NationStates Jolt Archive

http://www.boston.com/news/science/articles/2007/01/11/idaho_governor_calls_for_gray_wolf_kill/

Idaho's governor said Thursday he will support public hunts to kill all but 100 of the state's gray wolves after the federal government strips them of protection under the Endangered Species Act.

Gov. C.L. "Butch" Otter told The Associated Press that he wants hunters to kill about 550 gray wolves. That would leave about 100 wolves, or 10 packs, according to a population estimate by state wildlife officials.

The 100 surviving wolves would be the minimum before the animals could again be considered endangered.

"I'm prepared to bid for that first ticket to shoot a wolf myself," Otter said earlier Thursday during a rally of about 300 hunters.

Otter complained that wolves are rapidly killing elk and other animals essential to Idaho's multimillion-dollar hunting industry. The hunters, many wearing camouflage clothing and blaze-orange caps, applauded wildly during his comments.

Suzanne Stone, a spokeswoman for the advocacy group Defenders of Wildlife in Boise, said Otter's proposal would return wolves to the verge of eradication.

"Essentially he has confirmed our worst fears for the state of Idaho: That this would be a political rather than a biological management of the wolf population," Stone said. "There's no economic or ecological reason for maintaining such low numbers. It's simple persecution."

Wolves were reintroduced to the northern Rocky Mountains a decade ago after being hunted to near-extinction. More than 1,200 now live in the region.

The U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service plans to start removing federal protections from gray wolves in Montana and Idaho in the next few weeks.

A plan drafted by Idaho's wildlife agency calls for maintaining a minimum of 15 wolf packs _ higher than Otter's proposal of 10 packs.

Jeff Allen, a policy adviser for the state Office of Species Conservation, said 15 wolf packs would allow "a cushion" between the surviving wolf population and the minimum number that federal biologists would allow before the animals are again considered endangered.

Allen said Otter and state wildlife officials agree on wolf strategy and will be able to reach a consensus on specific numbers.

"You don't want to be too close to 10 because all of a sudden when one (wolf) is hit by a car or taken in defense of property, you're back on the list," Allen said.

I wish I could say that I didn't expect something this to happen, but I did.

That's just stupid. I hope at least one of the hunters gets killed when he pisses of a pack. And just because a species is not endangered doesn't mean it should be slaughtered til it is. Only kill if you're about to be killed or if you intend to eat your kill. Wolves don't attack people unless provoked and people don't eat wolves so there's no reason to kill them.

Wolves don't attack people unless provoked and people don't eat wolves so there's no reason to kill them.

Sure there is. How are the manly men going to prove their manly unless they shoot a wolf at a distance with a high powered rifle and a scope?

That's just stupid. I hope at least one of the hunters gets killed when he pisses of a pack. And just because a species is not endangered doesn't mean it should be slaughtered til it is. Only kill if you're about to be killed or if you intend to eat your kill. Wolves don't attack people unless provoked and people don't eat wolves so there's no reason to kill them.

Seriously and it is not even like they are getting into livestock or anything like that, they are killing wild animals like elk and such. I mean what the fuck? Isn't that what they are supose to be eating? Shit.:mad:

Sure there is. How are the manly men going to prove their manly unless they shoot a wolf at a distance with a high powered rifle and a scope?

hmmm,
i get your point,but the same argument could be made against deer hunters.
i think it is stupid and senseless to kill these wolves just to protect the tourism created by hunters.
i use to hunt many years ago,alot of my friends still do.
i was turned off for whatever reason,i did not like killing things,i did not like all the effort involved in gutting/skinning and then butchering the animal to get food when i could go to the acme.
my friends that still hunt,do use the pelts/fur and the meat...i had some the other night(venison)but i myself just lost my urge to hunt for meat.
if i was hungry i still would hunt,but i am not hungry.

i have never liked trophy hunting,never killed an animal for no reason...and those are the ones i think your alluding too...killing for no purpose other then the kill or the trophy..that disgusts me.
i suspect alot of these so called hunters are just that..trophy hunters that the state is catering too,i may be wrong but i doubt it.

i have zero problems with hunting,aint my cup of tea anymore,but it is needed to maintain an ecological balance with some of the huge herds we have.
but only if the hunter uses the meat or gives it to the needy..fine with me..but to kill just for a trophy or just to kill is b.s.

and i find their reasons for this culling suspect...about money if you will,and that also is bullshit.

i may go bear hunting next year,partly for the hunt,partly because they are becoming somewhat of a threat were i go in the winter(to much encroachment on the land,so there are an over population of bear)..but rest assured i will eat the meat and use the hide.
hunting in and of itself is not bad..but killing for no reason is.

the wolf hunt in my opinion accomplishes nothing more then catering to jerks,and economics.

i am dead against this hunt unless someone can give other reasons.

one day soon, idaho people will be outnumber by californian transplants. i look forward to it greatly.

fuck i hate this state

one day soon, idaho people will be outnumber by californian transplants. i look forward to it greatly.

fuck i hate this state

You live in Idaho? Wow, I feel kind of sorry for you. At least you can travel to California or Oregon, though.

