NationStates Jolt Archive

I don't want to argue about the evidence of historical occurrences in Israel because they aren't important. For now, I'm just assuming that everything in the old testament is an accurate portrayal of what actually happened in history. The thing I don't understand is how people can be willing to die for the ability to call Israel home.

The only argument I can get from people is that so many events reportedly occurred in Israel that it makes the land itself holy. My question is how that is possible. If God created the entire world, which again I am not debating the Old Testament, how can any piece of land be any more holy than any other? By saying that one piece of land is better is to say that God's craftsmanship was sub par in certain areas. Others report that conversing with God in Israel is easier. Well, if God is omnipotent, I have a tough time buying that God would be hard of hearing unless the person trying to speak to him was in Israel.

So if the land isn't anymore holy than say, North Dakota, and God is capable of hearing people anywhere, why can't people just remember the stories and lessons the bible teaches, and stop fighting over a piece of land where war has been on-going for ages?

If you want to know why Israel is so important to the Jews, then you must read about the events that have occurred during the Diaspara.

The Zionist movement itself was a response to the anti-semitism observed in Europe during the shameful trial of Alfred Dreyfuss.

So we can keep a war on ideals going by proxy.

Because, according to the Bible, God intended Israel to be a "Promised Land" for the Jews. It's like their homeland, which they inhabited for hundreds of years, and is also where all their holiest shrines and such are.

And what's with all the hate provoking topics???

Where's the love people, WHERE IS IT????

Because, according to the Bible, God intended Israel to be a "Promised Land" for the Jews. It's like their homeland, which they inhabited for hundreds of years, and is also where all their holiest shrines and such are.

Didn't all three prophets chill out in Israel?

I don't want to argue about the evidence of historical occurrences in Israel because they aren't important. For now, I'm just assuming that everything in the old testament is an accurate portrayal of what actually happened in history. The thing I don't understand is how people can be willing to die for the ability to call Israel home.

The only argument I can get from people is that so many events reportedly occurred in Israel that it makes the land itself holy. My question is how that is possible. If God created the entire world, which again I am not debating the Old Testament, how can any piece of land be any more holy than any other? By saying that one piece of land is better is to say that God's craftsmanship was sub par in certain areas. Others report that conversing with God in Israel is easier. Well, if God is omnipotent, I have a tough time buying that God would be hard of hearing unless the person trying to speak to him was in Israel.

So if the land isn't anymore holy than say, North Dakota, and God is capable of hearing people anywhere, why can't people just remember the stories and lessons the bible teaches, and stop fighting over a piece of land where war has been on-going for ages?

Does the bible say the people of North Dakota would be spread around the world, and the state would cease to exist as it had, but then one day it would be be restored, by "many nations", and when it was restored the desert would blossom? Well, it says that in the OT about 2000 yrs befor it all happened to Israel. So, maybe, just maybe, it DOES have a little bit of specialness to it. (http://ineedjesus.com/Documents/Bible_Desk/proof_bible_true.htm#2-THE%20SOON%20COMING%20CLIMAX)

And what's with all the hate provoking topics???

Where's the love people, WHERE IS IT????

Where is the provocation?

Where is the provocation?

Alas, many people fly into a rage and lose all sense of perspective as soon as they hear the word 'Israel.'

I've got a feeling it's important to the Israelis because for centuries they had no land to call their own. During that time they were abused and even almost exterminated. Everyone abused them and they had no place to turn to. Now they have a homeland. They have a place that is their own that they can go to or ask for help if they're attacked. Given the long history of antisemitism in much of the world I can see why they cherish such a place.

Realistically Israel isn't important. Why we continue to support them is beyond me, they're well capable of handling their own affairs.

Where's the love people, WHERE IS IT????

At home, in bed, asleep. Love gave up on the whole bad deal.

I've never understood why so many people are so willing to fight over such a crappy peice of real estate. If you really need to duke it out over a section of land, then at least find a nice one. Like Western Canada or the US Pacific Northwest, Northern Italy, etc.

Come to think of it, its a rather small piece of land. Why die for earth marked within illusionary boundaries?

Because, according to the Bible, God intended Israel to be a "Promised Land" for the Jews. It's like their homeland, which they inhabited for hundreds of years, and is also where all their holiest shrines and such are.

So, the Hebrews wrote a book some 2700 years ago that said their god gave them Israel, and people are still dying for it now? I wonder what bit of religious propaganda from the last couple of centuries people wil be killing each other over 3 millennia from now? I expect by then they'll have forgotten that L Ron Hubbard was a sci fi writer and will have elevated him to a prophet. But hopefully the human race might have grown up a little by then.

So, the Hebrews wrote a book some 2700 years ago that said their god gave them Israel, and people are still dying for it now? I wonder what bit of religious propaganda from the last couple of centuries people wil be killing each other over 3 millennia from now? I expect by then they'll have forgotten that L Ron Hubbard was a sci fi writer and will have elevated him to a prophet. But hopefully the human race might have grown up a little by then.

My guess is Oprahism.

And what's with all the hate provoking topics???

Where's the love people, WHERE IS IT????

You'll get used to it. In the meantime, here you go ... :fluffle:

Does the bible say the people of North Dakota would be spread around the world, and the state would cease to exist as it had, but then one day it would be be restored, by "many nations", and when it was restored the desert would blossom? Well, it says that in the OT about 2000 yrs befor it all happened to Israel. So, maybe, just maybe, it DOES have a little bit of specialness to it. (http://ineedjesus.com/Documents/Bible_Desk/proof_bible_true.htm#2-THE%20SOON%20COMING%20CLIMAX)

So...we should instead have given North Dakota to the Jews? Hmmm...then where would we have put all our n00ks during the Cold War? Besides, that contradicts my other common sense plan of giving Kansas to the Jews...

Oh, what the hell; JEWS FOR NORTH DAKOTA!

So...we should instead have given North Dakota to the Jews? Hmmm...then where would we have put all our n00ks during the Cold War? Besides, that contradicts my other common sense plan of giving Kansas to the Jews...

Oh, what the hell; JEWS FOR NORTH DAKOTA!

The Jews are not crazy. North Dakota? Have you been there? :p

There was a porposal to settle the jews in Uganda once upon a time. Didn't receive a great deal of support, though.

And what's with all the hate provoking topics???

Where's the love people, WHERE IS IT????

Not here.

Because abstracting from any history, any religion, and "pay back" from the holocaust, any of that.

Israel is a sovereign nation that has the right to exist and to defend itself from threats the same as any nation. They are likewise surrounded by countries that deny their right to exist, and seek to destroy them.

If Mexico and Canada had declared unending, unyielding war on the United States and had consistantly provoked, attacked, and threatened the US, would we think them justified to defend themselves?

Of course, so why not Israel?

The Jews are not crazy. North Dakota? Have you been there? :p

There was a porposal to settle the jews in Uganda once upon a time. Didn't receive a great deal of support, though.

No, I haven't been there...haven't been to Kansas either, but my main motivation for picking Kansas was that Fred Phelps lives there and the Israelis wouldn't take any shit off of him.

I recall a proposal to settle the Jews in Ethiopia as well...frankly, they need to be put somewhere, and they're probably less likely to be suicide-bombed in North Dakota than in the Middle East.

If Mexico and Canada had declared unending, unyielding war on the United States and had consistantly provoked, attacked, and threatened the US, would we think them justified to defend themselves?


If the United Nations decided to give all the fertile parts of America back to the indigenous Americans and forced those whose families had been living there for centuries into refugee camps, and then the indigenous Americans, backed up with billions of dollars of European weaponry decided to occupy areas outside the land that the UN had given them, that would be alright, because the United States of Indigenous Americans would be a sovereign country with a right to exist.

If the United Nations decided to give all the fertile parts of America back to the indigenous Americans

false analogy, for two reasons.

1) the nation of "america" already existed in that land

2) the UN had no legal claim to that land.

There WAS NO NATION THERE BEFORE. It was land owned by the UN and under the authority of Britain. The UN didn't make ANOTHER nation give up its land, it WILLINGLY gave up ITS OWN LAND.

Your analogy is bullshit because you stated "America" there was no equivlant. The was no nation there that was dissolved. There was no country that was forced to split up. It was UN land, under British mandate.

The only way for your analogy to be correct is if America WILLINGLY gave back land to the native americans. And guess what, they have.

Heard of "Indian Nation" before?

It was owned by the UN? Do you actually know when the UN was formed?

I bet the indigenous Americans are really grateful for their Indian Nation, about as grateful as the European Jews were for their ghettos.

false analogy, for two reasons.

1) the nation of "america" already existed in that land

2) the UN had no legal claim to that land.


Your analogy is bullshit because you stated "America" there was no equivlant. The was no nation there that was dissolved. There was no country that was forced to split up. It was UN land, under British mandate.

The only way for your analogy to be correct is if America WILLINGLY gave back land to the native americans. And guess what, they have.

