NationStates Jolt Archive

The South is losing its power in Congress. At one point they were extremely powerful and could bend Congress to their will, but now they have last much power. And many Southern politicians aren't even that Southern. Me likey.

Link (http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070331/ap_on_go_co/lost_southern_clout)

WASHINGTON - When he was in Congress, Rep. Howard "Judge" Smith routinely frustrated the Washington establishment by leaving town when House leaders tried to push bills he did not like through his Rules Committee.

Once in 1957, the Virginia Democrat blocked President Eisenhower's civil rights legislation by saying a barn burned down on his farm and he needed to tend to it.

At the time, Smith's antics were hardly out of place. Colorful Southern politicians wielded near-authoritarian control on Capitol Hill, presiding over committees that wrote tax laws, set federal spending and steered subsidies to cotton and peanut farmers back home.

Now, Dixie's heyday in Congress is over. It is rare to find anyone with a Southern accent in a position of power. After the Democratic victories last November, congressional historians say, the region's clout fell to its lowest level in at least 50 years.

Near the end of Smith's tenure in 1965, Southerners headed about two-thirds of the committees in the House and Senate. In the current Congress, no Southern senator is a committee chairman and there are just four in the House — fewer than from the state of California alone.

Only one Southerner is in the Democratic leadership: House Whip James Clyburn (news, bio, voting record) of South Carolina.

"It really is the end of the era," said Christian Grose, a Vanderbilt University professor who studies Southern politics.

One chief reason is the South's shift toward the Republican Party that was cemented in the 1990s. When Republicans lost control of Congress in last year's elections, the region's clout took a hit.

But signs of waning influence were evident under Republican control. Through death, retirement and a more competitive political environment, the South simply lost the seniority that gave it such outsized influence.

"There was a time when Southerners just got re-elected and re-elected over and over again. You stick around long enough, you get powerful," said former Louisiana congressman Billy Tauzin. The one-time Democrat switched parties in the middle of his 24-year House career before retiring in 2004.

"But it's not the old, genteel South anymore. It's a brutal political playing field now," he said.

Brad Fitch, chief executive of Knowlegis, a government relations firm that ranks lawmakers' power, says there is good news for the region: The South still has heavy representation on the agriculture committees.

The bad news is that just one Southerner, Senate Republican leader Mitch McConnell (news, bio, voting record) of Kentucky, made the top 10 lists in his 2007 "preseason" scorecard.

Dating to the Depression, the South was so dominated by conservative Democrats that lawmakers who behaved reasonably well — and even some who did not — could hold office virtually as long as they wanted, earning seniority and privileges.

That political monopoly produced legislators such as Democratic Rep. Jamie Whitten of Mississippi. He became known as the "permanent secretary of agriculture" because he held such a grip over farm spending during a 54-year career.

Democratic Sen. Russell Long — scion of the famed Louisiana political dynasty of Huey Long — was called the "fourth branch of government" for his mastery of tax law during 16 years as
Senate Finance Committee chairman.

Committee chairmen held far more power and independence than they do under today's centralized system, and Southerners often made clear their disdain for contrary views from other parts of the country.

In 1972, for example, near the end of a 36-year career, Democratic Rep. Edward Hebert of Louisiana forced two liberals from the West to share a chair for two years because he did not want them on his Armed Services Committee.

Sen. Trent Lott (news, bio, voting record) of Mississippi, the Senate's second-ranking Republican and a former majority leader, noted that as recently as the 1990s, Southerners like him and former House Speaker Newt Gingrich of Georgia held nearly all the top leadership positions.

Lott called the South's current low point an "aberration." Regional influence in Congress ebbs and flows, he said, and the South will rise again.

I'm an Alabama resident, and sadly I think it's a good thing we're losing clout...

This has happened before... right before the Civil War, in fact. There might be a second secession (I hope.)

This has happened before... right before the Civil War, in fact. There might be a second secession (I hope.)
What IS it with you and secession?

What IS it with you and secession?

*Shrugs* I just find the idea appealling.

This has happened before... right before the Civil War, in fact. There might be a second secession (I hope.)

America should have a four way civil war, the northern, the eastern, the southern and western quadrants should duke it out! :p

America should have a four way civil war, the northern, the eastern, the southern and western quadrants should duke it out! :p

And when they're weak and tired, BLAM! northern blitzkrieg! And then the rise of the Canadian Empire, like the British Empire with American Empire accents, and a funny tendency to be polite during invasions.

