NationStates Jolt Archive

Latest Mufti comments

Sydney Muslim leader, Sheikh Taj El-Deen El-Hilali, has set off a new controversy by claiming Muslims have more right to be in Australia than the descendants of convicts.

In an interview on Arabic television, he defended his sermon comparing women who show some skin to uncovered meat and blamed the media for the national outcry that followed.

The spiritual leader believes that it was a calculated conspiracy aimed at terrorising the Islamic community.

The Sheikh called Anglo-Saxons the world's biggest liars and said Muslims had more of a right to be in Australia because they paid for their tickets and didn't arrive on boats shackled in chains.

He also claimed gang rape leader Bilal Skaf was victimised by the judicial system in the wake of September 11.

Liberal MP Bronwyn Bishop says the concept that women are evil and men can do what they like is totally unacceptable and the Sheikh must learn this or leave the country.

http://www.skynews.com.au/story.asp?id=149051

Here we go again...

*awaits cries of "He was just misunderstood!"*

Liberal MP Bronwyn Bishop says the concept that women are evil and men can do what they like is totally unacceptable and the Sheikh must learn this or leave the country.


Damn that freedom of speech!

I guess every religion has a Pat Robertson. I'll have to remember that when I start my own.

What's with the boats and chains thing. Is he saying the black community should leave the US?

I don't think he's thought it through.

Well this seems to be a paradigm. Isn't the comment that was made by bronwyn bishop oppressive? Like isnt telling them to change their beliefs or get out racist or ignorant or some shit? I got no clue but you social minded enlightened poster should be able to tell me.

What's with the boats and chains thing. Is he saying the black community should leave the US?

I don't think he's thought it through.

The first Europeans in Australia were British convicts. However, most white Australians today are descent from free British settlers or continentals who arrived later.

The Sheikh called Anglo-Saxons the world's biggest liars and said Muslims had more of a right to be in Australia because they paid for their tickets and didn't arrive on boats shackled in chains.

My family paid for their tickets. He's generalising again.

My family paid for their tickets. He's generalising again.

My Ukrainian family were refugees of sorts (which the Australian government chose to take in, so nyah), my mother was a immigrant.

The first Europeans in Australia were British convicts. However, most white Australians today are descent from free British settlers or continentals who arrived later.

If being a fan of english cricket since I was five has taught me anything - other than the inevitability of batting collapses; it is that all australians are convicts.

Well this seems to be a paradigm. Isn't the comment that was made by bronwyn bishop oppressive? Like isnt telling them to change their beliefs or get out racist or ignorant or some shit? I got no clue but you social minded enlightened poster should be able to tell me.

You ignore the fact that this Mufti gentlemen is clearly a racist, sexist, ignorant, bigot.

He might even be wrong as far as the muslims thing goes. I remember hearing somewhere that muslims were first brought here as labourers to help construct the railways.

The Sheikh called Anglo-Saxons the world's biggest liars


Hit the nail on the head :D

i thought that no matter who you are you are allowed to believe what you want. Saying that hes a right dick doesnt void his right to have beliefs and live in a country. I mean surely we cant just kick him out for being a ****. Id be in switzerland right now if that was the case.

Hit the nail on the head :D

You are a racist.

Don't make me quote Voltaire.

You are a racist.

I am of partial anglo ancestry silly. No go pull your panties out of a bunch ;)

Don't make me quote Voltaire.

Go ahead.

If being a fan of english cricket since I was five has taught me anything - other than the inevitability of batting collapses; it is that all australians are convicts.

lol, when I first heard about this I immediately thought it sounded like something a pom would say.

I am of partial anglo ancestry silly. No go pull your panties out of a bunch ;)

That doesn't mean it wasn't racist. If a negro said "all blacks are criminals" that would still be racist.

Eh, the guy's just saying what he thinks he's supposed to say. I'll bet he doesn't really believe it anyway.
I mean, if he was really so reviled by living in a country full of white people, he probably wouldn't live there.

Eh, the guy's just saying what he thinks he's supposed to say. I'll bet he doesn't really believe it anyway.
I mean, if he was really so reviled by living in a country full of white people, he probably wouldn't live there.

Never underestimate the power of stupidity.

This cleric has already been forced by Muslim leaders to apologise, odds are he will be the Muslim equivalent of excommunicated

That doesn't mean it wasn't racist. If a negro said "all blacks are criminals" that would still be racist.

depends how he says it and how its meant

Damn that freedom of speech!

Sadly, Australia doesn't have the same freedom of speech laws as the USA, and our current government is steadily whittling back our rights even further.