Heard of "Indian Nation" before?

Besides being utterly confused by the input of the UN in this matter (Did you want to type US instead of UN?)
some rewriting might be in order before we can accurately respond to your statements unless you want miscommunication to occur (And respond in colorfull language such as the fesces of the male bovine).

However I find your argument of (and do say if I misunderstood you) the United States not being able to give back land to the native Americans rather odd.

You seem to implicitly conclude that people belonging to a community that have no defined goverment or borders to be ripe for conquest. I hope you can agree with me that such a statement is absurd. Before the colonisation, North America was entirely inhabited by its native people. To put it more bluntly, they were there before the Europeans.

Indeed im stating the obvious here and Ill just have to assume I misunderstood you.

PS: This was merely an objective input upon the matter. I didn't give any opinion upon the matter of the Native American plight and fate this day. Even though their history of the last centuries is undeniably a very tragic one, it would still be very unpragmatic to return the orginal lands of the Indian tribes today.

So if that's what happened, why doesn't god blow up the filthy monster arabs that dare call themselves "humans"?

I don't want to argue about the evidence of historical occurrences in Israel because they aren't important. For now, I'm just assuming that everything in the old testament is an accurate portrayal of what actually happened in history. The thing I don't understand is how people can be willing to die for the ability to call Israel home.

The only argument I can get from people is that so many events reportedly occurred in Israel that it makes the land itself holy. My question is how that is possible. If God created the entire world, which again I am not debating the Old Testament, how can any piece of land be any more holy than any other? By saying that one piece of land is better is to say that God's craftsmanship was sub par in certain areas. Others report that conversing with God in Israel is easier. Well, if God is omnipotent, I have a tough time buying that God would be hard of hearing unless the person trying to speak to him was in Israel.

So if the land isn't anymore holy than say, North Dakota, and God is capable of hearing people anywhere, why can't people just remember the stories and lessons the bible teaches, and stop fighting over a piece of land where war has been on-going for ages?

"Israel" which is really Palestine is holy to Muslims because the Al-Aqsa Mosque is in the holy city of Jerusalem. This is where the Prophet Muhammed accended to heaven. Jerusalem should never, and will never be given up to the Christians or Jews without a fight by Muslims everywhere.

I've got a feeling it's important to the Israelis because for centuries they had no land to call their own. During that time they were abused and even almost exterminated. Everyone abused them and they had no place to turn to. Now they have a homeland. They have a place that is their own that they can go to or ask for help if they're attacked. Given the long history of antisemitism in much of the world I can see why they cherish such a place.

In 2 and a half lines of text, you hit the nail right on the head.

"Israel" which is really Palestine is holy to Muslims because the Al-Aqsa Mosque is in the holy city of Jerusalem. This is where the Prophet Muhammed accended to heaven. Jerusalem should never, and will never be given up to the Christians or Jews without a fight by Muslims everywhere.

LOL. You always make me laugh.

Guess what? Jordan decided to enter the 1967 war after Israel told them that they wouldn't be touched. The Muslims already gave up Jerusalem with a fight in which they got their asses handed to them despite the fact they heavily outnumbered the Jews.

Oh yeah, that was 2 years before the US authorized arms sales to Israel (that didn't happen unil 69). So you can't blame that one on the US. Blame it on Egypt and Syria for mobilizing for an attack on Israel and blockading the Straights of Tiran.

Come to think of it, its a rather small piece of land. Why die for earth marked within illusionary boundaries?

Probably because far fewer Jews have died fighting for Israel than died living under the rule of Europeans.

The Zionist movement itself was a response to the anti-semitism observed in Europe during the shameful trial of Alfred Dreyfuss.
And the rise of romantic nationalism in the German States. Some German Jews wanted to be part of that Germany and found themselves being excluded, so their romantic nationalism took a different direction.

Funny that, really. The root of the Nazi movement is the same as the root of the Zionist movement. :p

Zionism is rooted in the Pale region of Czarist Russia (where the members of the 1st Aliyah came from) and the anti-semitism of France. Theodor Herzl, the founder of Modern Zionism, started the movement after he observed the people of Paris yelling "Kill the Jews" during the Dreyfus trial. The Germans didn't begin to make Aliyah and buy into Zionism until the 20th century.

I don't want to argue about the evidence of historical occurrences in Israel because they aren't important. For now, I'm just assuming that everything in the old testament is an accurate portrayal of what actually happened in history. The thing I don't understand is how people can be willing to die for the ability to call Israel home.

The only argument I can get from people is that so many events reportedly occurred in Israel that it makes the land itself holy. My question is how that is possible. If God created the entire world, which again I am not debating the Old Testament, how can any piece of land be any more holy than any other? By saying that one piece of land is better is to say that God's craftsmanship was sub par in certain areas. Others report that conversing with God in Israel is easier. Well, if God is omnipotent, I have a tough time buying that God would be hard of hearing unless the person trying to speak to him was in Israel.

So if the land isn't anymore holy than say, North Dakota, and God is capable of hearing people anywhere, why can't people just remember the stories and lessons the bible teaches, and stop fighting over a piece of land where war has been on-going for ages?

It's not that the land is more holy than another; God promised Jews the land in his first covenant with Abraham.

The Germans didn't begin to make Aliyah and buy into Zionism until the 20th century.
But then, that immigration had little to do with the political Zionism that led to the creation of Israel. It was a personal journey, not a political one.

And to deny the pretty obvious connection between romantic nationalism (not just in Germany) is sorta unnecessary. It doesn't take anything away from it.

Most Zionism was a reaction to anti-semitism. Those who left for Israel didn't really do so for religious reasons. It was more of attempting to escape pogroms.

It is no coincidence that the number of Jews in Israel rose as pogroms became more and more frequent.

Most Zionism was a reaction to anti-semitism.
Which is true. But nonetheless, on the political (and cultural) level the influence of romantic nationalism is clearly visible.

Which is true. But nonetheless, on the political (and cultural) level the influence of romantic nationalism is clearly visible.

Among some, that would be the case. When you look at Zionism in the big picture, it was a way to ensure safety from repeated pogroms, attempts at genocide, and just general anti-semitism.

As unsafe as Israel is today, the Jews there are safer than they were at any time during the Diaspara. Even if you add up Israel's total war dead since 1947, I bet more Jews were killed during any 60 year period of their time in Europe.

Oh yeah, and when it comes to political movements, Marxism probably had the largest role in the creation of Israel. Realize that Ben Gurion himself was a Socialist. The Kibbutz movement is probably one of the few cases where Socialism has actually survived. Now it is beginning to falter. The Kibbutzim today aren't as successful as they once were. They are selling off some of their unused land to developers for millions.

Israel is so important to the Jews because the Jews said so. Why was Israel so readily accepted as belonging to the Jews? Same reason anything else is accepted. Whenever they face disagreement, they say "Holocaust," and everyone rallies to kiss their asses.

Zionism is rooted in the Pale region of Czarist Russia (where the members of the 1st Aliyah came from) and the anti-semitism of France. Theodor Herzl, the founder of Modern Zionism, started the movement after he observed the people of Paris yelling "Kill the Jews" during the Dreyfus trial. The Germans didn't begin to make Aliyah and buy into Zionism until the 20th century.

zionism is the greatest evil the world has ever known.

I've got a feeling it's important to the Israelis because for centuries they had no land to call their own. During that time they were abused and even almost exterminated. Everyone abused them and they had no place to turn to. Now they have a homeland. They have a place that is their own that they can go to or ask for help if they're attacked. Given the long history of antisemitism in much of the world I can see why they cherish such a place.

Which is great and all. But the thing is they now have a homeland because they took over other peoples land and abused and drove out a whole heap of the locals. And now continue to do this to the non-people living in the west bank through the settlement program.

As unsafe as Israel is today, the Jews there are safer than they were at any time during the Diaspara.
Are you saying the Jews in America or Great Britain are not safe?


Even if you add up Israel's total war dead since 1947, I bet more Jews were killed during any 60 year period of their time in Europe.

So sicve 1947 more jews have been murdered in Europe than in Israel?

At any rate it is irrevelent when giving a reason why they should be able to take over a land inhabited by people who had/have nothing to do with Europe.

Because, according to the Bible, God intended Israel to be a "Promised Land" for the Jews. It's like their homeland, which they inhabited for hundreds of years, and is also where all their holiest shrines and such are.

then they had a king. then they crucified him. then they left thier land. then they used attempted genocide to accused attemping genocide.

Just an extra remark about that America, native american thing:

Israel wasn't fertile until the Jews started moving in and making it fertile. They invested in the land, and they were living in the land when the dual state solution was created in the 40's, so it's not like the land was just ripped from the Palestinians. And if they didn't want to lose their country, they shouldn't have tried to take Israel in the first place.

And what's with all the hate provoking topics???

Where's the love people, WHERE IS IT????
outside religion

Israel wasn't fertile until the Jews started moving in and making it fertile.Is that so? And even if, does that make the land theirs?