America should have a four way civil war, the northern, the eastern, the southern and western quadrants should duke it out! :p

Can the Indians rise up too?

And when they're weak and tired, BLAM! northern blitzkrieg! And then the rise of the Canadian Empire, like the British Empire with American Empire accents, and a funny tendency to be polite during invasions.

I'd blast as many southern racist hicks as possible then resist the oppression of Canada. :p *Canadian bacon happens*

Well, that's what tends to happen then the South lost the civil war.

I'd move up the military ranks and have all the colored people under me acquire high ranks then I'd make the racist southeners and their families like slaves for the sake of poetic justice. :D

I'd move up the military ranks and have all the colored people under me acquire high ranks then I'd make the racist southeners and their families like slaves for the sake of poetic justice. :D

You did not use the correct terminology- the correct phrase is "African American." Ergo, you might have to enslave yourself.

I'd move up the military ranks and have all the colored people under me acquire high ranks then I'd make the racist southeners and their families like slaves for the sake of poetic justice. :D

Want to be a Colin Powell eh?

Want to be a Colin Powell eh?

Seriously though, you have to find the idea of racist white southerners picking cotton for Asians and Africans somewhat funny. Plus they'll get what they deserve.

Seriously though, you have to find the idea of racist white southerners picking cotton for Asians and Africans somewhat funny. Plus they'll get what they deserve.

It's a matter whose perspective I guess. I'd prefer people live together with differences rather than relive tit-for-tat historical problems. The USA was built on slavery but at least, things are well, slightly, better with the former slaves now getting more influence. I'm Asian so I'll be alright in your world! :)

This has happened before... right before the Civil War, in fact. There might be a second secession (I hope.)

Why? You do know the South would be utterly SCREW-ED without the rest of the nation these days(So would any other country)? What would you use for currency, for example? Any currency you would print would be laughed at to holy hell, forcing you to adopt something else. And honestly, what honest reason is there for a secession? Eh? Anything? At all?

It's a matter whose perspective I guess. I'd prefer people live together with differences rather than relive tit-for-tat historical problems. The USA was built on slavery but at least, things are well, slightly, better with the former slaves now getting more influence. I'm Asian so I'll be alright in your world! :)

HIGH FIVE!!

Seriously though, you have to find the idea of racist white southerners picking cotton for Asians and Africans somewhat funny. Plus they'll get what they deserve.

I do. *evil plan*

It's a matter whose perspective I guess. I'd prefer people live together with differences rather than relive tit-for-tat historical problems. The USA was built on slavery but at least, things are well, slightly, better with the former slaves now getting more influence. I'm Asian so I'll be alright in your world! :)

You are proof that skin color and ethnicity is irrelevant. I never even imagined you as "asian".

You are proof that skin color and ethnicity is irrelevant. I never even imagined you as "asian".

Most people think I'm just another European or Jewy character. :D

Why?

Political competition, a la Northern Italy and the area around Amsterdam during the Renaissance.

You do know the South would be utterly SCREW-ED without the rest of the nation these days(So would any other country)?

We could trade, y'know.

What would you use for currency, for example? Any currency you would print would be laughed at to holy hell, forcing you to adopt something else.

We could use gold. It would be a little difficult to laugh at that.

And honestly, what honest reason is there for a secession? Eh? Anything? At all?

I'd say the South being forced to rejoin the Union would be one. If it's under duress, it's only assent, not consent, and is thus null and void.

What IS it with you and secession?

Ask the Founders that when the colonies seceded from Britain. For the record, I support secession, due to my belief Minnesota should be an independent republic. The whole country's going to hell in a handbasket, and I see no reason Minnesotans should have to go down with them.

Ask the Founders that when the colonies seceded from Britain. For the record, I support secession, due to my belief Minnesota should be an independent republic. The whole country's going to hell in a handbasket, and I see no reason Minnesotans should have to go down with them.

good point. Why should the good go down with all the other bastards who actually deserve it?

Ask the Founders that when the colonies seceded from Britain. For the record, I support secession, due to my belief Minnesota should be an independent republic. The whole country's going to hell in a handbasket, and I see no reason Minnesotans should have to go down with them.

Every day I like you a little bit more.

