NationStates Jolt Archive

It was pretty funny. Basically, my friend needs to bring people into the station to talk to the recruiters, so they can try and recruit them. I'm not that interested in joining, but it meant he got off work earlier, and I figured I could see what they had to say.

So, I'm in there, and they're coming at me hard, trying to get me to join. I'm giving them the reasons why I'm "hesitant" to commit to anything, telling them I might want to concentrate on college, etc. So, finally, I get to something they would be hard pressed to work me on.

Politics.

I basically started telling them how I would find it hard to join the marines, when they are involved in a war I completely disagree with. I could tell the recruiter was getting a little peeved(sp?) about it, but he was really trying to work me over, without turning me away. So, he gives me the standard crap.

"Would you rather be fighting them over here?"

"The iraqi's? No, I'd rather not be fighting them at all."

"You don't think Iraq was involved in 9/11?"

"No, and I havn't seen anything half-reliable showing me they did."

*Cue tyrade about how the media is a bunch of liars, and I should listen to the people who have been over there. Because, of course, he directly watched Saddam and Osama collaberating[/sarcasm]

He showed me this picture, to "prove" saddam was a part of 9/11

http://www.spiritoftruth.org/images/3rd-infantry-saddam-911.jpg

"So?"

"So what? Its a picture of saddam, and the twin towers. Anyone could have drawn that."

"Are you serious?"

"What if I drew a picture of George Bush there, and said he did it? Would that mean it was true?"

"But we found them all over!"

:rolleyes:

The best part as to come.

"So, not to be semantic or anything, but have you actually found WMD in iraq?"

"Yes, I have."

"Really? What did you find?"

"Ever heard of anthrax?"

"You found Anthrax in Iraq?"

"Yeah, why do you think the marines are getting anthrax shots?"

...

"Then why hasn't bush brought it up? His support for the war is declining heavily, if he showed the world proof like this, anthrax found in iraq, he would have way more support."

Then he starts dodging the question.

It was pretty funny. They want me to come in on tuesday. I'm gonna come at the next recruiter ever harder.

Tell them you're far too gay, you'd just have to score one of your commanding officers. See how they react. Bring a hidden camera if possible.

Is that seriously what they're telling them now? When I was in (I got out in '04) they told us the war was to get rid of Saddam and free the Iraqi people. The WMD thing wasn't really on the radar, and some sort of ridiculous Iraq-9/11 link was even further off the radar.

Is it just me or does that picture look like it was taken at some family's backyard soccer field in Texas?

Yeah, they've done some hidden-camera things that show similar practices. It's pretty bad, but you have to wonder if they really believe the crap that they are spewing. Personally, I wouldn't be surprised if they did think it was all true, they probably get all of their news exclusively from Rush Limbaugh and Fox News.

You didn't point out Osama Bin Laden tried to kill Saddam like, twice?

Do you live in Texas, or are you just spitballing here?

We'd never let Marines patrol my backyard football field (soccer, feh... a Euroo-peean sport) Clearly liberal Yankee propaganda.

This was sarcasm in case you missed it :D (except for the Yankee part)

Saddam might have been happy the Trade Centers were hit, it doesn't mean he was responsible. How about you ask them why you should join a war that was started without an exit strategy? If he says Bush does have an exit strategy ask him why it's taking so long. After all, Bush was photographed on that aircraft carrier how many years ago with that "mission accomplished" sign.

It was pretty funny. They want me to come in on tuesday. I'm gonna come at the next recruiter ever harder.

Why not just ignore it? What purpose would it serve to go back there and argue with them if you have no intention of joining?

Let them believe what they want, and you do the same. It seems like a waste of time and energy, for both you and them, to do that and then come back here to post about it as if you're trying to slander them.

Since when is anthrax a WMD? (Or the decades old mustard gas they have also reported as WMDs)

It seems that the term loses its meaning when we start labeling such things under it. Why don't we just call tanks WMDs and be done with it? The Iraqis could certainly cause more death and destruction in this country with tanks and planes than they ever could have with anthrax.

Since when is anthrax a WMD? (Or the decades old mustard gas they have also reported as WMDs)

It seems that the term loses its meaning when we start labeling such things under it. Why don't we just call tanks WMDs and be done with it? The Iraqis could certainly cause more death and destruction in this country with tanks and planes than they ever could have with anthrax.

It's curious, because apparentally under one legal definition, a hand grenade is a weapon of mass destruction.

Since when is anthrax a WMD? (Or the decades old mustard gas they have also reported as WMDs)

It seems that the term loses its meaning when we start labeling such things under it. Why don't we just call tanks WMDs and be done with it? The Iraqis could certainly cause more death and destruction in this country with tanks and planes than they ever could have with anthrax.

