Kali Maharaj, have been killed by NLFT rebels in the past two years for disobeying orders.

Tribals constitute about 30 per cent of Tripura's population of 3.19 million. Christians form a meager 10 per cent of the total, while the majority are Hindus.

http://www.hvk.org/articles/1101/45.html
Author: Statesman News Service
Publication: The Statesman
Date: November 15, 2001

Agartala, Nov. 14. - Leaders of the Tripura Jamatiya Hill community have announced a programme of setting up schools and cultural units in the state’s hill villages to counter the influence of the missionary-run schools.

‘Jamatiya Hada’, the apex social unit of the community, expressed concern over the manner in which tribal children were being weaned away from their tradition under the influence of the educational system run by Church loyalists.

The Hada also pointed out that while hundreds of government schools had been shut for years under threats from insurgents groups, "thus far, not a single missionary has been affected by insurgency". Rebel groups show readiness to allow tribal students and teachers, along with other non-teaching staff, to attend English medium missionary schools even in the most inaccessible hill areas.

The Jamatiya Hada believes that forcible conversion of hill people by gun-toting insurgents was "part of the design".

The Jamatiya said members of the Tripura Assembly, cutting across party lines, had expressed their deep concern over the manner in which militants groups were indulging in proselytism. The Jamatiya leaders had met at Birchandramanu, in Belonia subdivision, recently to review the situation in hill Tripura.

http://www.nationalcatholicreporter.org/update/conclave/jp_obit_main.htm
During his November 1999 visit to India, for example, the pope took the occasion to call for what seemed a program of proselytism.

“Just as the first millennium saw the cross firmly planted in the soil of Europe, and the second in that of America and Africa, so may the third Christian millennium witness a great harvest of faith on this vast and vital continent,” he said. The country’s Hindu majority was insulted, especially given that papal planners had scheduled John Paul’s Mass on the same day as the festival of Diwali, the most important Hindu celebration of the year.

:rolleyes:

What am I? A crop, to be harvested and counted ?

:rolleyes:

What am I? A crop, to be harvested and counted ?

No, seedbed for faith crops. See, the pope doesn't eat normal food. He starts everyday with a big bowl of faith krispies dipped in fervor milk and washes it down with a big glass of ego juice. Not just the pope though. Most bigwig religious heads start their day that way too.

Why, without it, they'd just wither away.

:p

No, seedbed for faith crops. See, the pope doesn't eat normal food. He starts everyday with a big bowl of faith krispies dipped in fervor milk and washes it down with a big glass of ego juice. Not just the pope though. Most bigwig religious heads start their day that way too.

Why, without it, they'd just wither away.

:p

Jokes aside, there never used to be a problem between Christians and Hindus in India. With these evanjihadis showing up, hindu reactionaries are well...reacting to this assault and the traditionally harmonious relationship is getting soured.

And if things worsen, it is the local Christian who has to face the Hindu ire, not the rich Christian who sits in Alabama and funds this conversion campaign wittingly/unwittingly.

Jokes aside, there never used to be a problem between Christians and Hindus in India. With these evanjihadis showing up, hindu reactionaries are well...reacting to this assault and the traditionally harmonious relationship is getting soured.

That's kind of expected isn't it? You've got two relatively dogmatic groups existing peacefully by not getting involved in shouting matches and suddenly this bunch of no-brainers waltz in expecting to whip up some religious fervor without expecting backlash.


And if things worsen, it is the local Christian who has to face the Hindu ire, not the rich Christian who sits in Alabama and funds this conversion campaign wittingly/unwittingly.

I think they'll get the idea once they start receiving the heads of the ones they sent in tidy little boxes on their front doorstep.

Undeniable statistical fact - a country with over a billion people reproducing exponentially is going to have more anything than any other single country.
Err... I'd be amazingly worried if the Chinese were reproducing exponentially with a billion citizens. That would take some serious building work to house and feed everyone.



Anyway, I don't see what the big deal is. People can be Christian in China if they like, just as they can be Taoist in the US. I don't see why we should intervene, or indeed be terribly interested.