NationStates Jolt Archive

THE "YES!" option refers to real football and not gridiron. Sorry for the potential misunderstanding.

NFL and their rubbish sport are trying to invade Europe, while continually referring to it as football, which it is only genetically and barely resembles the real sport. If I prayed, I ould pray for Europe and its salvation from this dark cloud that has hovered over North America for decades.

Link (http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news?slug=afp-amfootnflsupereng&prov=afp&type=lgns)

MIAMI (AFP) - National Football League officials announced that the Miami Dolphins and New York Giants will play in a game October 28 in London, the first gridiron matchup played outside North America.

The official announcement came during an NFL International news conference where officials revealed the regular season game would be played at the new 90,000 seat Wembley Stadium which is due to open later this year.

"I'm looking forward to going to London and playing a game there," said Giants quarterback Eli Manning on Friday.

"Hopefully we will draw a big crowd. American football has become popular there."

NFL owners voted in October to play up to two games outside the US every year for the next five years, but only one is planned in 2007.

The NFL has played pre-season games in London before but this would be the first regular season game on the continent.

"The international popularity of the NFL grows every year," said commissioner Roger Goodell. "That interest will be seen as the far corners of the world watch Super Bowl this Sunday.

"That is a fascination we will build upon. London and its international stature adds to the impact of the game."

The NFL announced four months ago that the Seattle Seahawks and New England Patriots would play an exhibition game in Beijing on August 8. The match will be played at the 60,000-seat Beijing Workers Stadium - the site of the soccer competition at the 2008 Summer Olympics.

In 2005, the NFL played its first regular-season game outside US cities and set an all-time attendance record when 103,467 people in Mexico City's Estadio Azteca watched the Arizona Cardinals beat the San Francisco 49ers 31-14.

The Dolphins and Giants are two of the most recognizable teams in the NFL, with four Super Bowl wins between them. In 1972, Miami won 17 straight to become the only team in history to post an undefeated season en route to a Super Bowl title.

The Giants won the Super Bowl in 1986 and 1990.

London mayor Ken Livingstone said he expects 10,000 Americans to travel to England for the game.

"It is a brave step for the NFL to come to Europe," Livingstone said. "After London's success in winning the 2012 Olympics our aim has been to bring Londoners the best of all sports."

Livingstone has been an outspoken critic of the ruling US Republican party that he once denounced as "a gang of thugs."

He angered the Bush regime by making trips to Cuba and been photographed shaking hands with controversial Venezuela President Hugo Chavez.

Asked if it was ironic that a Bush critic was hosting an American icon event, Livingstone said: "No-one should think Britain is anti-American. I love American people, I love the country. That doesn't mean people can't criticize the American government."

"American football has become popular there."

What an odd thing to say.

"American football has become popular there."

What an odd thing to say.

Da's wha' I'm talkin' 'bout!

"American football has become popular there."

What an odd thing to say.
Just what I was thinking. I don't know why they're holding it in Wembley, I couldn't see the stadium being any more than a third full, and that's very optimistic. Even Livingstone expects 10,000 people to travel from America, and I couldn't see many Brits going to attend the game.

how ridiculous.

Logically speaking, neither the NFL nor the owners of Wembley Stadium would have planned this shindig if it were not expected to make both oodles of money.

NFL and their rubbish sport are trying to invade Europe, while continually referring to it as football, which it is only genetically and barely resembles the real sport. If I prayed, I ould pray for Europe and its salvation from this dark cloud that has hovered over North America for decades.

Link (http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news?slug=afp-amfootnflsupereng&prov=afp&type=lgns)

(Kicks Sel)

Why not?

... wait i thought there already was an american football league in Europe..... hmmm... ima go find a link to that

"American football has become popular there."

What an odd thing to say.

If they even half fill the new Wembley I shall eat an item of clothing of NSGeneral's choosing.

Burn it! Burn it!

Ahh, well. Least they're not playing at Anfield. That would be desecrating holy ground.

Didn't there used to be a London Monarchs WFL team?

(can't be bothered to check).

If they even half fill the new Wembley I shall eat an item of clothing of NSGeneral's choosing.

a whole burkha. (biggest item of clothing i could think of :p)

Didn't there used to be a London Monarchs WFL team?

(can't be bothered to check).

yup... there's an american football league.... still can't find that link though :headbang:

Football's impossible not to like if you actually play it, but simply watching it isn't going to do the trick if there aren't some giveaways of balls and things. Hopefully the NFL will figure that out if they're interested in helping the game's popularity.

Watching World Cup as a kid never made soccer look fun to me.. it wasn't until I actually played the game in school that I actually sort of enjoyed soccer for a few minutes, before becoming bored and wanting to play football. But the point is, soccer looked mindlessly boring on t.v., while actually sort of amusing when I played it myself. The NFL should set up some tire-swings for the kids or something.. you need to experience it, rather than just watching.

Rubbish Ball?!

*Recalls all the things he said about respecting other sports for their different aspects repeatedly. It has done nothing.*

Fuck you, and any of you unathletic fucks who pretend to be sports gurus when in fact, you were probably the fat kid who got picked last for everything in gym class.

Anyone with an iota of physical prowress would be able to silently respect the differences between sports.

This shit pisses me off to no end.

I take solice in the fact that I was kicked out of two college Rugby teams for injuring someone by tackling them 'wrong'.

Football's impossible not to like if you actually play it, but simply watching it isn't going to do the trick if there aren't some giveaways of balls and things. Hopefully the NFL will figure that out if they're interested in helping the game's popularity.

Watching World Cup as a kid never made soccer look fun to me.. it wasn't until I actually played the game in school that I actually sort of enjoyed soccer for a few minutes, before becoming bored and wanting to play football. But the point is, soccer looked mindlessly boring on t.v., while actually sort of amusing when I played it myself. The NFL should set up some tire-swings for the kids or something.. you need to experience it, rather than just watching.

*offers to check you into an insane asylum*

Gridiron is boring...it's just guys slamming into each other and chucking around a bladder. In real football, the entire match can hinge on one goal.

Rubbish Ball?!

*Recalls all the things he said about respecting other sports for their different aspects repeatedly. It has done nothing.*

Fuck you, and any of you unathletic fucks who pretend to be sports gurus when in fact, you were probably the fat kid who got picked last for everything in gym class.

Anyone with an iota of physical prowress would be able to silently respect the differences between sports.

This shit pisses me off to no end.

I take solice in the fact that I was kicked out of two college Rugby teams for injuring someone by tackling them 'wrong'.

I respect all sports. Gridiron hardly qualifies as a sport.

I respect all sports. Gridiron hardly qualifies as a sport.

You are pathetic because you absolutely fail to even try to respect another's way of life. This entire thread is flamebait which I unfortunately bit on.

What are your credentials to define what a sport is, oh master sport guru?

NFL sucks. It's all about College ball.

Oh, and personally, while I like American Football a lot, much more than soccer (though the latter would be better if goals happened more often), I'm of the opinion that American Football should stay... American.

I'd also like to add that Rugby is a most fine and excellent sport. Who couldn't love a game in which the opposing teams try to beat the crap out of each other for an hour and afterwards have lunch?

Gridiron is boring...it's just guys slamming into each other and chucking around a bladder. In real football, the entire match can hinge on one goal.


Football games are low-scoring or decided by a single goal all the time. The Bears won their first round playoff game by a single kick. Football might look like chaos if you haven't played it. Rugby looks a bit chaotic too if you don't know the rules. Once you do, it makes more sense. There's a lot of chance involved, but strategy pays off too. Each position plays an important part.

NFL sucks. It's all about College ball.

Strange how people love only one and never the other.

I hate watching college ball even though I play it. Maybe because the names are a little outrageous.

My friend plays for the University of South Carolina, go Gamecocks! Woo! :D

Unfortunately, I think the article is right about an increase in popularity for American Football, I have noticed a lot more people becoming interested in it, and the Super Bowl is televised these days... ah well.

Rubbish Ball?!

*Recalls all the things he said about respecting other sports for their different aspects repeatedly. It has done nothing.*

Fuck you, and any of you unathletic fucks who pretend to be sports gurus when in fact, you were probably the fat kid who got picked last for everything in gym class.

Anyone with an iota of physical prowress would be able to silently respect the differences between sports.

This shit pisses me off to no end.

I take solice in the fact that I was kicked out of two college Rugby teams for injuring someone by tackling them 'wrong'.

dot dot dot... Oddest thing to get mad about, EVAR.

dot dot dot... Oddest thing to get mad about, EVAR.

I've been playing football for 13 years now, I take it kind of personal. Anyone want to bash real wrestling while we're on my piss-list.

You are pathetic because you absolutely fail to even try to respect another's way of life. This entire thread is flamebait which I unfortunately bit on.

What are your credentials to define what a sport is, oh master sport guru?

This isn't flamebait, it's truthful news reporting.

I've been playing football for 13 years now, I take it kind of personal. Anyone want to bash real wrestling while we're on my piss-list.

That crap on TV, or the stuff done in Ancient Greece or Mongolia(which are different)? Well I guess you could argue that wrestling can also be...I can't really explain it, but siblings do it a lot...

NFL, along with rugby, is so ARTIFICIAL. Grab the ball, run 100 meters, stop, pass it back, get tackled, go back 100 meters...

Football (soccer), it's all just gameplay. No fake rules. Get the ball in the goal, do what you gotta do.

Strange how people love only one and never the other.

I hate watching college ball even though I play it. Maybe because the names are a little outrageous.

My friend plays for the University of South Carolina, go Gamecocks! Woo! :D

I love the outrageous names. Like the "Fighting Blue Hens." The team that's always been my favorite doesn't have an outrageous name though.

And I don't exactly HATE the NFL. Just, to me, College ball is 100 times more fun to watch. The only time I really care what happens in the NFL is if Oakland is involved. I used to like the 49ers as well, but they're moving to Santa Clara (and ruining SF's olympic bid) so now I hate them. The reason like a team is because of the place they're representing, not the team itself. For instance, if the Raiders moved back to LA, I'd hate them, too.

That's one of the things I like better about college ball. The teams don't move. And players don't get traded all the time, there's a bit more loyalty like that. Oh, and the teams aren't owned by some rich guy you've never heard of, but by their respective universities. And then of course, the bitter, century old rivalries. I love all that pomp.

NFL, along with rugby, is so ARTIFICIAL. Grab the all, run 100 meters, stop, pass it back, get tackled, go back 100 meters...

Football (soccer), it's all just gameplay. No fake rules. Get the ball in the goal, do what you gotta do.

You get next thread dedication.

NFL? Ha! XFL 4tw!!

You get next thread dedication.

Yay? *doesn't know what that is*

That crap on TV, or the stuff done in Ancient Greece or Mongolia(which are different)? Well I guess you could argue that wrestling can also be...I can't really explain it, but siblings do it a lot...

*sigh*

This isn't flamebait, it's truthful news reporting.

Negros freed, watch your daughters.

Just because you added an article with the end of the civil war afterwards doesn't mean it isn't flamebaiting.

Oh, and the teams aren't owned by some rich guy you've never heard of, .

You don't like/never heard of Al Davis and you call yourself a Raiders fan!!!??

BURN!

Oh, and the reason it is called football in the US is because during the colonial period it was traditionally played using a foot from a defeated enemy as a ball. Hence 'foot'ball.

Oh, and the reason it is called football in the US is because during the colonial period it was traditionally played using a foot from a defeated enemy as a ball. Hence 'foot'ball.

...

Seriously?

Oh, and the reason it is called football in the US is because during the colonial period it was traditionally played using a foot from a defeated enemy as a ball. Hence 'foot'ball.

i call bullshit...

You don't like/never heard of Al Davis and you call yourself a Raiders fan!!!??

BURN!

I was referring to the 49ers owners actually.

As far as Al Davis is concerned, most Oakland fans I know hate the guy and want him to kick the bucket ASAP.

i call bullshit...

I would too, normally, but since it's the Americans... :D

Haha, I expect all of, oh, about 5 people (who aren't US ex-pats or visitors) to go.

Such a shit game.

Dodgeball was invented when the Chinese would throw their enemy's heads at one another, or so I was told by a comedy movie.

Haha, I expect all of, oh, about 5 people (who aren't US ex-pats or visitors) to go.

Such a shit game.

I wouldn't be surprised if it sold out. When Australia played Greece here last year, it sold out, even though soccer isn't the primary sport in Australia. I suppose people get curious.

Oh, and the reason it is called football in the US is because during the colonial period it was traditionally played using a foot from a defeated enemy as a ball. Hence 'foot'ball.I really don't think that's true, but I'll spread it around until it is.

As far as Al Davis is concerned, most Oakland fans I know hate the guy and want him to kick the bucket ASAP.

You only know Bronco's fans in disguise. None of the faithful can hate the evil empire's eternal overlord.

The world is so different on the west coast.

I wouldn't be surprised if it sold out. When Australia played Greece here last year, it sold out, even though soccer isn't the primary sport in Australia. I suppose people get curious.

Yeah, but it's much bigger than American Football is here. It's in a different league.

As a Jets fan, I hope both the Dolphins and the Giants are slightly thrown off by the game in Europe. I'll take any advantage.



And to the American football bashers here, if you don't know the game, you shouldn't knock it. If you do know the game, why don't you like it, specifically?

And if there was a good college football team near here, I suspect I would be a bigger college football fan than NFL fan.....speaking of which, Rutgers recruiting FTW!

You only know Bronco's fans in disguise. None of the faithful can hate the evil empire's eternal overlord.

The world is so different on the west coast.

They also hate the broncos with a fiery passion, slightly more than they hate Davis. A lot of them want the city to own the team. Remember, the East Bay is full of lefties, even if football is traditionally a right-wing thing.

and contrary to popular belief, rugby was not invented at rugby school, but was in fact named for the ancient practice of eating the lesser spotted rugg bee before a match. it's secretes a chemical which is a stimulant and induces an aggressive trance-like state that rendered the players impervious to pain. the rugg bee was made extinct sometime in the 19th century when they were all rounded up and taken to New Zealand where they were ruthlessly hunted down by kiwi birds. because of this the new zealanders invented the haka to produce a similar aggressive trance effect and this is why they are so much better at rugby than everyone else. true fact that, no lie.

