NationStates Jolt Archive

N Korea statement on nuclear test (http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/5402292.stm)

This is a summarised version of a statement released by the foreign ministry of North Korea, also known as the Democratic People's Republic of Korea, DPRK, announcing plans to test a nuclear weapon.

The US daily increasing threat of a nuclear war and its vicious sanctions and pressure have caused a grave situation on the Korean Peninsula in which the supreme interests and security of our State are seriously infringed upon and the Korean nation stands at the crossroads of life and death.

The US has become more frantic in its military exercises and arms build-up on the peninsula and in its vicinity for the purpose of launching the second Korean war since it made a de facto "declaration of war" against the DPRK through the recent brigandish adoption of a UN resolution.

At the same time it is making desperate efforts to internationalize the sanctions and blockade against the DPRK by leaving no dastardly means and methods untried in a foolish attempt to isolate and stifle it economically and bring down the socialist system chosen by its people themselves.

The present Bush administration has gone the lengths of making ultimatum that it would punish the DPRK if it refuses to yield to the US within the timetable set by it.

Under the present situation in which the US moves to isolate and stifle the DPRK have reached the worst phase, going beyond the extremity, the DPRK can no longer remain an on-looker to the developments.

The DPRK has already declared that it would take all necessary countermeasures to defend the sovereignty of the country and the dignity of the nation from the Bush administration's vicious hostile actions.

The DPRK Foreign Ministry is authorized to solemnly declare as follows in connection with the new measure to be taken to bolster the war deterrent for self-defence:

Firstly, the field of scientific research of the DPRK will in the future conduct a nuclear test under the condition where safety is firmly guaranteed.

The DPRK was compelled to pull out of the NPT as the present US administration scrapped the DPRK-US Agreed Framework and seriously threatened the DPRK's sovereignty and right to existence.

The DPRK officially announced that it manufactured up-to-date nuclear weapons after going through transparent legitimate processes to cope with the US escalated threat of a nuclear war and sanctions and pressure.

The already declared possession of nuclear weapons presupposes the nuclear test.

The US extreme threat of a nuclear war and sanctions and pressure compel the DPRK to conduct a nuclear test, an essential process for bolstering nuclear deterrent, as a corresponding measure for defence.

Secondly, the DPRK will never use nuclear weapons first but strictly prohibit any threat of nuclear weapons and nuclear transfer.

A people without reliable war deterrent are bound to meet a tragic death and the sovereignty of their country is bound to be wantonly infringed upon. This is a bitter lesson taught by the bloodshed resulting from the law of the jungle in different parts of the world.

The DPRK's nuclear weapons will serve as reliable war deterrent for protecting the supreme interests of the state and the security of the Korean nation from the US threat of aggression and averting a new war and firmly safeguarding peace and stability on the Korean Peninsula under any circumstances.

The DPRK will always sincerely implement its international commitment in the field of nuclear non-proliferation as a responsible nuclear weapons state.

Thirdly, the DPRK will do its utmost to realize the denuclearization of the peninsula and give impetus to the world-wide nuclear disarmament and the ultimate elimination of nuclear weapons.

The ultimate goal of the DPRK is not a "denuclearization" to be followed by its unilateral disarmament but one aimed at settling the hostile relations between the DPRK and the US and removing the very source of all nuclear threats from the Korean Peninsula and its vicinity.

Hmmm, I guess it shouldn't surprise me, but it's still something of a worry.

What do you think will come from this?

I don't expect the North Koreans to back down, I mean, they did the missile test recently too even though everyone begged them not to.

So how should the world respond, and how do you think it actually will respond?

DPRK is pretty psycho, so I highly doubt they will back down.

TOo tired to think about what will happen, but it will be interesting, to put it mildly.

Hmmm, I guess it shouldn't surprise me, but it's still something of a worry.

What do you think will come from this?

I don't expect the North Koreans to back down, I mean, they did the missile test recently too even though everyone begged them not to.

So how should the world respond, and how do you think it actually will respond?

Kim Jong-Ill is a crazy bastard, nothing to lose really. If we go in to do something(which might not be that crazy of a thought, given the incompetence of the current admin), it would give NK a reason to do a live test of the weaponry. Not only this, but it would give Iran an Itchy trigger finger, because hey-we just hit two of the three countries on the "Axis of Evil", we may just be planning for Iran next(and given recent tension with them, it'd be worse), and using our very own argument against us, they have every reason to preemptive strike. Regional tensions would increase, causing all-out war, possibly on the nuclear side, and everything goes to shit.

And I'd be eating pancakes naked in the middle of Washington, saying "Told ya so".

