NationStates Jolt Archive

found this on the interwebs, thougt it was funny, so posted it here. probably old, but it is very, very funny :p






How to argue effectively

I argue very well. Ask any of my remaining friends. I can win an argument on any topic, against any opponent. People know this and steer clear of me at parties. Often, as a sign of their great respect, they don't even invite me. You too can win arguments. Simply follow these rules:


# Drink liquor.

Suppose you are at a party and some hotshot intellectual is expounding on the economy of Peru, a subject you know nothing about.

If you're drinking some health-fanatic drink like grapefruit juice, you'll hang back, afraid to display your ignorance, while the hotshot enthralls your date.

But if you drink several large martinis, you'll discover you have STRONG VIEWS about the Peruvian economy. You'll be a WEALTH of information. You'll argue forcefully, offering searing insights and possibly upsetting furniture. People will be impressed. Some may leave the room.


# Make things up.

Suppose, in the Peruvian economy argument, you are trying to prove that Peruvians are underpaid, a position you base solely on the fact that YOU are underpaid, and you'll be damned if you're going to let a bunch of Peruvians be better off. DON'T say: "I think Peruvians are underpaid." Say instead: "The average Peruvian's salary in 1981 dollars adjusted for the revised tax base is $1,452.81 per annum, which is $836.07 before the mean gross poverty level."

NOTE: Always make up exact figures.

If an opponent asks you where you got your information, make THAT up too. Say: "This information comes from Dr. Hovel T. Moon's study for the Buford Commission published on May 9, 1982. Didn't you read it?" Say this in the same tone of voice you would use to say, "You left your soiled underwear in my bathroom."

Use meaningless but weighty-sounding words and phrases.

Memorize this list:

* Let me put it this way
* In terms of
* Vis-a-vis
* Per se
* As it were
* Qua
* So to speak

You should also memorize some Latin abbreviations such as "Q.E.D.", "e.g.", and "i.e." These are all short for "I speak Latin, and you don't."

Here's how to use these words and phrases. Suppose you want to say, "Peruvians would like to order appetizers more often, but they don't have enough money." You never win arguments talking like that. But you WILL win if you say, "Let me put it this way. In terms of appetizers vis-a-vis Peruvians qua Peruvians, they would like to order them more often, so to speak, but they do not have enough money per se, as it were. Q.E.D."

Only a fool would challenge that statement.


# Use snappy and irrelevant comebacks.

You need an arsenal of all-purpose irrelevant phrases to fire back at your opponents when they make valid points. The best are:

* You're begging the question.
* You're being defensive.
* Don't compare apples to oranges.
* What are your parameters?

This last one is especially valuable. Nobody (other than engineers and policy wonks) has the vaguest idea what "parameters" means. Don't forget the classic: YOU'RE SO LINEAR.

Here's how to use your comebacks:

You say: As Abraham Lincoln said in 1873...
Your opponent says: Lincoln died in 1865.
You say: You're begging the question.

You say: Liberians, like most Asians...
Your opponent says: Liberia is in Africa.
You say: You're being defensive.


# Compare your opponent to Adolf Hitler.

This is your heavy artillery, for when your opponent is obviously right and you are spectacularly wrong. Bring Hitler up subtly. Say, "That sounds suspiciously like something Adolf Hitler might say," or "You certainly do remind me of Adolf Hitler."

lol I love it. :D

But the sad thing is I can recognise a lot of that being used here in NSG. :(

When I drink, I get really pissed off at aliens, the X-men and Philip Seymour Hoffman. Fucking mutants.

found this on the interwebs, thougt it was funny, so posted it here. probably old, but it is very, very funny :p

How to argue effectively

I argue very well. Ask any of my remaining friends. I can win an argument on any topic, against any opponent. People know this and steer clear of me at parties. Often, as a sign of their great respect, they don't even invite me. You too can win arguments. Simply follow these rules:


# Drink liquor.

Suppose you are at a party and some hotshot intellectual is expounding on the economy of Peru, a subject you know nothing about.

If you're drinking some health-fanatic drink like grapefruit juice, you'll hang back, afraid to display your ignorance, while the hotshot enthralls your date.

But if you drink several large martinis, you'll discover you have STRONG VIEWS about the Peruvian economy. You'll be a WEALTH of information. You'll argue forcefully, offering searing insights and possibly upsetting furniture. People will be impressed. Some may leave the room.


# Make things up.

Suppose, in the Peruvian economy argument, you are trying to prove that Peruvians are underpaid, a position you base solely on the fact that YOU are underpaid, and you'll be damned if you're going to let a bunch of Peruvians be better off. DON'T say: "I think Peruvians are underpaid." Say instead: "The average Peruvian's salary in 1981 dollars adjusted for the revised tax base is $1,452.81 per annum, which is $836.07 before the mean gross poverty level."