Never underestimate the power of stupidity.

Odds are, if he was living in one of those shitholes they call muslims countries, he'd be begging the West to take him as a refugee.

depends how he says it and how its meant

You must be joking.

Odds are, if he was living in one of those shitholes they call muslims countries,

Dubai’s a shithole, how fabulous does a place have to be?

he'd be begging the West to take him as a refugee.

Not Australia though hardly a nice place if you happen to not be white

You must be joking.

...explain.

Not Australia though hardly a nice place if you happen to not be white

What a generalised load of shit. Half of my best friends aren't white and they aren't treated any differently at all. Where do you live?

*snip*

Not Australia though hardly a nice place if you happen to not be white



Australia is not perfect by any means, but it's certainly nowhere near as bad as you're trying to make out.

Australia is not perfect by any means, but it's certainly nowhere near as bad as you're trying to make out.

Convicts I say!

...explain.

Alright, you said:

depends how he says it and how its meant

In response to:

That doesn't mean it wasn't racist. If a negro said "all blacks are criminals" that would still be racist.

Please explain to me how this could be construed as not racist in any context. The statement is offensive, and is entirely clear in its intent. That is to say, it is a racist statement that makes all blacks out to be criminals. I am honestly shocked how anyone could look at that and say its not racist.

Convicts I say!

Convicts or no, it was us giving the lash to you this time around! :p

My parents migrated (or should I say were clapped in irons & forcibly shipped?) to Aus from England in the early 70s.

Funny, whilst some are debating how it's such a shame that he can't be allowed to say what he wants, this hate-preacher's message is going unchallenged. It is not his right to free speech, but the content of his speech, that is not alright. When will people take off their goddamn blinders and see what is going on for once? Instead of saying "oh but he's just one of a limited few" realise that these people are gaining momentum, and that someone has to expose them to criticism.

This is not about him being Muslim, or anything. It is about the nonsense he preaches. If Phelps were to make similar comments, he'd be blasted from all angles! That is to say, I support this guy's right to say what he wants, but not the garbage he preaches. To add insult to injury, this guy has the nerve to also attack the native citizenry of the country he moved to.

Funny, whilst you morons are debating how it's such a shame that he can't be allowed to say what he wants, this hate-preacher's message is going unchallenged. It is not his right to free speech, but the content of his speech, that is not alright. When will people take off their goddamn blinders and see what is going on for once? Instead of saying "oh but he's just one of a limited few" realise that these people are gaining momentum, and that someone has to expose them to criticism.

This is not about him being Muslim, or anything. It is about the nonsense he preaches.

problem is most people couldn't care less about what he says even if some people are listening. shit i'd listen to to him just to have a laugh (witch is the dangerous part, listening in the first place)

Convicts or no, it was us giving the lash to you this time around! :p

My parents migrated (or should I say were clapped in irons & forcibly shipped?) to Aus from England in the early 70s.

Nah, we let you win. It's all part of our cunning plan. :)

Alright, you said:



In response to:



Please explain to me how this could be construed as not racist in any context. The statement is offensive, and is entirely clear in its intent. That is to say, it is a racist statement that makes all blacks out to be criminals. I am honestly shocked how anyone could look at that and say its not racist.

It would be like me calling myself an Indian-killing English pig. I mean, sure it's racist, but if I said it in a funny context, then it's inherently racist yes but not meant to be hurtful, which kinda puts it in the territory of dead-baby jokes. Hilarious in the right company, not such a good idea otherwise.

It would be like me calling myself an Indian-killing English pig. I mean, sure it's racist, but if I said it in a funny context, then it's inherently racist yes but not meant to be hurtful, which kinda puts it in the territory of dead-baby jokes. Hilarious in the right company, not such a good idea otherwise.

I agree, but I don't think that was the argument he was trying to make.

Oh, but on topic:

No one cares if he says these things, because we do believe in freedom of speech. However, he's an influential man capable of inciting people to these beliefs.

I do agree that he seems to be enjoying a certain amount of immunity by virtue of being Moslem. If the Pope stood up and said these things, or Pat Robertson, or any other religious leader, well, they sure wouldn't be religious leaders for much longer.

People ARE afraid to criticize Moslems and Islam. Why is that? Whenever you offend them they blow things up! This is a racist view, but you know I'm right to at least some degree. The Dutch draw some pictures, and there're violent riots and bombings.

It behooves us to handle the rising population and its leaders carefully, for they have every right to exist and to believe whatever they like. They should not, however, be allowed to influence public policy to their religious beliefs. No religion should have that power.