Refer to the Iraqi Army as a weapon of mass destruction. It's true, in a sense.

Why not just ignore it? What purpose would it serve to go back there and argue with them if you have no intention of joining?


To fuck with them for being stupid asshats.

Let them believe what they want

You are seriously advocating that believing lies and killing based on those lies is a good thing ?

You are seriously advocating that believing lies and killing based on those lies is a good thing ?

What I seriously believe is that nothing you say will convince them that you're right and they're wrong. Anymore than anything say say will convince you that they're right and you're wrong. All you will succeed in doing is pissing them off, and, really, what good will that do? Let it be.

You are seriously advocating that believing lies and killing based on those lies is a good thing ?

What I seriously believe is that nothing you say will convince them that you're right and they're wrong. Anymore than anything they say will convince you that they're right and you're wrong. All you will succeed in doing is pissing them off, and, really, what good will that do? Let it be.

If you want to know what I believe, it is that there is truth on both sides and that intelligent, thinking people will try to find that truth instead of blindly following ideologues.

To fuck with them for being stupid asshats.

Then they have every right to enter Chellis' workplace and fuck with him for being a "stupid asshat".

The greatest respect we can give our men and women in uniform is refusing to send them into harm's way unless it is really necessary for national DEFENSE.

Any schlep will tell you you aren't DEFENDING yourself when you go break into someone's home and start shooting them. If they broke into YOUR home, then it's defense to shoot them.

So yeah, I'd rather fight them over here. Otherwise we are the criminals.

Imagine how well-defended our nation would be if we brought all our soldiers home and put them to work guarding our borders and infrastructure, and inspecting shipping containers. Our intelligence officials would only have to worry about what WMDs are being made inside the US, and watch the skies for incoming missiles.

We could actually let the rest of the world live in peace.

(some fuel for the OP = ask the recruiters where they think Saddam got the gas to kill the Kurds with--maybe even take a picture of Rummy shaking Saddam's hand in the days leading up to the gassing)

Then they have every right to enter Chellis' workplace and fuck with him for being a "stupid asshat".

The recruiting station is inviting people in, Chellis' workplace may not be.

You are seriously advocating that believing lies and killing based on those lies is a good thing ?

I said nothing that even remotely resembled that.

I honestly doubt that the recruiters truely believe everything they said to him, however, it is their job to be persuasive and even misleading in trying to convince young people to sign their lives over to the military for a period of time. I still fail to see the purpose in picking an argument with military recruiters about the validity of the war in Iraq.

The recruiting station is inviting people in, Chellis' workplace may not be.

They're inviting people in who are considering joining the Marine Corps, not people who want to debate the war in Iraq.

They're inviting people in who are considering joining the Marine Corps, not people who want to debate the war in Iraq.

Guess they should have just asked him to leave then.

Guess they should have just asked him to leave then.

I agree.

It was pretty funny. Basically, my friend needs to bring people into the station to talk to the recruiters, so they can try and recruit them. I'm not that interested in joining, but it meant he got off work earlier, and I figured I could see what they had to say.

So, I'm in there, and they're coming at me hard, trying to get me to join. I'm giving them the reasons why I'm "hesitant" to commit to anything, telling them I might want to concentrate on college, etc. So, finally, I get to something they would be hard pressed to work me on.

Politics.
SNIP

"Yes, I have."

"Really? What did you find?"

"Ever heard of anthrax?"

"You found Anthrax in Iraq?"

"Yeah, why do you think the marines are getting anthrax shots?"

...

"Then why hasn't bush brought it up? His support for the war is declining heavily, if he showed the world proof like this, anthrax found in iraq, he would have way more support."

Then he starts dodging the question.

It was pretty funny. They want me to come in on tuesday. I'm gonna come at the next recruiter ever harder.

Chellis,

I don't think they want an army deserter in the corps.

My recruiters are cool. Supposedly Homeschoolers aren't allowed to join the marines. Not so, I found out.

They're inviting people in who are considering joining the Marine Corps, not people who want to debate the war in Iraq.

I bet they secretly enjoy it. Just like Telemarkerers sometimes like getting the people who insult them on the phone.

I said nothing that even remotely resembled that.

I honestly doubt that the recruiters truely believe everything they said to him, however, it is their job to be persuasive and even misleading in trying to convince young people to sign their lives over to the military for a period of time. I still fail to see the purpose in picking an argument with military recruiters about the validity of the war in Iraq.

