NationStates Jolt Archive

As I sit here, not doing what I should be doing, I wonder what the media is trying to tell us. About how they see the future and how we are all the same. I see the way they use hollywood movies to show us the conformism of the future.

In uniforms, the people go about their daily lives, all the same, never exploring what options they have. They go buy the same things that they need to live. With uniform style, they march to the same drum.

I ponder the thought that the media wants to control the future, the culture of our children, and the lives they will live. I see that the big wigs in LA want us to conform to a communistic world of sames and alikes.

What do they want? Our money.

We will wear the clothes they design, the flying cars we will buy, and most importantly, rule our lives with a conforming iron fist.

When the future comes, and we all look the same, with no culture, and no diversity, in a world that Hitler would have loved, I hope I am dead.

I ask you, fellow NSers, please, a revolution is needed!

consumerism = :(

I have a feeling that something similar to this was said many times in dimly lit, smoke-filled coffeehouses and bars in the early 1960s. It's just your turn now, Ruffy. Revolutionize away! I'll be right behind you (huffing and puffing and trying to keep up).

consumerism = :(

Quoted for truth.

No revolution. Generally, after a revolution, all that has happened is that something bad has been replaced with something worse. Gradual reform is what is needed.

It's simple.

Develop a mind of your own. Don't buy shit just because the 'media' wants you to. Teach your kids that you are not in fact what you buy.

The media is so fantastically powerful because we buy into their adverts, and support the products they peddle.

In the future, we will all be the same: dead ;)

I for one welcome the end of Hawaiian shirts :p

We don't have a future. The rapture and the end times are on their way soon.

I have a feeling that something similar to this was said many times in dimly lit, smoke-filled coffeehouses and bars in the early 1960s. It's just your turn now, Ruffy. Revolutionize away! I'll be right behind you (huffing and puffing and trying to keep up).

:eek: And we can wear hippy clothes and play the Beatles!
Well...I can.

:eek: And we can wear hippy clothes and play the Beatles!
Well...I can.
You'll be the only one...

Can you cut down your sig a bit, please? They're meant to be a max of 8 lines

I for one welcome the end of Hawaiian shirts :p

but what will I wear? teh Hawaiian shirt is the only shirt for me, would you rather my exposed, pasty white chubby bits?

Anyway, let's go revolute, I'm tired of all this siting around thinking about how the world sucks, lets get some action up ins

But in all seriousness,the world is becoming very vain and product-based.There's a Remington advert on TV in Britain that says "It's what's on the outside that counts," and that made me feel slightly sick.The media and faceless corporations are,unfortunately,driving people to buy products in the frame of mind it will make them more successful,or more beautiful.It doesn't work that way unfortunately,we can't buy happiness.We don't necessarily need a revolution...reform is always better.But revolutions are so much more fun :p

You'll be the only one...

Can you cut down your sig a bit, please? They're meant to be a max of 8 lines

Yeah,independence!
Wooooooooo!
I did write a serious post,though,in all fairness.
And yeah,I'll change the sig.Oopsy.

It's simple.

Develop a mind of your own. Don't buy shit just because the 'media' wants you to. Teach your kids that you are not in fact what you buy.

The media is so fantastically powerful because we buy into their adverts, and support the products they peddle.

The media is so potent primarily because society is essentially a moronocracy. What renders intellectuals so different is that thought, upon a plane higher than "what drink/skirt/meal shall I buy, is a central element of their life. Ultimately, if the "media", an amorphous term at any rate, does perpetuate conforming consumerism by means of advertisement and endorsement, it is the rank stupidity of the lower and middle orders that adheres, and buttresses it.

We should all start making our own clothes again. I would do it myself but I can't get the bloody thread through the needle, its fucking impossible!

Meh, it's going to take more than a few snappy advertising campaigns for The Man to get into MY head.

But in all seriousness,the world is becoming very vain and product-based.There's a Remington advert on TV in Britain that says "It's what's on the outside that counts," and that made me feel slightly sick.The media and faceless corporations are,unfortunately,driving people to buy products in the frame of mind it will make them more successful,or more beautiful.It doesn't work that way unfortunately,we can't buy happiness.We don't necessarily need a revolution...reform is always better.But revolutions are so much more fun :p

advertising is a clever way of influencing opinion. it creates in our heads artificial wants and "needs" that otherwise would not be there, and society tends to judge a person not so much as how they've lived their life but what they own. living up to (purchasing) these expectations, wants and endless desires fed by advertising becomes our goal. endlessly striving for what we truly do not want, but that which we think will make us happy. these unfulfilled and endless manafactured desires, the "unlimited wants" of economics, together with societies judgement of success, lead to immense dissatisfaction with life for all those able to lift their gaze from the next pointless item to consume - ignorance is indeed bliss.

in short: companies manafacture wants to sell products. the media pushes those "wants" down our throats at every concievable turn to make money. we hand over our money to live up to the 'lifestyle' as sold by the PR, trying to gain that little bit more short-lived satisfaction from conforming to societies' judgement of success. and we ultimately end up not happy in the slighest, but merely frustrated with life and stuck in an endless 'rat-race' for things we would otherwise have no desire to have if we were not told what to want and 'need'.
depression is not just a chemical imbalance in the brain. i believe clinical depression is growing in prevelance throughout the western world because our societies are sick, with the emphasis only on personal gain, material accumulation and consumption, and profit the only thing on companies' minds. this cannot continue (though evidently it doesn't apply to everybody)



edit: my "in short" was longer than the first bit :p
but i feel this is the essence of what ruffy was getting at :)

But in all seriousness,the world is becoming very vain and product-based.There's a Remington advert on TV in Britain that says "It's what's on the outside that counts," and that made me feel slightly sick.The media and faceless corporations are,unfortunately,driving people to buy products in the frame of mind it will make them more successful,or more beautiful.It doesn't work that way unfortunately,we can't buy happiness.We don't necessarily need a revolution...reform is always better.But revolutions are so much more fun :p

the ads for men's products are so blatantly manipulative. there is the one for the beard dye that shows the man being rejected by the hotchick when his beard is gray but if he darkens it he gets laid. and those TAG cologne ads where women lose control around men who use the right scent.

why dont men protest that crap? dont y'all find it just a tad bit insulting?

anyway, there is no need for reform or revolution. smarten up and make your own decisions about your own life and you will be fine. who cares what other people do in their own lives?

I find I'm generally repulsed by products that have been excessively/badly advertised, to the extent I will purposely try to buy something else. Then again, the other product may be excessively/badly advertised also, but I may not have seen it. Advertising may serve to increase our awareness of different products, but normally its entirely dominated by the big companies with the money to buy the advertising space/time.

As I sit here, not doing what I should be doing, I wonder what the media is trying to tell us. About how they see the future and how we are all the same. I see the way they use hollywood movies to show us the conformism of the future.

In uniforms, the people go about their daily lives, all the same, never exploring what options they have. They go buy the same things that they need to live. With uniform style, they march to the same drum.

I ponder the thought that the media wants to control the future, the culture of our children, and the lives they will live. I see that the big wigs in LA want us to conform to a communistic world of sames and alikes.

What do they want? Our money.

