NationStates Jolt Archive

*points at title*

Since my current, quite vintage pc nearly went up in smoke once again today, I figured it might be the time to replace it with something new & shiny.
I got a budget of roughly 1000-1200 euros and peripheral equipment is at hand, so all I need is some advice from NS's techwizzes concerning the entrails of my new machine, as I know next to nothing about hardware.
It would mainly be used for gaming and surfing teh interwebs, with the odd leech thrown in for good measure, so I guess a good video card and high core frequency (or whatever the Hertz count is called in actual English) are the more important parts.

Thanks in advance, will be back later.

*places cookie box on table*

you need Upward Thrust.

*points at title*

Since my current, quite vintage pc nearly went up in smoke once again today, I figured it might be the time to replace it with something new & shiny.
I got a budget of roughly 1000-1200 euros and peripheral equipment is at hand, so all I need is some advice from NS's techwizzes concerning the entrails of my new machine, as I know next to nothing about hardware.
It would mainly be used for gaming and surfing teh interwebs, with the odd leech thrown in for good measure, so I guess a good video card and high core frequency (or whatever the Hertz count is called in actual English) are the more important parts.

Thanks in advance, will be back later.

*places cookie box on table*


Are you buying or building?

Buying, but I intended to bugger something like Dell about a customized version.
And ya, I was hoping UpwardThrust would feel challenged.
*keeps hoping*

Failing that, mayhaps someone got a linky to a noob-friendly site concerning such stuff?

If you decide to buy a computer you really cannot beat Dell for price.
You can configure the computer you like online to match the specs you desire.
I am probably going to buy my son a Dell when tax refund time rolls around.
If you want to build a computer I suggest going to Froogal (http://froogle.google.com/) and typing "bare bones computer" into the search field.
Just be aware of any kind of warranty information and look for sellers that have been around for a while.
The same applies for Ebay.
You can get some fantastic deals on hardware on the Internet.

For gaming you'll want an Intel Core2Duo CPU at the moment. Pick one according to budget.

Graphics are quite complicated... The Geforce 8800 series are coming out next week, but I doubt your budget will cover one. X1900XT 256MB cards are good value for money (they're in the region of £170 - 250 Euros - in Britain). THG's Graphics Charts (http://www.tomshardware.co.uk/graphics/charts.html?modelx=33&model1=519&model2=586&chart=198) are a good place to compare what's available.

Ideally you should look up the motherboard in the machine before buying it, just make sure it's nothing too terrible. Same for PSU, but much more important; many companies skimp here to save money. You do not want an underpowered PSU, and a higher-wattage no-name (or worse, Q-tec) PSU is worse than a lower-wattage of a decent brand (eg. Enermax, Seasonic, Hiper etc.). Decent brands are also more reliable, which is nice because PSU deaths don't tend to do anything good for other components.

You don't want less than a gig of RAM, and two gigs would be preferable. Ideally it should be PC-6400 (DDR2-800) RAM. You probably won't get much choice about latencies and they're not that important, really.

Hard disks; try not to get a Maxtor, and don't get anything less than 7200RPM no matter how cheap. Western Digital and Seagate are generally considered good. Capacity whatever you can afford, it doesn't really matter.

I can't recommend anyone to buy one from, but I imagine your local newsagent will have various PC magazines. The bigger ones (eg. PC Plus or Computer Shopper in the UK) with hundreds of pages of adverts will give you lots of info here, and you'll probably be able to find one with a group-test of PCs in the price-range you're looking at. Dells tend to strike me as a bit cheap (as in "low quality" rather than "inexpensive"), and some of the upgrade options on their site are frankly extortionate, so do shop around.

Nothing can beat doing research when buying a new PC. Tom's Hardware Guide (http://www.tomshardware.com) (notice "build your own" section ;) )and Anandtech (http://www.anandtech.com) are two good places to start...

