NationStates Jolt Archive

In another thread I hinted that, if Turkey can become a member of EU, thus widening EU membership to non-geographically-european countries, then also Australia, New Zealand and Canada can become members of EU and adopt the Euro as currency instead of the local $.

Euro-coins have all the same picture on one side. The picture on the other side is left to each country to decide. Here's the link to the European Central Bank with all the pictures.

http://www.euro.ecb.eu/en/section/euro0/specific.html

If your country was to join EU, what pictures would you like it to choose for the Euro-coins?

coins:
0.01 €
0.02 €
0.05 €
0.10 €
0.20 €
0.50 €
1.00 €
2.00 €

1. Turkey is geographically European.
2. My country is in the EU and I hope we never join the third stage of the EMU, so I won't be playing along with "pick the pic," even if we would probably just do what we've done with the krona: put the monarch's mug on them.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/5/54/Swedish_10krona_2001_front.jpg

1. Turkey is geographically European.
2. My country is in the EU and I hope we never join the EMU, so I won't be playing along with "pick the pic," even if we would probably just do what we've done with the krona: put the monarch's mug on them.

I thought only England stayed out of the EMU. Though I never did pay that a whole lot of attention.

I thought only England stayed out of the EMU. Though I never did pay that a whole lot of attention.

Obviously. There are 25 EU members. The Euro has been adopted by 12 of them.

I thought only England stayed out of the EMU. Though I never did pay that a whole lot of attention.

The UK, Sweden and Denmark were the ones of the 15 "old" members who did not adopt the euro.

The UK, Sweden and Denmark.

Plus all of the 10 new member states. The three Baltic republics, Poland, Czech Rep., Slovakia, Hungary, Slovenija, Malta and Cyprus.

Plus all of the 10 new member states. The three Baltic republics, Poland, Czech Rep., Slovakia, Hungary, Slovenija, Malta and Cyprus.

They don't count because they did not have the choice the 15 old ones got. All the new ones will adopt the euro.

1. Turkey is geographically European.


No. Only a very small fraction of the Turkish land is Europe. Anything south of the Bosphor is Asia.

They don't count because they did not have the choice the 15 old ones got. All the new ones will adopt the euro.

Not immediately. Some already said they won't until 2010.

Obviously. There are 25 EU members. The Euro has been adopted by 12 of them.

Ah. Thanks for that. :)

Aren't they getting all the 1c and 2c coins back? They've been rounding to 5c in the Netherlands for a while now

Aren't they getting all the 1c and 2c coins back? They've been rounding to 5c in the Netherlands for a while now

No, to my knowledge Finnland is not minting 1c and 2c coins anymore. They cannot force other countries or ECB to do the same, and 1c and 2c coins are legal currency in Finnland anyway, because other €-zone countries keep them as a legal tender.
It is true, however, that many people don't like the 1c and the 2c coins, because they're so small and light they can be a real pain to use, also their value is next to nothing.

Back to the OP, is anyone going to play "pick the pic" ?

Back to the OP, is anyone going to play "pick the pic" ?

Linky doesn't work :(

In no particular order for the USA:
White House
Congress
Washington Monument
Jefferson Memorial
Lincoln Memorial
Statue of Liberty
Jamestown?
Independence Hall

Really, it's too hard to think of what can be agreed on by the whole US as appropriate for the whole US.

Linky doesn't work :(

?

i think it would be funny they allowed palistien and not israel. sure they are technically not european but it is destined to exanspand outside europe.

In no particular order for the USA:
Really, it's too hard to think of what can be agreed on by the whole US as appropriate for the whole US.

You might have 50 states x 8 coins... that makes 400 (wow!) different pictures! Ain't that cool!

i think it would be funny they allowed palistien and not israel. sure they are technically not european but it is destined to exanspand outside europe.

If:
1.Palestine becomes an fully sovereign and independent state and developes a stable economy
2.The Near-East becomes peaceful for at least 20 years

then both Palestine and Israel could become EU members.
But I think that it is more likely that there will be a just a free-trade agreement between all mediterranean countries, be they EU, asian shore or african shore.

You might have 50 states x 8 coins... that makes 400 (wow!) different pictures! Ain't that cool!

Well, the US-states were never sovereign countries, they are equal to the German Bundesländer. And there is only one German coin-set.

The reason, that every Euro-country may make its one coins is, that in old times only the king was allowed to mint coins. This traditions survived.

BTW: There are also some very small Euro-countries which aren't member of the EU. (Monaco, Vatican, San Marino, Andorra) Their coins are very rare and very valuable for colletors.

Turkey is geographically European.

Turkey is as geographically European as France is geographically African, American and Asian. Next.

Turkey is as geographically European as France is geographically African, American and Asian. Next.

No, it's more like "Turkey is as geographically European as Cyprus or Malta." Turkey actually has land on the European mainland. So any claims that Turkey is not geographically European are just plain old dumb. Insipidly stupid, even.

No. Only a very small fraction of the Turkish land is Europe. Anything south of the Bosphor is Asia.As opposed to the massive landmasses of Australian or New Zealandish territory in Europe?

No, it's more like "Turkey is as geographically European as Cyprus or Malta." Turkey actually has land on the European mainland. So any claims that Turkey is not geographically European are just plain old dumb. Insipidly stupid, even.

And... France doesn't have land on mainland South America? Your point is moot.

And... France doesn't have land on mainland South America?

not france itself.

And... France doesn't have land on mainland South America? Your point is moot.It's a DOM/TOM, and hardly contains one of it's largest population centers.

It's a DOM/TOM, and hardly contains one of it's largest population centers.

Is the majority of Turkey's population in Europe?

And... France doesn't have land on mainland South America?

