NationStates Jolt Archive

Ok, I need some help, I am trying to find the passage that tells/gives that basis to the Islamic claim on the holy land. I've looked on Google and i can't seem to find it, if any one can point me in the correct direction that would be awesome. :)

You will not find it in the Koran.

It doesn't matter. Even if you find it I guarantee that someone will violently disagree whith whatever you think it means because you are: taking it out of context; interpreting it wrong; have a bad translation, &c.

So I would save the effort.

I think it's the part that goes:

By the rivers of babylon (dark tears of babylon)
There we sat down (you got to sing a song)
Ye-eah we wept, (sing a song of love)
When we remember zion. (yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah)

or something like that.

Might be in the Hadith unless it's an extrapolation of the old right to go to war to defend Islam thing.

A certain passage in the Koran links the Prophet Muhammad with Jerusalem and the Temple Mount. That passage, the seventeenth Sura, entitled 'The Night Journey', relates that Muhammad was carried by night 'from the sacred temple to the temple that is most remote, whose precinct we have blessed, that we might show him our signs...' Muslim belief identifies the two temples mentioned in this verse as being in Mecca and Jerusalem. According to tradition, Muhammad's mystic night journey was in the company of the Archangel Gabriel, and they rode on a winged steed called El Burak (meaning `lightning'), which according to Islamic Hadith tradition was a winged, horse-like creature that was "smaller than a mule, but larger than a donkey." Stopping briefly at Mt. Sinai and Bethlehem, they finally alighted at Temple Mount in Jerusalem, and there encountered Abraham, Moses, Jesus and other prophets, whom Muhammad led in prayers. Gabriel then escorted Muhammad to the pinnacle of the rock, which the Arabs call as-Sakhra, where a ladder of golden light materialized. On this glittering shaft, Muhammad ascended through the seven heavens into the presence of Allah, from whom he received instructions for himself and his followers. Following his divine meeting, Muhammad was flown back to Mecca by Gabriel and the winged horse, arriving there before dawn.
http://www.sacredsites.com/middle_east/israel/jerusalem.html

Link to The Seventeenth Surah of the Qur'an
http://www.al-sunnah.com/call_to_islam/quran/surah17.html

A certain passage in the Koran links the Prophet Muhammad with Jerusalem and the Temple Mount. That passage, the seventeenth Sura, entitled 'The Night Journey', relates that Muhammad was carried by night 'from the sacred temple to the temple that is most remote, whose precinct we have blessed, that we might show him our signs...' Muslim belief identifies the two temples mentioned in this verse as being in Mecca and Jerusalem. According to tradition, Muhammad's mystic night journey was in the company of the Archangel Gabriel, and they rode on a winged steed called El Burak (meaning `lightning'), which according to Islamic Hadith tradition was a winged, horse-like creature that was "smaller than a mule, but larger than a donkey." Stopping briefly at Mt. Sinai and Bethlehem, they finally alighted at Temple Mount in Jerusalem, and there encountered Abraham, Moses, Jesus and other prophets, whom Muhammad led in prayers. Gabriel then escorted Muhammad to the pinnacle of the rock, which the Arabs call as-Sakhra, where a ladder of golden light materialized. On this glittering shaft, Muhammad ascended through the seven heavens into the presence of Allah, from whom he received instructions for himself and his followers. Following his divine meeting, Muhammad was flown back to Mecca by Gabriel and the winged horse, arriving there before dawn.
http://www.sacredsites.com/middle_east/israel/jerusalem.html

Link to The Seventeenth Surah of the Qur'an
http://www.al-sunnah.com/call_to_islam/quran/surah17.html

yay thank you :)
one more quick thing
Genesis 17:19-20
And God said, Sarah thy wife shall bear thee a son indeed; and thou shalt call his name Isaac: and I will establish my covenant with him for an everlasting covenant, and with his seed after him.
20And as for Ishmael, I have heard thee: Behold, I have blessed him, and will make him fruitful, and will multiply him exceedingly; twelve princes shall he beget, and I will make him a great nation
would Muslims consider verse 20 a basis to that claim?

yay thank you :)
one more quick thing

would Muslims consider verse 20 a basis to that claim?

The thing is though, one can argue (and I am not going to do that here) that the story of Mohammed and the Temple Mount does not mean that the Muslims can lay claim to the Holy Land.

Try looking in a Mad Magazine. If you don't find what you're looking for at least you'll be entertained.

The thing is though, one can argue (and I am not going to do that here) that the story of Mohammed and the Temple Mount does not mean that the Muslims can lay claim to the Holy Land.

true, i'm not trying to start an argument i just trying to educate my self;)

true, i'm not trying to start an argument i just trying to educate my self;)

I know your not and I am not trying to start one either. It is good that you are trying to educate yourself. I do recommend taking a class on Islam. It is a very interesting religion to study.

yay thank you :)
one more quick thing

would Muslims consider verse 20 a basis to that claim?

Yes, they do. And in addition to that, Islam says that it was Ishmael that was going to be sacrificed on the mount by Abraham, not Isaac, as the OTsays.

Myself, I think it doesn't matter which son, either way the son was an allegory promise of God's Son to come later, the sacrificial Son that would not be substituted, but die for us on the cross.

I know your not and I am not trying to start one either. It is good that you are trying to educate yourself. I do recommend taking a class on Islam. It is a very interesting religion to study.
i hoping that next semester i will be able to take a class on Islam
Yes, they do. And in addition to that, Islam says that it was Ishmael that was going to be sacrificed on the mount by Abraham, not Isaac, as the OTsays.

Myself, I think it doesn't matter which son, either way the son was an allegory promise of God's Son to come later, the sacrificial Son that would not be substituted, but die for us on the cross.
hmmm, that is an interesting idea. i have never heard that point of view regarding the allocation of land.

AFAIK, there is no claim made on Jerusalem as such in the Qur'an. There maybe hadiths.....hadiths are dime a dozen...not really reliable...has lots of sectarian bias and such.

But the Dome mosque in Jerusalem is a special place since it is considered that Muhammed ascended to heaven from there.

Little known fact - in the early days of Islam, Muhammed had his followers bow down in the direction of Jerusalem. It was after he concluded that the Jews would never accept him as prophet, he chose towards bow down to Mecca instead (thereby showing his ass towards Jerusalem...:p )