NationStates Jolt Archive

A 14 year old schoolgirl was arrested for racism and had to spend a few hours in jail before she was released. What did she do? She refused to work with a group of students who don't speak English. How the fuck is she supposed to work with people who don't even speak her language? Shouldn't non-English speaking pupils be in bilingual classes? Since when do people get arrested for racism? British laws sure are silly.


http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/articles/news/news.html?in_article_id=410150&in_page_id=1770

An over-the-top reaction to be sure, but that picture proves she's a future candidate for an ASBO if there ever was one.

Yep, she wears alot of jewellery and therefore must automatically be a criminal.

I wouldn't wanna fight with her!!

I bet she has a nice clown on the end of that chain. She would have put her Chav best jewellry on for a school photo:D

An over-the-top reaction to be sure, but that picture proves she's a future candidate for an ASBO if there ever was one.


Yes, because you can tell these things just by looking at someone... :rolleyes:

Yep, she wears alot of jewellery and therefore must automatically be a criminal.

yes? didn't you go to public school?

on that note there are people who don't speak English in an English school :confused:

Yes, because you can tell these things just by looking at someone... :rolleyes:

That and the fact she's from Worsley. It's not slam dunk evidence of chavness but if it looks like a duck, quacks like a duck...

A complaint was made to a police officer based full-time at the school,

What? Since when did Scottish schools have full time police officers?

Yes, because you can tell these things just by looking at someone... :rolleyes:
You think she's not?

Look at her and seriously tell me she won't have one before she's 20.

What? Since when did Scottish schools have full time police officers?

It's in England and sadly full time police at schools is becoming more common.

You think she's not?

Look at her and seriously tell me she won't have one before she's 20.

Good call on the premature judgment.

You think she's not?

Look at her and seriously tell me she won't have one before she's 20.

So she's not a rich hottie... she must be a crimina/welfare cheat/single mum.

Then that is rasicim plain and simple. By refusing to work with those who do not speak her language she is discriminating against them based soley on their lack of knowledge of her language. That by any definition of the term is racist.

We have many immigrants in our schools, and not all of them speak English, which is why I guees their parents choose to send them to English speaking schools.

What? Since when did Scottish schools have full time police officers?
Where does it say it's a Scottish school? It's in Salford, Manchester, and the Greater Manchester Police dealt with it.

I hate to agree with the Daily Mail, but they do have a point here. This was a massive over-reaction. Unless, of course, the girl is lying and this:

Headteacher Dr Antony Edkins said: "An allegation of a serious nature was made concerning a racially motivated remark by one student towards a group of Asian students new to the school and new to the country."

is true.

So she's not a rich hottie... she must be a crimina/welfare cheat/single mum.
There's no need for her to be a hottie.

Then that is rasicim plain and simple. By refusing to work with those who do not speak her language she is discriminating against them based soley on their lack of knowledge of her language. That by any definition of the term is racist.

We have many immigrants in our schools, and not all of them speak English, which is why I guees their parents choose to send them to English speaking schools.

Are you serious? How is she supposed to work on her science assignment with people she can't even communicate with? It's not racism, it's common sense. Also why aren't those kids in special bilingual classes that help them learn English? Why are they in normal English speaking classes?

Then that is rasicim plain and simple. By refusing to work with those who do not speak her language she is discriminating against them based soley on their lack of knowledge of her language. That by any definition of the term is racist.

A. You fail at spelling "racism."

B. Language has nothing to do with race. How many Africans are there speaking how many different languages? How many East Asians are there speaking how many different languages. How many Caucasians are there speaking how many different languages? The girl couldn't work with them, because she couldn't communicate with them. Your post, by any definition of the term, is ignorance.

Where does it say it's a Scottish school? It's in Salford, Manchester, and the Greater Manchester Police dealt with it.

Indeed it is. I wonder where I got Scotland in my head from? Anyhoo... since when have _English_ schools had full-time police officers?

I'm just waiting for Ny Nordland to come and twist this into another immigrant debate.

So she's not a rich hottie... she must be a crimina/welfare cheat/single mum.

must be because anyone who wears chunky gold chains and has there hair like that is clearly going out with a boy called Rickey who has a BMX!!!

Seriously people in school dress to fit a certain group or they don’t wear chunky gold chains simple fact

Are you serious? How is she supposed to work on her science assignment with people she can't even communicate with? It's not racism, it's common sense. Also why aren't those kids in special bilingual classes that help them learn English? Why are they in normal English speaking classes?

she did have someone to translate...

I think the accusation of rascism stems from the fact that the young lady in question referred to her classmates as "fucking blacks who don't speak english".

Firstly, whilst I do have sympathy with the girl for her situation, the way she expressed her anger was rascist.

Secondly, why involve the police? A stern telling off from teacher should have sufficed.

Then that is rasicim plain and simple. By refusing to work with those who do not speak her language she is discriminating against them based soley on their lack of knowledge of her language. That by any definition of the term is racist.

We have many immigrants in our schools, and not all of them speak English, which is why I guees their parents choose to send them to English speaking schools.
I hope this is sarcasm. But can't see it.

Not being able to speak a language is a new definition of racism

The assignment was discussion. She did not know the language the group were discussing in. She could not take part in the discussion.

This is like turning up to an exam and the questions are all in russian, when you don't speak russian and are not expected to be able to. And being accused of racism when you ask for a paper in english.