We will wear the clothes they design, the flying cars we will buy, and most importantly, rule our lives with a conforming iron fist.

When the future comes, and we all look the same, with no culture, and no diversity, in a world that Hitler would have loved, I hope I am dead.

I ask you, fellow NSers, please, a revolution is needed!

Revolution of nonconformity? I have three of them. The future is fucked. :)

the ads for men's products are so blatantly manipulative. there is the one for the beard dye that shows the man being rejected by the hotchick when his beard is gray but if he darkens it he gets laid. and those TAG cologne ads where women lose control around men who use the right scent.

why dont men protest that crap? dont y'all find it just a tad bit insulting?

Only thing insulting will be proving there are some real idiots out there. You know there will be some guy out there who actually believes that wearing TAG will cause random women to start swarming all over them. They will be quite disappointed when they realize it is just a marketing ploy. :D

advertising is a clever way of influencing opinion. it creates in our heads artificial wants and "needs" that otherwise would not be there, and society tends to judge a person not so much as how they've lived their life but what they own. living up to (purchasing) these expectations, wants and endless desires fed by advertising becomes our goal. endlessly striving for what we truly do not want, but that which we think will make us happy. these unfulfilled and endless manafactured desires, the "unlimited wants" of economics, together with societies judgement of success, lead to immense dissatisfaction with life for all those able to lift their gaze from the next pointless item to consume - ignorance is indeed bliss.

in short: companies manafacture wants to sell products. the media pushes those "wants" down our throats at every concievable turn to make money. we hand over our money to live up to the 'lifestyle' as sold by the PR, trying to gain that little bit more short-lived satisfaction from conforming to societies' judgement of success. and we ultimately end up not happy in the slighest, but merely frustrated with life and stuck in an endless 'rat-race' for things we would otherwise have no desire to have if we were not told what to want and 'need'.
depression is not just a chemical imbalance in the brain. i believe clinical depression is growing in prevelance throughout the western world because our societies are sick, with the emphasis only on personal gain, material accumulation and consumption, and profit the only thing on companies' minds. this cannot continue (though evidently it doesn't apply to everybody)



edit: my "in short" was longer than the first bit :p
but i feel this is the essence of what ruffy was getting at :)

*uuuuber nod*

Revolution of nonconformity? I have three of them. The future is fucked. :)

Huzzah!

I used to believe that the media was turning us into a bunch of consumerist sheeple bastards, but now I don't know what to think.

[obligatory blaming Ruffy for consumerism]

:p

*uuuuber nod*

:fluffle:

We wanted to blast the world free of history.... picture yourself planting radishes and seed potatoes on the fifteenth green of a forgotten golf course. You'll hunt elk through the damp canyon forests around the ruins of Rockefeller Center, and dig clams next to the skeleton of the Space Needle leaning at a forty-five degree angle. We'll paint the skyscrapers with huge totem faces and goblin tikis, and every evening what's left of mankind will retreat to empty zoos and lock itself in cages as protection against the bears and big cats and wolves that pace and watch us from outside the cage bars at night. ~Chuck Palahniuk, Fight Club, Chapter 16

Imagine," Tyler said, "stalking elk past department store windows and stinking racks of beautiful rotting dresses and tuxedos on hangers; you'll wear leather clothes that will last you the rest of your life, and you'll climb the wrist-thick kudzu vines that wrap the Sears Tower. Jack and the beanstalk, you'll climb up through the dripping forest canopy and the air will be so clean you'll see tiny figures pounding corn and laying strips of venison to dry in the empty car pool lane of an abandoned superhighway stretching eight-lanes-wide and August-hot for a thousand miles." ~Chuck Palahniuk, Fight Club, Chapter 16

F*** consumerism and go back to craftsmanship. We'd be better off living in tipis or yurts anyway.
(Yes I did read the book!)

The problem is that a lot of non-conformists like to see people buying the same things or keeping up with popular culture and then assume that's all there is to that person.

One's identity is not in the clothes we buy or the music we listen to. That's a matter of taste. And just because someone doesn't act like a philosopher doesn't mean they're shallow or stupid, they may just prefer to keep their thoughts to themselves.

The problem is that a lot of non-conformists like to see people buying the same things or keeping up with popular culture and then assume that's all there is to that person.

One's identity is not in the clothes we buy or the music we listen to. That's a matter of taste. And just because someone doesn't act like a philosopher doesn't mean they're shallow or stupid, they may just prefer to keep their thoughts to themselves.

you=winnar

advertising is a clever way of influencing opinion. it creates in our heads artificial wants and "needs" that otherwise would not be there, and society tends to judge a person not so much as how they've lived their life but what they own. living up to (purchasing) these expectations, wants and endless desires fed by advertising becomes our goal. endlessly striving for what we truly do not want, but that which we think will make us happy. these unfulfilled and endless manafactured desires, the "unlimited wants" of economics, together with societies judgement of success, lead to immense dissatisfaction with life for all those able to lift their gaze from the next pointless item to consume - ignorance is indeed bliss.

in short: companies manafacture wants to sell products. the media pushes those "wants" down our throats at every concievable turn to make money. we hand over our money to live up to the 'lifestyle' as sold by the PR, trying to gain that little bit more short-lived satisfaction from conforming to societies' judgement of success. and we ultimately end up not happy in the slighest, but merely frustrated with life and stuck in an endless 'rat-race' for things we would otherwise have no desire to have if we were not told what to want and 'need'.
depression is not just a chemical imbalance in the brain. i believe clinical depression is growing in prevelance throughout the western world because our societies are sick, with the emphasis only on personal gain, material accumulation and consumption, and profit the only thing on companies' minds. this cannot continue (though evidently it doesn't apply to everybody)



edit: my "in short" was longer than the first bit :p
but i feel this is the essence of what ruffy was getting at :)

Good post. :)

Only thing insulting will be proving there are some real idiots out there. You know there will be some guy out there who actually believes that wearing TAG will cause random women to start swarming all over them. They will be quite disappointed when they realize it is just a marketing ploy. :DWhat about all the jewelry commercials that tell men that the only way to show their love is to buy diamonds? It makes women look so shallow. Diamonds are forever, my ass.
I'd rather have a kitten anyday.

What about all the jewelry commercials that tell men that the only way to show their love is to buy diamonds? It makes women look so shallow. Diamonds are forever, my ass.
I'd rather have a kitten anyday.

Diamonds are teh evil anyway.

Though kittens are harder to wear around your neck.......

Diamonds are teh evil anyway.

Though kittens are harder to wear around your neck.......Mine aren't. They dig their little claws in and hang on quite nicely.:p

Mine aren't. They dig their little claws in and hang on quite nicely.:p

You have some intelligent kittens. Or some very violent ones. Or possibly both. I'm scared now........
I for one welcome our Hyper-Intelligent And Violent Kitten Overlords.

What about all the jewelry commercials that tell men that the only way to show their love is to buy diamonds? It makes women look so shallow. Diamonds are forever, my ass.
I'd rather have a kitten anyday.

i hate those ads SOOO much.

the man cant be bothered to think up a real present for his wife so he buys the advertised diamond necklace or earrings from kay jewelers. the woman swoons over this incredible offering of love.

it must be such a disappointment for the man who believes that ad and buys his wife a common sterile piece of jewelry.

