NationStates Jolt Archive

To combat the fact that the evil Planned Parenthood has erected three signs proclaiming "Birth control is easy" Tulsa's Catholic community has erected 10 signs saying "Birth control is harmful."

Tim Sullivan of the Catholic Diocese of Tulsa said the Catholic campaign is a continual process on "what we would say is a healthy understanding of sexuality." He said the consequences of using birth control include domestic violence, child abuse, promiscuity and sexually transmitted diseases.

:confused: Birth contol causes domestic violence and child abuse?

Anyway, the whole story here:
http://www.tulsaworld.com/NewsStory.asp?ID=061130_Ne_A1_Expre56692

That is a load of horseshit.

The worse things I've heard about the pill is that is tends to raise blood pressure in women.

That is a fact. It happened to me.

But, causes domestic and child abuse? WTF...?

Two questions - what are these people on, and can I get some? :D

You're talking about religious people here. They also believe that a sky pixie magically created the universe for their sole benefit.

Don't expect coherent thought on the matter.

and jesus causes wars.

I love logic, don't you all?

To combat the fact that the evil Planned Parenthood has erected three signs proclaiming "Birth control is easy" Tulsa's Catholic community has erected 10 signs saying "Birth control is harmful."

Tim Sullivan of the Catholic Diocese of Tulsa said the Catholic campaign is a continual process on "what we would say is a healthy understanding of sexuality." He said the consequences of using birth control include domestic violence, child abuse, promiscuity and sexually transmitted diseases.

:confused: Birth contol causes domestic violence and child abuse?

Anyway, the whole story here:
http://www.tulsaworld.com/NewsStory.asp?ID=061130_Ne_A1_Expre56692

Ignorant savages

I am sorry I am normally more eloquent then this and less judgmental but I am getting tired not calling this what it is
IDIOCY

Claiming birth control causes domestic violence is just plain old ignorant. I have no respect for those that use their religion to deny reality.

Wait, wait, wait, wait.....

So condoms cause STDs and child abuse?

Surely, the lack of children caused by contraception prevents child abuse?

Wait, wait, wait, wait.....

So condoms cause STDs and child abuse?

Surely, the lack of children caused by contraception prevents child abuse?

Well, duh. If you don't have children, you will abuse the children you don't have. What would you expect?

and jesus causes wars.

I love logic, don't you all?

Finally someone who speaks truth

Birth control tastes bad.

Well, it tastes like latex.

So I'm told, anyway.

Birth control causes water retention, weight gain, irritability, and fewer and lighter menstrual cycles.

I'm not so sure about domestic violence and abuse.

:confused: Birth contol causes domestic violence and child abuse?

I thought everyone knew that. ;)

Healthy understanding of sexuality? Fucking crackpot. More like healthy understanding of the jesus juice.

PS. I'm surprised they didn't say birth control causes unwanted pregnancy since their usual statements about any form of birth control gives it failure rates of around 98%.

just one more nut job

"She was bitching at me to wear a condom so I slapped her around a little"

See? Birth control can cause domestic violence.

To combat the fact that the evil Planned Parenthood has erected three signs proclaiming "Birth control is easy" Tulsa's Catholic community has erected 10 signs saying "Birth control is harmful."

Tim Sullivan of the Catholic Diocese of Tulsa said the Catholic campaign is a continual process on "what we would say is a healthy understanding of sexuality." He said the consequences of using birth control include domestic violence, child abuse, promiscuity and sexually transmitted diseases.

:confused: Birth contol causes domestic violence and child abuse?

Anyway, the whole story here:
http://www.tulsaworld.com/NewsStory.asp?ID=061130_Ne_A1_Expre56692

According to the book Freakonomics, easy access to both birth control and abortion is partially responsible for the lower crime rates in the 90s. Who you gonna believe?

just one more nut jobYeah, and these are our local nut jobs. Keep this up and we'll be as crazy as Kansas.

According to the book Freakonomics, easy access to both birth control and abortion is partially responsible for the lower crime rates in the 90s. Who you gonna believe?

Obviously that book was written by some godless liberal.

According to the book Freakonomics, easy access to both birth control and abortion is partially responsible for the lower crime rates in the 90s. Who you gonna believe?The local Catholic diocese?
The Catholic church is always on the cutting edge of science. And faultlessly logical.

The local Catholic diocese?
The Catholic church is always on the cutting edge of science. And faultlessly logical.

The anti Vatican II's are anyway.

Yeah, and these are our local nut jobs. Keep this up and we'll be as crazy as Kansas.

And those are just the Catholics. Be glad the Protestants didn't decide to put up similar billboards (though they're a bit more relaxed, so to speak, on birth control).

I didn't follow the links but I imagine you could make a statistical case for birth control causing global warming if you work hard enough. It's the same sort of logic that puts the nut-cases out every fall during the Race For The Cure with signs saying that abortions cause breast cancer. :rolleyes:

According to the book Freakonomics, easy access to both birth control and abortion is partially responsible for the lower crime rates in the 90s. Who you gonna believe?

That was a very fun book.

And those are just the Catholics. Be glad the Protestants didn't decide to put up similar billboards (though they're a bit more relaxed, so to speak, on birth control).
Mainline Protestants are pretty cool on birth control. Conservative Protestants, not so much. There's not a single conservative protestant group that supports easy access to birth control--there are some who aren't openly hostile to it, but none are supportive.

It would be nice if they could get nailed on false and misleading medical advice charges.

It would be nice if they could get nailed on false and misleading medical advice charges. Unfortunately, if they say it's a religious matter, they can spread whatever nonsense they want. They can be as irresponsible as they please.

He said the consequences of using birth control include domestic violence, child abuse, promiscuity and sexually transmitted diseases.

:confused: Birth contol causes domestic violence and child abuse?

Well, let's see. Birth control pills regulate hormones. And since you're less likely to have cramps and be PMSy......no, that doesn't work, seems like that would reduce domestic violence and child abuse.

Hmmmm. Condoms help block many STDs, so obviously this mean......no, seems like that would reduce STDs, not cause them.

Yeah, I'm confused too.

