NationStates Jolt Archive

http://cbs4boston.com/topstories/local_story_352133112.html

Deric Allen broke into a 21 year old's home armed with a knife, and she called 911. On the tapes you can hear her screaming in terror and begging him not to hurt her, begging him to leave her alone, and telling him repeatedly there was an infant in the house.

He had apparently cornered her in the bedroom and jumped onto her bed when the cops arrived and arrested him.

Her father, hearing these tapes played in court, leaped out of the gallery and charged the suspect; the defense attorney and court officers took him to the ground before he could reach Allen.

Listening to those tapes, knowing he was caught in her bedroom with the knife menacing her, hell yeah, I'd have gone for him too if he'd menaced my daughter and grandchild. Too bad the court officers didn't let him get one good punch in.

After the attack, the defendant looked shaken. My heart absolutely bleeds for him. After all, having someone's father trying to punch you is FAR worse than being held at knifepoint and begging not to be hurt, thinking you and your kid are about to be raped, murdered, kidnapped or whatever else this asshole had in mind before the cops stopped him.

It's too bad she didn't own a gun.

The father is a criminal also.

Don't be dumb folks. The proper way to handle this is to talk to someone in his cell block and arrange for an accident to take place in exchange for a couple hundred dollars being deposited into the guy's commissary fund.

It's too bad she didn't own a gun.

mother =/= skilled gunman :p

I hope the guy gets the help he needs *gets ready to go through this whole debate again*

The video is priceless. He thought he was in his own home. I don't think I could still walk if I was that drunk.

*silence due to the fact I'm a poria*

Otherwise I'd say something. :mad:

mother =/= skilled gunman :p

I hope the guy gets the help he needs *gets ready to go through this whole debate again*you don't need to be a skilled gunman to be able to point a shotgun at somebody armed with a knife and ask them to leave your home

Her terrifying screams were heard on the recorded call as Allen allegedly entered her room and jumped on her bed moments before police caught him.
He pleaded not guilty.

What? They caught him in the room with a knife, and he plead not guilty?

What? They caught him in the room with a knife, and he plead not guilty?

He thought he was in his own house. Clearly not the sharpest knife in the drawer ;)

Aye, making verbally threatening remarks to the punk while getting ten minutes with him through armored glass is the way to go. Shoot deep, be cheap. Tell him that you've gotten some of the prison gangs to keep an eye out for him, and make sure he becomes the village bicycle while he's in jail.

That way he'll go away shaking.

The father is a criminal also.

Then let me applaud him and put him into the same category as Jean Val Jean.

you don't need to be a skilled gunman to be able to point a shotgun at somebody armed with a knife and ask them to leave your home

lol and where would this shotgun be stored? do you think it would be loaded with kids in the house?

I listened to the tape on the news tonight. It was bad. And yes, he pled not guilty and we still need to refer to him as a suspect even though he was caught red handed by the cops.

I prefer "defendant" myself.

Then let me applaud him and put him into the same category as Jean Val Jean.

oh yes how silly of me I forgot we had descended to barbarism

And isn’t that a book:confused:

lol and where would this shotgun be stored? do you think it would be loaded with kids in the house?


Doesn't need to be loaded. My parents own a gun and not a single bullet, and I'm confident that they can defend themselves with that. Point it at the dude and he'll have second thoughts. Tell him to "Get the fuck out of my home, you sick motherfuckin' fuck, or I'll blow your fuckin' face off!" He'll think "Crazy bitch: Run." And he will.

Then let me applaud him and put him into the same category as Jean Val Jean.

BOOM! The atomic Les Mis reference FTFW!

lol and where would this shotgun be stored? do you think it would be loaded with kids in the house?

I keep ours on a bracket above the bedroom door, loaded.

I listened to the tape on the news tonight.

why?

Then let me applaud him and put him into the same category as Jean Val Jean.

You only care because of the victim, no because of the crime. If you want to shoot all burgulars in the testicles, by all means, but it should be done across the board.

Speaking of which, the father attempted to commit a violent felony. I suggest the lash.

I keep ours on a bracket above the bedroom door, loaded.

is that safe?