As a Jets fan, I hope both the Dolphins and the Giants are slightly thrown off by the game in Europe. I'll take any advantage.



And to the American football bashers here, if you don't know the game, you shouldn't knock it. If you do know the game, why don't you like it, specifically?

And if there was a good college football team near here, I suspect I would be a bigger college football fan than NFL fan.....speaking of which, Rutgers recruiting FTW!

Rutgers is right down the road from here...almost literally.

What’s with all the hate for American football? I hardly see any difference between wasting your time watching a rugby game or a football game.

The putdowns are just unnecessary, and I'm sure it's all good drunk.

Rutgers is right down the road from here...almost literally.

My grandparents both went to Rutgers and grew up in Jersey. My grandmother's brothers were on Rutger's baseball team in the 50s.

I'm no huge fan of American football, but it's definetely better than watching a bunch of foot-fairies, erm, I mean "soccer players" aimlessly chase a ball around and never even score.

I'm no huge fan of American football, but it's definetely better than watching a bunch of foot-fairies, erm, I mean "soccer players" aimlessly chase a ball around and never even score.

Have you ever played soccer/watched a full soccer game?

My grandparents both went to Rutgers and grew up in Jersey. My grandmother's brothers were on Rutger's baseball team in the 50s.

Most people who graduate from my high school go to it. Actually a friend just said she was accepted there.

Have you ever played soccer/watched a full soccer game?

Yes, during the 2006 World Cup. Unsurprisingly, it was a very good cure for insomnia.

And I played Little League soccer, but eventually lost interest.

Have you ever played soccer/watched a full soccer game?

Yes. Hardly anything happened. Eventually they decided the past way to tell which team was better was to take turns making penalty kicks at each other's goals. I was kinda bored by then.

Most people who graduate from my high school go to it. Actually a friend just said she was accepted there.

Not Old Bridge High School, by any chance?

Most people who graduate from my high school go to it. Actually a friend just said she was accepted there.
Cool, my grandparents always spoke well of it.
Yes, during the 2006 World Cup. Unsurprisingly, it was a very good cure for insomnia.

And I played Little League soccer, but eventually lost interest.

Well, at least your not making completely baseless blanket statements. I guess it's just a matter of personal preference. Your main objection is the lack of scoring?

Well, at least your not making completely baseless blanket statements. I guess it's just a matter of personal preference. Your main objection is the lack of scoring?

Yeah, I guess my attention span isn't long enough to wait 45 minutes for the scoreboard to change.

Or even the full 90, in some cases.

Yes. Hardly anything happened. Eventually they decided the past way to tell which team was better was to take turns making penalty kicks at each other's goals. I was kinda bored by then.

My theory of sports is that the more you know the details and intracacies of the sport the more you are able to enjoy it. When I watch soccer, I find I can't look away from a zero-zero tie, ever. On the other hand, I have a hard time watching hockey cause I know so little about it.

Yeah, I guess my attention span isn't long enough to wait 45 minutes for the scoreboard to change.

Or even the full 90, in some cases.

To me, I find it thrilling and tense, and the flow and movements of the players is beautiful. To each their own, I guess.

I'm fine with all the codes of sport spreading everywhere. The bigger the pool of talent, and the more choices they have of a sport in which they can excel, the better the best players will be.

Me wanting to see tall African girls play netball wouldn't have anything to do with that, of course. ;)

Aussie Rules Football FTW. :)

I've been playing football for 13 years now, I take it kind of personal. Anyone want to bash real wrestling while we're on my piss-list.
yeah alright then.
Wrestling is the pinnacle of gay sport.
It's just two sweaty half-naked fat guys fondling and groping each other for several minutes in front of a crowd.

It's much more fun to go to the gay mardi gras.

happy now?

Aussie Rules Football FTW. :)

Oh yeah, they're really playing for the win :confused:

Changing the name of their code from Victorian Football League to Australian Football League was a master-stroke! World domination, here we come. :D

Not Old Bridge High School, by any chance?

Man, don't tell people what town you live in...

yeah alright then.
Wrestling is the pinnacle of gay sport.
It's just two sweaty half-naked fat guys fondling and groping each other for several minutes in front of a crowd.

It's much more fun to go to the gay mardi gras.

happy now?

Yes, very happy aside from the amount of wrestlers who die from losing weight. You're a fecking genius. I would avoid wrestlers on that logic given they can could 'take' you in the most forbidden and uncomfortable positions.

Half my high school went to Rutgers :/

Yes, very happy aside from the amount of wrestlers who die from losing weight. You're a fecking genius. I would avoid wrestlers on that logic given they can could 'take' you in the most forbidden and uncomfortable positions.

Half my high school went to Rutgers :/

You live in Jersey also?

Rubbishball has already infested Europe and the purging fire of the American football is now coming in.:)

You live in Jersey also?Well, I live in hell, but in the grand scheme there is not much difference.

Rubbishball has already infested Europe and the purging fire of the American football is now coming in.:)

Uh...no.

Well, I live in hell, but in the grand scheme there is not much difference.

You did not just diss the Garden State. :mad:

Oh yeah, they're really playing for the win :confused:

Changing the name of their code from Victorian Football League to Australian Football League was a master-stroke! World domination, here we come. :D

Not the name of the code, the name of the league. The code is still called Australian Rules Football. The national league is the AFL, the state leagues are the VFL, WALF, SANFL, etc.

Much like the ARL became the NRL, but the code is still called Rugby League.

My theory of sports is that the more you know the details and intracacies of the sport the more you are able to enjoy it.

This is very accurate. I have believed football to be the most boring sport imaginable for years, but at the beginning of this season, I decided to ask my father, who likes it, to thoroughly explain the sport to me. I'm still not a fan, but the game has at least become a great deal more watchable.

(Now, soccer, on the other hand, I've always liked. I'm not a big sports person in general, but I genuinely enjoy watching the World Cup. Heck, during last year's final, I was actually yelling at my TV. I normally make fun of people who do that. :p )

Not the name of the code, the name of the league. The code is still called Australian Rules Football. The national league is the AFL, the state leagues are the VFL, WALF, SANFL, etc.
I stand corrected. :)

I'm no huge fan of American football, but it's definetely better than watching a bunch of foot-fairies, erm, I mean "soccer players" aimlessly chase a ball around and never even score.

never score...ok just for you yanks who can't understand we can change the scoring system...every time in football(soccer) someone scores a goal we'll award them 6 points, and after that they get a free kick at putting the ball over the bar from 12 meters out and give them another point...every time they kick the ball over the ball over the bar from anywhere on the field we award them another 3 points:rolleyes:...with the footballers accuracy and being able to put it over the bar from 50-70 meters football(soccer) could have scores approaching a basketball game...

americans have deluded themselves into thinking their football is exciting fast sport....fucking boring beyond belief, "actual playing time" in an american football match is about 12 and half minutes...and don't tell me I don't know it unless I've played it, because I have, the game sucks...the Super Bore is nothing more than a spectacle not a legitimated sporting event ...

another myth about the game...that anyone outside the US cares...they claim a viewing audience of 1 billion, well that's potential audience...actual numbers 98 million, 90 mill in the US, 3 mill in Canada and 5 mill foreigners watching the big titted cheerleaders...compared to 250million who watched the WC final...

americans watch football because flowing sports where athletes need to think are too difficult for them to comprehend, they need to stop the play every few seconds to figure out whats going on...basketball, baseball and US football all sports for the mentally challenged...that's why they Hockey has a difficult time in the US not enough stoppages...

...that's why they Hockey has a difficult time in the US not enough stoppages...
Perhaps a little harshly phrased but I agree with the general sentiment. It's the pace of American football that ultimately turns it off as an exciting sport. What's more, the amount of advertising and raw showmanship that takes place in any major game just highlights the fact that very little is actually happening.

I don't see it working in Europe. Same with Baseball. Basketball, on the other hand, could potentially be repopularised with quite some effect.

American football has been played in Europe for quite a while. The first league was set up in 90 or 91 I think...but it never became hugely successful.

I'm not a American football fan...but I really do not see the big problem with this. Its just another minority sport. In fact I bet there are more Kabbadi fans than American football fans.

Needless to say I am a proper football fan.

American football has been played in Europe for quite a while. The first league was set up in 90 or 91 I think...but it never became hugely successful.
Precisely.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/9/98/NFLE_Galaxy.gif
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NFL_Europa

This proves America just won't stop with it's cultural imperialism.

... wait i thought there already was an american football league in Europe..... hmmm... ima go find a link to that
There is - NFL Europa. All the teams in it are based in Germany. Two English teams relocated to Germany because it was inconvenient for them to travel there all the time and no one bothered turning up to the American Football games in this country. That's the level of interest we have in the game.

Does it even matter which sport is better? I mean it's not like England will ever win at either of them so who the hell cares?

Gridiron is boring...it's just guys slamming into each other and chucking around a bladder. In real football, the entire match can hinge on one goal.

Yeah, there it is. Your opinion, the hole point of this thread. To voice your opinion.

Big fucking woop. You find gridiron boring. Soccer is fascinating because at any moment over 90 minutes, one team might score a goal. And that's fascinating because ... well ... you are fascinated by it.

Care to respond to my point about the internationalization of sport? That the standard of every sport is improved by having a wider fan base, with a wider range of choice of sports? It's a natural corrollary of my simply worded post. Here. (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=12286798&postcount=58)

Bang on topic. Not partisan. Answer it.

I must say, this unslanted journalism is wonderful.

Sorry not a great fan of Amrican football. Too many stoppages, not enough flowing play, too slow, not enough skill involved (throwing, kicking and barging people over seems to be about it) and far, far, far too much commercialism.

My main gripe is the American attitude to it compared to the rest of the world. In world terms it is a minority sport and always will be. I applaud the efforts of the NFL to popularise the sport abroad, but I don't think it will work.

I fail to see how anybody can like Gridiron, watch Rugby (Union or League) and not instantly hate Gridiron and find it slow and boring.

... wait i thought there already was an american football league in Europe..... hmmm... ima go find a link to that

Yep. For more than 15 years. See the links above. There are also leagues in other regions (Japan's X League, for example).

Interesting rules mod for Europe: a 50+ yard feild goal counts for 4 points.

Didn't there used to be a London Monarchs WFL team?

(can't be bothered to check).

Unfortunately deffeunct.

yup... there's an american football league.... still can't find that link though :headbang:

It was easy to find. Try harder next time.

I respect all sports. Gridiron hardly qualifies as a sport.

Bul-fucking-shit. Gridiron is a hard core version of rugby that developed in the late 1800 at US colleges. It came very close to being banned due to the very high fatality rate.

Early footballers prided themselves on their superb physical conditioning that allowed them to handle the walloping contact of the sport. Walter Camp once said that his Yale team of 1876 was remarkable for two things, "our toughness and our tackling. No wonder we were tough, for it had been a general killing off and survival of the fittest, both through the medium of our mining and also the ground upon which we practiced. Our training consisted of an hour practice in an afternoon and a three-mile run in the gymnasium every evening at nine o'clock. . . Such was the enthusiasm of our captain. . . that we believed that we were making ourselves models of strength and endurance."

On the field, players could push or pull their teammates along, even carry them forward. Ball carriers were permitted to crawl with the ball until held down. During such critical times, many fights broke out, slowing the game down and making it less interesting for fans to watch. Witnesses' descriptions suggest that these skirmishes looked something like a combination of wrestling, boxing, and a barroom brawl. One English spectator, after watching a game, allowed that football "is quite different than soccer and Rugby. In soccer, you kick the ball. In Rugby, you kick the man when you can't kick the ball. In American football, you kick the man."

Referees dared not declare a play finished until the tackled ball carrier fell to the ground and hollered "Down! " They had no rules to deter blind-sided hits or brawling, partly because they could not see into the thickness of the fray.

It did not take long for football's once-lustrous reputation as a gentleman sport to become tarnished. John L. Sullivan, the heavyweight boxing champion from 1882 until 1892, commented: "Football. There's murder in that game. Prizefighting doesn't compare in roughness or danger with football. In the ring, at least you know what you're doing. You know what your opponent is trying to do. He's right there in front of you. There only one of him. But in football--there 11 guys trying to do you in!"

BTW, Sullivan was the last world champion boxer to win under the bare-knuckles London Prize Ring rules. Whan that caliber of brute says American Football is murderous, he knows what he's on about.


This isn't flamebait, it's tr

uthful news reporting.

Again, bull-fucking-shit. That poll, and your comments on it, is total flame bait.

i call bullshit...

American football came soccer and rugby, no questions.

Although football had been played in one form or another for centuries, the American version of the sport originated, for the most part, in Northeastern high schools and matured during the late nineteenth century in the Ivy League universities of the Northeast. As early as the 1840s, intramural matches had assumed a significant place in the campus life of students at Harvard and Yale University. Rivalries between classes became so intense that, by the beginning of the Civil War, the game had to be outlawed by the administrations of both institutions.

During the war years, a young man named Gerritt Smith Miller, who had played football while a high-school student in upstate New York, organized the Oneida Football Club in Boston, Massachusetts. He was the first to introduce the concept of teamwork to the game. Up to this time, players functioned individually on the field, with little regard to what their teammates were doing. Miller's "Boston game" assigned each player a role in advancing the ball or defending the goal.

Princeton and Rutgers played the first intercollegiate football game in 1869, with Yale, Cornell, and Columbia following soon after. Most closely resembling soccer (ball carrying was not yet considered an option), the earliest games were melees in which roughly 25 men blocked, tackled, and fought to kick a round, leather-covered ball through a wooden crossbar.

