NationStates Jolt Archive

There's an assload of interpretation to his message and opinion on what he's done, but nobody's really been satisfied.

For those of you, like me, who constantly crave that hidden meaning and purpose behind all of this Jesus stuff, I suggest you read "Tarot", by Piers Anthony.

At around page 300~ it gets really interesting (as if it wasn't already) and Brother Paul actually animates himself into the time of Jesus, and from there the book paints a very original version of his experience. From his days as a wanderer to the crucifixion and beyond, everything from his demeanor to how he felt about Paul's goals of creating a new church - it's all laid out through the eyes of Piers Anthony in a staggeringly readable and interesting way.

I guarantee you've never even THOUGHT of anything like this being possible, but having read the book I can say it's not too outrageous to be true to a point.


Anyone here ever read it?

Is it anything like 'Live from Golgotha' by Gore Vidal?

I think the basics of Jesus' message can be summed up in a few simple words:

"Love God and don't be an ass."

Dunno, never read "Live from Golgotha".

It's fiction, somewhat science fiction, about a priest sent to another planet on which he's supposed to find the true face of god. It's set in the future, with a bunch of complications because of the emigration to other inhabitable planets. Essentially technology has reversed back to basics, with the exception of the ability to send people to other planets instantaneously.

So on Tarot these animations occur where things symoblizing the cards of the Tarot deck appear and interact with people for positive or negative results. The people of the planet think that through these animations, the true god can be known.

I think the basics of Jesus' message can be summed up in a few simple words:

"Love God and don't be an ass."

Of course. But if you're into specifics, such as how he came about his message and if he ever fucked, then look to this book.

Anyone here ever read it?

Nope.

I'm in the process of typing up an excerpt from the thing, but I'm at work so it'll be a while.

Of course. But if you're into specifics, such as how he came about his message and if he ever fucked, then look to this book.


How can one gain specifics through a work of fiction?

How can one gain specifics through a work of fiction?

It's all speculation, of course - much like everything we say in this forum - but it's interesting nonetheless.

There's Michael Moorcock's Behold the Man ...

The novella begins with Glogauer arriving in 28 in the Holy Land, where his time machine is destroyed. We find out later through flashbacks that Glogauer has chronic problems with women, an interest in Jung, and a messiah complex. He meets and lives with John the Baptist and a group of Essenes. Eventually, Glogauer gets lost in the desert and wanders off, leaving John and the Essenes. He makes his way to Nazareth in search of Jesus. When he finds Mary and Joseph, their child Jesus turns out to be a mentally retarded hunchback. At this point, Glogauer himself begins to step into the role of Jesus.

In the end, he becomes Jesus, and dies on the cross. This novella is about the philosophical issue of whether or not it even matters whether the historical Jesus ever existed. Does something need to have happened historically for the myth surrounding it to be powerful? Which is more important, myth or history?

Behold the Man won the Nebula Award for best novella in 1967.

There's Michael Moorcock's Behold the Man ...

I was about to mention this one.

"Behold the Man" should be required reading.

There's Michael Moorcock's Behold the Man ...

Sounds like an interesting book, though it doesn't quite fulfill the whole 'reincarnation' thing if he just dies.

There's an assload of interpretation to his message and opinion on what he's done, but nobody's really been satisfied.

For those of you, like me, who constantly crave that hidden meaning and purpose behind all of this Jesus stuff, I suggest you read "Tarot", by Piers Anthony.

At around page 300~ it gets really interesting (as if it wasn't already) and Brother Paul actually animates himself into the time of Jesus, and from there the book paints a very original version of his experience. From his days as a wanderer to the crucifixion and beyond, everything from his demeanor to how he felt about Paul's goals of creating a new church - it's all laid out through the eyes of Piers Anthony in a staggeringly readable and interesting way.

I guarantee you've never even THOUGHT of anything like this being possible, but having read the book I can say it's not too outrageous to be true to a point.


Anyone here ever read it?

I've only read the first book (God of Tarot), but he does show some brilliance... which is unusual, because I normally have no time for Anthony.

I read Tarot when I was about 12 and hadn't yet gotten completely fed up with Anthony's perpetual boobie fetish. I have only vague memories of it, although I do seem to recall the book making the story of the woman at the well kind of horrifyingly (if also rather humorously) dirty.

Sounds like an interesting book, though it doesn't quite fulfill the whole 'reincarnation' thing if he just dies.

Well, but the question is, does the resurrection have to be real? Is it enough that people believed that Jesus rose from the dead?

I've only read the first book (God of Tarot), but he does show some brilliance... which is unusual, because I normally have no time for Anthony.

I've got the trilogy in one book. =)

And yeah, I'm probably gonna excerpt that woman of the well part, along with skipping ahead to explain how Jesus dealt with those sexual urges.

I've got the trilogy in one book. =)

And yeah, I'm probably gonna excerpt that woman of the well part, along with skipping ahead to explain how Jesus dealt with those sexual urges.