What? They caught him in the room with a knife, and he plead not guilty?

Sure, why not? They're not charging him with being in a room with a knife. They're charging him with armed home invasion and kidnapping. He'll argue that he wasn't "home invading" or kidnapping and try to plea down to something like breaking and entering and a minor weapons possession charge or something.

You only care because of the victim, no because of the crime. If you want to shoot all burgulars in the testicles, by all means, but it should be done across the board.

Speaking of which, the father attempted to commit a violent felony. I suggest the lash.

For five minutes alone with a man who held my daughter and grandchild at knifepoint?

Give me the rack, baby.

I listened to the tape on the news tonight.

why?

Duh, because I was watching the news?

is that safe?

Keeping it loaded, absolutely not.

One of the three primary rules the NRA teaches you is "Always keep your gun unloaded until you're ready to use it."

Absolutely vital to memorize the three rules, otherwise someone stands the chance of being badly injured.

is that safe?

They're only three (can't reach) and already know not to touch them w/o permission or to point them at people.

He'll argue that he wasn't "home invading" or kidnapping and try to plea down to something like breaking and entering and a minor weapons possession charge or something.

*shrug* if I found some woman in my house I would of run to the neighbours (or in this case stumbled) squatters scare me:(

Good advise for everyone here I say

Keeping it loaded, absolutely not.

One of the three primary rules the NRA teaches you is "Always keep your gun unloaded until you're ready to use it."

Absolutely vital to memorize the three rules, otherwise someone stands the chance of being badly injured.

The reason I keep it loaded is coyotes. We've lost numerous poultry during that time it takes me to load it and get outside.

They're only three (can't reach) and already know not to touch them w/o permission or to point them at people.

I'm thinking of all the tragedy’s that could happen myself…along with the problems that may result if you keep bullets loaded in a gun for years on end something which there not built to withstand (in other words the round might backfire and take your face off along with everyone Behind the barrel)

You only care because of the victim, no because of the crime.
You're a magical mindreader now?

If you want to shoot all burgulars in the testicles, by all means, but it should be done across the board.
Please scroll back and tell me where I mentioned shooting him. I'll wait. Oh, right, I didn't. I said I understood why the father tried to punch him. But go on projecting whatever it is you're trying to project on me. Makes you look pretty ridiculous.

Speaking of which, the father attempted to commit a violent felony. I suggest the lash.
The defendant broke and entered, menaced, and kidnapped. He actually committed several felonies. But hey, let's all weep and wail over how it's not really hisfault, and then we can turn it around and say it's the victim's fault for screaming in terror when he broke into her home, armed with a knife, and threatened her and her child.

Then we can bake him cookies and sing Kumbaya.

The reason I keep it loaded is coyotes. We've lost numerous poultry during that time it takes me to load it and get outside.

then buy a bow and arrow simple to get ready and kids won't be able to pull the bow back

archery FTW!

I'm thinking of all the tragedy’s that could happen myself…along with the problems that may result if you keep bullets loaded in a gun for years on end something which there not built to withstand (in other words the round might backfire and take your face off along with everyone Behind the barrel)

So do I. That's why I teach my kids safety and check it periodically. It doesn't just stay up there collecting dust.

FYI: They're shells, not bullets, for shotguns.

You're a magical mindreader now?


Yes.

The defendant broke and entered, menaced, and kidnapped. He actually committed several felonies. But hey, let's all weep and wail over how it's not really hisfault, and then we can turn it around and say it's the victim's fault for screaming in terror when he broke into her home, armed with a knife, and threatened her and her child.

Then we can bake him cookies and sing Kumbaya.

Did I say the defendant wasn't a criminal?

Maybe two wrongs don't make a right, however.

You're a magical mindreader now?

well that leaves a bad taste in my mouth how long did it take you to try and sentence this man in your head? did the reporter use lots of scary words?

The defendant broke and entered, menaced, and kidnapped. He actually committed several felonies. But hey, let's all weep and wail over how it's not really hisfault, and then we can turn it around and say it's the victim's fault for screaming in terror when he broke into her home, armed with a knife, and threatened her and her child.

innocent till proven guilty until that judge bangs his hammer your acting just a little bit above the mob that best up a paediatrician

Then we can bake him cookies and sing Kumbaya.

