NationStates Jolt Archive

If incentives help kids learn and place some value on their education I have no problem with it.

It's better to give such gifts to everyone and not just to some. take it with the well meaning behind it and as you said. give it to someone who will appreciate it if you don't.

you will need incentives later in life. if you don't think so, then think about the paycheck you want to earn when you choose your career.

Yesterday I checked the mail after getting home and found a nice little envelope addressed to me from the school. So I opened that nice little evelope only to find a nice little sheet of stationery inside.

The nice little sheet of stationery stated:

Thank you for doing your best on the 11th Grade Writing PSSA!
Enjoy the enclosed movie gift card ($10.00)

We will see (you) they totally forgot to type "you") on Monday, March 12th for the 11th Grade Reading & Mathematics PSSA.

Please come rested & mentally prepared!!

Rewards and incentives are planned!

And a nice little gift card to use at the movie theater.


Now I didn't do well thinking "Oh boy! Incentives!" I did well because I'm not an idiot that doesn't know how to write a persuasive essay. Which, by the way, I needed to write an essay on what book I have read and why I would reccomend to a friend. I wrote about The Little Train That Could, and my friend? Whereyouthinkyougoing. I shit you not.

Well.. yeah.. back to my point.

I don't know why, but I feel offended by this incentive. I don't think any school should have to give their students anything just so they do good. It annoys me that a student would do bad on a test when they know how they are capable of doing good. But tell them they get something out of it other than a good grade and they go wild and actually try.

I think incentives are ridiculous, and I think it's sad that schools have to give them to students to even get them to try.

I gave the gift card to my brother.

What's your opinion on incentives in school?

Jebus, can't people take a compliment anymore these days?

Unfortunately, there are people who don't think that learning is an end in itself. They want incentives, like money. I blame parents who started the nonsense of giving $5.00 (or more) for every "A." Then it escalated to giving the idiot brats $20.00 for every grade that wasn't an "F." The kids learned all right. They learned that parents and school systems are suckers. And now the people who actually understand the intrinsic value of learning are being insulted with "incentives."

Who said its about the students? Maybe the school have a pact with the movie theathers, because every single student that goes there to see the movies will buy popcorn/sodas and other stuff.

Maybe the school director is banging the movie theater owner and they came with this nice marketing move.

Its all about money, who cares about kids?

Whats the equivalent of 11th grade in england?

Who said its about the students? Maybe the school have a pact with the movie theathers, because every single student that goes there to see the movies will buy popcorn/sodas and other stuff.

Maybe the school director is banging the movie theater owner and they came with this nice marketing move.

Its all about money, who cares about kids?

Aye. Those incentives were there so the school gets more funding.

Which, by the way, I needed to write an essay on what book I have read and why I would reccomend to a friend. I wrote about The Little Train That Could, and my friend? Whereyouthinkyougoing. I shit you not.

You broke the first and second rules of NSG! :upyours:

Rule 1 of NSG: Don't talk about NSG.
Rule 2 of NSG: Don't talk about NSG!






:p

Incentives are cool.. For example for the past 2 years as a sixth former the incentive for myself and thousands of other students is 30 GBP a week (roughly $60) for turning up to all lessons. It helped as others who would ussualy have skipped lessons stayed at school and worked hard. It's great.

Whats the equivalent of 11th grade in england?

That year before that year when you graduate?

You broke the first and second rules of NSG! :upyours:

Rule 1 of NSG: Don't talk about NSG.
Rule 2 of NSG: Don't talk about NSG!






:p

Oh, no no! I used her real name. *nods*

You broke the first and second rules of NSG! :upyours:

Rule 1 of NSG: Don't talk about NSG.
Rule 2 of NSG: Don't talk about NSG!






:p

I'd sig it, but it's probably already been done before...

Oh, no no! I used her real name. *nods*

Did you mention how you knew her?

Oh, no no! I used her real name. *nods*

think theres a rule for that too

Did you mention how you knew her?

Nope. :)

Nope. :)

And what were your reasons?

And what were your reasons?