They invested in the land, and they were living in the land when the dual state solution was created in the 40's, so it's not like the land was just ripped from the Palestinians. And if they didn't want to lose their country, they shouldn't have tried to take Israel in the first place.Jews took Palestine from the Arabs in the first place, after the UN and the colonial powers ripped the land from the Palestinians/Arabs.

Israel wasn't fertile until the Jews started moving in and making it fertile. They invested in the land, and they were living in the land when the dual state solution was created in the 40's, so it's not like the land was just ripped from the Palestinians.

This is standard for when one race decides to take from another. The teach that the other race was inferior and had no use for the land and were wasting it before the 'enlightened' people came and did something useful. Regardless of how true it is.
Deny any achievement of the inferior race. Teach that they are inferior and do not deserve land because of their inferiority. Re-write history. Par for the course really.


And if they didn't want to lose their country, they shouldn't have tried to take Israel in the first place.
The creation of Israel took their country from many of them. The only way they could try to not lose their country was to defend themselves against the invaders.

in the old testiment, didnt they take thier holy kand off someone else?
vile bunch of people.

in the old testiment, didnt they take thier holy kand off someone else?
vile bunch of people.

This happens all the time - like the Anglo Saxons took the UK from the Celts.

I'm an anglo-saxon, celtic, russian, german, jewish, italian.

Where's my Save Haven?

Where's my parade?

Where's my holy land?

Who am I allowed to kick off their land because some ancestor of mine used to live there before they were booted off? - You anglo saxons! Damn you for your persecuation of my celtic people!

This happens all the time - like the Anglo Saxons took the UK from the Celts.

I'm an anglo-saxon, celtic, russian, german, jewish, italian.

Where's my Save Haven?

Where's my parade?

Where's my holy land?

Who am I allowed to kick off their land because some ancestor of mine used to live there before they were booted off? - You anglo saxons! Damn you for your persecuation of my celtic people!

i dont how you could claim to be a mix 6 groups. in that respect i could claim to be irish, french, scottish and german. but i dont. i was born on the island called ireland, and blood is mostly irish, thus i'm irish. some could argue german being the root.

if you are living in your ancestors land and another group are tyring to kick you out, they are in the wrong.

i am not anglo-saxon. i'm celtic.

Israel is so important to the Jews because the Jews said so. Why was Israel so readily accepted as belonging to the Jews? Same reason anything else is accepted. Whenever they face disagreement, they say "Holocaust," and everyone rallies to kiss their asses.
It's important because people like you try to commit genocide against us.

It's important because people like you try to commit genocide against us.

so take your anger out on my 'pals'?

Are you saying the Jews in America or Great Britain are not safe?


So sicve 1947 more jews have been murdered in Europe than in Israel?

At any rate it is irrevelent when giving a reason why they should be able to take over a land inhabited by people who had/have nothing to do with Europe.
Israel didn't take the land. England gave the land to the UN who split ownership of it.

The Palestinians were told they would be allowed to live in Israel. They responded to this by trying to exterminate the Jews once more along with 6 other Arab armies. The Palestinians lost their homes because they decided they would rather live in refugee camps than under the rule of a Jewish government.

BTW, there are over a million Arabs in Israel because some of them decided to ignore the Arab calls for them to leave the land. The Palestinians in refugee camps today are either there by choice or because their father/grandfather made that choice.

Is that so? And even if, does that make the land theirs?

Jews took Palestine from the Arabs in the first place, after the UN and the colonial powers ripped the land from the Palestinians/Arabs.

There is a Palestinian state, it's called Jordan. The Palestine Mandate was split in 2 by the British right after WWI. They used 80% of Palestine to form the Kingdom of Jordan.

The Jews didn't take a piece of land. Any land taken in war was taken because the Arabs have been trying to exterminate the Jews. They just suck at it.

T

The creation of Israel took their country from many of them. The only way they could try to not lose their country was to defend themselves against the invaders.

Do you care to enlighten me on what country got stolen. I don't think there ever was a country known as Palestine.

Israel didn't take the land. England gave the land to the UN who split ownership of it.

The Palestinians were told they would be allowed to live in Israel. They responded to this by trying to exterminate the Jews once more along with 6 other Arab armies. The Palestinians lost their homes because they decided they would rather live in refugee camps than under the rule of a Jewish government.

BTW, there are over a million Arabs in Israel because some of them decided to ignore the Arab calls for them to leave the land. The Palestinians in refugee camps today are either there by choice or because their father/grandfather made that choice.

oh so its ok to murder children then? i'm glad you cleared that up.

zionism is the greatest evil the world has ever known.

LOL. Yeah and Islam wasn't spread by the sword.:rolleyes:

oh so its ok to murder children then? i'm glad you cleared that up.

Israel doesn't murder children. When terrorists fire rockets from civilian areas, the responsibility for those deaths is placed on those who made the area a target (i.e. Hamas).

Now the Palestinians on the other hand try to target school buses, shopping malls, discos, and universities.

in the old testiment, didnt they take thier holy kand off someone else?
vile bunch of people.

Almost everyone took their land from someone else. All people are equally vile. The history of humanity is a story of war, conquest and oppression.

Israel doesn't murder children. When terrorists fire rockets from civilian areas, the responsibility for those deaths is placed on those who made the area a target (i.e. Hamas).

Now the Palestinians on the other hand try to target school buses, shopping malls, discos, and universities.

oh so israel have never fired bombs on beaches?
child refugee camps?

Almost everyone took their land from someone else. All people are equally vile. The history of humanity is a story of war, conquest and oppression.

through time, the idea of war, conquest and oprression should become more disgusting to civilised people.
disgust=e^t

my country was controlled by a foreign body. now we controll most of our island. the only group of people we have ever oppressed to my knowledge, were gays.

oh so israel have never fired bombs on beaches?
child refugee camps?

Show me proof Israel targets civilians.

The anti-semites here love to try to claim that Israeli s trying to commit genocide. Guess what? If what all of the bastards on this site claim to be true was, there would be no Palestinians left in the world after 48 hours.

As for some of the civlian deaths, misfires happen. The death toll also gets scewed by a few things.


The Palestinians have on many occassions refused to allow the Israelis to treat wounded in their more advanced hospitals.
The Israelis often suffer many more total casualties. Theirs are more likely to survive due to the skill of first responders.
Israel's wall has made it almost impossible for the Terrorists to strike.
All Hamas can do now is fire the Piece of Shit Qassams

oh so israel have never fired bombs on beaches?
child refugee camps?

What's a child refugee camp? I don't think there is such a thing. Refugee camps consist of all ages. Also Palestinian refugee camps are home to Hamas and other terrorists. If the militants didn't hide among the civilians the civilians wouldn't be in the line of fire. Still Israel tries to target their killings at terrorists rather than just carpet bombing towns. Israel makes some effort to kill only the enemy combatants. The Palestinian terrorists fire rockets randomly into towns or blow themselves up on busses and in shopping centers. In addition to all that there is plenty of evidence that the Palestinians fake their civilian casualty rates to gain public sympathy.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zTX3CZqDyOA

through time, the idea of war, conquest and oprression should become more disgusting to civilised people.
disgust=e^t

my country was controlled by a foreign body. now we controll most of our island. the only group of people we have ever oppressed to my knowledge, were gays.

And they are disgusting to civilised people. The Israelis have left Lebanon, Gaza, and were planning to dismantle some of their settlements on the west bank. They're civilised people. The Palestinians and Hezbollah have decided that they still want to play war. Rockets still rain down on Israeli towns.

It's important because people like you try to commit genocide against us.

Like the Jews never tried to commit genocide, or otherwise commit hate crimes. :rolleyes:

http://www.stsimonoftrent.com

Finally the torturers mitated the crucifixion by holding the twitching body upside down and the arms outstretched and during this horrible act they spoke the following:

Take this, crucified Jesus. Just as our forefathers did once, so may all Christians by land and sea perish.

BTW, there are over a million Arabs in Israel because some of them decided to ignore the Arab calls for them to leave the land. The Palestinians in refugee camps today are either there by choice or because their father/grandfather made that choice.

And Amnesty International, Human Rights Watch, and Desmond Tutu all say that those Arabs are being discriminated against.

Like the Jews never tried to commit genocide, or otherwise commit hate crimes. :rolleyes:

http://www.stsimonoftrent.comThat would be "homocide", not "genocide". Extrapolating genocide from an example of homocide is just damn stupid, especially if you have to dig back to the 15th century to find an example of it.

Like the Jews never tried to commit genocide, or otherwise commit hate crimes. :rolleyes:

http://www.stsimonoftrent.com

The blood libel?

This is the best you can come up with, events 600 years old that have basically been demonstrated time and time again to be absolutly historically false?

Really, the blood libel?