What about all the jewelry commercials that tell men that the only way to show their love is to buy diamonds? It makes women look so shallow. Diamonds are forever, my ass.
I'd rather have a kitten anyday.

I doubt I'll be able to afford diamonds any time soon, if ever, so this won't be an issue for me. Whoever my future wife turns out to be will have to live with more modest presents. I'm sure she'll be cool with this. :)

I doubt I'll be able to afford diamonds any time soon, if ever, so this won't be an issue for me. Whoever my future wife turns out to be will have to live with more modest presents. I'm sure she'll be cool with this. :)

We women prefer kittens over jewelry any day. Kittens are cuter.

You have some intelligent kittens. Or some very violent ones. Or possibly both. I'm scared now........
I for one welcome our Hyper-Intelligent And Violent Kitten Overlords.

My cats are teh overlords?! :eek:

i hate those ads SOOO much.

the man cant be bothered to think up a real present for his wife so he buys the advertised diamond necklace or earrings from kay jewelers. the woman swoons over this incredible offering of love.

it must be such a disappointment for the man who believes that ad and buys his wife a common sterile piece of jewelry.

"Every kiss begins with Kay" :rolleyes:

I like jewelry, but jeeze, it's a freaking piece of jewelry.

In the 1980s, there was a conscious decision in children's programming that all shows should encourage getting along. Even to the extent of going along to get along. If the group wants to do something, you should agree because the harmony of the group is paramount.

There were whole TV shows devoted to this ideal (The Get-Along Gang), and other shows were altered by studios to include this message. This is why the Dungeons & Dragons cartoon had Eric the Cavalier in it. His job in each episode was to disagree with the group and then be shown to be wrong.

Incidentally, I loved Eric the Cavalier, and generally liked his ideas. Maybe that's why I'm the anti-social misanthrope I am today.

Conformity was being openly promoted as an ideal. And as end in and of itself.

If this works on you, I have a lot less respect for you... but let's face it: the colony needs worker ants. Keeping the masses happy and predictable is in the elites' best interests. This shouldn't surprise anyone. And anyone smart enough to realise it's happening probably doesn't qualify as a worker ant.

We live in a society where nothing can ever make anyone happy. It is wrong, “lazy,” if one finds contentment and just wants to stand still for a while. We have no niche. We aren’t allowed to.

We women prefer kittens over jewelry any day. Kittens are cuter.

I love kittens too. Unfortunately they grow up but that is ok, they are still great. At the moment there are 3 cats in my house and they are always a pleasure, even though you have to watch your step when going down the stairs or you might take a tumble. :D

I love kittens too. Unfortunately they grow up but that is ok, they are still great. At the moment there are 3 cats in my house and they are always a pleasure, even though you have to watch your step when going down the stairs or you might take a tumble. :D

That is teh frickin annyoing. :mad:

And my one cat swats at my pencil while I'm trying to do homework.

That is teh frickin annyoing. :mad:

And my one cat swats at my pencil while I'm trying to do homework.

Oh yes, they get quite annoyed if you are doing something else that distracts your attention from them. If I am in bed trying to read and one of the cats happens to be around they will keep trying to nudge the book away from me. Cats are such jealous creatures.

As I sit here, not doing what I should be doing, I wonder what the media is trying to tell us. About how they see the future and how we are all the same. I see the way they use hollywood movies to show us the conformism of the future.

In uniforms, the people go about their daily lives, all the same, never exploring what options they have. They go buy the same things that they need to live. With uniform style, they march to the same drum.

I ponder the thought that the media wants to control the future, the culture of our children, and the lives they will live. I see that the big wigs in LA want us to conform to a communistic world of sames and alikes.

What do they want? Our money.

We will wear the clothes they design, the flying cars we will buy, and most importantly, rule our lives with a conforming iron fist.

When the future comes, and we all look the same, with no culture, and no diversity, in a world that Hitler would have loved, I hope I am dead.

I ask you, fellow NSers, please, a revolution is needed!


What you're decribing isn't communism, at least it's not exclusive to Marxiam/Lenninism/Maoism. Any dictatorship -- fascist, communist, theocratic -- wants the same thing. A Libertarian free-for-all isn't the answer, either. The average Libertarian acts on his own self-interest; and not an enlightened self-interest, either. The average libertarian still wants it his way. In my experience, the average libertarian believes he has rights -- and you don't, unless you agree with him. (and yes, I know that's not what the idea of Libertarianism is. I just have yet to meet any Libertarian who actually believes in "pure" libertarianism. They all claim to, but they don't, really). You want a Revolution, Ruffy? It won't work. Revolutions haven't brought a better government than the one they overthrew since 1776.

-- And no, I don't have a better idea. I'm convinced there isn't a solution.

P.S. If they want us to spend our money, it's not communism, it's consumerism run amok.

Okay, soooo... eventually the planet is subjected to corporate rule; the planet becomes a toxic dump. By then genetic engineering is advanced to the point where humans evolve into something superior, whereas those who don't mutate into goblin-like, moronic creatures. Interstellar travel allows the remaining "humans" to move to a better planet. They build their communities here, sort of like a "gated" community, and derive their income from the little moronic creatures working on the putrid colony-planets. If anyone tries to invade the mother planet, an intergalactic fleet of corporate-enforcers will crush them (nevermind the fact that the moronic imps will be too dumb to even do so). I'll purchase one of the massive luxury towers in said community, and crown myself its King, and all its inhabitants my subjects. <.<

Sounds like Heaven. :D

-- And no, I don't have a better idea. I'm convinced there isn't a solution.
And I thought I was the only one so completely resigned.

The problem is everything. The solution is nothing.

And I thought I was the only one so completely resigned.

The problem is everything. The solution is nothing.

I beg to differ. Alcohol is a damn fine solution.

And I thought I was the only one so completely resigned.

The problem is everything. The solution is nothing.
The solution is to acquiesce, and await the aforementioned utopia. :D If you're a good subject (with substantial assets), I'll give you a princely title. :)

I beg to differ. Alcohol is a damn fine solution.
As my slav...er, subject, you'd get all the alcohol you liked; at premium market prices, anyway. ^^

A Libertarian free-for-all isn't the answer, either. The average Libertarian acts on his own self-interest; and not an enlightened self-interest, either. The average libertarian still wants it his way. In my experience, the average libertarian believes he has rights -- and you don't, unless you agree with him.
The average person is more or less an idiot, whatever flavour of politics they adhere to. I would be inconsistent if I said those who don't share in libertarian ideology don't have the right to secede, and either join an extant community of their liking, or form one anew.

Oh yes, they get quite annoyed if you are doing something else that distracts your attention from them. If I am in bed trying to read and one of the cats happens to be around they will keep trying to nudge the book away from me. Cats are such jealous creatures.

Do any of your cats rub their butts in your face when you're playing in the interenet? :mad:

Do any of your cats rub their butts in your face when you're playing in the interenet? :mad:

Well, just their tails. Though sometimes they have a surprise for you on the tail as they somehow forgot to clean it properly...

