NationStates Jolt Archive

Ok, it is a beautiful Fall day here in the Holy Land, but I'm taking time off to get collect opinions from the biggest bunch of know--it--alls I can think of.

Air America has filed for Chapter 11 bankruptcy. This is after two and a half years of losing almost $40 million dollars. That's a lot of money! They intend to keep operating with funding from its investor group, led by RealNetworks Inc. CEO Robert Glaser, who owns 36.7 percent of the company, and two other former board members.

Good for them. Maybe they will finally find their audience, or more important, maybe they will find their sponsorship.

My thought are that they will not find either the audience that they need to attract sponsors, nor will they be broadcasting at this time next year. What's wrong? Certainly there are enough unhappy Democrats and Bush-hating liberals to provide a core audience for the network. Do Dems and BHLs just not own radios? Or do they only tune in PBS broadcasts?

The real reason is probably in the programming. I don't think many of the Dems, nor even the hard--core BHLs can listen to two and a half years of political commericals. Not without a little entertainment, anyway.

When I travel into a market that is served by AA, I try to listen, but I usually just give up in disgust. The shows never seem to vary off the theme that Republicans are bad and Bush is the Devil. Even Limbaugh and Hannity realize the need for a little entertainment mixed into the Message from time to time. That's certainly why they are paid to broadcast, rather than operating in reverse.

What do y'all think about the situation? Is Air America devoid of entertainment? Is it's only function to influence elections? Have you sent your contribution to their Chapter 11 fund?

Article (http://www.ajc.com/business/content/shared-gen/ap/Finance_General/Air_America_Radio_Bankruptcy.html)

Its failure was generally a result of all around piss-poor logistics. The people who were running it simply had no idea how to run a radio station.

Who would want to listen to politics on the radio constantly? Look at NS general. We're a politically heavy message board, but even so there are more threads about music, science, Chuck Norris, odd news stories and other subjects than there are political threads. Politics gets boring for most people and the few who can listen to political programming all day are probably already politicians.

Air America is indeed quite unentertaining as far as liberal radio goes, especially when much better alternatives are around that appeal to much less political sensibilities: Democracy Now!, BBC World Service, National Public Radio, so many to choose from. I think the main reason why they would fail is because the left wing movement here does not really need to identify with a network like Air America: for a lot of the people on the left, being disgusted by the things going on right now is enough.

I think Air America was a solution for a problem that didn't, or at least does not now exist.

People weren't buying what AA was selling. Simple as that.

There's a reason conservative talk radio has achieved the success it has--a large audience wants to hear it, and advertisers know it.

AA was at best redundant to ABC/NBC/CBS/CNN/MSNBC/NPR/NYT/LAT/WP, and at worst was implacable far-left hate speech that even libs didn't want to listen to.

Good-bye, AA. You won't be missed.

Oh, and enjoy Election Day, it ought to give you something else to bitch about while you still have time left on-air :p

People weren't buying what AA was selling. Simple as that.

There's a reason conservative talk radio has achieved the success it has--a large audience wants to hear it, and advertisers know it.

AA was at best redundant to ABC/NBC/CBS/CNN/MSNBC/NPR/NYT/LAT/WP, and at worst was implacable far-left hate speech that even libs didn't want to listen to.

Good-bye, AA. You won't be missed.

Oh, and enjoy Election Day, it ought to give you something else to bitch about while you still have time left on-air :p

IMO, MSNBC & NBC aren't liberal media. NPR/NYT/CBS? Absoltutely.

Personally, I listen to lots of NPR and read the NY Post.

Who would want to listen to politics on the radio constantly? Look at NS general. We're a politically heavy message board, but even so there are more threads about music, science, Chuck Norris, odd news stories and other subjects than there are political threads. Politics gets boring for most people and the few who can listen to political programming all day are probably already politicians.

Absolutely.

The radio station near where my parents live that carries Rush Limbaugh also carries shows on sports, gardening, home repairs, crazy alien conspiracy stuff, religion, food and general humor. It attracts listeners because it's got variety, meanwhile, Air America has nothing even remotely resembling variety, and suffers therefore.