I agree with this cookies rule

You're a magical mindreader now?

Yes.

Really? What am I thinking now?

So do I. That's why I teach my kids safety and check it periodically. It doesn't just stay up there collecting dust.

how often do you change the bullets?

FYI: I'm British I no little of primitive home defence weapons

Really? What am I thinking now?

What an asshat.

You see.

The defendant broke and entered, menaced, and kidnapped. He actually committed several felonies. But hey, let's all weep and wail over how it's not really hisfault, and then we can turn it around and say it's the victim's fault for screaming in terror when he broke into her home, armed with a knife, and threatened her and her child.

Then we can bake him cookies and sing Kumbaya.


Even hinting that anyone in this thread has suggested in the slightest that the father's felonious actions in any way, in any form, mitigates or excuses the other man's unrelated actions is a straw man fallacy in the extreme. Nobody has at ANY point in this thread suggested that it wasn't his fault, or that it was the victim's fault, or said anything even remotely similar to this. In fact the only person to say it here has been you.

The actions of the father in no way lessens the seriousness of the crimes the man has been charged with. That being said, the seriousness of the crimes the man has been charged with in no way alters the actions of the father. However, stating "The defendant broke and entered, menaced, and kidnapped. He actually committed several felonies." is contrary to the ideals of justice. It skips the trial and goes straight to the conviction. It is an anathma of the fundamental principles our system of justice is based on.


If the man is guilty of the crimes he has been charged with, then let him be punished. But let him be punished as our justice system demands. Let him be charged, placed on trial, have evidence of his guilt shown to him, allow his attorney to advocate for him with all due diligance, let a jury of his peers consider the evidence, and, should they find him guilty beyond reasonable doubt, convict him of his crimes, at which point he will be sentenced.

That is justice.

Leaping over the stands to assault him is not justice. It is vigilantism. And vigilantism is illegal for a reason.

is that safe?

Pretty much. I'm not sure a weapon designed for home defense is necessarily going to be able to be loaded on the fly if it is ever needed for it's designated purpose.

It is important to note that guns (especially shot guns) are fairly simple machines. Modern firearms do not "just go off" unless they are in a terrible state of disrepair. The shotgun I own for home defense is a fairly inexpensive model and even it has several internal safety mechanisms. The only time it goes off is if I pull the trigger and the safety button is set to red.

Keeping it loaded, absolutely not.

One of the three primary rules the NRA teaches you is "Always keep your gun unloaded until you're ready to use it."

Absolutely vital to memorize the three rules, otherwise someone stands the chance of being badly injured.

I disagree pretty heartily there. Unless you're using a very old weapon, a very cheap weapon, or keeping it in the rain there isn't much of a problem keeping a gun loaded, especially a shotgun. Keeping a round in the chamber is a bad idea, but having a few shells in the tube is harmless, especially if you rotate them out every few months.

Hell I'd go for the s.o.b. if I were in that man's place too. But yes,... talking about certain 'arrangements' behind a glass wall seems even more appealing :D

Hell I'd go for the s.o.b. if I were in that man's place too. But yes,... talking about certain 'arrangements' behind a glass wall seems even more appealing :D

You'd make him look over his shoulder constantly. It would be "flippin' suh-weet".

Her father, hearing these tapes played in court, leaped out of the gallery and charged the suspect; the defense attorney and court officers took him to the ground before he could reach Allen.
Ooh, big man that, charging the man after he's been disarmed and arrested.
Too bad the court officers didn't let him get one good punch in.
I got a better idea, let's give the suspect back his knife and see if your valiant, little He-Man still has the sack to try and pull something clever.

Even hinting that one has suggested in the slightest that one man's felonious actions in any way, in any form, mitigates or excuses another man's unrelated actions

I stopped reading here, as nobody is claiming such a thing. Kat said she understood why he did it, that's it.

I stopped reading here, as nobody is claiming such a thing. Kat said she understood why he did it, that's it.

