NationStates Jolt Archive

Yeah, I know I come off as knowing everything about everything at times, but I really don't, and there are times when I need information especially from an opposing prespective.

If I were asked to name the leading conservative voices from media, politics, and punditry, I could rattle off a long list of names. I could even get down into second and third tier, and these would be people who regularly appear on tv shows, who have newspaper columns, and who are involved in the highest places of government. It would include people like Limbaugh, William Kristol, Condoleeza Rice, Dick Cheney, O'Reilly, Dinesh D'Souza, Ann Coulter, Mitt Romney. You get the idea.

So here's what I want to know. Who do the right, the American conservatives, think are the leading voices of American liberalism from media, politics and punditry?

And I'm looking for names here, not institutions--you'll notice I left Fox News off my list because I don't want to get into yet another "liberal media" argument. I'm also staying away from think tanks, because I'd imagine most people couldn't tell the difference between the Hoover Institute, Brookings, and AEI if you forced them at gunpoint.

So who does the right consider to be the faces of the left? I can make some guesses, but that's it--just guesses.

Face of the left?

http://www.openwebletter.com/letter/image_2/11/bozo-medium.jpg

Arianna Huffington.
George Soros.

Keith Olbermann
Walter Cronkite (retired, but still noisy)
Helen Thomas
Al Franken (and everyone still on Air America)
Everyone on the Pacifica Radio Network
Most of the people at MSNBC (according to this http://newsbusters.org/node/10857)

Eason Jordan
The editors of the New York Times
Amy Goodman (on radio)
Most of the staff of National Public Radio

I could go on. In reality, it is too many people to name.

If I was to list the left-leaning bloggers, we would be here forever.

Yeah, I know I come off as knowing everything about everything at times, but I really don't, and there are times when I need information especially from an opposing prespective.

If I were asked to name the leading conservative voices from media, politics, and punditry, I could rattle off a long list of names. I could even get down into second and third tier, and these would be people who regularly appear on tv shows, who have newspaper columns, and who are involved in the highest places of government. It would include people like Limbaugh, William Kristol, Condoleeza Rice, Dick Cheney, O'Reilly, Dinesh D'Souza, Ann Coulter, Mitt Romney. You get the idea.

So here's what I want to know. Who do the right, the American conservatives, think are the leading voices of American liberalism from media, politics and punditry?

And I'm looking for names here, not institutions--you'll notice I left Fox News off my list because I don't want to get into yet another "liberal media" argument. I'm also staying away from think tanks, because I'd imagine most people couldn't tell the difference between the Hoover Institute, Brookings, and AEI if you forced them at gunpoint.

So who does the right consider to be the faces of the left? I can make some guesses, but that's it--just guesses.

I'd say:

Al Franken
Hillary Clinton
Al Sharpton
Jesse Jackson
Al Gore
Katie Courric
Wolf Blitzer
Phil Donahue

prolly some more but those were the quickest to come to mind

Yeah, I know I come off as knowing everything about everything at times

No, you don't.

No, you don't.

Yes he does.

Yes he does.

No, he's right, it's Fass' job to come off as if he knows everything about everything...and to tell you all about it while looking sternly down his nose...

Yeah, I know I come off as thinking I know everything about everything at times...

Fixed. :p

No, he's right, it's Fass' job to come off as if he knows everything about everything...and to tell you all about it while looking sternly down his nose...

Oh, sorry, I thought at least one American could do that...

I'm surprised no one listed Bill Moyers _OR_ Dan Rather. Peas in a pod, if you ask me.

Others?
Howard Dean -- Chairman of the DNC has to be included.
Nancy Pelosi -- She's where much of the party would like to go -- Socialist.

Molly Ivins was a great read.

I'm surprised no one listed Bill Moyers _OR_ Dan Rather. Peas in a pod, if you ask me.

Others?
Howard Dean -- Chairman of the DNC has to be included.
Nancy Pelosi -- She's where much of the party would like to go -- Socialist.

Molly Ivins was a great read.

Don't forget Barbara Streisand, Susan Sarandon, the entire case of West Wing, Sean Penn, George Clooney, and most of Hollywood...

If I was to list the left-leaning bloggers, we would be here forever.

Yeah, but which ones do you guys look at as representative of the left in general. This is what I'm looking for--when you guys think "left-wing," who are you thinking about?

Don't forget Barbara Streisand, Susan Sarandon, the entire case of West Wing, Sean Penn, George Clooney, and most of Hollywood...
I don't pay attention to most of Hollywood. Alec Baldwin was the only one that ever really pissed me off. That was during the Clinton impeachment when he advocated going to Henry Hyde's house and killing him and his family. I thought that went a little over the line.