And I have denied that they are a multicontinental country where exactly? You do know this is not an either or situation? I mean, you are able to fathom it?

Oh, and you forgot the Kingdom of The Netherlands.

And I have denied that they are a multicontinental country where exactly? You do know this is not an either or situation? I mean, you are able to fathom it?

Oh, and you forgot the Kingdom of The Netherlands.

Thus, by your logic, why is France not in the African Union, or the South American equivalent?

Is the majority of Turkey's territory in Europe?How does that matter?

Thus, by your logic, why is France not in the African Union, or the South American equivalent?

Perhaps because France has no desire to be a member of said union? Regardless, the overseas territories of these nations are not regarded as part of the mainland, unlike the Turkish territory in Europe. Your comparison is crap.

Oh, and Fass, I have missed your scathing intellect. Welcome back.

Regardless, the overseas territories of these nations are not regarded as part of the mainland, unlike the Turkish territory in Europe.

I like that; just ignore the fucking Bosphorus. No, it's not even there, forget about it. Let's walk across from European Turkey to... European Turkey!

Your comparison is crap.

Just keep telling yourself that.

I like that; just ignore the fucking Bosphorus. No, it's not even there, forget about it. Let's walk across from European Turkey to... European Turkey!

I find it amusing that you consider a strait 3.7km wide a greater division than the 75km of sea separating Cyprus from any EU nation. Amusing, indeed, that you've somehow equated tiny extra-continental relics of the imperial age to the modern borders of Turkey, which (regardless of your claims to the contrary) stray into what is considered Europe. Turkey is in Europe. To claim otherwise is simply incorrect.

Just keep telling yourself that.
You hurt me. No, really.

I like that; just ignore the fucking Bosphorus. No, it's not even there, forget about it. Let's walk across from European Turkey to... European Turkey!Yes, let's. Which bridge would you prefer..?

I find it amusing that you consider a strait 3.7km wide a greater division than the 75km of sea separating Cyprus from any EU nation.

You assume that I give a fuck about Cyprus. They can either let themselves be annexed by Greece, or join Turkey and leave the Union.

Amusing, indeed, that you've somehow equated tiny extra-continental relics of the imperial age

Yeah, sure, if that's what you like to call it. It's a straight. It's not something man-made; it's a freaking big river. It divides Europe and Asia.

Turkey is in Europe. To claim otherwise is simply incorrect.

I don't care if they have territory in Europe. It's not enough. They need to have most of their land, or population, in Europe. And they need an overtly European culture, and that means religion too.

Yes, let's. Which bridge would you prefer..?

The one which nature built. Give me that, or Turkey is not a European nation.

The one which nature built. Give me that, or Turkey is not a European nation.If you give that Manhattan isn't part of NY... or USA. But wait! Is half of Istanbul European then..?!?

If you give that Manhattan isn't part of NY... or USA.

Except that Manhattan is accepted to be part of North America; which the US claims to be part of.

I never said that European Turkey wasn't it Europe; I said that Turkey was not a European nation. It's the same way the Russia isn't an Asian nation, despite having the majority of it's territory in Asia; culturally and population-wise, it's more closely linked to Europe than Asia.

Except that Manhattan is accepted to be part of North America; which the US claims to be part of.

I never said that European Turkey wasn't it Europe; I said that Turkey was not a European nation. It's the same way the Russia isn't an Asian nation, despite having the majority of it's territory in Asia; culturally and population-wise, it's more closely linked to Europe than Asia.
Right. If you want to make a totally arbitrary distinction like that. One could easily argue Turkey has long and rich ties with Europe and thus could be considered European. I myself don't much care about those distinctions.

But let's put it like this, so it's easier for you to understand: Turkey is as European as you are German.

I thought only England stayed out of the EMU. Though I never did pay that a whole lot of attention.



England is not a member of the EU. Britain is, of which England is one part. And as a Briton, I fervently look forward to the day when we finally join the Euro.

Right. If you want to make a totally arbitrary distinction like that. One could easily argue Turkey has long and rich ties with Europe and thus could be considered European. I myself don't much care about those distinctions.

What, invading, raping and pillaging? The Mongolians did that same. European too?

But let's put it like this, so it's easier for you to understand: Turkey is as European as you are German.

Assuming that you think like everybody else; not at all.

England is not a member of the EU. Britain is, of which England is one part. And as a Briton, I fervently look forward to the day when we finally join the Euro.

if your gonna nit pick...

britain isnt a member of the EU... the UNITED KINGDOM is, which is "Great Britain and Northern Ireland"

Thus, by your logic, why is France not in the African Union, or the South American equivalent?

Because they haven't joined them. Really, your questions are getting as dumb as the claim that Turkey is not geographically European.

In no particular order for the USA:
White House
Congress
Washington Monument
Jefferson Memorial
Lincoln Memorial
Statue of Liberty
Jamestown?
Independence Hall

Really, it's too hard to think of what can be agreed on by the whole US as appropriate for the whole US.

Personally, if I WERE USAmerican, I think I would want the Liberty Bell in there somewhere, also an Apollo V rocket. With the words "all men are created equal" around the edge of the surface.

Because they haven't joined them. Really, your questions are getting as dumb as the claim that Turkey is not geographically European.

Why are you fighting me? Read the sig. What does that tell you?

Because they haven't joined them. Really, your questions are getting as dumb as the claim that Turkey is not geographically European.

Or the claim that Turkey is not culturally and historically European.

Or the claim that Turkey is not culturally and historically European.

It's not my fault they're not.

What, invading, raping and pillaging? The Mongolians did that same. European too?Huh? Yeah, they have warred against Europeans, sure. They have also been allies, no?