Blood libels against the Jews were a common form of anti-Semitism during the Middle Ages, though there is no ritual involving human blood in Jewish law or custom. Though the first recorded instance was in the writings of Apion, who claimed that the Jews sacrificed Greek victims in the Temple, there are no existent records of the blood libel against the Jews from that period until the legend surrounding William of Norwich in the 12th century, but the libel afterward became an increasingly common accusation. In many cases, anti-Semitic blood libels served as the basis for a blood libel cult, in which the alleged victim of human sacrifice was worshipped as a Christian martyr, but the claim has pre-Christian origins. Many Jews were killed as a result of false blood libels, which continued into the 20th century, with the Beilis Trial in Russia and the Kielce pogrom in Poland, and the persistence of blood libel stories in the Arab world.

Seriously, not only does this shit just make you look immensly bigoted, it doesn't make you look very smart. I used to have severe dislike for people like you, but then I realized you're just too stupid to even pick even a SLIGHTLY convincing argument. Elder Council of Zion, Jews control the media, SOMETHING...but a 600 year old blood libel? C'mon you can do better than that.

Like the Jews never tried to commit genocide, or otherwise commit hate crimes. :rolleyes:

http://www.stsimonoftrent.com

Still, Catholic Tradition teaches it is incumbent on every Catholic to oppose with all their energy World Jewry.
:rolleyes:

:headbang:

Oh well, LOL at site.

Like the Jews never tried to commit genocide, or otherwise commit hate crimes. :rolleyes:

http://www.stsimonoftrent.com

The blood libel? Can't you think of some new lies? You're demonstrating the same bigotry and racism found in the crazy extremist muslim fuckers from Iran.

Like the Jews never tried to commit genocide, or otherwise commit hate crimes. :rolleyes:

http://www.stsimonoftrent.com

In 1965, in the wake of the Second Vatican Council, the Catholic Church began to reinvestigate the story of Saint Simon and opened the trial records anew. Finally declaring the episode a fraud, the cult of Saint Simon was suppressed by Pope Paul VI and the shrine erected to him was dismantled. He was removed from the calendar, and his future veneration was forbidden, but some Catholics have ignored this suppression and continue to venerate the holy little boy of Trent.
Like you should pay more attention to the pronouncements from the Vatican. :rolleyes: Link (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Simon_of_Trent)

The blood libel? Can't you think of some new lies?

Beat you to it :p

Beat you to it :p

Must be a Jewish conspiracy.

Must be a Jewish conspiracy.

now give us your land!

Must be a Jewish conspiracy.I knew it! All those jolt hiccups couldn't be coincidence :mad:



:D

I knew it! All those jolt hiccups couldn't be coincidence :mad:



:D
'spose Jolt qualifies as media, doesn't it?

Must be a Jewish conspiracy.

now give us your land!

I knew it! All those jolt hiccups couldn't be coincidence :mad:

:D

I didn't even know Bill Clinton was Jewish! :eek: (Everything is Clinton's fault, remember?)

'spose Jolt qualifies as media, doesn't it?Indeed! Ariel Sharon isn't lying in a coma. He's in a secret Mossad base with his finger on a button that makes the forum go wonk whenever pressed!

Indeed! Ariel Sharon isn't lying in a coma. He's in a secret Mossad base with his finger on a button that makes the forum go wonk whenever pressed!
I thought the Israeli government performed a ritual to allow Ariel Sharon to ascend to a higher plane and exist as pure energy...

Indeed! Ariel Sharon isn't lying in a coma. He's in a secret Mossad base with his finger on a button that makes the forum go wonk whenever pressed!

Mel Gibson was right!

I thought the Israeli government performed a ritual to allow Ariel Sharon to ascend to a higher plane and exist as pure energy...

and then they celebrated by eatting a small christian child.

Mel Gibson was right!

About the Jews or about officer "Sugartits"?

and then they celebrated by eatting a small christian child....on a Sunday! :eek:

and then they celebrated by eatting a small christian child.
As WC Fields replied (in a movie) when asked if he liked children, "I do if they're properly cooked."

About the Jews or about officer "Sugartits"?
Well, I don't know the officer personally, so I can't say ...

Now I think of it, has anyone seen that BBC documentary on Hitler? (can't remember what it was called, a bit old) If so, anyone remember the scene where the singer sings the "Blame the Jews" song? :p

Now do people believe me when I say that NS is turning into stormfront?

Now do people believe me when I say that NS is turning into stormfront?

I was just kidding about that "Jewish conspiracy" thing.

I was just kidding about that "Jewish conspiracy" thing.

I wasn't referring to you. I know you support Israel.

I'm referring to 4th reich.

I don't want to argue about the evidence of historical occurrences in Israel because they aren't important. For now, I'm just assuming that everything in the old testament is an accurate portrayal of what actually happened in history. The thing I don't understand is how people can be willing to die for the ability to call Israel home.

The only argument I can get from people is that so many events reportedly occurred in Israel that it makes the land itself holy. My question is how that is possible. If God created the entire world, which again I am not debating the Old Testament, how can any piece of land be any more holy than any other? By saying that one piece of land is better is to say that God's craftsmanship was sub par in certain areas. Others report that conversing with God in Israel is easier. Well, if God is omnipotent, I have a tough time buying that God would be hard of hearing unless the person trying to speak to him was in Israel.

So if the land isn't anymore holy than say, North Dakota, and God is capable of hearing people anywhere, why can't people just remember the stories and lessons the bible teaches, and stop fighting over a piece of land where war has been on-going for ages?

The Temple of Jerusalem was/is? the footstool of the Lord as Heaven is his throne. Jerusalem is also the City of David. The land was given to the Israelites by divine order. There is a need for a Jewish homeland so that Jews will not be killed in another holocaust. Why not Israel? The answer to this is silence and "Yeah...but..." The answer to Why Israel? is a whole list of historical and religious reasons.

Since the establishment of Israel a lot of brave Israelis died and often in slow painful fashions at the hands of Muslim Tormentors to preserve Israel. The blood of these heroic martyrs are perhaps the most compelling answer to "Why Israel should be the homeland for the Jewish people?"

Also, there is a good political reason. Israel is an oasis of democracy in the middle of a horribly oppressive and totalitarian region. Hopefully, Iraq and Lebanon will emerge as liberal democracies and the region will be that much more democratic.

Another political reason is that Israel is our friend and ally and her enemies are often terrorists who should be fought, killed, or jailed at every opportunity.

Now do people believe me when I say that NS is turning into stormfront?How's this different from how things used to be?

The Temple of Jerusalem was/is? the footstool of the Lord as Heaven is his throne. <snip>.

Why does god need a footstool? In fact, he's god. Why does he even need feet? Can't he just, like, teleport or fly or something?

Why does god need a footstool? In fact, he's god. Why does he even need feet? Can't he just, like, teleport or fly or something?

"Why does G-d need a starship?" Captain James T. Kirk (sorry, had to get a Trek reference in there)

Just an extra remark about that America, native american thing:

Israel wasn't fertile until the Jews started moving in and making it fertile. They invested in the land, and they were living in the land when the dual state solution was created in the 40's, so it's not like the land was just ripped from the Palestinians. And if they didn't want to lose their country, they shouldn't have tried to take Israel in the first place.

Untrue. Present some numbers re agricultural production pre 1947 to support your claim or forever hold your peace.


Israel didn't take the land. England gave the land to the UN who split ownership of it..

Incorrect. The Brits did not "own" the land and the UN plan was rejected.


The Palestinians were told they would be allowed to live in Israel. They responded to this by trying to exterminate the Jews once more along with 6 other Arab armies. The Palestinians lost their homes because they decided they would rather live in refugee camps than under the rule of a Jewish government...

As I've refuted this a number of times now, in detail, in threads you were involved in, I have to say that you are now lying.


The Jews didn't take a piece of land. Any land taken in war was taken because the Arabs have been trying to exterminate the Jews. They just suck at it....

What percentage of land was owned by settlers in 1945/6? You may give the figure in thousands of dunum/acres owned if it suits you.


The anti-semites here ....

Not forgetting the ones in the BBC, CNN, Amnesty, HRW, Red Cross, UN and the secret bunker, plus the ones under the bed......


Israel makes some effort to kill only the enemy combatants....

"little" would be more accurate.


They're civilised people.....

Some of them are. Some of them operate a semi-apartheid system in the occupied territories. One should never generalise.

Why does god need a footstool? In fact, he's god. Why does he even need feet? Can't he just, like, teleport or fly or something?

I do not know. Go ask him.

i dont how you could claim to be a mix 6 groups.

My great grandparents come from an almost even mix of those six groups. Hence genealogically I am not one any more or less than I am the others.

e.g. - someone has a 'A' mum and a 'B' dad. They are fairly A,B (or B,A - whatever.

now - someone has an A,B mum and a C,D dad then their ancestory is evenly mixed between A,B,C and D - hence they are an A,B,C,D.

Personally I can't wait until 'Mutt' is an option on those forms that ask for race.