NOTE: Always make up exact figures.

If an opponent asks you where you got your information, make THAT up too. Say: "This information comes from Dr. Hovel T. Moon's study for the Buford Commission published on May 9, 1982. Didn't you read it?" Say this in the same tone of voice you would use to say, "You left your soiled underwear in my bathroom."

Use meaningless but weighty-sounding words and phrases.

Memorize this list:

* Let me put it this way
* In terms of
* Vis-a-vis
* Per se
* As it were
* Qua
* So to speak

You should also memorize some Latin abbreviations such as "Q.E.D.", "e.g.", and "i.e." These are all short for "I speak Latin, and you don't."

Here's how to use these words and phrases. Suppose you want to say, "Peruvians would like to order appetizers more often, but they don't have enough money." You never win arguments talking like that. But you WILL win if you say, "Let me put it this way. In terms of appetizers vis-a-vis Peruvians qua Peruvians, they would like to order them more often, so to speak, but they do not have enough money per se, as it were. Q.E.D."

Only a fool would challenge that statement.


# Use snappy and irrelevant comebacks.

You need an arsenal of all-purpose irrelevant phrases to fire back at your opponents when they make valid points. The best are:

* You're begging the question.
* You're being defensive.
* Don't compare apples to oranges.
* What are your parameters?

This last one is especially valuable. Nobody (other than engineers and policy wonks) has the vaguest idea what "parameters" means. Don't forget the classic: YOU'RE SO LINEAR.

Here's how to use your comebacks:

You say: As Abraham Lincoln said in 1873...
Your opponent says: Lincoln died in 1865.
You say: You're begging the question.

You say: Liberians, like most Asians...
Your opponent says: Liberia is in Africa.
You say: You're being defensive.


# Compare your opponent to Adolf Hitler.

This is your heavy artillery, for when your opponent is obviously right and you are spectacularly wrong. Bring Hitler up subtly. Say, "That sounds suspiciously like something Adolf Hitler might say," or "You certainly do remind me of Adolf Hitler."

Lolz.

Shit, they're giving away all the tricks....

When I drink, I get really pissed off at aliens, the X-men and Philip Seymour Hoffman. Fucking mutants.

Let me put it this way, nation states is a bastion proper debating. Mr. Hitler.

#1 Rule of Winning Arguements...

Always pack heat.

Philip Seymour Hoffman

:confused:

:confused:
:rolleyes: Agree.

When I drink, I get really pissed off at aliens,
Hey, aliens are purity, remember? We're the mutants.

http://nounouss.club.fr/Grammaire/xfiles/images/1X23cap106.jpg

As for Seymour Hoffman ... well, that one i have to side with you on.

I'm surprised the whole Nazi/Hitler thing didn't appear in the piece earlier (what worries me is that we'll still be making Nazi analogies well into the third millennium, even as atrocities continue to occur around us :rolleyes: ). Otherwise, bravo.

Another good way to extricate oneself from a losing argument is to say in your most patronising voice, "Well, I wouldn't expect you to understand" and then smirk at them.

But I wouldn't expect you lot to understand this.

don't forget, you can also bring renewed strength to your argument merely by making it again at a slightly later time. so if you ever find yourself completely shouted down simply leave the room for a minute or two, and then come back and start up again as if you never left.

~snip~

Nice one. When Melkor gets back here, we should try those on him.

Very funny, but the worst thing is that it is all so terribly true. I'm about the best debater on serious subjects in my class at school, but now my secrets are revealed!

If all else fails, you can pull a Fass on them and focus solely on their grammar and not their argument.

Once they make a grammtical era - say splitting an infinitive or ending a sentence with a proposition (or even just making a spelling misteak) - you can deride them loudly and then snootily declare that there's no point debating with someone who is so inept in the English language basics they're obviously also incapable of higher-level functioning and genuine interesting povs.
From then on, every time they try to bring a subject up, just smirk condescending at them for a few seconds before ignoring them once more.

This is very effective if you cannot actually counter their arguments.

Old but good. I seem to remember maybe reading that in an article or book or something, pre-dating the internet maybe? Where's it from?

You can tell it's old because it doesn't even mention Godwin's Law or other trendy internet bullshit.

hmmm.......

A fairly accurate reflection of NSG practice, especially the last point.

Old but good. I seem to remember maybe reading that in an article or book or something, pre-dating the internet maybe? Where's it from?

You can tell it's old because it doesn't even mention Godwin's Law or other trendy internet bullshit.
i can't remember... i just stumbled on (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stumbleupon) it

Another good way to extricate oneself from a losing argument is to say in your most patronising voice, "Well, I wouldn't expect you to understand" and then smirk at them.

