NationStates Jolt Archive

We are not responsible for them, it's either themselves or their governments fault that causes them to be poor. Why should we help them?

Jesus said to.

You'd be surprised how easily you could become one. *nod*

Jesus said to.

:fluffle:

Jesus said to.

The one who said "there will always be poor", and didn't criticize Mary for pooring the expensive purfume on his foot rather then selling it for money to the poor?

Because the rich don't need it.

1) It's the christian/muslim/buddhist thing to do.
2) It's the human thing to do.

because its much more expensive to hold them in prison when their poverty drives them to crime.

The one who said "there will always be poor", and didn't criticize Mary for pooring the expensive purfume on his foot rather then selling it for money to the poor?

Someone's been listening to "Jesus Christ Superstar", it would seem.

We should help people with problems because we are social animals. When we stop helping each other, society will fall apart. And we eare not capable of survival without society.

Its called being compassionate and generous. And with that attitude, I doubt your moneys going to anything else worthwhile. £1 ain't much to ask for.

because its much more expensive to hold them in prison when their poverty drives them to crime.

Who said we should hold them in prisons? I am talking about poverty outside of your own country btw.

The one who said "there will always be poor", and didn't criticize Mary for pooring the expensive purfume on his foot rather then selling it for money to the poor?

Matthew 25 ;)

If it's the government fault, the poor aren't accountable because they are powerless and can only focus on the bare elements needed for survival.

If it's their fault, exactly how is it their fault? It is their fault for being born into poverty? It is their fault when the economy fails, leaving them unemployed through no fault of their own? It is their fault when they are forced to shoulder burdening medical costs that are financially overwhelming that it drives them to the poor house?

Yes, there are situations that are brought on by their own decisions, but many are not poor through any fault of their own.

When you strip away old age security, factor in fixed incomes, you get old people who are poor because they are unable to work because of age.

There are many factors to consider.

I'm not saying that all poor people are like that because of no fault, there are plenty who are poor because they made the choices, but, at the same time, there are many who are poor because of circumstances beyond their control.

The parts of the Bible that encourage good to those who are poor... (and to those who have asserted that I don't focus on the good of the Bible, eat your words!)

Exodus 23:6 Thou shalt not wrest the judgment of thy poor in his cause.

Leviticus 19:10 And thou shalt not glean thy vineyard, neither shalt thou gather every grape of thy vineyard; thou shalt leave them for the poor and stranger: I am the LORD your God.

Deuteronomy 15:7 If there be among you a poor man of one of thy brethren within any of thy gates in thy land which the LORD thy God giveth thee, thou shalt not harden thine heart, nor shut thine hand from thy poor brother: .
15:8 But thou shalt open thine hand wide unto him, and shalt surely lend him sufficient for his need, in that which he wanteth.

Who said we should hold them in prisons? I am talking about poverty outside of your own country btw.

Poor people have a tendency to leave poor countries.

Because if I was dirt poor I'd like someone to send me some cash.

Why not?

Because it's the human thing to do.

This does not even have the excuse of being creative trolling.

Poor people have a tendency to leave poor countries.

We will never be able to help enough so immigration will stop happening.

We will never be able to help enough so immigration will stop happening.

People will die anyway, so why build hospitals? :rolleyes:

Actually, it's debatable whether we should give them aid, in the sense of money.
Give a man a fish and he will eat for a day; give that man a fishing rod and he will eat for many.
Giving those in need (countries or beggars on the street) monetary aid can only go so far to help them. Many believe that the best way to help Africa is through improving the trade laws, and it's better to offer a beggar a way out of that way of living than enough money for his next meal.

But why should we help them at all?
Becuase they're human too.

People will die anyway, so why build hospitals? :rolleyes:

Because it's the duty of the government to look after it's own people, not others.

Actually, it's debatable whether we should give them aid, in the sense of money.
Give a man a fish and he will eat for a day; give that man a fishing rod and he will eat for many.
Giving those in need (countries or beggars on the street) monetary aid can only go so far to help them. Many believe that the best way to help Africa is through improving the trade laws, and it's better to offer a beggar a way out of that way of living than enough money for his next meal.

