NationStates Jolt Archive

And the DA keeps rolling along...

http://www.usatoday.com/sports/college/lacrosse/2007-01-11-duke-lacrosse-accuser_x.htm?csp=34

Accuser in Duke lacrosse case says one player charged didn't commit assault
Updated 1/11/2007 12:41 PM ET E-mail | Save | Print | Subscribe to stories like this Subscribe to stories like this

DURHAM, N.C. (AP) — The accuser in the Duke lacrosse sexual assault case told prosecutors in December that one of the three players charged did not commit any sex act on her during the alleged attack, according to court papers filed Thursday by the defense.

The attacker identified as Reade Seligmann only watched, she told an investigator, the papers said. While he was repeatedly urged to take part in the alleged attack, she recalled, he said he could not participate because he was getting married.

"The accuser's most recent recollection of events demonstrates clearly that she cannot accurately recall and describe her attackers and that any identification made by her is necessarily unreliable," the defense filing said.

If this wasn't a rape case it would have been thrown out and she would be charged with filing a false report or wasting the court's time or something.

well we are going to spend the next 10 years having stories changed and such maybe we should stop caring what this woman says as she’s so unreliable at the moment and instead look at some evidence

she recalled, he said he could not participate because he was getting married.

*doesn't say anything*

i dont suppose that was the young man who has a picture of himself at an atm machine at the time the assault was going on

If this wasn't a rape case it would have been thrown out and she would be charged with filing a false report or wasting the court's time or something.

It's no longer a rape case. It's been dropped to "sexual assault" (and still changing). The DA is already facing ethics violation charges. Yet the twit just keeps pushing it.

If this wasn't a rape case it would have been thrown out and she would be charged with filing a false report or wasting the court's time or something.

Most likely.

The DA's case is seriously hurting, and I faill to see why he keeps plugging away at it.

If this wasn't a rape case it would have been thrown out and she would be charged with filing a false report or wasting the court's time or something.

While I haven't been following this in detail, there's something very wrong withthis entire situation. I can't imagine that the accuser, even if she's pursuing a vendetta of some sort against Duke or these students or lacrosse in general, is driving this. The DA must have some sort of agenda himself, or he'd have shut this down ages ago. I'm all for pursuing allegations of rape but there's something not right here.

well we are going to spend the next 10 years having stories changed and such maybe we should stop caring what this woman says as she’s so unreliable at the moment and instead look at some evidence



*doesn't say anything*

unfortunately she IS the evidence. the dna tests were a bust, even her coworker doesnt back her story

only the DAs reluctance to lose face is keeping this from being thrown out.

only the DAs reluctance to lose face is keeping this from being thrown out.

maybe she should accuse the DA?

maybe she should accuse the DA?

Well, she is getting ... fucked over on this, maybe she should. That'd be interesting, the accuser dragging the DA into court for prosecutorial misconduct.

While I haven't been following this in detail, there's something very wrong withthis entire situation. I can't imagine that the accuser, even if she's pursuing a vendetta of some sort against Duke or these students or lacrosse in general, is driving this. The DA must have some sort of agenda himself, or he'd have shut this down ages ago. I'm all for pursuing allegations of rape but there's something not right here.

I'm convinced that it is mostly the DA caught trying to grandstand on this. All you have to do is look at his pattern of conduct immediately after the case opened, and how many detailed public statements he made.

The only motivation for making so many public statements is a political one, and it looks like he'll have to pay these lacrosse players money for the rest of his life - the first civil suit has already been filed.

If the DA think this will help him get re-elected in the next election cycle, it won't.

I'm convinced that it is mostly the DA caught trying to grandstand on this. All you have to do is look at his pattern of conduct immediately after the case opened, and how many detailed public statements he made.

The only motivation for making so many public statements is a political one, and it looks like he'll have to pay these lacrosse players money for the rest of his life - the first civil suit has already been filed.

is the DA open to civil suits based on prosecutorial misconduct?

i assume that the civil cases are on hold until (if) the criminal case is finished.

If this wasn't a rape case it would have been thrown out and she would be charged with filing a false report or wasting the court's time or something.

If this wasn't a rape case involving a black accuser and white defendents in a 50% African American district with a district attorney who was white and up for reelection it wouldn't have seen the inside of a courtroom. Nifong should be disbarred and brought up on charges of prosecutorial misconduct and the accused students should sue the city for millions. If Tenney Pierce can get 2.6 million for being fed a spoonful of dog food these kids, who's lives and reputations have been forever tarnished, not to mention their college experience destroyed, should get enough money to live very comfortable lives.

If the DA think this will help him get re-elected in the next election cycle, it won't.

