NationStates Jolt Archive

In this day and age is it possible for a revolution to occur in the West. I'm not talking some riots and such but the big kind. You know ovethrowing people in power and replacing the governing system. Or has the revolutionary spirit died within society as we become more materialistic?

Well not in the UK, people are just too comfortable to get of their lazy asses and start a revolution.

Well if someone got off their ass and blew up Parliament House I would join for sure. ;)

Especially if it was to some groovy classical overture.

someone would have to think up some new cool reason for revolution. i cant imagine what it might be but it would have to quickly capture the hearts of lots of people.

the economic reasons that spurred on possible communist revolutions just dont exist anymore. plus the communist countries that were helping it along were show to be horrific.

Right here, right now? No. Sometime within the next century? Sure, it's possible.

No matter which way you look at things, the Earth isn't going to be the same forever. And history shows us that a lot of things can change in a mere decade.

I've heard that most countries are just three square meals away from a revolution, but I think it would take a huge event - I can't even think of one big enough - to spark a revolution that changes the US government. I suppose if the president tried to postpone the regular elections and stay in power, people might rise up, but I don't know that that would change the government, just the faces in it.

In this day and age is it possible for a revolution to occur in the West. I'm not talking some riots and such but the big kind. You know ovethrowing people in power and replacing the governing system. Or has the revolutionary spirit died within society as we become more materialistic?

I don't think the majority of the people in the "West" want Revolution, were happy with our current democracies

Or has the revolutionary spirit died within society as we become more materialistic?
I think that's the key. Harold Macmillan said we'd never had it so good, and that's only become more true since he said it. Now it seems that so long as people feel they're financially comfortable they don't see the point in forcing change anywhere else, no matter how much they moan about erosion of civil rights, etc.

Governments now seek re-election by trying to make sure that the majority of the electorate has enough money - just look at Gordon Brown's last Budget. Sure, there's a lot of people negatively affected by the removal of the starter rate of income tax, but Brown has probably given himself an extra half million votes at the next election by making so many other people better off.

Just bring home a million disgruntled soldiers to a ruined economy sometime in the future, and you'll have one.

Just bring home a million disgruntled soldiers to a ruined economy sometime in the future, and you'll have one.

But I don't know that it would be a "to the barricades!" kind of revolution. I think you'd see some politician tap into that anger and use it to sweep into power, but as I said before, I don't think it would work a permanent change in the structure of the government in the US.

In this day and age is it possible for a revolution to occur in the West. I'm not talking some riots and such but the big kind. You know ovethrowing people in power and replacing the governing system. Or has the revolutionary spirit died within society as we become more materialistic?Revolutions can and will happen.

No.

People only revolt when they are hungry and suffering. Currently, the general populace of the industrialized societies of Western world is neither, rather contrary to the quasi-religious claims of Marx (who predicted that industrialized societies would internally produce exactly those things).

In the West, a revolution will have to occur in the same manner that got the Nazis into power - an abuse of the democratic process. Some people clamor that "Oh boo frickety hoo, Bush is going to suspend elections." it will take a lot more than that for a dictator to spring up in the U.S. Yes, the political situation's in sad shape, but it's no dictatorship.

It will take a few things:

First off, it will take the right people. All that matters is taht they are charismatic and can get what they want out of the people. People will willingly hand over their rights in a neat little gift-wrapped package if they are convinced to do so. (Well, most people will, anyway. And some will hand them over anyway.)

Next, it will take a hard situation. The housing bust? Not nearly enough. Iraq? Won't cut it. Vietnam didn't. The Savings and Loan scandals and corporate crime? Don't bet on it. The Great Depression all over again? Now you're talking, although it isn't always enough. It took Versailles AND the Depression for Germany to go Nazi. America had no Versailles, and it stayed democratic (yes, we could have voted out Roosevelt if we really wanted to, and yes, he played by the rules.) The oil crash could trigger it, though due to its nature, it may end up triggering regional despotism instead rather than an American dictatorship.