I'd blast as many southern racist hicks as possible then resist the oppression of Canada. :p *Canadian bacon happens*

Kinky. That'll be $250 per session, though. In cash next time.

Every day I like you a little bit more.

I like to think that Minnesota is sitting in the back near the emergency exit. That way, when we see that we are going to veer off a cliff, we can make a clean break away. Stay on till there is no hope, sort of thing. Then, we can poke North Dakota's corpse with a stick, and laugh at them. At least, that's the dream.

I like to think that Minnesota is sitting in the back near the emergency exit. That way, when we see that we are going to veer off a cliff, we can make a clean break away. Stay on till there is no hope, sort of thing. Then, we can poke North Dakota's corpse with a stick, and laugh at them. At least, that's the dream.

If you go, can I come with? Or, even better, drag Michigan with you? I never much liked the other parts of the country. Us in the "OMG sN0w" belt must stick together.

If you go, can I come with? Or, even better, drag Michigan with you? I never much liked the other parts of the country. Us in the "OMG sN0w" belt must stick together.

Oh indeed. Of course, we we'll need to tie North Dakota's shoelaces to the seat to make sure. The South is to busy up in the front of the bus, afraid of "cooties" from the girls, Utah is to busy flirting with all the girls, the Northeast are shooting spit wads at the South, California is to busy with her self-obsessed self to take her mind off her mirror to notice. The Midwest, however, being the cool-kids in the back, can all jump out the emergency exit. Except for North Dakota, of course, which is the moron who thinks he's cool because he follows the rest of us around, think he's part of group.

America should have a four way civil war, the northern, the eastern, the southern and western quadrants should duke it out! :pI call northern quadarant and all the farm girls.

Oh indeed. Of course, we we'll need to tie North Dakota's shoelaces to the seat to make sure. The South is to busy up in the front of the bus, afraid of "cooties" from the girls, Utah is to busy flirting with all the girls, the Northeast are shooting spit wads at the South, California is to busy with her self-obsessed self to take her mind off her mirror to notice. The Midwest, however, being the cool-kids in the back, can all jump out the emergency exit. Except for North Dakota, of course, which is the moron who thinks he's cool because he follows the rest of us around, think he's part of group.

Yeah, we can bail and let the losers fight over the scraps.

But what about Wisconsin? He's been hanging around lately. Is he part of the cool kids yet?

Yeah, we can bail and let the losers fight over the scraps.

But what about Wisconsin? He's been hanging around lately. Is he part of the cool kids yet?

Eh, he's the drunk friend who everyone knows as "The Party Guy". You know, wasted 24/7, huge partier, passes out at random times, and plays on the football team.

If he makes it out, sure. We just aren't going to make special accomodations to make sure he does.

Eh, he's the drunk friend who everyone knows as "The Party Guy". You know, wasted 24/7, huge partier, passes out at random times, and plays on the football team.

If he makes it out, sure. We just aren't going to make special accomodations to make sure he does.

Yeah, I can deal with that.

So, when do we bail? I'm thinking sometime soon.

Yeah, I can deal with that.

So, when do we bail? I'm thinking sometime soon.

When the Bus Driver points starts driving towards Iran, or North Korea, or the Bus Company decides to tell us sit quiet and face the front while we're headed towards the cliff.

I.E.:If the President somehow becomes more of an idiot(Is it possible to have negative intelligence?), or Congress decides to take on as much power as possible. Not sure which. I'm an optimist, and against all rational thought, I still believe that it's possible to salvage something from the current wreck. Once that tiny bit of optimism is gone, I'm gonna tuck and roll, and you better be behind me if you want to live. :D

When the Bus Driver points starts driving towards Iran, or North Korea, or the Bus Company decides to tell us sit quiet and face the front while we're headed towards the cliff.

I.E.:If the President somehow becomes more of an idiot(Is it possible to have negative intelligence?), or Congress decides to take on as much power as possible. Not sure which. I'm an optimist, and against all rational thought, I still believe that it's possible to salvage something from the current wreck. Once that tiny bit of optimism is gone, I'm gonna tuck and roll, and you better be behind me if you want to live. :D

I agree. But only us cool MidWestNortherners. No Ohio or Indiana or, god forbid, Illinois *shutters*.

And we can bring along the Dakotas to be our bitches.

