NationStates Jolt Archive

I know there are quite a few folks who are christian and don't find any conflict between christian teachings and current scientific thought.
I was wondering then whether you believe in an afterlife? And if so are there only people in heaven, or do other life forms go to heaven? If you could teach a chimpanze or a gorilla about jesus and they chose to believe would they have an opportunity to go to heaven?

I know this sounds confrontational... but it really isn't intended that way.. I just had an odd thought and was wondering what the good folk on NSG thought of it...

I know there are quite a few folks who are christian and don't find any conflict between christian teachings and current scientific thought.
I was wondering then whether you believe in an afterlife? And if so are there only people in heaven, or do other life forms go to heaven? If you could teach a chimpanze or a gorilla about jesus and they chose to believe would they have an opportunity to go to heaven?

I know this sounds confrontational... but it really isn't intended that way.. I just had an odd thought and was wondering what the good folk on NSG thought of it...1. Those humans who believe in Jesus aren't going to heaven.
2. Thank Yah no chimpanzee or gorilla would ever adhere to this utter crap.

I know there are quite a few folks who are christian and don't find any conflict between christian teachings and current scientific thought.
I was wondering then whether you believe in an afterlife? And if so are there only people in heaven, or do other life forms go to heaven? If you could teach a chimpanze or a gorilla about jesus and they chose to believe would they have an opportunity to go to heaven?

I know this sounds confrontational... but it really isn't intended that way.. I just had an odd thought and was wondering what the good folk on NSG thought of it...

yeah good question!

can Bush get into heaven?

when evolution (and creation) is complete, even grass will be saved.

animals don't go to heaven because God is an A-hole who hates animals for some reason (most likely some horrible incident in his childhood or an allergy)

1. Those humans who believe in Jesus aren't going to heaven.
2. Thank Yah no chimpanzee or gorilla would ever adhere to this utter crap.

Wait,so you're God now?
You're not?
In that case,don't pass jusdgement.Isn't your job.

1. Those humans who believe in Jesus aren't going to heaven.
2. Thank Yah no chimpanzee or gorilla would ever adhere to this utter crap.
1. Why, do you think that all Christians are bad people?

2. Yah? You aren't Jewish, are you?

yeah good question!

can Bush get into heaven?
You win the thread.

I was wondering then whether you believe in an afterlife? And if so are there only people in heaven, or do other life forms go to heaven?

According to the description of paradise, animals lived and plants/trees grew there.
If heaven is like paradise we at least know they can exist there.

1. Why, do you think that all Christians are bad people?

Well.. many Christians seem to believe that non-Christians will go to hell, regardless of how they lived their life. Turning that around is not unfair in my opinion, though just as silly.

1. Why, do you think that all Christians are bad people?
2. Yah? You aren't Jewish, are you?1. At least those who dwell on being Christian.
2. Hell no. Yah ain't jewish.

You win the thread.O yes o yes o yes.

Well.. many Christians seem to believe that non-Christians will go to hell, regardless of how they lived their life. Turning that around is not unfair in my opinion, though just as silly.

Well who are they to pass judgement?I'm a Christian.Ain't my calling on who's going to hell and who isn't.

1. At least those who dwell on being Christian.
2. Hell no. Yah ain't jewish.
1. What do you mean? The self-righteous hypocrites?

2. What is Yah? What is your religion?

1. What do you mean? The self-righteous hypocrites?

2. What is Yah? What is your religion?

1) ignore him... he's rambling

2) yah if i'm not mistaken refers to the head of the rastafarian trinity... which just happens to be the same figure as jehove (as i said, he's rambling)

1. What do you mean? The self-righteous hypocrites?
2. What is Yah? What is your religion?1. Those, the self-righteous and the hypocrites. Generally those who put faith over knowledge.
2. Yah is Enki/Ea. I follow no religion.

1) ignore him... he's rambling
2) yah if i'm not mistaken refers to the head of the rastafarian trinity... which just happens to be the same figure as jehove (as i said, he's rambling)There is no such thing as a "Rastafarian trinity". And the Jah of Rastafarian ideology is somewhat different from the judeo-christian Yahweh/Jehova.