I hope this is sarcasm. But can't see it.

Not being able to speak a language is a new definition of racism

The assignment was discussion. She did not know the language the group were discussing in. She could not take part in the discussion.

This is like turning up to an exam and the questions are all in russian, when you don't speak russian and are not expected to be able to. And being accused of racism when you ask for a paper in english.

Agreed.

A 14 year old schoolgirl was arrested for racism and had to spend a few hours in jail before she was released. What did she do? She refused to work with a group of students who don't speak English. How the fuck is she supposed to work with people who don't even speak her language? Shouldn't non-English speaking pupils be in bilingual classes? Since when do people get arrested for racism? British laws sure are silly.


http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/articles/news/news.html?in_article_id=410150&in_page_id=1770

its the daily mail. i wouldn't trust them with a news story as far as i can flick snot from my nose.

its the daily mail. i wouldn't trust them with a news story as far as i can flick snot from my nose.

And how far is that exactly? :p

its the daily mail. i wouldn't trust them with a news story as far as i can flick snot from my nose.

I was thinking something similar.

its the daily mail. i wouldn't trust them with a news story as far as i can flick snot from my nose.

I can flick snot pretty far, man.

I think the accusation of rascism stems from the fact that the young lady in question referred to her classmates as "fucking blacks who don't speak english".

Firstly, whilst I do have sympathy with the girl for her situation, the way she expressed her anger was rascist.

Secondly, why involve the police? A stern telling off from teacher should have sufficed.
Erm, you got a source for that quote?

And how far is that exactly? :p

1.409 meters exactly :)

and my measure of trust is about 50 meters further down the road ;)

1.409 meters exactly :)

and my measure of trust is about 50 meters further down the road ;)


Okay, but is that just for runny snot, or are you including crusty boogers that fly a little better?

Are you serious? How is she supposed to work on her science assignment with people she can't even communicate with? It's not racism, it's common sense. Also why aren't those kids in special bilingual classes that help them learn English? Why are they in normal English speaking classes?

Damn me are you serious? So if you emigrated to Sweden and the pupils in the school refused to work with your child, you would call this common sense?

Okay, but is that just for runny snot, or are you including crusty boogers that fly a little better?

aerodynamic snot-missiles and all *nods*
even rocket-propelled snot :cool:

Damn me are you serious? So if you emigrated to Sweden and the pupils in the school refused to work with your child, you would call this common sense?

I would want my child to have access to bilingual education so he or she could get a decent education over there. Putting kids who don't speak the language into ordinary classes just ensures that they won't be able to benefit from the education they're supposedly being given.

I would want my child to have access to bilingual education so he or she could get a decent education over there. Putting kids who don't speak the language into ordinary classes just ensures that they won't be able to benefit from the education they're supposedly being given.

Yeah but it is not the school we are discussing is it. Answer the question.

Yeah but it is not the school we are discussing is it. Answer the question.
Are you seriously suggesting that if the school did refuse to teach him unless he spoke English, the children should be arrested?

Damn me are you serious? So if you emigrated to Sweden and the pupils in the school refused to work with your child, you would call this common sense?

If they're refusing to work with my child because they cant communicate with eachother then fine by me

A. You fail at spelling "racism."

B. Language has nothing to do with race. How many Africans are there speaking how many different languages? How many East Asians are there speaking how many different languages. How many Caucasians are there speaking how many different languages? The girl couldn't work with them, because she couldn't communicate with them. Your post, by any definition of the term, is ignorance.

A. I couldn't give a monkeys.

B. Irelevent. This from the story:

A teenage schoolgirl was arrested by police for racism after refusing to sit with a group of Asian students because some of them did not speak English.

Look at the words, for refusing to sit with them, becuase some of them did not speak English. That isn't a racist act? What sort of an act is it then?

Erm, you got a source for that quote?

Well I read the article and that specific quote is not in there, though there is a reference about 'black' in there:

"School insiders acknowledge that at least three of the students Codie refused to sit with had recently arrived in this country and spoke little English.

But they say her comments afterwards raised further concerns, for example allegedly referring to the students as "blacks" - something she denied yesterday"

From how the article is written it seems that after making her request to the teacher and being refused it is then claimed that she referred to the students as blacks. So she may have said a racist comment after the fact though that does not excuse the teacher for lacking common sense in putting her in a group for a discussion exercise where she was only able to communicate with one of the five other students. Nor does it excuse the school and police for over reacting when it could and should have been dealt with internally. The police should only get involved if the situation then escaltes.

Yeah but it is not the school we are discussing is it. Answer the question.

Yes I would call it common sense. My kids don't have the right to screw up another kid's education.

Damn me are you serious? So if you emigrated to Sweden and the pupils in the school refused to work with your child, you would call this common sense?

Yes, I'd call it common sense if my child didn't know Sweedish and the other children didn't know English. I'd tell my child he damn well better learn Sweedish if he's going to a school where that is the primary language.

It's kind of fucked up that one can be arrested for racism. Seriously, you'd have to arrest a big percentage of the population if you're going to enforce laws like that.

A. I couldn't give a monkeys.

B. Irelevent. This from the story:

A teenage schoolgirl was arrested by police for racism after refusing to sit with a group of Asian students because some of them did not speak English.

Look at the words, for refusing to sit with them, becuase some of them did not speak English. That isn't a racist act? What sort of an act is it then?