Birth control causes water retention, weight gain, irritability, and fewer and lighter menstrual cycles.

Irritability? I'm much more cranky if I have cramps and PMS, let me tell you.

Well, let's see. Birth control pills regulate hormones. And since you're less likely to have cramps and be PMSy......no, that doesn't work, seems like that would reduce domestic violence and child abuse.

Hmmmm. Condoms help block many STDs, so obviously this mean......no, seems like that would reduce STDs, not cause them.

Yeah, I'm confused too.

Don't you see? Condoms promote sexual activity, which can lead to STDs. Better to not have sex whatsoever. Or fuck altar boys, because they're clean. Or something.

That is a load of horseshit.

The worse things I've heard about the pill is that is tends to raise blood pressure in women.

That is a fact. It happened to me.

But, causes domestic and child abuse? WTF...?

Two questions - what are these people on, and can I get some? :D

Pregnancy is more dangerous for a womans health than taking the pill though (in this respect anyway)

Irritability? I'm much more cranky if I have cramps and PMS, let me tell you.

Irritability for me, because I have to remember to take the damned things.

According to the book Freakonomics, easy access to both birth control and abortion is partially responsible for the lower crime rates in the 90s. Who you gonna believe?

Have sex or commit a crime...humm...tough decision...;)

Yeah, and these are our local nut jobs. Keep this up and we'll be as crazy as Kansas.

just wait there next plan is to say you go to hell by using it

Idiots!

The issue shouldn't be "use birth control or don't." The issue should be, Planned Parenthood says if you are going to be sexually active, use birth control and the Church says sex is a healthy and beautiful thing - within the confines of marriage.

Teens won't stop having sex just because they lack birthcontrol. To think that is naive. If anything, the Church shouldn't be campaigning against birth control, it should be campaigning against premarital sex.

Idiots!

The issue shouldn't be "use birth control or don't." The issue should be, Planned Parenthood says if you are going to be sexually active, use birth control and the Church says sex is a healthy and beautiful thing - within the confines of marriage.

Teens won't stop having sex just because they lack birthcontrol. To think that is naive. If anything, the Church shouldn't be campaigning against birth control, it should be campaigning against premarital sex.You'd think the church and PP could get together to prevent abortions. Save a baby, use a condom.
Not to mention the fact that most people who use contraceptives are married. They do realize that not everyone thinks that limiting you family size to less than ten is a sin, don't they?

You'd think the church and PP could get together to prevent abortions. Save a baby, use a condom.
Not to mention the fact that most people who use contraceptives are married. They do realize that not everyone thinks that limiting you family size to less than ten is a sin, don't they?

Ah, but the Catholic Church regards even condoms as interfering with God's plan for human reproduction. Sex is healthy within marriage but really only for procreation, not for recreation. The only sanctioned methods of birth control for Catholics are abstinence and the "rhythm method."

If you want some recreation, join a softball team or a bowling league.

And they don't much care what other people think, those other people are disobeying God when they act contrary to Church doctrine. It really is very simple if you accept the underlying rules.

To combat the fact that the evil Planned Parenthood has erected three signs proclaiming "Birth control is easy" Tulsa's Catholic community has erected 10 signs saying "Birth control is harmful."

Tim Sullivan of the Catholic Diocese of Tulsa said the Catholic campaign is a continual process on "what we would say is a healthy understanding of sexuality." He said the consequences of using birth control include domestic violence, child abuse, promiscuity and sexually transmitted diseases.

:confused: Birth contol causes domestic violence and child abuse?

Anyway, the whole story here:
http://www.tulsaworld.com/NewsStory.asp?ID=061130_Ne_A1_Expre56692
Whoah... I was expecting a scientific discovery on the danger of the hormones in our drinking water, not bullshit.

The only sanctioned methods of birth control for Catholics are abstinence and the "rhythm method."

What I call intermittent abstinence.
So glad I'm not Catholic. It rots your brain.

Have sex or commit a crime...humm...tough decision...;)

I like that. The actual argument was that when birth control and abortion are easily accessible, then women in the lower economic classes are able to control how many kids they have. If they can do that, then there are fewer kids being raised in bad economic conditions, and fewer to go into lives of crime and desperation. That's where the majority of criminals come from--the lower economic classes.

You ought to see the site of the organization responsible for the billboards.

http://respectlifetulsa.org/Home_Page.php

Some of their crap.

1. Birth control is harmful because it degrades women and makes them simply a sexual object.
2. It allows people to bond without a commitment.
3. It gives a false sense of safety in having promiscuous sex.

Like being considered a walking womb isn't degrading to women.

You'd think the church and PP could get together to prevent abortions. Save a baby, use a condom.
Not to mention the fact that most people who use contraceptives are married. They do realize that not everyone thinks that limiting you family size to less than ten is a sin, don't they?

You'd think, but the problem with the Church is the difficulty it tends to have compromising.

And, yeah, I think they do realize that. I mean, I am one of only 5 kids, and my parents are devout Catholics. ;)

In seriousness, though, the Church does believe that believe that birth control is wrong, even in the case of marriage, excepting "natural family planning" (where the couple only has sex when the woman is not ovulating. Some problems with this include irregularity of some women's cycles, and the fact that sperm can live in a woman's body for up to three days). According to the Church, sex is meant to express love between the couple with openness to the possibility of children.

For my part, once I get married I don't plan on using much contraceptives, cuz I want to have a large family. Plus, I hear sex is better without condoms (though I've never tried it) and I am reluctant to use something that alters my hormones if it is not necessary to my health.

That doesn't mean I agree with the Church. Contraceptives can be good for some people in some situations. Certainly teen couples should always use birth control. If your biggest concern is what you are going to wear to prom, you shouldn't be raising children. That's what I think.

That doesn't mean I agree with the Church. Contraceptives can be good for some people in some situations. Certainly teen couples should always use birth control. If your biggest concern is what you are going to wear to prom, you shouldn't be raising children. That's what I think.Absolutley. You'd think the Church could get around to saying "Contraception is wrong, but not as wrong as unwanted children and AIDS." The Vatican doesn't live in the real world.
I remember reading a while back about Mexican priests being quite free in giving absolution to couples using birth control. Much to the disgust of the Vatican. Living closer to real people with real problems evidently opens the mind. Who'd have thunk it?