I am being BRUTALLY HONEST when I say that recruiters will LIE THROUGH THEIR TEETH to get you to sign that peice of paper. As much as I love the marines, Marine Recruiters will LIE, as will any .mil recruiter you get. Don't beleive a word you hear unless it's in writing.

I bet they secretly enjoy it. Just like Telemarkerers sometimes like getting the people who insult them on the phone.

:O Maybe

I bet they secretly enjoy it. Just like Telemarkerers sometimes like getting the people who insult them on the phone.


They love it when a hippie attacks them. Reminds them of the last time they were in combat.....:p

Chellis,

I don't think they want an army deserter in the corps.

My recruiters are cool. Supposedly Homeschoolers aren't allowed to join the marines. Not so, I found out.

...seems to contradict....

I am being BRUTALLY HONEST when I say that recruiters will LIE THROUGH THEIR TEETH to get you to sign that peice of paper. As much as I love the marines, Marine Recruiters will LIE, as will any .mil recruiter you get. Don't beleive a word you hear unless it's in writing.

Seemingly, they'll try and take anyone.
No?

I am being BRUTALLY HONEST when I say that recruiters will LIE THROUGH THEIR TEETH to get you to sign that peice of paper. As much as I love the marines, Marine Recruiters will LIE, as will any .mil recruiter you get. Don't beleive a word you hear unless it's in writing.

I don't really doubt that, but my recruiter (Michigan ANG) was pretty straight with me and there weren't any surprises when it came time to sign my name next to the X.

-snip-I still fail to see the purpose in picking an argument with military recruiters about the validity of the war in Iraq.

I DO see the purpose. The administration cannot proceed with its agenda unless the soldiers continue to believe the lies they are being told.

I support the troops in refusing to follow the immoral orders to kill innocent iraqis.

The war is a sham. Saddam had no WMD, and what weapons he had, he got from US.

It's shameful to be telling our young citizens these lies to get them to go over and kill people.

How many Kurds did Saddam gas? The US has killed over 600,000 iraqis.

And where did Saddam get the chemical agents? Osama? think again



On November 1 1983, the secretary of state, George Shultz, was passed intelligence reports of "almost daily use of CW [chemical weapons]" by Iraq.

However, 25 days later, Ronald Reagan signed a secret order instructing the administration to do "whatever was necessary and legal" to prevent Iraq losing the war.

In December Mr Rumsfeld, hired by President Reagan to serve as a Middle East troubleshooter, met Saddam Hussein in Baghdad and passed on the US willingness to help his regime and restore full diplomatic relations.

Mr Rumsfeld has said that he "cautioned" the Iraqi leader against using banned weapons. But there was no mention of such a warning in state department notes of the meeting.

Howard Teicher, an Iraq specialist in the Reagan White House, testified in a 1995 affidavit that the then CIA director, William Casey, used a Chilean firm, Cardoen, to send cluster bombs to use against Iran's "human wave" attacks.

A 1994 congressional inquiry also found that dozens of biological agents, including various strains of anthrax, had been shipped to Iraq by US companies, under licence from the commerce department.


source: http://www.globalpolicy.org/security/issues/iraq/history/2002/1231rumsfeld.htm

Then they have every right to enter Chellis' workplace and fuck with him for being a "stupid asshat".

Only if Chellis' work place is army recruiting or customer service.

Then they have every right to enter Chellis' workplace and fuck with him for being a "stupid asshat".

The recruiters invited him.

I DO see the purpose. The administration cannot proceed with its agenda unless the soldiers continue to believe the lies they are being told.

I support the troops in refusing to follow the immoral orders to kill innocent iraqis.

The war is a sham. Saddam had no WMD, and what weapons he had, he got from US.

It's shameful to be telling our young citizens these lies to get them to go over and kill people.

How many Kurds did Saddam gas? The US has killed over 600,000 iraqis.

And where did Saddam get the chemical agents? Osama? think again





source: http://www.globalpolicy.org/security/issues/iraq/history/2002/1231rumsfeld.htm

I'm not going to be pulled into the same argument about the war that I suggested Chellis avoid, my opinion on it doesn't belong in this thread. However, if Chellis believes that he should do something about this issue with the recruiters, then why not become politically active with it? Organize a protest of the use of certain recruiting methods and such, for example. Wasting the recruiters' time and arguing with them is not going to accomplish anything.

...seems to contradict....



Seemingly, they'll try and take anyone.
No?

Chellis stated that he had deserted from the army.

They'll take almost anyone. The marines are more picky, however.

...seems to contradict....



Seemingly, they'll try and take anyone.
No?