Assuming that you think like everybody else; not at all.
Well, you have many times said in NSG that you are German (or at least feel German), yet you live in Australia. You have said so because of your family's historical ties with Germany. Well, Turkey shares historical ties with Europe.
You could probably become a proper German if you cut the mustard. Turkey could become European (or at least EU:ian), if it reforms its society enough according to standards set. (Jesus, what a poor analogy)

1. Turkey is geographically European.
2. My country is in the EU and I hope we never join the third stage of the EMU, so I won't be playing along with "pick the pic," even if we would probably just do what we've done with the krona: put the monarch's mug on them.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/5/54/Swedish_10krona_2001_front.jpg



turkey is as europpean as russia :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

if your gonna nit pick...

britain isnt a member of the EU... the UNITED KINGDOM is, which is "Great Britain and Northern Ireland"

You are partially correct. But "the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland" is more or less never named in full, and "Britain" is an accepted short form, as is United Kingdom.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_Isles_%28terminology%29

As you can see here, "United Kingdom" is as much an abbreviation of the full official name of the country as is "Britain" although both are accepted and quasi-official through usage.

Why are you fighting me? Read the sig. What does that tell you?

I don't have signatures turned on, but I am "fighting" you because you are wrong.

turkey is as europpean as russia :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

Russia is European. It's Asian as well. It's both. It being one doesn't mean it isn't the other.

Euro coins look pretty sexy. I like the German and Italian ones especially... :)

Or the claim that Turkey is not culturally and historically European.

Yeah, that one was a pretty silly and ignorant claim, too, but the OP was about geography, so I ignored on account of irrelevance.

Huh? Yeah, they have warred against Europeans, sure. They have also been allies, no?

They were allied with the country that later became the Nazis. In what sick, twisted dimension is that considered allying with Europe?

Well, you have many times said in NSG that you are German (or at least feel German), yet you live in Australia. You have said so because of your family's historical ties with Germany.

Historical ties? You make it sound like my closest German relatives lived 200 years ago.

You could probably become a proper German if you cut the mustard.

Germany's immigration laws are about as soft as talc; combine that with my German heritage, and I could probably become a citizen by popping into the nearest consulate.

Turkey could become European (or at least EU:ian), if it reforms its society enough according to standards set. (Jesus, what a poor analogy)

If their reforms involve dropping islam, adopting an Indo-European language, becoming less poor, and physically lifting Asian Turkey into Europe, I'm all for it.

As you can see here, "United Kingdom" is as much an abbreviation of the full official name of the country as is "Britain" although both are accepted and quasi-official through usage.


And I personally prefer the name Britain. I am a democrat (in the widest sense, not necessarily the narrower US party sense) and a Paineite, and I await the day when I can say I come from the Federal Republic of Britain. :D

Why are you fighting me? Read the sig. What does that tell you?

Yeah, that one was a pretty silly and ignorant claim, too, but the OP was about geography, so I ignored on account of irrelevance.

Yes, but ol' Potato here has deferred on his argument that Turkey is not geographically European because of a little problem called "facts", and has resorted to the old claim that Turkey is not culturally European. That's why I wrote that.

In regards to his signature, it says: "An open mind is like a fortress with its gates unbarred and unguarded", which frankly reads as the opinion that "ignorance = safe". Speaks volumes, really.

Why are you fighting me? Read the sig. What does that tell you?

That you're Irish??

I don't have signatures turned on, but I am "fighting" you because you are wrong.

My sig says

An open mind is like a fortress with its gates unbarred and unguarded.

Basically, I can never be wrong. If I said the sky was a shade of purple, then in my mind, it would in fact, be lavender.

My sig says

An open mind is like a fortress with its gates unbarred and unguarded.

Basically, I can never be wrong. If I said the sky was a shade of purple, then in my mind, it would in fact, be lavender.

So, the questions and claims being dumb are simply indicative of a larger issue? OK, then I will just have to take your self-denigration at face value.

And I personally prefer the name Britain. I am a democrat (in the widest sense, not necessarily the narrower US party sense) and a Paineite, and I await the day when I can say I come from the Federal Republic of Britain. :D

I HATE it when people call the UK "Britain". It's incorrect; Britain is only the island of England, Scotland and Wales.

They were allied with the country that later became the Nazis. In what sick, twisted dimension is that considered allying with Europe? Gee, I don't know... NATO, maybe?
Historical ties? You make it sound like my closest German relatives lived 200 years ago.I do? Not my intention. I really don't care.
Germany's immigration laws are about as soft as talc; combine that with my German heritage, and I could probably become a citizen by popping into the nearest consulate.Good for you.
If their reforms involve dropping islam, becoming less poor, and physically lifting Asian Turkey into Europe, I'm all for it.Really?!? I wasn't aware they were required to convert. Shit, that's embarrassing if somebody reads my old thesis...


Well, I'm done. This all has been discussed to death with your previous incarnations such as Kievan-Prussia and Greater Allemania. I'm sure you can look those threads up and see where I stand. Good day.

Gee, I don't know... NATO, maybe?

Yeah, come cowering to the United States when the Soviets are on your doorstep. Real allies.

Really?!? I wasn't aware they were required to convert. Shit, that's embarrassing if somebody reads my old thesis...

They're not, but they should be.

Kievan-Prussia and Greater Allemania.

Oh, I see.

I shall join you in parting.

Well, the US-states were never sovereign countries, they are equal to the German Bundesländer. And there is only one German coin-set.

Texas was a sovereign, independent nation from 1836 to 1845. at which point it became the 28th state of the US. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Texas

Hawaii was also once an independent nation.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hawaii#Republic_of_Hawaii

There may or may not be others.

Turkiye is cosmopolit, it has always been and it is countries one of greatest strenghts.Trying to fit my country into a description is meaningless and restraining for all involved parties.