But why should we help them at all?
Becuase they're human too.

he didn't specify what type of help.

If our governments didn't loan them huge sums of money in the first place, there would be no debt problem anyway.

he didn't specify what type of help.

that's why i put in that bit at the end

Actually, it's debatable whether we should give them aid, in the sense of money.
Give a man a fish and he will eat for a day; give that man a fishing rod and he will eat for many.
Giving those in need (countries or beggars on the street) monetary aid can only go so far to help them. Many believe that the best way to help Africa is through improving the trade laws, and it's better to offer a beggar a way out of that way of living than enough money for his next meal.

But why should we help them at all?
Becuase they're human too.

Give a man a fish and he will eat for a day. Teach a man to fish and now he's got to go out and buy a fishing license, and he's got to learn to cook the fish, and now the department of health wants to know how he'll dispose of the scales and the guts, and the IRS will want to know how much money he made from fishing but he can't figure out a tax form he only just learned how to catch a fucking fish for christ sake, so the IRS will roll a big truck up to his house and take his fishing pole, his stove, and his velvet painting of dogs playing poker and all this poor motherfucker ever wanted was a fish dinner.

Because it's the duty of the government to look after it's own people, not others.

Show me a hospital that won't accept people from other nations...

Because countries with extreme poverty breed extremists on other issues as well--like whackos who hijack planes and fly them into buildings. Desperate people do desperate things.

Give a man a fish and he will eat for a day. Teach a man to fish and now he's got to go out and buy a fishing license, and he's got to learn to cook the fish, and now the department of health wants to know how he'll dispose of the scales and the guts, and the IRS will want to know how much money he made from fishing but he can't figure out a tax form he only just learned how to catch a fucking fish for christ sake, so the IRS will roll a big truck up to his house and take his fishing pole, his stove, and his velvet painting of dogs playing poker and all this poor motherfucker ever wanted was a fish dinner.

Damn... I'd love to sig that, but it's too long. :(

Damn... I'd love to sig that, but it's too long. :(

It's actually not original. I'm paraphrasing comedian Doug Stanhope.

Who said we should hold them in prisons? I am talking about poverty outside of your own country btw.

Perhaps if we aid these countries, oneday they will be wealthy and we can trade with them which will help us in return...kinda like an investment.

I am talking about poverty outside of your own country btw.
Because they're still human and hence our equals?

We are not responsible for them, it's either themselves or their governments fault that causes them to be poor. Why should we help them?

We should. But, not via government coercion.

Who said we should hold them in prisons? I am talking about poverty outside of your own country btw.

Oh, well, then - If it's outside of my country, then it's up to whatever country they are in to aid them.

Because it's the duty of the government to look after it's own people, not others.

No, it's not.

If our governments didn't loan them huge sums of money in the first place, there would be no debt problem anyway.

Foreign aid is hardly the major cause of the US debt.

We do it because we can and because it's the right thing to do. I'm sorry you don't think so, but maybe when you grow up you'll understand that there is a large world outside this country, and that helping people out there enhances our own standing, which means other nations will help us with things and cooperate with us.

I do not think the government should help anyone. People need to be responsible.

Because they are a huge target market and labour pool.
Think:

Poor people do not own the means of production. Therefore, in order to survive, they must purchase things like food, temporary use of shelter, fuel, medicine, etc. They can not make these things.

Now, they won't spend very much per capita, but there sure is alot of them.

Besides, if you're the one holding the pursestrings, then those poor folk will have to what you want if they want some cash.

I do not think the government should help anyone. People need to be responsible.
Outside factors often play a key role in why people are poor, and it's not really right for people to have to starve because of errors made on the director's board of the company that they work for.

I do not think the government should help anyone. People need to be responsible.
Luckily, the British government dropped that line in about 1900.:)

I'd rather see something done about the less fortunate, as opposed to seeing violent, crime-ridden, and/or abusive households escalate, and having homeless peoples just scattered across the streets, knowing full well that something can be done about it.