The Palestinians were told they would be allowed to live in Israel. They responded to this by trying to exterminate the Jews once more along with 6 other Arab armies. The Palestinians lost their homes because they decided they would rather live in refugee camps than under the rule of a Jewish government...

There was a huge campaign of terror and killings that ammounted to an attempt to drive the Palastinians out of Israel (and before Israel was officially created out of the area in which Israel would become). Whole villages were wiped out with systematic killings carried out by Jewish terrorist groups (which later became political parties, with some of their more prolific murderers eventually leading Israels government) with the aim of terrifying the Palastinian population and driving them off the land. Even after they were driven out of the boarders of Israe they are still attacked or punished - in Gaza, in the West Bank where the IDF and Settlers are TODAY acting to drive Palastinians off land that Israel wants to expand into. Not to mention attacks on refugee camps or even attacking entire third party countries to kill thousands of refugees in Lebanon - men, women and children/infants.

The land was given to the Israelites by divine order. Can I see that signed order please?

I do not know. Go ask him.

He told me to mind my own business and to tell everyone down here to quit bugging him with all those damn prayers.

The Jews have no right to Israel. If they are God's chosen people, then by all means, they have gone far astray. But they certainly don't have a right to Israel.

The Jews have no right to Israel. If they are God's chosen people, then by all means, they have gone far astray. But they certainly don't have a right to Israel.

Who's going to make them move? You?

Must be a Jewish conspiracy.

I know your kidding, but in reality you shouldn't underestimate what the jews are capable of.

Who's going to make them move? You?

The same God they crucified.

The same God they crucified.

And how will God accomplish this?

The same God they crucified.

He dead. Got nailed to a stick then stabbed through the heart. He's not doing anything ever again.

I know your kidding, but in reality you shouldn't underestimate what the jews are capable of.You shouldn't overestimate their capability or their uniformity either.

And how will God accomplish this?Iranian nuke.

You shouldn't overestimate their capability or their uniformity either.

*nods*

I'd say they are hardly of the same strength they were at 20 years ago. They do not have the collective will to fight wars anymore. Though I would hate to see anyone lauch another Yom Kippur war. I think they would still get their heads handed to them.

And how will God accomplish this?
By getting very angry and then sending them a letter in which He tells them just how angry He is.

By getting very angry and then sending them a letter in which He tells them just how angry He is.

I bet the Jews are real scared of that. ;)

Iranian nuke.

If one nuke goes off in Israel I'm pretty sure we won't ever need to worry about Iran again. That whole nation would be converted to radioactive glass. The only problem is that I think the Guardian council and Amadinejad are too stupid to realise that fact.

zionism is the greatest evil the world has ever known.

Some people in my opinion are a true and undiluted example of religious intolerance. Oh, but wait. She's a muslim. That's quite natural then. Way to represent your religion so accurately. Your 'Allah' would be proud.

Long live my Jewish brethern. And long live those who serve the Christ.

Some people in my opinion are a true and undiluted example of religious intolerance. Oh, but wait. She's a muslim. That's quite natural then. Way to represent your religion so accurately. Your 'Allah' would be proud.

Long live my Jewish brethern. And long live those who serve the Christ.

So what about atheists like me?

So what about atheists like me?You get angry letters too :D

Some people in my opinion are a true and undiluted example of religious intolerance. Oh, but wait. She's a muslim. That's quite natural then. Way to represent your religion so accurately. Your 'Allah' would be proud.

Long live my Jewish brethern. And long live those who serve the Christ.

I take it you don't like Muslims very much do you?

So what about atheists like me?

Athiests will become lower then the muslims. Not believing in a higher power leaves you cleaning NYC bathrooms with your tongue. Too low for much else. ;)

I take it you don't like Muslims very much do you?

I don't! I despise Muslims. And Jews. And Pagans. And Atheists. And Protestants. And I forgetting anyone?

I don't! I despise Muslims. And Jews. And Pagans. And Atheists. And Protestants. And I forgetting anyone?

You're angry. You need to go get laid.

You're angry. You need to go get laid.

I also despise women and homosexuals.

I don't! I despise Muslims. And Jews. And Pagans. And Atheists. And Protestants. And I forgetting anyone?

That's nice. If you had any real power or influence we'd despise you too.

But you don't. Your kind ended when Hitler blew his brains out. Good riddance, I say. :)

I also despise women and homosexuals.

That rules out most of your options. I guess there is always beastiality.

That rules out most of your options. I guess there is always beastiality.

Ew.

You're angry. You need to go get laid.

Or drunk.

That rules out most of your options. I guess there is always beastiality.

What about necrophilia? Maybe when the women are dead he will find them easier to deal with.

That rules out most of your options. I guess there is always beastiality.

LOL!

I don't! I despise Muslims. And Jews. And Pagans. And Atheists. And Protestants. And I forgetting anyone?Catholics that support the NO?

What about necrophilia? Maybe when the women are dead he will find them easier to deal with.

Well, the dead ones don't talk back or call the police when you punch them.

Catholics that support the NO?

Those too.

What about children? Does he hate children?

What about children? Does he hate children?

I really don't like children.

I really don't like children.I like children. Scrambled... Fried...

What about lemons? Do you hate those too?

I really don't like children.

Maybe you could tell us who you like.

Maybe you could tell us who you like.

I like puppies. They ish soooo cute! I just like to pet them and hug them and call them George... :p

I dunno. I think that this "Fourth Holy Reich" person is a bit too eloquent in his writing to be a puppet. Unless, of course, he begins to slip into a definite routine like MeansToAnEnd. However, I've not followed this one long enough, so I can't begin to place any sort of judgement.

Though he is a troll, and that's objective fact.

I like puppies. They ish soooo cute! I just like to pet them and hug them and call them George... :p

I'm getting a pitbull puppy in a couple of weeks. It's still too young to be separated from it's mother. I still haven't decided what to name it.

Why is Israel so important?

For the various people that live there, it's an integral part of their religion.
The U.S. supports Isreal because, as a whole, they believe the Hebrews are God's chosen people.
I think Isreal is highly compatible with the U.S. We should offer them a state of their choice. Get's us out of there, cheaper in the long run both in lives saved and money.

For the various people that live there, it's an integral part of their religion.
The U.S. supports Isreal because, as a whole, they believe the Hebrews are God's chosen people.
I think Isreal is highly compatible with the U.S. We should offer them a state of their choice. Get's us out of there, cheaper in the long run both in lives saved and money.

Israel is the only thing close to a dependable ally in the area. Not Muslim also so is another plus to the government. And has been fighting the extremism just like we have. Doesn't that make us natural friends in the view of our leaders?

Israel is the only thing close to a dependable ally in the area. Not Muslim also so is another plus to the government. And has been fighting the extremism just like we have. Doesn't that make us natural friends in the view of our leaders?

We helped establish Israel because our religion in the U.S. says the Israelites are God's chosen people. I don't think that was correct. It would be correct to offer them a U.S. state of their choice.
Islam is incompatible with our western values. We should have nothing more to do with them until they evolve into a religion that doesn't advocate killing and torturing everyone who doesn't subscribe to their religion.
I'm not defending Christianity here.

Because without it we will be killed.

Israel is the only thing close to a dependable ally in the area. Not Muslim also so is another plus to the government. And has been fighting the extremism just like we have. Doesn't that make us natural friends in the view of our leaders?

So non Muslims are a plus?

Because without it we will be killed.

who is we?

Why is Israel so important?


wrong question..." Why insnt it so important " is much better .

So non Muslims are a plus?
None of the Muslim governments in the area are particularly... agreeable. Israel has its faults, but it's better than Iran or Saudi Arabia. It's nice to have an ally in a place where all the other nations hate us.

None of the Muslim governments in the area are particularly... agreeable. Israel has its faults, but it's better than Iran or Saudi Arabia. It's nice to have an ally in a place where all the other nations hate us.

they hate us because the US supports Israel smart guy. And Saudi Arabia is as good an ally as any other. The US gets oil, Saudi Arabia gets money and government security.

they hate us because the US supports Israel smart guy. And Saudi Arabia is as good an ally as any other. The US gets oil, Saudi Arabia gets money and government security.
And they would happily bomb Israel into oblivion if the US wasn't supporting it and if Israel didn't have nuclear weapons. All the more reason to back Israel up. The alliance with Saudi Arabis is an alliance of necessity. The Saudis are hardly the sort the US would/should be allying itself with if there was no oil.

they hate us because the US supports Israel smart guy. And Saudi Arabia is as good an ally as any other.
Iran hates for our support for the Shah, and their lifetime enemy Iraq as well as Israel.

The US gets oil, Saudi Arabia gets money and government security.
Where does all that money go to?
Terrorists, and an oppressive autocratic regime.