If it's remotely entertaining, people will listen/watch. Why do you think Fox News has been around as long as it has? If they aren't Conservatives enjoying the news, they're liberals laughing at Bill O'Reilly trying to sound smart by using big words. Some people like listening to idiots, after all.

Liberal minded people don't want to listen to ideologues run their mouths, even liberal ideologues.

Whoever was responsible for that station didnt understand that the know-nothing partisanship that makes conservative radio so popular with conservatives doesn't have a counterpoint in liberalism.

Liberal minded people don't seem interested in hearing liberal partisan banter, but rather in hearing genuine, intelligent, rigorous, thoughtful journalism.

This is why NPR is a good station, but air america was not. Also why the New York Times is the best news paper, &c.

The problem with conservative radio isnt that it has a conservative spin, it is that it has a spin to begin with. Liberal-spun radio wasn't a remedy for this at all.

I think a large part of the problem Air America has in establishing an audience was the original packaging. It came on the air as a network, not a big network, but a monolithic package of liberal radio, all the same. Most, if not all, of the popular syndicated shows didn't start out that way. Most built up a following in a single market and grew from there.

The other thing that strikes me about Air America is that they didn't get 'radio' people to anchor their big shows. Al Franken isn't a broadcaster. I'm not sure what Randi Rhodes background is, but I think radio is new to her, too. They just don't seem to have the qualities that are needed to go out and talk in an entertaining way for three or four hours a day.

If it's remotely entertaining, people will listen/watch. Why do you think Fox News has been around as long as it has? If they aren't Conservatives enjoying the news, they're liberals laughing at Bill O'Reilly trying to sound smart by using big words. Some people like listening to idiots, after all.


If people liked listening to idiots, Air America would not be in danger of going out of business.

Liberal programmers need to learn that personality is just as important, if not more so, than ideology when it comes to Talk Radio. Also, there just aren't as many people who want to listen to a liberal over a centrist/conservative talk show host. It is the general political leanings of this country.

plus, the people on Air America whine too much and also talked about idiotic 911 conspiracy theories.

Air America got pwned by United and some other airlines...! :eek:

There is no point complaining about what 'liberal minded' people do or do not want to listen to. I believe Al Gore, champion of the liberal minded, was one of the driving forces behind this CF. And so you have to wonder about the Ben Kenobi question if that's your reason for it's failure.

The plain fact is that Air America was awful to listen to. I spent the summer in DC, and not knowing the local AMs I ended up trying it a few times. Basically the on air talent was a nothing more than a 'smug' festival.

In other words it was just crap. It's failure has nothing to do with politics.

Al Gore is undoubtably a liberal minded person, but he is also capable of making mistakes, and was clearly mistaken with Air America Radio.

A liberal-partisan radio station, regardless of the talent, simply can't compete with genuine journalism for a thoughtful audience.

Again, the problem with conservative know-nothing radio stations isnt that they are conservative, it's that they are partisan.

Liberal minded people don't seem interested in hearing liberal partisan banter, but rather in hearing genuine, intelligent, rigorous, thoughtful journalism.


What about that near-riot at Columbia University? It seems to me that liberals are interested in equal opportunity and free speech, just not giving people they don't like the opportunity to speak of things they don't agree with.

What about that near-riot at Columbia University? It seems to me that liberals are interested in equal opportunity and free speech, just not giving people they don't like the opportunity to speak of things they don't agree with.

What in god's name do some disgruntled miscreants at columbia have to do with the discussion at hand?

Didnt some conservatives lynch black people in the south before? Who cares?

What about that near-riot at Columbia University? It seems to me that liberals are interested in equal opportunity and free speech, just not giving people they don't like the opportunity to speak of things they don't agree with.I'm not certain that the people who opposed the minutemen there were liberals. Liberalism isn't the whole of the left-wing, you know.

What in god's name do some disgruntled miscreants at columbia have to do with the discussion at hand?

Didnt some conservatives lynch black people in the south before? Who cares?

Actually, those were... you know, racists.

Or do you just automatically equate the KKK with the GOP?

Ok, it is a beautiful Fall day here in the Holy Land, but I'm taking time off to get collect opinions from the biggest bunch of know--it--alls I can think of.