I do not think the government should help anyone. People need to be responsible.

And sometimes even the most responsible people need help. I hope you never find that out for yourself.

And sometimes even the most responsible people need help. I hope you never find that out for yourself.

Oh, I hope he does. It's the only way people like him ever learn. Give him a couple of months on government cheese and see how he likes it.

Oh, I hope he does. It's the only way people like him ever learn. Give him a couple of months on government cheese and see how he likes it.

Better yet, give him a few months without, and see what he'd do for some government cheese.

Or maybe send him to Nairobi and let him wait for some foreigners to bring yummy millet to make gruel from and then let's see if he complains about helping the foreign poor. :p

We are not responsible for them, it's either themselves or their governments fault that causes them to be poor. Why should we help them?

How are we not responsible for them?

Oh, I hope he does. It's the only way people like him ever learn. Give him a couple of months on government cheese and see how he likes it.

Better yet, give him a few months without, and see what he'd do for some government cheese.

Or maybe send him to Nairobi and let him wait for some foreigners to bring yummy millet to make gruel from and then let's see if he complains about helping the foreign poor. :p

:p

Ah, government cheese! Your tax dollars at work!

Better yet, give him a few months without, and see what he'd do for some government cheese.

Or maybe send him to Nairobi and let him wait for some foreigners to bring yummy millet to make gruel from and then let's see if he complains about helping the foreign poor. :p
If we could only teach empathy....

Wait - I thought this Criik character was the new christian right trolly person? Is he instead just the new politically right-wing trolly person? :confused:

I really can't keep up with the trolly persons anymore. :(

We are not responsible for them, it's either themselves or their governments fault that causes them to be poor. Why should we help them?

Yet another reason you need to fall down a long flight of stairs.

Wait - I thought this Criik character was the new christian right trolly person? Is he instead just the new politically right-wing trolly person? :confused:

I really can't keep up with the trolly persons anymore. :(

I know. He's the new teenage right-wing trolly person, and nowhere as creative as some we've known. Curse you, Means To An End! You spoiled us!

teenage right-wing trolly person
Sounds about right & explains the weirdness.

I know. He's the new teenage right-wing trolly person, and nowhere as creative as some we've known. Curse you, Means To An End! You spoiled us!Speaking of MTAE, is he still about? Haven't been on in about a week and I don't see him now. Where's the entertainment?

Speaking of MTAE, is he still about? Haven't been on in about a week and I don't see him now. Where's the entertainment?

Last I heard, he got a two week vacation. I don't think it has ended yet, but I'm not sure.

Last I heard, he got a two week vacation. I don't think it has ended yet, but I'm not sure.

Might be longer than that--after the two week ban, he posted around the ban complaining about mod bias. Last I checked, that earns you a DOS, though I'm not positive that happened to him.

Who said we should hold them in prisons? I am talking about poverty outside of your own country btw.

oh you might have specified that in your OP.

in addition to nazz's point that poverty breeds desperation and desperation breeds trouble that can come right to us, there is a positive benefit to international aid.

prosperity breeds prosperity. if we give the right kind of aid to the impoverished masses of the world, we can bring up their standard of living, increase their life satisfaction, lessen the chance that they will want to go to war with us or one of our allies and increase the market for our own goods.

helping them get their economies going will help us in the long run. its an investment in a peaceful and posperous future for everyone.

Speaking of MTAE, is he still about? Haven't been on in about a week and I don't see him now. Where's the entertainment?

i too miss the entertainment from him
i know some one got ban last week but now forgot who it was

Might be longer than that--after the two week ban, he posted around the ban complaining about mod bias. Last I checked, that earns you a DOS, though I'm not positive that happened to him.

I thnk it did, I seem to recall he started a "Farewell, Cruel NSG!" thread and got called for posting around the ban and for being a drama ... what's the male equivalent of "drama queen"? "Drama king" doens't sound right. So he had decided to forsake us all and then got a little help leaving from one of the Mods.

i too miss the entertainment from him
i know some one got ban last week but now forgot who it was

The Fourth Holy Reich. Good fucking riddance.