It got him reelected last year. It'll get him disbarred this year.

is the DA open to civil suits based on prosecutorial misconduct?

Yes.

i assume that the civil cases are on hold until (if) the criminal case is finished.

Which will be any minute now.

The government and Mr. Nifong are about to find out what "rape" means in a monetary sense.

It got him reelected last year. It'll get him disbarred this year.

And what it ultimately does is make it harder to prosecute rape accusations where there actually is evidence and a decent case.

And what it ultimately does is make it harder to prosecute rape accusations where there actually is evidence and a decent case.

That, too. That's why I think DA's should be appointed rather than elected. There's a reason Federal judges are apointed - keeps politics out of the office.

That, too. That's why I think DA's should be appointed rather than elected. There's a reason Federal judges are apointed - keeps politics out of the office.

Well, I agree, though the US Attorneys are political appointees. The worst thing they did here in Colorado, or at least in Denver, was to make the District Attorney term-limited. I find that amazing, just as the guy's getting good at his job, out he goes. Professional politicians can be a pain in the ass, often, but I would rather have someone who knows what he's doing prosecuting criminals and crafting legislation than someone who just came out of the freshman orientation class at the Capitol. Sorry, didn't mean to slide into that anti-term limits rant.

It looks like someone (filthy lying whore) should spend some time in prison.

Well, I agree, though the US Attorneys are political appointees. The worst thing they did here in Colorado, or at least in Denver, was to make the District Attorney term-limited. I find that amazing, just as the guy's getting good at his job, out he goes. Professional politicians can be a pain in the ass, often, but I would rather have someone who knows what he's doing prosecuting criminals and crafting legislation than someone who just came out of the freshman orientation class at the Capitol. Sorry, didn't mean to slide into that anti-term limits rant.

Yep. Terms limits were a cure for the effects of gerrymandering. get rid of the gerrymandering and you don't need them. Why would you want someone who's doing a good job to be forced to leave?

Yes.



Which will be any minute now.

The government and Mr. Nifong are about to find out what "rape" means in a monetary sense.

i certainly hope so

as much as i dont normally give a fuck about the trials and tribulations of spoiled rich kids, i make an exception in this case. what has been done to these kids needs to be made up for.

i hope nifong is completely ruined.

When will this two legged sperm receptacle be held responsible for the phony allegations?

Where is the marching,chanting "No justice,No peace" crowd?


So many people wanted these boys to be guilty. Or,at least not be able to defend themselves effectively.

It's no longer a rape case. It's been dropped to "sexual assault" (and still changing).
still changing?

so.. how many versions of "rape" or whatever-they-call-it-now they've got?
..

When will this two legged sperm receptacle be held responsible for the phony allegations?

Where is the marching,chanting "No justice,No peace" crowd?


So many people wanted these boys to be guilty. Or,at least not be able to defend themselves effectively.

"Two legged sperm receptable" is uncalled-for. I expect better from you. She shouldn't have made what clearly appear to have been unfounded allegations, and the DA should not still be pursuing this case, given the facts.

"Two legged sperm receptable" is uncalled-for. I expect better from you. She shouldn't have made what clearly appear to have been unfounded allegations, and the DA should not still be pursuing this case, given the facts.

She had the DNA of five guys in her. I'd call it a pretty apt description. After she supposedly hadn't had consensual sex in a week. Interestingly none of the DNA matched the accused.

is the DA open to civil suits based on prosecutorial misconduct?

Depends on the state really. As an agent of the government in default he is immune from civil liability in matters pertaining to his office. You can't sue the government unless the government lets you.

She had the DNA of five guys in her. I'd call it a pretty apt description. After she supposedly hadn't had consensual sex in a week. Interestingly none of the DNA matched the accused.Yes but I would not call her that.

Yes she lied.. she cried Wolf(rape).. and her lie would be normaly enough to put inocent men in prisson

just like untold numbers of womem have done before her (and untold numbers of raped women have kept it secret)..

but.. I would still not call her that.
I would call her "criminal".. but not "2 legged sperm receptacle"

Now hold on a moment all, I find it patently amusing that those of you who champion or standards of evidence and call the men "innocent" are the same to refer to her as "guilty".

There may well not be enough evidence to prove their guilt. There likewise is likely not enough evidence to prove she made it up.

I find it hypocritical in the extreme to immediatly scream how the men are innocent and she is guilty when frankly I have yet to see enough evidence to prove either. Logic and a sense of the integrity of our justice system, if it moves you to declare that these boys are not guilty due to insufficiency of evidence, must, for the sake of intellectual honesty also admit you can't prove she lied, either.