The defendant broke and entered, menaced, and kidnapped. He actually committed several felonies. But hey, let's all weep and wail over how it's not really his fault, and then we can turn it around and say it's the victim's fault for screaming in terror when he broke into her home, armed with a knife, and threatened her and her child.

I read this differently than you do perhaps. I would like to know at which point someone in this thread suggested something even REMOTELY similar to this. I have yet to see it.

Hrm, perhaps I see where you might have misread. I did not mean to say that Kat was suggesting the defendant's actions in some way excused the father's response. I am saying that she seems to be suggesting that some have argued that the father's assault someone excuses the defendant's alleged crimes. I have edited for clarification.

well that leaves a bad taste in my mouth how long did it take you to try and sentence this man in your head? did the reporter use lots of scary words?

What is wrong with you tonight? Did I somehow insult you that you and Lackademon are ascribing things to me that I never said, or are you just being a dick? I listened to the TAPE. Gee, wow, imagine listening to some evidence that was being played in court and coming to the conclusion that it's understandable that a father would lose his temper and try to punch the person who made it all possible.


your acting just a little bit above the mob that best up a paediatrician

See above.

I stopped reading here, as nobody is claiming such a thing. Kat said she understood why he did it, that's it.

Thank you. Apparently it's more fun to be a mob and shout insults at someone than, oh, I don't know, actually respond to what they said.

Pretty much. I'm not sure a weapon designed for home defense is necessarily going to be able to be loaded on the fly if it is ever needed for it's designated purpose.

you won't need to load it on the fly though its in the bedroom you get your family in there barricade the door and shoot anyone who tries to get in

I disagree pretty heartily there. Unless you're using a very old weapon, a very cheap weapon, or keeping it in the rain there isn't much of a problem keeping a gun loaded, especially a shotgun. Keeping a round in the chamber is a bad idea, but having a few shells in the tube is harmless, especially if you rotate them out every few months.

why do you keep a weapon on such readiness :confused:

I disagree pretty heartily there. Unless you're using a very old weapon, a very cheap weapon, or keeping it in the rain there isn't much of a problem keeping a gun loaded, especially a shotgun. Keeping a round in the chamber is a bad idea, but having a few shells in the tube is harmless, especially if you rotate them out every few months.

I guess that's what I've been taught from the very beginning, by my grandfather at his farm, by Boy Scouts, by the NRA Course, by competition pistol teams and the like. It's an ingrained rule.

What an asshat.

You see.

You happen to be wrong. About what I was thinking, anyway.

how often do you change the bullets?

FYI: I'm British I no little of primitive home defence weapons

I never change the bullets.

I change the shells every couple of months. Yes, they are perfectly fine being in there that long.

Thank you. Apparently it's more fun to be a mob and shout insults at someone than, oh, I don't know, actually respond to what they said.

actually I believe the person you are quoting misread my statement. I have since edited. I did not say that you suggested that the defendant's actions excused the father's.

I did say however that you suggested that some of us have argued that somehow, should the defendant be shownt o be guilty, that we think it wasn't his fault. And for that claim I would like you to provide some substantiation for the suggestion.

What is wrong with you tonight? Did I somehow insult you that you and Lackademon are ascribing things to me that I never said, or are you just being a dick? I listened to the TAPE. Gee, wow, imagine listening to some evidence that was being played in court and coming to the conclusion that it's understandable that a father would lose his temper and try to punch the person who made it all possible.

I think routing for such actions was the thing that did it you see I don't take too kindly to vigilantes what your basically doing in my eyes is giving the thumbs up for assault

at home he would get a nice bullet in him

What is wrong with you tonight? Did I somehow insult you that you and Lackademon are ascribing things to me that I never said, or are you just being a dick? I listened to the TAPE. Gee, wow, imagine listening to some evidence that was being played in court and coming to the conclusion that it's understandable that a father would lose his temper and try to punch the person who made it all possible.

Understandable? Sure. Inevitable? Maybe.

Illegal? Yup.

You happen to be wrong. About what I was thinking, anyway.

You can't have it both ways.

