NationStates Jolt Archive


Circus Animals: Entertainment or Inhumane?

PootWaddle
12-03-2007, 14:40
Various places have banned Circuses from performing in their cities because of perceived animal abuses. The PR fight continues.

Circus Animals… Animal Activists vs. Ringling Bros. and Barnum & Bailey Circus

Living conditions:

Activist:
Most animals used in the circus are meant to live in the wild. Instead of their natural habitats where they would roam free and live on their natural instincts, they are forced to live and travel in cramped quarters far smaller than their habitats in the wild. They are often forced to eat, sleep and even defecate in the same place. Circuses travel to many locations and water is limited in some locations, bathing and cleaning the animals living quarters is given low priority where water is limited. Unfortunately, this limitation extends to their drinking water as well.
Elephants are kept with their feet chained down for long periods of time. Baby elephants are prematurely removed from their mothers for the purpose of early training. They are tied with ropes, which leads to rope burn. Many circuses give no consideration to climate and the animals are exposed to extreme heat or cold. In addition, their diets do not consist of what they would naturally and they are sometimes underfed in the interest of getting an ideal performance. Disease is common among circus animals. Veterinarians qualified to treat exotic animals are not always present and circus animals frequently suffer inadequate veterinary care.

Ringling Bros.:
• Our staff is dedicated to meeting our animals’ physical and behavioral needs. For instance, elephants need daily exercise, fresh food and a compatible herd all of which they get with Ringling Bros.

• Our animal husbandry team provides a stable, stimulating and rewarding environment where animals thrive year-round.

• Elephants are highly intelligent, curious and playful and we provide a variety of items with which they entertain themselves. You’ll notice enrichment items, such as tires, traffic cones and logs that elephants play with and climb. There are also mounds of sand that they like to throw on themselves or roll in, and when appropriate they have pools to splash in. A favorite treat during hot weather is fruit frozen in huge blocks of ice. They will spend countless hours picking at the ice blocks, smashing them and licking them to get to the frozen treat inside.

• Nutritious meals, exercise and mental stimulation combined with excellent veterinary care play an integral role in the health and well-being of the animals.

• Ringling Bros. has an expert animal care team consisting of staff veterinarians and full-time animal care staff on each unit who are all dedicated to the animals’ physical and emotional well-being 24/7. We also consult with outside animal specialists and have on-call veterinarians in every city we perform.
Training

Activists:
Ever wonder how circuses manage to get the animals to perform so well? Animals do not perform the acts you see in the circus naturally. They have to be trained, often by extreme methods. They are traumatized in to obeying their human ‘trainers” commands. Bull hooks are often driven in to the tender areas of an elephant’s body to make it cooperate. Electric shock, whips, baseball bats and pipes are also among the methods used to force the animals to cooperate in training. Some animals are kept muzzled to subdue them and discourage them from defending themselves if they feel threatened. Some animals are drugged to make them manageable and some have their teeth removed. Some bears have had their paws burned to force them to stand on their hind legs.

Ringling Bros.:
• Our animals are great performers, because their routines are tailored to each animal’s natural abilities and individual preferences and reinforced through a system of repetition and reward.

• The same behaviors you see the elephants exhibit in the arena you can see among young calves naturally exploring their environment at the Ringling Bros. and Barnum & Bailey Center for Elephant Conservation® such as climbing on their mothers and on each other, doing head stands for fun or manipulating things in their environment like logs and branches.

• Because the performances are based on what the animals do during play and socialization, training is simply a matter of encouraging the elephants to do what comes naturally on cue to music. We accomplish that by reinforcing their natural behaviors through repetition and reward.

• And, because the trainers provide the animals with a stable, rewarding environment, the animals eagerly learn to repeat their behaviors in sequence and on verbal cue.

• We only include animals in our show that are comfortable with the routines and performing.

• Anyone with a dog knows that training takes patience, praise and lots of treats, but the outcome is a secure, stimulating life for the animal. The same principles hold true for an elephant.