*shudders*


Don't get too worked up. Just remember the cuteness! Remember! :)

Well, just their tails. Though sometimes they have a surprise for you on the tail as they somehow forgot to clean it properly...

*shudders*

:eek: I'm glad my cats clean their tails properly.

Well, as Ifreann said, we must welcome our Hyper-Intelligent and Violent Kitten Overlords. My cats r teh Overlords!!!!!! :eek:

Well, just their tails. Though sometimes they have a surprise for you on the tail as they somehow forgot to clean it properly...

*shudders*


Don't get too worked up. Just remember the cuteness! Remember! :)


My cats climb into bed with me. :)

:eek: I'm glad my cats clean their tails properly.

Well, as Ifreann said, we must welcome our Hyper-Intelligent and Violent Kitten Overlords. My cats r teh Overlords!!!!!! :eek:

Yes, cats do often appear to be the ruler of us all even now. Just think what will happen when the day comes and our new Overlords take power! :eek:

My cats climb into bed with me. :)

Ditto. :)

I'd like it more but unfortunately I can't keep still, have to keep changing positions. Cats don't really care for that. :(

Yes, cats do often appear to be the ruler of us all even now. Just think what will happen when the day comes and our new Overlords take power! :eek: :eek: They're going to take back to Ancient Egypt! :eek:



Ditto. :)

I'd like it more but unfortunately I can't keep still, have to keep changing positions. Cats don't really care for that. :( I accidentally kick my cats. They bite my toes. :(

:eek: They're going to take back to Ancient Egypt! :eek:

We must prepare! :eek:

I accidentally kick my cats. They bite my toes. :(

Yes. Sometimes they hide under the covers and I may accidently lay on one of them. :(

We must prepare! :eek:

Quick, get the water hose and the cages! :eek:

We don't have a future. The rapture and the end times are on their way soon.

December 14, 2006 at 11:59 PM is when the world will end.

December 14, 2006 at 11:59 PM is when the world will end.

O RLY?

December 14, 2006 at 11:59 PM is when the world will end.

Meh, I'm cool with it.

Meh, I'm cool with it.

But why that time, eh?

But why that time, eh?

Who knows? Perhaps the person who will end the world had his girlfriend dump him on that day. Who can guess such a thing?

the ads for men's products are so blatantly manipulative. there is the one for the beard dye that shows the man being rejected by the hotchick when his beard is gray but if he darkens it he gets laid. and those TAG cologne ads where women lose control around men who use the right scent.

why dont men protest that crap? dont y'all find it just a tad bit insulting?


Personally, I just take note of these adverts and avoid the product. If there's some sucker out there who believes that rubbish, that's their concern.

Personally, I just take note of these adverts and avoid the product. If there's some sucker out there who believes that rubbish, that's their concern.
Words of wisdom.

snip

You want a taste of what it will be like? Go live in Singapore for a short while.

It's social engineering in its extremes, its almost like everyone came off an assembly line in their behavior.

It's very much "Step out of line and the Man will take you away".

Meh... Stupid people buy stupid shit, and non-conformists get the shit beat out of them when they step out of line. There's no way to organize without succumbing to a group, and even friendship causes a part of individualism to be crushed. Hell, verbalizing and expressing it destroys it.

So what's the point? We can have our vain little ditties about the idiocy of it all (after all "We owe you nothing, you have no control") that eventually destroy and demean us, or we can stay silent and desperate.

Either way, it'll never change. Humans are retarded, social beasts that can never even see beyond the immediate impulse to get laid, get drunk, and get food.

O RLY?

Yep, one minute before my 21st birthday.

No revolution. Generally, after a revolution, all that has happened is that something bad has been replaced with something worse. Gradual reform is what is needed.

Wrong.

The American Revolution.

Yep, one minute before my 21st birthday.

:eek:

If the world ends then, I'll be ticked. I won't get to turn 15! :mad:

I majored in advertising design in art school. I spent 4 years studying how to design images that would deliver maximum message via minimum content and how to evoke and manipulate the feelings and thoughts of viewers. I didn't go into advertising as a profession -- not because it's evil to society, but because it's evil to its workers. A cut-throat business, if ever there was one. Instead, I went into the fine arts, and I apply the principles of advertising to a body of art the purpose of which is to screw with other people's brains -- to make them feel and make them think, even if they don't want to. Not surprisingly, I'm a surrealist, but perhaps surprisingly, I've actually sold pieces, and I even have a few fans. Go figure.

I love advertising as a pop-culture art form, but then, I'm immune to its effects. I've been the man behind the curtain. I know the tricks. And you are all correct -- the whole purpose and core technique of advertising is to bypass your critical judgment in your decision-making process. This is also the whole purpose and core technique of propaganda, which is just a specialized form of advertising. The social conformism depicted and promoted in movies, television and advertising is exactly what you think it is, exactly what it looks like -- a deliberate attempt to mold your thinking, to form you into "the masses," which in corporate-speak means a vast and docile herd of sheep ready for fleecing, producing maximum profits, as often as possible.

So, how do we get out of this trap? I recommend two steps. They're pretty big steps, with some effort involved, but they will free your mind:

1) Know your enemy. Study advertising. Learn its history and evolution and tricks. Learn how corporate special interests have quietly emasculated or even rescinded the laws that used to enforce truth in advertising. Learn to tell fact from fiction and spot the cliche icons that pass for cultural identity these days, and the code phrases that indicate legal ass-covering. With practice, you'll be able to dissect any ad, picking out its particular manipulative tricks, warning signs of deception, and even whether it contains any real information at all. You'll even be able to critique good ads, bad ads, and even failed ads.

For instance, in my opinion, a good ad was a very old, one-line slogan for Certs breath mints: "It's two, two, two mints in one!" This was a classic from Ted Bates, an ad agency in NY that my mother used to work for. They also did Maalox: "For fast, fast, fast relief!" I call it the Ted Bates 3-Repeat Principle of Brain Retention, and I call it good advertising. Think of it this way: You're standing in line at a drugstore counter with a mouth that feels, tastes and smells like yesterday's burnt coffee, and you just want to clean it. Do you really want to hold up the whole line of customers while you peruse the array of breath mints, trying to find one that fits your lifestyle? IT'S A FUCKING BREATH MINT, FOR GOD'S SAKE!! JUST PICK ONE, YOU SMELLY-MOUTHED BASTARD!! Faced with a confusing blur of white and green packets, advertising comes to your rescue, as you remember the slogan -- "Certs, it's two, two, two mints in one, pick up product, pay money, leave, thank you, goodbye." In and out in 3 seconds flat. In this instance, advertising has freed you from an unnecessary pressure -- the pressure of choosing a breath mint.

Compare that to those legendary, psychotic Mentos ads in which terrifyingly happy people from the Netherlands (or is it netherworld?) are living out a maniacal lifestyle of happy-happy-joy-joy adventures, driven by constant doses of Mentos, like they're tablets of cocaine. What the fuck was up with that shit? Lifestyle advertising, that's what that is, and I hate it. It is pernicious and toxic. It is the kind of advertising that sends the message that your character is defined by your stuff -- stuff which other people make, and tell you is good, and tell you you'll be rejected by hot chicks and laughed at by your neighbors and kept out of the popular cliques if you don't buy.