Most people won't desert once they're in. Especially since it's a criminal act. I don't think they want people who are pretty much garenteed to desert. I have mixed feelings about recruiters, they are the used car salesman of the military. These recruiters know what they're in for, they had this argument with this guy and still invited him to come back. So whatever. I don't think they'll be losing any sleep either way.

I served my time in the Army. Yes, recruiters will tell you anything to get you to sign on the dotted line.

I am being BRUTALLY HONEST when I say that recruiters will LIE THROUGH THEIR TEETH to get you to sign that peice of paper. As much as I love the marines, Marine Recruiters will LIE, as will any .mil recruiter you get. Don't beleive a word you hear unless it's in writing.

Don't even expect a guarrantee when it is in writing. The US government is the only entity in the country that can write up a contract and then promptly break it - and no one can enforce it on them.

But I've met many people who have been completely misled by recruiters.

The recruiters invited him.

Yes, they did invite him. They invited him because they believe they can somehow convince him to join the Marine Corps. It's obvious that they can't, so I see no reason to return. Just like they would have no reason to enter his workplace when they have no business there.

I DO see the purpose. The administration cannot proceed with its agenda unless the soldiers continue to believe the lies they are being told.

I support the troops in refusing to follow the immoral orders to kill innocent iraqis.

The war is a sham. Saddam had no WMD, and what weapons he had, he got from US.

It's shameful to be telling our young citizens these lies to get them to go over and kill people.

How many Kurds did Saddam gas? The US has killed over 600,000 iraqis.

And where did Saddam get the chemical agents? Osama? think again





source: http://www.globalpolicy.org/security/issues/iraq/history/2002/1231rumsfeld.htm

600,000 Iraqis? We're THAT good? :rolleyes:

The troops will do what they are told. Orders are orders. I know of a woman in the army who flat out refused to fire her weapon at Iraqis (insurgents who were shooting at the base) and was Court martialed, kicked out of the service, etc. Then there's the one army guy who tossed grenades into the officer's tents.

My friend's gonna go to Iraq in 2009, right before the end of his contract. He knows he has a job to do. He also has a sense of duty, something that is eerily lacking in many of today's young people.

My friend's gonna go to Iraq in 2009, right before the end of his contract. He knows he has a job to do. He also has a sense of duty, something that is eerily lacking in many of today's young people.

Well, hopefully he may never get there.

Yes, they did invite him. They invited him because they believe they can somehow convince him to join the Marine Corps. It's obvious that they can't, so I see no reason to return. Just like they would have no reason to enter his workplace when they have no business there.

Give the recruiters some credit. They're not stupid, they can tell when someone is F-ing with them. They might find it just an amusing to try to F- with him.

They invited him because they believe they can somehow convince him to join the Marine Corps. It's obvious that they can't, so I see no reason to return.
But didn't they make the second appointment?

They're asking for it, he's giving them what they want. If they're gonna lie to people, they're gonna have to deal with a bit of awkwardness when people don't buy their tales.

He also has a sense of duty, something that is eerily lacking in many of today's young people.
That'll be it.

Give the recruiters some credit. They're not stupid, they can tell when someone is F-ing with them. They might find it just an amusing to try to F- with him.

That's very possible.

600,000 Iraqis? We're THAT good? :rolleyes:

The troops will do what they are told. Orders are orders. I know of a woman in the army who flat out refused to fire her weapon at Iraqis (insurgents who were shooting at the base) and was Court martialed, kicked out of the service, etc. Then there's the one army guy who tossed grenades into the officer's tents.

My friend's gonna go to Iraq in 2009, right before the end of his contract. He knows he has a job to do. He also has a sense of duty, something that is eerily lacking in many of today's young people.

Those stories make me so angry. You made a choice, you volunteered for the job. Don't screw the other people who are over there with you that are counting on you to do your job.

You made a choice, you volunteered for the job.
While I agree in principle, there are two things that also need to be considered:

1) Is it really a voluntary choice if you were grossly misinformed by your recruiters?

2) I think the US Military doesn't leave enough room for individual judgement and conscience. While that's irrelevant in the case of this woman (just not wanting to fire your weapon in a combat situation is plain stupid and has nothing to do with conscientious objection), I think part of a change in the military to deal with urban combat situations needs to be to allow the human element of the soldier to override the robotic one in certain cases. For example, see here (http://www.bmvg.de/portal/a/bmvg/kcxml/04_Sj9SPykssy0xPLMnMz0vM0Y_QjzKLt4w3MrUASUGY5vqRMDFfj_zcVP2g1Dx9b_0A_YLciHJHR0VFAJJDChM!/delta/base64xml/L2dJQSEvUUt3QS80SVVFLzZfOV8yQjQ!?yw_contentURL=%2FC1256F1200608B1B%2FW2686BW2672INFOEN%2Fcontent.jsp ).