Harvard University students again joined the ranks of footballers in 1871, but followed different, Rugby-like rules that permitted players to run with the ball. The other schools in the Northeast were not quick to adopt this innovation, leaving Harvard with no option but to restrict its play to intramural contests. Intercollegiate football, meanwhile, spread west as far as Michigan and south to Virginia.

In 1874, David Roger of Montreal's McGill University, where Rugby itself was played, challenged Harvard's captain, Henry Grant, to a three-game match between their respective teams. Harvard comported itself well in the cross-border encounters, in which many of its players had their first opportunity to use the easier-to-control egg-shaped ball made from a pigs durable bladder.

Flushed with enthusiasm for Rugby, Harvard challenged Yale to give its rules a try. On November 13, 1875, some two thousand spectators watched as the arch rivals met in the first American intercollegiate game played under Rugby rules. Harvard took the win, and the game of American football was never the same. With their flair for unifying far-flung ideas, Americans quickly became enthralled by the game and formally adapted Rugby's ball-carrying rules for the 1876 season.

At a time when field goals made by drop-kicks vastly outscored touchdowns, the game looked like a mongrel of European soccer and English Rugby. Of course, the American "frontier" version was far more rugged than its more dignified European counterparts. Although in the American version aggressive defenses doled out uppercuts and roundhouse punches before and after the ball was snapped, football was nonetheless considered a "gentleman's Adventure in sport."

Under Rugby's rules, "neither side had possession of the ball, nor the right to put it in play and to execute the ensuing maneuver. . . ." Walter Camp, an ingenious fellow from Yale University, proposed in 1880 that a scrimmage line be set on the spot where the ball was last downed. Whereas in Rugby's scrummage, the ball was tossed between two herds of men, the new line of scrimmage in football indicated the exact spot where the following play should begin.

Camp then created the positions of snapback (center) and quarterback for placing the ball into play. The snapback rolled the ball back between his legs with his foot to the quarterback, who pitched it to another player. This created the unique feature of having one team take undisputed possession of the ball. Perhaps more than any other single rule, the scrimmage-line innovation distinguished American football from its European antecedents.

To counteract the stalling tactics that often resulted from the offense having unlimited control of the ball, Camp also introduced a rule requiring the offensive team to gain five yards in three plays or surrender possession of the ball. Since everyone except the quarterback was permitted to carry the ball, guards such as Yale's towering William "Pudge" Heffelfinger often scored as many touchdowns as halfbacks or full-back. From Camp's forward-thinking rules came strategies and tactics for systematically advancing the ball. In tribute to his phenomenal foresight, Camp became known as the "Father of American Football."

http://wesclark.com/rrr/yank_fb.html


What’s with all the hate for American football? I hardly see any difference between wasting your time watching a rugby game or a football game.

The haters of American football are going to scream bloody murder over my answer to that. They hate it primarily because it's American, and they're snobs.
Let them scream all they want. It's true.

The American's will scream bllody murder now, because the reverse is also true.

The putdowns are just unnecessary, and I'm sure it's all good drunk.

Indeed. Unsportsmanlike conduct is frequent on both sides when this debate comes up.

Have you ever played soccer/watched a full soccer game?

I like both equally, but prefer ice hockey.

Rubbishball has already infested Europe and the purging fire of the American football is now coming in.:)

More flamebait. It's because of flamenbait like this that I suggested the mods simply ban this topic altogether.

that's why they Hockey has a difficult time in the US not enough stoppages...

Err... I understood ice hockey is growing pretty fast in the US...

Trilby63]Does it even matter which sport is better? I mean it's not like England will ever win at either of them so who the hell cares?

QFT. :D

My main gripe is the American attitude to it compared to the rest of the world.

The Europeans are equally guilty of a poor attitude, as they have exhibited here and elsewhere when this topic comes up.

I fail to see how anybody can like Gridiron, watch Rugby (Union or League) and not instantly hate Gridiron and find it slow and boring.

Then you simply fail at understanding.

The Europeans are equally guilty of a poor attitude, as they have exhibited here and elsewhere when this topic comes up..

Again I'm generalising. I'm talking of the kind of idiots (and every nation has these kind of idiots) who will insist it is great simply because it is American. Of course your right to point out that attitude works both ways

Yep. For more than 15 years. See the links above. There are also leagues in other regions (Japan's X League, for example).


I was not aware there was league in Japan...I know rugby is played over there...and they do play internationals...and (!) have never really disgraced themselves...

I have played American football (in school)...and I used to watch it as well when they stated broadcasting it over here in the UK back in the 80's.

The reason I can't be arsed to watch it anymore is that quite frankly it is too boring. Don't get me wrong...when the action kicks off it is watchable...like rugby...but the constant breaks in between downs...gah...that is the part that is tedious. And its worse when its televised.

THE "YES!" option refers to real football and not gridiron. Sorry for the potential misunderstanding.

NFL and their rubbish sport are trying to invade Europe, while continually referring to it as football, which it is only genetically and barely resembles the real sport. If I prayed, I ould pray for Europe and its salvation from this dark cloud that has hovered over North America for decades.

Link (http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news?slug=afp-amfootnflsupereng&prov=afp&type=lgns)

No thanks. Not for me. Never understood the sport of dressing up as a tank, ramming people and then standing around while someone does something with a measuring tape.
I don't like rugby much either.

Interestingly, I was offered two tickets today as part of my 18th Birthday. Man Utd vs Bolton at OT, or Wankball at Wembley. God, that was a difficult answer.....:rolleyes:

Is there actually any skill in American Football? Beyond eating lots, being quick or gaining muscle of course...

I fail to see how anybody can like Gridiron, watch Rugby (Union or League) and not instantly hate Gridiron and find it slow and boring.

To be fair, England won the world cup playing an equally boring style of Rugby:D

Bul-fucking-shit. Gridiron is a hard core version of rugby that developed in the late 1800 at US colleges. It came very close to being banned due to the very high fatality rate.

There's nothing hardcore about wearing armour that an anti-tank gun would have difficulty penetrating.

Since I just blew my top and called the OP a one-eyed egotist (or whatever that was) let me explain my position on sport.

I cycle. I wave to other cyclists, who generally ignore me since they are pedalling uphill while I'm rolling down.

I swim. I get lapped by 200lb women twice my age, but I do what feels right for me and I enjoy it.

I bowl right-arm offspin, the full measure of the suckiness of which has not yet been tested by any batter over the age of twelve, and rarely even troubles the green strip in my local nets. My bowling could be boldly described as 'experimental,' and I haven't swung a bat in twenty years.

I watch cricket when it's on free-to-air. When my national broadcaster showed it without ads, I watched the game of the week in the US NFL. I watched about half the games in the World Cup which were televised. They were late at night, and I'll admit I fell asleep during several of them (particularly the games where Aus played, since they always seemed to be latest.)

Sport to me is an intermittent distraction from the real world (what I'm doing right now.) Cricket and Gridiron are similarly gratifying, because when the ball is bowled, or the play is called, something definitely happens for a few seconds, and it's win/lose/draw, then there's a decent pause for me to get on with what I was doing before there's another spasm of sport.

It's just a way of marking out time, to me.
I try to respect how others project their egos onto sportspeople. I have trouble understanding how a team representing a nation thereby gratifies the ego of a citizen of that nation, and (on-topic at last) I find the insistence that other citizens of someone's nation adhere to a national code and rule-set of what is essentially a contest of egos, a sad and despairing groping for identity.

Thus spake Zaraspissedthra.

Again I'm generalising. I'm talking of the kind of idiots (and every nation has these kind of idiots) who will insist it is great simply because it is American. Of course your right to point out that attitude works both ways

Fair dinkum.

I was not aware there was league in Japan...I know rugby is played over there...and they do play internationals...and (!) have never really disgraced themselves...

I have played American football (in school)...and I used to watch it as well when they stated broadcasting it over here in the UK back in the 80's.

The reason I can't be arsed to watch it anymore is that quite frankly it is too boring. Don't get me wrong...when the action kicks off it is watchable...like rugby...but the constant breaks in between downs...gah...that is the part that is tedious. And its worse when its televised.



There's nothing hardcore about wearing armour that an anti-tank gun would have difficulty penetrating.


The reasons for the padding - note not ant-tank armor (you'll do your argument a world of good if you leave out the the stupid comments) - is, if you had bothered to read what I posted, that murderous fatality rate that Sullivan was commenting on, and which almost got the sport banned. The particular differences in American footbal and rugby result in one needing padding to be played without a prohbitively high death rate. (I noiw fully expect some idiots to come in and make the usual comments regarding how the sport ought to be banned if it's that dangerous. :rolleyes:)


Try bothering to know an iota about what you're commenting on next time.

Fair dinkum.








The reasons for the padding - note not ant-tank armor (you'll do your argument a world of good if you leave out the the stupid comments) - is, if you had bothered to read what I posted, that murderous fatality rate that Sullivan was commenting on, and which almost got the sport banned. The particular differences in American footbal and rugby result in one needing padding to be played without a prohbitively high death rate. (I noiw fully expect some idiots to come in and make the usual comments regarding how the sport ought to be banned if it's that dangerous. :rolleyes:)


Try bothering to know an iota about what you're commenting on next time.

Where is the skill in being employed to run into people?

How does being big and muscled, and running into people, constitute being a sportsman?

Sport is about inspiration, talent and drama, none of which are prominent in American Football.

Since I just blew my top and called the OP a one-eyed egotist (or whatever that was) let me explain my position on sport.

I cycle. I wave to other cyclists, who generally ignore me since they are pedalling uphill while I'm rolling down.

I swim. I get lapped by 200lb women twice my age, but I do what feels right for me and I enjoy it.

I bowl right-arm offspin, the full measure of the suckiness of which has not yet been tested by any batter over the age of twelve, and rarely even troubles the green strip in my local nets. My bowling could be boldly described as 'experimental,' and I haven't swung a bat in twenty years.

I watch cricket when it's on free-to-air. When my national broadcaster showed it without ads, I watched the game of the week in the US NFL. I watched about half the games in the World Cup which were televised. They were late at night, and I'll admit I fell asleep during several of them (particularly the games where Aus played, since they always seemed to be latest.)

Sport to me is an intermittent distraction from the real world (what I'm doing right now.) Cricket and Gridiron are similarly gratifying, because when the ball is bowled, or the play is called, something definitely happens for a few seconds, and it's win/lose/draw, then there's a decent pause for me to get on with what I was doing before there's another spasm of sport.

It's just a way of marking out time, to me.
I try to respect how others project their egos onto sportspeople. I have trouble understanding how a team representing a nation thereby gratifies the ego of a citizen of that nation, and (on-topic at last) I find the insistence that other citizens of someone's nation adhere to a national code and rule-set of what is essentially a contest of egos, a sad and despairing groping for identity.

Thus spake Zaraspissedthra.


:D There's a darn good reason I tend to like you antipodian types.... ;)

(I know I had a good beer from NSW once, but for the life of me I can't recall what it was. Anywho, if we ever meet IRL, first shouts on me.)

Fair dinkum.

The reasons for the padding - note not ant-tank armor (you'll do your argument a world of good if you leave out the the stupid comments) - is, if you had bothered to read what I posted, that murderous fatality rate that Sullivan was commenting on, and which almost got the sport banned. The particular differences in American footbal and rugby result in one needing padding to be played without a prohbitively high death rate. (I noiw fully expect some idiots to come in and make the usual comments regarding how the sport ought to be banned if it's that dangerous. :rolleyes:)


Try bothering to know an iota about what you're commenting on next time.

Huh???

Where is the skill in being employed to run into people?

How does being big and muscled, and running into people, constitute being a sportsman?

Sport is about inspiration, talent and drama, none of which are prominent in American Football.


One could ask every single one of those questions about rugby or ice hockey with equal legitimacy. Fortunately, that's not what any of those sports are about.

Like I suggested to the potato, try and at least actually know something about what you're passing judgement on. It will help you avoid looking stupid to those who do know something about the topic. GIGO

BTW, yes, those comments go equally as well for anyone making ignorant comments about rugby or soccer. Particularly those who feel a need to denigrate soccer with the sort of "pansy" comments I saw earlier in this thread.

The reasons for the padding - note not ant-tank armor (you'll do your argument a world of good if you leave out the the stupid comments) - is, if you had bothered to read what I posted, that murderous fatality rate that Sullivan was commenting on, and which almost got the sport banned. The particular differences in American footbal and rugby result in one needing padding to be played without a prohbitively high death rate. (I noiw fully expect some idiots to come in and make the usual comments regarding how the sport ought to be banned if it's that dangerous. :rolleyes:)

So? Being dangerous doesn't make it cool. It makes it stupid.

Try
Try, try, it's a TRYYYY for Japan!!
bothering
Here, are you trying to bother me?? I'll give ya bother!!
to know
"Chess."
"Sure you wouldn't like a nice game of chequers?"
"Chess. Pawn to King Four."
an iota
Right. OK. Philosophy. The smallest possible quantity. How big is that again?
about what you're commenting on
Fair 'nuf. Commentary is a sport too.
next time.
Futurology?! What sport are we playing now?

EDIT: I've done being silly, and I've done being awake. A decent and respectful hug to Diastallia2104, and anyone else who bothers to post. You all make my day!

I heart you muchly Daistallia.

And to those who say football has no skill, LaDanian Tomlinson (http://www3.youtube.com/watch?v=eH7QR7NWKLU).

I heart you muchly Daistallia.

And to those who say football has no skill, LaDanian Tomlinson (http://www3.youtube.com/watch?v=eH7QR7NWKLU).

Please tell me what is skillful about being a linebacker (if I have the position wrong then feel free to correct my ignorance). Their only job seems to be pushing people over. That is hardly skillful.

Please tell me what is skillful about being a linebacker (if I have the position wrong then feel free to correct my ignorance). Their only job seems to be pushing people over. That is hardly skillful.