The Fourth Holy Reich. Good fucking riddance.

now i know why i forgot who it was

I thnk it did, I seem to recall he started a "Farewell, Cruel NSG!" thread and got called for posting around the ban and for being a drama ... what's the male equivalent of "drama queen"? "Drama king" doens't sound right. So he had decided to forsake us all and then got a little help leaving from one of the Mods.

the male equivalent of drama queen is drama queen. its an attitude not a gender.

the male equivalent of drama queen is drama queen. its an attitude not a gender.

Ah. Works for me. ;)

Give a man a fish and he will eat for a day. Teach a man to fish and now he's got to go out and buy a fishing license, and he's got to learn to cook the fish, and now the department of health wants to know how he'll dispose of the scales and the guts, and the IRS will want to know how much money he made from fishing but he can't figure out a tax form he only just learned how to catch a fucking fish for christ sake, so the IRS will roll a big truck up to his house and take his fishing pole, his stove, and his velvet painting of dogs playing poker and all this poor motherfucker ever wanted was a fish dinner.

I was put in mind of a different parable.
Invite a man to sit by your fire, and he will be warm for a night. Set a man on fire, and you can dance on his ashes in the morning.

Criik, you have too many "shoulds" in your life.

Because we're not all cold heartless jerks who laugh at other's miseries.

Jesus said to.

Amen.

Because we have too much money while thay haven't enough. Are you following the logic?

Because we have too much money while thay haven't enough. Are you following the logic?

No, I see two facts. "you cannot deduce an ought from an is..."

No, I see two facts. "you cannot deduce an ought from an is..."

Often, the fact that people are poor is not their "fault".

Let's say you became crippled as the result of a disease and could no longer work.

Are you saying that we should say, "well, that's your fault for getting rheumatoid arthritis, and too bad, because we'll eat popcorn and watch your children starve!" ???

Btw, what do you mean with poor? Poor people in poor countries or poor people in rich countris or what?

Lesse here, we've now got:

evolution is fake
those damned liberals
fuck the poor

Looks like the troll trifecta.

Often, the fact that people are poor is not their "fault".

Let's say you became crippled as the result of a disease and could no longer work.

Are you saying that we should say, "well, that's your fault for getting rheumatoid arthritis, and too bad, because we'll eat popcorn and watch your children starve!" ???

Or shall we say, "Sorry your leaders ransacked your country and ran off to St. Moritz, hope you do better next time?"

Or "Too bad about that drought. How many years has it been going on? I will say this, the lean and hungry look does something for you."

We are not responsible for them, it's either themselves or their governments fault that causes them to be poor. Why should we help them?

Because they need it.

If I have or can get something someone desperately needs, I do what I can to help them out.

Someday,I might need it. Or my family.

Lesse here, we've now got:

evolution is fake
those damned liberals
fuck the poor

Looks like the troll trifecta.

:D All we need is Rosa Parks dancing with Mark Foley!

Or shall we say, "Sorry your leaders ransacked your country and ran off to St. Moritz, hope you do better next time?"

Or "Too bad about that drought. How many years has it been going on? I will say this, the lean and hungry look does something for you."

I guess criik wouldn't mind if we left him to starve for reasons beyond his control.

We should keep that in mind.

:D All we need is Rosa Parks dancing with Mark Foley!

I'm sure Mark would prefer George Michael

I guess criik wouldn't mind if we left him to starve for reasons beyond his control.

We should keep that in mind.

We should. And we're feeding him now by dignifying his threads with responses. I quit smoking last January, but I tell you, feeding trolls is far more addictive.

I'm sure Mark would prefer George Michael

Too old. Aaron Carter. :D

Lesse here, we've now got:

evolution is fake
those damned liberals
fuck the poor

Looks like the troll trifecta.

Let us not foget the

"Fact: Islam is intolerant, FACT" thread

I'm sure Mark would prefer George Michael

No doubt. Did you miss MeansToAnEnd's "Mark Foley is the Modern-Day Rosa Parks" thread? It was a brilliant bit of trollage.