The Catholic church differs from other pro-lifers even, because they believe that life begins at fertilisation, rather than just by conception.

The Catholic church differs from other pro-lifers even, because they believe that life begins at fertilisation, rather than just by conception.

Catholics also believe that the use of contraception is a mortal sin and is essentially turning away from god by taking control of your own procreation.

Ah, but the Catholic Church regards even condoms as interfering with God's plan for human reproduction. Sex is healthy within marriage but really only for procreation, not for recreation. The only sanctioned methods of birth control for Catholics are abstinence and the "rhythm method."

If you want some recreation, join a softball team or a bowling league.

And they don't much care what other people think, those other people are disobeying God when they act contrary to Church doctrine. It really is very simple if you accept the underlying rules.

That's not quite true.

My dad always says, "I hate kids."
So I always ask him, "Then why did you have FIVE?!?!?!"
To which he responds, "I don't have making them!"

There is nothing wrong with sex for fun (within the confines of marriage) as long as the couple is open to the possibility of new life.

Interestingly the Roman Catholic Church asked previous Irish governments to ban tampons on the grounds they would introduce young women to the pleasures of vaginal penetration.

What I call intermittent abstinence.
So glad I'm not Catholic. It rots your brain.

To be fair, blindly ascribing to any faith without critically analyzing and challenging its tenets rots your brain. It isn't just Catholicism.

Interestingly the Roman Catholic Church asked previous Irish governments to ban tampons on the grounds they would introduce young women to the pleasures of vaginal penetration.ROFLMAO
That's even crazier than... anything ever.

ROFLMAO
That's even crazier than... anything ever.

it shows how they are still in the stone age

I like that. The actual argument was that when birth control and abortion are easily accessible, then women in the lower economic classes are able to control how many kids they have. If they can do that, then there are fewer kids being raised in bad economic conditions, and fewer to go into lives of crime and desperation. That's where the majority of criminals come from--the lower economic classes.

Maybe I'm not thinking this through right, but it seems to me that the logical progression of this line of thinking is that the sterilization of impoverished women will drastically reduce crime. So naturally it makes me uncomfortable. I think, though, that perhaps a better way of stating it would be that women with fewer children can devote more time and resources to the children that they DO have, meaning not only that there are fewer kids being raised in poor households (because Mary has 1 baby instead of 3), but that the children who are born are not as poor because Mary's wages are needed to support only her and her one child, instead of her and her 3 children.

That may actually be what you already said, or meant to say, I'm not sure.

Actually, I've seen billboards purporting that something like half of all children aborted (or maybe just those aborted in DC) are Black children. It is a somewhat disturbing trend, in my opinion.

To combat the fact that the evil Planned Parenthood has erected three signs proclaiming "Birth control is easy" Tulsa's Catholic community has erected 10 signs saying "Birth control is harmful."

Tim Sullivan of the Catholic Diocese of Tulsa said the Catholic campaign is a continual process on "what we would say is a healthy understanding of sexuality." He said the consequences of using birth control include domestic violence, child abuse, promiscuity and sexually transmitted diseases.

:confused: Birth contol causes domestic violence and child abuse?

Anyway, the whole story here:
http://www.tulsaworld.com/NewsStory.asp?ID=061130_Ne_A1_Expre56692

Now I know why I am not Catholic.

Don't you see? Condoms promote sexual activity,

They do what!?!?!? And here I thought they just helped to prevent pregnancy and STDs in the event of sexual acticity.

which can lead to STDs. Better to not have sex whatsoever. Or fuck altar boys, because they're clean. Or something.

hehe

Absolutley. You'd think the Church could get around to saying "Contraception is wrong, but not as wrong as unwanted children and AIDS." The Vatican doesn't live in the real world.
I remember reading a while back about Mexican priests being quite free in giving absolution to couples using birth control. Much to the disgust of the Vatican. Living closer to real people with real problems evidently opens the mind. Who'd have thunk it?

Actually, I recall hearing something about the Church setting up a panel to investigate whether it should change its position on the use of condoms to fight the AIDS epidemic. http://www.catholicnews.com/data/stories/cns/0602392.htm

I don't know if they ever released an official statement, but at least the Church is thinking about whether it should join the rest of the world in the 21st century :rolleyes:

ROFLMAO
That's even crazier than... anything ever.

Its even funnier when you imagine they held a conference, priests, bishops and the rest. 'Celibate' men sitting aroung a table with boxes of tampons discussing weather a woman would feel the 'vibe', so to speak.

Actually, I recall hearing something about the Church setting up a panel to investigate whether it should change its position on the use of condoms to fight the AIDS epidemic. http://www.catholicnews.com/data/stories/cns/0602392.htm

I don't know if they ever released an official statement, but at least the Church is thinking about whether it should join the rest of the world in the 21st century :rolleyes:I've heard something about that. John Paul II was a peacemaker and seemed so sweet. Yet it takes the guy who insults the Muslims and everyone calls a Nazi to get the Church to make a little sense. *sigh*

Interestingly the Roman Catholic Church asked previous Irish governments to ban tampons on the grounds they would introduce young women to the pleasures of vaginal penetration.

And thus we see the problems with a patriarchal church authority :rolleyes:

On the other hand, the sources said, the Vatican is hesitant to make any move that would be seen as an endorsement of condoms as a method of disease prevention, because condoms do not offer 100 percent protection from AIDS and could encourage sexual promiscuity.

You know what encourages sexual promicuity? Pleasure. You know what combats it best? Self control.
If you really have a problem with it, don't do it. Leave everybody else alone.