I'd always recommend building your own. It's fun, and if you're careful you're quite unlikely to fry anything important :D

*points at title*

Since my current, quite vintage pc nearly went up in smoke once again today, I figured it might be the time to replace it with something new & shiny.
I got a budget of roughly 1000-1200 euros and peripheral equipment is at hand, so all I need is some advice from NS's techwizzes concerning the entrails of my new machine, as I know next to nothing about hardware.
It would mainly be used for gaming and surfing teh interwebs, with the odd leech thrown in for good measure, so I guess a good video card and high core frequency (or whatever the Hertz count is called in actual English) are the more important parts.

Thanks in advance, will be back later.

*places cookie box on table*

As been stated you have to decide if you are comfortable building or buying

At that price range the benefit starts leaning towards the building (I start looking at building when the tower itself without peripherals starts to reach 600 USD) Thats when the benefits of building and the equipment you buy at that price range justify the support and price difference. And it becomes cheaper at that point. Low end hardware in the end is more worth your while to buy.


Otherwise my recommendations sort of follow Compulsive Depression though I place less emphasis on the core duo's Good procs don’t get me wrong but I don’t find the advantage worth the money personally In fact I am not a big dual core fan for the standard user in any brand (and this coming from someone with dual procs)
Personally for a gaming rig I would spend the money on a better single core of either manufacture then to go dual

Hard drive recommendations I lean towards Seagate and Samsung myself. After a few hundred built computers I have never had a DOA Seagate and only 1 failure. Samsung is similar performance personally. WD does make some nice cheep hardware I defiantly would not ignore them when shopping for hardware.

The ram recommendations are solid by Compulsive Depression though the type of ram will vary. The amount is good though I probably would recommend staying down in the 1 GB mark with your price range and spending that money on a higher class mob.

I liked the jump to 2 gigs (and the jump to 4 gigs) but to be honest I do a lot of non standard stuff. When gaming I tend to keep my ram usage closer to 1600 at max (depending on the game) with no virtual memory used. A gig will be comfortable to you. And buy it in 1 stick (unless your board has separate channels and you need to balance them) so that you are not wasting money if you want to upgrade your ram later

you need Upward Thrust.

Thanks for the shout out this is something I do regularly, though for some reason I have been lazy about doing online recommendations.

For awhile there I was doing a lot of actual hardware pricing and such for people essentially handing them the list for a good computer. But I realized this is not something I like to debate about lol and too many arguments over hardware … too many fanboys over ATI or Nvidia AMD or Intel that nothing but jumbled argument ensues and I find that the person asking for help has too much material to sort through.

Now get me on an operating systems thread :) hehe

If you decide to buy a computer you really cannot beat Dell for price.
Yes you can. It's called HP. beats Dell in cost for benefits.

You can configure the computer you like online to match the specs you desire.
I am probably going to buy my son a Dell when tax refund time rolls around.
If you are going to customise online, you might as well build because they are ripping you the hell off. Either build it yourself or buy a box.

If you want to build a computer I suggest going to Froogal (http://froogle.google.com/) and typing "bare bones computer" into the search field.
Or you can just go to www.tigerdirect.com or www.newegg.com or whatever any Europe one is.

Build it yourself by buying the parts and you'll have something a lot better than what you could buy (and cheaper too). Unfortunately, the warranty services won't nearly be as good as some of the leading computer manufacturers but you've got to be smart about it and not go bezerk doing stupid shit. I don't know if they sell Dell computers in Europe but they have never let me down. I have two still at my mom's house (one running from 1999 and the other from 2002). In fact, right now, I'm on that 1999 one. It's still a good piece of equipment.

not sure about your side of the pond, But I'd wait (if possible) until after Christmas, prices should drop quite a bit in January as the next generation hardware comes out and you might be able to pick up an Nvidia 7950 GTX for about the price you can get a 1900XT. You'll also be able to get a cheaper Core 2 Duo as the Core 4s will have been out for a while.