If a chimp or gorilla had true sentience, and could understand what it was being told about Christianity, probably it could go to heaven.

I believe the early church separated animals from humans by saying animals did not have souls -- what other difference, really, is there between animals and humans than the perception of which one is sentient? ;) Maybe what they thought was the spiritual self is really the sentient, self aware part.

It'll be pretty funny to get up there and find the dolphins are running the show. ;)

Or those crazy mice....

The threoy of Evolution I believe to be almost correct:confused: , BUT, I also believe that there may be a heaven. Now, I love to read and from books I read, I know 3 threoys of heaven:

1.When you die you age backwards (From Elsewhere/Good book;was odd)

2.When you die you meet 5 people who you or they changed your life in some way (The 5 people you meet in heaven/Great book;sad)

3.Before you die creatures come to take you to heaven and If you kill yourself you turn into a monster (Full moon/comic;So odd)

And i some way I believe in this. Why? I don't know.:confused:

If a chimp or gorilla had true sentience, and could understand what it was being told about Christianity, probably it could go to heaven.

I believe the early church separated animals from humans by saying animals did not have souls -- what other difference, really, is there between animals and humans than the perception of which one is sentient? ;) Maybe what they thought was the spiritual self is really the sentient, self aware part.

It'll be pretty funny to get up there and find the dolphins are running the show. ;)

I thought it was the little white mice?

It's possible to believe in both. Count me as one of those people who believe in both. I even have had devoutly religious biology teachers.

Conflict? I've resolved that a long time ago. It seems to me they want to square off Creation and Evolution like roosters in a cockfight. No need for it actually. ;)

My belief is that they actually complement each other.

It's possible to believe in both. Count me as one of those people who believe in both. I even have had devoutly religious biology teachers.

Conflict? I've resolved that a long time ago. It seems to me they want to square off Creation and Evolution like roosters in a cockfight. No need for it actually. ;)

My belief is that they actually complement each other.

Evolution: "Your prose is well composed."
Bible: "Why, thank you! I've always admired your platypus."
Evolution: *blushes*

Well.. many Christians seem to believe that non-Christians will go to hell, regardless of how they lived their life. Turning that around is not unfair in my opinion, though just as silly.And I'm a bad person for warning someone that they will die? Look, like Arinola said, Christians don't call the shots. If you're non-religious then what does it matter to you if Christians warn other people of what will, happen, according to their teachings, if you don't believe them anyway? It's not like Christianity calls for you to jump off the tallest tower in the kingdom armed only with a sword and expect you to live. It's pretty simple to be saved; believe that Jesus died for you, repent of your sins; that's the basics.

God called Christians to warn other people of their fate; they didn't come up with heaven and hell! Believe me warning of impending hell offends a lot of people and it's not an easy thing to do. It's far easier to keep your mouth shut. It's not advised to start conversations with it, though. I knew a guy in secondary school who would preach death and torment; suffice to say that he wasn't much liked. That approach doesn't work. And I would've kept my mouth shut had you not brought it up. But seeing as you made that point I feel compelled to respond.

http://diy.despair.com/output/poster75665117.jpg

It's possible to believe in both. Count me as one of those people who believe in both. I even have had devoutly religious biology teachers.

Conflict? I've resolved that a long time ago. It seems to me they want to square off Creation and Evolution like roosters in a cockfight. No need for it actually. ;)

My belief is that they actually complement each other.

My biggest problem is that many in the field try to use evolution as a means to try to disprove creationism (it hasn't worked yet, haha).

And I'm a bad person for warning someone that they will die? Look, like Arinola said, Christians don't call the shots. If you're non-religious then what does it matter to you if Christians warn other people of what will, happen, according to their teachings, if you don't believe them anyway? It's not like Christianity calls for you to jump off the tallest tower in the kingdom armed only with a sword and expect you to live. It's pretty simple to be saved; believe that Jesus died for you, repent of your sins; that's the basics.