• You will also notice the animals’ vitality and muscle tone and their interest in their surroundings—all signs of well adjusted healthy animals that receive excellent care, nutrition and stimulation.

• We are committed to the health and wellbeing of all our animals and we meet and exceed the standards of the Animal Welfare Act, the federal law that governs proper animal care.

Old age for circus animals:

Activists:
As with many other forms of animal “entertainment”, once the animal can no longer perform, it is not much value to the circus. They may be permanently caged, sold to a game farm to be hunted, or sold to a lab.

Ringling Bros.:
• In the last fourteen years, 25 elephants died, most as the result of old age.

• We mourn the passing of the elephants but also consider ourselves fortunate that overall our herd, the largest sustainable population of captive Asian elephants in the Western Hemisphere, is thriving and that our Asian elephant conservation program has bred 20 elephant calves since our program started in the early 1990’s.

• Breeding programs like Ringling Bros. will be essential to the survival of the Asian elephant species.
• The average life expectancy for Asian elephants is 45 years in North America (‘Calculation of Longevity and Life Expectancy in Captive Elephants’, Zoo Biology by Robert J. Wiese, 2004).

• The same study suggests that captive elephants have a longevity and life expectancy similar to wild elephants.

• Ringling Bros. has 12 elephants that are 45 or older, including 6 over 50 years (figures from 9/06).


Activists Links (http://www.starbreezes.com/11/circusabuse.html):
PETA Link (http://www.circuses.com/):

Ringling Bros. Link (http://www.feldentertainment.com/pr/aca/FAQ1.htm)

So what say you? I think the circuses, with proper oversight, are fine. They should NOT be outlawed or banned anymore than dog shows and horse farms should be banned. With proper oversight and attention, circuses provide a service to the public AND to the animal husbandry of the species that are used by circuses.
Cluichstan
12-03-2007, 14:42
Fuck those PETA asshats.
Ultraviolent Radiation
12-03-2007, 14:49
Ban circuses? Even those that don't use animals? Actually, I wouldn't be surprised.
Call to power
12-03-2007, 14:50
I don't see a problem though Animal cruelty should be monitored, which it is
The Most Glorious Hack
12-03-2007, 14:50
Fuck those PETA asshats.But I like Eating Tasty Animals...
Khadgar
12-03-2007, 14:59
People
Eating
Tasty
Animals
Cluichstan
12-03-2007, 15:02
But I like Eating Tasty Animals...

Well, that PETA's different. I'm even a member. ;)
Anti-Social Darwinism
12-03-2007, 15:41
PETA is a group of liars and extremists. Most of the time they've been proven to be completely wrong about their contentions. That said, I hate circuses. The clowns, you know *shudders, creeps away backwards, hoping the evil clowns won't notice her.*
Vetalia
12-03-2007, 15:44
I'm pretty sure most major circuses take very good care of their animals, and they likely fund efforts to conserve populations in the wild. If the animals are treated humanely and given good living conditions, there is nothing wrong with using them in a circus. It's no different than a person taking their dog or cat to a show or racing horses.
Lunatic Goofballs
12-03-2007, 16:21
Regardless of how well circus animals are treated, I can't help but smile when an elephant steps on someone. :)
Compulsive Depression
12-03-2007, 16:41
I imagine it depends very much on what animals we're talking about, what they're doing, the conditions in which they're kept and how they're treated.
United Beleriand
12-03-2007, 16:42
1. What is humane?
2. Keeping animals in circuses is still better than eating animals.
Smunkeeville
12-03-2007, 16:43
The clowns, you know *shudders, creeps away backwards, hoping the evil clowns won't notice her.*

:(
Ifreann
12-03-2007, 16:47
Can't it be entertaining and inhumane?
Hoyteca
12-03-2007, 16:57
Doesn't PETA kill more animals than the groups they oppose combined? I'm not talking about People Eating Tasty Animals. I'm a proud supporter of that group. I'm talking about the hippy terrorists.