The power of advertising can be used for good, but only if you learn its kung-fu. The first step is to learn good ads from bad ads.

2) My second recommendation is to learn to think for yourself -- not about breath mints or sex or social roles/status, but about happiness. About what happiness really is -- to you. About what YOU really need to make you happy. And above all, about whether the things you have and the things you are being offered and urged towards are making you happy or unhappy.

I'm a fan of the Greek philosopher Epicurus. Some of his ideas I disagree with or don't care about, but his thinking on the subject of happiness was a revelation to me. Basically, the key to the Epicurean idea of happiness is not to clutter your life with crap you don't need, not to waste your precious time and tire yourself out chasing after said crap, and not to pursue said crap at the expense of things that really do matter to you, like the people you love. Here's an article (scroll down and read from the part about ethics):

http://www.iep.utm.edu/e/epicur.htm

Here's a quote from the article:

The greatest destroyer of happiness, thinks Epicurus, is anxiety about the future, especially fear of the gods and fear of death. If one can banish fear about the future, and face the future with confidence that one's desires will be satisfied, then one will attain tranquility (ataraxia), the most exalted state. In fact, given Epicurus' conception of pleasure, it might be less misleading to call him a 'tranquillist' instead of a 'hedonist.'

Bad advertising creates and exploits just this kind of anxiety.

Good advertising either relieves us of the stressful pressure of making annoyingly trivial decisions or else it merely transmits information in a memorable way and, thus, has nothing to do with dictating lifestyles.

Oh, and I think I should add that I like cats, too.

Oh, and I think I should add that I like cats, too.

CONFORMIST!!!!!!!!!!! :eek:

Muah ha ha! You are bending to our will- I mean, uh, YOU EBIL CONFORMIST! You must wear black, listen to AFI, and EXCESSIVELY PET CATS!

;)

Wrong.

The American Revolution.
One could argue that present-day US' sad political situation stemmed from this Revolution though...

However, I do not see the American Revolution as typical of its species - afterall, it was more of a secession movement rather than one aiming exclusively at a new type of government.

:eek:

If the world ends then, I'll be ticked. I won't get to turn 15! :mad:
15's a crappy age. You wouldn't like it, anyway.

15's a crappy age. You wouldn't like it, anyway.

Hmmm, now that I think about it, 14 isn't so bad. Good thing I have till January 5th! :)

Hmmm, now that I think about it, 14 isn't so bad. Good thing I have till January 5th! :)

*claps*

PS: Why am I not in your sig?

*claps*

PS: Why am I not in your sig?

Because we are only engaged and you did not join teh ceremony on Gabbly.

We have 11 cats. beat that.

*bows to Queen Cuddles of the Feline Empire* yes, we have a cat named cuddles

Hmmm, now that I think about it, 14 isn't so bad. Good thing I have till January 5th! :)
You're 14?!

*rots in jail* :(

EDIT: Be back later. gonna watch a movie with family :)

You're 14?!

*rots in jail* :(

EDIT: Be back later. gonna watch a movie with family :)

It's NS, there are no marriage laws here ;)

Otherwise I would not be married to another woman AND a bunch of other guys at teh same time. :D

We have 11 cats. beat that.

*bows to Queen Cuddles of the Feline Empire* yes, we have a cat named cuddles

My cats are top leaders of the Feline Uberarmy! :eek: *respects Salem and Sneaky*

CONFORMIST!!!!!!!!!!! :eek:

Muah ha ha! You are bending to our will- I mean, uh, YOU EBIL CONFORMIST! You must wear black, listen to AFI, and EXCESSIVELY PET CATS!

;)

Black makes me look like a Sicilian widow. I wear gray.

Now, if you'll excuse me, the All-Powerful Overlord is meowing for his snack.

Black makes me look like a Sicilian widow. I wear gray.

Now, if you'll excuse me, the All-Powerful Overlord is meowing for his snack.

A Sicilian window? Okeeeee.....

It's NS, there are no marriage laws here ;)

Otherwise I would not be married to another woman AND a bunch of other guys at teh same time. :D
True....

You're 14?!

*rots in jail* :(

EDIT: Be back later. gonna watch a movie with family :)

if she was in Australia the age for a girls is 16,boys 15 thats if they have not change it with out me hearing of it

A Sicilian window? Okeeeee.....
http://portal.unesco.org/en/ev.php-URL_ID=18291&URL_DO=DO_TOPIC&URL_SECTION=201.html

In mediterranean places like Sicily, there's an old tradition of widows wearing black, pretty much for the rest of their lives. Also, the older a woman gets, the more funerals she is likely to attend, so eventually, the old women wore black all the time. Around the Mediterranean, such traditional old ladies are known as "blackbirds." And since I'm part Sicilian, and inherited those Sicilian dark looks, complete with dark circles around the eyes...well, gray looks more optimistic on me than solid black.

My cat is black. It looks better on him.

http://portal.unesco.org/en/ev.php-URL_ID=18291&URL_DO=DO_TOPIC&URL_SECTION=201.html

In mediterranean places like Sicily, there's an old tradition of widows wearing black, pretty much for the rest of their lives. Also, the older a woman gets, the more funerals she is likely to attend, so eventually, the old women wore black all the time. Around the Mediterranean, such traditional old ladies are known as "blackbirds." And since I'm part Sicilian, and inherited those Sicilian dark looks, complete with dark circles around the eyes...well, gray looks more optimistic on me than solid black.

My cat is black. It looks better on him.

Oh, widow.... I misread that as "window". Though, at the time, I'd just woken up from a nap. :p

if she was in Australia the age for a girls is 16,boys 15 thats if they have not change it with out me hearing of it

I'm in the US, ages depend on the states but 18 is safer to go by.

Oh, widow.... I misread that as "window". Though, at the time, I'd just woken up from a nap. :p
Well, if the world doesn't end, then someday you'll be old enough to drink coffee all day long and you won't make such mistakes. ;)

http://portal.unesco.org/en/ev.php-URL_ID=18291&URL_DO=DO_TOPIC&URL_SECTION=201.html

In mediterranean places like Sicily, there's an old tradition of widows wearing black, pretty much for the rest of their lives. Also, the older a woman gets, the more funerals she is likely to attend, so eventually, the old women wore black all the time. Around the Mediterranean, such traditional old ladies are known as "blackbirds." And since I'm part Sicilian, and inherited those Sicilian dark looks, complete with dark circles around the eyes...well, gray looks more optimistic on me than solid black.