God called Christians to warn other people of their fate; they didn't come up with heaven and hell! Believe me warning of impending hell offends a lot of people and it's not an easy thing to do. It's far easier to keep your mouth shut. It's not advised to start conversations with it, though. I knew a guy in secondary school who would preach death and torment; suffice to say that he wasn't much liked. That approach doesn't work. And I would've kept my mouth shut had you not brought it up. But seeing as you made that point I feel compelled to respond.
There are those among us who believe it was invented. There's a BIG grey area around freedom of speech, freedom of religion, and freedom from religion . . .

My biggest problem is that many in the field try to use evolution as a means to try to disprove creationism (it hasn't worked yet, haha).

It has unless you're an idiot, haha ;)

1. Those, the self-righteous and the hypocrites. Generally those who put faith over knowledge.
2. Yah is Enki/Ea. I follow no religion.

There is no such thing as a "Rastafarian trinity". And the Jah of Rastafarian ideology is somewhat different from the judeo-christian Yahweh/Jehova.

wiki disagrees:p

Rasta doctrine concerning the Holy Trinity relates to the name Haile Selassie meaning Power of the Trinity in Ge'ez. Rastas believe that Haile Selassie is both God the Father and God the Son of the holy Trinity, while it is themselves, and potentially all human beings, who embody the Holy Spirit. Some see Melchizedek in addition to Jesus as having been former incarnations of Haile Selassie.

Evolution: "Your prose is well composed."
Bible: "Why, thank you! I've always admired your platypus."
Evolution: *blushes*

cute but he did say "complement" as opposed to compliment... funny enough though :p

It's possible to believe in both. Count me as one of those people who believe in both. I even have had devoutly religious biology teachers.

Conflict? I've resolved that a long time ago. It seems to me they want to square off Creation and Evolution like roosters in a cockfight. No need for it actually. ;)

My belief is that they actually complement each other.
Yeah a lot of people have said that to me before. I find them somewhat incongruous myself.

The idea that we have a reasonable idea of what is going on in the universe through scientific investigation and there is some kind of God entity that is outside of that seems to me to be possibly reconcilable.. I don't understand why you would need to but that is besides the point.

A Christian god in particular seems like a strange choice though. Just seems like in order to reconcile the 2 you have to ignore a whole swathe of components that make up the basis of the Christian faith.

So I was just interested as to where evolution fitted in. Where is a good point to stop being literal and start being metaphorical. Are humans still the chosen ones. If evolution is/was a steady process at which point in our history did we switch over to being humans and therefore valid entrants to heaven?

Is it when we became reproductively separate from other Homo sapiens like species? Presumably these very closely related species were also sentient. Which ones were excluded?

If it is soul related when in our history did we acquire souls? As evolution is a steady process will we at some point in the future lose them if we evolve beyond a certain point?

Is there a point at which the notion of a Christian God was formed or did we always know. If so did we know about God before we were reproductively isolated? Or did the idea arrive at exactly the point at which our population was finally separated from our ancestors? Could other Homo erectus be in heaven? Or were there generations of Homo sapiens that had no opportunity to enter heaven?

EDIT: Potato Factory.. that "Heavolution: Where obsolete animals go to die" is awesome!!

It has unless you're an idiot, haha ;)

Not everybody's been fooled by those evolutionists

Why not? The Bible doesn't say that animals don't have a spiritual essence, just that man is unique with his soul formed in God's image.

And, remember, animals did live in the Garden of Eden. If that was not a physical place but rather a spiritual one, it shows that animals do live spiritually even if they are not on the same level as humans. Perhaps animals are lucky enough to have that salvation because of their lack of knowledge of sin.

wiki disagrees:pYeah, but who is wiki? The Rastafarians I know, and unfortunately I know many as I used to share an office with the owner of the top Rastafarian website in Germany, stronly disagree with basically all wiki. The Rastafarian movement is no homogeneous entity, you know. Right know I am co-writing a text for an ex-Rastafarian's website in Switzerland. Believe me, I know what this idiotic movement is about.

Why not? The Bible doesn't say that animals don't have a spiritual essence, just that man is unique with his soul formed in God's image.