The jews piss me off, so what if they lived there ages ago, soon theyll have the same claim to Jew York, germany and other places. I dont give a shit about the holocaust and I dont give a shit about their claim to the middle east, fuck zionism

And they would happily bomb Israel into oblivion if the US wasn't supporting it and if Israel didn't have nuclear weapons. All the more reason to back Israel up. The alliance with Saudi Arabis is an alliance of necessity. The Saudis are hardly the sort the US would/should be allying itself with if there was no oil.


With what? They dont have enough people willing to strap bombs to themselves (not to mention they dont have any air force, artillery, bombs, stupid muslims bahahahha nuke the middle east)

*has not read entire thread*

It's important to Jews because it represents a place where they are numerous and strong enough to be authors of their own destiny - a power that has been lacking for most of Jewish history, with unfortunate results.

Also, it is a cultural and religious centre with amazing diversity. You can find pretty much whatever your looking for there culture and identity-wise. Home.

With what? They dont have enough people willing to strap bombs to themselves (not to mention they dont have any air force, artillery, bombs, stupid muslims bahahahha nuke the middle east)

Educate yourself.

Jane's reported that the Army was commanded via three army level headquarters with 10 divisions[3]. The IISS reports that there were four armoured, and six infantry divisions, two commando divisions, plus an airborne brigade.[4] Often reported formations include the 23rd Special Forces Division, established in 1993-1994, and the 55th Paratroop Division. One source reports that the 23rd Special Forces Division is amongst the most professional units in the Iranian Army, with 5,000 regulars soldiers and strictly no conscripts.

The regular armoured divisions are sub-divided into three brigades.

The regular army also has a number of independent brigades and groups, though there is almost no reliable data on the size and number of these smaller independent formations. These include one logistics brigade, an infantry brigade, an airborne brigade, special forces (Takavar) brigades, and five artillery brigades/regiments. There are also coastal defense units, a growing number of air defense groups, between four and six army aviation units, and a growing number of logistics and supply formations.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islamic_Republic_of_Iran_Army

With what? They dont have enough people willing to strap bombs to themselves (not to mention they dont have any air force, artillery, bombs, stupid muslims bahahahha nuke the middle east)
What Pyotr said.

And they would happily bomb Israel into oblivion if the US wasn't supporting it and if Israel didn't have nuclear weapons.

why is that a bad thing?

The alliance with Saudi Arabis is an alliance of necessity. The Saudis are hardly the sort the US would/should be allying itself with if there was no oil.

They are still an ally. I don't like this claim that because the country is mostly Muslim, that they are not an ally of the US.

why is that a bad thing?

hundreds of thousands, if not millions of innocent people would die.

Why is Israel so important?

It isn't, it's really a rather crappy piece of land. Deluded people just think it's important.

Yes, I'm sure someone will find that offensive. I don't care. I'm sick of all these people fighting so viciously over a tiny patch of dirt.


Oh, and your first post analysis was pretty spot on, in my opinion.

You're angry. You need to go get laid.
He needs something else to happen to him. I can't say it because it would get me banned.

We helped establish Israel because our religion in the U.S. says the Israelites are God's chosen people. I don't think that was correct. It would be correct to offer them a U.S. state of their choice.
Islam is incompatible with our western values. We should have nothing more to do with them until they evolve into a religion that doesn't advocate killing and torturing everyone who doesn't subscribe to their religion.
I'm not defending Christianity here.

The US did nothing to help establish Israel. The US had almost nothing to do with it. All we did was vote for partition, which almost every nation did. Only 2 non-Islamic countries vetoed parititon.

You know jack shit about Israeli history.

The jews piss me off, so what if they lived there ages ago, soon theyll have the same claim to Jew York, germany and other places. I dont give a shit about the holocaust and I dont give a shit about their claim to the middle east, fuck zionism

Now does everyone here see what I mean?

NS is being overrun with Nazis who belong on fucking stormfront,

You know who I'm talking about

East of Eden is Nod, Soviestan, OcceanDrive, Ikfaldu, Fourth Reich, etc.

They just use anti-zionism to hide anti-semitism.

Now does everyone here see what I mean?

NS is being overrun with Nazis who belong on fucking stormfront,

You know who I'm talking about

East of Eden is Nod, Soviestan, OcceanDrive, Ikfaldu, Fourth Reich, etc.

They just use anti-zionism to hide anti-semitism.


"Have you ever thought someone was racist, and then realized that maybe they weren't racist at all, you were just being an asshole."

Oceandrive a Nazi? Lmao, that's ridiculous.

"Have you ever thought someone was racist, and then realized that maybe they weren't racist at all, you were just being an asshole."

Oceandrive a Nazi? Lmao, that's ridiculous.

OcceanDrive is ceratainly anti-semitic. He has made posts about how the Jews control the media and uses Al-Manar as a source in his threads against Israel.

OcceanDrive is ceratainly anti-semitic. He has made posts about how the Jews control the media and uses Al-Manar as a source in his threads against Israel.

Pathologically anti-semitic? Yes.


National Socialist? No.

Pathologically anti-semitic? Yes.


National Socialist? No.

Noted.

But regardless, when you see the vicious anti-semites out there, I think you can't really argue with Israel's existance. Israel exists so the Jews are protected from some of the psychos out there who have no qualms with acting out their hatred. History has proven that time and time again.

Noted.

But regardless, when you see the vicious anti-semites out there, I think you can't really argue with Israel's existance. Israel exists so the Jews are protected from some of the psychos out there who have no qualms with acting out their hatred. History has proven that time and time again.

I would love to believe that we have overcome that madness. But yes, people like that seem to demonstrate otherwise; The west has suffered a general regression in regards to religious tolerance lately.

hundreds of thousands, if not millions of innocent people would die.

Arent we talking about Israelis?

Arent we talking about Israelis?
:rolleyes:
Anyway, if Israel got bombed lots of Palestinians would get hit too.

Arent we talking about Israelis?

Oh for the love of....

:rolleyes:
Anyway, if Israel got bombed lots of Palestinians would get hit too.

Given Arab actions in regards to Palestine, I think they wouldn't mind sacrifising them if the Jews got killed.

The Palestinians have just been the pawns of the Arab States.

Soviestan's posts here have answered the question posed by the title.

Israel is important because it gives the Jews a nation and army to fight back against genocidal maniacs who have been trying to wipe us out for milenia.

Now does everyone here see what I mean?

NS is being overrun with Nazis who belong on fucking stormfront,

You know who I'm talking about

East of Eden is Nod, Soviestan, OcceanDrive, Ikfaldu, Fourth Reich, etc.

They just use anti-zionism to hide anti-semitism.

East of Eden is Nod got deleted I believe. And none of the people you mentioned (including myself) are anything close to Nazis. I have never advocated a master race, aryan superiority, or any other bs.

Soviestan's posts here have answered the question posed by the title.

Israel is important because it gives the Jews a nation and army to fight back against genocidal maniacs who have been trying to wipe us out for milenia

if Israel really does protect jews, why doesnt every jew in the world including yourself live there so can protect yourself against, as you put it, genocidal maniacs.

The Palestinians have just been the pawns of the Arab States.

sad but true. Thats one thing I can agree with you on.

OcceanDrive is ceratainly anti-semitic. He has made posts about how the Jews control the media and uses Al-Manar as a source in his threads against Israel.


There's more to national socialism than hating Jewish people. You also have to hate gays, communists, gypsies, democracy, etc.

The US did nothing to help establish Israel. The US had almost nothing to do with it. All we did was vote for partition, which almost every nation did. Only 2 non-Islamic countries vetoed parititon.

You know jack shit about Israeli history.

Okay. I stand corrected. What is it I need to know?

why is that a bad thing?

Love or hate Israel's government, there's no reason its people should be killed.

They are still an ally. I don't like this claim that because the country is mostly Muslim, that they are not an ally of the US.

The religious demographics are irrelevant. The Saudis support terrorism, thus, they are not a dependable ally.

He needs something else to happen to him. I can't say it because it would get me banned.

What, a wedgie? :D

I don't! I despise Muslims. And Jews. And Pagans. And Atheists. And Protestants. And I forgetting anyone?

You're forgetting Catholics, unless you intended to leave them out. I'm Catholic.

And no, I don't like Muslims.

You're forgetting Catholics, unless you intended to leave them out. I'm Catholic.

And no, I don't like Muslims.

TFHR is a Catholic.

if Israel really does protect jews, why doesnt every jew in the world including yourself live there so can protect yourself against, as you put it, genocidal maniacs.

Maybe for theses reasons:

1 - They don't all want to be attacked by some religious zealot wearing a towel on his head.

2 - They dont all live near by and transporting them to Israel is a little unpractical.

3 - Moving them all to Israel would only create a giant bullseye for your intolerance.

4 - Nationalism creates a bond between their country and weakens the bond to the Holy Land.

5 - If all the Jews in all the lands came together, they would own you. And that's just no fun.

And on a personal note. I <3 Jews. Catholics have Jews back anyday. Oh ya, and you know, some people have lives other than their faith and don't devote their entire existance towards criticizing others because of their own inherit intolerances towards other nationalities and religions.