Air America has filed for Chapter 11 bankruptcy. This is after two and a half years of losing almost $40 million dollars. That's a lot of money! They intend to keep operating with funding from its investor group, led by RealNetworks Inc. CEO Robert Glaser, who owns 36.7 percent of the company, and two other former board members.

Good for them. Maybe they will finally find their audience, or more important, maybe they will find their sponsorship.

My thought are that they will not find either the audience that they need to attract sponsors, nor will they be broadcasting at this time next year. What's wrong? Certainly there are enough unhappy Democrats and Bush-hating liberals to provide a core audience for the network. Do Dems and BHLs just not own radios? Or do they only tune in PBS broadcasts?

The real reason is probably in the programming. I don't think many of the Dems, nor even the hard--core BHLs can listen to two and a half years of political commericals. Not without a little entertainment, anyway.

When I travel into a market that is served by AA, I try to listen, but I usually just give up in disgust. The shows never seem to vary off the theme that Republicans are bad and Bush is the Devil. Even Limbaugh and Hannity realize the need for a little entertainment mixed into the Message from time to time. That's certainly why they are paid to broadcast, rather than operating in reverse.

What do y'all think about the situation? Is Air America devoid of entertainment? Is it's only function to influence elections? Have you sent your contribution to their Chapter 11 fund?

Article (http://www.ajc.com/business/content/shared-gen/ap/Finance_General/Air_America_Radio_Bankruptcy.html)



They are radical left Liberals for the most part with no experiance at actually making money in broadcasting.


So consider the fact that the vast majority of the US is moderate to conservative and that the people that actually have and spend money on whats advertised on "" air America"...well who are they ? whats the target demographic ? How much ranting and raving and conspiracy theories and Bush is Satan can you listen to ?

Rush Limbaugh..the Vicodan dude ..has the top rated radio talk show ...I dont know who two is,,,but three is a recovering alchoholic and born again or converted Christian...who is funny at times but..CONSERVATIVE ..along with most of the stations or shows that make any money...conservative ...

Why is that ?

Air America was not built to make money it was built to influence elections and press an agenda...they forgot to throw some " entertainment " and " money earning " into the mix...so why are suprised they failed ?

Look at the so called " talent " they employed...and look at the numbers they pulled in the ratings..DISMAL isnt strong enough..but they never adjusted.. ( Bill Mahr give him three hours a day...bet you get an audience...did they try ?

A doofus like hanity and a dingus like Colmes though can destroy the whole Air America Lineup with their combined ratings...BTW ratings determine how much you can charge for airtime ....how much cash you can make ....Liberals seem to think that just being liberals is enough to get paid .

Guess they were wrong ...again .

So they died . That simple .

Remember that Air America movie with Mel Gibson? Now that was good stuff.

I'm not certain that the people who opposed the minutemen there were liberals. Liberalism isn't the whole of the left-wing, you know.

Um... the "International Socialists" aren't left wing/liberals?

http://blog.case.edu/james.chang/2006/10/05/riot_at_columbia_university_free_speech_under_fire

...I'd post a "real" news cite, but CNN and the like haven't covered the story, and I have only seen it in the NY Post. I've also not heard it on NPR.

Or do you just automatically equate the KKK with the GOP?

The point just zoomed right over your head.

- - - - -

As for the question: "Did America fail because of the fact that liberals can't find a market?", the answer is not only no but "48% of the population, say what?"

People didn't like Air America because it was like being smothered in ego and smarmy self-important posturing. I couldn't stand listening to it. It made me feel downright dirty.

Remember that Air America movie with Mel Gibson? Now that was good stuff.

I liked that movie.

Actually, those were... you know, racists.

Or do you just automatically equate the KKK with the GOP?

You missed the point completely, the point is that it is incorrect to generalize from an unrepresentative sample.

Umm, guys? It's restructuring. It's not a death knell for Air America radio, so you're a bit early with the crowing and claiming victory. They're not going off the air, as some of you would so love for them to do, and in a number of markets, they're doing quite well. Plus, there's now a second liberal radio network--Jones--which is doing even better. They've got a stronger lineup with Ed Schultz and Stephanie Miller, and they're beating hell out of many conservatives right now, even though they've only been on two years.