Build it yourself by buying the parts and you'll have something a lot better than what you could buy (and cheaper too). Unfortunately, the warranty services won't nearly be as good as some of the leading computer manufacturers but you've got to be smart about it and not go bezerk doing stupid shit. I don't know if they sell Dell computers in Europe but they have never let me down. I have two still at my mom's house (one running from 1999 and the other from 2002). In fact, right now, I'm on that 1999 one. It's still a good piece of equipment.

Like I mentioned it all depends on the price range

In the below 600 USD mark, while it can be done it is awful hard to keep up with the deals manufactures are making. And at that price range you are using awful crappy cheep hardware to keep up. I find that those cheep towers tend to be more headaches to build yourself, supporting them for the long run is a major headache and not something I do anymore.

You end up using cheaper or the same equipment as the manufactures, except that when you get a DOA board you have a lot more headache dealing with manufacture or shipping return work then a manufacture does (they just pull another one out of the pile and keep going)

But as you get over that 600 dollar mark then the price gap between what you can build and what you can buy widens. It becomes a lot better above the 1000 USD mark to build

not sure about your side of the pond, But I'd wait (if possible) until after Christmas, prices should drop quite a bit in January as the next generation hardware comes out and you might be able to pick up an Nvidia 7950 GTX for about the price you can get a 1900XT. You'll also be able to get a cheaper Core 2 Duo as the Core 4s will have been out for a while.

Next gen harware usualy realeases in the spring ... with a possible release as early as feb (though not often)

Build it yourself by buying the parts and you'll have something a lot better than what you could buy (and cheaper too). Unfortunately, the warranty services won't nearly be as good as some of the leading computer manufacturers but you've got to be smart about it and not go bezerk doing stupid shit. I don't know if they sell Dell computers in Europe but they have never let me down. I have two still at my mom's house (one running from 1999 and the other from 2002). In fact, right now, I'm on that 1999 one. It's still a good piece of equipment.

I think it is safe to assume that anyone having to consult an online forum for suggestions on what they should buy next has no ability to build their own system.

And if a 1999 any PC is a good piece of equipment, you either don't do anything or spent thousands of dollars on it when you bought it.

well, the 8800 is releasing this month, along with the Core 4 series.
DDR2 is set to finally sweep the older RAM off the majority of the market and new motherboards are coming out practically daily to take better advantage of multi-core processing, DDR2 RAM and SLI/Crossfire GPUs.
not too mention the pre-Christmas price Hike

Oldie but goodie:
http://www-5.ibm.com/fi/news/archive/images/images/misc/First_PC.jpg

well, the 8800 is releasing this month, along with the Core 4 series.
DDR2 is set to finally sweep the older RAM off the majority of the market and new motherboards are coming out practically daily to take better advantage of multi-core processing, DDR2 RAM and SLI/Crossfire GPUs.
not too mention the pre-Christmas price Hike
I might look into a Notebook for Black Friday, but I'ma drop a couple k on a new PC next year.

well, the 8800 is releasing this month, along with the Core 4 series.
DDR2 is set to finally sweep the older RAM off the majority of the market and new motherboards are coming out practically daily to take better advantage of multi-core processing, DDR2 RAM and SLI/Crossfire GPUs.
not too mention the pre-Christmas price Hike

Intells quad core are looking like they will actualy be released first quarter next year (note spring) and the 88000 is just an upgrade
DDR2 has been out for awhile

Like I said most break throughs are released from about febuary through the spring from the looks of it intell is going to follow that tradition for the most part.

And they are going to have to do better then motherboard support as is we need better OS support. Windows fails at most of the predictitive load processing that has been a part of linux for years. Not to mention more applications themselfs taking advantage of multi proccessing envronment. The software industry is the real industry that has to keep up with the tech changes. They are still floundering with 64 across the board support much less distributive processing

Thanks for the shout out this is something I do regularly, though for some reason I have been lazy about doing online recommendations.