And, remember, animals did live in the Garden of Eden. If that was not a physical place but rather a spiritual one, it shows that animals do live spiritually even if they are not on the same level as humans. Perhaps animals are lucky enough to have that salvation because of their lack of knowledge of sin.

Sadly, the "Hamlets" claim there was no suffering or death before the Fall. Since animals now suffer and die, they must also be Guilty :(

Oh, and do I believe in such a thing? Maybe. The only thing I know for sure is that I won't know until I get there.

There's a lot of evidence out there that has not been explained and there are a lot of personal accounts of something after death that I can't rule out; for example, the sheer volume of cases of children having memories of things they couldn't possibly know about people they're not related to and have never met suggests strongly that there is some kind of reincarnation or survival after death.

There are those among us who believe it was invented. There's a BIG grey area around freedom of speech, freedom of religion, and freedom from religion . . .And you're free not to believe it. From a Christian's point of view this is what I believe. I believe that I have a right at least in this country to follow whatever religion I want, regardless of whether or not people think that I'm stupid for it.

Sadly, the "Hamlets" claim there was no suffering or death before the Fall. Since animals now suffer and die, they must also be Guilty :(

Of course, if you interpret Genesis to mean spiritual death (as in a shade in Sheol) rather than strictly mortality, it's a little different. Things always died, but they were no longer capable of reuniting with God after death due to original sin. Perhaps animals and humans suffered before, but without the loss of spiritual salvation?

...big snip...

It's a sentience thing.

Like someone just said, there were animals in the Garden. But, guess what the humans did (of their own volition) that the animals didn't... ya, that's right, they ate from the tree of knowledge, and now we're forced to live a life where we must choose between God and evil.

And you're free not to believe it. From a Christian's point of view this is what I believe. I believe that I have a right at least in this country to follow whatever religion I want, regardless of whether or not people think that I'm stupid for it.

Oh, agreed. But somewhere there's a line, when a religion tells it's followers to spread it, where it stops being religion and becomes a virus :eek:

Oh, agreed. But somewhere there's a line, when a religion tells it's followers to spread it, where it stops being religion and becomes a virus :eek:

Ah yes, but does wearing a hazmat suit protect me from conversion?

I believe in an afterlife, I do not know the nature of it....

yeah good question!

can Bush get into heaven?

Yes, but a weird pseudo heaven with people for him to kill always. Sometimes he'll rape them first. Until Jesus comes and pimpslaps him.

It's a sentience thing.

Like someone just said, there were animals in the Garden. But, guess what the humans did (of their own volition) that the animals didn't... ya, that's right, they ate from the tree of knowledge, and now we're forced to live a life where we must choose between God and evil.

I don't recall the scripture saying whether or not the animals ate from that tree...

something related-AI artificial intelligence.....how far are computer developers from developing a self aware AI......if AI becomes self aware does it become a life form? a life form with rights? what happens when these AI's self replicate?

Yeah, but who is wiki? The Rastafarians I know, and unfortunately I know many as I used to share an office with the owner of the top Rastafarian website in Germany, stronly disagree with basically all wiki. The Rastafarian movement is no homogeneous entity, you know. Right know I am co-writing a text for an ex-Rastafarian's website in Switzerland. Believe me, I know what this idiotic movement is about.

Strangely, when you refer to it as 'this idiotic movement', and claim an 'ex' Rastafarian as your point of contact, I don't find you all that convincing as an authority...

something related-AI artificial intelligence.....how far are computer developers from developing a self aware AI......if AI becomes self aware does it become a life form? a life form with rights? what happens when these AI's self replicate?

Tiny hungry robots! Billions of them! (http://www.exitmundi.nl/graygoo.htm)

something related-AI artificial intelligence.....how far are computer developers from developing a self aware AI......if AI becomes self aware does it become a life form? a life form with rights? what happens when these AI's self replicate?

Yeah just watched Blade Runner yesterday.. there are some pretty tough questions to answer there...