My cat is black. It looks better on him.

my step sister husband Family came from there and when i was young i could pick up what they were saying and say it back
but cant no more

Okay, soooo... eventually the planet is subjected to corporate rule; the planet becomes a toxic dump. By then genetic engineering is advanced to the point where humans evolve into something superior, whereas those who don't mutate into goblin-like, moronic creatures. Interstellar travel allows the remaining "humans" to move to a better planet. They build their communities here, sort of like a "gated" community, and derive their income from the little moronic creatures working on the putrid colony-planets. If anyone tries to invade the mother planet, an intergalactic fleet of corporate-enforcers will crush them (nevermind the fact that the moronic imps will be too dumb to even do so). I'll purchase one of the massive luxury towers in said community, and crown myself its King, and all its inhabitants my subjects. <.<

Sounds like Heaven. :D

Sounds like Ursula Le Guin's (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ursula_K._Le_Guin) novel The_Word_for_World_is_Forest (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Word_for_World_is_Forest)

Sounds like Ursula Le Guin's (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ursula_K._Le_Guin) novel The_Word_for_World_is_Forest (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Word_for_World_is_Forest)
That's hot (http://badgas.co.uk/language/thats_hot.jpg)! :D

I know her by the way. Excellent writer. But I like my world's ending better. :)

That's hot (http://badgas.co.uk/language/thats_hot.jpg)! :D

I know her by the way. Excellent writer. But I like my world's ending better. :)

The problem with your idea is that it is basically expoltation of one class of person over the another. That's basically what we have right now. Western nations exploting other countries like China or India for cheaper labor. The problem with cheap and especially very cheap labor is that it causes a everything else to become chaper and cheaper. We are seeing that right now with companies like Wal-mart going to communities and causing small business to go out of business. The price of labor is actually as cheap as it was in the early 40's and 50's but we are still have inflation were basic goods and services have doubled in price. Also their is a strong case that within the nest 10-20 years China will have to change to survive the disater it's heading towards with the problem of the ratio of men to women.

Also when you lack resources you usually have to become imperialistic to control the resourses. By the way this actually happened during the later part of the industrial revolution. from about the 1870's to 1900 the world was struck by major depressions every 3-8 years causing massive social strife.

The problem with your idea is that it is basically expoltation of one class of person over the another.
Yes, and you think I didn't notice this? :)

And no, we don't have anything of the sort now. I am not going to debate it here, since I already have elsewhere (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=508078&highlight=Europa+Maxima).

Yes, and you think I didn't notice this? :)

And no, we don't have anything of the sort now. I am not going to debate it here, since I already have elsewhere (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=508078&highlight=Europa+Maxima).


Hmmm. Only problem with that is like most Liberterians/Randists you are basically blind by the fact that it isn't in your nation. I not gonna argue either but i'll just bring up that point.

I not gonna argue either but i'll just bring up that point.
I was just trying to break apart some of the gloom and doom in here with my little vision of the future. <.<

I was just trying to break apart some of the gloom and doom in here with my little vision of the future. <.<

Well ok then. I think i've told you before I don't have anything against libertarians just that I think they are a little misguided(Like communists). Especially the hard core Ayn Randists.

Well ok then. I think i've told you before I don't have anything against libertarians just that I think they are a little misguided(Like communists). Especially the hard core Ayn Randists.
Meh, I'm not a fan of Rand's.

Anyways, after reading over it I realised how much like BNW my future "vision" is. Except the Soma isn't free. :p Or necessary...

Off topic, I didn't know you're gay too, although I rarely pay much attention to sigs anyway...

Meh, I'm not a fan of Rand's.

Anyways, after reading over it I realised how much like BNW my future "vision" is. Except the Soma isn't free. :p Or necessary...

Off topic, I didn't know you're gay too, although I rarely pay much attention to sigs anyway...


Lol I was gonna bring up BNW. If you are going to do that I would recommend that you give out the Soma for free. It would reduce the revolts against you.

Yes i'm gay. I love guys. I have no prob telling folks that. My mom has a prob with it.

Lol I was gonna bring up BNW. If you are going to do that I would recommend that you give out the Soma for free. It would reduce the revolts against you.
I'd go one step further - if the toxicity doesn't turn the goblin-thingies into mindless slaves, genetic engineering will. :) The soma will be for the humans, but they will be free to act as they please on the motherplanet (as long as they buy my products). :D And if anyone tries to incite a rebellion from outwith or invade the motherplanet, they'll have a corporate starfleet to deal with. <.<

Yes i'm gay. I love guys. I have no prob telling folks that. My mom has a prob with it.
So am I, although I haven't actually informed my parents of it yet. :)

I'd go one step further - if the toxicity doesn't turn the goblin-thingies into mindless slaves, genetic engineering will. :) The soma will be for the humans, but they will be free to act as they please on the motherplanet (as long as they buy my products). :D And if anyone tries to incite a rebellion from outwith or invade the motherplanet, they'll have a corporate starfleet to deal with. <.<


So am I, although I haven't actually informed my parents of it yet. :)

Check out the "Paridise found" link on my sig. It has some very intresting ideas. Genetic slaves wouldn't work because you would have to make so unitellegent they would border on disabled physically & or mentally. The problem is that slaves (if normal humans) will always rebel at some point if by themselves or by people like abolitionists.

I think the best thing would to be to create robot slaves but even they might rebel.( See: Animatrix- The Second Renaissance).

Cool I would have never guessed that. Are you cute?

Check out the "Paridise found" link on my sig. It has some very intresting ideas. Genetic slaves wouldn't work because you would have to make so unitellegent they would border on disabled physically & or mentally. The problem is that slaves (if normal humans) will always rebel at some point if by themselves or by people like abolitionists.

I think the best thing would to be to create robot slaves but even they might rebel.( See: Animatrix- The Second Renaissance).
Oh I am sure there must be a way to create slaves that are both capable of fulfilling their duties and having no will of their own - or better yet, slaves who like their servitude. :) You might be right though. Robots may be a better option, although their AI could be an issue. I'll give the link a look.

If to go by fantasy, I'd use undead - their servitude is eternal and binding. Except for the ruling Lichs (http://files.maps4heroes.com/heroes5/pictures/necropolis/cr5.jpg) and Vampires, of course. :)

Cool I would have never guessed that. Are you cute?
I've mentioned it a couple of times here before. And beauty is in the eye of a beholder to evoke a cliche, but usually I do get told I am cute, yes.

I was just trying to break apart some of the gloom and doom in here with my little vision of the future. <.<

No offense, man, but your vision of the future is my personal hell. Brightened, nothing.

No offense, man, but your vision of the future is my personal hell. Brightened, nothing.
LOL Sorry to hear. You won't mind being sent to work on one of the colony-planets, will you? :)

(By the way, that is not what I would want the future to be like, just working out a hypothetical scenario ^^.)

LOL Sorry to hear. You won't mind being sent to work on one of the colony-planets, will you? :)

Is there free sex?

If so I am so in.

(By the way, that is not what I would want the future to be like, just working out a hypothetical scenario ^^.)

Good. You had me very scared.

Is there free sex?

If so I am so in.
Oh, yes there is much free sex. With what it is to be had is another question entirely though... semi-decaying corpses, what little flora is left on the planets, and the goblin-like semi-moron slaves (if we can't figure out necromancy by then). :)

Good. You had me very scared.
I tend to be a bit of a shock-jock. :D

Oh, yes there is much free sex. With what it is to be had is another question entirely though... semi-decaying corpses, what little flora is left on the planets, and the goblin-like semi-moron slaves (if we can't figure out necromancy by then). :)


I think I may opt out then.

Huxley would have had a heyday with some of our current inventions and their capabilities for control.

Of course, he would have also been deeply troubled by the re-emergence of the extreme-moral right, but I never really got a grasp on his politics anyway.