To help her strengthen her self confedence.

To help her strengthen her self confedence.

Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaand?

Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaand?

And because I didn't feel like using The Great Gatsby, like everyone else.

And because I didn't feel like using The Great Gatsby, like everyone else.

Ok. Everything is fine here. Move along.

How about this for an incentive. If you don't pass you won't get a good job and be deemed a failure. That was enough incentive for me.

Some schools give out $50's if one is not absent duringthe school year.
Unfortunatly my school didn't have such a policy, because it would have been the easiest $50 i ever made.

Oh, no no! I used her real name. *nods*

We don't have real names here. Oh my no.

Incentives are nice. I recently received the Rotary Club of Wellington Science Price for computer science (first year university). Its $100 which isn't really anything to get extremely excited about, but its nice to be realized as having done hard work, and it goes on my academic transcript which is much more important.

Awesome timewarp, the two posts above my previous one(Which incidentally might be below this one are 2 minutes ahead of the current time, they say 10:54 but it is strangely 10:53...
EDIT:TIS CORRECTED. :(

How about this for an incentive. If you don't pass you won't get a good job and be deemed a failure. That was enough incentive for me.

Some people just don't care.

Wow, they have low standards.

My primary income as a kid was grade money, x-mas and my birthday.

I didn't do well for the money, per se, I did well because it was easy and it would have disappointed my parents not to. The money was icing on the cake. I got a lot more money from my university for doing well in school also - a scholarship is a monetary incentive.


If it takes money to motivate kids to do well in school, then the money should be spent.
We already mis-spend a great deal of our education budget. If rewarding good behavior is the most efficient way to get kids to learn, then it should without a doubt be commonplace.

I don't tend to like kids who expect to get paid for grades, but then again, I don't tend to like grades in general, so I guess I am weird.

If it takes money to motivate kids to do well in school, then the money should be spent.
We already mis-spend a great deal of our education budget. If rewarding good behavior is the most efficient way to get kids to learn, then it should without a doubt be commonplace.

What he said. Schools have to cater to many different groups of students. The students who will do well because they want to learn will do well whether or not there is motivation. The students who won't do well no matter what will do poorly whether or not there is motivation. Providing motivation means that the students who might have otherwise done poorly do well. That's not a bad things. Schools aren't just for smart people. They are there to give everyone a chance, not just elites. Otherwise we'd just have smart kids going to private schools.

Yesterday I checked the mail after getting home and found a nice little envelope addressed to me from the school. So I opened that nice little evelope only to find a nice little sheet of stationery inside.

The nice little sheet of stationery stated:

Thank you for doing your best on the 11th Grade Writing PSSA!
Enjoy the enclosed movie gift card ($10.00)

We will see (you) they totally forgot to type "you") on Monday, March 12th for the 11th Grade Reading & Mathematics PSSA.

Please come rested & mentally prepared!!

Rewards and incentives are planned!

And a nice little gift card to use at the movie theater.


Now I didn't do well thinking "Oh boy! Incentives!" I did well because I'm not an idiot that doesn't know how to write a persuasive essay. Which, by the way, I needed to write an essay on what book I have read and why I would reccomend to a friend. I wrote about The Little Train That Could, and my friend? Whereyouthinkyougoing. I shit you not.

Well.. yeah.. back to my point.

I don't know why, but I feel offended by this incentive. I don't think any school should have to give their students anything just so they do good. It annoys me that a student would do bad on a test when they know how they are capable of doing good. But tell them they get something out of it other than a good grade and they go wild and actually try.

I think incentives are ridiculous, and I think it's sad that schools have to give them to students to even get them to try.

I gave the gift card to my brother.

What's your opinion on incentives in school?

Show me the essay!

In principle, I hold them to be a waste of time and resources, since the "incentives" most schools can offer will not motivate the average student, and thos who work will do do anyway. Equally, I object to offering a reward for an education, the results of which are an end in themselves. If people can't see that, they deserve to fail.

