NationStates Jolt Archive

Yeah, advocates for the blind say they are too quiet for blind people to hear and should be given a noise. I think this is utterly ridiculous. No matter what you do, someone will complain. This is a non-issue. Blind people should keep to the sidewalks, go with a friend, or just stay at home. If we keep making allowances for every health issue, we'll turn into a very scary society.

Link (http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20070214/ts_alt_afp/usautohybridpedestriansaccident_070214034245)

WASHINGTON (AFP) - An association of blind Americans has warned that cars with hybrid engines using electricy and fuel are dangerously too quiet for pedestrians.

The National Federation of the Blind (NFB) said hybrid cars pose a risk to the blind, children, the elderly, cyclists and distracted pedestrians.

The group said it conducted tests with blind people.

"We had the car drive by in different situations, to see wether or not people could hear it and use the sound of the car to safely cross the street, and they could not. The car was just silent," NFB spokesman John Pare told AFP.

Pare said NFB does not want to add to noise pollution, but hybrid cars should not be less noisy than other cars.

Chris Danielsen, a 36-year-old NFB member, said up to 30 people took part in tests on a side street and in an alleyway with a Toyota Prius and a Honda Civic.

"We all stood on the side of the street and the idea was to raise your hand as you heard the car approach," Danielsen said.

"We generally couldn't sense that it was there right in front of us, which of course, if we had been standing in the road, would have been running right over us," he said.

"By the time anybody detected it, if we had actually been standing in the road, it would have taken out three or four people."

Barbara Pries, a member of NFB's pedestrian security committee, said no blind person has been killed by a hybrid car but some have reported having near accidents.

"It's just a matter of time before people are going to get injured and killed," she said.

Nearly 4,900 pedestrians were killed in road accidents in the United Stats in 2005, according the government figures.

NFB said it contacted Toyota, Honda and Ford in vain to ask that a noise or signal could be added to their hybrids.

Toyota representatives said there were no current plans to change its hybrid but that it was looking into improving pedestrian safety.

"We are aware of this issue and studying a way to improve pedestrian safety. It's important that the solution doesn't add to noise pollution but is good for pedestrians," said Toyota spokeswoman Martha Voss.

But another Toyota spokesman, Xavier Dominici, said the trend was toward quieter cars and that people should start getting used to them.

"There is a lot of ambient noise and the trends toward quiet powertrains in all vehicle has raised the need for additional caution to be exercised by pedestrians and drivers as well," he said.

"Part of it is also acclimating your ear to that noise. Frankly the sound of an automobile is changing as more quiet powertrains and hybrid vehicles come to dominate the market," he said.

I have to admit, this is clever. Can't argue with the fuel efficiency, they're getting more powerful, so you can't call them toy cars with as much gusto as before, what to do, what to do? Ah, I have it, they're too quiet! That's it, yeah, too quiet, you could get run over by a hybrid car because you won't hear it coming. Especially if you have that damn iPod thing plugged in and you're just groovin' down the street and go to cross, and wham! there's hamburger all over the road.

:D

Hybrids make lots of noise... since when they were uber quiet?

EDIT: Sorry. I thought it was about the drivers complaining.
(But a CD with engine noise on it.)
It still seems a little far fetched.

But a CD with engine noise on it.

That's a good idea. And one of those horns that goes "AhOOOOgah! AhOOOOgah!" like they had back in the 1920s. And sensors on each corner to sound the horn as the vehicle approaches the intersection.

Well then couldn't they make a crosswalk signal that makes a recognizable noise when you can or cannot walk? Oh, wait blind-deafs.... well couldn't they make a device that pokes you when you are allowed to walk? Oh, wait....Sexual harassment.....Well, I'm out of ideas....

Well then couldn't they make a crosswalk signal that makes a recognizable noise when you can or cannot walk? Oh, wait blind-deafs.... well couldn't they make a device that pokes you when you are allowed to walk? Oh, wait....Sexual harassment.....Well, I'm out of ideas....

How about speakers on the corners that play a recording, in a nice sultry voice, "The light is red, please wait. The light is red, please wait. You may walk now. You may walk now."

Need flying cars... or teleportation. Or pretty much anything that does away with roads.