Hrm, perhaps I see where you might have misread. I did not mean to say that Kat was suggesting the defendant's actions in some way excused the father's response. I am saying that she seems to be suggesting that some have argued that the father's assault someone excuses the defendant's alleged crimes. I have edited for clarification.

All I have said is that I understand what motivated the father to lunge for him.

Others have said she should have shot him, that the father should pay someone to abuse him in jail, that the father should lie and SAY that he's paid someone to abuse him in jail. Lackademon even suggested that *I* said he should be shot, which I did not.

All I have said is that I understand what motivated the father to lunge for him.

Then let me applaud him and put him into the same category as Jean Val Jean.

hmmm

Nah, I only suggested that the father make the dude think that he'd paid someone to abuse him in jail. Make the perp freak for a while.

hmmm

Who stole food to feed his starving family. You couldn't see the motivation for that crime?

All I have said is that I understand what motivated the father to lunge for him.

Others have said she should have shot him, that the father should pay someone to abuse him in jail, that the father should lie and SAY that he's paid someone to abuse him in jail. Lackademon even suggested that *I* said he should be shot, which I did not.

Actually, I was suggesting that I don't really care what happens to people who break and enter, as long as it happens across the board.

Who stole food to feed his starving family. You couldn't see the motivation for that crime?

ah but punching a guy doesn't....unless your a boxer...or its in a street and the guy has money...

you get the point

They're only three (can't reach) and already know not to touch them w/o permission or to point them at people.
And we all know children always do exactly what their parents tell them to do. Especially when they told NOT to do something.
Ohhh...forbidden fruit!

I keep ours on a bracket above the bedroom door, loaded.
loaded and above the bedroom door.
The woman in this instance was cornered in her bedroom and he had jumped onto her bed.
So a few scenarios play out here:
She wakes up in time, grabs the gun and shoots his sorry ass
He corners her before she has a chance to get to the gun, making having it a moot point
He sees the gun upon entering her bedroom and uses that instead of the knife

And we all know children always do exactly what their parents tell them to do. Especially when they told NOT to do something.
Ohhh...forbidden fruit!


loaded and above the bedroom door.
The woman in this instance was cornered in her bedroom and he had jumped onto her bed.
So a few scenarios play out here:
She wakes up in time, grabs the gun and shoots his sorry ass
He corners her before she has a chance to get to the gun, making having it a moot point
He sees the gun upon entering her bedroom and uses that instead of the knife



Now you get to show me where I said she should have had a gun instead of combining my posts w/ others to make up a strawman.

What if "Dirty Harry" was in the home? :p
But seriously, the Dad was right. As a matter of fact, this may sound heartless, but I couldn't care less if he (the knife-creep of course) were shot.

The father should get time served. The knife creep should get sentenced to extreme rehab. If that exists...

Oh, and then being banned from alcohol.

The father should get time served. The knife creep should get sentenced to extreme rehab. If that exists...

Oh, and then being banned from alcohol.

HAHAH! Lol. :p That's the way this country is begining to work...you are joking...right?

HAHAH! Lol. :p That's the way this country is begining to work...you are joking...right?

I definitely am not. He broke into a woman's house and threatened her with a knife because he was drunk, is what I'm hearing. If he's going to do that when he drinks (I don't care if this is a one time thing) then he most definitely should not be allowed to drink.

The father should get time served.

WHAT time served?

WHAT time served?

yeah so he can't get a firearm or vote!

I definitely am not. He broke into a woman's house and threatened her with a knife because he was drunk, is what I'm hearing. If he's going to do that when he drinks (I don't care if this is a one time thing) then he most definitely should not be allowed to drink.

I have a better idea. We commend the Dad and kill the offender by means of an overdose.

yeah so he can't get a firearm or vote!

You miss my point. "time served" is a statement meaning that the time the defendant served awaiting a verdict is adequate punishment for the crime. If you wait in jail for a year awaiting verdict and you get a verdict, a judge can award "time served" to basically say "ok you already did a year, that's enough".