Maybe you should get one of those thingies... what are they called? Oh yes, I remember!

Maybe you should get a life.

Peace be with you.

Maybe for theses reasons:

1 - They don't all want to be attacked by some religious zealot wearing a towel on his head.
A beach towel or a bath towel? :rolleyes: Minus the towel part however, I think that's pretty true for me. From what my (Isreali) friends have told me, Isreal is a beutiful country but I don't even want to visit there because I'm afraid of being caught in the crossfire.

I'm probably the only Jew that isn't 100% backing Israel (my friend Tamar doesn't think that is possible and we have had arguements about it); it runs in the family. My Dad was so disgusted by being taught "Israeli propaganda" in his Hebrew classes when he was younger that he's now pretty much an atheist.

In my opinion both the Israeli governments and Palestinian governments are pawns. The Israelis of neo-cons and Christian fundamentalists waiting for the rapture. :rolleyes: The Palestinians of Islamic Fundamentalists who use anti-Israel support to keep the people in their countries from realizing how badly they are being treated. Them realizing that truth will be the first step toward peace, the others will be much harder.

Also Jews do control the media in the form of the companies: Viachim, General Elechtrich, Desni, and Timiem Warner. ;)

A beach towel or a bath towel? :rolleyes: Minus the towel part however, I think that's pretty true for me. I'm too scared to even visit Israel and get caught in the crossfire. Some of my best friends are Israeli and they left because they didn't like the chaos either.

I'm probably the only Jew that isn't 100% backing Israel; it runs in the family. My Dad was so disgusted by being taught "Israeli propaganda" in his Hebrew classes when he was younger that he's now pretty much an atheist.

In my opinion both the Israelis and Palestinians are pawns. The Israelis of neo-cons and Christian fundamentalists waiting for the rapture. :rolleyes: The Palestinians of Islamic Fundamentalists who use anti-Israel support to keep the people in their countries from realizing how badly they are being treated. Them realizing that truth will be the first step toward peace, the others will be much harder.

Also Jews do control the media in the form of the companies: Viachim, General Elechtrich, Desni, and Timiem Warner. ;)A naive kid like you should watch out wandering the internet.

But anyway, here's something to harden you up a bit: I'm a Jew, I'm an atheist, and I supposrt Israel far less that 100%. So your dad's not alone and neither are you. About the pawn issue, I suggest to you that Israelis have more votes in Israel than Christian fundamentalists and neo-cons do. And before you scrounge one up, let me just remind you that yes, conspiracy theories are lame.

A naive kid like you should watch out wandering the internet.
I think what he was saying is that both sides have their maniacs, which is certainly true.

The difference is probably that on one side the maniacs are in government, and on the other...oh, damn. I forgot (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yisrael_Beytenu).

;)

I'm probably the only Jew that isn't 100% backing Israel

Not exactly. Here's another. And there are lots more.

I think what he was saying is that both sides have their maniacs, which is certainly true.

The difference is probably that on one side the maniacs are in government, and on the other...oh, damn. I forgot (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yisrael_Beytenu).

;)I chalk it up to Russians drinking too much.

No but seriously, they are nuts. Oh well, they were given a pretty narrow profile (IIRC) in the coalition, so I don't expect anything outlandish. Mind you, that govenment is in a fucking mess, so I really expect nothing but paralysis at this point.

Not exactly. Here's another. And there are lots more.QFT

Israel is the only thing close to a dependable ally in the area.

Excatly how is Israel Americas ally?

I see how America is Israels ally - but when in the last 50 years as Israel sent troops or financial help to help America in any conflict that America has gotten involved with?

I bet the Jews are real scared of that. ;)

Until the lawyer goes through it at least.

So, the Hebrews wrote a book some 2700 years ago that said their god gave them Israel, and people are still dying for it now? I wonder what bit of religious propaganda from the last couple of centuries people wil be killing each other over 3 millennia from now? I expect by then they'll have forgotten that L Ron Hubbard was a sci fi writer and will have elevated him to a prophet. But hopefully the human race might have grown up a little by then.

3,000 years from now, scientologists will be fighting over Holy volcanoes of course.

wow. someone who's been here since 2002 but only has 3 post. weird.

Excatly how is Israel Americas ally?

I see how America is Israels ally - but when in the last 50 years as Israel sent troops or financial help to help America in any conflict that America has gotten involved with?

They send us jewelers. Ever been to the diamond district in Manhattan when work lets out at 5pm? LOL

:rolleyes:
Anyway, if Israel got bombed lots of Palestinians would get hit too.

I get it. Every dark cloud has a silver lining. Kidding, don't get all uptight.

I get it. Every dark cloud has a silver lining. Kidding, don't get all uptight.
lol

Excatly how is Israel Americas ally?

I see how America is Israels ally - but when in the last 50 years as Israel sent troops or financial help to help America in any conflict that America has gotten involved with?

Thats generally how those people are. They will take all the help you give them, but when it comes time for them to help you, they back out of it. Don't be fooled.

i would like to point out to all the "holocaust gives us accuse to kill people" people. hitler said that the only race that could match the power of the *aryans was the jews. which is why he wanted them dead. not saying that was a good reason. but think about it. no jews, no israel.

*hitlers version of what an aryan was.

i would like to point out to all the "holocaust gives us accuse to kill people" people. hitler said that the only race that could match the power of the *aryans was the jews. which is why he wanted them dead. not saying that was a good reason. but think about it. no jews, no israel.

*hitlers version of what an aryan was.


I've no fucking idea what thats meant to be about. Which is possibly good.

I've no fucking idea what thats meant to be about. Which is possibly good.

read mein kampf plus hitlers speaches.

i would like to point out to all the "holocaust gives us accuse to kill people" people. hitler said that the only race that could match the power of the *aryans was the jews. which is why he wanted them dead. not saying that was a good reason. but think about it. no jews, no israel.

*hitlers version of what an aryan was.

Wow. You're so intelligent! You even managed to misuse 'accuses!'

The word you were looking for is 'excuses.' And, no. Hitler did not say that. That would go against his very core values. And, without the Jews, the Muslims would just find some other religion to target.

So your theory dies right where it began. So there would be an 'Israel,' but in the sense that Israel is only used to describe a track of land that religiously intolerant Zealots invade, or bombard from the safety of dark ally ways in the name of their 'Allah.'

Yours Cordially,
Vheschenstein.

Thats generally how those people are. They will take all the help you give them, but when it comes time for them to help you, they back out of it. Don't be fooled.

Generally how those people are? Wow. Well hey, if you wanna throw around generalizations... then so be it. And, I do believe Israeli forces have on occasion aided us in the past 50 years.

But hell, we gave weapons to Iraq to repell the Soviets... and look what they did? So with that logic... I should assume that's how 'those people', aka Muslims, generally are.

Savvy?

With deep Love,
The Catholic.

The word you were looking for is 'excuses.' And, no. Hitler did not say that. That would go against his very core values. And, without the Jews, the Muslims would just find some other religion to target.
Thats a lie and you know it. Muslims do not target other religions.

So your theory dies right where it began. So there would be an 'Israel,' but in the sense that Israel is only used to describe a track of land that religiously intolerant Zealots invade, or bombard from the safety of dark ally ways in the name of their 'jewish god.'

fixed

Muslims don't target other religions?

Who are you kidding? Don't give me that 'muslims-are-peaceful' bullcrap that the left wing media feeds to the people. That's bitter ignorance that defies the factual occurances that your religious bretheren have committed in the name of your faith.

Even your religious texts command that your faithful kill the infidel.

With distrust,
The Catholic.

Thats a lie and you know it. Muslims do not target other religions.
QUOTE]
So your theory dies right where it began. So there would be an 'Israel,' but in the sense that Israel is only used to describe a track of land that religiously intolerant Zealots invade, or bombard from the safety of dark ally ways in the name of their 'jewish god.'[/QUOTE]

fixed

Dont quote me and change a few words in my sentences to write it off as your genious. Oh, and don't call me a liar. You don't even know me. Also, learn how to tag things correctly.

Muslims don't target other religions?

Who are you kidding? Don't give me that 'muslims-are-peaceful' bullcrap that the left wing media feeds to the people. That's bitter ignorance that defies the factual occurances that your religious bretheren have committed in the name of your faith.

Even your religious texts command that your faithful kill the infidel.

With distrust,
The Catholic.

Ah, I see, Muslims are dangerous because

A.) there are people who are committing crimes who claim that Islam is the motivation for these crimes

and

B.) the Qur'an states that muslims should kill people of other religions

Now lets apply this to christianity

A.) the Lord's Resistance Army is committing crimes, and they claim that christianity is the motivation for these said crimes

B.) Certain men, the children of Belial, are gone out from among you, and have withdrawn the inhabitants of their city, saying, Let us go and serve other gods, which ye have not known; (13:12-17)
If you hear of a city where another god is worshiped, then destroy everyone in the city (even the cattle) and burn it down.