In principle, I hold them to be a waste of time and resources, since the "incentives" most schools can offer will not motivate the average student, and thos who work will do do anyway. Equally, I object to offering a reward for an education, the results of which are an end in themselves. If people can't see that, they deserve to fail.

The goal of the educational system is to produce educated students, not to produce "deserving" students. It is pure elitism to assume that only those who value knowledge for knowledge's sake deserve to succede at life. Children are not all as wise as adults, and many allow education to slip by them because they do not have the wisdom to attempt to learn.

It does not matter whether or not it makes intellectuals feel good. What matters is that the educational system achieves its goals. The goals of the educational system are to produce as many educated students as is possible, and to offer children the best possible future for them.

I understand and embrace the idea that knowledge is its own end. However, I do not expect the whole world to agree with me. All I want is for every student to get as much as they can out of the educational system. If bribes are required for that, then so be it.

The other side of this is that offering large enough rewards to students of High School age might keep them from working, and therefore increase the amount of time they spend on homework.

Which, by the way, I needed to write an essay on what book I have read and why I would reccomend to a friend. I wrote about The Little Train That Could, and my friend? Whereyouthinkyougoing. I shit you not.Oh my God, you did what? Boy, just how cute are you? :eek: :p :fluffle:
Oh, no no! I used her real name. *nods*:eek:
To help her strengthen her self confedence. <.< >.>

So how come I haven't seen this essay yet? Way to bolster my self confidence. :rolleyes: (I love you anyway, of course).


Actual on-topic post coming up in a sec. :rolleyes:

In principle, I hold them to be a waste of time and resources, since the "incentives" most schools can offer will not motivate the average student, and thos who work will do do anyway. Equally, I object to offering a reward for an education, the results of which are an end in themselves. If people can't see that, they deserve to fail.

While this may make you feel like a special person, it is bad for wherever you live.

The better educated people are, the higher the standard of living. A good education should be foisted upon people using whatever means are available to entice those who can't at first understand the intangible benefits.

As was said above, there is a certain segment that will naturally succeed, a certain segment that will naturally fail, and a middle ground which can and should succeed, but for some reason or another needs extra motivation.

i'd have been more pissed off about the fact they sent a voucher rather than the incentive scheme as a whole. fuck that! i want cash!

The goal of the educational system is to produce educated students, not to produce "deserving" students. It is pure elitism to assume that only those who value knowledge for knowledge's sake deserve to succede at life. Children are not all as wise as adults, and many allow education to slip by them because they do not have the wisdom to attempt to learn.

It does not matter whether or not it makes intellectuals feel good. What matters is that the educational system achieves its goals. The goals of the educational system are to produce as many educated students as is possible, and to offer children the best possible future for them.

I understand and embrace the idea that knowledge is its own end. However, I do not expect the whole world to agree with me. All I want is for every student to get as much as they can out of the educational system. If bribes are required for that, then so be it.

The other side of this is that offering large enough rewards to students of High School age might keep them from working, and therefore increase the amount of time they spend on homework.

Quite correct, however, I did not specifically state that knowledge should be an end in itself. Whilst I would dearly love for all students to be motivated by purely academic considerations, I'm not quite that idealistic. However, how many genuinely "successful" people, as society measures success, have a poor level education?

Surely, those who fail to appreciate the necessity of working to secure a future, and to better themselves, are not likely to work in any case?

Quite correct, however, I did not specifically state that knowledge should be an end in itself. Whilst I would dearly love for all students to be motivated by purely academic considerations, I'm not quite that idealistic. However, how many genuinely "successful" people, as society measures success, have a poor level education?

Surely, those who fail to appreciate the necessity of working to secure a future, and to better themselves, are not likely to work in any case?

A lot of unfortunates are born to parents who are uneducated and do not understand the benefits of education.

People are to a pretty big extent products of their environment, so an otherwise capable person might never see firsthand that education is good both in itself and as an instrument of getting a better life.

One way of changing that environment is to provide tangible incentives for being educated. Remember, children do not think like adults, they are not as capable of realizing the long-term implications of things. Sometimes incentives in the short-term are necessary.

