NationStates Jolt Archive

What if the US elected an INDEPENDENT Congress?

A Socialist, libertarian, or green one, assumably...

But what would happen? And OI know it's farfetched. it's a "what if", so answer the question!

I would be absolutely ecstatic, I hate democrats, I hate republicans. To me their both corrupt whiny bastards who care much, much more about their own asses then they do about the will of the american public.

BTW: good poll, there isn't a single answer that makes one bit of sense.

Easy: Things would get MUCH better.

What if the US elected an INDEPENDENT Congress?

A Socialist, libertarian, or green one, assumably...

But what would happen? And OI know it's farfetched. it's a "what if", so answer the question!

simple. It will be a sight to behold. and their best chance, so they better NOT screw it up.

in order to get anything done. congress would have to break into factions. not unlike the parlimentary system but without a vote of confidence provision. it might be solid, with the socialists and greens forging an alliance or it might be fluid depending on the issue.

in order to keep the government running, the president would have to find a majority of legisilators that he could work with and he would have to compromise in order to get bills and budgets passed that he could accept instead of veto.

the big 2 would immediately start to scramble in order to grab whatever issues they think caused the public to vote for these other parties and woo their natural constituents back by proclaiming that they have always been pro <whatever>. next time it would be back to a 2 party system but the 2 parties would be transformed to some extent by having to deal with the will of the people for a change.

Having more than two big parties means than in many occassions you will have Congress where there's no majority and this will force them to negotiate between each other instead of filibustering and voting along the lines.

define "independents"

there are as many whackjob independant conservatives as there are whackjob independent liberals.

I see as many moderates in the parties as I see outside of the parties.


Say what you will about the party system, it gives a good measure of a candidate. Knowing nothing about the person other than the D or R next to his name, I know a lot more about him than someone with an I.

let's put it this way:

In the bag of fruit labeled "Apples", there are some rotten apples, and there are some great apples. Same way with a bag of Oranges. Delve into the bag marked "Other" and you are just as likely to come up with a pinapple as a grape, and there is still no guarantee if it's rotten or not.

What if the US elected an INDEPENDENT Congress?

A Socialist, libertarian, or green one, assumably...

But what would happen? And OI know it's farfetched. it's a "what if", so answer the question!

I'd start pumping my money into the Dems. All of those parties are too extreme to be left to running any country.

In short... Ew.

What if the US elected an INDEPENDENT Congress?

A Socialist, libertarian, or green one, assumably...

But what would happen? And OI know it's farfetched. it's a "what if", so answer the question!

1.I would like US policies a lot more than I do today.
2.I would know that there's some differencies between parties in the US political chessboard... as seen from many people here in the EU, Democrats and Republicans are quite similar, at least in foreign and labour policies - both right-winged.
3.I would give a serious thought about looking for a job in the US (at least for that congress term, I'm too european to live in the US for the rest of my life)
4.I think that the poll turnouts would increase a lot, maybe even over 50% of the potential voters!!!

cum amicis. no idea what it means but it sounds funny....

i just voted for something bad, didn't i...

you have to vote in johhny the impaler. (http://www.boingboing.net/2006/01/13/satanist_runs_for_go.html)

his website crashed so i gave the above link.

I don't live in america, and I am glad my country has a system with more than 2 parties.

cum amicis. no idea what it means but it sounds funny....

i just voted for something bad, didn't i...

It means "with friends". Think of that what you will... :eek: :p

I don't live in america, and I am glad my country has a system with more than 2 parties.

Yep. I always find it a bit surprising that Americans consider a two-party system normal. Here in France we have several parties in Parliament. A two-party system would be seen by many as rather un-democratic.

Still, if Americans feel its works for them, why not.

mostly we'd look like italy

not a pretty sight

Besides the fact it would never happen for a number of reasons, the problem lies in the fact that there isn't a single "independent" party. There are a number of third parties who are not allied and do not agree. In fact, most hold the worst and most despised beliefs of the two major parties. Unless they took complete control of Congress, none of the stuff you would want them to pass, like free marijuana, would pass, but plenty of the things Democrats and Republicans pass that you don't like will keep passing. And no one is immune to lobbyists.

What if the US elected an INDEPENDENT Congress?

A Socialist, libertarian, or green one, assumably...

But what would happen? And OI know it's farfetched. it's a "what if", so answer the question!It is farfetched. What would likely happen is that the new party would get drunk with power before it has enough experience to handle congress. I'd prefer the scenario of a sizable fraction of congress going to a third party, forcing coalition building.

Is it likely that an independent Congress could be elected? It's damn near impossible in 2006. It's highly unlikely in 2008. And it's difficuly in the future under the current system.

Remember, there are 435 districts in the U.S. I'll assume that some districts will be filled by party ideologues no matter what. Nancy Pelosi's district will likely be filled by a party-line Democrat in any circumstance under the current setup. Conversely, Dennis Hastert's district will be filled by a party-line Republican. I'll carve up about...say, 50 districts that will be filled by party-line ideologues.