I agree. But only us cool MidWestNortherners. No Ohio or Indiana or, god forbid, Illinois *shutters*.

And we can bring along the Dakotas to be our bitches.

I'd rather drag Ohio's fat-ass along with me out the door then have to put up with North Dakota. South Dakota's cool though.

I'd rather drag Ohio's fat-ass along with me out the door then have to put up with North Dakota. South Dakota's cool though.

Sorry, no Ohio. I refuse. Ohio is an evil place, made of evilness, with a smooth creamy nougat center thats evil flavored.

What if we take South Dekota with us, and then go and kick North Dakota's ass and take his things?

While the Midwest is fighting over which states they want to be their bitches and which aren't in the cool club, I will have Texas quietly secede while no one is looking and declare myself its king.

Well, I hope you all like Mexican food. When our campaign of Canadian oppression is in full swing, there'll of course be forced migrations southward, so as to give us breathing room...

Good riddance, the South can't even competently operate their own legislatures.

Guess what? They still control who becomes president, basically:


http://watch.windsofchange.net/pics/electoral_map_2004.gif

Note the former confederacy all voted red in one clean chunk. Not only that, but look at the electoral vote distribution:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/a/aa/Electoral_map.png

Texas alone has 34 electoral votes! That's 6% of the electoral vote! And don't forget they're redistricting to fuck over moderates and liberals.

Guess what? They still control who becomes president, basically:


http://watch.windsofchange.net/pics/electoral_map_2004.gif

Note the former confederacy all voted red in one clean chunk. Not only that, but look at the electoral vote distribution:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/a/aa/Electoral_map.png

Texas alone has 34 electoral votes! That's 6% of the electoral vote! And don't forget they're redistricting to fuck over moderates and liberals.

Land doesn't vote. People vote. In that way, the map looks like this:
http://www-personal.umich.edu/~mejn/election/statecartredblueakhi.png

of course, if we went with the popular vote, it would look more like this:
http://www-personal.umich.edu/~mejn/election/countycart3070large.png

You really don't deserve to rule over a people if all you are going to do is resent them.

You really don't deserve to rule over a people if all you are going to do is resent them.

What, and the North is fond of the South?

While the Midwest is fighting over which states they want to be their bitches and which aren't in the cool club, I will have Texas quietly secede while no one is looking and declare myself its king.

Minnesota will immediately recognize your independence.

of course, if we went with the popular vote, it would look more like this:
http://www-personal.umich.edu/~mejn/election/countycart3070large.png

Yes. But the electoral college was specifically devised to give the South more power, and it is doing it's job. Under the electoral college, the south has a disproportionate amount of influence on the outcome.

Can New Jersey bail too? We are the Garden State and all, you need a state that looks pretty.

I see Florida ripping apart... specifically the Seminole and Miami parts... That'd be awkward.



But for the country, watch Utah and Texas as they slide out quietly while the Carolinas throw a fit. :cool:

Yea be glad your losing power in congress while the central government grows stronger be glad...

I'd blast as many southern racist hicks as possible then resist the oppression of Canada. :p *Canadian bacon happens*

"What's wrong with you people!? All I said was Canadian Beer sucks!!"

Yes. But the electoral college was specifically devised to give the South more power, and it is doing it's job. Under the electoral college, the south has a disproportionate amount of influence on the outcome.

...the electoral college gives small states more power...not the south...

http://www-personal.umich.edu/~mejn/election/countycart3070large.png
This image (which shall hence forth be refered to as the "Map That Should Not Be") is going to haunt my nightmares for months now, thanks a lot.

This image (which shall hence forth be refered to as the "Map That Should Not Be") is going to haunt my nightmares for months now, thanks a lot.

It's because Florida looks a bit engorged, isn't it?

that, or its caused you to have a relapse...

either way, you're welcome :)

Yes. But the electoral college was specifically devised to give the South more power, and it is doing it's job. Sure it does - soon as we use our time-shifting abilities to make it 1800 again.
But that is only assuming you have any clue what the fuck you are talking about. You don't.

of course, if we went with the popular vote, it would look more like this:
http://www-personal.umich.edu/~mejn/election/countycart3070large.png

I see a person sitting next to a bed, on a couch playing a video game while another person dives past them, presumably coming in through the window.

Minnesota will immediately recognize your independence.