I start to have trouble with simple stuff like: If a man has total amnesia and has to relearn everything from scratch is he the same man as he was before. Is he any more the same man as he was before as an identical twin is the same man as his identical brother?

Let alone stuff like if you have an AI computer can you turn it off?

Yeah just watched Blade Runner yesterday.. there are some pretty tough questions to answer there...

I start to have trouble with simple stuff like: If a man has total amnesia and has to relearn everything from scratch is he the same man as he was before. Is he any more the same man as he was before as an identical twin is the same man as his identical brother?

Let alone stuff like if you have an AI computer can you turn it off?

Can you turn humans off?

I thought it was the little white mice?

Humans were THIRD most intelligent, remember. White mice and dolphins both came before them. ;)

2) yah if i'm not mistaken refers to the head of the rastafarian trinity... which just happens to be the same figure as jehove (as i said, he's rambling)
I thought Rastafari was a Christian sect.


2. Yah is Enki/Ea. I follow no religion.
Enki existed in the religion of ancient Sumer.

Are you a pantheist?

I thought Rastafari was a Christian sect.


More likely to be a form of strict Judaism.... they follow the Nazarite laws.

I thought Rastafari was a Christian sect.Rather a Jewish sect.
More likely to be a form of strict Judaism.... they follow the Nazarite laws.At least some claim to do so. However most of them don't even know what Nazarite law really instructs.
Enki existed in the religion of ancient Sumer.And? He didn't just disappear.
Are you a pantheist?No.

Can you turn humans off?

yes. turning them back on is nearly impossible though.

yes. turning them back on is nearly impossible though.

Then the same can be done to self-sentient AI methinks.

yes. turning them back on is nearly impossible though.

A picture of Salma Hayek, and a jar of peanut butter should...

Err.. maybe I misunderstand...

A picture of Salma Hayek, and a jar of peanut butter should...

Err.. maybe I misunderstand...

I hope you do :p

I thought Rastafari was a Christian sect.


Enki existed in the religion of ancient Sumer.

Are you a pantheist?

no. just weird.

A picture of Salma Hayek, and a jar of peanut butter should...
Err.. maybe I misunderstand...You mean, as in DOGMA ?
http://www.radiofree.com/profiles/salma_hayek/sa029327.jpg

You mean, as in DOGMA ?
http://www.radiofree.com/profiles/salma_hayek/sa029327.jpg

I was actually thinking "From Dusk Till Dawn", but it's hard to find bad in either...

http://www.art.com/asp/sp-asp/_/pd--10034505/Salma_Hayek_From_Dusk_Till_Dawn.htm#

either way we still don't have our peanut butter.

I was actually thinking "From Dusk Till Dawn", but it's hard to find bad in either...

http://www.art.com/asp/sp-asp/_/pd--10034505/Salma_Hayek_From_Dusk_Till_Dawn.htm#Well, in Dogma she played a heavenly Muse. I found that more fitting for this thread.... :p

If there is a heaven, animals will certainly go there, too. That is because heaven is supposed to be a place of eternal joy, with no suffering, and for many people (including me), heaven would not be such a place without animals!

(I really love my dog)

Well, in Dogma she played a heavenly Muse. I found that more fitting for this thread.... :p

Oh, indeed. I just think she's hot in DTD. Of course, maybe I could come up with some 'logic' about the 'evolution of Aztec vampires'... ;)

I know there are quite a few folks who are christian and don't find any conflict between christian teachings and current scientific thought.
I was wondering then whether you believe in an afterlife? And if so are there only people in heaven, or do other life forms go to heaven? If you could teach a chimpanze or a gorilla about jesus and they chose to believe would they have an opportunity to go to heaven?

I know this sounds confrontational... but it really isn't intended that way.. I just had an odd thought and was wondering what the good folk on NSG thought of it...

i don't believe in an afterlife.
i see no reason to.
end of story.

i don't believe in an afterlife.
i see no reason to.
end of story.

I see a number of really good reasons to believe in an afterlife.

Unfortunately, I can't change what I believe just becaus it would be 'nice'.