Finally, it will take something for people to get pissed off at. Illegal immigration and Islamic terrorism are the two most likely choices for that.

So if I'm an American looking to overthrow society and become a dictator, here's what I do:

1. Get lots of like-minded friends who have nothing else and want power.
2. Bone up on my public speaking and write down what I believe.
3. Get involved in politics on some level, but stay within the realm of acceptable thought for now.
4. Anticipate a disaster and formulate a workable solution to it. And I mean a super-hyper-mega disaster, a la the oil crisis.
5. Start spouting off solutions that really sound like they can work.
6. Run for the big offices and get elected.
7. Start making things better right away in order to gain the trust of the nation, but remember to save some miracles for later on because the public has a very short attention span.
8. Allow it to get worse on some level just so the people feel like they need me.
9. Whip out some more potential miracles while, at the same time, convincing those who can make it happen that I should be President for life.
10. Pass an amendment that names me President for life, and just to make the people more at ease, whip out some of those miracles I had in store.

After that, I can do pretty much whatever I damn well please. I would gradually disarm the population, starting with the parts of the country that aren't dedicated to gun rights. I would institute buyback campaigns and start closing gun shops, instead turning their firearms manufacturing toward the police and government. I would begin evicting people from Washington, D.C. and require clearance in order to enter the district. I would give big tax breaks to corporations and encourage them to be as strict and brutal as they please with their employees; after all, why should I get my hands dirty when I can get my buddies at Wal-Mart to do it for me? Frankly, labor rights would be the first thing to go and the easiest to get rid of. It's not as if people actually use their labor rights anyway.

In order to solve the car crisis, I would have to start using GM crops and converting all cars over to burning ethanol. Other power can be through coal and nuclear power. With cleaner coal-burning technology, I can even pass myself off as an environmentalist! As for those with older cars that can't be converted over and can't afford new cars...well, for those who borrow money, the shackles of debt can be very useful to me, and for those who don't borrow money, having my biggest victims immobilized by poverty can also be very useful to me.

And if I can come up with this in half and hour on an internet forum, imagine what a professional who's been planning this for years can do.

In this day and age is it possible for a revolution to occur in the West. I'm not talking some riots and such but the big kind. You know ovethrowing people in power and replacing the governing system. Or has the revolutionary spirit died within society as we become more materialistic?

I would never discount revolution. When people have just had enough it will happen.

I don't think the majority of the people in the "West" want Revolution, were happy with our current democracies

Heh and I'm not sure how true that is?

I don't think the majority of the people in the "West" want Revolution, were happy with our current democracies

I wouldnt say we were happy but as usaual instead of doing something we moan about it. It's the western way. The only time we would kick up a fuss is if a TV channel showed something before nine. Oh the abuse the TV company would get......

8. Allow it to get worse on some level just so the people feel like they need me.
9. Whip out some more potential miracles while, at the same time, convincing those who can make it happen that I should be President for life.
10. Pass an amendment that names me President for life, and just to make the people more at ease, whip out some of those miracles I had in store.

one thing to keep in mind would be your political enemies. when it comes down to it, you can't rule completely with loose ends. if 8 doesn't concern itself completely to it, then killing off rivals would still make for a nice little sideshow. even better would to claim any assassinations the work of whatever "corrupt" party is giving you hassle

-snip-

Expect for me to come gunning for you then.

Americans can't even get off their lazy asses to vote, there is just too much apathy and too many distractions. However, if things don't change, I see the distinct possibility of a dictator taking over this country and then you might see a revolution.

No.