Woohoo! Best Friends 4Ever!

http://www-personal.umich.edu/~mejn/election/countycart3070large.png

Are you supposed to take LSD and look at this map?

Woohoo! Best Friends 4Ever!



Are you supposed to take LSD and look at this map?

oh, thats nothing...take a look at some of these:
http://www-personal.umich.edu/~mejn/election/ (<-the election ones origins)
http://www-personal.umich.edu/~mejn/cartograms/ (<-fun world map ones)

Cartograms are fun!

I agree. But only us cool MidWestNortherners. No Ohio or Indiana or, god forbid, Illinois *shutters*.

And we can bring along the Dakotas to be our bitches.

I have never understood how these qualify as being Midwest, wouldn't Mideast be more accurate? I mean they are about as far west as Utah is East.

Being Canadian, my natural bias is towards the north. They tend to be more similar to us, politically speaking. At the same time, it would be nice to see all countries (America included) have a relatively equal regional distribution of power, as long as population was also taken into account.

Of course, if they secede, we have a contingency plan for you. My buddies and me developed this for our province of Quebec:

Let them secede, invade and annex them, and take them over under better terms! IE. fewer legal privileges, reduced electoral power, plundering and sacking of cities... think about it.

Might not be good for national unity, but it would teach 'em a lesson.

oh, thats nothing...take a look at some of these:
http://www-personal.umich.edu/~mejn/election/ (<-the election ones origins)
http://www-personal.umich.edu/~mejn/cartograms/ (<-fun world map ones)

Cartograms are fun!

Especially if you have some Pink Floyd music playing...

Woohoo! Best Friends 4Ever!

Yay! :cool:

I have never understood how these qualify as being Midwest, wouldn't Mideast be more accurate? I mean they are about as far west as Utah is East.

I think the general consensus is that Midwest is anything west of the Mississippi that isn't West Coast. I'd probably refer to those states you bolded as Middle states.

Yea be glad your losing power in congress while the central government grows stronger be glad...

Um...what? This isn't about the South losing power in Congress to the central government. It's about the South losing power to the rest of the states as far as influence on policy goes.

Did you...actually...read the thread at all?

I have never understood how these qualify as being Midwest, wouldn't Mideast be more accurate? I mean they are about as far west as Utah is East.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Northwest_Ordinance

I have never understood how these qualify as being Midwest, wouldn't Mideast be more accurate? I mean they are about as far west as Utah is East.


I believe they are also called "Great Lake States"

The South is losing its power in Congress. At one point they were extremely powerful and could bend Congress to their will, but now they have last much power. And many Southern politicians aren't even that Southern. Me likey.

Link (http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070331/ap_on_go_co/lost_southern_clout)

Kewl.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Northwest_Ordinance

That seems a little out datedconsidering we hace added a few times that width to the country since them leaving them pretty far from anywhere that actualy qualifies as the west.

That seems a little out dated considering we have added a few times that width to the country since them leaving them pretty far from anywhere that actualy qualifies as the west.

The name still sticks, though. Blame Jefferson.

The name still sticks, though. Blame Jefferson.

Pfft, personaly I think they just want to be associated with the west, with the whole cultural mytho that the west has attached to it here;)

Pfft, personaly I think they just want to be associated with the west, with the whole cultural mytho that the west has attached to it here;)

Sorry, we were the original west. You just want to be cool like us.

Sorry, we were the original west. You just want to be cool like us.
Maybe you were the "west" first, but you weren't the cool west, not that I'd consider us part of that either I'd say you would still need to go a bit farther.

Maybe you were the "west" first, but you weren't the cool west, not that I'd consider us part of that either I'd say you would still need to go a bit farther.

Incorrect. The midwest is the original cool west. You guys just tried to clone our coolness. Which you were terribly unsucessfull at.

Sorry, we were the original west. You just want to be cool like us.

Pfft. You can keep your renowned Western icons Kiss and Eminem; we'll keep John Wayne and Clint Eastwood.

Pfft. You can keep your renowned Western icons Kiss and Eminem; we'll keep John Wayne and Clint Eastwood.

...

Dude, you guys can KEEP John Wayne. We don't want him. He was batshit crazy.

...

Dude, you guys can KEEP John Wayne. We don't want him. He was batshit crazy.

Watch what you say about the Duke, pilgrim... :D

Good. The South could use a Northern-influenced federal government.