Hmmm, I guess it shouldn't surprise me, but it's still something of a worry.

What do you think will come from this?

I don't expect the North Koreans to back down, I mean, they did the missile test recently too even though everyone begged them not to.

So how should the world respond, and how do you think it actually will respond?

Sanction them so thier GDP goes from 206.37USD (200,000,000,000 in North Korean) yearly, too 21.34. Then they only have 20 bucks for a nuclear program, and 1.34 for social welfare, education, etc.

It's NOT a good thing. Things are already very tense in this part of the neighborhood and we don't need the North adding fuel to the fire.

I'm sure it's their normal saber rattling, but playing with nukes can easily spiral out of control.

...A little Strontium-90 never hurt anyone :rolleyes:

Naked force has resolved more conflicts throughout history than any other factor. And force, my friends, is violence. Threaten to use force and follow through with that threat with small skirmishes/stirkes if demands of peace are not met. If that fails, destroy the enemy. Conflict resolved.

Naked force has resolved more conflicts throughout history than any other factor. And force, my friends, is violence. Threaten to use force and follow through with that threat with small skirmishes/stirkes if demands of peace are not met. If that fails, destroy the enemy. Conflict resolved.
That might sound like a good idea from where you're sitting, but I suspect that the people in the region might disagree with you.

Go rest of the world! nuke each other!



I'll just sit here out of the way..

That might sound like a good idea from where you're sitting, but I suspect that the people in the region might disagree with you.
Who? The North Koreans? The ones trying to build nukes and take over the south? Lil' Kim?

Who? The North Koreans? The ones trying to build nukes and take over the south? Lil' Kim?
The South Koreans? The Japanese? NERVUN?

Who? The North Koreans? The ones trying to build nukes and take over the south? Lil' Kim?
Me, who lives in Japan, well within range of North Korea. I'd prefer NOT to get blown up, thank you very much. I'm sure the millions of people in Seoul feel the same way.

The South Koreans? The Japanese? NERVUN?
*LOL* Good timing there!

HAIL THE PEOPLE'S REVOLUTIONARY CAUSE! MAN-SE, MAN-SE, MAN-SE! OUR 8 MILLION NORTH-KOREAN SOLDIERS WILL TRANSFORM INTO HUMAN BULLETS, AND REPEL THE IMPERIALIST, CAPITALIST ENEMY FROM DESTROYING OUR GREAT JUCHE SOCIALISM CAUSE!

Joke btw. I was bored.

I think North Korea has the right to develop nuclear weapons, particularly if they feel reasonably threatened by an overwhelmingly powerful, aggressive nuclear-capable nation. Like the PRC or USA, for example.

Seriously, does Dear Leader want to get his ass womped? If the US doesn't stop them (assuming he goes through with the test), the Japanese will.

The South Koreans? The Japanese? NERVUN?

And me! :(

Hmmm, I guess it shouldn't surprise me, but it's still something of a worry.

Neither surprised, nor worried. Nothing new to live under nuke threats from a Chinese proxy. Japanese and South Koreans, join the club!

Anyways, the Japanese are mere months away from making a bomb themselves, if they choose to do so. I hope Abe does it and tests a bomb, if NK tests.


What do you think will come from this?

A steady decrease of US influence in the Far East.


So how should the world respond, and how do you think it actually will respond?

The US will react like a wussy that it is when it comes to dealing with Chinese proxies. The Far East will be crying murder. The Muslim countries will snicker at the US discomfort. The EU will do its usual pontifications. The Latin Americans will be partying as usual. India will feel vindicated. Pakistan will be happy that their Chinese bomb still works. Australia will be ignored. And since this is already long, I will stop here....

Naked force has resolved more conflicts throughout history than any other factor. And force, my friends, is violence. Threaten to use force and follow through with that threat with small skirmishes/stirkes if demands of peace are not met. If that fails, destroy the enemy. Conflict resolved.

You been reading Starship Troopers again?

Ironic you quote Orwell in your sig, but have such warlike tendencies.

Seriously, does Dear Leader want to get his ass womped?

Nope.

If the US doesn't stop them (assuming he goes through with the test), the Japanese will.

Japan really doesn't have the capacity to do that. The will to do it is rather questionable as well.

And me! :(
And you.

Anyways, the Japanese are mere months away from making a bomb themselves, if they choose to do so. I hope Abe does it and tests a bomb, if NK tests.
Somehow I don't think more nukes are really going to make things much better. Plus, I don't know how happy the Japanese public would be with that idea.

Japan really doesn't have the capacity to do that. The will to do it is rather questionable as well.