Otter complained that wolves are rapidly killing elk and other animals essential to Idaho's multimillion-dollar hunting industry.

this article should have focused on objectivity more, and instead put it as "otter made up a bunch of bullshit that goes against the actual facts, which have been pointed out to him numerous times."

one day soon, idaho people will be outnumber by californian transplants. i look forward to it greatly.

fuck i hate this state
Yeah, but that means some of the weirder ones either go into Montana or try to sneak across into Nevada and I wish they'd stop.

Yeah, but that means some of the weirder ones either go into Montana or try to sneak across into Nevada and I wish they'd stop.

But Nevada gets a lot of people from everywhere else, so it balances out.

I'd really like to live in Vegas...

I'd really like to live in Vegas...
Dear God why?









One of these days we're going to have someone on NSG from Southern Nevada and the sniping between that person and me will rival ANYTHING done between Nazz and Deep Kimchi.

Dear God why?

Because I really like gambling and drinking.

One of these days we're going to have someone on NSG from Southern Nevada and the sniping between that person and me will rival ANYTHING done between Nazz and Deep Kimchi.

:eek:

Because I really like gambling and drinking.
That's the whole of the state, minus Bolder City (silly Feds) so you don't have to put up with the rest of Vegas.

*begins hunting people from Idaho*

Let the games begin mother fuckers!

That's the whole of the state, minus Bolder City (silly Feds) so you don't have to put up with the rest of Vegas.

Yeah, but all of the finance jobs are in Vegas. I need work to support my habits after all.

Because I really like gambling and drinking.



:eek:

then vegas would suit you perfectly...lol

just got back from there...was out there from jan.5th to the 10th...and i thought new orleans was off the hook..i spent 4 days drinking,gambling and generally in a daze.

i have a recollection of going to hoover dam(awesome)but we managed to find a casino between vegas and the dam and got hammered there also.

the only real clear thing i remember is the girls(lots and lots of them)and renting a lambo gallardo and going out to nellis afb and going crazy..fun stuff.

came home broke.

D:> (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v723/Luporum/Mpup1a.jpg)

hmmm,
i get your point,but the same argument could be made against deer hunters.
Yeah, I think that was kinda the point.

You live in Idaho? Wow, I feel kind of sorry for you.

it's not so bad. i mean, sure, it's sort of a death spiral for the whackjobs - one that is probably going to get worse before it gets better. but at least they are sparsely populated whackjobs.

Everybody knows that REAL men hunt with their bare hands in packs.
Meet those rebel dogs in hand to hand combat on equal terms, I say!

Seriously though, whoever it was that lives in Idaho needs to find their govonor and slap him. With a baseball bat.
...
In the crotch.

Sure there is. How are the manly men going to prove their manly unless they shoot a wolf at a distance with a high powered rifle and a scope?

Kill a puppy.

Yeah, I think that was kinda the point.

i don't know..i thought he was commenting on the fact that these idiots were being "manly" by killing wolves from a thousand feet away for no reason other then killing.
deer hunters hunt for meat mostly.

kinda different..though i may be wrong..i aint that quick on the uptake sometimes.

i think it is stupid and senseless to kill these wolves just to protect the tourism created by hunters.

especially since wolves have absolutely no impact on hunting tourism and a huge positive for normal people tourism and wildlife and ecology research money and all of that. but these fucks up here look at their massive wilderness areas and think that the best way to make money on them is to strip mine and clear cut them. fucking stupid.

though actually, the wolves have only slightly less massive popular support here than they do everywhere else - wolf reintroduction is another one of those rare issues that essentially everyone but the most fucktardly are all in favor of. the opponents are just loud and politically connected. and mind numbingly dumb, but that doesn't seem to matter.

Ridiculous. Utterly, plainly, and simply ridiculous. 550 wolves are quite a small population as it is.

this article should have focused on objectivity more, and instead put it as "otter made up a bunch of bullshit that goes against the actual facts, which have been pointed out to him numerous times."

It is annoying, isn't it? "Their killing elk!" Well no shit, sherlock. That's what they do. However, the amount of elk they kill in a decade probably isn't anywhere near the amount of elk they allow hunters to kill in a season. That I can almost guarentee. Not only this, but they want to dwindle the number to 100 individuals? What the bloody hell? That is 10 packs, and 10 breeding pairs... which more or less would spell extinction for them over there. Which I am sure is the intent.

At least in Minnesota, we have 3000 individuals, and as far as I know, there is only talk of management hunting, which over this way is taken with the utmost seriousness(Infact, in most cases, we just relocate the pack).

And seriously, those who think wolves are a danger to livestock don't know a damn thing about the animals. You need to worry more about coyotes and wild dogs than about wolves, ever. Coyotes and dogs know people, and aren't as skitish around them as wolves are.