I've heard something about that. John Paul II was a peacemaker and seemed so sweet. Yet it takes the guy who insults the Muslims and everyone calls a Nazi to get the Church to make a little sense. *sigh*

To be fair, J2P2 did some important things, like allow girls to become alter servers. And while that may seem like a tiny insignificant step, it was important in recognizing the importance of females in the Church, and one can only hope and pray that it will eventually lead to the ordination of woman. As a young Catholic girl, it was very important to me when he made that change. The Church is a bit of a beauracracy so it moves slowly anyway. But because it believes that some traditions are maintained by the Holy Spirit, it is even harder to get the Church up to speed than it is to get other beauracracies. I have some problems with Benny (as I somewhat affectionately like to call Benedict XVI), but this is a good move on his part.

To be fair, J2P2 did some important things, like allow girls to become alter servers. And while that may seem like a tiny insignificant step, it was important in recognizing the importance of females in the Church, and one can only hope and pray that it will eventually lead to the ordination of woman. As a young Catholic girl, it was very important to me when he made that change. The Church is a bit of a beauracracy so it moves slowly anyway. But because it believes that some traditions are maintained by the Holy Spirit, it is even harder to get the Church up to speed than it is to get other beauracracies. I have some problems with Benny (as I somewhat affectionately like to call Benedict XVI), but this is a good move on his part.
I like to call him Papa Ratzi

hmm.......I really think that they could have picked a better venue for their message, or at least not been so misleading, but it's a free country.

I am just glad that I have access to the birth control measures I want and need, so that I am not running around with 10 kids........blech.

hmm.......I really think that they could have picked a better venue for their message, or at least not been so misleading, but it's a free country.

I am just glad that I have access to the birth control measures I want and need, so that I am not running around with 10 kids........blech.

Aww, but imagine how great 10 mini-smunks would be for the world?!?!?!!

LoL just kidding.

I wanna have like 8 kids when I grow up. Sooo, yeah not so much worried about it.

Actually, I was just thinking about how happy I am that I will be twenty in a few months. Meaning that no matter what happens, I will have made it through life avoiding becoming a teen mother. :)

Aww, but imagine how great 10 mini-smunks would be for the world?!?!?!!

LoL just kidding.

I wanna have like 8 kids when I grow up. Sooo, yeah not so much worried about it.

Actually, I was just thinking about how happy I am that I will be twenty in a few months. Meaning that no matter what happens, I will have made it through life avoiding becoming a teen mother. :)

just be ubercareful and I think you can make it.

also take my advice, being pregnant on your 21st birthday? not so much fun.

On the other hand, the sources said, the Vatican is hesitant to make any move that would be seen as an endorsement of condoms as a method of disease prevention, because condoms do not offer 100 percent protection from AIDS and could encourage sexual promiscuity.

You know what encourages sexual promicuity? Pleasure. You know what combats it best? Self control.
If you really have a problem with it, don't do it. Leave everybody else alone.

Unfortunately, the concept that pleasure leads to sexual promiscuity has led in some areas to horrific practices like female genital mutilation.

hmm.......I really think that they could have picked a better venue for their message, or at least not been so misleading, but it's a free country.

I am just glad that I have access to the birth control measures I want and need, so that I am not running around with 10 kids........blech.They could have just claimed it was harmful to your soul. At least then they might have some claim to truth based on Church teachings.
But to claim it causes domestic violence and child abuse. Come on, people. That's just nuts. And harmful.

The ability to limit the number of children they have is one of the most important... crap, lost my train of thought.
Anyway, being able to limit the number of children they have is so important to the empowerment of women.

I'm still confused by the whole, "ZOMG! If we have birth control, people will have more sexxors!!" stance. From what I've seen, it simply isn't true.

I knew more about sex than most of my peers throughout my life. I had easy access to birth control as soon as I had any notion of thinking about being sexually active. ((In fact, I was on the pill well before I ever considered having sex with anyone.)) Having birth control didn't make me any more likely to have sex than anyone else. In fact, based on what I've seen, I was *less* likely to do so - probably because I was well-educated on it and it wasn't a big taboo to me.

Out of all my closest friends, the one who remained a virgin the longest has also been on the birth control pill the longest.

The girls I knew who were promiscuous in high school were not only the least educated about sex, but also the least likely to use any type of birth control (because they were scared of someone finding it).

The whole premise just doesn't seem to hold.

Unfortunately, the concept that pleasure leads to sexual promiscuity has led in some areas to horrific practices like female genital mutilation.True enough. At least most religious doctrines accept that women are entitled to sexual pleasure. At least within marraige.

Actually, I recall hearing something about the Church setting up a panel to investigate whether it should change its position on the use of condoms to fight the AIDS epidemic. http://www.catholicnews.com/data/stories/cns/0602392.htm

I don't know if they ever released an official statement, but at least the Church is thinking about whether it should join the rest of the world in the 21st century :rolleyes:

Yeah, well, how long did it take them to forgive Galileo? I'm sure they'll get on this just as fast.

ROFLMAO
That's even crazier than... anything ever.

You mean you guys don't get off on tampons? Wow! Seriously, guys, this is sarcasm. It never works well for me, so DISCLAIMER:

just be ubercareful and I think you can make it.

also take my advice, being pregnant on your 21st birthday? not so much fun.

lol, it's less than 9 months, so even if I somehow get pregnant (not sure how I would given the current lack of man), I wouldn't be a teenager when the child would be born.

And wow, that does sound like suckiness. I'll be sure to avoid getting pregnant any time during the 9 months leading up to my 21st bday ;) Tho, frankly, I imagine at least another 5 years before I have any children.

Haha, my friend once was got sick like 2 mornings in a row. And I was like, "girl you better not be pregnant." And she was like "uhhh, given my virginity, I definitely am not, barring any immaculate conception."
And then I decided if God for some reason Gabriel ever showed up at my doorstep telling my I was going to have God's child, I'd respond, "Fine, but you are telling my parents!" Haha, i thought it was funny :p

You mean you guys don't get off on tampons? Wow! Seriously, guys, this is sarcasm. It never works well for me, so DISCLAIMER:

;)

Aww, but imagine how great 10 mini-smunks would be for the world?!?!?!!

LoL just kidding.

I wanna have like 8 kids when I grow up. Sooo, yeah not so much worried about it.