I intend to obtain the remaining texts. I only got the first one to 'test the waters'... since, except for his 'mode' books, I usually have found Anthony scarily obsessed with pedophilic themes, and capable of writing only to the most juvenile level.

"God of Tarot" was a revelation - THAT is what Anthony should have been writing all along.

I intend to obtain the remaining texts. I only got the first one to 'test the waters'... since, except for his 'mode' books, I usually have found Anthony scarily obsessed with pedophilic themes, and capable of writing only to the most juvenile level.

"God of Tarot" was a revelation - THAT is what Anthony should have been writing all along.

It was one of his earliest writings.

I first got hooked into his stuff when I read "Castle Roogna", of the Xanth series, hence my name. I've read something like 20 or so of the Xanth books. Aside from his stuff and Odd Thomas by Dean Koontz, I don't enjoy reading all that often.

It was one of his earliest writings.

I first got hooked into his stuff when I read "Castle Roogna", of the Xanth series, hence my name. I've read something like 20 or so of the Xanth books. Aside from his stuff and Odd Thomas by Dean Koontz, I don't enjoy reading all that often.

Oy... I find the Xanth stuff horrible... only slightly preferable to his Adept books.

To me, he comes across as a poor man's Pratchett, but who spends half his time perving over kiddies.

Oy... I find the Xanth stuff horrible... only slightly preferable to his Adept books.

To me, he comes across as a poor man's Pratchett, but who spends half his time perving over kiddies.

How so? Most of his female characters are very physically 'gifted', yes, but they're of age.

I intend to obtain the remaining texts. I only got the first one to 'test the waters'... since, except for his 'mode' books, I usually have found Anthony scarily obsessed with pedophilic themes, and capable of writing only to the most juvenile level.


I'd agree that the Mode series is better than most of Anthony's stuff, but I'm not sure about "less scarily pedophilic." I mean, the main character is fourteen years old and very, very definitely a sex object.

Well, but the question is, does the resurrection have to be real? Is it enough that people believed that Jesus rose from the dead?

It seems that if one thinks of the Resurrection as something spiritual and not physical the whole story is easier to understand (for me anyway). Many of the early Christians believed that the Resurrection was a physical event, rather a great spiritual awakening of the followers of Christ. One can think of it as the dead in Christ rising up alive and full of the spirit of Christ.

An unusual intertperetation of Jesus?

He was a stoner. No, really! He had long hair, often got a funny look in his eyes and started talking about peace and love, walked around with 12 of his mates trying to talk to people, and eventually got arrested by an overly protective government.


That's unusual.

I'd agree that the Mode series is better than most of Anthony's stuff, but I'm not sure about "less scarily pedophilic." I mean, the main character is fourteen years old and very, very definitely a sex object.

The Mode books, I would say, are less juvenile... and, 'less' paedophilic only need mean that the participants in Anthony's trysts are a little older. Yes - our protagonist in Virtual Mode is a young teens, but compared to - say - Phaze Doubt, that is 'less' paedophilic...!

I think the basics of Jesus' message can be summed up in a few simple words:

"Love God and don't be an ass."

The best thing is, he would be happy if we all just did the second one. what a nice guy.

I think the basics of Jesus' message can be summed up in a few simple words:

"Love God and don't be an ass."

I think it was more like "Love people and don't be a jerk".

It seems that if one thinks of the Resurrection as something spiritual and not physical the whole story is easier to understand (for me anyway). Many of the early Christians believed that the Resurrection was a physical event, rather a great spiritual awakening of the followers of Christ. One can think of it as the dead in Christ rising up alive and full of the spirit of Christ.

Actually, the Roman Catholic Church still claims (as dogma!) that the resurrection of Jesus was physical. And transubstanteation (?) - that is, the wine and the bread turning into Christ's blood and flesh - is also claimed to be physical.

Theophagy + God in human form = Cannibalism?

Actually, the Roman Catholic Church still claims (as dogma!) that the resurrection of Jesus was physical. And transubstanteation (?) - that is, the wine and the bread turning into Christ's blood and flesh - is also claimed to be physical.

Theophagy + God in human form = Cannibalism?

Well, OBVIOUSLY its the CATHOLIC Church your talking about, most Christian PEOPLE think... oh whoops, said too much :p

How can one gain specifics through a work of fiction?

All works of art contain some of their creators ethos. In that reagrd most works of litary fiction cannot but help contian some of the philosphy of the authour, in whcih case if it is well wriiten, and if it is intended to have a moral, any fictional tale can looked upon as a work of philosopy, and thus can be used to stear ones moral compass.

I have never read anything by Piers Anthony that I liked.

For speculative fiction of the Gospels, the single best one would have to be Nikos Kazantzakis' The Last Temptation of Christ.

An easier read, but still far better than Piers Anthony, is Anthony Burgess' novel Man of Nazareth.

http://www.fantasticfiction.co.uk/b/anthony-burgess/man-of-nazareth.htm

Behold the Man was spooky. All those trippy dream sequences with large wooden crosses chasing little silver ones....