Let us not foget the

"Fact: Islam is intolerant, FACT" thread

oh yes that one.

So far we've taken a shit on: evolutionists, liberals, muslims and the poor.

MTAE did it far better kid, you got some big shoes to fill.

And I don't mean LG's clown shoes.

Or shall we say, "Sorry your leaders ransacked your country and ran off to St. Moritz, hope you do better next time?"

Or "Too bad about that drought. How many years has it been going on? I will say this, the lean and hungry look does something for you."

It's still not our responsibility.

No doubt. Did you miss MeansToAnEnd's "Mark Foley is the Modern-Day Rosa Parks" thread? It was a brilliant bit of trollage.

No. You know, one thing that would help this forum is a "Hall of Shame", where the most delectable troll threads are locked by Moderators so that we can point people to them and say, "ah, that was a fun day..."

It's still not our responsibility.

I'll remember that if you ever need help, then.

No. You know, one thing that would help this forum is a "Hall of Shame", where the most delectable troll threads are locked by Moderators so that we can point people to them and say, "ah, that was a fun day..."

I agree, but I don't think the Mods will. Still, it's an idea. Maybe they could save just the OP.

I'll remember that if you ever need help, then.

I wouldn't need help, and if I did, I wouldn't be expecting it from you.

I wouldn't need help, and if I did, I wouldn't be expecting it from you.

Who would you be expecting it from, exactly?

Who would you be expecting it from, exactly?

Mom. :)

It's still not our responsibility.

Who's filling your head with all this, child? Strictly speaking, you're correct, it isn't our responsibility. We certainly have enough problems of our own. Still, it's a good thing to do. There doesn't have to be any other reason than that: it's a good thing to do.

Who would you be expecting it from, exactly?

I would try my best to get myself out of the situation, but If i couldn't I would ask family & freinds.

Mom. :)

Mom! Where's the meatloaf?!?

I would try my best to get myself out of the situation, but If i couldn't I would ask family & freinds.

Why should they help you? According to you, it's your fault.

I would try my best to get myself out of the situation, but If i couldn't I would ask family & freinds.

and what if they were just as poor, if not poorer, than you were?

I would try my best to get myself out of the situation, but If i couldn't I would ask family & freinds.

And if they said no? I mean, let's just say that hypothetically your family and friends are as charitable as you and say, "You're not our responsibility." What then?

Who's filling your head with all this, child? Strictly speaking, you're correct, it isn't our responsibility. We certainly have enough problems of our own. Still, it's a good thing to do. There doesn't have to be any other reason than that: it's a good thing to do.

I don't mind if people give to the poor privately.

I do mind when you are pressured by everyone around you to give to the poor, even though all you are able to give is a measly sum.

I also mind when the governments waist their money pooring money into corrupt governments, where it would get spent on either arms or mansions.

And if they said no? I mean, let's just say that hypothetically your family and friends are as charitable as you and say, "You're not our responsibility." What then?

I wouldn't ask some random guy who has never met me to help.

I don't mind if people give to the poor privately.

I do mind when you are pressured by everyone around you to give to the poor, even though all you are able to give is a measly sum.

I also mind when the governments waist their money pooring money into corrupt governments, where it would get spent on either arms or mansions.

Changing the subject, eh?

I also mind when the governments waist their money pooring money into corrupt governments

Then elect representatives that won't do it. Aint democracy fucking grand.

I wouldn't ask some random guy who has never met me to help.

I've helped many people in need-some I've met and some I never will.

All of them were strangers and none ever asked me for help.

Then elect representatives that won't do it. Aint democracy fucking grand.

I don't think there is such a thing, and if there was he wouldn't get enough votes.

I wouldn't ask some random guy who has never met me to help.

So you wouldn't ask 'random guys' for help, and since in our situation you need help, but aren't getting it from your family and friends, what happens?

Oh yeah. You die.

And you claim to be supportive of this kind of system, but you know, you're lying or deluded if you think you're ever gonna be sitting there, literally starving or freezing to death, going, "Yup. This is a good economic system we have here!"

I don't mind if people give to the poor privately.