First of all, there is great skill involved in pushing people over, in fact, there are sports that are more or less only pushing people over, for example sumo. It takes great timing, body awarness, quick feet, strength, durability, long arms, good center of balance, will and determination. Second, you need to be smart and able to read people and motions very quickly; offensive lineman, especially centers (the guy who hikes the ball to the quarterback) need to be able to read blitzes before every play, and defensive lineman need to be able to read different formations and analyze the how likely certain plays (especially screens, draws, cutbacks, reverses, and playaction) are before every snap so that they won't get caught out of position and get burned for a big play. And you also have to be able to run decently to be a good lineman (the exception being nosetackle), whether it is to run ahead of your running back on certain blocking schemes where a lineman pulls out of his normal position during the play in order to add an extra blocker somewhere else, or, on defence, to run around the other team's line to sack the quarterback or chase down a running back.

It all has to do with how well you know the game. To my mom, and to countless other people who don't know the intracacies of the sport, it probably is very difficult to see past "pushing people over". However to people who watch it with knowledge and experience, even blocking schemes can be beautiful, each player fitting in and playing off his teammates perfectly to open up gaps for the running back.


Lineman aren't glamorous, and they hardly ever get any of the attention or accolades, because it is the nature of the sport that the people with the ball are going to be noticed more. But in many cases, it is the lineman on both sides of the ball who will win the games.


Note: this is all coming from someone who's never played on a real football team, so much of the terminology may be off, and it's possible I'm just dead wrong about things, or am missing crucial pieces of information.

"Invades"?

And what do you call the repeated attempts to establish soccer in the US? Attempts that are doomed to fail IMO.

American football appeals to people who (1) prefer a game in which strategy and creativity are required, (2) actually want to see scoring, and (3) have IQ's above room temperature. American football appeals to those with characteristically American qualities, while soccer appeals primarily to proles. Since there are more proles in the world than people with characteristically American qualities, soccer is more popular worldwide. Since there are (fortunately) fewer proles than people with characteristically American qualities here in the States, American football is more popular here.

All the geniuses who say soccer will eventually catch on because of all the little kids who play it and all the soccer moms who back it ignore one key fact: once those kids are old enough to know better, they dump soccer and turn to a real sport. Like American football!

Mr. Posh Spice and any other invader from the world of proles and kickballers will fail miserably in trying to change that reality :p

"Invades"?

And what do you call the repeated attempts to establish soccer in the US? Attempts that are doomed to fail IMO.

American football appeals to people who (1) prefer a game in which strategy and creativity are required, (2) actually want to see scoring, and (3) have IQ's above room temperature. American football appeals to those with characteristically American qualities, while soccer appeals primarily to proles. Since there are more proles in the world than people with characteristically American qualities, soccer is more popular worldwide. Since there are (fortunately) fewer proles than people with characteristically American qualities here in the States, American football is more popular here.

All the geniuses who say soccer will eventually catch on because of all the little kids who play it and all the soccer moms who back it ignore one key fact: once those kids are old enough to know better, they dump soccer and turn to a real sport. Like American football!

Mr. Posh Spice and any other invader from the world of proles and kickballers will fail miserably in trying to change that reality :p

See the post I made above

What’s with all the hate for American football? I hardly see any difference between wasting your time watching a rugby game or a football game.

The putdowns are just unnecessary, and I'm sure it's all good drunk.

It's an alternative form of nationalist dickwaving. As for the OP, I'm guessing that he wants to appear cultured and sophisticated (which means European to many Americans), unlike the provincial and barbaric Americans he is forced to put up with. Or something like that.

Either way, hockey is better than either football.

THE "YES!" option refers to real football and not gridiron. Sorry for the potential misunderstanding.

NFL and their rubbish sport are trying to invade Europe, while continually referring to it as football, which it is only genetically and barely resembles the real sport. If I prayed, I ould pray for Europe and its salvation from this dark cloud that has hovered over North America for decades.

Kiss ass much, Sel?

http://www.nfleurope.com/ Where have you been?

Huh???

My apologies. I forgot to add my comment re your post. What I intended tgo add was that yeah, Japan manages to do OK in both gridiron and rugby.

So? Being dangerous doesn't make it cool. It makes it stupid.

hehe. As per usual, and as I alluded to, once the reasons for the padding worn in American football are mentioned, the detractors go from calling it wimpy to calling it brutal. :rolleyes:

The padding is what keeps it from being a brutal killing affair and allows it to be a sporting affair on par with other highly phisical sports like rugby or ice hockey. If you want to criticise footbal for it's physicality, at least be honest enough to do so for rugby and hockey!

One of the important differences, and the one that calls for the padding, from ruby is that in gridiron players are allowed to "block" - that is they can protect the ball carrier.

As a final bit, I'll leave you with this article: Pads and Helmets: Rugby vs. Gridiron (http://wesclark.com/rrr/pads_and_helmets.html)

I visited Australia a decade or so ago; a rugby match was on the TV at a local pub. Being one of the few identified Americans in the establishment, it wasn’t too surprising that the topic of gridiron (NFL-style American football) eventually came up among my Aussie hosts. Despite my largely failed attempts to convince the crowd that gridiron was every bit as rough as rugby, all I could garner was at best total dismissal, and at worst contempt. The perception outside the U.S. is that American Football is just bastardized rugby with thick padding designed to avoid the physical harm associated with the Union sport. Interestingly, most Americans hold an inverse perception: that rugby is gridiron without the pads, and as such, rugby is perceived as senselessly violent.



The misconceptions between rugby and gridiron are rooted in the belief that gridiron and rugby are similar sports. The truth, however, is far from this, as anyone who's ever played both sports can attest. In rugby, the only collision (i.e., running at speed for the purpose of forcing a player to the ground) is when one has the ball. The other 29 lads on the pitch are there for support. In American football, 21 of the 22 players had better be colliding with someone on every down - at full speed. In gridiron, there is collision while blocking. In rugby, the equivalent is called "obstruction" and is illegal, thus there are far more opportunities - requirements - for player collision in American football.



The styles of tackling are also very different. In rugby, the object is to bring the player to the ground in order to force a turnover. In gridiron, on the other hand, the purpose of tackling is to not yield a single millimeter of turf to the opposition advance. Rugby is largely about possession and gridiron is largely about territory. This creates two immensely differing approaches to tackling.



In rugby, the tackler (ideally) wants to wrap up around the upper legs, and drag the runner to ground. Sooner is better than later, but a few feet doesn’t matter much. In gridiron, the tackler prefers a head-on collision, the hard plastic helmet connecting to the opponent's chest; a wrap up around the waist or lower subsequently follows, and then a drive backwards as far as the tackler can go. The ground is the forceful end of a preferably very long trip on an American tackle. Without a helmet, an American football player would not likely live or walk for very long in such a contest. In rugby, a tackler may not grab around the shoulders and neck (at least when the ref is looking). In gridiron, virtually any means of bringing the ball carrier to the ground is legal, so long as the facemask isn't grabbed. This broad interpretation of the tackling rule sets gridiron far apart from its rugby counterpart, and greatly changes the amount of violence with which the objective may be carried out.



In rugby, a runner must absorb the impact of a tackler's flesh-and-bone shoulder and arm along with the variant inertial energy associated with the tackler's speed, mass and angle of attack. In gridiron, a ball-carrier must absorb all these things, plus the impact of a hard, plastic helmet and shoulder pads behind the force of a tackler whose mass is often greater than his rugby counterpart. By the way, there is little protection for most American football players between the sternum and the groin, which happens to comprise the precise target area of a gridiron tackler. Also, the pads are not the soft rubber found in rugby equipment. They are hard, reinforced plastic designed for the purpose of diffusing energy. Wearing gridiron pads gives one a visceral sense of invulnerability that cannot be truly replicated in rugby. Thus, the force used in gridiron tackling tends to be less restrained by the fear of injury, conscious or otherwise. There are plenty of fearless rugby tacklers, but they will rarely throw their careers (and possibly lives) away by running face-first into a head-on collision with a sprinting ball-carrier.



When a rugby player's tackling is imminent, he (hopefully) has someone nearby that the ball can be passed to - granted, this is not a certain way to avoid a tackle, but in theory, it moves play away from him. In gridiron, all play ends when and where the ball runner is crushed - no one passes the ball in American football but the quarterback.



Having played both sports, I can say that while the tackling differs, one method is no less bearable than the other in their respective environs. Crippling injuries or death would occur if someone attempted to use American-style tackling in rugby (I know - I made that foolish mistake in one of my early matches and nearly paid dearly for it). American tackling in rugby may also result in "over-commitment," that is to say, running at so great a speed at the ball-carrier that a successful reaction to a side-step or a reasonably competent pass is impossible (remember, in American football, there is no passing once the ball leaves the line of scrimmage). This lends credence to my theory that while former gridiron players are impressively capable of good hits in rugby, they tend to be vulnerable in getting burned by a smart, experienced backline player.



This is not to say, however, that rugby tackling is "weak." It is not. Within the confines of the laws, it, too, has its own terrible aspect of violence; but one that is appropriate for a bunch of ruggers trying to bring down anyone who has the ball. As a backliner myself, I have both given and received my share of bone-jarring rugby tackles. But I rarely felt the kind of impact I routinely encountered in American football, even when accounting for the pads.



To those who would deride the comparative aggressiveness of American gridiron football, I would say this: you may intelligently criticize only when you have played both sports. My sense of it is that ruggers who have never played a down of football cannot meaningfully comment on the difference between the two sports. The truth of the matter is that if a skeptical rugger were to strap on gridiron armor and play just one half of American Football, they would not hold the same opinion of the sport’s violence. Being aggressively flattened a dozen or so times by 25 stone (350 pound) behemoths tends to make one a believer.




Postscript, by Wes Clark



I asked Bob to write this article because I have seen this “rugby vs. gridiron” matter come up again and wish to refute it in a lasting form available on the Internet. Like Bob, I, too, have played both rugby and gridiron (in high school).



The claim for false machismo based on ruggers not wearing pads (“Pads are for girls” is a frequent catchphrase) is flawed on a very basic level, since any rugger or rugby spectator will assure you that the claim is now false. It may have been true years ago, but the rise of professionalism has changed things. The best and toughest ruggers in the world now play with pads of some kind. Try telling them they’re girls. And as for helmets, while it is true that scrumcaps aren’t hard like a gridiron helmet, they still are designed to offer some protection. Ostensibly for forwards, even some backline players wear them.



A rugby pal of mine (another fellow who played both games) described it best when he said, “Rugby is a contact sport. Gridiron is a collision sport.” As Bob states in his article, there are collisions going on at various parts of the field in every down. This is wearing upon muscle and bone, to say the least. And consider that for all its legendary violence, rugby is indeed a lifetime sport, and Old Boys and “Golden Oldies” leagues abound, with some players being quite advanced in age. (Click here for a tale of a 96-year-old Roman, and here for an account of a 90-year-old Japanese rugger.) There simply is no such thing as Old Boys Gridiron! Americans who, in their thirties or forties, still find themselves wanting to play football commonly play a variation called “flag football,” where tackling is prohibited. (A tackle is considered to have been made when a flag, or bit of fabric, is pulled from the waistband of the shorts.)



Finally, consider the playing careers of the respective world class rugger and NFL star. Both and considered to be in their prime in their twenties and perhaps early thirties. But a professional, world-class rugger can still play a respectably competitive game of rugby in his forties. (I’ve seen this.) There is really no question of an NFL star playing gridiron in his forties – he is too badly battered!



Having written all this, I will go on record as stating that I prefer rugby; it’s more fun to play and certainly more fun to watch! But I agree with Bob: Before non-Americans mindlessly criticize gridiron as being soft, they ought to try it. I am certain they will find it far tougher than they think.

It's an alternative form of nationalist dickwaving. As for the OP, I'm guessing that he wants to appear cultured and sophisticated (which means European to many Americans), unlike the provincial and barbaric Americans he is forced to put up with. Or something like that.

Either way, hockey is better than either football.

Agreed, agreed, and agreed.

It was still better when they played it with feet.

(1) prefer a game in which strategy and creativity are required,
From what I've seen, it essentially boils down to territory control: you've got to make holes in your opponents borders to advance and keep a good coverage over your own ground to prevent people from abusing an opening. In theory, exactly the same strategies are applicable to international football, excepting the long gap between plays granted to the american football games. The difference in practice is that soccer players need these strategies to come instinctively and the team needs to act synergetically in order for it to be effective. It's less common, I grant you that, but all the more impressive when it works.

Chess and Go, of course, are probably more interesting to explore strategically, but I love the subtle complexities of my weekly Hockey game, and the fast pace is really what keeps me playing (apart from the exercise). Field sports like that need to keep the players constantly on their toes as part of their challenge, and removing that, such as through the staggered play that American football so encourages, feels to me to eliminate a huge part of both the excitement and the mental dexterity.

(2) actually want to see scoring,
Why is scoring that important? Score is a means to an end, which is to reward good play by means of discrete targets. I personally would rather see a well fought and goal-less draw than a sloppy, carefree pointfest.

I think one of the reasons some Europeans are against American football is simply the name. They see it as taking the name away from the original football, soccer having a greater claim to the name 'football'. I couldn't really care less, but the confusion it causes can be annoying.

I agree with Kamsaki mostly, I dislike the stop-and-start of American-style sports, I much prefer the flowing style of soccer and rugby. Infact, my favourite field sport is probably field hockey. It shares similar characteristics to soccer, but is faster, and in my opinion, has a better attitude to it. I dislike the diving and lack of sportsmanship in soccer (thats based on the English Premiership, but I suspect its reasonably widespread).

This is very accurate. I have believed football to be the most boring sport imaginable for years, but at the beginning of this season, I decided to ask my father, who likes it, to thoroughly explain the sport to me. I'm still not a fan, but the game has at least become a great deal more watchable.