Actually, I was just thinking about how happy I am that I will be twenty in a few months. Meaning that no matter what happens, I will have made it through life avoiding becoming a teen mother. :)

8 kids in your mind.. great fun

8 kids in reality....... takes a certain kind of woman to want and to do right by

I wanna have like 8 kids when I grow up. Sooo, yeah not so much worried about it.
I used to want 21 kids. beat that. :p

I'm still confused by the whole, "ZOMG! If we have birth control, people will have more sexxors!!" stance. From what I've seen, it simply isn't true.

I knew more about sex than most of my peers throughout my life. I had easy access to birth control as soon as I had any notion of thinking about being sexually active. ((In fact, I was on the pill well before I ever considered having sex with anyone.)) Having birth control didn't make me any more likely to have sex than anyone else. In fact, based on what I've seen, I was *less* likely to do so - probably because I was well-educated on it and it wasn't a big taboo to me.

Out of all my closest friends, the one who remained a virgin the longest has also been on the birth control pill the longest.

The girls I knew who were promiscuous in high school were not only the least educated about sex, but also the least likely to use any type of birth control (because they were scared of someone finding it).

The whole premise just doesn't seem to hold.

The premise is not based on making intelligent decisions, dear Dem, it's based on the idea that human beings are flawed, vile creatures who cannot control their baser instincts. So if you make it easier to have sex by protecting people against pregnancy and disease, why, there will be orgies in the streets! We'll be back in the horrid, decadent days of the Romans! Think of the children! The ones who won't be born!

Hmm, if you think about it, "God" has to be against birth control because it reduces the number of humans worshipping him. Can't have that.

Yeah, well, how long did it take them to forgive Galileo? I'm sure they'll get on this just as fast.

With the Vatican its generally- Call us tuesday and we'll get back to you in three hundred years.

It's simple really. Birth control is harmful because if you use them God will smite your sinful ass, he'll cause your penis to drop off and/or your vagina to close up. Cos that's the kind of thing God does, all the time.


Oh wait........

That is a load of horseshit.

The worse things I've heard about the pill is that is tends to raise blood pressure in women.

That is a fact. It happened to me.

But, causes domestic and child abuse? WTF...?

Two questions - what are these people on, and can I get some? :D

You wouldn't want it. Think about it: it turns people into raving social conservatives! That's not good stuff.

8 kids in your mind.. great fun

8 kids in reality....... takes a certain kind of woman to want and to do right by
When I was about ten I wanted thirteen kids. That was before I was old enough to get stuck babysitting siblings and cousins. Between that and my mother cursing me with the old "I hope you have kids just like you" I was cured.
No kids. No way I'm going to risk having kids like me and my brothers.

If using bith control causes child abuse what are they going to claim causes child abuse next eating something that isnt bread and water?

Interestingly the Roman Catholic Church asked previous Irish governments to ban tampons on the grounds they would introduce young women to the pleasures of vaginal penetration.

Oh, that is so...so...MALE! Asinine! Only a man would think that putting in a freakin' tampon was a pleasurable experience.

In high school, I actually had a male friend ask me about tampons--he didn't understand that they were different than maxi pads, that you actually insert them. When I told him, he was fascinated, and asked me if girls ever put them in just for fun...*sigh*

Does no one understand the female anatomy? This is why we need sex ed classes.

Oh, that is so...so...MALE! Asinine! Only a man would think that putting in a freakin' tampon was a pleasurable experience.

In high school, I actually had a male friend ask me about tampons--he didn't understand that they were different than maxi pads, that you actually insert them. When I told him, he was fascinated, and asked me if girls ever put them in just for fun...*sigh*

Does no one understand the female anatomy? This is why we need sex ed classes.

*grabs the popcorn*

8 kids in your mind.. great fun

8 kids in reality....... takes a certain kind of woman to want and to do right by

Yeah, I know. But I am one of 5, so I sort of know what being in a big family is like and I've seen how much work it is for parents. But trust me, if anyone could do it, it's me. And I don't say that to be arrogant. I say it cuz I come from a line of women who successfully raised many children (My dad is one of 10), and I say it because I've had a lot of experience taking care of kids. If I had a good, supportive husband, I could do it.

If using bith control causes child abuse what are they going to claim causes child abuse next eating something that isnt bread and water?

Very good point.

Oh, that is so...so...MALE! Asinine! Only a man would think that putting in a freakin' tampon was a pleasurable experience.

In high school, I actually had a male friend ask me about tampons--he didn't understand that they were different than maxi pads, that you actually insert them. When I told him, he was fascinated, and asked me if girls ever put them in just for fun...*sigh*

Does no one understand the female anatomy? This is why we need sex ed classes.

Yeah, tell me about it. The number of males so ignorant about female anatomy is astounding.

Once again: here's a guy wishing he was a girl.

"The worse things I've heard about the pill is that is tends to raise blood pressure in women."

It's also been proven to increase your chances of breast cancer, destroy uterine lining so that even when you want to get pregnant later on, it's more difficult, and a host of other rather crucial medical problems. If you think blood pressure is the worst of it, you may want to look more into it.

And when the Catholic Church states something is harmful, they don't simply mean medically so--as indicated by the longer list cited. And they're not making the claims in a vaccuum, either. There has been extensive research into these things--and even that research done by 'neutral' scientific parties has in fact confirmed the Church's claims.

Obviously Birth Control doesn't directly cause child abuse. However, the Church's findings indicate that the use of birth control can lead to harmful attitudes toward children and family (such as the thoughts of 'mistaken pregnancy' when the birth control doesn't work), that can lead to abusive behaviour. Is birth control therefore the sole contributor? Absolutely not. Does it contribute? Statistics would suggest that yes, in fact, it does.

I find it interesting that, on this forum, when a religious authority states something that you disagree with, rather than doing the research to find out why it teaches this, many here just automatically assume that "it's an ignorant religious institution and therefore can't know anything," and then, to bolster your claims, point out how such religious groups are intolerant and war-mongering, when in making such accusations and dismissals you yourselves exhibit the self-same attitudes that you deride in them.

"The worse things I've heard about the pill is that is tends to raise blood pressure in women."