I do mind when you are pressured by everyone around you to give to the poor, even though all you are able to give is a measly sum.

I also mind when the governments waist their money pooring money into corrupt governments, where it would get spent on either arms or mansions.

Not all of it is wasted. I haven't the statistics but I imagine that a great deal of our foreign aid does actually benefit the people for whom it's intended. I won't deny that there's corruption in the world, there's corruption here in our own country. We should try to eliminate as much of it as we can, but eliminating the aid is not right, either.

If you're worried about government waste, do what I do and help who you can instead of waiting for the government to fuck it up.

I don't think there is such a thing, and if there was he wouldn't get enough votes.

I feel sorry for you, really, that you're so young and so deep in the dark.

I feel sorry for you, really, that you're so young and so deep in the dark.

Care to show me an electorate in britian who opposes aid to the poor and would get enough votes?

We are not responsible for them, it's either themselves or their governments fault that causes them to be poor. Why should we help them?

Because we need someone to buy lottery tickets.

Care to show me an electorate in britian who opposes aid to the poor and would get enough votes?

That's what lies are for, my friend. :p

Care to show me an electorate in britian who opposes aid to the poor and would get enough votes?

Does not that very fact make you think that perhaps your position is wrong? Or you could make the trial yourself, when you reach the appropriate age. Run for office on a "No Foreign Aid" platform, see how it goes. Sitting and weeping that no one would vote for you when you haven't tried is a cop-out. Of course, if you don't believe in representative democracy ...

Does not that very fact make you think that perhaps your position is wrong? Or you could make the trial yourself, when you reach the appropriate age. Run for office on a "No Foreign Aid" platform, see how it goes. Sitting and weeping that no one would vote for you when you haven't tried is a cop-out. Of course, if you don't believe in representative democracy ...

Just because my opinion is unpopular doesn't make it wrong.

We are not responsible for them, it's either themselves or their governments fault that causes them to be poor. Why should we help them?

I liked it when MTAE trolled, he at least put some effort in to it.

http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c220/Jeffhh/Trolls.jpg

I don't think there is such a thing, and if there was he wouldn't get enough votes.

then you lose, tough shit.

Because we have too much money while thay haven't enough. Are you following the logic?

I don't see how they are deserving of "our" money.

Though one should help the less fortunate, one is by no means required to. Nor are others entitled to force one.

Nowhere is it written that life is fair.

Just because my opinion is unpopular doesn't make it wrong.

Actually, sometimes it does. Some positions are simply wrong. Not aiding people in other countries who need it, is wrong. And again, if you feel so strongly about this, it behooves you to try to do something about it.

Actually, sometimes it does. Some positions are simply wrong. Not aiding people in other countries who need it, is wrong. And again, if you feel so strongly about this, it behooves you to try to do something about it.

I don't feel so strongly about this, I'm asking NSG as I havn't fully made up my mind yet.

I don't feel so strongly about this, I'm asking NSG as I havn't fully made up my mind yet.

bullshit.

bullshit.

why? there could be hope for him just yet.

I don't feel so strongly about this, I'm asking NSG as I havn't fully made up my mind yet.

Really? from what I've seen, you wouldn't believe most of us if we told you your pants were on fire.

If you're still open-minded, as you say, then really, consider the possibility that helping poor people in other countries is simply a good thing to do. It's an extension of the people of your town/city/neighborhood helping the folks in the next town/city/neighborhood over when disaster strikes. It's like helping a stranger pick up his or her groceries in the car park instead of walking on by.

Actually, sometimes it does.

Well, no. How popular a position is is never an argument for it's truthfulness; that's a logical fallacy remember.

bullshit.

wateva, think what u like.

Well, no. How popular a position is is never an argument for it's truthfulness; that's a logical fallacy remember.

When you're trying to convey a lesson on humanity and helping others, logic is the least of your worries.

I don't feel so strongly about this, I'm asking NSG as I havn't fully made up my mind yet.