From the wording of the article it seems more that she refused to sit with them because she could have been placed with a group where her time would have been better spent.

I would want my child to have access to bilingual education so he or she could get a decent education over there. Putting kids who don't speak the language into ordinary classes just ensures that they won't be able to benefit from the education they're supposedly being given.

Ding ding.

Are you seriously suggesting that if the school did refuse to teach him unless he spoke English, the children should be arrested?

What I don't know Where you got that from?

I'm just waiting for Ny Nordland to come and twist this into another immigrant debate.
Indeed, I was quite surprised to see it was Drunk Commies and not Ny that started a thread about this.

What I don't know Where you got that from?
You're right, it's only the whole point of the thread. "Schoolgirl arrested for refusing to work with people".

Silly me.

Yes, I'd call it common sense if my child didn't know Sweedish and the other children didn't know English. I'd tell my child he damn well better learn Sweedish if he's going to a school where that is the primary language.

Agreed, but we are talking about this one girl and her actions. If this happend to your child would you be happy about it? Read the story it say some of them did not speak good English. The girl could have communicted with them, the story goes on to tell how one of them spoke English and was willing to Translate.

Yes, it makes things hard for her, but we do live in a multicultural place. We offten hear about immigrants not willing to learn English, no wonder when we are not willing to be near them.

If it was me that had moved to a foriegn place I too would send my kids to the local school, as we all know the best way to learn a new language is to imerse yourself in it.

A. I couldn't give a monkeys.

B. Irelevent. This from the story:

A teenage schoolgirl was arrested by police for racism after refusing to sit with a group of Asian students because some of them did not speak English.

Look at the words, for refusing to sit with them, becuase some of them did not speak English. That isn't a racist act? What sort of an act is it then?


A. Of course not. Proper spelling, like speaking English in a classroom comprised primarily of English-speakers, is obviously anathema to you.

B. I read the words and fully comprehended them. She couldn't work with them on a school project, because they couldn't speak English. Would it have been racist if they were Danish students that didn't speak English? No, because the question is one of language -- not race.

I would want my child to have access to bilingual education so he or she could get a decent education over there. Putting kids who don't speak the language into ordinary classes just ensures that they won't be able to benefit from the education they're supposedly being given.

Sooo you would rather segregate your kids, thus possibly causing more ill will?

You're right, it's only the whole point of the thread. "Schoolgirl arrested for refusing to work with people".

Silly me.

You need to re-read the tread. You aksed if I was seriously suggesting that if the school refused to teach the kid that kids should be arrested. I asked Where did you get that because I have not said anything like it, and wondered where you got this idea from.

Sooo you would rather segregate your kids, thus possibly causing more ill will?

Yes, then I'll send them to learn about their ethnic heritage in Christian Identity militia compounds back in the US so they return with the skills to build and use bombs against their adopted country. That's the plan.

Agreed, but we are talking about this one girl and her actions. If this happend to your child would you be happy about it? Read the story it say some of them did not speak good English. The girl could have communicted with them, the story goes on to tell how one of them spoke English and was willing to Translate.

Yes, it makes things hard for her, but we do live in a multicultural place. We offten hear about immigrants not willing to learn English, no wonder when we are not willing to be near them.

If it was me that had moved to a foriegn place I too would send my kids to the local school, as we all know the best way to learn a new language is to imerse yourself in it.

If it happened to my child, I'd be angry at the school for trying to force him to work with people he doesn't understand.
Yes, there was a translator, but that doubles the time it takes to get anything discussed. (Since whatever you say, they have to resay it.) Therefore, in their discussion period, all the students in the group are getting half the value from their time that they should get. That's not fair to any of them. While it's not a request I'd personally make, hers was a perfectly reasonable one.

Sooo you would rather segregate your kids, thus possibly causing more ill will?

Segregate them in the school environment yes, but only up until they are well enough schooled in the native language to take part in normal classes

A. Of course not. Proper spelling, like speaking English in a classroom comprised primarily of English-speakers, is obviously anathema to you.

B. I read the words and fully comprehended them. She couldn't work with them on a school project, because they couldn't speak English. Would it have been racist if they were Danish students that didn't speak English? No, because the question is one of language -- not race.

A. I coulnd't give a monkeys coz I have problems with speiling, always have done, always will, I've grown used to it, I really don't care what you think about it.

B. You didn't read enough, she refused to work with them, in A school lesson, because some of them did not speak very good English. One of the did and was translateing, she did not think this was good enough.

She decided she could not work with them because of their POOR English, although they could have worked together. If it was Danish, yes it would still be the same.

If it was Danish, yes it would still be the same.

If it were Danish (remember, the subjunctive is your friend), then it would be racism? Interesting...

Then that is rasicim plain and simple. By refusing to work with those who do not speak her language she is discriminating against them based soley on their lack of knowledge of her language. That by any definition of the term is racist.

We have many immigrants in our schools, and not all of them speak English, which is why I guees their parents choose to send them to English speaking schools.

She complained because in the supposed tutorial, (which incidentally was supposed to help her catch up), only one student besides her spoke English and they were supposed to discuss something. The people who couldn't speak English then started speaking in their own language, so Codie politely asked to change groups, and was immediately branded racist by the tutor.

So the facts are:

1. Codie was unable (through no fault of her own) to be involved in a group discussion due to a language barrier

2. Because of said language barrier, Codie asked to be moved to a group where she would be able to actually take part in the class.