I'm pretty sure that Japan has the capacity to strike, between the Maritime and Air Self Defense Force. Constitutionally, yes, it would be rather questionable. But a seasoned politician could say that destroying a "clear and present danger" to Japan was actually in self defense.

I think Iran will be watching very closely, to see how the USA responds.

Neither surprised, nor worried. Nothing new to live under nuke threats from a Chinese proxy. Japanese and South Koreans, join the club!

We in Japan have been there for a while now.

Anyways, the Japanese are mere months away from making a bomb themselves, if they choose to do so. I hope Abe does it and tests a bomb, if NK tests.

Technically yes, but politically, I don't think Abe could do it.

The US will react like a wussy that it is when it comes to dealing with Chinese proxies. The Far East will be crying murder. The Muslim countries will snicker at the US discomfort. The EU will do its usual pontifications. The Latin Americans will be partying as usual. India will feel vindicated. Pakistan will be happy that their Chinese bomb still works. Australia will be ignored. And since this is already long, I will stop here....

More or less.

I'm pretty sure that Japan has the capacity to strike, between the Maritime and Air Self Defense Force. Constitutionally, yes, it would be rather questionable. But a seasoned politician could say that destroying a "clear and present danger" to Japan was actually in self defense.
Abe is actually on record of stating so, however it's highly doubtful the public would support that.

Abe is actually on record of stating so, however it's highly doubtful the public would support that.

Is it possible that would change with a successful North Korean nuclear test?

Is it possible that would change with a successful North Korean nuclear test?
It'd be one hell of an argument.

I'm pretty sure that Japan has the capacity to strike, between the Maritime and Air Self Defense Force. Constitutionally, yes, it would be rather questionable. But a seasoned politician could say that destroying a "clear and present danger" to Japan was actually in self defense.

The JASDF is simply not configured for that role. They are air defense heavy. They have no bombers or strike aircraft (aside from the possible use of the F-15J as a fighter-bomber).

The JMSDF is even les well configured as an attack force.

I think Iran will be watching very closely, to see how the USA responds.

Yes indeed

The JASDF is simply not configured for that role. They are air defense heavy. They have no bombers or strike aircraft (aside from the possible use of the F-15J as a fighter-bomber).


With American help, I'm sure some fighters could be converted into a strike role.

With American help, I'm sure some fighters could be converted into a strike role.
There's just not enough of them to make an actual strike. It's the Japanese Self Defence Force, not the Imperial Army and Navy.

Japan could, if it wanted to, build back up; but it would take years and rattle South Korea and China even more.

And no, threat of a nuclear North won't distract those two.

There's just not enough of them to make an actual strike. It's the Japanese Self Defence Force, not the Imperial Army and Navy.

Japan could, if it wanted to, build back up; but it would take years and rattle South Korea and China even more.

And no, threat of a nuclear North won't distract those two.

The JASDF has over 350 combat aircraft. 50 aircraft, equipped properly, would probably be enough to set back the North Korean nuclear and missile program back a decade.

Is it possible that would change with a successful North Korean nuclear test?
It'd be one hell of an argument.

Yep.

With American help, I'm sure some fighters could be converted into a strike role.

Yes, actually Japan could pretty much do that itself, as I said. However, that would not suffice.

The US OPLAN calls for extensive B-2 and F-117 attacks, using earth-penetrating conventional weapons. Japan does not posess any of those. And the US is unlikely to assist Japan if it is unwilling to undertake the attack itself.

Furthermore, Japan certainly does not have the capacity to prevent a highly disproportionate counter-attack.

Have a look see:
http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/ops/oplan-5026.htm
http://cns.miis.edu/research/korea/dprkmil.htm

The JASDF has over 350 combat aircraft. 50 aircraft, equipped properly, would probably be enough to set back the North Korean nuclear and missile program back a decade.

Nope.

Yes, actually Japan could pretty much do that itself, as I said. However, that would not suffice.

The US OPLAN calls for extensive B-2 and F-117 attacks, using earth-penetrating conventional weapons. Japan does not posess any of those. And the US is unlikely to assist Japan if it is unwilling to undertake the attack itself.

Furthermore, Japan certainly does not have the capacity to prevent a highly disproportionate counter-attack.

Have a look see:
http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/ops/oplan-5026.htm
http://cns.miis.edu/research/korea/dprkmil.htm

I'm not suprised. However, we are not talking about decapitating the North Korean command structure. This is about a surgical strike on a very limited selection of targets. If the US were informed prior to the strike, which they most likely would, they would most definately provide support for the attacks (Tankers, weapons, etc...), and conveniently station a carrier between North Korea and Japan to prevent any unfourtunate retaliation.