Yeah, but which ones do you guys look at as representative of the left in general. This is what I'm looking for--when you guys think "left-wing," who are you thinking about?

Well, I do make a major distinction between "left-wing" in the true sense (i.e., socialist or Communist, or more in the European sense of the word).

Then there are the idiots that pass for the "left" here in the US.

We could start with the editorial staffs and reporters for most of the major US newspapers. Most of the major US news channels (except Fox).

Virtually every reporter, Hollywood celebrity, and popular singer/band member.

Well, I do make a major distinction between "left-wing" in the true sense (i.e., socialist or Communist, or more in the European sense of the word).

Then there are the idiots that pass for the "left" here in the US.

We could start with the editorial staffs and reporters for most of the major US newspapers. Most of the major US news channels (except Fox).

Virtually every reporter, Hollywood celebrity, and popular singer/band member.

So you really believe that the editorial staffs and reporters of most of the major US newspapers and the major news channels are left-wing? You honestly believe that? You're not just saying it to try to score points? I have seriously underestimated your intelligence level then.

Yeah, but which ones do you guys look at as representative of the left in general. This is what I'm looking for--when you guys think "left-wing," who are you thinking about?
I got enough on the network news. I quit watching ABC,CBS, CNN, and NBC news programs. Reading the newspapers (Atlanta Journal and WSJ) is about all I need to stay on top of world events and local stuff, too. So I guess the real answer is I don't care who represents liberal thought, except at the policy-making levels.

Al Franken, Randi Rhoades(sp?), and the few that have made any inroads on broadcasting are clowns. So I ignore them, too. Most have so much hatred of the Bush administration that they can't push any other message.

There are studies that confirm it.

Look here:

http://www.polisci.ucla.edu/faculty/groseclose/Media.Bias.8.htm

http://faculty.chicagogsb.edu/matthew.gentzkow/research/biasmeas111306.pdf

There are many more.

You surprise me, in that you just "feel" that there's no bias. Where I "know" there is.
Not that pathetic study again. The methodology of that UCLA study is so flawed it's fucking pathetic. You don't know shit.

So you really believe that the editorial staffs and reporters of most of the major US newspapers and the major news channels are left-wing? You honestly believe that? You're not just saying it to try to score points? I have seriously underestimated your intelligence level then.

There are studies that confirm it.

Look here:

http://www.polisci.ucla.edu/faculty/groseclose/Media.Bias.8.htm

http://faculty.chicagogsb.edu/matthew.gentzkow/research/biasmeas111306.pdf

There are many more.

You surprise me, in that you just "feel" that there's no bias. Where I "know" there is.

Not that pathetic study again. The methodology of that UCLA study is so flawed it's fucking pathetic. You don't know shit.

It's not the only one.

There are many, many studies that confirm it.

Walter Cronkite even admitted it.

What more do you want, an official declaration from each paper?

In terms of people who actually get widely listened to, rather than just talk:

Politics:
Al Gore
Bill Clinton
Howard Dean
George Soros (at least his money is listened to)
- liberals don't have a cabinet at the moment, so that limits the ammount that the two can be compared

Media
the 60 Minutes crew
Seymore Hersh

Pundits
Closest thing to a liberal rush limbaugh is probably the Daily Show




The list is pretty short.

It's not the only one.

There are many, many studies that confirm it.

Walter Cronkite even admitted it.

What more do you want, an official declaration from each paper?

Having cited a very flawed study and not known or acknowledged that it was flawed, you are absolutely not to be trusted when you claim without providing any evidence that there are "many many studies that confirm it."

Citations?

Having cited a very flawed study and not known or acknowledged that it was flawed, you are absolutely not to be trusted when you claim without providing any evidence that there are "many many studies that confirm it."

Citations?

I guess you're ignoring the second study, which no one said anything about.

You, like the Nazz, aren't willing to believe there is bias - period. I bet that even if the major news outlets publicly admitted it in official statements, you'll say, "they were forced by Republicans to say that... there isn't any bias".

I guess you're ignoring the second study, which no one said anything about.

You, like the Nazz, aren't willing to believe there is bias - period. I bet that even if the major news outlets publicly admitted it in official statements, you'll say, "they were forced by Republicans to say that... there isn't any bias".

Oh, there's bias, but it's a corporate bias, not a liberal one. And your studies are still shit.

