NationStates Jolt Archive

....in a Pakistani court in Peshawar. Peshawar is the capital of NWFP, a very conservative area bordering Afghanistan and the base of the resurgent taliban.

Why do I feel that if this was done in a non-muslim country by a non-muslim judge, we would be hearing a lot more furore...:p

http://dailytimes.com.pk/default.asp?page=2006\11\04\story_4-11-2006_pg1_9
PHC says no to veiled lawyers

PESHAWAR: Peshawar High Court (PHC) Chief Justice Tariq Pervaiz Khan has ordered women lawyers not to wear veils in courtrooms, saying they (the women lawyers) could neither be identified nor assist the court well in veils. “You (women lawyers) are professionals. You should be dressed as requisite for the lawyers. We (the judges) cannot identify women lawyers wearing veils and doubt that veiled lawyers appear in court several times seeking adjournments for other lawyers’ cases,” Justice Pervaiz told a veiled lawyer, Raees Anjum, who was seeking adjournment of a case. The court could barely hear Ms Anjum’s name when she was asked to make her presence for a case she was seeking an adjournment for. Ms Anjum had to repeat her name several times because of her veil and this led to the chief justice’s observation that women lawyers should not wear veils in courtrooms. “I was embarrassed when the chief justice asked me not to wear a veil in the courtroom,” Ms Anjum told Daily Times. “I feel more confident in my hijab (veil). I am a progressive Muslim woman who has the courage to follow her faith while living and working in this conservative society.... hijab reflects a woman’s modesty,” she said. She added that several women judges in the NWFP wear a veil and all MMA women MPAs are also veiled. Ms Anjum told Daily Times that there was a difference of opinion in the judiciary on the issue. “On one hand, Peshawar Sessions Judge Hayat Ali Shah tells women lawyers to wear veils when coming to his court, while the PHC chief justice wants women lawyers appearing in court without veils.” akhtar amin

They actually let women be lawyers in Pakistan?

They actually let women be lawyers in Pakistan?:eek:

They actually let women be lawyers in Pakistan?

They had a women prime minister. Do educate yourself.

Thats not a bad idea at all, religious and cultural customs should take a back seat when someone is doing a professional job, especially if its in service to the gov't or a gov't system.

Is this a ban on all headscarves? or just the face-covering Burqa/Niqab type?

Veils are so medieval anyway. :rolleyes:
Show your face! :eek:

:p

Thats not a bad idea at all, religious and cultural customs should take a back seat when someone is doing a professional job, especially if its in service to the gov't or a gov't system.

Is this a ban on all headscarves? or just the face-covering Burqa/Niqab type?

Oh, veils as in the scarf thing for some reason I was reading it as veal and was totaly like "WTF, whats the big deal about it being Pakistan.":D

Thats not a bad idea at all, religious and cultural customs should take a back seat when someone is doing a professional job, especially if its in service to the gov't or a gov't system.

Is this a ban on all headscarves? or just the face-covering Burqa/Niqab type?

From some evidence in the article; i.e. the stuff about the lawyer having to say her name five times because the court couldn't hear her, it appears that it would apply to the niqab or burqa. I don't see how the hijab would obstruct the voice.

From some evidence in the article; i.e. the stuff about the lawyer having to say her name five times because the court couldn't hear her, it appears that it would apply to the niqab or burqa. I don't see how the hijab would obstruct the voice.

Thats exactly what I thought, then I read this:
I was embarrassed when the chief justice asked me not to wear a veil in the courtroom, I feel more confident in my hijab
Probably a translation problem...

Most people I speak to wouldn't have a clue about the difference between a hijab, niqab or burqa. So I'd assume that populist media wouldn't be too particular.

On the OP: Muslims are not an unwanted minority in Pakistan. People aren't calling for their expulsion from Pakistan. In the West, Muslims are increasingly being forced to assimilate or emigrate.

I kept staring at the OP headline and thinking it said, "Veal is banned..." which just made me furious!

I'm hungry.

Meanwhile in Inglistan :p

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/graphics/2006/11/08/nmuslim08.jpg
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2006/11/08/nmuslim08.xml
Lawyer refuses to take off veil

By Joshua Rozenberg, Legal Editor
Last Updated: 2:26am GMT 08/11/2006

A senior judge has been asked to decide whether female Muslim advocates may wear the veil in court.

The question was referred to Mr Justice Hodge, president of the Asylum and Immigration Tribunal, by an immigration judge at Hanley, Stoke-on-Trent, who had difficulty in hearing a veiled legal executive.

Shabnam Mughal was dressed completely in black with a full-face veil leaving only her eyes visible.

The judge, George Glossop, asked Miss Mughal on Monday if she would "kindly remove her veil to assist with communication". He told her: "It will allow me to see your face and I cannot hear you as well as I would like."

She declined to do so and Immigration Judge Glossop briefly adjourned the case. Later in the day, he asked her a second time. When Miss Mughal again refused to remove her veil, the judge adjourned the case until next Monday, pending consultations with Mr Justice Hodge.

Miss Mughal, in her twenties, who was representing a Sikh businessman challenging the Government's refusal to permit his nephew to visit Britain, was not taking media calls yesterday. A colleague said she was upset by what had happened.


Javid Hussain, practice manager at the Law Partnership in Coventry, where Miss Mughal works, said she had worn her veil while appearing before tribunals in different parts of the country for at least the past two years.

Other Muslim women at the firm did not wear veils, he said. It was a matter of personal choice.

It is believed to be the first time that judges in Britain have been asked to consider whether advocates may appear veiled for religious reasons, and Mr Justice Hodge is thought likely to consult the Lord Chief Justice before issuing his advice. While courts would not wish to deny people their religious freedoms, judges certainly find it harder to assess the truthfulness of a witness whose face cannot be seen.

Although barristers and judges normally wear wigs in the higher courts, other head coverings are permitted for religious reasons. Rabinder Singh, QC, currently challenging the Government's refusal to hold an inquiry into the Iraq war, wears a white turban in court, while Shaheed Fatima, a young barrister featured in the Bar's latest recruitment brochure, always wears a black scarf covering her head and neck - a hijab.

The question of whether Muslim women should remove their veils if asked was raised last month by Jack Straw.

The former foreign secretary said the value of a meeting "was that you can - almost literally - see what the other person means, and not just hear what they say".

That was followed by the case of a Muslim teaching assistant suspended for wearing a veil in class. A tribunal rejected Aishah Azmi's claim of discrimination against Headfield Church of England Junior School in Dewsbury, West Yorks, but awarded her damages for victimisation.

Trevor Phillips, head of the new Commission for Equality and Human Rights, subsequently urged Mrs Azmi not to pursue an appeal. He said "she would be doing the nation a favour" by dropping the case.

Veils are so medieval anyway. :rolleyes:
Show your boobs! :eek:

:p

>.>
<.<

I kept staring at the OP headline and thinking it said, "Veal is banned..." which just made me furious!

I'm hungry.



Ahhhh veal, I do love it sooo but it alays makes me feel a little guilty!

Yes, because what the women of Pakistan need is more laws telling them how to dress.

*Sigh*

2 questions.

regarding the hijab, etc... what is the 'religious' rule behind it. As I understand it the qu'ran says women of the faith should be dressed modestly? is that correct?

also what about ID cards? won't women have to show their faces? not much point having an ID card with a veiled face?