Nope.

Israel did the same thing to Iraq in 1981 with 14 aircraft.

Israel did the same thing to Iraq in 1981 with 14 aircraft.
And every bad guy on the planet learned from it.

And every bad guy on the planet learned from it.

Breeder reactors are pretty hard to hide.

Breeder reactors are pretty hard to hide.
The North likes to tunnel and hide things. We don't know where everything is and we still cannot stop a retalitory strike to South Korea and Japan. We COULD attempt to steamroll the country (assuming we had the troops), but we did that one time and provoked China into answering and another war with the PRC isn't a good idea right now.

I'm not suprised. However, we are not talking about decapitating the North Korean command structure. This is about a surgical strike on a very limited selection of targets. If the US were informed prior to the strike, which they most likely would, they would most definately provide support for the attacks (Tankers, weapons, etc...), and conveniently station a carrier between North Korea and Japan to prevent any unfourtunate retaliation.

Israel did the same thing to Iraq in 1981 with 14aircraft.

The reason the US OPLAN for surgical strikes against DPRK's nuclear program calls for much more extensive forces is that Korea's program is significantly more advanced that Iraq's was. Japan would need to hit at least the six major facilities out of about 50 known facilities, in order to set the program back a decade.

Japan simply doesn't have sufficient aircraft to hit all the targets in a reasonable timeframe.

Also, most of the facilities are deeply buried and hardened, unlike Tammuz 1. Japan is unable to hit those facilities.

Also, Japan doesn't have the needed air defense suppression capability and has very little in the way of preventing a retaliatory attack.

If Japan tried this, they'd end up with the bad end of the stick.

Somehow I don't think more nukes are really going to make things much better. Plus, I don't know how happy the Japanese public would be with that idea.

Depends on how scared the Japanese public would be of an overt NK nuke test.

If I understand it correctly, NK will not test, because it does not need to. They already have a tested model and the US, Japan etc know this, so NK doesn't have to actually test to prove they have the bomb.

However, the Chinese will sabre rattle through them and extract concessions from the US. After all, that is what proxies are for and the Chicoms have been using their proxies pretty smartly.

However, the Chinese will sabre rattle through them and extract concessions from the US. After all, that is what proxies are for and the Chicoms have been using their proxies pretty smartly.
Hehe, you're one for conspiracy theories, ain't ya.

The Chinese have no need for extracting any sort of concessions from the US at this point in time. Things are going rosy for them. There is no economic, diplomatic or even ideological need for them to extract anything.

Hehe, you're one for conspiracy theories, ain't ya.

The Chinese have no need for extracting any sort of concessions from the US at this point in time. Things are going rosy for them. There is no economic, diplomatic or even ideological need for them to extract anything.
Not to mention that China is starting to get seriously annoyed with the North as well.

The North is useful in keeping the US from ringing China with influence, but it destabilizing the area is not so useful.

Well usa does it :(

so i guess korea can do it

nukes sucks but well usa are the only ones who ever used em, and they invade countries alot......

im actualy more scared of usa with them then korea

Well usa does it :(
Doesn't make it right.

so i guess korea can do it
An eye for an eye and a tooth and the world will soon be blind. Do you really want money that could be used to make the world better used in an arms race and the threat of nuclear attack against two liberal democracies?

nukes sucks but well usa are the only ones who ever used em, and they invade countries alot......
And?

im actualy more scared of usa with them then korea

Tell that to your average South Korean or Japanese. If it wan't for the USA one, or possibly even both, would be under a totalitarian dictatorship.

"North Korea Makes it Official."

Really? I didn't know that the DPRK was in a committed, long-term relationship? Or did they do it in Vegas?

As long as they don't start launching them at other countries, I'm fine. Also it seems that NK and Iran seem to be very different on the "nuke" issue. Iran is getting nukes for the sole purpose of waving it in the West's face. So far I really can't tell what NK wants nukes for. They haven't waved it in the West's face, and they don't seem to be threatening anyone at all with it really.

As long as they don't start launching them at other countries, I'm fine. Also it seems that NK and Iran seem to be very different on the "nuke" issue. Iran is getting nukes for the sole purpose of waving it in the West's face. So far I really can't tell what NK wants nukes for. They haven't waved it in the West's face, and they don't seem to be threatening anyone at all with it really.

They haven't waved it in the west's face?

I'm mindboggled with how incorrect that statement is.