And this is even more frustrating because I specifically asked that this thread not devolve into this field of discussion, and yet you insist, Eve Online/Deep Kimchi. Leave it alone already.

Oh, there's bias, but it's a corporate bias, not a liberal one. And your studies are still shit.

And this is even more frustrating because I specifically asked that this thread not devolve into this field of discussion, and yet you insist, Eve Online/Deep Kimchi. Leave it alone already.

Then why did you ask us to name people?

And I'm not DK.

Oh, there's bias, but it's a corporate bias, not a liberal one.

Ah, more "evil corporations" crap. Wonderful. :rolleyes:

Then why did you ask us to name people?

And I'm not DK.

I asked for who people on the right thought the spokespeople for the left were. Journalists and media organizations don't count. That's why I left Fox News out of my list above, and why I agree that Al Franken and Randi Rhodes qualify. But I'm not going to get into another of these bullshit "liberal media" discussions. There have been threads upon threads upon it, and that's not what I'm interested in.

I guess you're ignoring the second study, which no one said anything about.

You, like the Nazz, aren't willing to believe there is bias - period. I bet that even if the major news outlets publicly admitted it in official statements, you'll say, "they were forced by Republicans to say that... there isn't any bias".

WHen I read the second study, the one from chicago, I couldnt help but notice that in their examples of how they computed 'left of center' slant, they look for terms like "estate tax" and "war in iraq."

The problem here is the same one that most "liberal media" witch hunters get hung up on: the terminology of the 'left' is less political than factually accurate.

Calling the war in iraq "the war on terror" is a political assertion that it is indeed part of our war against terrorism, which is far from factually clear.

Calling the estate tax - which has always been called the estate tax, because it is a tax on what in the law is called an 'estate' - is simple and factual, calling it the "death tax" is a political, persuasive statement.

When the witch hunters "feel" that there is 'liberal bias,' they end up being forced to internalize the rhetoric of the republicans instead of the more factual, simple language used by serious journalists and 'left wing' politicians.

Language that isnt clearly marked republican political rhetoric is not "liberally biased" by default.

ETA
I've said my peace on this subject, and won't assist eve in doing further graffiti to this thread.

WHen I read the second study, the one from chicago, I couldnt help but notice that in their examples of how they computed 'left of center' slant, they look for terms like "estate tax" and "war in iraq."

The problem here is the same one that most "liberal media" witch hunters get hung up on: the terminology of the 'left' is less political than factually accurate.

Calling the war in iraq "the war on terror" is a political assertion that it is indeed part of our war against terrorism, which is far from factually clear.

Calling the estate tax - which has always been called the estate tax, because it is a tax on what in the law is called an 'estate' - is simple and factual, calling it the "death tax" is a political, persuasive statement.

When the witch hunters "feel" that there is 'liberal bias,' they end up being forced to internalize the rhetoric of the republicans instead of the more factual, simple language used by serious journalists and 'left wing' politicians.

Language that isnt clearly marked republican political rhetoric is not "liberally biased" by default.

Have to pick terms somewhere. I suppose that no matter what terms were picked, you would say they were wrong, because you believe there's no bias.

Even when Walter Cronkite admitted that he, and everyone at CBS, is biased.

Even when Walter Cronkite admitted that he, and everyone at CBS, is biased.
ZOMG!!!1111 Humans are biased!!!

Egads! Next you’ll be telling us we can hold opinions.

I don't pay attention to most of Hollywood. Alec Baldwin was the only one that ever really pissed me off. That was during the Clinton impeachment when he advocated going to Henry Hyde's house and killing him and his family. I thought that went a little over the line.

The irony of course being that it was bin laden who came into america's house and killed 3000 of our family because the republicans insisted on wasting time and money persecuting clinton that could and should instead of been used to prevent 9/11.

The Nazz doesn't believe in teh bias. He also believes that Republicans have a hive mind.And Eve Online believes Hillary Clinton is an alien who turned Vince Foster into a zombie in Fort Marcy Park. Look! We can both make shit up about each other! :rolleyes:

ZOMG!!!1111 Humans are biased!!!

Egads! Next you’ll be telling us we can hold opinions.

The Nazz doesn't believe in teh bias. He also believes that Republicans have a hive mind.

The irony of course being that it was bin laden who came into america's house and killed 3000 of our family because the republicans insisted on wasting time and money persecuting clinton that could and should instead of been used to prevent 9/11.

O RLY?

He would have spent the time on more blowjobs.

Jon Stewart
Stephen Colbert

If FOX is considered news, they are too. And they are probably considered left wing cuz they're funny.