The two-party system has the following built-in safeguard - in order to put a party people hate out of power, they feel like they have to vote for the other major party; therefore, since the anti-GOP faction wants them out of power, they feel that only the Dems get them there. Therefore, an independent takeover will have to begin when one party is entrenched in power.

Let's say that, for argument's sake, 20 years from now in 2026, the GOP has a stranglehold on the House. We'll just say they have an advantage of, I don't know, 260-173 with two independents in places like Vermont and Idaho. Basically, the GOP has to lose 43 seats to lose a majority, but picking up 30 seats for a two-thirds majority is far-fetched. Also, the two independents in Vermont and Idaho are, against all odds, making themselves a force in Congress, or at least one of them is. Independents have some legitimacy, and people are weary of the GOP; at the same time, they think the Dems can't put anything together and take Congress. The next thing people know, independent candidates pop up all over the place in districts in larger states. Sure, a few would appear in areas like Montana or the Dakotas or even Alaska, where a big-government, authoritarian party may not sit well (just for argument's sake, we'll say that the 2026 Congress is even more in-your-face than the 2006 one.) The independents are remarkable for their success, pandering to people who are weary of GOP rule. The GOP isn't too upset about it, since they have their majority. Let's just say they lose about 20 seats and the Democrats lose the same number; now there are 42 independents.

It's 2028. The Democrats are freaking out, down to 153 people in Congress to the GOP's 240. The GOP can do pretty much as it pleases in the House, but the independents are still trying to make life difficult for the majority party. Soon enough, they have more legitimacy as opposition to the majority than the Dems do. Also, increased weariness of the GOP turns many people to independent or Democratic candidates. However, with 42 people in Congress, independent candidates are making themselves known. GOP scare tactics include making people afraid of what an independent Congress would do. Who knows; they might give aid and comfort to the Wahhabists who run Saudi Arabia (remember, it's 22 years away; I have to predict future events,) raise taxes, or go soft on Kim Jong-chul, third-generation dictator of North Korea who once threatened a visiting Japanese ambassador with a nuclear strike (again, I made that up.)

The point is, the independents, some of whom are third-party members but are lumped in with independents, gain power in 2028, mostly from Democratic seats. The GOP still has 225 seats and is seeing its power dwindle; independents now have almost as many seats (we'll say 96) as the Dems do (that leaves 114.) The GOP elects the President, since no independent candidate can gain a state bigger than Oregon and their votes are split with the Dems. Forming a large party of independents is impractical, since some Congress members are Libertarians while others are Greens or Reformists. Libertarians make up the largest third-party membership in Congress at the time of the 2028 elections.

In 2030, the GOP continues its scare tactics, but the nation is ready to knock them from power, and by now, there are three factions - the deposed GOP, the withering Dems, and the growing independents. The setup becomes like that of Japan, where one major party co-exists with other parties (though Japan's LDP seems to be in power more than this GOP would.) The GOP finds itself having to form coalitions and actually work with the Democrats, with whom they would have a combined majority. However, ideologues on both sides would prevent any major coalition between the two parties; if the moderate Democrats splintered off and joined a GOP majority, the Democratic Republicans would hold a majority and the ideologue Democrats would become a minor party in a one-party state.

Then, after that happens, say, ten years after the first major breakthrough of independents, the Democratic Republicans lose their majority and Congress is run partially by regional and previously marginalized parties. It does away with the two-party stranglehold, but who knows what would come of it? Maybe a PR system would be in order if enough independents get through.

Sorry, this is a bit of a long speculation. Yes, it's speculation. Don't go whining about how batshit insane it is; of course it's batshit insane. It would never work. But it's what would need to happen in order to get some third-party candidates into Congress.

Actually, we'd lose a party (or more likely, they'd merge with a bit of fallout) and we'd have two parties again. We haven't always had Reps and Dems, but we've had two parties...

Actually, we'd lose a party (or more likely, they'd merge with a bit of fallout) and we'd have two parties again. We haven't always had Reps and Dems, but we've had two parties...

In time, that's what would happen...assuming it doesn't become one party against a bunch of opposition. The opposition may congeal into another party eventually, but the Greens won't be likely to join forces with the Libertarians. So congealing like that is difficult.

What exactly is the thread title meant to mean?

What exactly is the thread title meant to mean?

I think it's a reference to if there were 3 parties in Congress. Why he picked such a cryptic title I'm not sure.

What exactly is the thread title meant to mean?

How this will never occur with a 3rd party so that NOONE WOULD WASTE SPACE DISCUSING IT, BUT NOONE COULD RESIST, SO IT FAILED.

I am not that angry, but... :p :p :p

What if the US elected an INDEPENDENT Congress?

A Socialist, libertarian, or green one, assumably...

Your question makes no sense. If the US elected mostly independents, so that independents were the majority, how could that be "assumably" one of the third parties?

And, if it happened, I would take it as a sign of intelligence in the voting populace that has not yet been seen.