Um... the "International Socialists" aren't left wing/liberals? They are left-wing, but they aren't liberals. Again, liberalism isn't the only ideology to be found on the left-wing.

Umm, guys? It's restructuring. It's not a death knell for Air America radio, so you're a bit early with the crowing and claiming victory. They're not going off the air, as some of you would so love for them to do, and in a number of markets, they're doing quite well. Plus, there's now a second liberal radio network--Jones--which is doing even better. They've got a stronger lineup with Ed Schultz and Stephanie Miller, and they're beating hell out of many conservatives right now, even though they've only been on two years.

I understand what Chapter 11 is. My question is more about what Air America has done wrong to lose over $40 million in two and a half years. They are fortunate to have rich backers, because any other similar venture would have folded in much less time. These aren't the dot-com days anymore. The consensus seems to agree with my impression that the network is too hard to listen to.

I've never heard of the other shows you mention, but they may be doing things the right way. That is starting with sponsorship and letting syndication come after some demonstrated successes.

And you're probably seeing something you want to see, rather than facts when you accuse conservatives of being happy about the failure of Air America to become self-sufficient. I suspect most of us who have ever listened to the network have done so because we wanted to hear a real liberal and hear real liberal ideas. If "I hate Bush" and "Republicans are stupid" is it, then I guess y'all are more shallow than I thought. I figured that there would be a place where something deeper than sound bites and campaign ads would get discussed.

Apparently, there is, but it's not Air America and they'll continue to suffer until they figure it out, or until their backers finally get tired of pouring money down that hole.

It looks like a nice hatch is starting on my creek, so I'm going to go out and enjoy one more morning of trout fishing. Next Saturday is the start of deer season for firearms, so I'll be back on sabbatical from NS until some bad weather crops up. See you.

Good riddens to Air America!!! :D

You missed the point completely, the point is that it is incorrect to generalize from an unrepresentative sample.

Oops, sorry 'bout that... How about a [/sarcasm]?

I understand what Chapter 11 is. My question is more about what Air America has done wrong to lose over $40 million in two and a half years. They are fortunate to have rich backers, because any other similar venture would have folded in much less time. These aren't the dot-com days anymore. The consensus seems to agree with my impression that the network is too hard to listen to.

I've never heard of the other shows you mention, but they may be doing things the right way. That is starting with sponsorship and letting syndication come after some demonstrated successes.

And you're probably seeing something you want to see, rather than facts when you accuse conservatives of being happy about the failure of Air America to become self-sufficient. I suspect most of us who have ever listened to the network have done so because we wanted to hear a real liberal and hear real liberal ideas. If "I hate Bush" and "Republicans are stupid" is it, then I guess y'all are more shallow than I thought. I figured that there would be a place where something deeper than sound bites and campaign ads would get discussed.

Apparently, there is, but it's not Air America and they'll continue to suffer until they figure it out, or until their backers finally get tired of pouring money down that hole.

It looks like a nice hatch is starting on my creek, so I'm going to go out and enjoy one more morning of trout fishing. Next Saturday is the start of deer season for firearms, so I'll be back on sabbatical from NS until some bad weather crops up. See you.

Radio is a tough business, and I think there's little doubt that Air America's original business plan wasflawed--plus they weren't as capitalized as the original people in charge led everyone to believe. I remember the "scandal" that surrounded that at first.

I wish I could find the site where I read it, but the problem is not Air America's ratings for the most part. In most of their markets, they're competitive at the very least. It's just that there's precious little room to manuever in radio in general, and you have to sell ad time based on what your ratings have been previously as opposed to what they are at the time. It's the same reason why for a couple of years after Fox News started beating CNN in the ratings, CNN was still able to charge more for TV spots than Fox was. Past performance was what was selling.

Air America may yet fail, and I may be here eating crow about it when it happens depending on how far into the future that is. But this is more than a bit early for people to begin celebrating its demise. Lots of companies come out of Chapter 11 strong.

P.S. There's a lot more to Air America than "Bush Sucks" and "Conservatives Suck." And whether or not you choose to believe it, a lot of that other is on Franken's show. The strongest part of his show is the interviews with policy wonks.