For awhile there I was doing a lot of actual hardware pricing and such for people essentially handing them the list for a good computer. But I realized this is not something I like to debate about lol and too many arguments over hardware … too many fanboys over ATI or Nvidia AMD or Intel that nothing but jumbled argument ensues and I find that the person asking for help has too much material to sort through.

Now get me on an operating systems thread :) heheI sure appreciated your advice when I was looking for a laptop, though yes, it can become overwhelming for a noob like me and the OP. Thanks for sharing your knowledge UT!!

Get a Mac. Never worry again.

I'd definitely get a customized PC. There's a few good places that have great customizable PC's. If you want a fairly stock computer with a few add-on things, I'd go for Dell. If you wan't a full out specialised, my personal favorite pick would be AlienWare. It's forms and picking process is pretty easy, and those things are absolutely great for hardcore gaming (and other hardcore things that'd best not be mentioned here :p ).

I'd definitely get a customized PC. There's a few good places that have great customizable PC's. If you want a fairly stock computer with a few add-on things, I'd go for Dell. If you wan't a full out specialised, my personal favorite pick would be AlienWare. It's forms and picking process is pretty easy, and those things are absolutely great for hardcore gaming (and other hardcore things that'd best not be mentioned here :p ).

Last I checked, customizing on AlienWare is a real rip off, and what's worst is most manufacturers are making deals with them for customisation.

Get a Mac. Never worry again.

Why over pay for hardware? ... sure is handy in some situation and props with stealing FreeBSD as a kernal but still ... why? what advantages do they honestly hold to the standard user?

What advantages do they honestly hold to the standard user?

Well, as a lifelong PC users, I can honestly say that in the almost 2 years since I switched to Macs, I've not had the murderous urge to toss it into a river or a shredder once.

Well, as a lifelong PC users, I can honestly say that in the almost 2 years since I switched to Macs, I've not had the murderous urge to toss it into a river or a shredder once.

Funny thing, I've never had that problem with my PC. Maybe if you were a competent PC user, you wouldn't have had the problem.

Well, as a lifelong PC users, I can honestly say that in the almost 2 years since I switched to Macs, I've not had the murderous urge to toss it into a river or a shredder once.

Ive never had that issue . At least not over anything that switching to MAC would have solved. I mean I use them on a regular basis at work yet I have no urge to own one personaly.

There is absolutly no benifit and plenty of costs to switching to a mac with my current computing habits.

But I supose if you are a simplistic user they could be very simmilar ... but in that case the PC is cheeper for low end boxes

Yes you can. It's called HP. beats Dell in cost for benefits.


If you are going to customise online, you might as well build because they are ripping you the hell off. Either build it yourself or buy a box.


Or you can just go to www.tigerdirect.com or www.newegg.com or whatever any Europe one is.


newegg and tigerdirect are also great resources!
And I like HP computers but I thought that they were still a little more expensive then Dell.
I have just now started looking around at new hardware because I plan on buying/building sometime after the first of the year.

Intells quad core are looking like they will actualy be released first quarter next year (note spring) and the 88000 is just an upgrade
DDR2 has been out for awhile

Like I said most break throughs are released from about febuary through the spring from the looks of it intell is going to follow that tradition for the most part.

And they are going to have to do better then motherboard support as is we need better OS support. Windows fails at most of the predictitive load processing that has been a part of linux for years. Not to mention more applications themselfs taking advantage of multi proccessing envronment. The software industry is the real industry that has to keep up with the tech changes. They are still floundering with 64 across the board support much less distributive processing

8800 just an upgrade? Sure, an upgrade to a new architecture, 3 times as much on board memory as most current cards and the first support for DX10, sounds pretty next-gen to me.

And on Core 4, Your Google-Fu is weak old man, try searching 'Kentsfield Launch' and all you get is articles saying 'Intel sets the launch date for their Kentsfield core 4 extreme quadcore processors as Nov. 14th '06.
not exactly spring time 07 is it?