Yet, they have that power more than any other because it has become the political climate such that they can claim racism and discrimination simply because people disagree. This man says racist, sexist, and dangerous things, and should be treated as such. The Moslem populations should start policing their members better, because nothing is gained by letting people like this talk in the global political game.

problem is most people couldn't care less about what he says even if some people are listening.

Do you mean most people don't care in that they're not going to believe what he says? Or don't care at all. Because if you mean the latter you are just wrong. When he made the 'uncovered meat' comments there was a genuine uproar. And I don't use that phrase lightly.

I agree, but I don't think that was the argument he was trying to make.

Oh! I see both your points more clearly now.

Yes, that statement is always racist.
Yes, that statement is funny in certain contexts.

Odds are, if he was living in one of those shitholes they call muslims countries, he'd be begging the West to take him as a refugee.

Beg to differ, my time spent in Bah'rain was fantastic. I'd have a hard time finding a place I'd rather live.

Geez, as much as you people are calling prejudice on other people, you'd think you'd see your own damned posts, hell it's typed out in front of you to review..do it.:upyours:

It's clear that the mufti is a jackass.
Free speech, you know.

I'd rather have him where I can see him, and identify his idiot beliefs, and see his idiot followers, than send him abroad or drive him underground.

Better the jackass you can see and hear, than the one you can't see coming.

Oh, but on topic:

No one cares if he says these things, because we do believe in freedom of speech. However, he's an influential man capable of inciting people to these beliefs.

I do agree that he seems to be enjoying a certain amount of immunity by virtue of being Moslem. If the Pope stood up and said these things, or Pat Robertson, or any other religious leader, well, they sure wouldn't be religious leaders for much longer.

People ARE afraid to criticize Moslems and Islam. Why is that? Whenever you offend them they blow things up! This is a racist view, but you know I'm right to at least some degree. The Dutch draw some pictures, and there're violent riots and bombings.

It behooves us to handle the rising population and its leaders carefully, for they have every right to exist and to believe whatever they like. They should not, however, be allowed to influence public policy to their religious beliefs. No religion should have that power.

Yet, they have that power more than any other because it has become the political climate such that they can claim racism and discrimination simply because people disagree. This man says racist, sexist, and dangerous things, and should be treated as such. The Moslem populations should start policing their members better, because nothing is gained by letting people like this talk in the global political game.

I couldn't agree with you more. It certainly is alarming when a minority religious population uses intimidation to get the government to do what they want. And this is horrific no matter if they're Muslim, Christian, Buddhist, or whatever. I think if whenever there was some Muslim outrage the governments of Europe would do better to stand firm and let their immigrant population know that this is not acceptable instead of appeasing them. Thats just my $.02 though.

Beg to differ, my time spent in Bah'rain was fantastic. I'd have a hard time finding a place I'd rather live.

Geez, as much as you people are calling prejudice on other people, you'd think you'd see your own damned posts, hell it's typed out in front of you to review..do it.:upyours:

Uh-huh, one nice country. So would you rather live in Switzerland or Saudi Arabia?

Uh-huh, one nice country. So would you rather live in Switzerland or Saudi Arabia?

Depends on whether I'm poor or not.

Do you mean most people don't care in that they're not going to believe what he says? Or don't care at all. Because if you mean the latter you are just wrong. When he made the 'uncovered meat' comments there was a genuine uproar. And I don't use that phrase lightly.

well I just find these things absurdly funny why anyone can have an uproar over such a thing, need to lite up, kick back and just fuck it dude, It's all going straight to hell anyhow.

"Do you mean most people don't care in that they're not going to believe what he says?"

but yeah I meant this though I have seen examples of people not caring either way. besides by creating a uproar, people validate his opnions. \ignore unfortunately don't work irl.

If the Pope stood up and said these things, or Pat Robertson, or any other religious leader, well, they sure wouldn't be religious leaders for much longer.

Pat Robertson openly stated that the flooding of New Orleans was because of gays (it could have been Fred Phelps, but I'm sure he couldn't have passed it up). Not only that, he also advocated assassination of state leaders as well as stated that Ariel Sharon's heart attack was "gods punishment"

Oddly enough, he's still a fairly popular "religious leader". His 700 club hasn't exactly gone out of business now has it?

The thing is, people WILL eat up all that hate spewing crap because deep down, they empathize with it. All it has to do is be labeled correctly and aimed at the right target crowd.


They should not, however, be allowed to influence public policy to their religious beliefs. No religion should have that power.

Of course not. But sadly, a great deal of people seem willing to allow their religion of choice to influence public policy. Buddhism, Christianity, Hindusim, Islam, whatever.