Yeah, advocates for the blind say they are too quiet for blind people to hear and should be given a noise. I think this is utterly ridiculous. No matter what you do, someone will complain. This is a non-issue. Blind people should keep to the sidewalks, go with a friend, or just stay at home. If we keep making allowances for every health issue, we'll turn into a very scary society.

Link (http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20070214/ts_alt_afp/usautohybridpedestriansaccident_070214034245)

Feh. That's BS.

Not at all, we shall just have to limit them to 4 miles per hour and have a man walking 20 paces in front carrying a red flag to warn people that a vehichle is approaching.

Not at all, we shall just have to limit them to 4 miles per hour and have a man walking 20 paces in front carrying a red flag to warn people that a vehichle is approaching.

This won't help the blind as much. Maybe he should shout "Make way!"

Yeah, advocates for the blind say they are too quiet for blind people to hear and should be given a noise. I think this is utterly ridiculous. No matter what you do, someone will complain. This is a non-issue. Blind people should keep to the sidewalks, go with a friend, or just stay at home. If we keep making allowances for every health issue, we'll turn into a very scary society.

Link (http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20070214/ts_alt_afp/usautohybridpedestriansaccident_070214034245)

Blind people have the same rights you do. Demanding that they limit their freedom so that people can drive cars is insulting to blind people. Not to mention that the article also references cyclists, children, and the elderly. I will never understand why some people think that their right to drive is more important than other people's right to safety and movement.

How hard can it be to install a simple whistle on the car that gets louder as more air blows through it? Make it standard on all electric cars. Then blind people can cross the street safely.

Not at all, we shall just have to limit them to 4 miles per hour and have a man walking 20 paces in front carrying a red flag to warn people that a vehichle is approaching.

That's good, too. It will provide employment and exercise for millions of people.

PROTIP: If you're driving a car, it's your responsibility to keep an eye out for pedestrians, not your car's engine.

Problem solved.

PROTIP: If you're driving a car, it's your responsibility to keep an eye out for pedestrians, not your car's engine.

Problem solved.

Yeah, isn't there a law allowing blind people right of way across streets? White Cane Law or something like that?

Yeah, isn't there a law allowing blind people right of way across streets? White Cane Law or something like that?

Technically, all pedestrians have right of way, especially the blind and other disabled. There's no option; if someone is crossing, you've got to stop.

Technically, all pedestrians have right of way, especially the blind and other disabled. There's no option; if someone is crossing, you've got to stop.

Or speed up to get out of the way faster. That's how we'd do it in the US. :rolleyes: Or maybe we could just cut the road maintenance budget to 10% of what is now, the roads will disintegrate and cars will be forced to drive very, very slowly.

Technically, all pedestrians have right of way, especially the blind and other disabled. There's no option; if someone is crossing, you've got to stop.

Even when the crosswalk sign is red?

Or speed up to get out of the way faster. That's how we'd do it in the US. :rolleyes: Or maybe we could just cut the road maintenance budget to 10% of what is now, the roads will disintegrate and cars will be forced to drive very, very slowly.

Thats what Michigan does...

Serious answer now :

WASHINGTON (AFP) - An association of blind Americans has warned that cars with hybrid engines using electricy and fuel are dangerously too quiet for pedestrians.

The National Federation of the Blind (NFB) said hybrid cars pose a risk to the blind, children, the elderly, cyclists and distracted pedestrians.

The group said it conducted tests with blind people.

"We had the car drive by in different situations, to see wether or not people could hear it and use the sound of the car to safely cross the street, and they could not. The car was just silent," NFB spokesman John Pare told AFP.

Pare said NFB does not want to add to noise pollution, but hybrid cars should not be less noisy than other cars.

Chris Danielsen, a 36-year-old NFB member, said up to 30 people took part in tests on a side street and in an alleyway with a Toyota Prius and a Honda Civic.

"We all stood on the side of the street and the idea was to raise your hand as you heard the car approach," Danielsen said.

"We generally couldn't sense that it was there right in front of us, which of course, if we had been standing in the road, would have been running right over us," he said.