You can not, however, get time served unless youv'e actually served time. To my understanding the father hasn't even been charged of anything yet. So how in the world is he supposed to get time served if he hasn't served any time.

more to point, it's also rather ludicrus to say he should get "time served" without knowing how long he's actually there for. Time served isn't a symbolic thing, it's not "well ya did bad, but it's ok this time, we're not gonna hold you any longer".

It's not meant to be luck, it's not meant to be a "get out of jail free (or early" card if your trial is quick. It's not independant of the time put in. It's supposed to mean that the time already put in is roughly adequate.

To say he should get "time served" when he has yet to serve any time, and we're totally unaware of how long he will serve, if at all, is basically to say "well he should get whatever chance happens to give him depending on the length of the docket". No, that's not what it's about. It's a useful convenience when time there spent is already "about right", you can't say he should get "time served" when you don't know what that time frame IS yet.

I have a better idea. We commend the Dad and kill the offender by means of an overdose.

I have a better idea.

We arrest, prosecute, and attempt to convict both of them for their alleged crimes, and should we do so, we give them a sentence proportionate to their acts.

I have a better idea.

We arrest, prosecute, and attempt to convict both of them for their alleged crimes, and should we do so, we give them a sentence proportionate to their acts.

The Dad's not a criminal. Oh sure he can be dangerous, and threaten you, but he doesn't ask much. "Do NOT barge into my daugher's house with a knife and scare the hell out of her, with a possibility of killing her. Then you're safe" Really, is that asking SO much?

you won't need to load it on the fly though its in the bedroom you get your family in there barricade the door and shoot anyone who tries to get in

Too many what ifs. I'd rather have a weapon ready for a worst case scenario.

More to the point, I can't imagine barricading myself or my family away because someone broke in. Its really a rather simple situation: either the intruder backs out of the door or they get shot with a safety slug.

why do you keep a weapon on such readiness :confused:

My wife and I live in a questionable neighborhood in Chicago. Burglaries and home invasions are not unknown. I figure that its better to have and not need than need and not have.

I guess that's what I've been taught from the very beginning, by my grandfather at his farm, by Boy Scouts, by the NRA Course, by competition pistol teams and the like. It's an ingrained rule.

It depends on the weapon and the time. I'm sure it was a good rule of thumb when your grandfather learned it and safety features weren't as prolific as they are now, and it is definately a good idea if you're teaching someone to shoot.

The Dad's not a criminal. Really? It looks to me like he committed an assault. And while I admit my criminal law is a bit rusty (I'm a civil law kinda guy) last time I checked, assault is a crime.

Really? It looks to me like he committed an assault. And while I admit my criminal law is a bit rusty (I'm a civil law kinda guy) last time I checked, assault is a crime.

Aggravated assualt at the very worst. The guy provoked him, and he deserved it anyhoo.

What if "Dirty Harry" was in the home? :p
But seriously, the Dad was right. As a matter of fact, this may sound heartless, but I couldn't care less if he (the knife-creep of course) were shot.
http://memepedia.info/images/0/04/Asiancat_approves.jpg

Aggravated assualt at the very worst.Which is still a crime.


The guy provoked him, and he deserved it anyhoo.

please show me in the relevant penal code where "he deserved it anyhoo" is a defense to this particular crime. I suppose you'll find it right next to "the bitch was asking for it" rape defense and "that black man was sleeping with our white women!" justification for murder.

Which is still a crime.




please show me in the relevant penal code where "he deserved it anyhoo" is a defense to this particular crime. I suppose you'll find it right next to "the bitch was asking for it" rape defense and "that black man was sleeping with our white women!" justification for murder.

Well, in your mock instances, the crimes out-weighs the motives. Man comes into house with knife, scares daughter. Dad punches man. The punch wasn't as bad as the knife.

You can not, however, get time served unless youv'e actually served time. To my understanding the father hasn't even been charged of anything yet.

"The victim's father was charged with disorderly conduct and released on personal recognizance."

Served no time, so timed served is inappropriate.

Well, in your mock instances, the crimes out-weighs the motives. Man comes into house with knife, scares daughter. Dad punches man. The punch wasn't as bad as the knife.

