NationStates Jolt Archive

Why do governments spend multimillions on individual educators when they could spend a few million on providing excellent education resources?

Why have a million individual teachers, some good and some bad and mostly somewhere in between when we could have a few very good teachers teaching everyone?

With the combined efforts of TV and the internet surely public education could be provided to the masses?

For those of us that have had inspiring teachers at some point in their life you know what a difference they can make. What if instead of having a class of 30 they could have a class of 30 million. If everyone had a chance to sit in on a truly inspired education experience.

Once you have these (constantly updating) resources you could then make them freely available to the rest of the world…. Free education for the whole world. The developing world as well as the developed!! Imagine that!! And at an infinitely lower cost than pricey education for the few?

Sure you would most likely still need a hands on approach for some things… but the classes could still be very interactive thanks to feed back forums etc.

Specailized attention is needed, especailly is younger grades and everyone learns at different rates. Plus think of how stressed out teachers are with a class of 40... more is just a bad idea in university sure but anytime younger then that, well I'd rather take my chances and get smaller class where I can have a conversation with the inspiring teacher then sit there and listen to them talk without much feedback.

Specailized attention is needed, especailly is younger grades and everyone learns at different rates. Plus think of how stressed out teachers are with a class of 40... more is just a bad idea in university sure but anytime younger then that, well I'd rather take my chances and get smaller class where I can have a conversation with the inspiring teacher then sit there and listen to them talk without much feedback.

Small children will sit and watch Nemo over and over again... seasame st, play school.. etc etc what makes you think that they wouldn't watch a government sponsered education video??

Sure kids learn at different rates and in different ways .. but if you had a terminal per student they could learn at their own pace. They could have an education program specifically tailored to them... You could produce 3 differently inpiring teachers who each present the same material. With one teacher per 40 then you don't really get an individual program either .. and probably a less tailored ciriculum. It would also allow you to go over stuff if you missed it the first time... Whereas at school I remember being sick for when we did logs in Maths.. took me ages to catch up because I never actually got taught the material...

The other advantage is that the material wouldn't get impatient.
If a kid needed to go over the same material 20x it would be possible for them to do that.

I learn better in a small discussion-like environment. I might be able to pick stuff up by reading a book or watching television, but I actually learn it by interacting through discussion.

Small children will sit and watch Nemo over and over again... seasame st, play school.. etc etc what makes you think that they wouldn't watch a government sponsered education video??

Sure kids learn at different rates and in different ways .. but if you had a terminal per student they could learn at their own pace. They could have an education program specifically tailored to them... You could produce 3 differently inpiring teachers who each present the same material. With one teacher per 40 then you don't really get an individual program either .. and probably a less tailored ciriculum. It would also allow you to go over stuff if you missed it the first time... Whereas at school I remember being sick for when we did logs in Maths.. took me ages to catch up because I never actually got taught the material...

The other advantage is that the material wouldn't get impatient.
If a kid needed to go over the same material 20x it would be possible for them to do that.
A student needs to interact with whats being taught. They need to ask questions and answer questions. They need hands on experiances too.

I learn better in a small discussion-like environment. I might be able to pick stuff up by reading a book or watching television, but I actually learn it by interacting through discussion.

I would have to agree... but in a classroom of 40 kids and one (usually not amazingly capable) teacher you are unlikely to get a small discussion-like environment.

What if you could discuss ideas with other students who were viewing the same material as you online?

You watch the vid then check out, and post to the forums on the topic.
That would give you a small discussion group. You could even have a set of questions to guide the discussion....

A student needs to interact with whats being taught. They need to ask questions and answer questions. They need hands on experiances too.

But if you can provide better questions and more accurate answers wouldn't that be better.

Students could ask questions (via a forum) and these questions could be collected and answered. As the resource developed a better list of questions and answers could be compiled including question trees etc etc....

Many teachers have trouble keeping up with modern material. This way you would find it much easier to make sure the material being taught was relavant and up to date.

I am not suggesting that your education be swapped 100% for sitting in front of a screen... but you could certainly substitute a large proportion of it.

Hands on science experiments.. drama lessons.. and many other classroom activities would still be needed but at least the core resources would be better provided for...

I am not suggesting that your education be swapped 100% for sitting in front of a screen... but you could certainly substitute a large proportion of it.