The problem is not Turkiye belonging to EU or not, the problem is that EU that can't agree on its own description. But the bigger problem is trying to fit practical life in theories and classifications. If EU had managed to simply manage its goals then no one would have drown in these discussions needlesly. Such discussions only show the cluelessnes of where this entity is headed?

Oh, I see.

I shall join you in parting.

Good.

I HATE it when people call the UK "Britain". It's incorrect; Britain is only the island of England, Scotland and Wales.


No, you are as wrong about that as about almost everything else you witter about. The island is in fact called GREAT Britain. Britain is an acccepted short form of the full official name of the country, which is "The United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland," as you would know if you had bothered reading my previous posts on here. I will provide you again with the link. Incidentally, "England, Scotland and Wales" is not an island anyway. They each consist of part of the mainland of Great Britain plus numerous (especially in Scotland's case) other islands.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Britain

Please stop trying to lecture me about the name of the country I come from. Please stop displaying your racism and other ignorance quite so embarrassingly.

Why can't Turkey just be given a privileged partnership or something?

No, you are as wrong about that as about almost everything else you witter about. The island is in fact called GREAT Britain. Britain is an acccepted short form of the full official name of the country, which is "The United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland," as you would know if you had bothered reading my previous posts on here. I will provide you again with the link. Incidentally, "England, Scotland and Wales" is not an island anyway. They each consist of part of the mainland of Great Britain plus numerous (especially in Scotland's case) other islands.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Britain

Even though Britain is accepted as a short form of the country's name, it is fucking WRONG. It's only there for fools who can't distinguish between Great Britain, the UK, and England. Like your average American.

Please stop trying to lecture me about the name of the country I come from. Please stop displaying your racism and other ignorance quite so embarrassingly.

No.

Even though Britain is accepted as a short form of the country's name, it is fucking WRONG. It's only there for fools who can't distinguish between Great Britain, the UK, and England. Like your average American.



No.

I will repeat: the country is NOT called "Great Britain." Great Britain is the name of the largest island. Get your facts right, ignoramus. It is wrong to call the country "Great Britain." It is NOT wrong to call it "Britain."

I will repeat: the country is NOT called "Great Britain." Great Britain is the name of the largest island. Get your facts right, ignoramus. It is wrong to call the country "Great Britain." It is NOT wrong to call it "Britain."

*bashes head against keyboard*

I know I'm going to be banned for this, but GOD YOU'RE DUMB!

Great Britain is that fucking island. You know, the big fucking one east of Ireland?

England is a nation on said fucking island.

The United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland is the state which encompasses this island, as well as the northern part of Ireland.

Although Britain is an official short form for the UK, it is WRONG, because the British Isles consists of Great Britain and Ireland, and calling the UK "Britain" implies possession of Ireland.

Are we fucking done here?

Although Britain is an official short form for the UK, it is WRONG, because the British Isles consists of Great Britain and Ireland, and calling the UK "Britain" implies possession of Ireland.

When people say Britain, they do so as an abbreviation of "The United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland," rather than an abbreviation of "British Isles."

Although Britain is an official short form for the UK, it is WRONG, because the British Isles consists of Great Britain and Ireland, and calling the UK "Britain" implies possession of Ireland.

Are we fucking done here?


No, because it is you who is wrong.

"Britain" does not equate to "British Isles" and in no way implies ownership or any other relationship with Ireland.

Sheesh ... okay, from now on, the Island Formerly Known As Britain is now officially designated Airstrip One. It has always been designated Airstrip One.

Sheesh ... okay, from now on, the Island Formerly Known As Britain is now officially designated Airstrip One. It has always been designated Airstrip One.

Yeah, but now everyone is going to bitch about whether it refers to all of Oceania or just part of it.

I'd say if Turkey were admitted in to the EU they should use the Hagia Sophia. It's a historically significant piece of architecture that has a lot of symbolism behind it, and its religious and architectural history effectively combines both Islamic and Christian elements as well as European and Middle Eastern cultural influences.

Plus, it's uncontroversial...who the hell is offended by a timeless historical landmark?

Yeah, but now everyone is going to bitch about whether it refers to all of Oceania or just part of it.

:headbang:

1. Turkey is geographically European.
2. My country is in the EU and I hope we never join the third stage of the EMU, so I won't be playing along with "pick the pic," even if we would probably just do what we've done with the krona: put the monarch's mug on them.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/5/54/Swedish_10krona_2001_front.jpg

Only 3% of Turkey is in Europe. 97% is in Asia.

Only 3% of Turkey is in Europe. 97% is in Asia.

Yup. Turkey is both European and Asian. We've already established this, my racist friend.

Only 3% of Turkey is in Europe. 97% is in Asia.

I'm sure the Greeks would give them a good price for Turkey-in-Europe.

Only 3% of Turkey is in Europe. 97% is in Asia.

It's irrelevant about what percentage is in either, but at least you've admitted that Turkey is also in Europe. (Thusly giving it every right to ask to join- like all other states)

1. Turkey is geographically European.


only 5% of it.

They don't count because they did not have the choice the 15 old ones got. All the new ones will adopt the euro.

no. poland looks like it's trying to exploit a loophole here, is it is one of the few new members who did not join ERM 2 upon entry.

It's irrelevant about what percentage is in either, but at least you've admitted that Turkey is also in Europe. (Thusly giving it every right to ask to join- like all other states)

Only after Spain joins the African Union and France joins NAFTA and Mercousour(sp?).

Yup. Turkey is both European and Asian. We've already established this, my racist friend.

Then France is European, North American, South American, Ocenian and African.

