NationStates Jolt Archive

http://www.cnn.com/2006/TECH/science/10/04/teleportation.reut/index.html

Simply amazing. Obviously transporting more complex objects like humans would be impossible due to the Heisenberg Uncertainty Principle. I guess the next breakthrough will have to be the Heisenberg Compensator of TNG fame.

http://www.maxent.org/video/images/transporter03.jpg
*makes cheap sound effect*

http://www.cnn.com/2006/TECH/science/10/04/teleportation.reut/index.html

Simply amazing. Obviously transporting more complex objects like humans would be impossible due to the Heisenberg Uncertainty Principle. I guess the next breakthrough will have to be the Heisenberg Compensator of TNG fame.

http://www.maxent.org/video/images/transporter03.jpg
*makes cheap sound effect*

Technology will probably progress enough so that we can teleport humans.

Just think of where we were two centuries ago...

Technology will probably progress enough so that we can teleport humans.

Just think of where we were two centuries ago...

Just think of where we were 4 decades ago when Star Trek came out. Half of the made up technology in that show is a part of our every day lives. Pretty much the only technological area we are behind the Star Trek timeline is in space propulsion systems, but NASA's BPP seems to have begun to make breakthroughs there with ionic engines and solar sails.

I'd think carefully (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=495703) about teleportation if I were you...

I'd think carefully (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=495703) about teleportation if I were you...
So long as the Heisenberg Uncertainty Principle exists, I wouldn't even think of it. You wouldn't be correctly reassembled since there is no way to know where very molecule of your body is positioned. That's why we need another breakthrough before we can even think of transporting ourselves.

After all, we don't want to end up like the Kentucky Fried Vulcan in Star Trek: The Motion Picture.

As for the discussion in the link, "Star Trek" actually explored that idea. I recall that Dr. McCoy hated the idea of the transporter yet still used it because it was convenient. If Kirk can do it, then damnit! It's good enough for me! BEAM ME UP SCOTTY!

Until someone makes a real lightsaber, I won't care about any futuristic space themed science creation.

Until someone makes a real lightsaber, I won't care about any futuristic space themed science creation.

I guess you don't work in the freight and transport industry then.

Until someone makes a real lightsaber, I won't care about any futuristic space themed science creation.

Lightsabers make no damned sense whatsoever technologically. Even less so when you take the non-canon EU explanations for their function.

Teleportation, on the other hand, does make sense, albiet not fully in the Star Trek idea.

I guess you don't work in the freight and transport industry then.

I forsee a lot of medical applications, too. How about selectively (and totally non-invasively) teleporting cancer cells out of an unoperable brain tumour?

That's Wrong.

I watched Time Knight on Sunday...
The quote might be "Scotty, beam me up."...

I knew I saw this thread somewhere else. Let me just go look for it in back.
...
Found it (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?p=11766072)!

I forsee a lot of medical applications, too. How about selectively (and totally non-invasively) teleporting cancer cells out of an unoperable brain tumour?

That might be a wee bit difficult. The kind of scanning necessary for such a procedure...are we even capable of that?

Until someone makes a real lightsaber, I won't care about any futuristic space themed science creation.

Some guys filled fluorescent lights with petrol and fought with them. Yeah, they're dead.

Oh, and bugger true teleportation. Controlled wormholes FTW!

IDF, NASA had some really good advanced propulsion systems going. NERVAs and NPRs. High-thrust engines with much lower mass ratios than chem rockets. Ion engines are very low thrust and can only build up speed over extreme distances. And lets not forget the power requirements. And solar sails only work when you have a sun behind the sail, making it impossible to use it for travel between stars. And did I mention it too is low thrust? We don't have enough anti-matter to light a 60W bulb. When you look at where the money is going these days, the future of space exploration looks bleak.:(

IDF, NASA had some really good advanced propulsion systems going. NERVAs and NPRs. High-thrust engines with much lower mass ratios than chem rockets. Ion engines are very low thrust and can only build up speed over extreme distances. And lets not forget the power requirements. And solar sails only work when you have a sun behind the sail, making it impossible to use it for travel between stars. And did I mention it too is low thrust? We don't have enough anti-matter to light a 60W bulb. When you look at where the money is going these days, the future of space exploration looks bleak.:(
The antimatter bit is only due to the fact that supercolliders weren't BUILT to create antimatter. Course, the best we can ever hope for is a 50/50 ratio of matter vs antimatter, but if we can create replicators, all that means is that we have a nice little source for the base matter for the replicators too.