It's also been proven to increase your chances of breast cancer, destroy uterine lining so that even when you want to get pregnant later on, it's more difficult, and a host of other rather crucial medical problems. If you think blood pressure is the worst of it, you may want to look more into it.

And when the Catholic Church states something is harmful, they don't simply mean medically so--as indicated by the longer list cited. And they're not making the claims in a vaccuum, either. There has been extensive research into these things--and even that research done by 'neutral' scientific parties has in fact confirmed the Church's claims.

Obviously Birth Control doesn't directly cause child abuse. However, the Church's findings indicate that the use of birth control can lead to harmful attitudes toward children and family (such as the thoughts of 'mistaken pregnancy' when the birth control doesn't work), that can lead to abusive behaviour. Is birth control therefore the sole contributor? Absolutely not. Does it contribute? Statistics would suggest that yes, in fact, it does.

I find it interesting that, on this forum, when a religious authority states something that you disagree with, rather than doing the research to find out why it teaches this, many here just automatically assume that "it's an ignorant religious institution and therefore can't know anything," and then, to bolster your claims, point out how such religious groups are intolerant and war-mongering, when in making such accusations and dismissals you yourselves exhibit the self-same attitudes that you deride in them.
Care to prove your claims? If you make them, you gotta prove 'em, bud.

According to Respect Life, contraception facilitates the kind of relationships, attitudes and moral character that leads to abortion. That it causes people to treat sex as though it has no natural connection to babies.

Now to me it seems like people who use contraception have a pretty good grasp on that idea.

And this bit:
Furthermore, because all birth control methods fail, any unplanned pregnancy that results from contraceptive sex is at risk of an abortion.

And they think that an accidental pregnancy without the use of contraceptives is less likely to end up as an abortion?

And this:
It creates a sex on demand attitude, which can lead to sexual assaults and rape.

Obviously no one has told them that rape has basically nothing to do with sex.
Yep. They are chock full of nuts.

Oh, that is so...so...MALE! Asinine! Only a man would think that putting in a freakin' tampon was a pleasurable experience.

In high school, I actually had a male friend ask me about tampons--he didn't understand that they were different than maxi pads, that you actually insert them. When I told him, he was fascinated, and asked me if girls ever put them in just for fun...*sigh*

Does no one understand the female anatomy? This is why we need sex ed classes.

Maybe they should all go see The Vagina Monologues. One of the monologues is a personified vagina which asks its owner to please stop sticking cold, dry cotton wads inside.

I believe it was something like this:

**Warning, somewhat vulgar**

"Like tampons-- what the hell is that? A wad of dry fucking cotton stuffed up there. Why can't they find a way to subtly lubricate the tampon? As soon as my vagina sees it, it goes into shock. It says, Forget it. It closes up."


It's also been proven to increase your chances of breast cancer,

Actually, it hasn't been proven to do any such thing. A single study that suggested this came out, but later studies have contradicted it.

destroy uterine lining so that even when you want to get pregnant later on, it's more difficult,

Really? Do you have a source for this?

I actually have a friend who has to stay on the pill so that she can one day get pregnant. Without it, she'll have to have a hysterectomy sooner (and even with the pill, it's looking like 28 or 29 that she'll have to have one).

and a host of other rather crucial medical problems. If you think blood pressure is the worst of it, you may want to look more into it.

I'm on the pill. Believe me, I've looked into it. There are a few things that are incredibly rare complications, but, for the most part, its quite often healthier to be on it than off it.

And when the Catholic Church states something is harmful, they don't simply mean medically so--as indicated by the longer list cited. And they're not making the claims in a vaccuum, either. There has been extensive research into these things--and even that research done by 'neutral' scientific parties has in fact confirmed the Church's claims.

Then you can obviously produce such research?

Obviously Birth Control doesn't directly cause child abuse. However, the Church's findings indicate that the use of birth control can lead to harmful attitudes toward children and family (such as the thoughts of 'mistaken pregnancy' when the birth control doesn't work), that can lead to abusive behaviour. Is birth control therefore the sole contributor? Absolutely not. Does it contribute? Statistics would suggest that yes, in fact, it does.

And you can produce these statistics?

Bear in mind that unplanned pregnancies occur whether birth control is used or not - actually less often when birth control is used (surprise surprise).

Yes, because proving claims around here is the natural trend that I've seen.

Show me one claim against what the Church teaches on this issue that has, in fact, been proven or defended by the poster--why is it that when someone defends the Church, suddenly proof is desired? Nice double standard.

Link between Contraceptives and Increased Chances of Cancer (http://www.cancer.gov/cancertopics/factsheet/Risk/oral-contraceptives)

Unfortunately, I don't have the time to offer further proofs at the moment, but I'll try to come back and provide more.

"-and even that research done by 'neutral' scientific parties has in fact confirmed the Church's claims.

~snippage~
I find it interesting that, on this forum, when a religious authority states something that you disagree with, rather than doing the research to find out why it teaches this, many here just automatically assume that "it's an ignorant religious institution and therefore can't know anything," and then, to bolster your claims, point out how such religious groups are intolerant and war-mongering, when in making such accusations and dismissals you yourselves exhibit the self-same attitudes that you deride in them.

First of all, the Catholic Church probably wouldn't recognize a "neutral" scientific party if it bit them in the ass.

And we tend to assume that religious authorities are full of crap when they make scientific claims because they usually are. Especially the ones on this forum. If you want us to believe otherwise please include a few links to reputable scientific studies.

Oh, that is so...so...MALE! Asinine! Only a man would think that putting in a freakin' tampon was a pleasurable experience.

In high school, I actually had a male friend ask me about tampons--he didn't understand that they were different than maxi pads, that you actually insert them. When I told him, he was fascinated, and asked me if girls ever put them in just for fun...*sigh*

Does no one understand the female anatomy? This is why we need sex ed classes.

Gabbly (http://gabbly.com/http://forums.jolt.co.uk/forumdisplay.php?f=1227) would be a perfect place to teach that sex ed class, no?