3. The teacher branded Codie racist and had the police involved due to the polite reasonable request

4. The police waited more than a week to arrest her - can you imagine the shock of being arrested and not even having any idea what it might be about because it was a week ago and nothing official was done about it at the time? For a 14-year-old child? It can be extremely scary too and very distressing.

So my question is, and this may or may not be relevant, what country was the teacher from?

On another note, Codie alledgedly referred to the students as "blacks" (an accusation that she refutes). Plenty of people with pale skin colours (eg. peachy) are referred to as "whites". The term "Asian" is wrongly used officially to describe people with a certain shade of skin colour, as Chinese people are also Asian. If the word "whites" is used to refer to people with a skin colour close to white, then it's fair to use the word "blacks" to refer to people with a skin colour close to black (such as brown). In addition, using one particular word for people with similar skin colours (close to white) and another particular word for another group of people with similar skin colours (close to black) is fairer than having the specific addition of another word (for example, "Asians") for people within one of those groups who have a certain tone of skin colour, as it implies that dark-skinned people are worth more than light-skinned people by treating them differently.

She complained because in the supposed tutorial, (which incidentally was supposed to help her catch up), only one student besides her spoke English and they were supposed to discuss something. The people who couldn't speak English then started speaking in their own language, so Codie politely asked to change groups, and was immediately branded racist by the tutor.

So the facts are:

1. Codie was unable (through no fault of her own) to be involved in a group discussion due to a language barrier

2. Because of said language barrier, Codie asked to be moved to a group where she would be able to actually take part in the class.

3. The teacher branded Codie racist and had the police involved due to the polite reasonable request

4. The police waited more than a week to arrest her - can you imagine the shock of being arrested and not even having any idea what it might be about because it was a week ago and nothing official was done about it at the time? For a 14-year-old child? It can be extremely scary too and very distressing.

So my question is, and this may or may not be relevant, what country was the teacher from?

On another note, Codie alledgedly referred to the students as "blacks" (an accusation that she refutes). Plenty of people with pale skin colours (eg. peachy) are referred to as "whites". The term "Asian" is wrongly used officially to describe people with a certain shade of skin colour, as Chinese people are also Asian. If the word "whites" is used to refer to people with a skin colour close to white, then it's fair to use the word "blacks" to refer to people with a skin colour close to black (such as brown). In addition, using one particular word for people with similar skin colours (close to white) and another particular word for another group of people with similar skin colours (close to black) is fairer than having the specific addition of another word (for example, "Asians") for people within one of those groups who have a certain tone of skin colour, as it implies that dark-skinned people are worth more than light-skinned people by treating them differently.


You make some very good points.

I read it a differant way though.

1. She was able to be involved, as the other girls had poor English(not none) and one of them was fine(making two English speakers out of 5) so it was made a harder for her not imposible.

2. I can understand this.

3. Both the teacher and the school did over react.

4. Granted.

You are quite correct it is normal to call white people white and black people black, I know nobody form either end of the spectrum that have any problems with this.

You make some very good points.

I read it a differant way though.

1. She was able to be involved, as the other girls had poor English(not none) and one of them was fine(making two English speakers out of 5) so it was made a harder for her not imposible.

2. I can understand this.

3. Both the teacher and the school did over react.

4. Granted.

You are quite correct it is normal to call white people white and black people black, I know nobody form either end of the spectrum that have any problems with this.


Why thank-you :)

But in response to you: (1) Despite what the media says, school can be difficult enough (and all you old people who think it's easier than in "your day", try going there for a month) without it being made harder by not even being able to understand your classmates and feeling isolated because you can't join in. Considering the fact the school needs a full-tim cop, I'm willing to bet £100 (genuinely) that it's a crap school anyway.

I once met a black guy who didn't like being called black, just "Asian" (which not only does my head in cus it suggests people from a certain group of skin colours (brown, black, light brown, etc) are special, it is also virtually never applied to the group it actually refers to, in whole: Asians (it virtually never includes Chinese and other white Asians). <<< on about UK btw

You make some very good points.

I read it a differant way though.

1. She was able to be involved, as the other girls had poor English(not none) and one of them was fine(making two English speakers out of 5) so it was made a harder for her not imposible.

2. I can understand this.

3. Both the teacher and the school did over react.

4. Granted.

You are quite correct it is normal to call white people white and black people black, I know nobody form either end of the spectrum that have any problems with this.

Just to be pedantic there were six students. The only other girl in the group was fluent in english and was helping by translating. The article says that at least three of the other students spoke little, not poor, english. If it was poor then communication is possible though difficult, if it is little then communication at the level of a discussion is orders of magnitude more difficult.

If the discussion group exercise is limited in time then the whole group suffers as, compared to other groups, it would take at least twice as long (though very likely more) to have the discussion. If the bilingual girl was there purely as a trained translator then maybe but as she was also there as part of the group and very unlikely to be a trained translator the groups work would have suffered.

Oh my... That's an overreaction if I've ever seen one...

I wouldn't blame the laws though, not in this case. But I see no reason to involve the police in this...

That's rediculous.

You shouldn't be punished..

That's rediculous.
Personally, I think it's ridiculous. :)

Personally, I think it's ridiculous. :)

I don't deserve this ridicule!

I smell too good for that. :(

I don't deserve this ridicule!

I smell too good for that. :(
You smell like puppies on a fresh summers day.

*Nods*

You smell like puppies on a fresh summers day.