And yea, DDR2 has been out for a while, but its still fighting with DDR1 for shelf space and thats about to change.

And don't fogrget the pre-christmas price hike. Even disregarding the Nex gen stuff hitting the market now, I wouldn't buy a new computer this soon before christmas anyway. RAM alone is 80% more expensive than it was this summer.

Otherwise my recommendations sort of follow Compulsive Depression though I place less emphasis on the core duo's Good procs don’t get me wrong but I don’t find the advantage worth the money personally In fact I am not a big dual core fan for the standard user in any brand (and this coming from someone with dual procs)
Personally for a gaming rig I would spend the money on a better single core of either manufacture then to go dual

What you say there was true when I built my machine (with an Athlon 64 4000+ Socket 939 CPU that I paid a bit over £200 for) in February/March, but it's not true now.
The problem with it is there is no better single-core. The best modern single-core CPU you can get at the moment is the AM2 Athlon 64 3800+ (about £82), which is easily outclassed in every way by the cheapest Core2Duo CPU (the E6300, £135). Considering how much you can (should ;) ) overclock an E6300 by, that games as well as everything else are beginning to take advantage of multiple CPUs, and the responsiveness benefits of being able to run more than one thread concurrently I feel that single-core CPUs are now a false economy in anything other than the dreariest of office machines.

Also, the Geforce 8800 is a lot more than a refresh (like the X1950XTX was to the X1900XTX); I think they're releasing now to get a big bite of the DirectX 10 early-adopter market at Christmas, well in time for Vista's launch.

If you decide to buy a computer you really cannot beat Dell for price.
You can configure the computer you like online to match the specs you desire.
I am probably going to buy my son a Dell when tax refund time rolls around.
If you want to build a computer I suggest going to Froogal (http://froogle.google.com/) and typing "bare bones computer" into the search field.
Just be aware of any kind of warranty information and look for sellers that have been around for a while.
The same applies for Ebay.
You can get some fantastic deals on hardware on the Internet.

dell desktops tend to be good in my experience, but i bought a high-end Dell XPS2 laptop and have had to replace the power supply, the battery, and now the power plug itself has decided to go very faulty (to the point of having to tape the cable at the right angle down to the desk in fear of it randomly turning off should the power connection go funny...)

i suggest novatech.co.uk (http://www.novatech.co.uk) - very cheap, quite reliable, just not sure if they ship to the continent :confused:

edit:
http://www.novatech.co.uk/novatech/pcrange.html?EXE seems fairly cheap but good. my new lappy has similar specs :)
but i don't think they ship outside the UK :(

If you want to get the best value for money and not have to bother building the PC then go to an independent computer parts dealer.

Have an idea in your mind of what you want before you go. Firstly, make sure you go to a fairly small shop so you can be guarenteed to be talking to someone who knows what they're talking about, not some generic PCworld sales assistant.

When you get the attention of the shop keeper talk to him about your needs, the list you've compiled, general prices and so forth - have a good chat. Then thank the person for their time and leave. Do the same at other shops, see who seem to be offering the best prices.

Now, have lunch and a nice coffee or whatever suits you best and then go back to the cheapest people and ask about discounts or an deals they can offer for bulk buying all the parts off them. Don't leap on the first offer they give you and again, check everyone out first.

Finally, got back to the cheapest shop ask about the deal you were offered earlier and then mention if its possible that they could put it all together for you. Believe me, they should be willing to do that for free to close a 1000 euro deal. It hardly take up much of their time, and gives them something to do in the quiet hours.

One last piece of advice, since you're having to spend so much money all at once from one shop I would probably reject and cash-in-hand offers. The discount for paying cash is not worth the risk. Though if you do pay cash-in-hand then he should be giving you a 20% discount. No less. VAT is standardised across the EU, right?