"By the time anybody detected it, if we had actually been standing in the road, it would have taken out three or four people."
Barbara Pries, a member of NFB's pedestrian security committee, said no blind person has been killed by a hybrid car but some have reported having near accidents.

"It's just a matter of time before people are going to get injured and killed," she said.

Nearly 4,900 pedestrians were killed in road accidents in the United Stats in 2005, according the government figures.

NFB said it contacted Toyota, Honda and Ford in vain to ask that a noise or signal could be added to their hybrids.

Toyota representatives said there were no current plans to change its hybrid but that it was looking into improving pedestrian safety.

"We are aware of this issue and studying a way to improve pedestrian safety. It's important that the solution doesn't add to noise pollution but is good for pedestrians," said Toyota spokeswoman Martha Voss.

But another Toyota spokesman, Xavier Dominici, said the trend was toward quieter cars and that people should start getting used to them.

"There is a lot of ambient noise and the trends toward quiet powertrains in all vehicle has raised the need for additional caution to be exercised by pedestrians and drivers as well," he said.

"Part of it is also acclimating your ear to that noise. Frankly the sound of an automobile is changing as more quiet powertrains and hybrid vehicles come to dominate the market," he said.

I've bolded the bit that makes NO SENSE. So, they couldn't hear the car approaching, fair enough. But to say, "if we had been standing in the road.."? Forgive me for being "blindist" but how stupid are these people? You don't stand in the middle of the road, especially if you're blind. Thats why crossings have mechanisms for letting the blind know when the walk sign is up, thats why guide dogs are so well trained and thats why even SIGHTED people don't stand in the road. Also are they assuming that simply because they can't see that the drivers of the cars cant either?. As hookie rather inelegantly stated, that's what horns are for, as a warning. There are a few blind people around where I live, well only two actually and BOTH of them use the pedestrian crossings without fail every time. I have not once seen either of them take the chance and cross just because they couldnt hear a car comming, its a great way to get a bicycle in the side of the head if you're blind. Likewise I, a sighted person, always use the pedestrian crossing and always wait for the "green man" regardless of whether there's traffic there or not, though in my case it's re-inforcing into my 5 year old son what he should be doing.

Even when the crosswalk sign is red?

You're not supposed to, but if someone does cross you have to stop for them. Of course, a person crossing at that time, aside from the physical risks they take, can actually be fined or otherwise punished by the police for crossing when the sign is red.

Ninjamobile strike! :)

Blind people have the same rights you do. Demanding that they limit their freedom so that people can drive cars is insulting to blind people. Not to mention that the article also references cyclists, children, and the elderly. I will never understand why some people think that their right to drive is more important than other people's right to safety and movement.

How hard can it be to install a simple whistle on the car that gets louder as more air blows through it? Make it standard on all electric cars. Then blind people can cross the street safely.

That's hilarious, can you imagine a row of these parked up at night with a steady breeze blowing? not to mention a whistle loud enough to be heard at city speeds (where the road crossing is an issue) would be deafening once you get onto even slightly faster roads. And even if you did it, imagine once a larger number of the population have hybrids (say on in 3), every third vehichle has a "eeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee" as it goes down the road?.

Hybrids make lots of noise... since when they were uber quiet?
When running on the electric motor only. They're near-silent. Or good ones are, anyway, Top Gear took the piss a bit and said they would need to change the Green Cross Code if everyone drove one to "Look left... look right... listen... cross... wonder why you're going through someone's windscreen".

Plus this fuel efficiency stuff really is a crock of shite. A diesel will go 80 or so miles to the gallon. A hybrid goes 45ish.

That's hilarious, can you imagine a row of these parked up at night with a steady breeze blowing? not to mention a whistle loud enough to be heard at city speeds (where the road crossing is an issue) would be deafening once you get onto even slightly faster roads. And even if you did it, imagine once a larger number of the population have hybrids (say on in 3), every third vehichle has a "eeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee" as it goes down the road?.

I was thinking of merely modifying the existing ones that you can purchase for your car that warn animals off the road by making a high pitched whistle. Just make it so that it makes a sound at a lower frequency and it's done.