(Now, soccer, on the other hand, I've always liked. I'm not a big sports person in general, but I genuinely enjoy watching the World Cup. Heck, during last year's final, I was actually yelling at my TV. I normally make fun of people who do that. :p )

Yeah...Italy so cheated...France also fucked up by subbing out 3 of their top 4 guys...

never score...ok just for you yanks who can't understand we can change the scoring system...every time in football(soccer) someone scores a goal we'll award them 6 points, and after that they get a free kick at putting the ball over the bar from 12 meters out and give them another point...every time they kick the ball over the ball over the bar from anywhere on the field we award them another 3 points:rolleyes:...with the footballers accuracy and being able to put it over the bar from 50-70 meters football(soccer) could have scores approaching a basketball game...

*snip*

americans watch football because flowing sports where athletes need to think are too difficult for them to comprehend, they need to stop the play every few seconds to figure out whats going on...basketball, baseball and US football all sports for the mentally challenged...that's why they Hockey has a difficult time in the US not enough stoppages...
rofl...so true...we should invent an Americanized football just to show them what its like

chum tum tum
Gridiron has no reason to be internationalized.

No thanks. Not for me. Never understood the sport of dressing up as a tank, ramming people and then standing around while someone does something with a measuring tape.
I don't like rugby much either.

rofl

The reasons for the padding - note not ant-tank armor (you'll do your argument a world of good if you leave out the the stupid comments) - is, if you had bothered to read what I posted, that murderous fatality rate that Sullivan was commenting on, and which almost got the sport banned. The particular differences in American footbal and rugby result in one needing padding to be played without a prohbitively high death rate. (I noiw fully expect some idiots to come in and make the usual comments regarding how the sport ought to be banned if it's that dangerous. :rolleyes:)

Just proves how retarded it is...

Where is the skill in being employed to run into people?

How does being big and muscled, and running into people, constitute being a sportsman?

Sport is about inspiration, talent and drama, none of which are prominent in American Football.

more rofls and QFT...

I heart you muchly Daistallia.

And to those who say football has no skill, LaDanian Tomlinson (http://www3.youtube.com/watch?v=eH7QR7NWKLU).

Was there a point to that?

"Invades"?

And what do you call the repeated attempts to establish soccer in the US? Attempts that are doomed to fail IMO.

American football appeals to people who (1) prefer a game in which strategy and creativity are required, (2) actually want to see scoring, and (3) have IQ's above room temperature. American football appeals to those with characteristically American qualities, while soccer appeals primarily to proles. Since there are more proles in the world than people with characteristically American qualities, soccer is more popular worldwide. Since there are (fortunately) fewer proles than people with characteristically American qualities here in the States, American football is more popular here.

All the geniuses who say soccer will eventually catch on because of all the little kids who play it and all the soccer moms who back it ignore one key fact: once those kids are old enough to know better, they dump soccer and turn to a real sport. Like American football!

Mr. Posh Spice and any other invader from the world of proles and kickballers will fail miserably in trying to change that reality :p

Real football is not invading, it is trying to show the US what football is. Kids grow up and are brainwashed by their drunk dads who tell them running into each other is cool. So we're all killing each other and foreigners and wonder why the world hates us. That and fear...

From what I've seen, it essentially boils down to territory control: you've got to make holes in your opponents borders to advance and keep a good coverage over your own ground to prevent people from abusing an opening. In theory, exactly the same strategies are applicable to international football, excepting the long gap between plays granted to the american football games. The difference in practice is that soccer players need these strategies to come instinctively and the team needs to act synergetically in order for it to be effective. It's less common, I grant you that, but all the more impressive when it works.

Chess and Go, of course, are probably more interesting to explore strategically, but I love the subtle complexities of my weekly Hockey game, and the fast pace is really what keeps me playing (apart from the exercise). Field sports like that need to keep the players constantly on their toes as part of their challenge, and removing that, such as through the staggered play that American football so encourages, feels to me to eliminate a huge part of both the excitement and the mental dexterity.


Why is scoring that important? Score is a means to an end, which is to reward good play by means of discrete targets. I personally would rather see a well fought and goal-less draw than a sloppy, carefree pointfest.

:)

I think one of the reasons some Europeans are against American football is simply the name. They see it as taking the name away from the original football, soccer having a greater claim to the name 'football'. I couldn't really care less, but the confusion it causes can be annoying.

No, they don't like it because it is crap.

Am I the only person here who knows that there has been a professional (American) football league in Europe for some ten years? The "invasion" is over.Whether or not it will ever grow popular remains to be seen but football has been in Europe for a while now.

What's not to love about 11 guys (is it 11? :confused:) beating the shit outta each other? I have nothing against American Football, just that its called Football, yet closer to rugby than anything else. In american football you use your hands mosta the time dont you? Or am I wrong...? :confused:

Am I the only person here who knows that there has been a professional (American) football league in Europe for some ten years? The "invasion" is over.Whether or not it will ever grow popular remains to be seen but football has been in Europe for a while now.

To be quite blunt...no you are not.

Am I the only person here who knows that there has been a professional (American) football league in Europe for some ten years? The "invasion" is over.Whether or not it will ever grow popular remains to be seen but football has been in Europe for a while now.

And it's been failing ever since...just continues to be funded by the NFL...

And it's been failing ever since...just continues to be funded by the NFL...

I understand that,I guess I just don't understand the sudden ,for lack of a better word,outrage. It's nothing new and it's only one game. If there were a football game held every day in London, how big of an effect would it have on you? By the way,have you ever played (American)football? It isn't alway fun to watch,that depends on how evenly the two teams are matched and styles of play, but it's great fun to play.

"American football has become popular there."

What an odd thing to say.
Yeahg, first I've heard of it.

I understand that,I guess I just don't understand the sudden ,for lack of a better word,outrage. It's nothing new and it's only one game. If there were a football game held every day in London, how big of an effect would it have on you? By the way,have you ever played (American)football? It isn't alway fun to watch,that depends on how evenly the two teams are matched and styles of play, but it's great fun to play.

How? It's essentially self-harm.

How? It's essentially self-harm.
No, it's mutual harm. Somehow that's much more fun than hurting yourself.

Football's impossible not to like if you actually play it, but simply watching it isn't going to do the trick if there aren't some giveaways of balls and things. Hopefully the NFL will figure that out if they're interested in helping the game's popularity.

Watching World Cup as a kid never made soccer look fun to me.. it wasn't until I actually played the game in school that I actually sort of enjoyed soccer for a few minutes, before becoming bored and wanting to play football. But the point is, soccer looked mindlessly boring on t.v., while actually sort of amusing when I played it myself. The NFL should set up some tire-swings for the kids or something.. you need to experience it, rather than just watching.

QFT

Sports are fun, and there's no reason to be "nationalist" about them.

Anyways, a little variety never hurt anybody.

Rather stupid really. There is a reason why American football doesn't exist outside of America. No one will go to these games.

I understand that,I guess I just don't understand the sudden ,for lack of a better word,outrage. It's nothing new and it's only one game. If there were a football game held every day in London, how big of an effect would it have on you? By the way,have you ever played (American)football? It isn't alway fun to watch,that depends on how evenly the two teams are matched and styles of play, but it's great fun to play.

I've played it a few tiems and it was plain retarded. I've played frisbee football also, which is like the same thing with a frisbee and is also retarded. You pass it down the field player by player until you reach the endline and you cant run with it.

My boyfriend suggested changing the name of North American Football to Lemon Throw.

My boyfriend suggested changing the name of North American Football to Lemon Throw.

lol

My boyfriend suggested changing the name of North American Football to Lemon Throw.

well, it illustrates the point of the sport more.

However, the most practical name foor the sport is "tackling", since thats all that ever happens in it.

sports I've played...Football(soccer), Hockey, Basketball, Baseball, American football, skiing...so I know what they're about and which are the most difficult, which require the most training, stamina, intelligence, creativity...

Ranking those six I've taken part in...I never have played rugby but I know enough about it to move into 3rd spot, but I have to be fair so I didn't include it...Aussie Rules could be in the top 3 but I know little about it...

1-Football-subtle, high technical skills, flowing, tactical, creative and intelligent, requiring incredible levels of fitness, requires using body parts to control the ball which are not normal so development must begin at a early age to be successful.
2-Ice Hockey-same creativity and intelligence required as Football also very tactical, extremely fast, less endurance required than football but more it is much more physical...because it requires learning an unnatural method of propulsion it like football must be learned from a young age...


3-Basketball-creative, quick thinking, tactical
4-Skiing-Competitive skiing, frightening speeds in dangerous settings, highly technical, requires considerable strength...







-American football,amusing to play, dull dull dull to watch...the coach tells you what to do and when to do it, endurance needed low, physical strength needed high,















6-baseball-FFS's is that ever a tedious game.....long, long, long periods of absolutely nothing then mere seconds of panic before things settle down to sleepy time again...only four people have much to do pitcher, catcher, batter and 1st baseman...I had a teammate who always brought a book with him so he could read when he played center field...

Is cricket any better? I've never seen it, but read it takes quite some time.

Is cricket any better? I've never seen it, but read it takes quite some time.

cricket requires technical skillis similar to baseball and the games do indeed take very long to play...having played baseball and a local game based on cricket I can say while they are not very exciting to watch, but neither are a bad way to spend a Sunday afternoon with friends...

Is cricket any better? I've never seen it, but read it takes quite some time.

Sir, I encourage you not to watch cricket or try to learn anything about it.

I like the game, and really don't need to see a whole thread about how you think it sucks.

You are pathetic because you absolutely fail to even try to respect another's way of life. This entire thread is flamebait which I unfortunately bit on.

I don't think that American football is a bad thing; I think that the Americanisation of Europe is a bad thing.

Is cricket any better? I've never seen it, but read it takes quite some time.

Cricket is the best sport to watch ever. But only when England is beating the convicts.

Is cricket any better? I've never seen it, but read it takes quite some time.

Best sport in existance. If we could stop Australia playing England, it'd be perfect:D

American football isn't a game for retards. I've played it and it can be pretty complex. I suspect that those who hate it are either being somewhat nationalistic (no, nationalism isn't an American-only thing) or just ignorant. This whole thread is flamebait. I've read less-biased things from Fox news.

American Football is the sports equivalent of war. In war, you aren't constantly fighting 24-7. You wear armor and helmets because your life depends on it. When there is action, it's often intense. Before you criticise a sport, make sure you do some research first. I've played international football. I've played American football. Since I know what both are like, my opinion is less bull than someone who doesn't even know what he or she is bashing. They have a general idea, sure. They just lack the details needed to know exactly what they are bashing.

Best sport in existance. If we could stop Australia playing England, it'd be perfect:D

No. If we could stop England losing to Australia, it would be the best sport in existence.

Test matches only count when they are five days and are between England and Aus.

As a final bit, I'll leave you with this article: Pads and Helmets: Rugby vs. Gridiron (http://wesclark.com/rrr/pads_and_helmets.html)

That article is strewn with a number of errors due to the writer's lack of experience in playing rugby. (I'll point them out if you want).



American football isn't a game for retards. I've played it and it can be pretty complex. I suspect that those who hate it are either being somewhat nationalistic (no, nationalism isn't an American-only thing) or just ignorant. This whole thread is flamebait. I've read less-biased things from Fox news.
I just dislike the lack of individual thought in American football. It's so regimented, coach decides where everyone runs and everyone does it. I'd just like to see more occasions where there's the opportunity for some creativity.

This proves America just won't stop with it's cultural imperialism.

How could this possibly, or anything else for that matter, be defined as cultural imperialism? We're not forcing anything on anyone. If people want to watch/play American football in Europe, then they will. If no one does, then it won't be successful, end of story. It's not our fault people around the world watch MTV and use iPods. Some people need to cut out the xenophobia.

To be fair, England won the world cup playing an equally boring style of Rugby:D

No form of Rugby is as boring as Gridiron. Even if it has an unusually high number of stoppages, it still flows a hell of a lot faster than Gridiron.

Where does that term come from - gridiron? And why is it used with regards to American Rugby....I mean football?

Asked if it was ironic that a Bush critic was hosting an American icon event, Livingstone said: "No-one should think Britain is anti-American. I love American people, I love the country. That doesn't mean people can't criticize the American government."

Way to play it safe, Ken. He might be left-of-center, but Red Ken is a politician, through and through.

Way to play it safe, Ken. He might be left-of-center, but Red Ken is a politician, through and through.

Rubbish! Just because I think Bush is a craven psychopathic knobjockey does not mean I think the same off all Americans...

/not a Red Ken fan either...does that mean I hate all Londoners?

You guys are to afraid we Americans will beat you.

Football>Soccer

Just what I was thinking. I don't know why they're holding it in Wembley, I couldn't see the stadium being any more than a third full, and that's very optimistic. Even Livingstone expects 10,000 people to travel from America, and I couldn't see many Brits going to attend the game.

Everybody should give it a chance....Whether you personally like American Football or not, no need to trash it.. Believe it or not, there are alot of people around the world that aren't absolutely in love with soccer (football) but don't feel the need to trash the game.. I would bet alot more go to see it than you think.....

You guys are to afraid we Americans will beat you.

Football>Soccer
You seem to have your mathematical symbols mixed up. I think you wanted '=' instead of '>'. ;)

Originally Posted by Pepe Dominguez

Watching World Cup as a kid never made soccer look fun to me.. it wasn't until I actually played the game in school that I actually sort of enjoyed soccer for a few minutes, before becoming bored and wanting to play football. But the point is, soccer looked mindlessly boring on t.v., while actually sort of amusing when I played it myself. The NFL should set up some tire-swings for the kids or something.. you need to experience it, rather than just watching.

you played soccer for a few minutes and understand the game?...I can guarantee you that you can't kick the ball correctly, receive the ball correctly or do anything that would add to the enjoyment of the sport...you know nothing about the game to be able to pass judgment on it...

unlike American football where an individual can pick up the game in his first year of uni and become a professional, if you haven't begun soccer training as an 6-8 yr old you are never going to become a professional...the technical difficulty of mastering soccer is far, far, far more difficult than the american game this is not a game you can begin playing at 16 or 19 and hope to excel at.....then there is the knowledge requirements, having the coach tell you what to do on every play is not an option in soccer..again learning the mental part of soccer takes decades and many who think they understand it do not...