It was pretty funny. Basically, my friend needs to bring people into the station to talk to the recruiters, so they can try and recruit them. I'm not that interested in joining, but it meant he got off work earlier, and I figured I could see what they had to say.

So, I'm in there, and they're coming at me hard, trying to get me to join. I'm giving them the reasons why I'm "hesitant" to commit to anything, telling them I might want to concentrate on college, etc. So, finally, I get to something they would be hard pressed to work me on.

Politics.

I basically started telling them how I would find it hard to join the marines, when they are involved in a war I completely disagree with. I could tell the recruiter was getting a little peeved(sp?) about it, but he was really trying to work me over, without turning me away. So, he gives me the standard crap.

"Would you rather be fighting them over here?"

"The iraqi's? No, I'd rather not be fighting them at all."

"You don't think Iraq was involved in 9/11?"

"No, and I havn't seen anything half-reliable showing me they did."

*Cue tyrade about how the media is a bunch of liars, and I should listen to the people who have been over there. Because, of course, he directly watched Saddam and Osama collaberating[/sarcasm]

He showed me this picture, to "prove" saddam was a part of 9/11

http://www.spiritoftruth.org/images/3rd-infantry-saddam-911.jpg

"So?"

"So what? Its a picture of saddam, and the twin towers. Anyone could have drawn that."

"Are you serious?"

"What if I drew a picture of George Bush there, and said he did it? Would that mean it was true?"

"But we found them all over!"

:rolleyes:

The best part as to come.

"So, not to be semantic or anything, but have you actually found WMD in iraq?"

"Yes, I have."

"Really? What did you find?"

"Ever heard of anthrax?"

"You found Anthrax in Iraq?"

"Yeah, why do you think the marines are getting anthrax shots?"

...

"Then why hasn't bush brought it up? His support for the war is declining heavily, if he showed the world proof like this, anthrax found in iraq, he would have way more support."

Then he starts dodging the question.

It was pretty funny. They want me to come in on tuesday. I'm gonna come at the next recruiter ever harder.

lol that's good :D
start raving about communism if you dare.... i bet that'll really piss em off :p

While I agree in principle, there are two things that also need to be considered:

1) Is it really a voluntary choice if you were grossly misinformed by your recruiters?
I think it comes down to one thing: if you sign a legally binding contract it is your responsibility to read it thoroughly and understand it.

Also, common sense. Look at what the military does, look at your military's track record. Look at the military actions of your country for the past 20- 30 years. Understand that you might not agree with the cause you are fighting for.

That said: It does piss me off that recruiters lie.

2) I think the US Military doesn't leave enough room for individual judgement and conscience. While that's irrelevant in the case of this woman (just not wanting to fire your weapon in a combat situation is plain stupid and has nothing to do with conscientious objection), I think part of a change in the military to deal with urban combat situations needs to be to allow the human element of the soldier to override the robotic one in certain cases. For example, see here (http://www.bmvg.de/portal/a/bmvg/kcxml/04_Sj9SPykssy0xPLMnMz0vM0Y_QjzKLt4w3MrUASUGY5vqRMDFfj_zcVP2g1Dx9b_0A_YLciHJHR0VFAJJDChM!/delta/base64xml/L2dJQSEvUUt3QS80SVVFLzZfOV8yQjQ!?yw_contentURL=%2FC1256F1200608B1B%2FW2686BW2672INFOEN%2Fcontent.jsp ).

The US Army does want people who think for themselves, at least that was my experience.

I don't disagree with the theory at all. I was only commenting on those two stories (and stories similar to those).

The US Army does want people who think for themselves, at least that was my experience.
As unlikely as it is (:p), if I ever find myself joining the US Military, I'd want to make sure I go to this place (http://www.spiegel.de/international/spiegel/0,1518,455165,00.html).

As unlikely as it is (:p), if I ever find myself joining the US Military, I'd want to make sure I go to this place (http://www.spiegel.de/international/spiegel/0,1518,455165,00.html).

That's also where the military prison (http://usmilitary.about.com/od/justicelawlegislation/a/leavenworth.htm)is. I honestly had no idea there was anything else to that base. That does sound interesting.

Well, hopefully he may never get there.

He's going to Afghanistan this January. When I talked to him a month ago he said he was on fire and ready to do his part. Now that he has really fallen for this girl he doesn't want to go. And when he's over there, we can't go Jousting with Walmart shopping carts at 4am anymore.