People only revolt when they are hungry and suffering.

nah. people that are suffering too much invest all their energy into scraping by. revolutionary circumstances are more often caused by rising expectations being unfulfilled.

one thing to keep in mind would be your political enemies. when it comes down to it, you can't rule completely with loose ends. if 8 doesn't concern itself completely to it, then killing off rivals would still make for a nice little sideshow. even better would to claim any assassinations the work of whatever "corrupt" party is giving you hassle

The first step would be to get as many of my own people into power as possible. Say, the disaster hits, and both the GOP and Dems drag their feet, so I go national with the Law Abiding Criminals party. Even better, I use the GOP as a platform for my group, the Law Abiding Criminals. At first, we're a minority in Congress, but we get things done, so we run LAC candidates in swing districts, and they win; in four years, we're a majority. Then, with power in the states as well, I can help my party bend the rules so that it's far easier for my candidates to get elected. We're getting things done, and my party would try its best to keep its nose clean for a while, so we would be seen as a welcome relief from the crooked asshole politicians. Then, during my second term, I have two options - get a 2/3 majority in both houses or expand my lead as much as I can and strong-arm the more crooked politicians into doing my bidding. Especially those in the Senate. What's that, Mr. Democratic Senator? You really want to keep your job, but you have all these ethics charges against you? Well, I could make sure those turn into convictions and send you off to jail, or you could vote with my agenda. What'll it be?

As corrupt and backward as politicians are these days, and as much as they depend on re-election, blackmail and strong-arming should be no trouble at all. Even if I can't get my own posse into every high-ranking position.

nah. people that are suffering too much invest all their energy into scraping by. revolutionary circumstances are more often caused by rising expectations being unfulfilled.

My high school history teacher once said, "Revolutions happen when things start to get better." In the worst of situations, a revolution can't happen because the people are too busy trying to subsist. If people start to get more well-fed after that, though, it could be curtains for the people in power. I think Stalin and Mao knew this, and that's why they were never overthrown.

I don't know about the rest of the West, but those Americans sure are revolting.

*pause for laughter*

nah. people that are suffering too much invest all their energy into scraping by. revolutionary circumstances are more often caused by rising expectations being unfulfilled.

Well, that's certainly not the case with the French, Russian or German (1918) Revolutions. Starvation, misery and the deprivations of war were the drivers of those

Well not in the UK, people are just too comfortable to get of their lazy asses and start a revolution.

In the US also...we don't even riot any more...

Well that is until I get around to things...

In this day and age is it possible for a revolution to occur in the West. I'm not talking some riots and such but the big kind. You know ovethrowing people in power and replacing the governing system. Or has the revolutionary spirit died within society as we become more materialistic?

It's definitely possible, but here's the qualifier: we all have to work really hard for it. Also, I think that the reactionaries in power are going to have to fuck up something really hard in order to get enough people interested in motivated for it to possible in the near future.

It's definitely possible, but here's the qualifier: we all have to work really hard for it. Also, I think that the reactionaries in power are going to have to fuck up something really hard in order to get enough people interested in motivated for it to possible in the near future.

And I'd work my butt off to stop you, if you had even the remotest chance.

But I don't know that it would be a "to the barricades!" kind of revolution. I think you'd see some politician tap into that anger and use it to sweep into power, but as I said before, I don't think it would work a permanent change in the structure of the government in the US.

Their is a fine line between revolution and coup d'etat. Discontent at home can be a catalyst for both a revolution (a la French Revolution) or the justification for a coup (the Bolshevik coup).

And I'd work my butt off to stop you, if you had even the remotest chance.

Neither I nor the poster specified what kind of revolution it was going to be. You just assumed it would be my kind of syndicalist/socialist revolution. It could be a social revolution to overthrow patriarchy, the vestiges of racism, a corrupt and unfixable government, or any number of another things. The point still remains that any revolution is still a ways off.

Well, that's certainly not the case with the French, Russian or German (1918) Revolutions. Starvation, misery and the deprivations of war were the drivers of those

it's more like starvation and misery and the deprivations of war coming on top of dashed hopes of reform or previously improving situations. the starvation, etc. was not really worse for the people than it had been for much of the time before.