Only after Spain joins the African Union and France joins NAFTA and Mercousour(sp?).

there is an african union too? someone save this world.

there is an african union too? someone save this world.

AU is nowhere near moronic as EU...I like the European flag and anthem tho...

Only after Spain joins the African Union and France joins NAFTA and Mercousour(sp?).

Not really no. Like all foreign possessions they are entitled to the same EU rights/laws et al as Continental Europe. Ceuta, Martinique etc etc are considered foreign possessions- much like Gibraltar or Falklands, not part of the county proper.

The same cannot be said for European Turkey. Turkish-North Cyrpus, maybe.

AU is nowhere near moronic as EU...I like the European flag and anthem tho...

yeah the AU has not yert been hijacked into an attempt to create a totalitarian superstate.


by the way, the EU anthem is stolen. it's the ode to joy, which is much older then the eu, and should not be used as its national anthem.

by the way, the EU anthem is dtolen. it's the ode to joy, which is much older then the eu, and should not be used as its national anthem.

I love that.

"The anthem is stolen". Not "adopted" . :rolleyes:

In another thread I hinted that, if Turkey can become a member of EU, thus widening EU membership to non-geographically-european countries, then also Australia, New Zealand and Canada can become members of EU and adopt the Euro as currency instead of the local $.

Euro-coins have all the same picture on one side. The picture on the other side is left to each country to decide. Here's the link to the European Central Bank with all the pictures.

http://www.euro.ecb.eu/en/section/euro0/specific.html

If your country was to join EU, what pictures would you like it to choose for the Euro-coins?



0.01 € - Banksia tree
0.02 € - Eucalypt tree
0.05 € - Wattle tree
0.10 € - Platypus
0.20 € - Kookaburra
0.50 € - Kangaroo
1.00 € - Uluru (Ayers Rock)
2.00 € - Eureka Stockade flag (Southern Cross)

I don't care if they have territory in Europe. It's not enough. They need to have most of their land, or population, in Europe. And they need an overtly European culture, and that means religion too.

What is European religion? Islam has a role in European history. The Moors controlled the Iberian Peninsula for a long time. The Ottomans controlled a large part of Southern Europe. What about present-day Albania? It is about 70% Muslim. Bosnia and Herzegovina's largest religion is Islam. I don't think that Turkey should be able to join, but there are much better reasons. They haven't put into place the reforms that EU requires quickly enough, still have gross human right issues, and don't recognise one of the member states. Islam isn't a reason to say 'no' to Turkey. If they cleaned up their act, I don't see why could not join, but at the rate they are going, I can't see it really happen. The EU would have to bend its own rules a lot to let Turkey in as it is today.

What is European religion? Islam has a role in European history. The Moors controlled the Iberian Peninsula for a long time. The Ottomans controlled a large part of Southern Europe. What about present-day Albania? It is about 70% Muslim. Bosnia and Herzegovina's largest religion is Islam. I don't think that Turkey should be able to join, but there are much better reasons. They haven't put into place the reforms that EU requires quickly enough, still have gross human right issues, and don't recognise one of the member states. Islam isn't a reason to say 'no' to Turkey. If they cleaned up their act, I don't see why could not join, but at the rate they are going, I can't see it really happen. The EU would have to bend its own rules a lot to let Turkey in as it is today.

In the case of Iberia and southern Europe, they were invasions. Do you considered Christianity to be an Asian religion because they invaded during the Crusades?

In the case of Iberia and southern Europe, they were invasions. Do you considered Christianity to be an Asian religion because they invaded during the Crusades?

Yes. Christianity had a major role in Asia historically. Certainly Russia is part of Asia, what is their major religion? There are large populations of Christians in Lebanon and Palestine. You also ignored that I stated that Islam is the largest religion in Albania and Bosnia and Herzegovina. Are they not European?

Then France is European, North American, South American, Ocenian and African.

The status of France's overseas territories has recently changed, but at the very least Guadeloupe, Réunion, French Guyana and Martinique are still considered part of France (rather than be external territories administered by France). Hence yes, France is at least European, American and African.

And it should be noted that France is or has been a member of international Oceanian organisations, indicating its status as an Oceanian country.

If their reforms involve dropping islam,

I'm sure my French Muslim acquaintances would be very surprised to hear they have to "drop Islam" in order to be considered EU citizens.

Oh, wait. They don't. Just as I don't need to convert to Christianity, and just as my Jewish friends don't need to "drop" Judaism.

Christianity is not a requirement for EU membership. France is a founding member despite being a secular country with full seperation of Church and State.


adopting an Indo-European language,

Ridiculous. Having a specific language has never been a specific requirement for membership. And I'm all in favour of linguistic diversity. The EU will be culturally richer for it.


becoming less poor,

Actually, that is a requirement. In relative terms. Eastern Europe wasn't kept out, after all...


and physically lifting Asian Turkey into Europe, I'm all for it.

:rolleyes:

You'd oppose Russian membership (if Russia ever became a proper democracy), would you?

In the case of Iberia and southern Europe, they were invasions. Do you considered Christianity to be an Asian religion because they invaded during the Crusades?

no its an asian religion because it originated in asia.

What is European religion? Islam has a role in European history. The Moors controlled the Iberian Peninsula for a long time. The Ottomans controlled a large part of Southern Europe. What about present-day Albania? It is about 70% Muslim. Bosnia and Herzegovina's largest religion is Islam. I don't think that Turkey should be able to join, but there are much better reasons. They haven't put into place the reforms that EU requires quickly enough, still have gross human right issues, and don't recognise one of the member states. Islam isn't a reason to say 'no' to Turkey. If they cleaned up their act, I don't see why could not join, but at the rate they are going, I can't see it really happen. The EU would have to bend its own rules a lot to let Turkey in as it is today.

don't forget cyprus. that's in the middle east

adopting an Indo-European language,

your right!
let's kick out the finnish, hungarians and estonians. they have no right to be in the EU!!!

your right!
let's kick out the finnish, hungarians and estonians. they have no right to be in the EU!!!