Naked force has resolved more conflicts throughout history than any other factor. And force, my friends, is violence. Threaten to use force and follow through with that threat with small skirmishes/stirkes if demands of peace are not met. If that fails, destroy the enemy. Conflict resolved.Note that that's what's helped cause this mess in the first place. Force was threatened and used against Saddam to get him to dismantle weapons he apparently didn't have anymore. Now all the other rogue states took note and are scrambling to get those weapons since not having them is obviously not going to be ample protection.

They haven't waved it in the west's face?

I'm mindboggled with how incorrect that statement is.

Well, they aren't doing it like Iran is.

Doesn't make it right.


An eye for an eye and a tooth and the world will soon be blind. Do you really want money that could be used to make the world better used in an arms race and the threat of nuclear attack against two liberal democracies?


And?



Tell that to your average South Korean or Japanese. If it wan't for the USA one, or possibly even both, would be under a totalitarian dictatorship.


Well no it doesent make it right but well we send aid to those who are bombed in awars by coffins to burry thier dead maybe you should insteade protect the living?

if usa keeps thier nukes and noone else ever gets em the suciry that yes sucurty that were with soviet being the part that balanced the world power is now gone we need otheres take it over and crazy muslims cant do it :rolleyes:

well usa aint a democrasy so i guess its a dictatorship? i dunno its something else then a democrasy anyways and quite toletarian

and... that means that a country with leadership that wars alot are probobly more stupid enough to use nukes then a country wich are so pushed back theyre just defending themselfs

Well, they aren't doing it like Iran is.

They're doing it specifically to piss off the west and their asian neighbors! They scared the living fuck out of Hawaii when they tested their missiles in their general direction!

They're doing it specifically to piss off the west and their asian neighbors! They scared the living fuck out of Hawaii when they tested their missiles in their general direction!

iran hasent been threatned before they made nuclear program (if its nukes we cant fucking say really its just asumptions really but probobly so) thats the diffrence
north korea is threatned military from Usa japan and south korea used as puppets

iran hasent been threatned before they made nuclear program (if its nukes we cant fucking say really its just asumptions really but probobly so) thats the diffrence
north korea is threatned military from Usa japan and south korea used as puppets

I would respond, but I can't understand a word you said.

The Latin Americans will be partying as usual.

Hey! I resent that. And if it wasn't my turn at the piñata I would do something about it.

*sips tequila*

Ahahay!

*shoots to the air*

I would respond, but I can't understand a word you said.

Iran not thretned....

korea been threatned

get it?

They're doing it specifically to piss off the west and their asian neighbors! They scared the living fuck out of Hawaii when they tested their missiles in their general direction!

Have they ever went up to a U.N. meeting and said "Fuck you guys. We have nukes now. We can do whatever we want!"? No, they're simply testing nukes, which is indirectly scaring the shit out of other countries.

Have they ever went up to a U.N. meeting and said "Fuck you guys. We have nukes now. We can do whatever we want!"? No, they're simply testing nukes, which is indirectly scaring the shit out of other countries.
It's essentially what's implied. If South Korea or Japan's army was as large as the North's, there'd be troops pouring over the DMZ now and rightly so.

It's essentially what's implied. If South Korea or Japan's army was as large as the North's, there'd be troops pouring over the DMZ now and rightly so.

Ok, let me ask you this. Why did NK first start developing nukes?

EDIT: Oh, and it is. Just indirectly. If SK attacked NK, America would be sending massive amounts of troops over to assist.

It's essentially what's implied. If South Korea or Japan's army was as large as the North's, there'd be troops pouring over the DMZ now and rightly so.If I'm not much mistaken, Japan's military is constitutionally forbidden from attacking other countries.

Ok, let me ask you this. Why did NK first start developing nukes?

as the result of the threatning imperialism

If I'm not much mistaken, Japan's military is constitutionally forbidden from attacking other countries.
Well, okay, not now, but Abe apparently intends to change that. And like someone said, it could be spun as an imminent threat to Japan and self-defensive.

as the result of the threatning imperialism

Exactly, my fine friend. Now fix your grammar and spelling and you could easily become a great NSer.

Well, okay, not now, but Abe apparently intends to change that. And like someone said, it could be spun as an imminent threat to Japan and self-defensive.

wahtever will ever happen in hat confilict korea will never be the ones who start the war agian

I hate North Korea so much. I hate every American President who has not sent our military into North Korea since it was first established. I am so jealous of the veterans who got to fight such an evil bunch of scumbags. Oh if only Bush was not such a pussy! We just got to get a piece of Kim Jong-Il! It would be so sweet!

wahtever will ever happen in hat confilict korea will never be the ones who start the war agian
A conflict over hats is certainly a real danger to stability in Asia. North Korean development of headwear of mass destruction could easily interfere with American hat superiority.
:)
Which Korea do you mean?