*Nods*

*smells air*

Ahh..

An over-the-top reaction to be sure, but that picture proves she's a future candidate for an ASBO if there ever was one.

What's an ASBO ?:confused:

What's an ASBO ?:confused:

Anti Social Body Odor.

You make some very good points.

I read it a differant way though.

1. She was able to be involved, as the other girls had poor English(not none) and one of them was fine(making two English speakers out of 5) so it was made a harder for her not imposible.

I sounded more like she sat down and they were all speaking in Urdu, and that while one of them was a translator the only translation was the teachers instructions. It did not sound that the other students made any effort to translate back to the girl what was being said in Urdu.

There is no evidence that the translater made any effort to translate the conversation into english. And it does not sound like the english speaker was making any effort to speak english.

The students with poor english were not using it and hence she had no chance of being able to understand.

If anything they were the ones excluding her from the group.

Her request was very reasonable - to be allowed to work with the group she could actually do the exercise with.

What's an ASBO ?:confused:

Anti Social Behavior Order.

Its a type of punishment in the British criminal justice system where offenders are given an ASBO which states they are not alowed to do whatever it was they were doing (harrassing people, loitering in streets X, Y and Z, noise issues, neighbor disputes and the like,but also for some more serious crimes. The idea is if they repeat the offence after the ASBO they are more harshly punished. In reality they just get given another ASBO and get told to stop being naughty.

^ Thanks.

DCD, you prick. "Body Odor"...lol...:D

^ Thanks.

DCD, you prick. "Body Odor"...lol...:D

I was close.

The Daily Mail is hardly a reliable source; I'm inclined to think that the version of events it presents have been exaggerated. This section of the article in particular simply doesn't sound believable:

"I said 'I'm not being funny, but can I change groups because I can't understand them?' But she started shouting and screaming, saying 'It's racist, you're going to get done by the police'."

Methinks somebody's making stuff up.

Is anyone else more than a little creeped out that we're reading a story about someone in a modern western country being arrested because of non-violent speech and the only response their countrymen can come up with is speculation about her furture sexual activity and whether her clothing and hairstyle warrant being punished without charge or trial(in the form of an ASBO).

Seriously, folks, even if she did call the other students "fucking blacks" thats an example of repulisive ignorance, not criminal activity. The very concept of unpopular speech being criminal should worry the hell out of you.

Then again, maybe I'm off-base. She's just an ignorant, uneducated, low born piece of racist white trash who will be an unwed mother by the age of 20.

I'd laugh at the irony if I wasn't vaguely nauseous.

The Daily Mail is hardly a reliable source; I'm inclined to think that the version of events it presents have been exaggerated. This section of the article in particular simply doesn't sound believable:



Methinks somebody's making stuff up.

Big time. Its hardly in a Manchester syntax is it.;)

Big time. Its hardly in a Manchester syntax is it.;)

:D

Here's what I suspect happened:

-The school are implementing a strict zero-tolerance policy. I believe this to be the case because they are a severely underachieving school which has a police officer on site permanently.

-The girl is told to work with the group, many of whom speak little English.

-She complains to the teacher in a rude, probably racist, manner. I deduce this from the fact that her account of the conversation is clearly made up/strongly exaggerated, suggesting she has something to hide; also, the head-teacher reports that she racially abused the group.

-After walking out of the room she is confronted by another member of staff. She was almost certainly lippy and possibly racist; from my experience of secondary school this is inevitable.

-She is isolated as a result of her outburst.

-A week later the bureaucracy finally informs the resident police officer: the policy of zero-tolerance comes into effect.

-The girl lies to divert blame.

All in all, it was a gross over-reaction but it wasn't anything like as silly as the Mail tried to make out. Obviously this is purely speculative but I think it makes more sense than the version propagated in the article.

The Daily Mail is hardly a reliable source; I'm inclined to think that the version of events it presents have been exaggerated. This section of the article in particular simply doesn't sound believable:



Methinks somebody's making stuff up.

Why does it not sound believable? Haven't you watched programmes with teenagers? That sounds like the words of a teenager to me, and it's totally plausible that such a teacher who would have someone arrested for a polite request would also be very unreasonable to the child. I don't know how old you are, but try staying in a UK school for a while, pretending to be a kid. or hide some CCTV. they're mostly extremely poor quality (maybe not on the teaching, but on dealing with students -badly behaved or not- in a rational, adult manner).

Here's what I suspect happened:

-The school are implementing a strict zero-tolerance policy. I believe this to be the case because they are a severely underachieving school which has a police officer on site permanently.

-The girl is told to work with the group, many of whom speak little English.

-She complains to the teacher in a rude, probably racist, manner. I deduce this from the fact that her account of the conversation is clearly made up/strongly exaggerated, suggesting she has something to hide; also, the head-teacher reports that she racially abused the group.

-After walking out of the room she is confronted by another member of staff. She was almost certainly lippy and possibly racist; from my experience of secondary school this is inevitable.

-She is isolated as a result of her outburst.

-A week later the bureaucracy finally informs the resident police officer: the policy of zero-tolerance comes into effect.

-The girl lies to divert blame.

All in all, it was a gross over-reaction but it wasn't anything like as silly as the Mail tried to make out. Obviously this is purely speculative but I think it makes more sense than the version propagated in the article.