Don't forget the Basque people too.

Don't forget the Basque people too.

yeah but i would have meant it with them;)

your right!
let's kick out the finnish, hungarians and estonians. they have no right to be in the EU!!!

since when were those languages not indo-european?

since when were those languages not indo-european?

Finnish, Hungarian (Magyar), and Estonian are Finno-Ugric languages.

In the case of Iberia and southern Europe, they were invasions. Do you considered Christianity to be an Asian religion because they invaded during the Crusades?
Do you consider Christianity a European religion because it was founded in the area of modern day Israel and Palestine?

Finnish, Hungarian (Magyar), and Estonian are Finno-Ugric languages.

yup

In the case of Iberia and southern Europe, they were invasions. Do you considered Christianity to be an Asian religion because they invaded during the Crusades?

Christianity is actually a middle eastern religion. Of course I don't want to ruin your imagination of aryan Christ but you know ;) Anatolia (Turkiye) is full of christian history, and not just at the west of Turkiye, there are cave temples and artifacts, stories etc. at the easternmost parts of Turkiye. Christ was further south further east then we were and he is the figure that you put into center of Christianity and western culture. Your attempts to isolate european culture into single source of Rome and the greek culture effecting it is entirely wrong. the trade of goods and culture in this region is always incredible. All the cultural and technolgical achievments of east had flowed to west by this place. The european culture has its roots at middle east but since you are not actually trained to objectively learn whole world cultures but only indoctrinated with propaganda raising European culture to heavens and condemning rest to hell. Entirely ignoring any connections to other cultures, its truly cultural fascism.
But hell, you are so doctrinated with Roman view its your constant urge to call anyone else barbarian, even true europeans like Germans denying to accept imposed views on them by Christian church. The rest of europe was evenly bloodthirsty as germans were but its always them who is blamed. The germans started WW1 but rest of europe was getting ready for it too.
Let me remind you that Turks allied with Germans at WW1 but after that we created a new democracy whereas 'European' germans started 3.th reich. And those truly Roman Italians started fascism. French happily agreed fascism and I don't remember Austria or many other countries being unhappy about it too?Until of course war changed its course.
When noone else helped them we protected all Jews that made it into Turkiye. Not only at WW2 but at the massacres in Spain too. So we know what human rights are, better than europe. Did you actually knew that professor Einstein were to live and work at Turkiye if the pay were as good at its offered in Usa? Of course not, you only know the cliches from old war propaganda booklets.

Christianity is actually a middle eastern religion. Of course I don't want to ruin your imagination of aryan Christ but you know ;)


but, but...

christ was blond and blue eyed, around 6 feet tall and spoke an indo-european language.

No amount of anti-west neo-islamo-fascist revisionist propaganda can change that!
so there:upyours:

(joking)

In fact, Turkey is more secular than many other European countries. E.g, in many places, the headscarf is forbidden.

I see more problems with Turkey in the large nationalism. So they still belive there was no Armenian genocide. And now they introduced a law which forbids blaming the Turkey.

Another problem is cyprus, and their policy against the curds.

But this doesn't change the fact, that Turkey is an European country.

The status of France's overseas territories has recently changed, but at the very least Guadeloupe, Réunion, French Guyana and Martinique are still considered part of France (rather than be external territories administered by France). Hence yes, France is at least European, American and African.

And it should be noted that France is or has been a member of international Oceanian organisations, indicating its status as an Oceanian country.

So France is European, American and African. Denmark is North American. Norway and UK Antartican. Anyone see the retardation there?

I'm sure my French Muslim acquaintances would be very surprised to hear they have to "drop Islam" in order to be considered EU citizens.

Oh, wait. They don't. Just as I don't need to convert to Christianity, and just as my Jewish friends don't need to "drop" Judaism.

Christianity is not a requirement for EU membership. France is a founding member despite being a secular country with full seperation of Church and State.


"Christianity" is also part of the culture, from architecture to laws...



Ridiculous. Having a specific language has never been a specific requirement for membership. And I'm all in favour of linguistic diversity. The EU will be culturally richer for it.



Actually, that is a requirement. In relative terms. Eastern Europe wasn't kept out, after all...



:rolleyes:

You'd oppose Russian membership (if Russia ever became a proper democracy), would you?

I would. EU shouldnt have a country bordering China and Mongolia and Japan.

Christianity is actually a middle eastern religion. Of course I don't want to ruin your imagination of aryan Christ but you know ;) Anatolia (Turkiye) is full of christian history, and not just at the west of Turkiye, there are cave temples and artifacts, stories etc. at the easternmost parts of Turkiye. Christ was further south further east then we were and he is the figure that you put into center of Christianity and western culture. Your attempts to isolate european culture into single source of Rome and the greek culture effecting it is entirely wrong. the trade of goods and culture in this region is always incredible. All the cultural and technolgical achievments of east had flowed to west by this place. The european culture has its roots at middle east but since you are not actually trained to objectively learn whole world cultures but only indoctrinated with propaganda raising European culture to heavens and condemning rest to hell. Entirely ignoring any connections to other cultures, its truly cultural fascism.
But hell, you are so doctrinated with Roman view its your constant urge to call anyone else barbarian, even true europeans like Germans denying to accept imposed views on them by Christian church. The rest of europe was evenly bloodthirsty as germans were but its always them who is blamed. The germans started WW1 but rest of europe was getting ready for it too.
Let me remind you that Turks allied with Germans at WW1 but after that we created a new democracy whereas 'European' germans started 3.th reich. And those truly Roman Italians started fascism. French happily agreed fascism and I don't remember Austria or many other countries being unhappy about it too?Until of course war changed its course.
When noone else helped them we protected all Jews that made it into Turkiye. Not only at WW2 but at the massacres in Spain too. So we know what human rights are, better than europe. Did you actually knew that professor Einstein were to live and work at Turkiye if the pay were as good at its offered in Usa? Of course not, you only know the cliches from old war propaganda booklets.