That's what I did, comparitively I even managed to save money on internet prices even though I was buying from a high street retailer.

First, thanks everyone for the input - I'm reading the thread thoroughly now, but from first glance it seems quite helpful.
Thanks a lot!

*opens new box o'cookies*

So, from what I gathered, the PC will/ should have the following:
- a high-quality PSU, likely from Enermax, Seasonic or hiper
- a Core2Duo E6300 CPU
- a non-Maxtor hard-drive with at least 7200rpm, preferably from Digital Western or Seagate
- a X1900XT 256mb graphic card (is this ATI or Nvidia? :confused: )
- about 2 GB PC-6400 (DDR2-800) RAM.

When taking this list to the shop - since my own building skills most certainly would get me fried, I'll follow Infinite Dune's advice and bugger the local shops - and adding a good motherboard (any recommendations for these?), would I get something resembling a working PC?

If you do end up building your own computer, make sure all your parts are compatible. I have a friend who decided to build his own computer and went out and spent $2500 on top of the line components. Only problem was when he tried to put it all together, the parts didn't fit. He called me for help, I went over, took a while to look at his stuff and started laughing. I was like, "you know you can't use that CPU with that motherboard... and you don't have the right slot for that graphics card... and that RAM isn't right for the motherboard either..." :p

You're friend doesn't happen to be me? Sounds very much like me. :D

Which is why I'm tripple-checking this - with friends, online and finally at the store. Hopefully, this will result in a good & working PC, instead of a load of stuff to sell on ebay.

You're friend doesn't happen to be me? Sounds very much like me. :D

Which is why I'm tripple-checking this - with friends, online and finally at the store. Hopefully, this will result in a good & working PC, instead of a load of stuff to sell on ebay.
Is your name Michael? If not, you're safe. :p

I recently built a new computer, but I haven't kept up with my computer tech stuff so I had friends help me. After my experience with my friend, I wanted to make really really sure that I had everything right before buying everything.

So, from what I gathered, the PC will/ should have the following:
- a high-quality PSU, likely from Enermax, Seasonic or hiper
- a Core2Duo E6300 CPU
- a non-Maxtor hard-drive with at least 7200rpm, preferably from Digital Western or Seagate
- a X1900XT 256mb graphic card (is this ATI or Nvidia? :confused: )
- about 2 GB PC-6400 (DDR2-800) RAM.

When taking this list to the shop - since my own building skills most certainly would get me fried, I'll follow Infinite Dune's advice and bugger the local shops - and adding a good motherboard (any recommendations for these?), would I get something resembling a working PC?
That'd be a good machine that should keep you happy for a while. The X1900XT is an ATi card.

For reference I quickly specced up a machine with an E6300, X1900XT 256MB, 2GB Geil PC2-6400, MSI 965P NEO mainboard, 250GB Seagate 7200.10 HDD, LiteOn DVDRW, Antec SLK3000B Midi Tower Case and a 400W Enermax Liberty PSU (should be enough considering high-end machines with a Geforce 8800GTX only draw 300-odd watts under load) for £730.98 including 17.5% VAT (from www.overclockers.co.uk (http://www.overclockers.co.uk)). That's about 1100 euros, so leaves about 100 left for more storage/bigger PSU/to buy a copy of Windows if you don't have one/for the shop to build it/whatever.

If that's too much then you could cut down to 1GB RAM (or down to DDR2-667) or maybe cut the X1900XT down to something a little cheaper (I'm not good on budget graphics cards so don't know what the next notch down is, sorry). Shopping around (especially for the memory - anything of decent spec by Corsair, OCZ, Geil or G.Skill should be pretty good) might save you a few shiny-tokens, too.

I should mention that I think that memory is compatible with that mainboard, but I've heard stories that some Core2Duo-compatible boards can be a bit fussy; worth checking compatibility between whatever memory and motherboard you choose thoroughly before you buy it. The shop you choose should be able to help and advise here.