If the daily mail does make stuff up, you're just as bad. You've suddenly discovered all these "facts" despite having no involvement at all in what happened... in other words, you is making stuff up innit

Sooo you would rather segregate your kids, thus possibly causing more ill will?

it's not a matter of segregation it's a matter of communication. if they had NO way of communicate, I could see that working together would be difficult.
as DCD said it's commonsense (but of course that is not common)
granted her reactions was probaly a bit harsh, but understandable, should she go to jail for it? no in IMO.

do not make this into something it's not.

Is anyone else more than a little creeped out that we're reading a story about someone in a modern western country being arrested because of non-violent speech and the only response their countrymen can come up with is speculation about her furture sexual activity and whether her clothing and hairstyle warrant being punished without charge or trial(in the form of an ASBO).

Seriously, folks, even if she did call the other students "fucking blacks" thats an example of repulisive ignorance, not criminal activity. The very concept of unpopular speech being criminal should worry the hell out of you.

Then again, maybe I'm off-base. She's just an ignorant, uneducated, low born piece of racist white trash who will be an unwed mother by the age of 20.

I'd laugh at the irony if I wasn't vaguely nauseous.

agree, I want to shave my head and have a copy of mein kampf under my arm, just to see if people start making things up about me.

A 14 year old schoolgirl was arrested for racism and had to spend a few hours in jail before she was released. What did she do? She refused to work with a group of students who don't speak English. How the fuck is she supposed to work with people who don't even speak her language? Shouldn't non-English speaking pupils be in bilingual classes? Since when do people get arrested for racism? British laws sure are silly.


http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/articles/news/news.html?in_article_id=410150&in_page_id=1770

It is cited from the Mail, and thus must be considered with a pinch of salt, however, the principle remains correct. Legislation, and imposed pre-suppositions, regarding "Racism" and "political correctness" are excessive, myopic, and, above all, imposed by left wing nut jobs with nothing better to do than oppress the very classes who fund government.

It is cited from the Mail, and thus must be considered with a pinch of salt, however, the principle remains correct. Legislation, and imposed pre-suppositions, regarding "Racism" and "political correctness" are excessive, myopic, and, above all, imposed by left wing nut jobs with nothing better to do than oppress the very classes who fund government.

LOL I agree with you, but Not who imposes them, if any quite the opposite.

If the daily mail does make stuff up, you're just as bad. You've suddenly discovered all these "facts" despite having no involvement at all in what happened... in other words, you is making stuff up innit

You seem to have missed the part where he states that his is merely supposition, it's hardly like the mail has a gleaming track record when it comes to truth and accuracy.
We are talking here about the paper that once ran the headline "5 million immigrants invade england" only to follow up that that was a projected figure based over the next twenty years in very very small writing.

agree, I want to shave my head and have a copy of mein kampf under my arm, just to see if people start making things up about me.

Yes, because a subculture which you find to be aesthetically displeasing is exactly the same as allying yourself with a totalitarian regeime hellbent on genocide. This classist bullshit that rears it's head every time the word "chav" comes up is appalling.

she did have someone to translate...

-snip-"Only one could speak English, so she had to tell that one what to do so she could explain in their language. Then she sat me with them and said 'Discuss'."

According to Codie, the five - four boys and a girl - then began talking in a language she didn't understand, thought to be Urdu, so she went to speak to the teacher."

Maybe they didn't want to waste their time translating to someone who was a day behind? Or maybe they were unable to translate effectively and went on about their business in their own language. Doesn't matter. They aren't the ones who are being accused of racism, and taken to jail.. the girl is however... because she was sat with students who for whatever reason wasn't speaking a language she understood, and she asked to be seated with students who spoke her language. That teacher must be a nut job.

Since DCD brought attention to this. I will now remove my sig link to the article.

Doesn't this sound like the perfect "real life" opportunity for just this assignment http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=502748 ?

The Daily Mail : Britain's finest hate-rag.

Plus she looks like prime ASBO material.

How foolish can people get? Amazing, really. I wonder how they expected her to work with people she can't communicate with?

Btw, newspapers can give the names of minors who are arrested in Britain? :confused:

How lame, how characteristic of our times...

The Daily Mail : Britain's finest hate-rag.

Plus she looks like prime ASBO material.

How immature, judging her based on her looks. Bloody ridiculous.

re: laws over racism: yep, in England, it is illegal to say racist things, believe it or not. it's classed as a "hate crime".

A 14 year old schoolgirl was arrested for racism and had to spend a few hours in jail before she was released. What did she do? She refused to work with a group of students who don't speak English. How the fuck is she supposed to work with people who don't even speak her language? Shouldn't non-English speaking pupils be in bilingual classes? Since when do people get arrested for racism? British laws sure are silly.


http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/articles/news/news.html?in_article_id=410150&in_page_id=1770

I've heard from stupid shit in my time, but this really takes the cake. :headbang:

All laws are bit more than fucking 'silly'

Lawl, goth chick.

But yeah, refusing to do work with non-English speaking people isn't racism. Yes, British laws are silly indeed!

you know what scares me more than our laws that let stuff like this happen? the fact that Americans are saying they're silly. When an American (whose country puts religion before virtually everything else, and whose government passes laws indirectly approving of, allowing, and encouraging torture) says your laws are silly, you know your country's fucked :headbang: :headbang: :headbang:

All laws are bit more than fucking 'silly'

I agree. I could use some extra cash. Why can't I rob a bank? Some **** doesn't want to fuck me. I think she's hot, I should rape her. Some fucking dickhead looked at me a little too long. I should be able to shoot him.