Oh I am sure there must be a way to create slaves that are both capable of fulfilling their duties and having no will of their own - or better yet, slaves who like their servitude. :) You might be right though. Robots may be a better option, although their AI could be an issue. I'll give the link a look.

If you could create a race like the Eloi (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eloi) maybe. But with normal humans the power of self will is too strong to stay in servertude for too long like the Africans in the New World or the Jews in Egypt & Nazi Germany.

Robots- maybe---you would have to program very limited AI intellegence.

I've mentioned it a couple of times here before. And beauty is in the eye of a beholder to evoke a cliche, but usually I do get told I am cute, yes.

Do you have a profile with pic?---Just curious what u look like. I guess I look ok not beautiful just a regular looking. http://photos.yahoo.com/sir_mercutio_99

Huxley would have had a heyday with some of our current inventions and their capabilities for control.
I think he'd probably switch from disdaining what he described to supporting it due to its (seeming) inevitability.

Of course, he would have also been deeply troubled by the re-emergence of the extreme-moral right, but I never really got a grasp on his politics anyway.
He was purportedly a humanist. I am not sure where I would place him, but he believed in the idea of a natural aristocracy and such other notions. If anything, he resembles Wilhelm Roepke the most, so I would assume he was something akin to an Ordoliberal. He did regret that he never added in a more "balanced" community in his novel, which to me, prima facie, sounded a lot like Roepke's ideas.

If you could create a race like the Eloi (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eloi) maybe. But with normal humans the power of self will is too strong to stay in servertude for too long like the Africans in the New World or the Jews in Egypt & Nazi Germany.
God no, I don't want a bunch of Paris Hiltons on the motherplanet. :eek: It's something akin to that concept, but rather more proximate to BNW's Alpha and Beta ruling elites and the Delta and Epsilon slave classes (minus the need for Soma). It will be post-human too, of course. :) In the absence of any threats though, the elite (ie what humans become) would probably degenerate into something like the Eloi, rather than Plato's war-like Philosopher-Kings and Guardians.

Robots- maybe---you would have to program very limited AI intellegence.
If only undeath were realisable... :(

Do you have a profile with pic?---Just curious what u look like. I guess I look ok not beautiful just a regular looking. http://photos.yahoo.com/sir_mercutio_99
No, I don't have any photos right now of myself to put up really, but when I obtain a few I'll post them. :)

Do you have a profile with pic?---Just curious what u look like. I guess I look ok not beautiful just a regular looking. http://photos.yahoo.com/sir_mercutio_99
Why must your engage in these "parades" around our cities in dresses simply for shock appeal which actually helps to give the masses a further negative view of gays?:confused:

Why must your engage in these "parades" around our cities in dresses simply for shock appeal which actually helps to give the masses a further negative view of gays?:confused:

Honey-Because closets are only for hanging your clothes. I hate this idea that being gay has to "normalized" and assimilated into society. Gays back in the 60's & 70's were far more radical. Gay isn't just upper middle class white boys who work 9-5, live in condos and drive BMW's and act like "Normal" straight people.

BTW--I was a volunteer for Paws Atlanta, a local animal shelter.

God no, I don't want a bunch of Paris Hiltons on the motherplanet. It's something akin to that concept, but rather more proximate to BNW's Alpha and Beta ruling elites and the Delta and Epsilon slave classes (minus the need for Soma). It will be post-human too, of course. In the absence of any threats though, the elite (ie what humans become) would probably degenerate into something like the Eloi, rather than Plato's war-like Philosopher-Kings and Guardians

I think Huxley's "Island" would be a better template for a society. BNW is conidered a dystopia.

Gay isn't just upper middle class white boys who work 9-5, live in condos and drive BMW's and act like "Normal" straight people.
Well it is in my case. :p Minus the driving, and working (for now)...

I think Huxley's "Island" would be a better template for a society. BNW is conidered a dystopia.
Yes, I've been meaning to give the "Island" a read. :) I intended on painting the picture of a dystopia though. If nothing more just to get a reaction out of people. :D

Well it is in my case. :p Minus the driving, and working (for now)...

Seems a bit empty these days. The gay movement is too much trying to assimilate with the hetreo culture. We seem to be losing a flavor and communites. especially here in Atlanta with the closing of gay bars, resturants & bookstores. Midtown isn't as gay as it use to be.


Yes, I've been meaning to give the "Island" a read. :) I intended on painting the picture of a dystopia though. If nothing more just to get a reaction out of people. :D

I'm gonna start reading Kim Stanley Robinson's Three Californias Trilogy (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Three_Californias_Trilogy) and Ursula Le Guin.
As a slight anarchist I would be against any type of control that limits a person freedom to a set level. This is why I consider myself a Green/Libertarian Socialist. I feel it would be better if humans live in communities no larger than 25,000 that can be grouped into larger groups(Cities) or small villiages.

Seems a bit empty these days.
I'm happy with it nonetheless. :)

As a slight anarchist I would be against any type of control that limits a person freedom to a set level. This is why I consider myself a Green/Libertarian Socialist. I feel it would be better if humans live in communities no larger than 25,000 that can be grouped into larger groups(Cities) or small villiages.
Although we differ on the means of achieving that (me being a market anarchist), I agree that smaller communities would indeed be infinitely preferrable to what we have nowadays. This is also what Huxley (and Roepke) tried to point out; that we've gone overboard with the centralisation.

Le Guin is one of my favourite authors by the way. She is wunderbar. :)

Why must your engage in these "parades" around our cities in dresses simply for shock appeal which actually helps to give the masses a further negative view of gays?:confused:

Is anyone else starting to view Atlantian Islands ever so slightly worse than MTAE...could just be me...

Is anyone else starting to view Atlantian Islands ever so slightly worse than MTAE...could just be me...
Being online friends with him, I haven't really got any problem with him. :)

Although we differ on the means of achieving that (me being a market anarchist), I agree that smaller communities would indeed be infinitely preferrable to what we have nowadays. This is also what Huxley (and Roepke) tried to point out; that we've gone overboard with the centralisation.

I would only take the Pacific Coast (Baja California, California,Oregon, Washington, British Columbia),European Union, South America and Africa to form the Ecotopia Union of Nations. The rest of the world could be anarco-capitalist/libertarian as long as their is low/no pollution.

Is anyone else starting to view Atlantian Islands ever so slightly worse than MTAE...could just be me...

I was wondering if Atlantian Islands was gay. Hey with Ted Haggard and Mark Foley ;). You know what they say about those who "Doth protest too much".

I would only take the Pacific Coast (Baja California, California,Oregon, Washington, British Columbia),European Union, South America and Africa to form the Ecotopia Union of Nations. The rest of the world could be anarco-capitalist/libertarian as long as their is low/no pollution.
Which would leave me with most of North America, Canada, Asia, Australia, maybe parts of South Africa and any European countries that refused to join in (probably England, Denmark, Russia, Ireland, Luxembourg, Switzerland, Norway, Iceland, most of Eastern Europe and Monaco, and any other dissidants). Suits me just fine. :D

Which would leave me with most of North America, Canada, Australia, maybe parts of South Africa and any European countries that refused to join in (probably England, Denmark, Russia, Ireland, Luxembourg, Switzerland, Norway, Iceland, most of Eastern Europe and Monaco). Suits me just fine. :D

Also most of Asia (China, Japan, India, etc...) I would like to set up a Anarcho-communist/Neo Communist state somewhere. I think the UK Dennmark, etc.... will join later in the EU. Europe is generally more accepting of green/environmentalist policies.