Because you stand to benefit tangibly from living in a generally better educated country, but are arguing that it should not be better educated, one has to conceive that you make these arguments to inflate your image of yourself as a special person. This isnt a sound basis for making public policy decisions.

Quite correct, however, I did not specifically state that knowledge should be an end in itself. Whilst I would dearly love for all students to be motivated by purely academic considerations, I'm not quite that idealistic. However, how many genuinely "successful" people, as society measures success, have a poor level education?

Some. Certainly there are sports players, musicians, and other entertainers of low educational level who are quite successful. However, I wouldn't say many. It is very difficult to live a successful life without having completed education through the age of 18 at the very least (this may be different under the U.K.'s educational system, so I'm being general).

In fact, if even 5% of students were motivated by this kind of program, it would be an economic boon to the nation that adopted it, and would pay for itself quickly.

Surely, those who fail to appreciate the necessity of working to secure a future, and to better themselves, are not likely to work in any case?

If we were all the people we acted like as children, the human race would have long since killed itself off. It is fair to assume that many people are not necessarily wise enough as children to truly see the end-results of their descisions; especially when those descisions draw from habits they've had since young child-hood. By offering the immediate reward that is visible and obvious to every student, they can be kept on the right path. It isn't so much that there aren't many hard working people with poor educations. Many members of the work corps are very hard workers dedicated to their jobs because they see the financial rewards of sucess, and pursue them.

Thank you for doing your best on the 11th Grade Writing PSSA!
Enjoy the enclosed movie gift card ($10.00)

We will see (you) they totally forgot to type "you") on Monday, March 12th for the 11th Grade Reading & Mathematics PSSA.

Please come rested & mentally prepared!!

Rewards and incentives are planned!
That is the first time I have ever heard of schools giving incentives to students, ever. And lo and behold, it gets worse:
Incentives are cool.. For example for the past 2 years as a sixth former the incentive for myself and thousands of other students is 30 GBP a week (roughly $60) for turning up to all lessons. It helped as others who would ussualy have skipped lessons stayed at school and worked hard. It's great.
Are you saying they pay you the equivalent of about $240 a month for not skipping classes???
You're a fucking student, getting your education for free. You're not supposed to be skipping classes in the first place!


I'm sorry, but to me this is totally insane. If I had a child and their school did that, I would be pissed. I mean, hello? You try and get it in their thick little heads that education is important in and of itself and the school comes running along and hands out movie passes? For a frigging essay writing assignment? (Now, I'm sure it was a fabulous essay, what with the subject matter :p, but come on).

When I was a kid, my parents wouldn't reward us for each good grade, the one thing we got were 10 bucks from my parents and grandparents at the end of the term if you had a good grade report. So while this is also obviously a "reward" for doing well, it's in no way an "incentive". 10 bucks bought a bit more then than it does now but it was nowhere near enough to get a kid to study all through the school year just to get it.


Bah, I don't even have good arguments. I never thought I would have to think about this because I never thought it could possibly happen. I just think it's completely fucked up.

While this may make you feel like a special person, it is bad for wherever you live.

The better educated people are, the higher the standard of living. A good education should be foisted upon people using whatever means are available to entice those who can't at first understand the intangible benefits.

As was said above, there is a certain segment that will naturally succeed, a certain segment that will naturally fail, and a middle ground which can and should succeed, but for some reason or another needs extra motivation.

The same argument, namely that the middle ground will benefit, was employed to dissolve grammar schools in the UK, and that has had no significant effect upon the academic merits of those leaving school. Quite simply, those in the middle ground are mediocre. If ludicrous resources are expended, they might attain the same as the higher tier of students, however, feasability dictates that one does not do so.

As for my feeling special, I'm sure you know me well enough to know my ego's quite fine thanks.;)

A lot of unfortunates are born to parents who are uneducated and do not understand the benefits of education.

People are to a pretty big extent products of their environment, so an otherwise capable person might never see firsthand that education is good both in itself and as an instrument of getting a better life.