Personally, I don't see how a really loud whistle could possibly be heard on a highway anyway with all the engine noise, so the volume of noise at high speeds is a moot point. And when I am outside I often see cars idling, and they are not only making noise, but they are usually belching toxic fumes at just the right height to get into kids lungs. So if you want to compare some whistling electric cars standing still and their ICE counterparts, then I say whistles are probably less annoying.

And every car now, as it goes down the road, makes a godawful noise, not to mention the smell.

Do you design whistles? Because it seems to me that the human mind is capable of designing a whistle that makes less decibels than the average existing car engine at speeds between zero and 30, and still be loud enough to warn blind people.

We add a smell to natural gas to allow people to detect it. I see no problem with spending 2 cents a car to make it aas loud as a normal car.

I was thinking of merely modifying the existing ones that you can purchase for your car that warn animals off the road by making a high pitched whistle. Just make it so that it makes a sound at a lower frequency and it's done.

Personally, I don't see how a really loud whistle could possibly be heard on a highway anyway with all the engine noise, so the volume of noise at high speeds is a moot point. And when I am outside I often see cars idling, and they are not only making noise, but they are usually belching toxic fumes at just the right height to get into kids lungs. So if you want to compare some whistling electric cars standing still and their ICE counterparts, then I say whistles are probably less annoying.

And every car now, as it goes down the road, makes a godawful noise, not to mention the smell.

Do you design whistles? Because it seems to me that the human mind is capable of designing a whistle that makes less decibels than the average existing car engine at speeds between zero and 30, and still be loud enough to warn blind people.

You did suggest a whistle that is going to increase in volume with speed and Im fairly certain that a whistle loud enough to be heard through ambient engine noise at city speed is certainly going to be heard throughout the range of speeds.

You didnt argue over the line of parked cars so I'll accept silence as a grudging agreement.

You can't use emotional morality regards polution as an argument against me when trying to argue over the noise so the belching fumes bit is irrelavent to the case in point.

As other's have pointed out, it is the driver's responsibility to be aware of pedestrians, especially in a city environment.

Also its not the ammount of noise as much as the TYPE of noise, you say yourself you could have a lower decibel whistle that was easily distinguishable against engine noise, but I guarantee you people would find engine rumble far less annoying than the whistle you describe. Once the majority of cars are hybrid, the noise (or lack of it) won't be a problem as it's all relative.

As for the "Do you design whistles" attack, no, I don't. But Im willing to bet neither do you.

And I still think a whistle attached to a car is a daft idea, you could have mentioned other ways that I would have agreed with but I really had to read twice to decide if you were serious. I'm not making this personal, I just think it's daft.

As other's have pointed out, it is the driver's responsibility to be aware of pedestrians, especially in a city environment.



Great. So after he kills a blind person because he didn't see them, even if the blind person could have avoided it had he been able to hear the car, then we know who to punish. Sounds like a much more reasonable solution than spending an absolutely miniscule amount of money, I mean pennies, to just throw a very simple device on the car that makes it audible when teh electric engine is engaged.

The rest of your argument is all about engineering and somehow I have faith that an actual engineer can figure out a way to make a car audible during electric engine engagement for so extremely cheap that it would cost less than a cup of coffee to put it on all te cars a company produces. I don't feel it necessary to point out how in this thread, but a closthes pin and a playing card comes to mind.

When running on the electric motor only. They're near-silent. Or good ones are, anyway, Top Gear took the piss a bit and said they would need to change the Green Cross Code if everyone drove one to "Look left... look right... listen... cross... wonder why you're going through someone's windscreen".

Plus this fuel efficiency stuff really is a crock of shite. A diesel will go 80 or so miles to the gallon. A hybrid goes 45ish.Most hybrids use both gasoline and electric simultaneously. My mother's RX400H makes just as much noise if not more than my gasoline-only car.

And in the US, where diesels are nearly nonexistent, hybrids are more fuel efficient by leaps and bounds. My mom's previous vehicle got a ridiculous 12mpg, and now is getting nearly 32mpg.

Most hybrids use both gasoline and electric simultaneously. My mother's RX400H makes just as much noise if not more than my gasoline-only car.

And in the US, where diesels are nearly nonexistent, hybrids are more fuel efficient by leaps and bounds. My mom's previous vehicle got a ridiculous 12mpg, and now is getting nearly 32mpg.