You guys are to afraid we Americans will beat you.

Football>Soccer

It's twisted so Americans can win their own crap. The rest of the world wouldn;t even bother trying because it's crap.

Everybody should give it a chance....Whether you personally like American Football or not, no need to trash it.. Believe it or not, there are alot of people around the world that aren't absolutely in love with soccer (football) but don't feel the need to trash the game.. I would bet alot more go to see it than you think.....

In every other country, virtually everyone likes real football and virtually everyone played it as a kid.

you played soccer for a few minutes and understand the game?...I can guarantee you that you can't kick the ball correctly, receive the ball correctly or do anything that would add to the enjoyment of the sport...you know nothing about the game to be able to pass judgment on it...

unlike American football where an individual can pick up the game in his first year of uni and become a professional, if you haven't begun soccer training as an 6-8 yr old you are never going to become a professional...the technical difficulty of mastering soccer is far, far, far more difficult than the american game this is not a game you can begin playing at 16 or 19 and hope to excel at.....then there is the knowledge requirements, having the coach tell you what to do on every play is not an option in soccer..again learning the mental part of soccer takes decades and many who think they understand it do not...

When I started getting interested in REAL FOOTBALL after WC2006, I played REAL FOOTBALL with myself, my sister, and my housekeepers cousin, and a few times at my day camp, but I was still crappy. I wanted to play REAL FOOTBALL more, but there is no one to play REAL FOOTBALL with and the teams are too much better for me and there isn't an intramural version. :(

I played with myself, my sister, and my housekeepers cousin, and a few times at my day camp, but I was still crappy. I wanted to play more, but there is no one to play with and the teams are too high up for me and there isn;t an intramural version. :(

Sounds sexy.

Sounds sexy.

Y'know...:rolleyes:

The cousin isn't female...

If people want to watch/play American football in Europe, then they will. If no one does, then it won't be successful, end of story.The inherent flaw in that statement is that it assumes that people haven't had the choice to watch American football over in Europe yet. However, the NFL Europe exists and has done so for quite some time. It hasn't been very popular though; for instance, most of the British teams have moved away from Britain because they weren't making any money there.

It hasn't been successful, but as this new venture shows, it isn't the end of the story.

The inherent flaw in that statement is that it assumes that people haven't had the choice to watch American football over in Europe yet. However, the NFL Europe exists and has done so for quite some time. It hasn't been very popular though; for instance, most of the British teams have moved away from Britain because they weren't making any money there.

It hasn't been successful, but as this new venture shows, it isn't the end of the story.

It means they are chasing a dead pheasant...meaning the idea is dead, but they keep trying it for no reason. Sel Appan idiom FTW.

It means they are chasing a dead pheasant...meaning the idea is dead, but they keep trying it for no reason. Sel Appan expression FTW.

FTL is more like it.

I'm trying to figure out just what you have against Football. Did your coach rape you during a little league game, or something? Or is it that you're a toothpick who wouldn't even have half a chance on any team, thus your (literally) disgusting, uninformed, idiotic rants against it (though I've seen many toothpicks playing football, it takes special courage to play with a body like that)?

Then again, you're probably just kissing foreign ass, much like I've seen you do several dozen times in the past. Whatever the case, this is absolutely ridiculous, pal. This entire thread can be considered one big dose of flame bait (which it is)... Which makes me wonder why it hasn't been moderated yet.

Don't get me wrong, though. I defend anything that people shit all over without reason, be it music, games, sports, cities, or even countries. And this is completely unreasonable rubbish (Hah! Irony!).

Y'know...:rolleyes:

The cousin isn't female...

And?

FTL is more like it.

I'm trying to figure out just what you have against Football. Did your coach rape you during a little league game, or something? Or is it that you're a toothpick who wouldn't even have half a chance on any team, thus your (literally) disgusting, uninformed, idiotic rants against it (though I've seen many toothpicks playing football, it takes special courage to play with a body like that)?

Then again, you're probably just kissing foreign ass, much like I've seen you do several dozen times in the past. Whatever the case, this is absolutely ridiculous, pal. This entire thread can be considered one big dose of flame bait (which it is)... Which makes me wonder why it hasn't been moderated yet.

Don't get me wrong, though. I defend anything that people shit all over without reason, be it music, games, sports, cities, or even countries. And this is completely unreasonable rubbish (Hah! Irony!).

It's not my fault I was born and live in the wrong country. American football is a crappily built little game that almost the entire native male population will get drunk over tonight and it's all advertising anyway. I cared about it for a little bit and I soon realized it was ridiculous. Golf and bowling are more interesting and I wish they'd drop those wastes of money at my school. I'm allowed to not like something and I'm allowed to wish I was born in Europe and I'm allowed to kiss their ass because I prefer their culture and can't have it because I can't live on my own yet legally here.

And?

*sigh*

Oh, and personally, while I like American Football a lot, much more than soccer (though the latter would be better if goals happened more often)

As an American, I think I'm justified in saying that that is a typical American attitude. It's essentially saying "this game would be better if it were fucking easy". It's awful. In "grid iron" (when did people start saying that?), you can still get half a goal, even if you screw up at a little over halfway there. In association football or hockey (AKA the two most unpopular pro sports in America), if you screw up at a little over halfway there, the other team gets the ball/puck, end of story. I guess its natural that, in the land of drive-thrus, lawsuits, and lotteries, where instant gratification is king, the highest scoring sports, football and basketball, are most popular. And it seems that most of my countrymen are too dumb to realise that, if you have more of something, it makes less of an impact. When Gilbert Arenas throws another three-pointer, or Brendan Haywood blocks a finger-roll, people barely react, but when Jens Lehmann blocks a shot, or Tomáš Rosický puts the ball in the net, it feels like a miracle just happened. But, no, soccer sucks because its not high scoring. :rolleyes:

Pathetic.

And?

Agreed.

It's not my fault I was born and live in the wrong country. American football is a crappily built little game that almost the entire native male population will get drunk over tonight and it's all advertising anyway. I cared about it for a little bit and I soon realized it was ridiculous. Golf and bowling are more interesting and I wish they'd drop those wastes of money at my school. I'm allowed to not like something and I'm allowed to wish I was born in Europe and I'm allowed to kiss their ass because I prefer their culture and can't have it because I can't live on my own yet legally here.

*backs away slowly with eyes bulged and hands outstretched*

As an American, I think I'm justified in saying that that is a typical American attitude. It's essentially saying "this game would be better if it were fucking easy". It's awful. In "grid iron" (when did people start saying that?), you can still get half a goal, even if you screw up at a little over halfway there. In association football or hockey (AKA the two most unpopular pro sports in America), if you screw up at a little over halfway there, the other team gets the ball/puck, end of story. I guess its natural that, in the land of drive-thrus, lawsuits, and lotteries, where instant gratification is king, the highest scoring sports, football and basketball, are most popular. And it seems that most of my countrymen are too dumb to realise that, if you have more of something, it makes less of an impact. When Gilbert Arenas throws another three-pointer, or Brendan Haywood blocks a finger-roll, people barely react, but when Jens Lehmann blocks a shot, or Tomáš Rosický puts the ball in the net, it feels like a miracle just happened. But, no, soccer sucks because its not high scoring. :rolleyes:

Pathetic.

I need to think more so i can write stuff like this :)

I need to think more so i can write stuff like this :)

You need to mature somewhat first.

THE "YES!" option refers to real football and not gridiron. Sorry for the potential misunderstanding.

NFL and their rubbish sport are trying to invade Europe, while continually referring to it as football, which it is only genetically and barely resembles the real sport. If I prayed, I ould pray for Europe and its salvation from this dark cloud that has hovered over North America for decades.

Link (http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news?slug=afp-amfootnflsupereng&prov=afp&type=lgns)

I'm surprised you live in New Jersey - most Americans (annoyingly) call real football "soccer".

I'm surprised you live in New Jersey - most Americans (annoyingly) call real football "soccer".

I'm a Europhile who tries to use the correct word (like metre and not meter). I call it soccer amngst fellow Americans or say futbol.

As an American, I think I'm justified in saying that that is a typical American attitude. It's essentially saying "this game would be better if it were fucking easy". It's awful. In "grid iron" (when did people start saying that?), you can still get half a goal, even if you screw up at a little over halfway there. In association football or hockey (AKA the two most unpopular pro sports in America), if you screw up at a little over halfway there, the other team gets the ball/puck, end of story. I guess its natural that, in the land of drive-thrus, lawsuits, and lotteries, where instant gratification is king, the highest scoring sports, football and basketball, are most popular. And it seems that most of my countrymen are too dumb to realise that, if you have more of something, it makes less of an impact. When Gilbert Arenas throws another three-pointer, or Brendan Haywood blocks a finger-roll, people barely react, but when Jens Lehmann blocks a shot, or Tomáš Rosický puts the ball in the net, it feels like a miracle just happened. But, no, soccer sucks because its not high scoring. :rolleyes:

Pathetic.

it's because they don't understand or appreciate the technical skills or mental requirements to play the game...to a person who has never played the game they just see people kicking a ball and have no idea what's involved...

I had a co-worker explaining to me the superior technically difficult to catch a football on a dead run over the shoulder it far far more difficult than anything in soccer...I replied "try the same thing with a soccer ball only with no hands... receive a long high pass on a run and with your 1st touch use your chest to control, on the 2nd touch as the ball drops with your foot you tap it 180 degrees back over your head, then spinning around on your third touch volley it into the back of the net...and all this time under pressure from a defender and the ball never touching the ground...

to someone who has never played the game they have no concept of how difficult something like that is to do...

Rubbish Ball?!

*Recalls all the things he said about respecting other sports for their different aspects repeatedly. It has done nothing.*

Fuck you, and any of you unathletic fucks who pretend to be sports gurus when in fact, you were probably the fat kid who got picked last for everything in gym class.

Anyone with an iota of physical prowress would be able to silently respect the differences between sports.

This shit pisses me off to no end.

I take solice in the fact that I was kicked out of two college Rugby teams for injuring someone by tackling them 'wrong'.

It's less the "we hate sport" thing and more the "we hate American culture being thrust upon us" (us=British).

And anyway, surely being "the fat kid who got picked last" illustrates EXACTLY why people hate sport, because of those self righteous, better than everybody TWATS who love themselves and like to wash each other in the showers.

Sport is great, I,for example, love fencing, tennis and rugby, its just the attitude of people who love it too much.

it's because they don't understand or appreciate the technical skills or mental requirements to play the game...to a person who has never played the game they just see people kicking a ball and have no idea what's involved...

I had a co-worker explaining to me the superior technically difficult to catch a football on a dead run over the shoulder it far far more difficult than anything in soccer...I replied "try the same thing with a soccer ball only with no hands... receive a long high pass on a run and with your 1st touch use your chest to control, on the 2nd touch as the ball drops with your foot you tap it 180 degrees back over your head, then spinning around on your third touch volley it into the back of the net...and all this time under pressure from a defender and the ball never touching the ground...

to someone who has never played the game they have no concept of how difficult something like that is to do...

That doesn't even make sense...

That doesn't even make sense...
Sure it does. It's a volley with a quick tap in the middle to bring it under control. It does, however, illustrate exactly the problem with the way people expect the game of international Football to be played; it focuses on the strength of the individual.

Football is, unfortunately, a case of a sport succumbing to the cult of celebrity. People expect individual players to shine, take on entire teams single handedly and score goals themselves, and view them as a disappointment when they don't do so. The transfer market is a billion-pound industry with individuals being bought and sold for stupidly large sums and receiving similarly ridiculous salaries. Of course, this approach really doesn't make for good sport most of the time, as high-valued players in positions of responsibility on the field have shown time and time again.

When teams focus instead on group strategies, as much of the WC2006 teams actually did quite well, you get fluid and exciting matches filled with good play from across the field. What we need to do is to spread this idea to the local football leagues and really make the most out of what could become a great source of entertainment. Perhaps this means cutting down the transfer market and docking a few wages, which'd be great; killing two birds with one stone.

THE "YES!" option refers to real football and not gridiron. Sorry for the potential misunderstanding.

NFL and their rubbish sport are trying to invade Europe, while continually referring to it as football, which it is only genetically and barely resembles the real sport. If I prayed, I ould pray for Europe and its salvation from this dark cloud that has hovered over North America for decades.

In 50 years the NFL will still be trying to carve out a market in Europe...and soccer will still be a joke in the U.S.

American Football will never be popular in Europe because Europeans don't understand why Americans find it more entertaining than Soccer.

Soccer will never be popular in the U.S. because Americans can't understand why Europeans find it more entertaining than ANYTHING.

So we're where we are now. :p

In 50 years the NFL will still be trying to carve out a market in Europe...and soccer will still be a joke in the U.S.

American Football will never be popular in Europe because Europeans don't understand why Americans find it more entertaining than Soccer.

Soccer will never be popular in the U.S. because Americans can't understand why Europeans find it more entertaining than ANYTHING.

So we're where we are now. :p

Wow... okay:

1) The NFL obviously wouldnt be moving a regular season game to London if there wasn't a market, which there obviously is.
2) No, most Americans aren't concerned about regular season soccer because its near impossible to get it broadcasted. Just like hockey. I do seem to remember, though, ESPN broadcasting most of the FIFA Cup games, even late late night ones in the US

*snip*

Football is, unfortunately, a case of a sport succumbing to the cult of celebrity.

*snip*

You've quite obviously been watching interviews of the wrong guys, because there wasn't even one that was self-hyping himself the entire two week Super Bowl layover period.

Maybe they do nothing but air interviews of Terrell Owens over there...

You've quite obviously been watching interviews of the wrong guys, because there wasn't even one that was self-hyping himself the entire two week Super Bowl layover period.

Maybe they do nothing but air interviews of Terrell Owens over there...
Being English, when I say Football, I mean Soccer unless otherwise explicitly stated.