South Africa is generally more liberal I think it would join the African Union.

Edit: I'm trying to create a map that shows the ecotopian/capitalist nations

Also most of Asia (China, Japan, India, etc...) I would like to set up a Anarcho-communist/Neo Communist state somewhere. I think the UK Dennmark, etc.... will join later in the EU. Europe is generally more accepting of green/environmentalist policies.
The UK, maybe. England? I doubt it. All the countries I mentioned value their independence, and prefer their own economic approaches to the EU's more general consensus one. That doesn't mean they'd necessarily go by my anarchocapitalist/libertarian ideas, but it does mean they'd generally be adverse to joining any sort of union. As for Asia, you can have it, except for Japan. :p

South Africa is generally more liberal I think it would join the African Union.
Oh, the fact that the nation is still "glued" together is a miracle. It should be allowed to break apart in my opinion. The Boerevolk tend to be more right-wing conservative. Black tribes such as the Zulus want their own Monarchy. The country is by no means a cohesive group.

Edit: I'm trying to create a map that shows the ecotopian/capitalist nations
Put it up when you're done.

I think the UK is more liberal than what it currently is. Remember right now most of Europe has conservative-right governments (France, Germany, Italy). I predicting after the fall of oil and our current corporatist system.

The Boers(Afrikaners) are mostly a faction of Neo-Nazis and Neo-Aparthieds. I doubt they will ever get back in power. They'll probaly emmigrate to another nation.


Any way here's the map: Worldmap (http://pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/sir_mercutio_99/album?.dir=40b3re2&.src=ph&store=&prodid=&.done=http%3a//photos.yahoo.com/ph//my_photos)

The UK, maybe. England? I doubt it. All the countries I mentioned value their independence, and prefer their own economic approaches to the EU's more general consensus one. That doesn't mean they'd necessarily go by my anarchocapitalist/libertarian ideas, but it does mean they'd generally be adverse to joining any sort of union. As for Asia, you can have it, except for Japan. :p

The nations in shown in green have independent nations in them. The nation would be more like a confederation of states like Switzerland. The confederations will then also be joined in an Ecotopian union that will promote trade/cooporation etc between each confederation.

Edit: The Pacific Islands would have their own ecounion. Greenland would be also an independent EcoU. Falklands would be shared by both the BA & EU. Tibet might also join the EcoU. New Zealand is undecided. Probaly would join given NZ's high level of conservation and envirommental protection.

I think the UK is more liberal than what it currently is. Remember right now most of Europe has conservative-right governments (France, Germany, Italy). I predicting after the fall of oil and our current corporatist system.
The UK as a whole, yes. England? It's already complaining about ceding more power to the EU. And it has always historically been a nation which favoured laissez-faire. The countries you mentioned have pseudo-right-wing governments. So-called "compassionate conservatives". A total joke. They are corrupt corporatists. I agree with your conclusion on the oil, but Russia, Norway and the Arctic will provide it in abundance.


The Boers(Afrikaners) are mostly a faction of Neo-Nazis and Neo-Aparthieds. I doubt they will ever get back in power. They'll probaly emmigrate to another nation.
Untrue. That is a gross overgeneralisation. If anything, most tend towards conservatism (and while many are racist, they are not Nazi), and many in the nation would welcome its breakup. Although I agree, emigration is more likely in the case of the Boerevolk.

The nations in shown in green have independent nations in them. The nation would be more like a confederation of states like Switzerland. The confederations will then also be joined in an Ecotopian union that will promote trade/cooporation etc between each confederation.
I still doubt any non-EU European country, as well as some EU ones (e.g. England itself), and South Africa would join in such a confederation. The rest seems fine though.

Edit: The Pacific Islands would have their own ecounion. Greenland would be also an independent EcoU. Falklands would be shared by both the BA & EU. Tibet might also join the EcoU. New Zealand is undecided. Probaly would join given NZ's high level of conservation and envirommental protection.
You can have 'em. :p

The UK as a whole, yes. England? It's already complaining about ceding more power to the EU. And it has always historically been a nation which favoured laissez-faire. The countries you mentioned have pseudo-right-wing governments. So-called "compassionate conservatives". A total joke. They are corrupt corporatists. I agree with your conclusion on the oil, but Russia, Norway and the Arctic will provide it in abundance.
I still doubt any non-EU European country, as well as some EU ones (e.g. England itself), and South Africa would join in such a confederation. The rest seems fine though.


South Africa is the most liberal of African nations and I perdict will lead the way forward. It's the only one right now that has gay rights and is going to allow civil unions. Scotland, Northern Ireland and Wales will probaly join first then England and Ireland wil later join. You forgot that in the UK had a very strong liberal/union movement after WW2. I think that the British people are growing tired of the Conservative/Labour rule. Like I pointed out before in another thread I think it will give the Lib. Democrats & Greens a chance to gain power if they work together.

Also it will lessen the need for sepration amoung nations. Groups like the Basque and the Bretagnians will have a level of self rule. In Africa the need to move away from the old borders and build a foundation of stronger small goverments will stop the ethnic wars there.

Edit: Also want to point out that oil production has already peaked. Even with oil from Russia and Iraq we are still consuming more oil than we can find. Also China is now becoming a leading oil consumer. The Artic & Anartica need to be left along. the ecosystems thier are very fragile.

South Africa is the most liberal of African nations and I perdict will lead the way forward. It's the only one right now that has gay rights and is going to allow civil unions.
Which is not incompatible with libertarian ideology in the least. Afrikaaners (and blacks) strongly value economic freedom. Neither group is hostile to capitalism. If the nation breaks up though with the whites emigrating, and the blacks forming their own self-ruled communities I think it would work well though in your union.

I think that the British people are growing tired of the Conservative/Labour rule. Like I pointed out before in another thread I think it will give the Lib. Democrats & Greens a chance to gain power if they work together.
Because both Labour and the Tories are control-freaks. The Lib-Dems were once the height of the Liberal movement in 19th - early 20th century England, and still remain somewhere in the libertarian spectrum. All three parties are right of centre actually. It's just that the Lib-Dems aren't authoritarians.

Also it will lessen the need for sepration amoung nations. Groups like the Basque and the Bretagnians will have a level of self rule. In Africa the need to move away from the old borders and build a foundation of stronger small goverments will stop the ethnic wars there.

Sounds good to me. If anarchocapitalism is consistently applied everywhere else (excepting the countries that remain statist left-wing), the world will almost be entirely anarchist. :D

Edit: Also want to point out that oil production has already peaked. Even with oil from Russia and Iraq we are still consuming more oil than we can find. Also China is now becoming a leading oil consumer. The Artic & Anartica need to be left along. the ecosystems thier are very fragile.
With Russia, Canada, Denmark, Norway and the US warring over who's gonna get first access to the oil there once the glaciers melt? :p Unless their systems experience a prior collapse, I doubt it.