Funny, in the March edition of Scientific American there's an article about how diesel engines here are becoming greener. I have't read it yet, so I can't say how this is happening.

You did suggest a whistle that is going to increase in volume with speed and Im fairly certain that a whistle loud enough to be heard through ambient engine noise at city speed is certainly going to be heard throughout the range of speeds.

You didnt argue over the line of parked cars so I'll accept silence as a grudging agreement.

You can't use emotional morality regards polution as an argument against me when trying to argue over the noise so the belching fumes bit is irrelavent to the case in point.

As other's have pointed out, it is the driver's responsibility to be aware of pedestrians, especially in a city environment.

Also its not the ammount of noise as much as the TYPE of noise, you say yourself you could have a lower decibel whistle that was easily distinguishable against engine noise, but I guarantee you people would find engine rumble far less annoying than the whistle you describe. Once the majority of cars are hybrid, the noise (or lack of it) won't be a problem as it's all relative.

As for the "Do you design whistles" attack, no, I don't. But Im willing to bet neither do you.

And I still think a whistle attached to a car is a daft idea, you could have mentioned other ways that I would have agreed with but I really had to read twice to decide if you were serious. I'm not making this personal, I just think it's daft.

Your criticisms of my ideas are valid. But they do not seem to be impossible to overcome. What we would be looking for is something that is loud enough to hear against ambient noise, yet is not so loud as to increase noise pollution. Whether or not this is a whistle is irrelevant. I agree with you.

But since this is NSG, I will now disagree with you.

Okay, so you don't design whistles. Neither do I. But it makes sense: If it was a whistle, it would be higher pitched than an internal combustion engine, which means it would be more audible at lower decibels. Also, since the whistle operates by having air blown through it, the speed of the car would provide all the energy required to operate it. Also, the lack of moving parts would make it last longer and make it more weatherproof. And the technology has already been developed and only needs to be modified for human ears.

Parked cars: while it would seem a little silly to have a row of parked cars whistling softly in the breeze, I think this would still be preferable to the sound of idling internal combustion engine cars. The lack of pollution, while irrelevant to the problem of noise, is also beneficial.

And while you are correct that it is the driver's responsibility to be aware of pedestrians, especially in a city environment, the truth is that many drivers are not very responsible. Now, if I am crossing the street and I see a car approaching at a reckless speed, I can see and hear it with enough time to avoid getting hit as he blows through the red light. But let's say our reckless driver is driving an electric car. I can still see him in time to avoid becoming a hood ornament. Blind people can not.

I'm bored. I'm arguing about freakin' whistles.

Most hybrids use both gasoline and electric simultaneously. My mother's RX400H makes just as much noise if not more than my gasoline-only car.

And in the US, where diesels are nearly nonexistent, hybrids are more fuel efficient by leaps and bounds. My mom's previous vehicle got a ridiculous 12mpg, and now is getting nearly 32mpg.

My motorcycl gets bitchen gas mileage! :)

Miles per Gallon

ESPFI 53.0 hwy / 34.0 city

Funny, in the March edition of Scientific American there's an article about how diesel engines here are becoming greener. I have't read it yet, so I can't say how this is happening.Mercedes-Benz actually sells a few diesel versions of their cars in the US, but in California, New York, and some other states they're still not clean enough. This is supposed to change for the 2008 model year though.

My motorcycl gets bitchen gas mileage! :)

Miles per Gallon

ESPFI 53.0 hwy / 34.0 city

And blind people in the next town say, "Huh, sounds like Dan's got the bike out of the garage again."

Mercedes-Benz actually sells a few diesel versions of their cars in the US, but in California, New York, and some other states they're still not clean enough. This is supposed to change for the 2008 model year though.

Yeah, and you can get diesel trucks. Just leafing through the article I mentioned it sounds like the next several years will see diesel engines getting much cleaner.

Yeah, and you can get diesel trucks. Just leafing through the article I mentioned it sounds like the next several years will see diesel engines getting much cleaner.I look forward to it. I refuse to drive a hybrid, but I'm sick of the 19mpg I'm getting in my car, so if my car comes in a diesel in the future I'm definitely purchasing it.