I hate North Korea so much. I hate every American President who has not sent our military into North Korea since it was first established. I am so jealous of the veterans who got to fight such an evil bunch of scumbags. Oh if only Bush was not such a pussy! We just got to get a piece of Kim Jong-Il! It would be so sweet!So what branch of the military are you enlisted in?

A conflict over hats is certainly a real danger to stability in Asia. North Korean development of headwear of mass destruction could easily interfere with American hat superiority.
:)
Which Korea do you mean?

north korea since they call themself korea and since south korea spcificif call themself just south i think its only neccery to say south korea and korea ;)

but yes i ment north korea

I hate North Korea so much. I hate every American President who has not sent our military into North Korea since it was first established. I am so jealous of the veterans who got to fight such an evil bunch of scumbags. Oh if only Bush was not such a pussy! We just got to get a piece of Kim Jong-Il! It would be so sweet!

And why do you hate North Korea?

*cough*obvious puppet-troll*cough*

And why do you hate North Korea?

*cough*obvious puppet-troll*cough*
Wow, I couldn't imagine why anyone would hate North Korea. They're only a totalitarian communist state who oppress their people, kidnap Japanese and South Korean civilians and are developing nuclear weapons. Discrimination against oppressive evil states, I say!

Remain calm.

China's got your back.

as the result of the threatning imperialism

Wrong. North Korea's nuclear program is intended as a direct threat to its neighbours. In fact, North Korea is the very model of an Imperialist nation, they have found themselves in the position where their neighbouring enemies are in no position to defend themselves so they have build a specifically offensive military poised to attack.

Also, please learn how to spell/type/think, I have had to use all of my self control not to dismiss you as a moron.

Back on the topic at hand, any intervention in North Korea would need to have China's implicit support, although we would probably have to offer a hell of a bribe to gain that support. Secondly, it would need to be 'marketed' as a war of Korean unification, the North Koreans will never get behind an act 'Western aggression', but most Koreans support reunification.

Well no it doesent make it right but well we send aid to those who are bombed in awars by coffins to burry thier dead maybe you should insteade protect the living?
Exactly. Protect them from North Korean WMDs. The peninsula is already too unstable for any side to have nuclear weapons, although I would admit I would be a little less worried if South Korea and Japan had wepaons. North Korea is one hell of a fucking mental country with a mad, boozy leader. It wouldn't take much for them to use one.

if usa keeps thier nukes and noone else ever gets em the suciry that yes sucurty that were with soviet being the part that balanced the world power is now gone we need otheres take it over and crazy muslims cant do it :rolleyes:
The Chinese have nukes. The Russians have nukes. THere you go, there's the MAD you wanted.

well usa aint a democrasy so i guess its a dictatorship? i dunno its something else then a democrasy anyways and quite toletarian
Eh? Are you pissed?

and... that means that a country with leadership that wars alot are probobly more stupid enough to use nukes then a country wich are so pushed back theyre just defending themselfs
Don't kid yourself, Kim Il Sung started the Korean War. Yeah, great self defense.

There's a pettern of these defiant leaders, appearing to be getting in our face.
I have no idea what we should do, but I feel like we are being pressured and prodded and set up.
I dont think North Korea is mainly a US problem- I think South Korea, China ,Japan, Tiawan and even Russia have a greater stake in what happens there. And I think they should all make it clear how they feel about North Korea's behavior. None of them can actually be comfortable with North Korea or its leader, wether they like the US or not.

Its not time for the US to make any statements or ultimatums on the North Korea issue. But- we should however, be focusing our attention and collecting as much intelligence-confirming and reconfirming that intelligence, to make damn sure we know all we can when the moment comes that we are forced to do something.
North Korea is like Iraq to the tenth power.

I hate North Korea so much.
So do I. Or should I say I hate the KWP. North Koreans are probably alright, as people go.

I hate every American President who has not sent our military into North Korea since it was first established.
Yes - what excuse do all those Presidents have for not starting the Third World War, for shame!

I am so jealous of the veterans who got to fight such an evil bunch of scumbags.
Yeah, only 33,000 people died. It was named "the century's nastiest little war". Still jealous? Or still just a little trolling puppet?

Oh if only Bush was not such a pussy! We just got to get a piece of Kim Jong-Il! It would be so sweet!
I get dibs on his platform shoes!

its not if they test but when are they going to do it

The South Koreans? The Japanese? NERVUN?

Everyone who's addicted to anime? :p

Remain calm.