Teachers use educational videos all the time. A friend of mine claims that his grade 10 science teacher was Bill Nye

I would have to agree... but in a classroom of 40 kids and one (usually not amazingly capable) teacher you are unlikely to get a small discussion-like environment.

What if you could discuss ideas with other students who were viewing the same material as you online?

You watch the vid then check out, and post to the forums on the topic.
That would give you a small discussion group. You could even have a set of questions to guide the discussion....

How many students (especially in primary and secondary education) who are capable (not even thinking about willing) of doing that?

And I would want someone who knows the answer, not a bunch of people figuring it out together.

The 40 students per class thing is a reason why we need more teachers.

How many students (especially in primary and secondary education) who are capable (not even thinking about willing) of doing that?

And I would want someone who knows the answer, not a bunch of people figuring it out together.

The 40 students per class thing is a reason why we need more teachers.

40 students/class in the USA really?
Where I am there are I think 30 max. Less for younger kids.

Why do governments spend multimillions on individual educators when they could spend a few million on providing excellent education resources?

Why have a million individual teachers, some good and some bad and mostly somewhere in between when we could have a few very good teachers teaching everyone?

With the combined efforts of TV and the internet surely public education could be provided to the masses?

For those of us that have had inspiring teachers at some point in their life you know what a difference they can make. What if instead of having a class of 30 they could have a class of 30 million. If everyone had a chance to sit in on a truly inspired education experience.

Once you have these (constantly updating) resources you could then make them freely available to the rest of the world…. Free education for the whole world. The developing world as well as the developed!! Imagine that!! And at an infinitely lower cost than pricey education for the few?

Sure you would most likely still need a hands on approach for some things… but the classes could still be very interactive thanks to feed back forums etc.

Not a bad idea. :)

40 students/class in the USA really?
Where I am there are I think 30 max. Less for younger kids.

The max here is 30 for one teacher. Here, they don't have enough classes for teachers, they don't have enough teachers for courses, and they don't have enough courses for students. Thank God I'm graduated and out of high school!

I guess what I am saying is that governments have shown that they are not prepared to fund education properly enough to attract the best applicants for teaching positions. There are many fine teachers still left but wouldn't it be better if more kids were exposed to the really inspiring techniques of the better teachers.

I want to know if people think we have the technology to achieve this.. if so why aren't we doing it.

How expensive would it really be to provide good teaching resources? Would it be more cost effective than providing good teachers?

So would be better off with say 5 excellent english teachers providing material for 50,000 mediocre teachers to use... or would we be better off with say 50,000 slightly better than mediocre teachers without those resources??

My response to the education mess?

Stop taxing the people and let them decide to spend their money on their child's education the way they want to.

We have the technology. We can make them better, stronger, faster...

My response to the education mess?

Stop taxing the people and let them decide to spend their money on their child's education the way they want to.

We already have a massive education infrastructure... its just not being used... at the moment they may as well be all independant and privately funded.

I just don't see the point in having a great big centralised education facility if you aren't going to use its centralisedness to some sort of advantage...

I like the idea of more educational television, computer games and programs, etc.

But it's important to remember interacting with adults and other children is an important part of a child's development.

Another issue is that many children have some form of special need- such as a learning disability- that cannot be handled by our current factory-like mass education system. More teachers are needed.

I like the idea of more educational television, computer games and programs, etc.

But it's important to remember interacting with adults and other children is an important part of a child's development.

Another issue is that many children have some form of special need- such as a learning disability- that cannot be handled by our current factory-like mass education system. More teachers are needed.

Ok the NIH of health in the US back in the 90s was spending literally millions on funding for scientists to purchase imaging software... until one bright spark said... well why don't we make our own and give it away for free. They employed one guy for a year.. by the end of the year they had a good enough start, the program allowed plugins and it was off.... no more need to spend millions each year .. just one guys wage so that he could keep things up to date.

The government spends millions on textbooks every year. Why?? Why don't they write their own and distribute them for free?? Educational videos.. they cost money to purchase... why don't they produce their own and distribute them for free.

Its not even hard to do with the internet now pretty much ubiquitous in schools. You could update a video and it would be availabale to all schools the next day...

Even if we just started with University.. most lectures are very hands off. One lecturer out the front of class of 400 or so in first year. Why have the guy you have at Grifith University giving the lecture when you could have the best lecturer in the field in the world giving the lecture. Most lecturers would rather be doing their own research anyway..