To combat the fact that the evil Planned Parenthood has erected three signs proclaiming "Birth control is easy" Tulsa's Catholic community has erected 10 signs saying "Birth control is harmful."

Tim Sullivan of the Catholic Diocese of Tulsa said the Catholic campaign is a continual process on "what we would say is a healthy understanding of sexuality." He said the consequences of using birth control include domestic violence, child abuse, promiscuity and sexually transmitted diseases.

:confused: Birth contol causes domestic violence and child abuse?

Anyway, the whole story here:
http://www.tulsaworld.com/NewsStory.asp?ID=061130_Ne_A1_Expre56692

I though Catholicism caused child abuse...

When I was about ten I wanted thirteen kids. That was before I was old enough to get stuck babysitting siblings and cousins. Between that and my mother cursing me with the old "I hope you have kids just like you" I was cured.
No kids. No way I'm going to risk having kids like me and my brothers.

Haha, I have the mother's curse too, and I admit it is a bit disconcerting when thinking about having kids.

But babysitting actually only made me know for sure that I wanted lots of kids when I grow up. Weird, aren't I?

"snip
I find it interesting that, on this forum, when a religious authority states something that you disagree with, rather than doing the research to find out why it teaches this, many here just automatically assume that "it's an ignorant religious institution and therefore can't know anything," and then, to bolster your claims, point out how such religious groups are intolerant and war-mongering, when in making such accusations and dismissals you yourselves exhibit the self-same attitudes that you deride in them.

Because I personally worked for the stats department for 2 years and never once saw any inkling in any of the reproductive surveys we have done I have never seen a high correlation between birth control rates and most of their claims

Because I personally worked for the stats department for 2 years and never once saw any inkling in any of the reproductive surveys we have done I have never seen a high correlation between birth control rates and most of their claims

Sorry, but that's anecdotal, and thusly cannot be accepted. I may support your side, but we must have rules, and one of them is clear evidence, not anecdotes.

Sorry, but that's anecdotal, and thusly cannot be accepted. I may support your side, but we must have rules, and one of them is clear evidence, not anecdotes.

In the absence of clear evidence, andecdotes are all we have. Personally, I haven't seen any peer-reviewed studies into whether or not birth control causes child abuse. Have you?

In the absence of clear evidence, andecdotes are all we have. Personally, I haven't seen any peer-reviewed studies into whether or not birth control causes child abuse. Have you?

No, but that's not the point. Clear evidence is preferable to anecdotal evidence, as anecdotal evidence cannot be independently confirmed.

Some wack job scientist that i absolutly detest stated that contraception lowered domestic violence but he is anti religion so i don't trust him as much as this thing.

I'm sure solo mums are up and if the dad was around i'm sure he'd be giving them a beating.
Of ocurse he didn't want kids he just wanted some Tang.

If the guy was around he'd be beating there ass.

Yeah, I know. But I am one of 5, so I sort of know what being in a big family is like and I've seen how much work it is for parents. But trust me, if anyone could do it, it's me. And I don't say that to be arrogant. I say it cuz I come from a line of women who successfully raised many children (My dad is one of 10), and I say it because I've had a lot of experience taking care of kids. If I had a good, supportive husband, I could do it.

of course you could. the good thing about it is that you normally only have one at a time so if you realize after 2 you are at your limit, you can stop. if you find you love it, you could end up with 15.

Unwanted children are bad for the economy.

Interestingly the Roman Catholic Church asked previous Irish governments to ban tampons on the grounds they would introduce young women to the pleasures of vaginal penetration.

Interestingly enough, I nor any woman I know has ever experienced sexual pleasure while putting a tampon in.

Two girls I know (their mothers are Southern Baptists) are not allowed to use tampons. My mom's Christian but the only reason she was hesitant on letting me use them was the whole hymen-breaking thing and didn't want it to hurt me. *shurg*

She's not letting me get the HPV shot though until I'm thinking of having sex... :mad: I'd rather get it now at 14 and not have to worry about it at, oh, say 16 when I actually consider having sex.

To be honest, that church really needs to have legal action taken against them. What they're doing can be potentially dangerous. "Freedom of speech" my arse, while I do support that I feel that misleading the public should be a crime.

Some wack job scientist that i absolutly detest stated that contraception lowered domestic violence but he is anti religion so i don't trust him as much as this thing.

I'm sure solo mums are up and if the dad was around i'm sure he'd be giving them a beating.
Of ocurse he didn't want kids he just wanted some Tang.

If the guy was around he'd be beating there ass.

Tang? (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tang_%28drink%29)



Incidentally, anyone remember 2 Stupid Dogs? The cartoon?

Incidentally, anyone remember 2 Stupid Dogs? The cartoon?Now iddn't dat cute? BUT IT'S WRONG!!!!

In the absence of clear evidence, andecdotes are all we have. Personally, I haven't seen any peer-reviewed studies into whether or not birth control causes child abuse. Have you?

Nope.

That's because there is most likely no correlation whatsoever.

Sadly, the State of North Carolina preaches this bull crap. :( I know more about sex than the sex ed teachers and I am a 14 year old virgin.

Nope.

That's because there is most likely no correlation whatsoever.

Sadly, the State of North Carolina preaches this bull crap. :( I know more about sex than the sex ed teachers and I am a 14 year old virgin.

Pancake should have her own sex ed class. Educate your peers. Though avoid the hormonal lads.

Pancake should have her own sex ed class. Educate your peers. Though avoid the hormonal lads.

I wish I could, but I'd probably be suspended. :(

I fear trouble at school.

I wish I could, but I'd probably be suspended. :(

I fear trouble at school.

Possibly, but you'd be a hero(ine). Besides, you could always do it on the sly.

Possibly, but you'd be a hero(ine). Besides, you could always do it on the sly.

Intarwebs!!!!!!! :D

But how do I tell people about this site?

Intarwebs!!!!!!! :D

But how do I tell people about this site?

Graffiti the link(or a tinyurl) around with no explanation as to what it is. People's curiousity will do the rest.

Graffiti the link(or a tinyurl) around with no explanation as to what it is. People's curiousity will do the rest.