But I wouldn't expect you lot to understand this.

lol, reminds me of this old classic :D

GUARANTEED WAYS TO END ANY ARGUMENT
10. Pretend to die
9. Suddenly lunge at the other person, making big snapping motions with your arms, like a shark’s mouth :p
8. Start spinning around in a corner very fast shouting “Out. Of. Con. Trol” in a Dalek-like voice.
7. Baffle them with irrelevant pronouncements like “Yeah, but that’s like comparing Egyptians to paper bags” and “Yeah, but you might as well look for lost socks on the moon…”
6. Every time they go to speak start mouthing the theme tune to Starsky And Hutch, getting louder whenever they tell you to stop.
5. Start crying and say you’re really sorry, but it’s the anniversary of your granddad’s death, and that the other person suddenly reminded you of him.
4. And then add that your granddad used to sexually abuse you.
3. Really, really angrily start agreeing with them.
2. Pull out a gun and shoot yourself in the leg.
1. Suddenly announce that you’re gay.

http://www.bubblegun.com/topten/71to80.html

Something similar: http://www.ninjapirate.com/logic.html

Best part:
Note: Make sure to use proper word placement: "Hey homo, I f*cked your mother." is a very strong and stable argument. "Hey Mother, I f*cked a homo." is not.

This makes me laugh :D

We should also discuss how to lose an argument.

There are number of people here who are adept at this.

If all else fails, you can pull a Fass on them and focus solely on their grammar and not their argument.

Once they make a grammtical era - say splitting an infinitive or ending a sentence with a proposition (or even just making a spelling misteak) - you can deride them loudly and then snootily declare that there's no point debating with someone who is so inept in the English language basics they're obviously also incapable of higher-level functioning and genuine interesting povs.
From then on, every time they try to bring a subject up, just smirk condescending at them for a few seconds before ignoring them once more.

This is very effective if you cannot actually counter their arguments.

I love that when i read this because it really points to the other persons lack of any arguement at all.

If all else fails, you can pull a Fass on them and focus solely on their grammar and not their argument.

And if that fails, you can pull a Demented Hamsters, as it were, and make an attempt at an ad hominem by bitterly (very pitifully so at that) accusing the other side of not being able to focus on mocking you for your horrendous grammar and crushing your habitually feeble arguments at the same time, using the former to pretend away the latter and thus think yourself clearly have shown to the other people in the thread, the peanut gallery who are as easily distracted as you are, that the other person is a big, old, bed-wetting doodie head, because if you can't win the argument, you might as well try to get the mob with you, because as we all know what matters isn't being "right" or "wrong" in your statements, it's being popular with the mindless masses that counts.

Old but good. I seem to remember maybe reading that in an article or book or something, pre-dating the internet maybe? Where's it from?

You can tell it's old because it doesn't even mention Godwin's Law or other trendy internet bullshit.

I suspect that it's a Dave Barry snippet. At least, I've seen the line "I can win an argument on any topic, against any opponent. People know this, and steer clear of me at parties. Often, as a sign of their great respect, they don't even invite me" attributed to him

This is my school on the methods of argument http://uncyclopedia.org/wiki/Worst_100_Ways_to_Win_an_Argument. All of them guaranteed to work

If all else fails, you can pull a Fass on them and focus solely on their grammar and not their argument.

Once they make a grammtical era - say splitting an infinitive or ending a sentence with a proposition (or even just making a spelling misteak) - you can deride them loudly and then snootily declare that there's no point debating with someone who is so inept in the English language basics they're obviously also incapable of higher-level functioning and genuine interesting povs.
From then on, every time they try to bring a subject up, just smirk condescending at them for a few seconds before ignoring them once more.

This is very effective if you cannot actually counter their arguments.

Sounds supiciously like me...

Ilaer

You can tell it's old because it doesn't even mention Godwin's Law or other trendy internet bullshit.

godwin's law was old when i first started hanging out on usenet in the second half of the 90s

We should also discuss how to lose an argument.

There are number of people here who are adept at this.

in bizarro world, winning is losing and losing is winning.

because as we all know what matters isn't being "right" or "wrong" in your statements, it's being popular with the mindless masses that counts.

It works for politicians...

damnit, i so should have titled this thread How To Master Debate :( :p

YOU CAN ALWAYS TALK IN ALL CAPS. IT GETS YOUR POINT ACROSS MORE CLEARLY.
damnit, i so should have titled this thread How To Master Debate
Nudge nudge, wink wink, know what I mean, know what I mean, say no more, say no more! A nod’s as good as a wink to a blind bat!