One way of changing that environment is to provide tangible incentives for being educated. Remember, children do not think like adults, they are not as capable of realizing the long-term implications of things. Sometimes incentives in the short-term are necessary.

Because you stand to benefit tangibly from living in a generally better educated country, but are arguing that it should not be better educated, one has to conceive that you make these arguments to inflate your image of yourself as a special person. This isnt a sound basis for making public policy decisions.

Incentives are wrong, plain and simple. If the education system were fit for purpose, and provided course to meet all interests, the issue would be irrelevant, and it it herein that "public policy" should focus. Incentives for acheivement, granted by the school, rarely work, and are inevitably set too low to be of any merit, whereas general amelioration of education, and selective schools, do work.

You're a junior? Awesome! So am I!

JUNIORS FTW!!!! Class of '08 FTW!!!!

You're a junior? Awesome! So am I!

JUNIORS FTW!!!! Class of '08 FTW!!!!

Class 0'10 phails. All else is good.

its nice to be realized as having done hard work,Exactly. I was always insulted by the idea that I should work my tail off for FREE!

I'm all for so-called incentives, and it's darned well time the schools started to clue up.

As for the "intrinsic value of learning," I can see it NOW, but I didn't find what they taught in my school to be intrinsically valuable. It was only after I got OUT of high school, and no one was trying to force me to do it, that I saw value in learning for its own sake. Probably because 1) I could learn about stuff I actually gave a crap about, and 2) Nobody was trying to force me to do it anymore.

Once in college, it's the student's choice to be there, which makes it totally different as far as I'm concerned. There, my big incentive was that it's a waste of expensive tuition to NOT do well. Plus, the "signal to noise" ratio in higher education is a lot better than high school: Not nearly as many classes that are off-topic to the major area of interest.

As for this:
If you don't pass you won't get a good job and be deemed a failure.I think that commonly used threat is bull. Mainly because it presumes that such "job" is the only way to be successful. It's not! Plus, the wider world will never even see your transcript, much less pass a judgement based on it. In fact, the jobs around here only care about the degree you've earned--not your actual grades. If the grades were good enough to get the required piece of paper, that'll do.

(Of course, I DO consider self-employment to be the preferable route to success in any case. Actually wanting to slave away for someone else, at any level, strikes me as simply masochistic.)

Some. Certainly there are sports players, musicians, and other entertainers of low educational level who are quite successful. However, I wouldn't say many. It is very difficult to live a successful life without having completed education through the age of 18 at the very least (this may be different under the U.K.'s educational system, so I'm being general).

In fact, if even 5% of students were motivated by this kind of program, it would be an economic boon to the nation that adopted it, and would pay for itself quickly.



If we were all the people we acted like as children, the human race would have long since killed itself off. It is fair to assume that many people are not necessarily wise enough as children to truly see the end-results of their descisions; especially when those descisions draw from habits they've had since young child-hood. By offering the immediate reward that is visible and obvious to every student, they can be kept on the right path. It isn't so much that there aren't many hard working people with poor educations. Many members of the work corps are very hard workers dedicated to their jobs because they see the financial rewards of sucess, and pursue them.


I'm sorry, but I've worked hard, when necessary, for years to ensure I'm rich enough not to give a fuck when I'm middle aged. Most of those around me have as well. I do, naturally, appreciate that grammar school is far from representative of the whole, however, the fact stands that, even in "poor" schools, those who genuinely want to achieve will do so. Whilst one should not have to live with irredemable childhood mistakes provided they are avoidable, personal responsibility in education remains paramount, and one should always consider this.

in high school Incentives where given to the misfits in my year
they got mac's once a week and a play station they could play on at lunch

Who wants to work hard without any immediate reward? The very idea is preposterous! :p

Who said its about the students? Maybe the school have a pact with the movie theathers, because every single student that goes there to see the movies will buy popcorn/sodas and other stuff.

Maybe the school director is banging the movie theater owner and they came with this nice marketing move.

Its all about money, who cares about kids?

See? We're teaching you how to be cynical too! :)