Of course, seeing as how replication is even more ridiculous than defeating the Heisenburg Principle, I don't see us ever managing it.

I've just taken the course in Quantum Calculus... and teleportation is, while theorically feasible, just practically useless.
Proof is too long and technical to explain it here.
The general idea is that you'd have anyway to destroy the original object and carry by normal means a duplicator (and that would be a HUGE machine) where you want the copy to appear, so it is better to carry Kirk on the planet by shuttle than by teleportation.
Quantum states cannot be exactly copied even by a quantum computation device, because of the No-Cloning Theorem, based on Pauli's Exclusion principle and the Slater determinant.

http://www.sciam.com/print_version.cfm?chanID=sa003&articleID=000E9691-0261-1524-826183414B7F0000

I've just taken the course in Quantum Calculus... and teleportation is, while theorically feasible, just practically useless.
Proof is too long and technical to explain it here.
The general idea is that you'd have anyway to destroy the original object and carry by normal means a duplicator (and that would be a HUGE machine) where you want the copy to appear, so it is better to carry Kirk on the planet by shuttle than by teleportation.
Quantum states cannot be exactly copied even by a quantum computation device, because of the No-Cloning Theorem, based on Pauli's Exclusion principle and the Slater determinant.

Thank you.

Actually, if you're taking Quantum Calculus, maybe you can explain some of the finer nuances to the Many Worlds theory to me. In a telegram, of course, since we don't need to hijack this thread.

I've just taken the course in Quantum Calculus... and teleportation is, while theorically feasible, just practically useless.
Proof is too long and technical to explain it here.
The general idea is that you'd have anyway to destroy the original object and carry by normal means a duplicator (and that would be a HUGE machine) where you want the copy to appear, so it is better to carry Kirk on the planet by shuttle than by teleportation.
Quantum states cannot be exactly copied even by a quantum computation device, because of the No-Cloning Theorem, based on Pauli's Exclusion principle and the Slater determinant.

Is this the thing where the more an object is teleported the less like the original it becomes? Something like that. I read a science fiction book once. Once.

Technology will probably progress enough so that we can teleport humans.

Without causing brain damage?

I'm much more interested in Star Trek's replicators, than I am in teleportation. When do we get those?

I'm much more interested in Star Trek's replicators, than I am in teleportation. When do we get those?
I'm more interested in the holodeck :D

I'm more interested in the holodeck :D

I wouldn't want to be the ensign stuck cleaning the holodeck, that's for sure...

I wouldn't want to be the ensign stuck cleaning the holodeck, that's for sure...Somebody has been reading too much somethingawful.com ;) .

http://www.somethingawful.com/index.php?a=4035

I wouldn't want to be the ensign stuck cleaning the holodeck, that's for sure...
"Clean it up, Scotty."

There was a science fiction story I read many years ago about teleportation. In this story, the teleportation process created an exact duplicate at the receiving end. The only problem was, what to do with the "original?" In this story, every time you were teleported, the "original" you was killed to prevent legal and moral problems involved in having two of the same person. It distrubed me a bit. Heh!

I forsee a lot of medical applications, too. How about selectively (and totally non-invasively) teleporting cancer cells out of an unoperable brain tumour?

I've always figured that's the real reason most of the people on Star Trek were fit. "Scotty, I want you to beam some of my ass over to the Klingon ship and leave it there for Gorth to slip on."

The antimatter bit is only due to the fact that supercolliders weren't BUILT to create antimatter. Course, the best we can ever hope for is a 50/50 ratio of matter vs antimatter, but if we can create replicators, all that means is that we have a nice little source for the base matter for the replicators too.

Of course, seeing as how replication is even more ridiculous than defeating the Heisenburg Principle, I don't see us ever managing it.