China's got your back.

I wish. China's been buttbuddies with NoKo for a while, now, and even through the missile launch have stood with them as allies.

I wish. China's been buttbuddies with NoKo for a while, now, and even through the missile launch have stood with them as allies.

Give it a while... China is beginning to realise that since the end of the Cold War they can make much better allies with much better people than have to resort to that crazy little country. If North Korea keeps going on this path, and the West doesn't do anything, its possible that China will either drop its alliance or perhaps even enforce some Regime Change of its own.

The Sino-Korean friendship is becoming increasingly unprofitable, and profit is what the ChiComs care about most these days.

China for North Korea 2007 or late 2006 if NK pissed them off with the way they are going
would you let a nut job have a nuke who could drop it on you

I wish. China's been buttbuddies with NoKo for a while, now, and even through the missile launch have stood with them as allies.

"How has China supported the United States with respect to North Korea? Washington expects Beijing to use its leverage to induce restraint in Pyongyang while also serving as a tacit mediator and message bearer between North Korea and the United States."* (http://www.jamestown.org/publications_details.php?volume_id=395&issue_id=2917&article_id=23592)

What happens in twenty or thirty years is anybody's guess.

As long as the test isn't on top of Tokyo, Grum, Midway, ect, I've no problem with them doing the test. You think Bush wouldn't nuke them if he could?

As long as the test isn't on top of Tokyo, Grum, Midway, ect, I've no problem with them doing the test. You think Bush wouldn't nuke them if he could?

Do you think Kim wouldn't nuke Tokyo, Grum or midway if he could?

Hehe, you're one for conspiracy theories, ain't ya.


It is not a "conspiracy theory". It is a rather well known theory, atleast to those who care to lookup and connect the dots of events.

China has a policy of not openly confronting US (like the USSR did) but use proxy states to create enough headaches and still not take a confrontational position with the US.

Sometime last year, I read that NK has now got ToT from a Chinese company for bikes. Until late 90s Pakistan could not even make a crankshaft on its own. Such is the scientific output and technological capabilities of these counries. And they have "indigeneous" nukes. Yeah right.:rolleyes:

Plausible deniaibility is the name of the game and Chicoms are pastmasters at this.

China wants to the sole hegemon of Far East and as long as there is US presence in South Korea (the encirclement of China), this charade will continue.

Like somebody said, the road to Pyongyong goes thru Beijing.

Old news, but I still have doubts over the official explanation.

http://www.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/asiapcf/09/12/nkorea.blast/
South Korea's Yonhap news agency is reporting a huge explosion shook North Korea's northernmost province on Thursday producing a mushroom cloud over 4 kilometers (two miles) wide.

The blast coincided with the anniversary of North Korea's founding on Sepember 9 when various military activities are staged.

The U.S. official said the cloud could be the result of a forest fire.

north korea since they call themself korea and since south korea spcificif call themself just south i think its only neccery to say south korea and korea ;)

but yes i ment north korea
Actually, no. South Korea refers to itself as the Republic of Korea. North Korea's offical name is the Democratic People's Republic of Korea and refers to itself as DPRK.

That might sound like a good idea from where you're sitting, but I suspect that the people in the region might disagree with you.

Well, at least a handful of people 'in the region' seem to want to play with nuclear weapons.

I'm pretty sure the average starving North Korean citizen wishes this would stop and would someone please give them something to eat, dammit.

I say we do the "The UN Way".

We wait for the UN to do something. And eventually, North Korea nukes something. And then the UN wrings its hands. And we wait while people get massacred. And the news story fades eventually.

This way, no one can blame anyone for going in "too early" or on "too little evidence".

When we do go in, about 10 years later, it's with the support of the world community, which has finally made up its mind that the radioactivity is now low enough to send unarmed observers to Korea.

Well, at least a handful of people 'in the region' seem to want to play with nuclear weapons.

I'm pretty sure the average starving North Korean citizen wishes this would stop and would someone please give them something to eat, dammit.

I say we do the "The UN Way".

We wait for the UN to do something. And eventually, North Korea nukes something. And then the UN wrings its hands. And we wait while people get massacred. And the news story fades eventually.

This way, no one can blame anyone for going in "too early" or on "too little evidence".

When we do go in, about 10 years later, it's with the support of the world community, which has finally made up its mind that the radioactivity is now low enough to send unarmed observers to Korea.

then the UN watchs them get shot and then they ask themselfs why did we not send in arm troops

Do you really want money that could be used to make the world better used in an arms race and the threat of nuclear attack against two liberal democracies?
You can blame the "new" arms race on the foreign policy of the US.