13:14 Then shalt thou enquire, and make search, and ask diligently; and, behold, if it be truth, and the thing certain, that such abomination is wrought among you;
13:15 Thou shalt surely smite the inhabitants of that city with the edge of the sword, destroying it utterly, and all that is therein, and the cattle thereof, with the edge of the sword.

13:1 If there arise among you a prophet, or a dreamer of dreams, and giveth thee a sign or a wonder,
13:5 And that prophet, or that dreamer of dreams, shall be put to death; because he hath spoken to turn you away from the LORD your God, which brought you out of the land of Egypt, and redeemed you out of the house of bondage, to thrust thee out of the way which the LORD thy God commanded thee to walk in. So shalt thou put the evil away from the midst of thee.

13:6 If thy brother, the son of thy mother, or thy son, or thy daughter, or the wife of thy bosom, or thy friend, which is as thine own soul, entice thee secretly, saying, Let us go and serve other gods, which thou hast not known, thou, nor thy fathers; (13:6-10)
13:7 Namely, of the gods of the people which are round about you, nigh unto thee, or far off from thee, from the one end of the earth even unto the other end of the earth;
13:9 But thou shalt surely kill him; thine hand shall be first upon him to put him to death, and afterwards the hand of all the people.
13:10 And thou shalt stone him with stones, that he die; because he hath sought to thrust thee away from the LORD thy God, which brought thee out of the land of Egypt, from the house of bondage.

Thats generally how those people are. They will take all the help you give them, but when it comes time for them to help you, they back out of it. Don't be fooled.

You can take this post and go shove it up your ass.

That's bitter ignorance that defies the factual occurances that your religious bretheren have committed in the name of your faith.
Pot. Kettle. Black. I suggest you look in the mirror

Even your religious texts command that your faithful kill the infidel.
says the man who has probably never even seen a Qur'an. You should just stop talking now, your making yourself look bad.

You can take this post and go shove it up your ass.

your just angry because its true.

your just angry because its true.

Israel is a good ally to the US.

The only reason the Israelis never get involved in the wars is that the US requests that they don't because it would destroy any chance of Arab support. Why is that? Because their nations are filled with intolerant biggots like yourself.

Israel has given the US a ton of military technology.

I want you to uninstall Windows XP, remove your Pentium chip, destroy your cell phone, stop taking many medicines, uninstall AIM, and most other modern devices. Why? Because they were developed by either Israelis or other Jews. You aren't worthy of using anything developed by my people. Why don't you join the radical bigots you support and go back to the stone age.

Pot. Kettle. Black. I suggest you look in the mirror


says the man who has probably never even seen a Qur'an. You should just stop talking now, your making yourself look bad.

It sure as hell seems like you interpret it that way. You hate the Jews. No wonder you converted to Islam.

Because they were developed by either Israelis or other Jews. You aren't worthy of using anything developed by my people. Why don't you join the radical bigots you support and go back to the stone age.
Hehe, trying hard to take credit for other people's work, are you?

Israel is a good ally to the US.

The only reason the Israelis never get involved in the wars is that the US requests that they don't because it would destroy any chance of Arab support. Why is that? Because their nations are filled with intolerant biggots like yourself.

oh I wasnt talking about only Israelis.
the US has given Israel a ton of military technology.
fixed.

I want you to uninstall Windows XP, remove your Pentium chip, destroy your cell phone, stop taking many medicines, uninstall AIM, and most other modern devices. Why? Because they were developed by either Israelis or other Jews. You aren't worthy of using anything developed by my people. Why don't you join the radical bigots you support and go back to the stone age.
windows wasnt develop by a jew and I don't use any the other things. Even if the jew did create a whole bunch of technology, which isnt true but lets just pretend it is, they wouldn't have been able to do so without math. And who perfected math and numbers? Muslims. Try again.

Soviestan, if you hate the Jews so much, give yourself a nice shot of Polio. After all, it is a Jew who created the vaccination for that disease.

It sure as hell seems like you interpret it that way. You hate the Jews. No wonder you converted to Islam.

The only reason I converted to Islam is because Islam is truth and pure. My feelings about the jew had no impact one way or the other.

oh I wasnt talking about only Israelis. Talking about all Jews?

fixed.
UAVs, Python V, etc The US has gotten a ton from Israel.

windows wasnt develop by a jew and I don't use any the other things. Even if the jew did create a whole bunch of technology, which isnt true but lets just pretend it is, they wouldn't have been able to do so without math. And who perfected math and numbers? Muslims. Try again.

Windows XP, the Pentium IV, cell phones, ICQ (Instant Messenging), CT scans, MRIs, etc are all from Jews or Israelis.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Jewish_inventors


Here is a list of inventors and inventions which you don't deserve to use unless you want to be a hipocrite.

http://www.homestead.com/prosites-prs/Israel.html

The only reason I converted to Islam is because Islam is truth and pure. My feelings about the jew had no impact one way or the other.
Dude, that's ridiculous. From what you have presented on NSG, your understanding of Islam is limited to "hate teh Jewz0rz!!1!".

You're trying to shock, and congratulations, you have managed. Perhaps now is the time to quit while you're ahead and leave religion to religious people.

And IDF, what's with the invention talk? Don't you want to use all the inventions Germans created?

Welcome to the Dark Age Soviestan. Since you seem to want to boycott Jews, I expect you will not be using any of those inventions.

Dude, that's ridiculous. From what you have presented on NSG, your understanding of Islam is limited to "hate teh Jewz0rz!!1!".

You're trying to shock, and congratulations, you have managed. Perhaps now is the time to quit while you're ahead and leave religion to religious people.

And IDF, what's with the invention talk? Don't you want to use all the inventions Germans created?
I never said I would boycott Germany. I will boycott individual companies such as VW, Bayer, and others which had Nazi ties, but not other companies.

I never said I would boycott Germany. I will boycott individual companies such as VW, Bayer, and others which had Nazi ties, but not other companies.
Do you like Fanta? :p

EDIT: Oh, and does that only go for German companies, or do you also refuse to use IBM products for example?

I never said I would boycott Germany. I will boycott individual companies such as VW, Bayer, and others which had Nazi ties, but not other companies.

ROFL! That was 60 years ago, isnt time to move on? I doubt VW or Bayer are being run by Nazis.

Pot. Kettle. Black. I suggest you look in the mirror


says the man who has probably never even seen a Qur'an. You should just stop talking now, your making yourself look bad.

No, I've seen one. I just don't care for that particular corrupt version of the Torah.

I never claimed the full population of our Faithful in the Roman Catholic church are peace loving people. Some get angry and turn to terrorist activities, but we'll deal with that without your help on pointing that out. We already knew.

"...your making yourself look bad," says the person who can't spell "you're" correctly.

Why Pyotr are you quoting the Old Testiment? You should know the New Testiment supercedes that. My! What a concept. Jesus, our Christ, said to Love our enemies, not to kill them.

But personally, I would have no problem with destroying a militant town of muslims if not for the new testiment and what it says against violence.

So as a recap:

Soviestan: I'm no pot. But you are a skillet.
Pyotr: Quote something that applies to the modern Christians.

With Sincerity,
Yours Truly.

P.S. The phrase is... "A pot calling a skillet black..." where I come from, as kettles are typically silver in color.

Dude, that's ridiculous. From what you have presented on NSG, your understanding of Islam is limited to "hate teh Jewz0rz!!1!".

You're trying to shock, and congratulations, you have managed. Perhaps now is the time to quit while you're ahead and leave religion to religious people.


Why are you mocking my faith? I've posted much more on here about Islam than just what seem percieve(wrongly) as anti-jew.

Why are you mocking my faith?
Because you'd feel alone doing it all by yourself.

than just what seem percieve(wrongly) as anti-jew.

The minute you use the words "those people" in reference to jews your opinion is made abundantly clear, no mocking necessary.

Because you'd feel alone doing it all by yourself.

:rolleyes: oh please

Why Pyotr are you quoting the Old Testiment? You should know the New Testiment supercedes that. My! What a concept. Jesus, our Christ, said to Love our enemies, not to kill them.

Oh, fuck me!, that totally refutes my point that the passages I quoted are in the bible!

Oh wait, it doesn't.

And you still have not addressed my other point.......

:rolleyes: oh please

And he has manners! Who knew.

I really hate when some attention-starved troll like Soviestan takes over a thread. I'm guilty of feeding them too. But it derails any worthwhile conversation.

My feelings about the jew .

Who is this fellow? All you jackboot types talk about "the Jew"? Who is he? Does he owe you money? Has he all your Playstation games? What? Why? Who?

The minute you use the words "those people" in reference to jews your opinion is made abundantly clear, no mocking necessary.


O he's said "the Jew" in classic Blues Brothers style...its open season now...

Who is this fellow? All you jackboot types talk about "the Jew"? Who is he? Does he owe you money? Has he all your Playstation games? What? Why? Who?

you took me out of context.