For his going away present we bought him a clone of the m4 he'll carry overthere.

Those stories make me so angry. You made a choice, you volunteered for the job. Don't screw the other people who are over there with you that are counting on you to do your job.

There are a few stories like this. Not many, but there are some. There are some people who will say "OH! more power to her! SHe's doing what she thinks is right!". No, she's a coward because she is willing to let other people die for her cowardness.

Why not just ignore it? What purpose would it serve to go back there and argue with them if you have no intention of joining?

Let them believe what they want, and you do the same. It seems like a waste of time and energy, for both you and them, to do that and then come back here to post about it as if you're trying to slander them.

You don't believe that MArine recruiters pushing outright lies is a problem when used to recruit impressionable teens? They should be allowed to believe falsely and lie in order to conscript members to go and die for that lie? Why not just tell the truth and hope people will follow your lead that way? Or is the truth too hard to expect. How about teh dateline show where they showed recruiters telling potential enlistees, "the war's over and everyone is already coming home?" Shouldn't we expect more from the people who "protect" our democracy?

I said nothing that even remotely resembled that.

I honestly doubt that the recruiters truely believe everything they said to him, however, it is their job to be persuasive and even misleading in trying to convince young people to sign their lives over to the military for a period of time. I still fail to see the purpose in picking an argument with military recruiters about the validity of the war in Iraq.

Actually that is not their job and it's actually against the law for them to do so. Lying to get people to join the military where they may likely die is morally reprehensible. Look into the Code of Justice and find out how wrong you are.

Actually that is not their job and it's actually against the law for them to do so. Lying to get people to join the military where they may likely die is morally reprehensible. Look into the Code of Justice and find out how wrong you are.

Where in the UCMJ does it say that?

You don't believe that MArine recruiters pushing outright lies is a problem when used to recruit impressionable teens? They should be allowed to believe falsely and lie in order to conscript members to go and die for that lie? Why not just tell the truth and hope people will follow your lead that way? Or is the truth too hard to expect. How about teh dateline show where they showed recruiters telling potential enlistees, "the war's over and everyone is already coming home?" Shouldn't we expect more from the people who "protect" our democracy?

I never said any of that wasn't a problem. I am simply trying to point out that going back to the recruiting station to argue with them about the war is not going to accomplish anything. It is a waste of time.

The original post didn't exactly show that Chellis is interested in bringing light to what some would consider shady recruitment practices and making a difference, but that he thought it was funny. I made another post addressing something similar to this, but it obviously has yet to be approved by a moderator after several hours.

Its the marines... jarheads, cannon fodder, grunts par excellence.

What did you expect?

the USMC has its own recruiting station?!

in my experience the U.K version is a guy from the navy who comes in every Monday (well is suppose to anyway) its all very basic and nothing coming close to the armies funding (though my recruiter had his own golf toy thing which was fun to take a break with*)

Then again I do live more-or-less in the centre of the country

*CTP suffers from severe interview nerves which is a bitch when your asked to give everything you’ know about the British armed forces

Actually that is not their job and it's actually against the law for them to do so. Lying to get people to join the military where they may likely die is morally reprehensible. Look into the Code of Justice and find out how wrong you are.

Show me where it is forbidden by law for recruiters to exaggerate and to make up lies to help convince people to join. You reference the UMCJ and prove how wrong I am, I am not going to do the work.

I clearly remember that when it came time to sign my contract, I was told several times to forget what the recruiters told me because the military is only required to honor what was written in the contract I signed. The recruiter could have promised me free beer and prostitutes at basic training, but it matters not because it was not written into my contract.

I would say that the same goes for what was said in the original post. Unless they promised him and forced him to enlist by signing a document saying that WMDs were found in Iraq, Iraq was involved in 9/11, and we have paintings that prove Saddam was involved were all true, then I can't see how they did anything illegal.

Morally reprehensible? Yeah. Illegal? Dunno, show me.

I never said any of that wasn't a problem. I am simply trying to point out that going back to the recruiting station to argue with them about the war is not going to accomplish anything. It is a waste of time.

The original post didn't exactly show that Chellis is interested in bringing light to what some would consider shady recruitment practices and making a difference, but that he thought it was funny. I made another post addressing something similar to this, but it obviously has yet to be approved by a moderator after several hours.

Surely its tantamount to treason to waste recruiters time when they
could be talking to someone who does want to join.
With his first conversation and his second one yet to come
he may be preventing or at least delaying other people joining the marines.