I think the $300 Billion spent destroying Iraq could definitely been used to better the world, but alas it is too late.

Taking on NK now while Afghanistan and Iraq are mess would be disastrous.

then the UN watchs them get shot and then they ask themselfs why did we not send in arm troops

Well, the answer to that 'why' can already be answered. The simple reason is because your, and other governments did not want to.

The UN does not decide to send troops or not, engage sanctions or not, or admit a member or not. Our governments decide. Any criticism of the UN, as much as the UN Bashers don't like to hear it, is a criticism of your governments foreign policy.

You can blame the "new" arms race on the foreign policy of the US.

I think the $300 Billion spent destroying Iraq could definitely been used to better the world, but alas it is too late.

Taking on NK now while Afghanistan and Iraq are mess would be disastrous.
I agree.

Well, the answer to that 'why' can already be answered. The simple reason is because your, and other governments did not want to.

The UN does not decide to send troops or not, engage sanctions or not, or admit a member or not. Our governments decide. Any criticism of the UN, as much as the UN Bashers don't like to hear it, is a criticism of your governments foreign policy.

iam not from the USA but we cant go in with the big ok form them
if i was in power we be in there next week making it a new state of a Australia

iam not from the USA but we cant go in with the big ok form them
You did in Iraq. And you don't get the OK from the UN anyway. You get it from the UK, France Russia and China.

if i was in power we be in there next week making it a new state of a Australia
Sure thing. Most sane individuals (including , I think, most Koreans) would want to see a united Korea, but sure, go ahead...

You did in Iraq. And you don't get the OK from the UN anyway. You get it from the UK, France Russia and China.


Sure thing. Most sane individuals (including , I think, most Koreans) would want to see a united Korea, but sure, go ahead...

hell i mean form the USA not bloody UN
and forget making the NK a state just make New Zealand one an then we can send them all back

hell i mean form the USA not bloody UN
Oh, sorry. My misunderstanding. And yes, that means you are quite right. You would need the permission of the US, along with the others I mentioned.

Unless you happen to be from the Republic of Korea, when you technically wouldn't, since the ROK and DPRK are still technically at war.

and forget making the NK a state just make New Zealand one an then we can send them all back[/QUOTE]
To where?

Oh, sorry. My misunderstanding. And yes, that means you are quite right. You would need the permission of the US, along with the others I mentioned.

Unless you happen to be from the Republic of Korea, when you technically wouldn't, since the ROK and DPRK are still technically at war.

and forget making the NK a state just make New Zealand one an then we can send them all back
To where?[/QUOTE]

oh me bad forgot to say so we can sent all the New Zealands back were they came form

To where?

oh me bad forgot to say so we can sent all the New Zealands back were they came form[/QUOTE]

Now, i'm getting a little confused. Aren't most New Zealanders from and in New Zealand?

oh me bad forgot to say so we can sent all the New Zealands back were they came form

Now, i'm getting a little confused. Aren't most New Zealanders from and in New Zealand?[/QUOTE]

half them move here to Australia dont ask why its along story

half them move here to Australia dont ask why its along story

No they don't. That's your paranoid Ozzie immigration-analness shining through. Despite the fact you have one of the most scarcely populated nations on Earth you would still rather throw your immigrants into Concentration Camps than allow them citizenship.

No they don't. That's your paranoid Ozzie immigration-analness shining through. Despite the fact you have one of the most scarcely populated nations on Earth you would still rather throw your immigrants into Concentration Camps than allow them citizenship.

half of it is shit to live in
as for the other thing those in power keep letting other people tell them what to do

half of it is shit to live in
Yep, you're right. (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/b/b8/Australia-climate-map_MJC01.png) But considering the entire UK is about the size of Victoria with a population about three times the entire of Australia, that's still quite a lot of space.

as for the other thing those in power keep letting other people tell them what to do
Like who?

Yep, you're right. (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/b/b8/Australia-climate-map_MJC01.png) But considering the entire UK is about the size of Victoria with a population about three times the entire of Australia, that's still quite a lot of space.


Like who?

USA for some things
one time INDONESIA for one gourp we send back home to west papua new guinea

USA for some things
one time INDONESIA for one gourp we send back home to west papua new guinea

Are you suggesting that Australian immigration policy is dictated by shadowy American-Indonesian conspirators? Because that is pretty nonsensical.

Are you suggesting that Australian immigration policy is dictated by shadowy American-Indonesian conspirators? Because that is pretty nonsensical.

not the USA on that just them over other things like going to war and others things
just the one time indonesian put there foot in the door over west papua new guinea immigration bill