550 wolves are quite a small population as it is.

especially for a place the size of idaho.

for example, isle royale has like 30 wolves, and it's just 206 square miles. the idaho part of the selway-bitterroot wilderness area alone is 1703 sq miles. and that just one of idaho's wilderness areas.

especially since wolves have absolutely no impact on hunting tourism and a huge positive for normal people tourism and wildlife and ecology research money and all of that. but these fucks up here look at their massive wilderness areas and think that the best way to make money on them is to strip mine and clear cut them. fucking stupid.

though actually, the wolves have only slightly less massive popular support here than they do everywhere else - wolf reintroduction is another one of those rare issues that essentially everyone but the most fucktardly are all in favor of. the opponents are just loud and politically connected. and mind numbingly dumb, but that doesn't seem to matter.

Indeed. And in actuality, wolves are a great asset to hunting tourism. Since their decline, wildlife population have been getting out of control in many areas, and reintroduction helps keep the population down, and thus healthier overall(Since they only tend to go after the sick/old/young, which most hunters don't even bother with).

It is annoying, isn't it? "Their killing elk!" Well no shit, sherlock. That's what they do. However, the amount of elk they kill in a decade probably isn't anywhere near the amount of elk they allow hunters to kill in a season.
What's really annoying is that wolves go after the slow and weak elk. So pretty much this is because bad hunters are bitching that their easy kills are being taken care of.

What's really annoying is that wolves go after the slow and weak elk. So pretty much this is because bad hunters are bitching that their easy kills are being taken care of.

Indeed. Between them, and poachers, it truly does piss me off to no end.

What's really annoying is that wolves go after the slow and weak elk. So pretty much this is because bad hunters are bitching that their easy kills are being taken care of.

and even that isn't true. there are too few wolves right now to even be noticed usually. ignorant fuckheads and republicans (but i repeat myself...) just like bitching

Wolves not decimating elk herds (http://www.mtexpress.com/index2.php?issue_date=01-12-2007&ID=2005113772)

hmmm,
i get your point,but the same argument could be made against deer hunters.
i think it is stupid and senseless to kill these wolves just to protect the tourism created by hunters.
i use to hunt many years ago,alot of my friends still do.
i was turned off for whatever reason,i did not like killing things,i did not like all the effort involved in gutting/skinning and then butchering the animal to get food when i could go to the acme.


I have no issues with "real" hunters. Many in the family do. But they are the type that head off into nowhere to do it. Rather then the weekend warrior types that we have here in Cali. Most of these *censored* make it dangerous as they tend to shoot at anything that moves.


i may go bear hunting next year,partly for the hunt,partly because they are becoming somewhat of a threat were i go in the winter(to much encroachment on the land,so there are an over population of bear)..but rest assured i will eat the meat and use the hide.
hunting in and of itself is not bad..but killing for no reason is.


Pack a second weapon and make sure you have a good guide and dogs. My uncle-in-law nearly got attacked once. Ran out of ammo and the dogs had it cornered. He asked for more and was told they had none. All of a sudden the bear swatted one dog and took after him. Somebody dropped it before it just reached him. My father-in-law likes to say the bear was too busy slipping on his well you know. :)

Another time he was chasing a black bear he shot. It went dark and he tracked it to a tree. He kept circling it trying to finish it off. It died and nearly fell on him.

He figured he should give it up after that. :D

Pack a second weapon and make sure you have a good guide and dogs. My uncle-in-law nearly got attacked once. Ran out of ammo and the dogs had it cornered. He asked for more and was told they had none. All of a sudden the bear swatted one dog and took after him. Somebody dropped it before it just reached him. My father-in-law likes to say the bear was too busy slipping on his well you know. :)

:D a second weapon? I and my friends used to throw rocks at bears for fun, Black bears are normally shy and cowards using a gun and killing them isn't much of a challenge...

a second weapon? I and my friends used to throw rocks at bears for fun, Black bears are normally shy and cowards using a gun and killing them isn't much of a challenge...

Try doing that with a mother and her cubs.

a second weapon? I and my friends used to throw rocks at bears for fun, Black bears are normally shy and cowards using a gun and killing them isn't much of a challenge...
Which is fun until the bear decides its cornered and charges. You're suddenly reminded that they tend to be bigger, stronger, faster, and equipped with claws and fangs... well, until they rip you apart, then not so much.

Why the hell would you want to throw rocks at a BEAR anyway?

You could hur it. :(

Which is fun until the bear decides its cornered and charges. You're suddenly reminded that they tend to be bigger, stronger, faster, and equipped with claws and fangs... well, until they rip you apart, then not so much. black bears don't attack unless they're cornered(there are exceptions) so throwing rocks was fun, exciting and the bear lived...wolves same thing much harder to get close to however... it's why I find those macho bear hunters so pathetic if I can walk to 25 yards of a bear and scare it off with a small stone where's the thrill in killing it from 100-400 yds with scope?...

I'd like to add I never threw rocks at Grizzlies, different kind of bear that...

Why the hell would you want to throw rocks at a BEAR anyway?

You could hur it. mostly to chase it out of the town, they tend to eat little dogs...little stones don't do any serious damage and the bears develop a respect for people, tame bears are more dangerous...