I agree. I could use some extra cash. Why can't I rob a bank? Some **** doesn't want to fuck me. I think she's hot, I should rape her. Some fucking dickhead looked at me a little too long. I should be able to shoot him.
Right, and then deal with the fucking consequences. What do you think the consequences of illegal immigration are? Fucking nothing

Right, and then deal with the fucking consequences. What do you think the consequences of illegal immigration are? Fucking nothing

What consequences? Revenge? When Lex Talionis goes into effect it's just another form of law. You can't expect to ever be free from law.

What consequences? Revenge? When Lex Talionis goes into effect it's just another form of law. You can't expect to ever be free from law.
When you go into effect you're just another form of law.

When you go into effect you're just another form of law.

That's right. I am the law. Don't step out of line.

That's right. I am the law. Don't step out of line.
Not until you come into effect sparky. an- yeah... the effect is it.

If the daily mail does make stuff up, you're just as bad. You've suddenly discovered all these "facts" despite having no involvement at all in what happened... in other words, you is making stuff up innit

Which part of "Obviously this is purely speculative" do you find it hard to understand? I merely tried to read between the lines to find a more plausible explanation as the story presented by the Mail was blatantly one-sided and the school's account of events isn't available.

What's more, significant parts of deduction involved little or no speculation: the school say that she made racist remarks so it seems likely that she did, no? If a school has a police officer permanently seconded to them then it's likely that they aren't going for a 'softly softly' approach, no?

They have a 'racisum register' in all school too. The idea is to take the names of anynoe who is deemed to have been racist. I know of two of my friends on it at my school. One for calling somone of Chinese descent a "rice farmer" and the other time for having an argument with some one. Also a number of letters we get from school ask you to fill in 'ethnicity codes'. It is PC gone mad. Run away now.

Why does it not sound believable? Haven't you watched programmes with teenagers? That sounds like the words of a teenager to me, and it's totally plausible that such a teacher who would have someone arrested for a polite request would also be very unreasonable to the child. I don't know how old you are, but try staying in a UK school for a while, pretending to be a kid. or hide some CCTV. they're mostly extremely poor quality (maybe not on the teaching, but on dealing with students -badly behaved or not- in a rational, adult manner).

Speaking as a seventeen year old who has attended state schools his life I feel you are doing teachers a great disservice. In all my time at various schools I can only think of one teacher who I would describe as 'bad'.

What's more, I suggest that you try hanging around teenagers for a while and see how they report any kind of criticism or perceived wrong against them. 99% of the time the account will be either grossly exaggerated or even completely different from the actual events. At my old secondary school there was a guy who would seize every opportunity to rant about how a certain teacher hated him and wanted him to fail; in reality he simply didn't do his homework and this led to poor grades. One girl was certain that the entire staff were constantly looking for excuses to pick on her: in fact, she simply made a habit of walking around with her tie half-undone. I can think of a dozen similar examples without much difficulty.

If you listened to their accounts of these alleged persecutions you would be amazed at the alleged vitriol of apparently amiable members of staff. Quite simply, if you have any experience of teenagers or schools then you should know better than to expect an accurate account of events from the testimony of a teenage-victim without corroboration.

Then that is rasicim plain and simple. By refusing to work with those who do not speak her language she is discriminating against them based soley on their lack of knowledge of her language. That by any definition of the term is racist.

We have many immigrants in our schools, and not all of them speak English, which is why I guees their parents choose to send them to English speaking schools.
I hate working with people I can't communicate with, and that is an important element with any group. If you cannot communicate because of an existing language barrier and the group makes no effort to try and speak your language, how is it racist that you don't want to work with them because you don't speak the same language?

In college I had encountered people who had trouble with the English language, and could barely speak it. I'll tell you this much: it sucks big fgat juicy donkey balls. Why? If you cannot understand what the people ar saying, you feel lost and thus, frustrated. It's natural to want to communicate efficiently. Being hit with a brick wall makes one very irritated.

In the case of foreign-language students being sent to English schools, well, it makes sense, since the students are in a PRIMARILY English speaking country, where the majority of the transactions are done in the English language.

If you had read the article, you'd realise that the girl was frustrated because the group spoke in another language entirely, and didn't try and speak English. She had every right to vocalise her frustration.

If you had read the article, you'd realise that the girl was frustrated because the group spoke in another language entirely, and didn't try and speak English. She had every right to vocalise her frustration.

If also look at the article the accusation was that she vocalised her frustration with racial slurs.

Lawl, goth chick.

But yeah, refusing to do work with non-English speaking people isn't racism. Yes, British laws are silly indeed!
It's plain common sense. Natural instinct is for us to communicate in a language we understand. In school, this is important, the need to be able to communicate when in a group.

I've asked to change groups for less than not being able to communicate.

If also look at the article the accusation was that she vocalised her frustration with racial slurs.
After no one would listen to her.

Even still... the initial need to be in a group that she can communicate with was her initial complaint. She had been quoted as saying she wanted to be in a group that she could understand. The teacher could've tried listening...

*snip*
I'll point out something else - language-speakers are not a race (!). You cannot be called racist if you want to work in a group of a particular language. I wish people would stop wallowing in their ignorance by branding everything and anything racist - get a fucking dictionary and see how the word works for Christ's sake. :rolleyes: I hate PC-inspired stupidity.