There could be situations where a platoon is a man short while under fire
because of his lily livered cowardly actions in wasting the recruiters time.

Good honest Amerikan boys and girls could die because of HIM.

So what if they have to lie about reasons for fighting
whats important is that fewer american soldiers and more hajis die.

The middle east is a very big place and full of arabs
cowardly arabs who are not willing to meet your boys out in the open
but instead use suiciders and ieds. The US needs every soldier out there
ready able and willing to kill anyone and everyone.

What if this guys type of activity caught on
what if all military recruiters were tied up with people who argued the truth
of the situation. What if there were no US fighting forces in Iraq at all.

What kind of world would we be living in then.

Surely its tantamount to treason to waste recruiters time when they
could be talking to someone who does want to join.
With his first conversation and his second one yet to come
he may be preventing or at least delaying other people joining the marines.

There could be situations where a platoon is a man short while under fire
because of his lily livered cowardly actions in wasting the recruiters time.

Good honest Amerikan boys and girls could die because of HIM.

So what if they have to lie about reasons for fighting
whats important is that fewer american soldiers and more hajis die.

The middle east is a very big place and full of arabs
cowardly arabs who are not willing to meet your boys out in the open
but instead use suiciders and ieds. The US needs every soldier out there
ready able and willing to kill anyone and everyone.

What if this guys type of activity caught on
what if all military recruiters were tied up with people who argued the truth
of the situation. What if there were no US fighting forces in Iraq at all.

What kind of world would we be living in then.

Are you insinuating with that post that I support such a trite idea?

Sarcasm and melodrama aside, you are assigning an opinion to me when I have said nothing to support such ridiculousness. If you would please scroll up to a previous post of mine and note the comment "Morally reprehensible? Yeah." with regard to the recruiters lying, you will see otherwise.

Are you insinuating with that post that I support such a trite idea?

Sarcasm and melodrama aside, you are assigning an opinion to me when I have said nothing to support such ridiculousness. If you would please scroll up to a previous post of mine and note the comment "Morally reprehensible? Yeah." with regard to the recruiters lying, you will see otherwise.

You said his going back to the recruiters wouldn't accomplish anything

I pointed out the dangerous effects it could have on the US fighting
forces, by potentially depriving them of recruit/s.

What if this guys type of activity caught on
what if all military recruiters were tied up with people who argued the truth
of the situation.

That'd be good. Because it means the aggregate total of naive people have dropped. Harder to trick with slogans and stuff.


What if there were no US fighting forces in Iraq at all.


There wouldn't be US forces dying in Iraq. Dur.


What kind of world would we be living in then.

A more honest one.

I grade your efforts as C-

Tell them you're far too gay, you'd just have to score one of your commanding officers. See how they react. Bring a hidden camera if possible.

lmao. That would be gold. Then when the recruiter looks shocked, pat him on the leg and say "You're not too bad yourself, big guy" and wink at him.

Oh, man....seeing a bunch of Marines whoop the living shit out of a smartass while he's screaming, "At least I know the truth!!".....

I'd pay good money to see that.

Oh, man....seeing a bunch of Marines whoop the living shit out of a smartass while he's screaming, "At least I know the truth!!".....

I'd pay good money to see that.

And I'd like to see when they got arrested for assault.

Anyways

Captain Pooby, I really don't appreciate you spreading rumors about me that are completely and totally untrue. If you aren't sure about something, please shut the hell up.

Everyone else: Honestly, I was going in there just wanting a quick, ten minute talk to the recruiter about military intelligence, as I didn't(and still dont) know much about it. It turned into them pressuring me as hard as they could to join, basically. I wasn't going in there to get into an argument, but they dragged it out of me.

I think I''m just going to call the guy, and tell him I'm not interested. Not worth my time to talk to either liars or people with large delusions.

Why not just ignore it? What purpose would it serve to go back there and argue with them if you have no intention of joining?

Let them believe what they want, and you do the same. It seems like a waste of time and energy, for both you and them, to do that and then come back here to post about it as if you're trying to slander them.

If it wastes their time, thereby limiting the amount of time available for them to work over someone else, someone with fewer wits about them perhaps - then it's worth it. Even a delay of one calendar day could be enough time for some other development, some viable alternative to present itself - something that would preclude the necessity of signing on.

If it wastes their time, thereby limiting the amount of time available for them to work over someone else, someone with fewer wits about them perhaps - then it's worth it.

Or, you know....someone who actually wants to enlist.


Wouldn't want to forget inconveniencing them, too!

In my somewhat limmited experience with military recruiters (that is to say, at least the only place they get to stand and look intimidating is the Cafeteria), they are sharks who can't be trusted period. However, I can hardly claim to have met the majority of them, and I may have only met the bastards from them, who knows?