Being English, when I say Football, I mean Soccer unless otherwise explicitly stated.

understood. i get the American in front.

THE "YES!" option refers to real football and not gridiron. Sorry for the potential misunderstanding.

NFL and their rubbish sport are trying to invade Europe, while continually referring to it as football, which it is only genetically and barely resembles the real sport. If I prayed, I ould pray for Europe and its salvation from this dark cloud that has hovered over North America for decades.

Link (http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news?slug=afp-amfootnflsupereng&prov=afp&type=lgns)
But the key thing to remember is that Europe already has it's own league...

My goodness there's been a lot of pointless and really quite mean-spirited snobbery on this thread, on both sides. Beginning with the OP (which was basically a big flame-bait, as others have pointed out).

Just cause you don't find something entertaining doesn't mean you should completely rip the shit out of it. I don't really find basketball all that entertaining, but I don't demean it by calling it "rubbishball" or stating that it shouldn't be considered a sport.

In the end, they're just games. I doubt that American football will ever get all that popular in Europe. Just as I doubt that soccer will ever become widely watched in the US. We've all already pretty much settled on our pastimes already.

Wow... okay:

1) The NFL obviously wouldnt be moving a regular season game to London if there wasn't a market, which there obviously is.
2) No, most Americans aren't concerned about regular season soccer because its near impossible to get it broadcasted. Just like hockey. I do seem to remember, though, ESPN broadcasting most of the FIFA Cup games, even late late night ones in the US

Not quite, they wouldn't move it if they didn't think there was at least a potential market. I think the NFL is trying to play catch up to football.

I doubt that American football will ever catch on in the UK, due to most people who would like the sport are already affiliated to rugby, and vice versa.

As for Football (soccer) I think it will catch on in America, since it's a very different game to anything else they have over there. And for no other reason but that the growing hispanic community over there is already affiliated with football (soccer).

Not quite, they wouldn't move it if they didn't think there was at least a potential market. I think the NFL is trying to play catch up to football.

I doubt that American football will ever catch on in the UK, due to most people who would like the sport are already affiliated to rugby, and vice versa.

As for Football (soccer) I think it will catch on in America, since it's a very different game to anything else they have over there. And for no other reason but that the growing hispanic community over there is already affiliated with football (soccer).

Since sport is essentially about markets and money, of course the NFL is trying to catch up to soccer. I doubt they'll catch it, but they'll try.

I find it interesting that you don't think rugby fans capable of following more than the one sport. I imagine, given the opportunity, they'd be happy to watch a different set of lads run around and collide on a field.

It's odd that professional soccer isn't bigger over here, given that almost every kid, boys and girls, play it for years in school. Go figure.

My goodness there's been a lot of pointless and really quite mean-spirited snobbery on this thread, on both sides. Beginning with the OP (which was basically a big flame-bait, as others have pointed out).

Just cause you don't find something entertaining doesn't mean you should completely rip the shit out of it. I don't really find basketball all that entertaining, but I don't demean it by calling it "rubbishball" or stating that it shouldn't be considered a sport.

In the end, they're just games. I doubt that American football will ever get all that popular in Europe. Just as I doubt that soccer will ever become widely watched in the US. We've all already pretty much settled on our pastimes already.

the NFL really only started becoming popular in the fifties it's not like it was always the dominate sport in the US...pastimes change, Baseball was at one time the biggest sport in the US, not anymore...Soccer is on the rise and it is the most popular sport in the US just not with the media and boomer generation(neither of whom understand the game) this will change as the millions of those now playing will direct the medias attention according to market demands...18 million Americans are active registered soccer players and there are more who are not registered...times change a soccer will become big sport in the US...

It's odd that professional soccer isn't bigger over here, given that almost every kid, boys and girls, play it for years in school. Go figure.

those millions of boys and girls are not yet old enough to take influential media positions...I don't know if you're old enough to have noticed but 20 yrs ago you would never see a tv commercial with soccer in it, now it's common, 20 yrs ago no one would have ever made a soccer movie in the US...the demographics of american sports fans are changing...

That doesn't even make sense...

Mayhaps you should try learning a bit more about the sports that you are bashing/praising before you post such inflamatory stuff.

IMO, in response to some posts and some ideas on this thread, both sports are hard, both are fun to play, you can't master either sport right away (most American pro football players have grown up playing American football...), both sports are fun to watch, both sports are complex, European football is easier for the casual fan to watch and understand (less rules), the two games are incredibly different, American football is more coach-oriented, both games are better if the members of the team play together rather than for themselves (selfish play=bad), being an American or a European does not create some magical difference in terms of what sport you will like more, and sports flaming/flamebaiting is still flaming/flamebaiting.


Edit: I know nothing of rugby, so I won't comment on it. And, for me, baseball is the greatest sport both to play and watch.

That doesn't even make sense...
it would to anyone who knows the game, which is the point I suppose...most americans have absolutely no concept of the technical difficulty of football(soccer)

i'd just like to throw the comment out there than the OP is an idiot for creating such a biased poll.


o, and i dig both forms of football.

In 50 years the NFL will still be trying to carve out a market in Europe...and soccer will still be a joke in the U.S.

American Football will never be popular in Europe because Europeans don't understand why Americans find it more entertaining than Soccer.

Soccer will never be popular in the U.S. because Americans can't understand why Europeans find it more entertaining than ANYTHING.

So we're where we are now. :p

I think eventually Americans will wisen up to what football really is. :)

Real football is not invading, it is trying to show the US what football is. Kids grow up and are brainwashed by their drunk dads who tell them running into each other is cool.

Just like kickballers and soccer moms tell kids that running up and down a field without any planning, using the same kinds of plays without variety and without end, and hoping that the ball will find its way into the net by "instinct", is "cool."

Face it, pal. Soccer is a relatively non-intellectual game. Soccer = prolefeed.

So we're all killing each other and foreigners and wonder why the world hates us.

Oderint dum metuant, baby :D

the NFL really only started becoming popular in the fifties it's not like it was always the dominate sport in the US...pastimes change, Baseball was at one time the biggest sport in the US, not anymore...Soccer is on the rise and it is the most popular sport in the US just not with the media and boomer generation(neither of whom understand the game) this will change as the millions of those now playing will direct the medias attention according to market demands...18 million Americans are active registered soccer players and there are more who are not registered...times change a soccer will become big sport in the US...

As I said before, when I'm talking about football, I'm not generally talking about the NFL. I much prefer college sports of any kind to professional leagues.

To be sure, people like playing soccer, but a lot of people at my school liked playing it but didn't like watching it on TV. If you do, great for you.

The main point of my post was that people are getting incredibly snappy about this and being a bunch of asses over a couple games. The point of games is recreation, fun. If a sport is fun for you, play it, watch it, follow it, whatever. If it's not, then don't.

I think eventually Americans will wisen up to what football really is. :)

You know, I used to think so too...then I joined these forums.

It has nothing to do with the lack of acceptance of American Football overseas. Americans couldn't care less what the rest of the world thinks...we like the sport, and it's here to stay.

The American people couldn't care less about a Europe league, or games in Japan or Mexico. It's the NFL trying to market itself that causes the "invasion" of the American sport that Europe so seems to detest. The average American just want's to see their team win just like every fan of every sports team does.

What prevents soccer from really establishing itself in America is the attitude of those who support soccer. Americans bad-mouth soccer, but in the end they don't really care. They don't care if Soccer becomes popular here, so long as Football remains. They don't care if Football ever catches on anywhere else, so long as it is here-to-stay in the states.

Soccer enthusiasts, however, not only bad-mouth Football, but seem to advance the point (directly or indirectly) that since Football is the "inferior" sport, that it's fans are "inferior", and will continue to be so until they come to accept the "superior" sport of soccer and let football die a slow death.

So long as that kind of elitism is widespread in the rhetoric of Soccer supporters, you will continue to see an utter lack of mainstream interest in soccer in the U.S.

You know, I used to think so too...then I joined these forums.

It has nothing to do with the lack of acceptance of American Football overseas. Americans couldn't care less what the rest of the world thinks...we like the sport, and it's here to stay.

The American people couldn't care less about a Europe league, or games in Japan or Mexico. It's the NFL trying to market itself that causes the "invasion" of the American sport that Europe so seems to detest. The average American just want's to see their team win just like every fan of every sports team does.

What prevents soccer from really establishing itself in America is the attitude of those who support soccer. Americans bad-mouth soccer, but in the end they don't really care. They don't care if Soccer becomes popular here, so long as Football remains. They don't care if Football ever catches on anywhere else, so long as it is here-to-stay in the states.

Soccer enthusiasts, however, not only bad-mouth Football, but seem to advance the point (directly or indirectly) that since Football is the "inferior" sport, that it's fans are "inferior", and will continue to be so until they come to accept the "superior" sport of soccer and let football die a slow death.

So long as that kind of elitism is widespread in the rhetoric of Soccer supporters, you will continue to see an utter lack of mainstream interest in soccer in the U.S.

That and the fact that, to be perfectly honest, Soccer is kinda boring.

That and the fact that, to be perfectly honest, Soccer is kinda boring.

I tend to agree, at least in terms of watching it on TV or live.

Playing it, however, is fun...I make a good goalie. :)

I tend to agree, at least in terms of watching it on TV or live.

Playing it, however, is fun...I make a good goalie. :)

I wouldn't mind watching American football on tv but it seems to take an eternity and for me nothing really happens. Thats probably what a lot of people think about football though so each to their own. Two different sports that unfortunatly have the same name but take different skills.

So long as that kind of elitism is widespread in the rhetoric of Soccer supporters, you will continue to see an utter lack of mainstream interest in soccer in the U.S.

Aye, but it doesn't help when you have block headed tarts like Sel Appa unwilling to be anything other than a xenophobic prick.

Aye, but it doesn't help when you have block headed tarts like Sel Appa unwilling to be anything other than a xenophobic prick.

My thoughts exactly. I like football, watching it brings me entertainment, it's fun for me. That doesn't mean I hate soccer. I don't enjoy watching it, but if it makes people happy, by all means, go for it. The point is to have fun, do what's fun for you and let other people have their fun, too. American, or Gridiron football is a completely different game from Soccer, or what everyone else calls Football. People are going to like different things. I'm an American, but I don't enjoy basketball much at all. If other people do, good for them. No reason to deride the sports others enjoy.

If unpopular is playing in front of 40,000 to 50,000 fans, then I guess NFL Europa is doomed to fail. That must be why the NFL owners approved the business plan for NFL-E through 2010.

I thought this thread was about the rubberball and I was gunna come in here and tell you that it's been in Europe for years. But you aren't so... carry on.

Threads like this are pointless.

Debating the merits of both sports is pointless.

The fact is simple. The NFL has every right to see if it has a following in Europe, just like European soccer has done in the U.S. If Europeans find it worthy of their attention, it will prosper. If they don't, it won't last long there. Does that really matter, though? America has over 300 million people. That's more than enough people to sustain the NFL.

Further, I'd like to point out that I watch two sports. The NFL and NASCAR. It's perfectly possible for other people to watch both soccer AND football.

The idea that there's some sort of "competition" between the two is sort of... dumb.

I think I should renew what Katganistan mentioned on the first page. The NFL would hardly be having these games outside the U.S. unless it was expected to turn a profit. Clearly it is expected to succeed, at least on this limited basis.

Mind you that NFL-Europa games in Germany and the Netherlands have averaged nearly 19,000 attendees per game, watching the equivalent minor league players. If the English won't go to the game, I guess the Germans and Dutch will.

Since sport is essentially about markets and money, of course the NFL is trying to catch up to soccer. I doubt they'll catch it, but they'll try.

I find it interesting that you don't think rugby fans capable of following more than the one sport. I imagine, given the opportunity, they'd be happy to watch a different set of lads run around and collide on a field.


I'm not, but when it enters real supporting terms, namely what they encourage their kids to take up and what they'll pay money to go and watch etc, rugby takes precedent.

Look at NFL Europe, in England and Scotland, where rugby is at least reasonably popular, it fails, in Germany and the Netherlands where rugby isn't, it succeeds.


Just like kickballers and soccer moms tell kids that running up and down a field without any planning, using the same kinds of plays without variety and without end, and hoping that the ball will find its way into the net by "instinct", is "cool."

Face it, pal. Soccer is a relatively non-intellectual game. Soccer = prolefeed.

No, firstly planning is used. Teams go out with a plan of what they're aiming to do, the higher level you go the more planning.

And requiring the players to be able to think for themselves rather than just what they're told makes it more intellectual, not less.

I really don't think that's true, but I'll spread it around until it is.
A short history of American football.

American football is derived directly from...

...Canadian football. American football was born when the football squads of McGill University and Harvard University faced each other in a series of matches in 1874. At the time, Harvard played a football-like kicking game, while McGill played a rugby-like handling game. The matches alternated between the two schools' sets of rules, and soon Harvard had persuaded other US schools to adopt the rugby-like rules. The first formal rules of American football were decided at the Massasoit Convention in 1876.

This probably explains why Canadian football retains more vestiges of rugby in its rules than American football does.

Just like kickballers and soccer moms tell kids that running up and down a field without any planning, using the same kinds of plays without variety and without end, and hoping that the ball will find its way into the net by "instinct", is "cool."

Face it, pal. Soccer is a relatively non-intellectual game. Soccer = prolefeed.



Oderint dum metuant, baby :D

Wow... there are so many different kinds of plays in real football, unlike gridiron where two lines of "tanks" charge at each other. lmao...

You know, I used to think so too...then I joined these forums.

It has nothing to do with the lack of acceptance of American Football overseas. Americans couldn't care less what the rest of the world thinks...we like the sport, and it's here to stay.

The American people couldn't care less about a Europe league, or games in Japan or Mexico. It's the NFL trying to market itself that causes the "invasion" of the American sport that Europe so seems to detest. The average American just want's to see their team win just like every fan of every sports team does.