Now hold on a moment all, I find it patently amusing that those of you who champion or standards of evidence and call the men "innocent" are the same to refer to her as "guilty".

There may well not be enough evidence to prove their guilt. There likewise is likely not enough evidence to prove she made it up.

I find it hypocritical in the extreme to immediatly scream how the men are innocent and she is guilty when frankly I have yet to see enough evidence to prove either. Logic and a sense of the integrity of our justice system, if it moves you to declare that these boys are not guilty due to insufficiency of evidence, must, for the sake of intellectual honesty also admit you can't prove she lied, either.

At this point there are two possibilities:

1) She's lying.
2) She's crazy.


That's pretty much it.

At this point there are two possibilities:

1) She's lying.
2) She's crazy.


That's pretty much it.

it's POSSIBLE her memory is faulty, it's POSSIBLE they wore condoms, it's POSSIBLE she was drugged. A lot is POSSIBLE. From what I've seen you would not be able to prove beyond reasonable doubt she was raped.

You would also not be able to prove beyond reasonable doubt that she lied.

So making any claims that any is absolute truth and any is absolute fiction is...contrary to our system of justice.

It's possible that all the air molecules in my office will randomly clump into a 1 cubic foot area, but it's not bloody likely.

It's possible a guy raped her when he was across town at an ATM? Man he must be HUNG!

it's POSSIBLE her memory is faulty, it's POSSIBLE they wore condoms, it's POSSIBLE she was drugged. A lot is POSSIBLE. From what I've seen you would not be able to prove beyond reasonable doubt she was raped.

You would also not be able to prove beyond reasonable doubt that she lied.

So making any claims that any is absolute truth and any is absolute fiction is...contrary to our system of justice.

She's gone from up to 20 guys raping her orally, vaginally, and anally along w/ torturing her for over a half hour to 2 guys who may have "sexually assaulted" her as well as the time it happened changing over several hours.

That's not a "faulty memory".

She's gone from up to 20 guys raping her orally, vaginally, and anally along w/ torturing her for over a half hour to 2 guys who may have "sexually assaulted" her as well as the time it happened changing over several hours.

That's not a "faulty memory".

She could of been drugged, unlikely since she was apparently drunk as hell, but it's possible. You'd think they'd of done a drug test on her.

She's gone from up to 20 guys raping her orally, vaginally, and anally along w/ torturing her for over a half hour to 2 guys who may have "sexually assaulted" her as well as the time it happened changing over several hours.

That's not a "faulty memory".

Fine, so bring perjury charges against her. I merely objected to "two legged sperm receptacle" as being below Carnivorous Licker's dignity. It's also indicative why prosecuting rape is so difficult - it doesn't take the kind of changes in story or lapses in memory displayed here to have the "she was asking for it" brigade to come out. As a woman, I object to this woman's continued stance in this matter because with every change of story she makes it harder for women to get justice in the future in rape cases.

it's POSSIBLE her memory is faulty, it's POSSIBLE they wore condoms, it's POSSIBLE she was drugged. A lot is POSSIBLE. From what I've seen you would not be able to prove beyond reasonable doubt she was raped.

You would also not be able to prove beyond reasonable doubt that she lied.

So making any claims that any is absolute truth and any is absolute fiction is...contrary to our system of justice.Except, falsly accusing people of a crime that you later admit was wrong is filing a false report. also it opens her to wrongful persecution suites by the victims and their families.

also, it has to be proven that she was drugged, funny that she was not the only stripper there (wasn't her friend there also?) and only she was drugged and raped?

She's gone from up to 20 guys raping her orally, vaginally, and anally along w/ torturing her for over a half hour to 2 guys who may have "sexually assaulted" her as well as the time it happened changing over several hours.

That's not a "faulty memory".and each change makes it harder for the DA to persecute.

She could of been drugged, unlikely since she was apparently drunk as hell, but it's possible. You'd think they'd of done a drug test on her.most "Date Rape" drugs leave no traces in the blood stream hours after it's taken. that's what makes it so hard to detect.

Most likely.

The DA's case is seriously hurting, and I faill to see why he keeps plugging away at it.

I think some DA's can't get it through their heads that some cases just need to be dropped.

I recently saw a case where a DA was trying to get a guy on violating a restraining order. The "violation" occurred before he was ever served with the order, and he had a recording of the girl who had placed the order calling and asking him to come over. And, like I said, this was before he was even served with it. She later tried to add a second alleged violation. He was at a store at the time, and was able to obtain the security videotapes to prove it.