While not all states give pedestrians the right of way, it really becomes a null problem because ALL states have the white cane law, which means as soon as you see that white cane, you are required by law to stop. While I can understand the problem of a blind person begining to cross the road while not hearing the car, if the driver was doing what they were supposed to, they would already be stopped because of that white cane.

And blind people in the next town say, "Huh, sounds like Dan's got the bike out of the garage again."

maybe not that loud, but they can hear me. ;)

I look forward to it. I refuse to drive a hybrid,*snip*

Why?

The right-of-way stuff is hilarious in NYC. Such a beautiful moment when hundreds of people are crossing during a green light and the cars are beeping non-stop and the pedestrians start giving random cars the finger.

We should get celebrities to tape warnings that would play constantly while the car is in motion. Can you imagine Larry King screaming "GET OUT OF THE WAY!" or Mr. T's "I pity the fool" to warn people of an incoming car.

Why?Because I'm not going to pay $15,000 more for a car for just 10mpg better mileage. I rather pay $2,000 more for a car and get 20mpg better mileage.

Diesel > Hybrid.

The right-of-way stuff is hilarious in NYC. Such a beautiful moment when hundreds of people are crossing during a green light and the cars are beeping non-stop and the pedestrians start giving random cars the finger.

The line from Midnight Cowboy (reprised in Forrest Gump) ... "Hey! I'm walkin' here!"

thats where deer whistles come in

thats where deer whistles come in

Make them dog whistles and the blind people's dogs can wrn them, but the rest of us won't go crazy?

Need flying cars... or teleportation. Or pretty much anything that does away with roads.

How about no cars at all? Peak Oil'll do that to us in a couple years. Then we'll be fine and dandy.

How about no cars at all? Peak Oil'll do that to us in a couple years. Then we'll be fine and dandy.

Yeah, until a horse kicks a blind guy in the head.

Yeah, until a horse kicks a blind guy in the head.

We'll cross that bridge when we come to it.

Yeah, until a horse kicks a blind guy in the head.

Hmm yeah, but with the ammount of gas horses produce you could pipe it off, fit them with an internal combustion engine and run the horse dual-fuel hybrid. The engine noise would then alert people of oncomming horses.

I don't think it'll be that much of an issue in America. Hybrid cars aren't that popular over here.

I don't think it'll be that much of an issue in America. Hybrid cars aren't that popular over here.

Ummm... two years ago used Priuses were selling for more than new ones because people were willing to pay extra to not have to sit on a six month waiting list. :confused:

I don't think it'll be that much of an issue in America. Hybrid cars aren't that popular over here.Yeah, that's why more than 400,000 have been sold nationwide...

Hmm yeah, but with the ammount of gas horses produce you could pipe it off, fit them with an internal combustion engine and run the horse dual-fuel hybrid. The engine noise would then alert people of oncomming horses.

This thread obviously has a winner.

I believe that these people who are complaining are not really blind. Everybody knows that blind people have superized hearing.

or how about collision detection systems that slow down the car and honks at the potential victim simultaneously? AND a deer whistle :p

And a dog whistle and ... big soft bumpers on the front in case those don't work.

Make them dog whistles and the blind people's dogs can wrn them, but the rest of us won't go crazy?


or how about collision detection systems that slow down the car and honks at the potential victim simultaneously? AND a deer whistle :p

My motorcycl gets bitchen gas mileage! :)

Miles per Gallon

ESPFI 53.0 hwy / 34.0 city

And you can scare the blind, as well as sighted!

What's your real-world mileage work out to?

And you can scare the blind, as well as sighted!

What's your real-world mileage work out to?

It's harder to check on a motorcycle because of the way filling up a tank works, but since about 55 miles of my 60 mile commute is freeway it's pretty high. I do notice that I fill up my motorcycle about as often as I filled up my car, once about every three to four days, but my car holds 15 gallons and my bike holds 4.8 so I spend about 1/3rd as much on gas.

It's harder to check on a motorcycle because of the way filling up a tank works, but since about 55 miles of my 60 mile commute is freeway it's pretty high. I do notice that I fill up my motorcycle about as often as I filled up my car, once about every three to four days, but my car holds 15 gallons and my bike holds 4.8 so I spend about 1/3rd as much on gas.