First of all, the Heisenburg Uncertainty Principle is not a certainty itself. It is entirely possible that Einstein is correct and we simply don't know all the variables.

We're also not sure if it's important in teleportation. In other words, we might not have to know the precise position of every single particle. It might be enough to know their possible positions.

All the Heisenburg Uncertainty Principle(Assuming it's true) is that it's impossible to 'scan' and record the precise position of ever particle of matter in an object because certain particles cannot be precisely positioned. It doesn't mean it is necessary to do so.

I've always figured that's the real reason most of the people on Star Trek were fit. "Scotty, I want you to beam some of my ass over to the Klingon ship and leave it there for Gorth to slip on."

"And beam a few hairs from his ass onto my head. I'm starting to recede again." :p

There was a science fiction story I read many years ago about teleportation. In this story, the teleportation process created an exact duplicate at the receiving end. The only problem was, what to do with the "original?" In this story, every time you were teleported, the "original" you was killed to prevent legal and moral problems involved in having two of the same person. It distrubed me a bit. Heh!

The original would have to be destroyed, though the idea of teleporting people is a bit absurd at this point in time.

Somebody has been reading too much somethingawful.com ;) .

http://www.somethingawful.com/index.php?a=4035

Hooray! :D

The original would have to be destroyed, though the idea of teleporting people is a bit absurd at this point in time.

Guess we'll just have to resort to the time tested ways of flinging people places.

Nothing has changed... (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=11531667&postcount=56)

I wouldn't want to be the ensign stuck cleaning the holodeck, that's for sure...

The invention of the Holodeck will be the end of humanity.

Oh great, now Dr. Breen is gonna invite the Combine and we're all gonna be screwed.

Gordon Freeman, if you're reading this, look, I'm never gonna buy you that beer, okay?

First of all, the Heisenburg Uncertainty Principle is not a certainty itself. It is entirely possible that Einstein is correct and we simply don't know all the variables.

We're also not sure if it's important in teleportation. In other words, we might not have to know the precise position of every single particle. It might be enough to know their possible positions.

All the Heisenburg Uncertainty Principle(Assuming it's true) is that it's impossible to 'scan' and record the precise position of ever particle of matter in an object because certain particles cannot be precisely positioned. It doesn't mean it is necessary to do so.

Additionally, it's also possible that you could accept some quantum-state differentiation. Technically speaking, you're not the same person you were before you step into an MRI, because an MRI effectively alters the quantum state of the objects it observes, body tissue included. It doesn't seem to affect a person, though.

There was a science fiction story I read many years ago about teleportation. In this story, the teleportation process created an exact duplicate at the receiving end. The only problem was, what to do with the "original?" In this story, every time you were teleported, the "original" you was killed to prevent legal and moral problems involved in having two of the same person. It distrubed me a bit. Heh!

You know, you could easily work out some sorta deal between the teleporter people and the soylent green people.

Think about it...it's perfect...one has bodies to get rid of and the other needs bodies.

That might be a wee bit difficult. The kind of scanning necessary for such a procedure...are we even capable of that?

Well, not at the moment, no, because it'd require scanning at the molecular level. However, full body teleport already assumes we'd make this breakthrough so I didn't see it as too much of a leap.

Additionally, it's also possible that you could accept some quantum-state differentiation. Technically speaking, you're not the same person you were before you step into an MRI, because an MRI effectively alters the quantum state of the objects it observes, body tissue included. It doesn't seem to affect a person, though.

So what does this mean for Star Trek's little theory about how to tell what quantum reality one is from via their quantum signature? Busted?

Mindset: True indeed.

So long as the Heisenberg Uncertainty Principle exists, I wouldn't even think of it. You wouldn't be correctly reassembled since there is no way to know where very molecule of your body is positioned. That's why we need another breakthrough before we can even think of transporting ourselves.

Only if you take the approach of actually trying to identify each component particle, move them separately and then reassemble them.

Every quantum system, including macroscopic objects, has an associated wave function. If a way can be found to cause the wave function of the macroscopic object to localize at a different point in space, there would be no need to separately identify and teleport each of its component atoms. Maybe this could be the needed breakthrough.