Over the course of several months, the hearing was postponed at least 4 times because she didn't show up. When she finally did show up, she asked him to drop it, and he said no. By this time, my friend had obtained evidence that she was doing meth and was a consistent liar, as well as all the evidence I already mentioned. She walked out of the courthouse before being called into the hearing, because she didn't want to push it.

Even after all of this, the DA still tried to push for some sort of "plea deal" that would have left him with a record and some community service. He refused and all charges were finally dropped.

Now hold on a moment all, I find it patently amusing that those of you who champion or standards of evidence and call the men "innocent" are the same to refer to her as "guilty".

There may well not be enough evidence to prove their guilt. There likewise is likely not enough evidence to prove she made it up.

I find it hypocritical in the extreme to immediatly scream how the men are innocent and she is guilty when frankly I have yet to see enough evidence to prove either. Logic and a sense of the integrity of our justice system, if it moves you to declare that these boys are not guilty due to insufficiency of evidence, must, for the sake of intellectual honesty also admit you can't prove she lied, either.

QFT.

"Two legged sperm receptable" is uncalled-for. I expect better from you. She shouldn't have made what clearly appear to have been unfounded allegations, and the DA should not still be pursuing this case, given the facts.

She has two legs and she was loaded with it. And the connotation is negative because she decided to try to take advantage of an opporotunity, regardless of the consequences.

I could have used rude terminology, but chose to stick with the facts.

This woman needs to shut the fuck up. She fucked up a bunch of people's lives, and she needs to be charged with filing false charges and slander. If she was ever interviewed, she should be charged with libel as well.

And no fines either. This bitch should get 3 years minimum, in my opinion.

This woman needs to shut the fuck up. She fucked up a bunch of people's lives, and she needs to be charged with filing false charges and slander. If she was ever interviewed, she should be charged with libel as well.

And no fines either. This bitch should get 3 years minimum, in my opinion.

She should be sued for ass loads of $$$$.

Now hold on a moment all, I find it patently amusing that those of you who champion or standards of evidence and call the men "innocent" are the same to refer to her as "guilty".

There may well not be enough evidence to prove their guilt. There likewise is likely not enough evidence to prove she made it up.

I find it hypocritical in the extreme to immediatly scream how the men are innocent and she is guilty when frankly I have yet to see enough evidence to prove either. Logic and a sense of the integrity of our justice system, if it moves you to declare that these boys are not guilty due to insufficiency of evidence, must, for the sake of intellectual honesty also admit you can't prove she lied, either.

Innocent until proven guilty is a standard our courts adhere to because their judgement results in actualy penalties to the accused. Our judgement carries no such weight so we, as lay people, have every right to use intuition and common sense to pass judgement on her. We do not have to adhere to the same standard because anything said here carries no force of law. I'll just go by the civil standard of "a proponderance of the evidence." She's a lying piece of shit who tried to destroy these people's lives and Nifong is an opportunist who didn't mind risking the lives of people I believe he knew were probably innocent in order to further his political career.

She should be sued for ass loads of $$$$.
She was a stripper, and now a single parent.
How much $$$ do you think she has?

I haven't followed this case, but I do have to wonder whether she made the allegations in the hope of extracting a few $$ from the accused to shut her up.

She was a stripper, and now a single parent.
How much $$$ do you think she has?

I haven't followed this case, but I do have to wonder whether she made the allegations in the hope of extracting a few $$ from the accused to shut her up.

That was my thought too. 3 Frat White Kids, raping a poor black woman. I mean comon, the DA was trying to turn this into the ol' Whites are holding down the blacks again. The Stripper, well she thought she could get some cash out of this, but she did not. I think the "sexual assault" will be thrown out as well as other charges.

Now hold on a moment all, I find it patently amusing that those of you who champion or standards of evidence and call the men "innocent" are the same to refer to her as "guilty".

There may well not be enough evidence to prove their guilt. There likewise is likely not enough evidence to prove she made it up.

I find it hypocritical in the extreme to immediatly scream how the men are innocent and she is guilty when frankly I have yet to see enough evidence to prove either. Logic and a sense of the integrity of our justice system, if it moves you to declare that these boys are not guilty due to insufficiency of evidence, must, for the sake of intellectual honesty also admit you can't prove she lied, either.I am not sure if this post was directed at me.. but just in case..

ahem..
for the sake of intellectual honesty.. I hereby admit I can't prove she lied.

LMAO i hope the black panthers that marched on the duke campus and supported this woman feel like retards now.

they were too fast to jump the gun on calling it a racist crime

LMAO i hope the black panthers that marched on the duke campus and supported this woman feel like retards now.

they were too fast to jump the gun on calling it a racist crime

Nah they'll try to wiggle out of it.