I know there are quite a few folks who are christian and don't find any conflict between christian teachings and current scientific thought.
I was wondering then whether you believe in an afterlife? And if so are there only people in heaven, or do other life forms go to heaven? If you could teach a chimpanze or a gorilla about jesus and they chose to believe would they have an opportunity to go to heaven?

I know this sounds confrontational... but it really isn't intended that way.. I just had an odd thought and was wondering what the good folk on NSG thought of it...

I don't think that there is anything wrong with scientific thought and I am a Christian. Of course, most people say that they are Christian, so it is hard to know what you mean when you refer to one as "Christian." Science is science, but so long as it goes along with the Bible. At least this is how I see it.

I believe in heaven and no, I don't believe that animals go to heaven. My reasoning behind this is because that the Bible says that only those who have souls go to heaven and animals don't have souls. I wish animals could go, but I really don't think that they will.

Great question though!

All dogs go to heaven!

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0096787/

I don't think that there is anything wrong with scientific thought and I am a Christian. Of course, most people say that they are Christian, so it is hard to know what you mean when you refer to one as "Christian." Science is science, but so long as it goes along with the Bible. At least this is how I see it.

I believe in heaven and no, I don't believe that animals go to heaven. My reasoning behind this is because that the Bible says that only those who have souls go to heaven and animals don't have souls. I wish animals could go, but I really don't think that they will.

Great question though!

Read the scripture in the native tongue - just because the poor English translations don't mention animal 'souls', doesn't mean it wasn't there originally.

I see a number of really good reasons to believe in an afterlife.

Unfortunately, I can't change what I believe just becaus it would be 'nice'.

But, wouldn't that be nicer?

I believe in re-incarnation, heaven doesn't really apply, though there is a state of nirvana which one achieves after a number of lifetimes where you become one with the universe. This could be considered analogous to what some people percieve as "Heaven". So yes, I believe in an afterlife.

And on the nature of heaven and hell I like this koan:

A Samurai warrior approached master Hakuin and asked "What is hell and heaven?" The master took one look at the Samurai and started insulting him saying, "You are such a scruffy looking warrior you would never understand". The Samurai became furious and pulled out his sword. "There!" said Hakuin. "This is hell".

The Samurai had a flash of illumination and was overcome with gratitude, humbly bowing before the master. Hakuin said, "There! This is heaven".

But, wouldn't that be nicer?

It would, indeed. We arem't 'here' nearly long enough to do all I want to do. I'd really like there to be more that comes after this - and I'd really like it to be without all the suffering we see in this life. I wish it were so.

But, like the old saying goes: wish in one hand and shit in the other, and see which one fills up faster.

It would, indeed. We arem't 'here' nearly long enough to do all I want to do. I'd really like there to be more that comes after this - and I'd really like it to be without all the suffering we see in this life. I wish it were so.

But, like the old saying goes: wish in one hand and shit in the other, and see which one fills up faster.

Eat less, wish more and you should be fine ;)

Can you turn humans off?

You turn me off...

>.>
<.<

Eat less, wish more and you should be fine ;)

I'd have to eat a lot less... and I think that would shorten my span on earth, not increase it. :D

And on the nature of heaven and hell I like this koan:

A Samurai warrior approached master Hakuin and asked "What is hell and heaven?" The master took one look at the Samurai and started insulting him saying, "You are such a scruffy looking warrior you would never understand". The Samurai became furious and pulled out his sword. "There!" said Hakuin. "This is hell".

The Samurai had a flash of illumination and was overcome with gratitude, humbly bowing before the master. Hakuin said, "There! This is heaven".

That's actually one of my favorites. :cool:

I'd have to eat a lot less... and I think that would shorten my span on earth, not increase it. :D

Yea, you've got a point there. You should think this over during dinner :p

You turn me off...

>.>
<.<

I'm just too hot to handle.

:rolleyes:

That's actually one of my favorites. :cool:

Then I am delighted to have made you smile :)

Science is science, but so long as it goes along with the Bible.

which is not very far...

I see a number of really good reasons to believe in an afterlife.