I've been to Turkey. It felt like Middle East. Anyways:


Recently, the ministry of education itself was outraged over the fact that several publishing companies had, on their own initiative, rewritten children's books that the ministry had recommended for classroom use. In the edited versions, Pinocchio, Heidi and Tom Sawyer live in an Islamic world where inhabitants wish each other a "blessed morning" or ask for food "in Allah's name." Aramis, one of the Three Musketeers, even converts to Islam.


http://www.spiegel.de/international/spiegel/0,1518,446163,00.html


ROFL!

turkey is in the middle east. (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/e/ec/GreaterMiddleEast2.png)

Christianity is actually a middle eastern religion. Of course I don't want to ruin your imagination of aryan Christ but you know ;) Anatolia (Turkiye) is full of christian history, and not just at the west of Turkiye, there are cave temples and artifacts, stories etc. at the easternmost parts of Turkiye. Christ was further south further east then we were and he is the figure that you put into center of Christianity and western culture. Your attempts to isolate european culture into single source of Rome and the greek culture effecting it is entirely wrong. the trade of goods and culture in this region is always incredible. All the cultural and technolgical achievments of east had flowed to west by this place. The european culture has its roots at middle east but since you are not actually trained to objectively learn whole world cultures but only indoctrinated with propaganda raising European culture to heavens and condemning rest to hell. Entirely ignoring any connections to other cultures, its truly cultural fascism.
But hell, you are so doctrinated with Roman view its your constant urge to call anyone else barbarian, even true europeans like Germans denying to accept imposed views on them by Christian church. The rest of europe was evenly bloodthirsty as germans were but its always them who is blamed. The germans started WW1 but rest of europe was getting ready for it too.
Let me remind you that Turks allied with Germans at WW1 but after that we created a new democracy whereas 'European' germans started 3.th reich. And those truly Roman Italians started fascism. French happily agreed fascism and I don't remember Austria or many other countries being unhappy about it too?Until of course war changed its course.
When noone else helped them we protected all Jews that made it into Turkiye. Not only at WW2 but at the massacres in Spain too. So we know what human rights are, better than europe. Did you actually knew that professor Einstein were to live and work at Turkiye if the pay were as good at its offered in Usa? Of course not, you only know the cliches from old war propaganda booklets.

when turkey admits to the armenian genocide, you might be able to argue some of these points, but i'm sorry turkeys human right record is abysmal.
Oh and when a military ruler takes over a country it is a dicatorship (ie ataturk's enlightened authoritarianism).

You are partially correct. But "the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland" is more or less never named in full, and "Britain" is an accepted short form, as is United Kingdom.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_Isles_%28terminology%29

As you can see here, "United Kingdom" is as much an abbreviation of the full official name of the country as is "Britain" although both are accepted and quasi-official through usage.

nope. many would disagree with you. britian and the uk are different things.

No, you are as wrong about that as about almost everything else you witter about. The island is in fact called GREAT Britain. Britain is an acccepted short form of the full official name of the country, which is "The United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland," as you would know if you had bothered reading my previous posts on here. I will provide you again with the link. Incidentally, "England, Scotland and Wales" is not an island anyway. They each consist of part of the mainland of Great Britain plus numerous (especially in Scotland's case) other islands.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Britain

Please stop trying to lecture me about the name of the country I come from. Please stop displaying your racism and other ignorance quite so embarrassingly.

i'm pretty sure its an island.

I will repeat: the country is NOT called "Great Britain." Great Britain is the name of the largest island. Get your facts right, ignoramus. It is wrong to call the country "Great Britain." It is NOT wrong to call it "Britain."

you just said it wasnt an island.

britain refers to england, scotland and wales

uk includes northern ireland

When people say Britain, they do so as an abbreviation of "The United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland," rather than an abbreviation of "British Isles."

come over here and try convince people that.

Aren't they getting all the 1c and 2c coins back? They've been rounding to 5c in the Netherlands for a while now

i throw my 1, 2 and 5 cent-coins into a box and go to the bank when it's full.
jea, i know, you should do this because of inflation and stuff but i don't want to carry around 2kg of coins to get myself some ice-cream xD

i throw my 1, 2 and 5 cent-coins into a box and go to the bank when it's full.
jea, i know, you should do this because of inflation and stuff but i don't want to carry around 2kg of coins to get myself some ice-cream xD

When I am in France, I save them to buy postage for letters because the automatic machines take them. It takes a bit longer but it is an easy way to get rid of them.

Christianity is actually a middle eastern religion.

No, it was a Middle Eastern cult. It became a European religion.

but, but...

christ was blond and blue eyed, around 6 feet tall and spoke an indo-european language.

No amount of anti-west neo-islamo-fascist revisionist propaganda can change that!
so there:upyours:

(joking)

Actually, Jesus looked like this guy:

http://media.popularmechanics.com/images/tb_jesuslead-lg.jpg

Actually, Jesus looked like this guy:

http://media.popularmechanics.com/images/tb_jesuslead-lg.jpg

as i said

but, but...

christ was blond and blue eyed, around 6 feet tall and spoke an indo-european language.