Then you need to clarify exactly waht you are asking. Foreign aid is a complex sibject. Here's a quick breakdown:

Foreign aid falls into several main categories:
1. Military aid, like the US gives to Israel.
2. Economic aid, to helps other countries get their economies rolling.
3. Humanitarian aid, like for the tsunami.

All this aid can be tied, which means the country receiving it has to spend it on things from the donor country, or untied, which means they can spend it how they want.

Also, only a certain fraction of aid money goes to alleviating the problems, while the rest goes to bureaucrats and other costs. This amount is called the real aid.

Economic aid is often used as a lever to control the economies of the receiving countries according to the policies of the donor countries. Humanitarian and military aid can also be used this way.

Jesus said to.


hey im all for religion and worship and whatnot, and Jesus had a good message...but there is no sense in using that argument in a case like this. not everyone believes in jesus so you need to develop a more thought out arguement. yeah it may be good enough for you and all other christians but its not good enough for others.

We are not responsible for them, it's either themselves or their governments fault that causes them to be poor.

Their or their society's fault, perhaps. And are we not part of society?

Why should we help them?

Because the fact that we did not specifically cause them harm (assuming we did not) does not mean that we are not obliged to aid those who need it.

We must do so because of basic human equality. We are not superior to them; we thus ought to regard their harm and suffering as equivalent to ours, and thus work to remedy it as we would remedy our own.

I do not think the government should help anyone.

Why should it exist, then?

As one whose family was helped by the "great theft" when I was a kid.

I thank everybody for whose money we stole.....

I missed one of Criik's points a little way back, about being constantly pressured to give to the poor. That's different than what I thought the point of the thread was. Certainly, if you are of limited means yourself, giving is perhaps not an option, and you should not feel pressured. That's different than the Government sending aid overseas.

I do not think the government should help anyone. People need to be responsible.

"Business! Business! Mankind was my business! The common welfare of all was my business!" - A Christmas Carol

"Business! Business! Mankind was my business! The common welfare of all was my business!" - A Christmas Carol

;)

Why should we help them?

Allah told us we should. Its the right thing to do.

Allah told us we should. Its the right thing to do.

See? Allah, Jesus, me ... what more incentive could you want?

See? Allah, Jesus, me ... what more incentive could you want?

Buddha was pretty big on compassion too.

Allah told us we should. Its the right thing to do.

allah and jesus might have told various peoples to do things.

Me, personally, I prefer to define my morality by myself, because I believe it's a good thing to do because it helps fellow human beings, not because someone TOLD me to.

There's a strong difference between morality and edict. You can go do it because you were told to, and believe that justifies it if you wish. Personally I prefer to do good things because it actually helps other people.

See? Allah, Jesus, me ... what more incentive could you want?

I dunno about y'all but I find Farnhamia far more compelling than Jesus...

I dunno about y'all but I find Farnhamia far more compelling than Jesus...

Bless you ... hmm, no sign of the cross smiley?

Buddha was pretty big on compassion too.

Yes, he was. And pork, too, I seem to recall, he was fond of a nice dish of pork.

allah and jesus might have told various peoples to do things.

Me, personally, I prefer to define my morality by myself, because I believe it's a good thing to do because it helps fellow human beings, not because someone TOLD me to.

There's a strong difference between morality and edict. You can go do it because you were told to, and believe that justifies it if you wish. Personally I prefer to do good things because it actually helps other people.

and at the end of the day we both help those in need. So stop complaining. I've stated before I would still give to charity and the like even if Allah didn't exist.

Bless you ... hmm, no sign of the cross smiley?

feh, I'm jewish anyway.

and at the end of the day we both help those in need. So stop complaining. I've stated before I would still give to charity and the like even if Allah didn't exist.

it's good that you do, so that's something. I just question your motives as being anything at all near as a result of compassion, however.

feh, I'm jewish anyway.

Oh, well, a sheynem dank, then.

Oh, well, a sheynem dank, then.

gezunteit.

Or is that "god bless you"?

gezunteit.

Or is that "god bless you"?

"Thank you very much" in Yiddish. Best I could do on short notice.

You'd be surprised how easily you could become one. *nod*

You're a smarty. Crazy things can happen just like that.