That said, elephants shouldn't be trained for entertainment. They should be trained to kill PETA hippies on sight, preferably in a hilarious and entertaining way. It's what they do naturally, though, in Africa and Asia, they go after hippy terrorist plants. Same thing.
PootWaddle
12-03-2007, 16:57
Can't it be entertaining and inhumane?

Yes, but the question is should circuses be banned in your city. Does the inhumane outweigh the education/entertainment aspect or does the entertainment/education aspect outweight the inhumane aspect of it for you? Should they be banned?
PootWaddle
12-03-2007, 17:00
...
That said, elephants shouldn't be trained for entertainment. They should be trained to kill PETA hippies on sight, preferably in a hilarious and entertaining way. It's what they do naturally, though, in Africa and Asia, they go after hippy terrorist plants. Same thing.

If they are trained to kill hippy terrorists on sight, how then is that not trained for entertainment? I'm at a loss :confused:


;)
Lunatic Goofballs
12-03-2007, 17:15
:(

She has already been noticed. ;)
Eve Online
12-03-2007, 18:12
The circus is no longer very entertaining, as that sort of entertainment can now be found on the web.

Squirrel Tricks ('http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=f5d_1172741350')
PootWaddle
12-03-2007, 18:32
The circus is no longer very entertaining, as that sort of entertainment can now be found on the web.

Squirrel Tricks ('http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=f5d_1172741350')

OMYGosh! :eek:

That's not funny! :D LOL


Okay, maybe it is funny in a ebi7 way, but I'm still not letting my nine year old boy watch it! He might get ideas... :p
Isidoor
12-03-2007, 18:45
meh i don't really like circus animals. imo they look pathetic and unhappy (not saying they are, but they do look like that)
i wouldn't really oppose a banning of circus animals, but i don't really support the PETA either, they're so extreme they do more harm than good.
PootWaddle
13-03-2007, 14:06
I'm surprised this thread didn't create a better 'debate'. It's nearly split in half for those in favor of banning and those in favor of not banning circuses in their cities, but the people in favor of banning them have only voted without presenting an argument 'why' the circuses should be banned... :(
Athiesta
13-03-2007, 14:08
No; circuses provide those who fall out of the education system a decent wage doing something out of the ordinary.

The animals are a vehicle for that wage.
The Most Glorious Hack
13-03-2007, 14:11
Well... I don't know how educational circuses are. They're fun, and there's some really neat tricks, but I don't know if I ever learned anything while there (except that elephants smell and the girl in the box-o-swords was really flexible). Still, I don't think they should be banned.

Sorry you didn't get much debate, though.
Andaluciae
13-03-2007, 14:23
When I said educational I would like to clarify that I'm thinking educational along the lines that Sesame Street, Mister Rogers' Neighborhood and the local small community zoo is educational. Good for pre-schoolers and kindergartners etc., I certainly didn't mean to imply that I think it's educational for a anything other than that. ;)

The presence of stimuli and interaction with unknown things, so as to stimulate the brain, then.
PootWaddle
13-03-2007, 14:25
Well... I don't know how educational circuses are. They're fun, and there's some really neat tricks, but I don't know if I ever learned anything while there (except that elephants smell and the girl in the box-o-swords was really flexible). Still, I don't think they should be banned...

When I said educational I would like to clarify that I'm thinking educational along the lines that Sesame Street, Mister Rogers' Neighborhood and the local small community zoo is educational. Good for pre-schoolers and kindergartners etc., I certainly didn't mean to imply that I think it's educational for a anything other than that. ;)
PootWaddle
13-03-2007, 14:37
The presence of stimuli and interaction with unknown things, so as to stimulate the brain, then.

Exactly right. When you are four years old and seeing an elephant for the very first time, your mouth full of cotton candy and bag full of popcorn on your lap, your little body all a shiver from a chemical reaction to the overdose of sugar and stimuli your Mom and Dad just exposed you too... it's educational :D