Edit: I can't see anything claiming either compatibility or uncompatibility with the Geil modules, but a pair of Corsair PC2-6400 DIMMs (specifically the "TWIN2X2048-6400 (http://www.corsairmemory.com/corsair/products/specs/TWIN2X2048-6400.pdf)" pair) are compatible, according to MSI's test results. Strange as they're 1.9V modules, but that's life. There are plenty of mainboards to choose from, anyway.

that looks like a good build, Personally I'd go for the Nvidia 7900GT over ATIs X1900XT, but I'm an Nvidia fanboi so thats just my opinion.

However, I can't stress enough that you should wait if at all possible, right now prices are absurd for the pre-Christmas rush and you should wait for either Black Friday price drops, or the Post Christmas season.

Is your name Michael? If not, you're safe. :p

Phew! Close enough!

That'd be a good machine that should keep you happy for a while. The X1900XT is an ATi card.

For reference I quickly specced up a machine ~snip~

Thanks, I'll go to the local store tommorrow and start to pester them.

Thanks, I'll go to the local store tommorrow and start to pester them.

I just wanna chime in that a good method of buying a pc if you're not very tech-savvy is to write the minimum wanted specs and a rough budget limit on a piece of paper and ask for offers (with listing of all parts) on paper from a couple (three or so) of local resellers, then drop the offers here. A lot less work than going trough all the tech sites yourself and more reliable than asking from one vendor who just might bullshit you. Total BS systems with one or several grossly inadequate parts is no more as common as it was on the heydays, but hey, stuff like GF 7600 GS 512 MB just wouldn't exist if there weren't uninformed people and the people ready to exploit them on the market.

For example, I'd ask for a:
Core 2 Duo system
2 GB of 800MHz DDR2
Gf 7600 GT or equivalent
and a good reliable PSU

About ATi VS NVidia:
Currently in the performance segment the X1900Xt just beats everything NVidia can offer at the same price. In the mainstream segment It's a lot more even battle with different pricepoints going to different vendors. I choose NVidia for my next system because the Linux combability of ati cards is utter crap (every kernel update seems to break the system - sigh), but if you find yourself unlikely to install linux, just go for ATI.

AMD vs Intel:
Intel is currently the king of gaming, and even if AMD would offer their processors at prices that make them attractive the point is moot because there just isn't enough AMD processors in the channel as they are being sucked by offices and DELL. Look for this to change when AMD's 65nm process matures and their next-gen processors hit the market, till then it's Intel Galore

Funny thing, I've never had that problem with my PC. Maybe if you were a competent PC user, you wouldn't have had the problem.

That wouldn't beeeee SARcasm, WOULD it?

First computer was a Radio Shack TRS-80 Color Computer with Extended 32K Basic Memory. I know how to use a PC, thank you.

... ATI vs Nvidia
AMD vs Intel.. for my next PC.. I decided I was to buy from Dell..

I just found out that dell sells Intel and AMD systems..

So my question is wich prosesor is comparable to wich one?
is it all about the MHZ.. or the Benchmarks.. or what?

BTW I tend to buy the lower end PC (I just buy a new system more often)

for my next PC.. I decided I was to buy from Dell..

I just found out that dell sells Intel and AMD systems..

So my question is wich prosesor is comparable to wich one?
is it all about the MHZ.. or the Benchmarks.. or what?


Benchmarks, of course, different kinds of procesors haven't been comparable by MHz since the original Athlon. Last I checked, however, there wasn't a decent gaming rig with amd processor in it on the dell site, all of them had some crappy x1300 or something as the video card. By the way, is my surf-fu just weak or do they really not sell any mid-range video cards. All I could find is the utter crap like X1300, GF 6150 TC and the high-end cards like 7900, 7950GX2?