We are on our way. Give it 10-20 years and Wikipedia might actually do what its original design purpose was-- to become The Final Encyclopedia, a compilation of most human knowledge freely available...

Collective education isn't education, it's indoctrination.

Collective education isn't education, it's indoctrination.

But apart from the quality of the presentation, what is the difference between 50,000 teachers teaching the same curriculum to 50 million students and 5 teachers teaching the same curriculum to 50 million students.

Does the fact that they get a better presentation mean that they are being indoctrinated rather than educated?

Isn't this what online university courses do? I know there are several universities in the US that do this, and they are quite high quality and accredited. As a matter of fact, OSU offers online courses to students admitted; you don't even have to show up for classes, just do the work, learn the material, and get a good grade on exams and assignments and it counts just like a regular graded class.

Wikipedia might do this too; I've learned a lot of things thanks to that which I might have been unable too without it. It makes learning a lot more accessible to people and for free; it has also had rapid improvements in quality that are making it more and more reliable every day.

Specailized attention is needed, especailly is younger grades and everyone learns at different rates. Plus think of how stressed out teachers are with a class of 40... more is just a bad idea in university sure but anytime younger then that, well I'd rather take my chances and get smaller class where I can have a conversation with the inspiring teacher then sit there and listen to them talk without much feedback.

nothing would stop the parents from giving the children "specialized attention" and there really wouldn't be a problem with each kid learning at their own pace...

Ultimately those kids are going to be out in the Real World, where sitting quietly and doing as you're told is how you earn the money to pay for your toys. They should start to learn that early so we don't have trouble with them getting all upset and depressed in their late teens and twenties when it dawns on them that being an adult is nowhere near as much fun as they thought it was going to be.

:p

Isn't this what online university courses do? I know there are several universities in the US that do this, and they are quite high quality and accredited. As a matter of fact, OSU offers online courses to students admitted; you don't even have to show up for classes, just do the work, learn the material, and get a good grade on exams and assignments and it counts just like a regular graded class.

Wikipedia might do this too; I've learned a lot of things thanks to that which I might have been unable too without it. It makes learning a lot more accessible to people and for free; it has also had rapid improvements in quality that are making it more and more reliable every day.
my kid is going to start online highschool in a few years, it's offered by the local university, everything is online, she only has to show up if she takes lab. It's fully accredited, and work at your own pace.

I really don't see a problem with it. Although I home school so, I have a different view of learning anyway.

This actually has been attempted for decades, in one form or another.

Sesame Street is an educational show for little kids (or at least it was 20 years ago).
There were tons of educational shows out there. Like 3-2-1Contact back in the day, or more recently Bill Nye the Science Guy, and that sort of thing. There are a lot of very talented people who would love to put something amazing together if they had the chance. (or you could go a little more nerdy and give homage to Carl Sagan…).

Given the vast resources the internet provides, there is little reason why kids cannot be very well educated without going to school. Not only can you produce a highly educational multi-media program, but you could connect it to a forum so students can chat with each other and with teachers. That way they get things explained to them in a good question and answer way.


There are simply 3 small problems.

1) Most kids are not capable of learning in an independent environment – you could argue that this is because the current school system makes education miserable but, whatever the reason, most students need the structured classroom environment.

2) Socialization – part of your education is learning the academic material, but a very important part of school is learning how to interact with your peers. You gain social skills at school. Actually, I have a theory as to why so many kids are unruly snots these days – it isn’t just because the parents won’t discipline them, it is also because whiny asshat trolls don’t get the crap beaten out of them by their peers when they piss people off. Mouth off and be a jerk, and people used to smack you for it. Bullies were often kept in check because 3 or 4 students would get together to beat the crap out of them – it was a great system that worked really well. Everyone treated each other with respect and there was hardly any need to resort to violence because the threat was there – give someone a blank check to behave however they want with no consequences and you get trolls. Sorry… off on a tangent.

3) Daycare – lets face it, school is daycare for children while the parents are at work.


These problems could be taken care of by having students report to schools until around 12 years old. After that, students should be responsible enough to be left on their own (if they are not, there could be some sort of daycare facilities for the less capable students).

If you still want to stick to the whole local school systems, you could quintuple the capacity of middle and high schools if you only required students to show up once a week. This way you can also get some hands-on experiences for science classes and such.