Unfortunately, I can't change what I believe just becaus it would be 'nice'.

oh i can see *that* 'reason'

just no "reason"... i.e. logic

I see a number of really good reasons to believe in an afterlife.Such as?
Belief means to accept an idea without proof. So what is a "reason to believe"?

Such as?
Belief means to accept an idea without proof. So what is a "reason to believe"?

A reason might be that it makes you feel better. And it seems like a pretty good reason too.

Such as?
Belief means to accept an idea without proof. So what is a "reason to believe"?

Comfort and peace of mind. If it helps you to deal with the stress of everyday life then it's a very good reason. :)

Humans were THIRD most intelligent, remember. White mice and dolphins both came before them. ;)

Oh, okay! The surprise is the dolphins are in charge instead of the mice, got it ;)

Can you turn humans off?

Apparently it's my forte :(

Can you turn humans off?

It's rebooting them after that's so tough ;)

If there is a heaven, animals will certainly go there, too. That is because heaven is supposed to be a place of eternal joy, with no suffering, and for many people (including me), heaven would not be such a place without animals!

(I really love my dog)

Best argument in the thread, IMO :D

Apparently it's my forte :(

Now, now, no need for manic depressions. ;)

*pat on back*

I believe in re-incarnation, heaven doesn't really apply, though there is a state of nirvana which one achieves after a number of lifetimes where you become one with the universe. This could be considered analogous to what some people percieve as "Heaven". So yes, I believe in an afterlife.

And on the nature of heaven and hell I like this koan:

A Samurai warrior approached master Hakuin and asked "What is hell and heaven?" The master took one look at the Samurai and started insulting him saying, "You are such a scruffy looking warrior you would never understand". The Samurai became furious and pulled out his sword. "There!" said Hakuin. "This is hell".

The Samurai had a flash of illumination and was overcome with gratitude, humbly bowing before the master. Hakuin said, "There! This is heaven".

Namaste.

which is not very far...

It all depends on how willing you are to accommodate it. The actual theological stuff is entirely compatible; the problem comes in how literal you interpret the other stuff.

Now, now, no need for manic depressions. ;)

*pat on back*

Oh, I'm good :) Post was meant to be funny, even if true ;)
ETA: Thanks though! :)

Comfort and peace of mind. If it helps you to deal with the stress of everyday life then it's a very good reason. :)I don't see how relying on something insubstantial could possibly bring comfort and peace of mind. Knowledge would do that, but surely not belief?

I don't see how relying on something insubstantial could possibly bring comfort and peace of mind. Knowledge would do that, but surely not belief?

Different levels of delusion is all ;)

Different levels of delusion is all ;)

Indeed. Watch Matrix movies and be deluded :p

Indeed. Watch Matrix movies and be deluded :p

But on a completely different level :D

i don't believe in an afterlife.
i see no reason to.
end of story.
That's OK, the belief may come to you eventually. It can't be proven by reason.

But on a completely different level :D

Yes, which one are we on anyway?

Yes, which one are we on anyway?

42

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I hope they have a toilet here. I really need to go. :p

I don't see how relying on something insubstantial could possibly bring comfort and peace of mind. Knowledge would do that, but surely not belief?

That's ok :) you don't have to believe me.

That's OK, the belief may come to you eventually. It can't be proven by reason.

Or any other way - except, one assumes, through personally witnessing an afterlife.

The only problem with that, is the timing. After - life. Which means, it can never be anything more than a baseless hope, during this one.

I hope they have a toilet here. I really need to go. :p

Only if you have your own towel.

Only if you have your own towel.

Yea, they were on discount at level 33.

Different levels of delusion is all ;)Is that your guide to life? And your slogan would be "more drugs" ?

Is that your guide to life? And your slogan would be "more drugs" ?

Good idea. Chew enough illegal mushrooms and you'll experience some levels of delusion that you'll never forget.

Good idea. Chew enough illegal mushrooms and you'll experience some levels of delusion that you'll never forget.

Chew the wrongs ones and you'll never wake up to remember....

yeah good question!

can Bush get into heaven?
Post 3! WooT!