Fried Tuna;11911724']Benchmarks, of course, different kinds of procesors haven't been comparable by MHz since the original Athlon. Last I checked, however, there wasn't a decent gaming rig with amd processor in it on the dell site, all of them had some crappy x1300 or something as the video card. By the way, is my surf-fu just weak or do they really not sell any mid-range video cards. All I could find is the utter crap like X1300, GF 6150 TC and the high-end cards like 7900, 7950GX2?

Would not suprize me ... tends to be a bit weak in the middle areas on most retailers

Nothing can beat doing research when buying a new PC. Tom's Hardware Guide (http://www.tomshardware.com) (notice "build your own" section ;) )and Anandtech (http://www.anandtech.com) are two good places to start...

Completely ignore what Tom's Hardware says about AMD. He is horribly biased that way.

Yes you can. It's called HP. beats Dell in cost for benefits.

HP makes Satan look like Jesus.

Good lord, don't buy from HP.

A good build guide is the one from Ars Technica (http://arstechnica.com/guides/buyer.ars)
very good stats and includes everything you'll need for your new computer whether you want a budget box, gaming computer, hot-rod or the aptly named God-Box

HP makes Satan look like Jesus.

Never had a single problem with HP, once you scrub the grime off the harddrive.

Speaking of advice, how about this (http://www.bestbuy.com/site/olspage.jsp?skuId=999963200050003&type=product&id=pcmprd63400050003) anyone

Completely ignore what Tom's Hardware says about AMD. He is horribly biased that way.

Actually, I disagree. The years I've read Tomshardware.com, I've noticed they don't seem to swing any certain way but are awfully enthusiastic at whatever seems to be their hot choice. Case in point: Tom was the first to point out how athlons tend to (Literally!) burn when they lost their heat sink, and as intel regained the performance crown tom's didn't think twice before proclaiming it the best chip in existance. Not much AMD-loving there.

Fried Tuna;11912311']Actually, I disagree. The years I've read Tomshardware.com, I've noticed they don't seem to swing any certain way but are awfully enthusiastic at whatever seems to be their hot choice. Case in point: Tom was the first to point out how athlons tend to (Literally!) burn when they lost their heat sink, and as intel regained the performance crown tom's didn't think twice before proclaiming it the best chip in existance. Not much AMD-loving there.

Actually, that is what I was getting at. Tom's is horrible biased against AMD.

Never had a single problem with HP, once you scrub the grime off the harddrive.

My old (now my sisters:p) HP is the only computer that I've had physically break. It isn't the oldest either. The PS/2 ports stopped working (and it only has 4 USB), the CD-Drive needs help opening, and the audio jack got pushed into the case.

A little bit of note on that IBM PC I linked to earlier:

4.77 MHz Intel 8088 microprocessor.
equipped with 16 kilobytes of memory, expandable to 256k.
five-inch CRT display
Weighs a portable 55 lbs
Available with either APL or BASIC or both!

A little bit of note on that IBM PC I linked to earlier:

4.77 MHz Intel 8088 microprocessor.
equipped with 16 kilobytes of memory, expandable to 256k.
five-inch CRT display
Weighs a portable 55 lbs
Available with either APL or BASIC or both!

Who needs 256K?:rolleyes:

Who needs 256K?:rolleyes:

I know! I'd save my money.

Actually, that is what I was getting at. Tom's is horrible biased against AMD.

Oh, somehow, I got it the other way. Anyway, tom's did hold the A64 as the best processor for the while it had. I myself am horribly biased FOR amd, mostly because I think you can get much better mobos for AMD in general (free competition FTW), and I've never really had any issue with tom's. I dunno. Could you direct me to a piece of unwarranted AMD-bashing published by Tom's?

No one thnks going 64 bits is worth it already?

No one thnks going 64 bits is worth it already?

Everything you can buy that makes sense is 64-bit. Whether the os should be 64-bit depends on preferences...

No one thnks going 64 bits is worth it already?

Depends on what you are doing. Standard user no, other users maybe.

Depending