So?
It's as illegal to assault Saddam Hussien as it is to assualt some random guy you meet on the street.
"Deserved it" is not a legal defence.

It's too bad she didn't own a gun.

Don't be dumb folks. The proper way to handle this is to talk to someone in his cell block and arrange for an accident to take place in exchange for a couple hundred dollars being deposited into the guy's commissary fund.

Aye, making verbally threatening remarks to the punk while getting ten minutes with him through armored glass is the way to go. Shoot deep, be cheap. Tell him that you've gotten some of the prison gangs to keep an eye out for him, and make sure he becomes the village bicycle while he's in jail.

That way he'll go away shaking.

For five minutes alone with a man who held my daughter and grandchild at knifepoint?

Give me the rack, baby.

Hell I'd go for the s.o.b. if I were in that man's place too. But yes,... talking about certain 'arrangements' behind a glass wall seems even more appealing :D

You'd make him look over his shoulder constantly. It would be "flippin' suh-weet".

The defendent broke into a home extremely drunk, and wound up on the bed. He had a knife. A careful reading of that story reveals the absence of such words as 'threatening,' 'menacing,' 'attacking,' 'raping,' 'killing,' or a host of other important verbs to makes this a henious crime. The extremely intelligent might notice that 'The mother and her baby daughter were not physically harmed.'

Did he commit a crime? Yes, he did. Is there a fitting punishment for this crime? Again, yes. Is he a human being, with rights(such as neither being attacked nor raped in prison)? Yes, as we all are. Does his waking a woman up and causing her some stress negate that fact? Not on your life.

Well, in your mock instances, the crimes out-weighs the motives. Man comes into house with knife, scares daughter. Dad punches man. The punch wasn't as bad as the knife.

By what measure? Unless the fright caused a heart attack, which it did not, a punch to the face is worse than a fright. More harm was done.

Well, in your mock instances, the crimes out-weighs the motives. Man comes into house with knife, scares daughter. Dad punches man. The punch wasn't as bad as the knife.

Yeah...no. Doesn't work that way. At best, provocation could mitigate damages in a civil suit, and setence in a criminal one...but it's not a defence.

If she'd had a pistol in the night stand she could have shot him in self defense.

If she'd had a pistol in the night stand she could have shot him in self defense.

Self defence is a defence. Provocation is not.

Self defence is a defence. Provocation is not.

What are you talking about?

What are you talking about?

Sorry, I made the assumption that you were replying to my comment above yours :D Carry on, if this was not so.

Doesn't need to be loaded. My parents own a gun and not a single bullet, and I'm confident that they can defend themselves with that. Point it at the dude and he'll have second thoughts. Tell him to "Get the fuck out of my home, you sick motherfuckin' fuck, or I'll blow your fuckin' face off!" He'll think "Crazy bitch: Run." And he will.

Unless he's on drugs, or crazy, or too stupid or fucked up to think straight. The most dangerous situation to be in is to be holding an unloaded gun on a sicko. They don't care. I want the gun and I want it loaded.

Aggravated assualt at the very worst. The guy provoked him, and he deserved it anyhoo.

I can "provoke" you all the live long day, and you're still a criminal if you attack me.

The dad was overwhelmed by his emotions and made a mistake and broke the law. I doubt the courts will exactly "throw the book" at him, but he deserves a slap on the wrist.

This still would have been a better story had it been titled "21 year old shoots knife-wielding assailant."

Then let me applaud him and put him into the same category as Jean Val Jean.
Ditto.

This is why "civilised law" is so very flawed. What would be so wrong with letting the father, and the aggrieved for that matter, beat nine bells out of the defendant?

The only bit I'm glad (apart from the man hitting the criminal if he managed to) about is this:

Her terrifying screams were heard on the recorded call as Allen allegedly entered her room and jumped on her bed moments before police caught him.

Far too often the police either don't get there in time, or do get there in time but spend too long banging on the door instead of kicking it down and racing to help the victim / would-be victim.

I'm glad they got there in time in this case, but, considering what he was probably after when he jumped on the woman's bed, it's a shame that it's probably unlikely that there's enough evidence for him to be charged with attempted rape on top of the other crimes.