Wow! Sixty miles a day on the freeway? I think I'd die before I could put up with that sort of drive every day. That's three hundred miles a week -- Yuck!

Good mileage, though.

Wow! Sixty miles a day on the freeway? I think I'd die before I could put up with that sort of drive every day. That's three hundred miles a week -- Yuck!

Good mileage, though.

I know, but the truth is that on my bike it's fun. I get to use the car pool lane and where there isn't one it's legal to split lanes in CA at low speeds so I get to work faster, too.

No fecking joke. I got hit by a car because I didn't hear it coming and couldn't see it because of the other cars in the way. I was absolutely sure the coast was clear!

Adding a little noise to a car doesn't hurt much. After all, most people do rely on their ears a great deal when listening for traffic, especially at crappy Bristol City Council junctions.

Maybe we should take the carphobia one step further and finally revive the plan from the start of last century to always have every car accompanied by someone walking in front of it and alerting everyone to the danger?

Most hybrids use both gasoline and electric simultaneously. My mother's RX400H makes just as much noise if not more than my gasoline-only car.
At low speeds, some of them run on the electric only (under 30mph) and those engines are damn-near silent.
And in the US, where diesels are nearly nonexistent, hybrids are more fuel efficient by leaps and bounds. My mom's previous vehicle got a ridiculous 12mpg, and now is getting nearly 32mpg.
What the hell was she driving - an Abrams or something?

don't blind people have dogs with them when they're crossing the road? dogs have pretty good hearing, especially in the higher ranges which electric motors run in. i can't see where this would be a problem.

having said that, any car that doesn't make a decent rumbly (or high revving scream) sound is just pish. stupid eu regulations limiting exhaust notes, muder the blind would you? :mad: ;)

That's a good idea. And one of those horns that goes "AhOOOOgah! AhOOOOgah!" like they had back in the 1920s. And sensors on each corner to sound the horn as the vehicle approaches the intersection.

That'd be a klaxon (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Klaxon). One of my favorite sirens.

Not at all, we shall just have to limit them to 4 miles per hour and have a man walking 20 paces in front carrying a red flag to warn people that a vehichle is approaching.

lmao!

Blind people have the same rights you do. Demanding that they limit their freedom so that people can drive cars is insulting to blind people. Not to mention that the article also references cyclists, children, and the elderly. I will never understand why some people think that their right to drive is more important than other people's right to safety and movement.

How hard can it be to install a simple whistle on the car that gets louder as more air blows through it? Make it standard on all electric cars. Then blind people can cross the street safely.

Bleeding heart.

PROTIP: If you're driving a car, it's your responsibility to keep an eye out for pedestrians, not your car's engine.

Problem solved.

/agree

Great. So after he kills a blind person because he didn't see them, even if the blind person could have avoided it had he been able to hear the car, then we know who to punish. Sounds like a much more reasonable solution than spending an absolutely miniscule amount of money, I mean pennies, to just throw a very simple device on the car that makes it audible when teh electric engine is engaged.

The rest of your argument is all about engineering and somehow I have faith that an actual engineer can figure out a way to make a car audible during electric engine engagement for so extremely cheap that it would cost less than a cup of coffee to put it on all te cars a company produces. I don't feel it necessary to point out how in this thread, but a closthes pin and a playing card comes to mind.

Shit happens.

The right-of-way stuff is hilarious in NYC. Such a beautiful moment when hundreds of people are crossing during a green light and the cars are beeping non-stop and the pedestrians start giving random cars the finger.

Anything can happen in NYC. :D

I know, but the truth is that on my bike it's fun. I get to use the car pool lane and where there isn't one it's legal to split lanes in CA at low speeds so I get to work faster, too.

Isn't that a wee dangerous?


WE should be happy noise pollution is being reduced. The blind should, in theory, be dead. But since that's mean we give them allowances, but this is going to far. I hate walking home from school and hearing VROOOOOOOOOOM!!! VROOM!!! VROOM!!! I hope they also can get rid of the smell. Use veggie oil or something so I want potato chips or fries by the time I get home. :)