What's a tinyurl? And how do I graffiti a link? They never taught us much about that stuff in school either.

What's a tinyurl? And how do I graffiti a link? They never taught us much about that stuff in school either.

Just use a sharpie and write the url on the back of chairs or bathroom walls.

Just use a sharpie and write the url on the back of chairs or bathroom walls.

Or write it down on little slips of paper and slip them into people's lockers? Hmm....

Or write it down on little slips of paper and slip them into people's lockers? Hmm....

Indeed. And a tinyurl is www.************. They turn long links into small ones.

/me sighs

Another reason why I don't really follow too much of my religion.

Anyway, Bush ( and anyone who thinks abstinence is better ) should do some reading/research.

http://www.cnn.com/2006/HEALTH/12/01/bc.teen.pregnancy.reut/index.html?eref=rss_health

Indeed. And a tinyurl is www.************. They turn long links into small ones.

Errr... huh?

Errr... huh?

Well people aren't likely to remember a big long link, but the would remember a short one.

Well at least you didn't use the noob smilies in your first post. That's something.
I think misspelling "Putz" says something.

To combat the fact that the evil Planned Parenthood has erected three signs proclaiming "Birth control is easy" Tulsa's Catholic community has erected 10 signs saying "Birth control is harmful."

Tim Sullivan of the Catholic Diocese of Tulsa said the Catholic campaign is a continual process on "what we would say is a healthy understanding of sexuality." He said the consequences of using birth control include domestic violence, child abuse, promiscuity and sexually transmitted diseases.

:confused: Birth contol causes domestic violence and child abuse?

Anyway, the whole story here:
http://www.tulsaworld.com/NewsStory.asp?ID=061130_Ne_A1_Expre56692
You should present the whole story.

He meant "Birth control doesn't always work, and teens who are parents are more likely to abuse children and cause domestic violance, then birth control is related to child abuse and domestic violance."

Birth control isn't always effective it CAN fail.

Birth control isn't always effective it CAN fail.It's still a lot less likely to fail than not using it ;)

You should present the whole story.

He meant "Birth control doesn't always work, and teens who are parents are more likely to abuse children and cause domestic violance, then birth control is related to child abuse and domestic violance."

Birth control isn't always effective it CAN fail.

Yeah, the whole side of the story should be presented. But I followed the links, and while it is possible that is in fact what he meant, no where does it come close to expressing that idea. So you can only suppose that is what he meant.

<snip>
Well aren't you the charming little n00b troll. We'll tolerate respectful debate of different opinions, but continue to step over the line with flamebait and trolling like that, and your visit to our site will be short.

~ Frisbeeteria ~
NationStates Game Moderator
The One-Stop Rules Shop

[would it be possible for ONCE for people not to extensively quote the damn trolls, so we can delete offensive crap without having to hit 50 posts? C'mon, people.]

There is nothing wrong with birth control. These idiots give religious people a bad name. :mad:

Tang? (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tang_%28drink%29)



Incidentally, anyone remember 2 Stupid Dogs? The cartoon?
Poon?

You should present the whole story.

He meant "Birth control doesn't always work, and teens who are parents are more likely to abuse children and cause domestic violance, then birth control is related to child abuse and domestic violance."

Birth control isn't always effective it CAN fail.Which still doesn't mean birth control causes domestic violence or child abuse. Since birth control does prevent pregnancy about 98% of the time, it is responsible for preventing teen pregnancies, not causing them. Therefore use of contraceptives prevents child abuse and domestic violence. They should try to use a little logic.

Which still doesn't mean birth control causes domestic violence or child abuse. Since birth control does prevent pregnancy about 98% of the time, it is responsible for preventing teen pregnancies, not causing them. Therefore use of contraceptives prevents child abuse and domestic violence. They should try to use a little logic.

The Christian America of old didnt have to deal with these problems. But that was a long time ago, like when public schooling didnt turn out anything but ignorant easily prevertable young minds. America is such a beautiful country, it is so sad that all of it must burn.

The Christian America of old didnt have to deal with these problems. But that was a long time ago, like when public schooling didnt turn out anything but ignorant easily prevertable young minds. America is such a beautiful country, it is so sad that all of it must burn.

It's sad that it must burn because of idiot conservatives who don't want to protect teens, but gain votes from their religious buddies.

Birth control does not condone or "encourage" sex at all. Many women don't even take it to prevent pregnancy-- they take it to regulate periods and in some cases acne. It has a 98% success rate, and condoms are something like 97% effective (have to go back and check). Sperm and HIV do not "eat through" latex or spermicides. That's what they told me and my classmates in seventh and eighth grade, and it's not true. The morality of premarital sex is debatable, but it's everyone's personal choice and nobody should have any control over someone else's choice.

I forgot to make my point. My high school auto teacher, Wallas, who also used to play for the Raiders, always used to tell us nothing man made is dependable. Being one of the most intelligent people ive ever met, I think his advice is worth its weight in gold. What other areas of industry is 98% acceptable? If an airliner was hijacked or crashed 2% of the time would you fly? If you dont want to spread the lineage of Abramham dont have sex

It's sad that it must burn because of idiot conservatives who don't want to protect teens, but gain votes from their religious buddies.

Birth control does not condone or "encourage" sex at all. Many women don't even take it to prevent pregnancy-- they take it to regulate periods and in some cases acne. It has a 98% success rate, and condoms are something like 97% effective (have to go back and check). Sperm and HIV do not "eat through" latex or spermicides. That's what they told me and my classmates in seventh and eighth grade, and it's not true. The morality of premarital sex is debatable, but it's everyone's personal choice and nobody should have any control over someone else's choice.

Hypocricy. Now conservatives are all idiots, yet they own all the businesses and are all wealthy. I personally am not a conservative at all. Things need to change and I will do just that. But have you ever been to a California high school? The only classes I could learn anything in are taught by conservative teachers, Ive considered dropping out because in the past 7 years I have learned nothing from going. The only thing its good for is finding the weak minded and building my army. I am actually for population control, only the intelligent should be allowed to breed, but abortion is murder