If she resorted to racial "slurs" after not being listened to, that is a different matter entirely - but not linked to the above!

I hate PC-inspired stupidity.

I hate PC, period.

I hate PC, period.
As do I - perhaps the added bits were superfluous. Stupidity is implicit in the term. ;)

As do I - perhaps the added bits were superfluous. Stupidity is implicit in the term. ;)

lol

I was thinking something similar.

And I was pondering how I could flick snot with my nose. :D

Here's what I suspect happened:

-The school are implementing a strict zero-tolerance policy. I believe this to be the case because they are a severely underachieving school which has a police officer on site permanently.

-The girl is told to work with the group, many of whom speak little English.

-She complains to the teacher in a rude, probably racist, manner. I deduce this from the fact that her account of the conversation is clearly made up/strongly exaggerated, suggesting she has something to hide; also, the head-teacher reports that she racially abused the group.

-After walking out of the room she is confronted by another member of staff. She was almost certainly lippy and possibly racist; from my experience of secondary school this is inevitable.

-She is isolated as a result of her outburst.

-A week later the bureaucracy finally informs the resident police officer: the policy of zero-tolerance comes into effect.

-The girl lies to divert blame.

All in all, it was a gross over-reaction but it wasn't anything like as silly as the Mail tried to make out. Obviously this is purely speculative but I think it makes more sense than the version propagated in the article.

Well this is probably closer to what actually happened
But,

A while ago one of my freinds was on a french exchange program, so one time i walked to school with him, and we had a french boy walking with us, none of us spoke good french so we basically ignored him, and at school all the french kids stood away from everyone else

I assume that the same thing has happened here and the asian kids have started talking amongst themselves and ignoring her, not understanding the work or anything they were saying would clearly have annoyed her so she would probably be rude when asking about a simple thing.

I hate PC, period.


So you are more of a Mac person? :D

I agree with you and NG, political correctness to me is just another form of censorship. And I absolutely despise censors.

Speaking as a seventeen year old who has attended state schools his life I feel you are doing teachers a great disservice. In all my time at various schools I can only think of one teacher who I would describe as 'bad'.

What's more, I suggest that you try hanging around teenagers for a while and see how they report any kind of criticism or perceived wrong against them. 99% of the time the account will be either grossly exaggerated or even completely different from the actual events. At my old secondary school there was a guy who would seize every opportunity to rant about how a certain teacher hated him and wanted him to fail; in reality he simply didn't do his homework and this led to poor grades. One girl was certain that the entire staff were constantly looking for excuses to pick on her: in fact, she simply made a habit of walking around with her tie half-undone. I can think of a dozen similar examples without much difficulty.

If you listened to their accounts of these alleged persecutions you would be amazed at the alleged vitriol of apparently amiable members of staff. Quite simply, if you have any experience of teenagers or schools then you should know better than to expect an accurate account of events from the testimony of a teenage-victim without corroboration.

Then you were either really lucky, or you're lying. Get a job as a mentor in a High School (you'd need to pass a CRB check of course) and ask the teenagers what they think of their teachers.

I can think of, concerning teachers: many examples of sexism (towards guys) - which is obviously bad for self esteem, pervertedness (male teachers towards girls - pervy looks, making inappropriate comments, etc) - which is of course an incentibe NOT to go to school, violence (I specifically remember one teacher ACTUALLY THROWING a guy against a wall then into another teacher's office, etc etc etc

since when did any criminal court outlaw racism?

since when did any criminal court outlaw racism?

they didn't. the UK government outlawed it (publicly at least, though I'm willing to bet cops can arrest people for saying racist things privately that then get leaked to the cops).

So you are more of a Mac person? :D

I agree with you and NG, political correctness to me is just another form of censorship. And I absolutely despise censors.

Ohhh i don't know, I guess it all depends on what flavour smoke you use!;)

It's england. You can be arrested for "racism"*, but not burglary. Stupid fucking labour government basically.

Everyone who voted for princess tony should be expelled from the country so things can get back to normal.

It's okay though, because the labour government has widened the class division, which is exactly what the middle class wankers who voted for new labour really wanted all along. So I laugh when they get happy slapped.

(*Unless you are a muslim threatening to behead non muslims, in which case the metropolitian police will come out and protect you, and even arrest peaceful counter protestors).

I am not too concerned about the racism law, but I read that in a Massachusetts town they outlawed playing tag at schools because it is too rough and they are afraid of injury lawsuits. Now that is absolutely ridiculous in my mind.

If also look at the article the accusation was that she vocalised her frustration with racial slurs.

Although one would question quite how the "offended" could comprehend her.....

I haven't actually read the article, however, does it qualify what a "racial slur" is?

Although one would question quite how the "offended" could comprehend her.....

I haven't actually read the article, however, does it qualify what a "racial slur" is?
She called the students "black" I believe (sort of like you could call one white). Yep, a real nasty slur there. Naughty naughty girl! :eek:

:rolleyes:

In the meanwhile, we get much more frivolous cases of this nature, where a Judge ordered a rapist to merely write a letter of apology (http://www.guardian.co.uk/uklatest/story/0,,-6006266,00.html) to his victim due to him being from a foreign culture.

So, we accuse 14-year old girls calling her classmates "black" racism, even though she was the one done wrong, but when it comes to rape, we settle for letters of apology. Britain's legal system is becoming a fucking joke.