What prevents soccer from really establishing itself in America is the attitude of those who support soccer. Americans bad-mouth soccer, but in the end they don't really care. They don't care if Soccer becomes popular here, so long as Football remains. They don't care if Football ever catches on anywhere else, so long as it is here-to-stay in the states.

Soccer enthusiasts, however, not only bad-mouth Football, but seem to advance the point (directly or indirectly) that since Football is the "inferior" sport, that it's fans are "inferior", and will continue to be so until they come to accept the "superior" sport of soccer and let football die a slow death.

So long as that kind of elitism is widespread in the rhetoric of Soccer supporters, you will continue to see an utter lack of mainstream interest in soccer in the U.S.

Gridiron is extremely inferior. It's utter crap without any sense.

That and the fact that, to be perfectly honest, Soccer is kinda boring.

Hahahahahaha...no. It,s a very tense sport that hinges on every moment.

Aye, but it doesn't help when you have block headed tarts like Sel Appa unwilling to be anything other than a xenophobic prick.

But, I live in the US. How can I be xenophobic if I don't like a rubbish sport played here...? :confused:

Threads like this are pointless.

Debating the merits of both sports is pointless.

The fact is simple. The NFL has every right to see if it has a following in Europe, just like European soccer has done in the U.S. If Europeans find it worthy of their attention, it will prosper. If they don't, it won't last long there. Does that really matter, though? America has over 300 million people. That's more than enough people to sustain the NFL.

Further, I'd like to point out that I watch two sports. The NFL and NASCAR. It's perfectly possible for other people to watch both soccer AND football.

The idea that there's some sort of "competition" between the two is sort of... dumb.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!! Gridiron and car racing are not sports at all. car racing doesn't even remotely resemble a sport.

I think I should renew what Katganistan mentioned on the first page. The NFL would hardly be having these games outside the U.S. unless it was expected to turn a profit. Clearly it is expected to succeed, at least on this limited basis.

I think they are just smoking some strong shit.


I'd like to round off with a pic:
http://www.maxwaugh.com/images/04.18.03-scrimmage/pile.jpg
This shows how retarded Gridiron is. A pile of guys...serves what purpose? :confused:

Strange how people love only one and never the other.

I hate watching college ball even though I play it. Maybe because the names are a little outrageous.

My friend plays for the University of South Carolina, go Gamecocks! Woo! :D

i love college ball,and pro ball.

i even enjoy futball(soccer)but only to play.
watching soccer is like watching grass grow,but then i was not raised on it's nuances.(i did play all thru middle school and high school)

american football is not men bashing into eachother..it is far more subtle...every player on every play is critical and serves a function.

much like soccer probably does.
when i was younger,i hated ice hockey,to me..it seemed like a bunch of guys chasing around a puck with no apparent rhyme nor reason.
much like soccer.
then i learned the game,and every players position and responsibility..now i love hockey.
i like to play soccer,but damn it is boring to watch..to me.
i do like watching some arsenal games with my kid brother...he loves soccer,and him getting fired up,gets me fired up.
that and when the world cup comes around,i go to this irish bar down the road from me(i actually hooked up a satelite there so they could watch it)and they really get fired up...and i thought eagle fans were nuts..lol

I'd like to round off with a pic:
http://www.maxwaugh.com/images/04.18.03-scrimmage/pile.jpg
This shows how retarded Gridiron is. A pile of guys...serves what purpose? :confused:

You could say the same about rugby. If you don't like a sport, don't watch it. No excuse for flamebaiting and acting in general like a complete turd.

You could say the same about rugby. If you don't like a sport, don't watch it. No excuse for flamebaiting and acting in general like a complete turd.

*hands you a special hashijuana cookie for the excellent and relevant use of the word "turd"*

*hands you a special hashijuana cookie for the excellent and relevant use of the word "turd"*

[Happily accepts and eats special hashijuana cookie]. :)

Thank you, good sir.

http://www.cbc.ca/cp/sports/070202/s020257A.jpg

This goes to show how fucking stupid soccer is. Wow, he's kicking a ball! What purpose does it serve?

Oh right, it's a FUCKING SPORT. It's for ENTERTAINMENT and FUN. What fucking purpose do you want sports to serve, American football, soccer, rugby, baseball, basketball, cricket, polo, racing, or whatnot?

*pic*

This goes to show how fucking stupid soccer is. Wow, he's kicking a ball! What purpose does it serve?

Oh right, it's a FUCKING SPORT. It's for ENTERTAINMENT and FUN. What fucking purpose do you want sports to serve, American football, soccer, rugby, baseball, basketball, cricket, polo, racing, or whatnot?

You're talking about something completely different. Gridiron is so illogical and stupid for the many reasons stated. You and the rest of America need to wake up and stop following this crap.

LOCK REQUESTED

You're talking about something completely different. Gridiron is so illogical and stupid for the many reasons stated. You and the rest of America need to wake up and stop following this crap.

LOCK REQUESTED

Thread should have been locked when you posted it, for blatant flamebaiting. Stop being an ass. You get to make fun of a sport a lot of people enjoy but then when they deride one that you like you get all pissy? Come on, don't be an emo.

Aye, but it doesn't help when you have block headed tarts like Sel Appa unwilling to be anything other than a xenophobic prick.

QFT

You're talking about something completely different. Gridiron is so illogical and stupid for the many reasons stated. You and the rest of America need to wake up and stop following this crap.

LOCK REQUESTED

You want your thread locked because your own baiting ways are getting the replies you wanted?!? Wonderful, wonderful. (I've been avoiding this thread due to your blockheadedness, but this was too funny.)

QFT



You want your thread locked because your own baiting ways are getting the replies you wanted?!? Wonderful, wonderful. (I've been avoiding this thread due to your blockheadedness, but this was too funny.)

:D

You're talking about something completely different. Gridiron is so illogical and stupid for the many reasons stated. You and the rest of America need to wake up and stop following this crap.

LOCK REQUESTED

Really? Because someone who clearly knows nothing about the sport (which is ok, if you're not interested) nor willing to actually take the time to check it out before posting idiotic drivel (which is just plain stupid) tells us to? I don't think so.

:D

Might I suggest watching how things go here: http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=517281

You're talking about something completely different. Gridiron is so illogical and stupid for the many reasons stated. You and the rest of America need to wake up and stop following this crap.

LOCK REQUESTED
REQUEST DENIED

Also, quit flaming and flamebaiting. Like it or not, there are people that have different opinions than you. Get over yourself.


The Most Glorious Hack
NationStates Game Moderator

Gridiron is extremely inferior. It's utter crap without any sense.

Way to prove my point.

Also...good job on the thread lock request. :rolleyes:

It's not my fault I was born and live in the wrong country. American football is a crappily built little game that almost the entire native male population will get drunk over tonight and it's all advertising anyway. I cared about it for a little bit and I soon realized it was ridiculous. Golf and bowling are more interesting and I wish they'd drop those wastes of money at my school. I'm allowed to not like something and I'm allowed to wish I was born in Europe and I'm allowed to kiss their ass because I prefer their culture and can't have it because I can't live on my own yet legally here.

However much you may wish you were European, you're still American. You may as well accept that. And this is coming from a raging Francophile who is currently living in France. As much as I may love France and French culture I recognize that I'm American and accept that.

I think it's great that different countries have sports they can claim as their own. If Americans get great entertainment out of their version, then more power to them. I would not want to make them all understand cricket purely because it is 'British' (mind you, the current England team are having a hard time understanding it)

I think it's also fun to watch the different sports, even if to stare at the screen and think WTF. I saw some Bass fishing from Florida on Sky the other night and did not understand the complexity of it but enjoyed seeing grown men using more modern technology than I could ever associate with fishing getting really excited about landing fish

Rubbish Ball?!

*Recalls all the things he said about respecting other sports for their different aspects repeatedly. It has done nothing.*

Fuck you, and any of you unathletic fucks who pretend to be sports gurus when in fact, you were probably the fat kid who got picked last for everything in gym class.

Anyone with an iota of physical prowress would be able to silently respect the differences between sports.

This shit pisses me off to no end.

I take solice in the fact that I was kicked out of two college Rugby teams for injuring someone by tackling them 'wrong'.


Ahhh and that I guess is why 'Jocks' are portiaed as lacking in brains huh?

Coz little things piss them off no end, and they are actulay proud of the injuries they have cuased by not playing to the rules. Fuckwit!

Oppps sorry that just poped out!

http://www.cbc.ca/cp/sports/070202/s020257A.jpg

This goes to show how fucking stupid soccer is. Wow, he's kicking a ball! What purpose does it serve?


Isn't that a woman?

Isn't that a woman?

Or a man with gynecomastia.

http://football-times.com/files/images/Lukas%20Podolski_0.preview.jpg

http://news.dipag.com/pictures/lowres/20060625/German-striker-Miroslav-Klose-in-action-0000008429.jpg

Two perfect examples of football excellence (could only find national team pics, sorry Bayern/Werder fans).

REQUEST DENIED

Also, quit flaming and flamebaiting. Like it or not, there are people that have different opinions than you. Get over yourself.
One-nil to the moderation team. Or is that six?

Sel Appa has left the building.

Reason: No point talking to senseless folk.

I believe someone (yes you Turquoise Days) is going to be eating a burkah fairly soon!


Ticket rush for NFL Wembley game

Wembley is due to open this Spring
The NFL game to be played at the new Wembley Stadium on 28 October is already guaranteed to be a sell-out.

Around 160,000 fans requested more than 500,000 tickets in just three days following last Friday's pre-Super Bowl confirmation of the teams and venue.

Miami will face the New York Giants in the first regular-season NFL game to be staged outside of the Americas.

"Nearly all the requests have come from UK-based fans," said NFL UK managing director Alistair Kirkwood.

"These figures do not take into account the allocation of tickets for Dolphins and Giants fans from the US.

"So we anticipate a very quick sell-out when tickets go on sale in early March."

Wembley is expecting to seat between 85,000-90,000 for the game.

source (http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/other_sports/american_football/6339425.stm)

You could say the same about rugby. If you don't like a sport, don't watch it. No excuse for flamebaiting and acting in general like a complete turd.

Not at all. Union, since I can't be bothered to digress into the realms of League, has long since eschewed any such simple notions. Granted, forward play requires physicality, and consistent presence at Rucks and Mauls, however all players are able to make individual decisions, breaks, passes, and replace others in the line.

In any case, I assume you contrast the pile up cited with a ruck. The analogy falls down in consideration of the purpose of a ruck; to secure the ball, and allow the back line to play. However, Gridiron expects such physicality so as to allow the "throwy bloke" to throw to the "Quick bloke".

Ahhh and that I guess is why 'Jocks' are portiaed as lacking in brains huh?

Coz little things piss them off no end, and they are actulay proud of the injuries they have cuased by not playing to the rules. Fuckwit!

Oppps sorry that just poped out!

Sel Appa has left the building.

Reason: No point talking to senseless folk.

Personally, I find both of those post very funny, though probably not for reasons the authors are happy about.

I believe someone (yes you Turquoise Days) is going to be eating a burkah fairly soon!

True, but I think it's as much the novelty value as anything. But at the rate Wembley's going the players are going to have to help out with the bricklaying.

Not at all. Union, since I can't be bothered to digress into the realms of League, has long since eschewed any such simple notions. Granted, forward play requires physicality, and consistent presence at Rucks and Mauls, however all players are able to make individual decisions, breaks, passes, and replace others in the line.

In any case, I assume you contrast the pile up cited with a ruck. The analogy falls down in consideration of the purpose of a ruck; to secure the ball, and allow the back line to play. However, Gridiron expects such physicality so as to allow the "throwy bloke" to throw to the "Quick bloke".

I'm not bashing rugby, I quite enjoy watching rugby. I'm just pointing out that the OP is being a spiteful cockwad over some games. If he doesn't like American Football (which apparently should really be called Canadian Football), he should just abstain from watching it instead of being a jerk for no reason. I mean, as I've said before, I don't much care for basketball, but I don't bash it needlessly, I just don't watch it or play it. A good comparison is music I like or don't like. I do not enjoy newer country music, but I don't go around trashing it, I just listen to music I enjoy instead. If you like soccer, good for you, have fun with that, enjoy your sport. Isn't that the point anyway? If you like American/Canadian Football, go enjoy that sport. I really see no reason for insulting sports others enjoy just because you enjoy something different. Why is that such a hard concept for Sel Appa?

I'm not bashing rugby, I quite enjoy watching rugby. I'm just pointing out that the OP is being a spiteful cockwad over some games. If he doesn't like American Football (which apparently should really be called Canadian Football), he should just abstain from watching it instead of being a jerk for no reason. I mean, as I've said before, I don't much care for basketball, but I don't bash it needlessly, I just don't watch it or play it. A good comparison is music I like or don't like. I do not enjoy newer country music, but I don't go around trashing it, I just listen to music I enjoy instead. If you like soccer, good for you, have fun with that, enjoy your sport. Isn't that the point anyway? If you like American/Canadian Football, go enjoy that sport. I really see no reason for insulting sports others enjoy just because you enjoy something different. Why is that such a hard concept for Sel Appa?

Let all us sports fanatics join together in harmony and the common notion that the OP is an arse.:)

I believe someone (yes you Turquoise Days) is going to be eating a burkah fairly soon!


Ticket rush for NFL Wembley game

Wembley is due to open this Spring
The NFL game to be played at the new Wembley Stadium on 28 October is already guaranteed to be a sell-out.

Around 160,000 fans requested more than 500,000 tickets in just three days following last Friday's pre-Super Bowl confirmation of the teams and venue.

Miami will face the New York Giants in the first regular-season NFL game to be staged outside of the Americas.

"Nearly all the requests have come from UK-based fans," said NFL UK managing director Alistair Kirkwood.

"These figures do not take into account the allocation of tickets for Dolphins and Giants fans from the US.

"So we anticipate a very quick sell-out when tickets go on sale in early March."

Wembley is expecting to seat between 85,000-90,000 for the game.
Damn.