After all, my High School is a waste of perfectly good recruiters anyway, since the military targets minorities to recruit. :rolleyes:

"So what? Its a picture of saddam, and the twin towers. Anyone could have drawn that."

"Are you serious?"

"What if I drew a picture of George Bush there, and said he did it? Would that mean it was true?"

"But we found them all over!"



So, I'm dying of curiousity...They showed you that photo at the recruiting station? From this website: www.spiritoftruth.org?? This doesn't seem to be the type of site that the military is going to explore looking for recruiting material.

Or, alternatively, I find it amazing good luck that you would find the same photo through a search on the web.

Then there's the one army guy who tossed grenades into the officer's tents. They do officer Fragging in Iraq?
I thought that died out after Vietnam.

So, I'm dying of curiousity...They showed you that photo at the recruiting station? From this website: www.spiritoftruth.org?? This doesn't seem to be the type of site that the military is going to explore looking for recruiting material.

Or, alternatively, I find it amazing good luck that you would find the same photo through a search on the web.

I was shown a picture of the exact same painting. The recruiter had a photograph of it that he pulled out, among a bunch of photo's. I searched online for Saddam 9/11 on google image and it happened to be on the first page.

Maybe they really were all over the place.

Maybe they really were all over the place.

Iraqis seem to have a penchant for political artwork. I found this in Al Asad Airbase when I was over there.

http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a353/tuebor/CIMG0384.jpg

Iraqis seem to have a penchant for political artwork. I found this in Al Asad Airbase when I was over there.
http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a353/tuebor/CIMG0384.jpg

Pff but is it ART?

They love it when a hippie attacks them. Reminds them of the last time they were in combat.....:p
Maybe this is why people fail to see you as being such a peaceful guy. Anyone who disagrees with your views is dismissed as a "hippie".

In my somewhat limmited experience with military recruiters (that is to say, at least the only place they get to stand and look intimidating is the Cafeteria), they are sharks who can't be trusted period. However, I can hardly claim to have met the majority of them, and I may have only met the bastards from them, who knows?

After all, my High School is a waste of perfectly good recruiters anyway, since the military targets minorities to recruit. :rolleyes:

http://www.prb.org/Template.cfm?Section=Population_Bulletin1&template=/ContentManagement/ContentDisplay.cfm&ContentID=12460

Check figure 7, page 21 of the link above. If the recruiters were focusing on recruiting minorities they're doing a really shitty job of it. Whites still make up the large majority of military personel.

They do officer Fragging in Iraq?
I thought that died out after Vietnam.

I remember there was one or two attempts made juuust prior to the invasion, while the forces were stationed along the border.

Iraqis seem to have a penchant for political artwork. I found this in Al Asad Airbase when I was over there.

http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a353/tuebor/CIMG0384.jpg

I for one am amused that they felt the need to write USA beside the American flag.

No, she's a coward because she is willing to let other people die for her cowardness.
Lol @ circular logic.

Though I agree, she shouldn't have volunteered in the first place if she's doing this sort of thing. She's shouldn't have volunteered for a lot of reasons, actually. She has no "duty" to the government.

That's also where the military prison (http://usmilitary.about.com/od/justicelawlegislation/a/leavenworth.htm)is. I honestly had no idea there was anything else to that base. That does sound interesting.

Ft Leavenworth is the home of the Command and General Staff School.

So, I'm dying of curiousity...They showed you that photo at the recruiting station? From this website: www.spiritoftruth.org?? This doesn't seem to be the type of site that the military is going to explore looking for recruiting material.

Or, alternatively, I find it amazing good luck that you would find the same photo through a search on the web.

Actually I have that photo on My hard drive I got when swapping photos with a soldier from the 3d ID when he was at my CP, we did some photo swapping because we had both been to different parts of the country and that is a photo he had in a file from his first deployment back in 2003. So I do not think you have to search just the web for that pic.

Iraqis seem to have a penchant for political artwork. I found this in Al Asad Airbase when I was over there.

http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a353/tuebor/CIMG0384.jpg

yes they do I found pics like that in buildings all over Speicher in Tikrit, and TQ airbase in the Ramadi area.

Speicher was also where the Stadium was in which Saddam had the 80 or so Olympic Athletes executed for losing as a warning to other Olympic Athletes. I have some pics of that place too.


But hey has anyone even stopped to think that this whole story about what the Marine recruiter said and showed might just be all made up to start some BS thread and get all kinds of responses like has happened?just an idea for thought!