No amount of anti-west neo-islamo-fascist revisionist propaganda can change that!
SO THERE

anyway i thought jesus look more like this (http://www.queenofpeace.ca/Mel_Gibson.jpg)

I don't care if they have territory in Europe. It's not enough. They need to have most of their land, or population, in Europe. And they need an overtly European culture, and that means religion too.
I'm sorry to tell you, but you don't make the definitions here. Besides, Turkey's culture isn't allt hat typically Asian, either... But if you take a look at the Greek culture, you'll find an amazing number of parallels. And you don't say Greece isn't European in culture, or do you?


Texas was a sovereign, independent nation from 1836 to 1845. at which point it became the 28th state of the US. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Texas

Hawaii was also once an independent nation.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hawaii#Republic_of_Hawaii

There may or may not be others.
In 1780, what is now Germany consisted of 1800 sovereign nations. Some of them, as Saxony and Bavaria, are now federal states. :p



by the way, the EU anthem is stolen. it's the ode to joy, which is much older then the eu, and should not be used as its national anthem.
So? The German anthem is also older than the Federal Republic Of Germany, too. By the way, Europe has no official anthem, let alone a national one.


I would. EU shouldnt have a country bordering China and Mongolia and Japan.
More opinion from someone whose country is not an EU member...

No, it was a Middle Eastern cult. It became a European religion.
So basically there's nothing wrong with Islam becoming a European religion.

I'm sorry to tell you, but you don't make the definitions here. Besides, Turkey's culture isn't allt hat typically Asian, either... But if you take a look at the Greek culture, you'll find an amazing number of parallels. And you don't say Greece isn't European in culture, or do you?



In 1780, what is now Germany consisted of 1800 sovereign nations. Some of them, as Saxony and Bavaria, are now federal states. :p



So? The German anthem is also older than the Federal Republic Of Germany, too. By the way, Europe has no official anthem, let alone a national one.


More opinion from someone whose country is not an EU member...
Oh give it up already. One is genetically, the other medically, unable to get what you are saying. Save your breath.

Finnish, Hungarian (Magyar), and Estonian are Finno-Ugric languages.

isnt't that a subcategory of Indo-European Languages?

isnt't that a subcategory of Indo-European Languages?No, Sir. Not even close.

Oh give it up already. One is genetically, the other medically, unable to get what you are saying. Save your breath.
You're propably right.

isnt't that a subcategory of Indo-European Languages?

They are not even mildly related.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indo-European_languages

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Finno_Ugric

The Finno-Ugric languages are a subcategory of the Uralic Languages.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Uralic_languages

They are not even mildly related.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indo-European_languages

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Finno_Ugric

The Finno-Ugric languages are a subcategory of the Uralic Languages.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Uralic_languagesYep.

Listen to the guy. You could listen to me too, but why bother

Aren't they getting all the 1c and 2c coins back? They've been rounding to 5c in the Netherlands for a while now

Only supermarkets and some other shops that specifically noted it. I know at least one store (mine) where they still use them. They're also still printed here :)

Only supermarkets and some other shops that specifically noted it. I know at least one store (mine) where they still use them. They're also still printed here :)"Minted" in the case of coins ;)

I'm sorry to tell you, but you don't make the definitions here. Besides, Turkey's culture isn't allt hat typically Asian, either... But if you take a look at the Greek culture, you'll find an amazing number of parallels. And you don't say Greece isn't European in culture, or do you?


Ah yes, ancient Turkish architecture, just like Partheon. Ancient Turkish cities with their democracies.


In 1780, what is now Germany consisted of 1800 sovereign nations. Some of them, as Saxony and Bavaria, are now federal states. :p



So? The German anthem is also older than the Federal Republic Of Germany, too. By the way, Europe has no official anthem, let alone a national one.


More opinion from someone whose country is not an EU member...

But unfortunately has open borders with EU.

Oh give it up already. One is genetically, the other medically, unable to get what you are saying. Save your breath.

LOL. Perfect example of pshychological reflection.

Yep.

Listen to the guy. You could listen to me too, but why bother

Comply with your own advice. Dont waste your "breath" with writing any more retarded comments.

Ah yes, ancient Turkish architecture, just like Partheon. Ancient Turkish cities with their democracies.

you mean Parthenon, don't you?

So basically there's nothing wrong with Islam becoming a European religion.

Sure. They'll only have to go through two thousand years of enlightenment.

Ah yes, ancient Turkish architecture, just like Partheon. Ancient Turkish cities with their democracies.
Cities like Pergamon?:D

Sure. They'll only have to go through two thousand years of enlightenment.
Europe didn't. They went through 1500 years of slaughtering each other first.

Either way, the beauty is that modern people don't need 500 years of philosophical thought, scientific discoveries and social upheaval - it's all been done for them. Immigrants just need to accept some of the results of those 500 years basically.

If they want to, fine, they can live in Europe. If they don't want to, that's fine too, but they can do that at home. Simple really.

Comply with your own advice. Dont waste your "breath" with writing any more retarded comments.

What's that all about then?

Ah yes, ancient Turkish architecture, just like Partheon. Ancient Turkish cities with their democracies.

The Parthenon.

Well, the US-states were never sovereign countries, they are equal to the German Bundesländer. And there is only one German coin-set.

The reason, that every Euro-country may make its one coins is, that in old times only the king was allowed to mint coins. This traditions survived.

BTW: There are also some very small Euro-countries which aren't member of the EU. (Monaco, Vatican, San Marino, Andorra) Their coins are very rare and very valuable for colletors.

The original 13 US states did have independent money. They were 13 different nations or states. Thus the United States of America instead of just America. Texas was its own nation with its own currency. California was also a republic but did not have an official currency other then the San Francisco gold rush coins.

http://www.frbsf.org/currency/bills.html